Galaxies set to launch this month

[Chryse]

File this in the "Gee, What's the Rush?" category:
----------

LucasArts reveals that its Star Wars online RPG will ship on June 26.

Since LucasArts delayed Star Wars Galaxies in March, the publisher hasn't publicly discussed a release schedule for the game. The company has today revealed that the game is set to launch sooner than anyone might have expected--next week.

Galaxies' pricing and subscription plans were also announced today, and the game's standard monthly fee will start a notch higher than what's charged for other online games. The month-to-month fee is $14.99, and there are three longer-term subscription plans that reduce this base rate: the three-month plan is $14 per month, the six-month plan is $13 per month, and the 12-month plan is $12 per month.

"The current subscription plan for Star Wars Galaxies is reflective of the game's high quality and competitive with the current marketplace," said Simon Jeffery, president of LucasArts. "No matter which subscription option players choose, they'll be able to look forward to a constant stream of dynamic content and features, first-rate customer service, and much, much more."

Star Wars Galaxies has a suggested retail price of $49.95, which includes a 30-day subscription. LucasArts will also release a $79.95 special collector's edition that comes with a book of game-related art, in-game wearable items for character customization, a pewter figurine, a lapel pin and patch, and a signed manual. For more details on Star Wars Galaxies, check out our previous coverage of the game.

By Sam Parker, GameSpot

[Prowler]

Very Interesting.

[Trol]

Any word on if SOE is going to add Galaxies to their MMO package deal?

[TekDragon]

Ill definately be getting it. That will be a game that will actually be WORTH the monthly fee. The content I see going into that game is unbelievable. Just hope they put up some good euro servers be4 i get shipped out.

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Trol
Any word on if SOE is going to add Galaxies to their MMO package deal?

They said at the first announcment of the package deal that SWG will not be included in it. They made some BS excuse about different developers/marketers. Fact is they know EVERYONE is going to want to play SWG and they dont need to package the subscription up to attract people. I concur. PS was a poorly developed game (considering its potential) and it needs all the help it can get. SWG does not.

[EineBeBoP]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Ill definately be getting it. That will be a game that will actually be WORTH the monthly fee. The content I see going into that game is unbelievable. Just hope they put up some good euro servers be4 i get shipped out.

**COUGH** im in beta and it sucks (IMHO) **cough**

**Cough** /me thinks PS is MUCH more worth the fee **cough**

[Prowler]

Originally posted by EineBeBoP
**COUGH** im in beta and it sucks (IMHO) **cough**

**Cough** /me thinks PS is MUCH more worth the fee **cough**


need a cough drop bro? ;)

[EineBeBoP]

hehe **clears throat**

Nah, Im good :D

[TekDragon]

Your welcome to your opinion.

I played and loved UO (before the "new" team took over). The old UO team, including Designer Dragon, is part of the team working on SWG. They actually working hard to make it so that the economy is ran and controlled by players. Furthermore, the old UO team has the experience to do it.

Skill based system rocks! Im sure everyone who played EQ would hate SWG.

In EQ the way the logic works is this: someone who has used a sword for their entire existance and is level 10 will get their ass HANDED to them by someone who has NEVER used a sword but who is level 50. In my mind it makes 0 sence.

In SWG they doing skill based system. If you use a blaster, your blaster skill increases. If you dodge a shot, your dodge skill increases. If you heal somene with a med kit, your med skill increases. A charachter who has played for 3 years and never touched a blaster will be just as good at shooting a blaster as a charachter who has played for 3 days and never touched a blaster.

Player run economy + huge world + skill based system + large scale faction system + vital PvP roles (covert vs overt) + player run towns + player located resources (not NPC provided) + futuristic theme = BEST MMORPG EVER!!

Added to that ive got 2 friends from college who got into beta pretty early and both of them agree the game has so much potential its frigging insane and the dev team is asking the right questions and implementing the right stuff to take full advantage of that potential.

Finally, unlike PS, SWG will actually be a game worthy of spending $50 on at release. It will actually have something more than an engine and a handful of content that looks like it took someone 3 days to think up *cough* ( base designs, 5 machine gun variants, 2 empire specific tanks, 0 empire specific planes) *cough*.

And instead of waiting an entire month and then saying "oooh, heres 2 gay ass pictures of 2 vehicles we'll EVENTUALLY be adding in but have no ETA for at the moment despite the fact that your payed $50 plus $13 in a few days", the SWG team already has HUGE plans for the upcoming weeks and months after release inlcuding craftable vehicles, politician skill tree, smuggler skill tree, and other cool shit.

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
I am just like the poor, dilusioned soul that Robot was 2 months ago.

[TekDragon]

:confused:

[xuur]

I know "someone" in the SWG beta and in "that persons" opinion, it doesnt suck. while hardly finished, its got a few nice features there that 1) surely arent for everyone but 2) break the oh so boring traditional MMORPG lines set by the likes of EQ (et al).

graphically intense (if you've the horsepower for it) and vastly larger than you can easily imagine (let alone run across quickly), even if you've played games like EQ and even the multi continent PS.

the interface and such are pretty different but allows total and complete customization to suit yourself and become intuitive pretty quickly once you get set the way you like. (that last part being the operative)

beyond that, like in most MMORPG's, it will be what you make it.
Unlike some others however, theres no "one focus" in there. that being the case, more than a few feel like "their end of the game is suffering due to trying to supply something that appeals to everyone". this may in fact be true. some things are missing, some things are wanting, some things are just..."not for me".

so...you will hear alot in the coming days that "it sux" "it rox" "its still beta" "its done enough, lets play"...blah blah blah. I'd take any one part of it with a grain of salt...a small one at that.

if you keep in mind that everyone has/had different expectations and desires for that kind of game..not to mention what they expect from something labeled 'Star Wars', you might just find something in SWG that appeals to you, even if alot of the other parts dont.

or so "that beta person" tells me ;)

peace

[Robot]

Originally posted by xuur

or so "that beta person" tells me ;)


knowing my track record for believing people from beta, i would say he is either a) a fanboy, or b) drunk

[Warborn]

Is the NDA for SWG still in effect? If it is, I seriously doubt the game is nearly as good as it is being hyped as. It is extremely unusual for a MMORPG to be in NDA till its release date, and unheard of for the NDA to exist till release if the game is actually good, because the good stories that will be heard from testers will improve sales. Disregarding all opinions and supposed Beta stories, the fact that SWG is still in NDA is enough reason for you to be concerned.

[Airlift]

The fact that it is based on character skill instead of player skill gives me enough reason to be concerned.

[xuur]

rest assured, "that beta person" is neither of those.

yes, the NDA is still in effect but its said will be lifted shortly before release.

No, its not a twitch game by any stretch of the imagination, so player skill in using a characters skill base effectively will be more important than good reflexes and a broadband connection.

like I said, its not going to be for everyone to be sure.

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Airlift
The fact that it is based on character skill instead of player skill gives me enough reason to be concerned.

So says the bastard generation of children being raised in a world without true RPGs like Final Fantasy, Ultima, and Dragon Warrior.

[Robot]

Originally posted by Warborn
Is the NDA for SWG still in effect?

Yep

Originally posted by TekDragon
So says the bastard generation of children being raised in a world without true RPGs like Final Fantasy, Ultima, and Dragon Warrior.

please give me the definition of, "a real RPG." that is entirely subjective judgement

[Hamma]

Originally posted by Warborn
Is the NDA for SWG still in effect? If it is, I seriously doubt the game is nearly as good as it is being hyped as. It is extremely unusual for a MMORPG to be in NDA till its release date, and unheard of for the NDA to exist till release if the game is actually good, because the good stories that will be heard from testers will improve sales. Disregarding all opinions and supposed Beta stories, the fact that SWG is still in NDA is enough reason for you to be concerned. ^^

[TekDragon]

Ignorance sure is bliss, eh?

SOE has already done press releases on why the NDA is still up. Their answers were logical, made good sence, and were met with overwhelming approval.

Dont believe me? Go check the official site. Or go check a fan site. Just, for god sakes, get yourself informed. Please.

[Prowler]

War, you spoke beautifully. :cool:

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Prowler
War, you spoke beautifully. :cool:

a/s/l?

Originally posted by TekDragon
Ignorance sure is bliss, eh?

Probably. I don't think I could stand to experience another poorly executed MMORPG. But, that's why I have guys like Chryse, the Peruvian Guinnea Pig, to play the games and tell me whether or not I'll want to do so myself.

As for reading the official reason for it being up, I also question your logic behind what you wrote in response to me.

Quoth the SW:G forums, found here: (http://boards2.station.sony.com/ubb/starwars/Forum3/HTML/130554.html)
"Essentially we don�t need negative press about some bug that won�t be present in the released version of the game. Is keeping the NDA in place the proper solution? That�s actually debatable. Some people would argue that we are trying to hide something by doing so. They are right, but not in the way they think. We�re not trying to hide a bad game as we have tons of people who are loving SWG. We just don�t feel it is appropriate to air our dirty laundry when we are in the process of getting it to the dry cleaners."


So what they're saying is that today, 06/17, there are a lot of Bad Things to be found about SW:G on the Beta forums. By 06/26, all of these Bad Things will no longer exist. In nine days, they will have solved all of the problems that are currently plaguing the game.

And there are no Americans in Baghdad, right guys?

The fact of the matter is that you do not fix a game in nine days, especially one as complex as MMORPGs tend to be. If the game were ready for release, there wouldn't be a lot of crap for them to conceal from the public. There'd be a few minor gripes, as there were with PlanetSide, and a lot of other people answering the thread, calling the poster a "newb whiner fagort" for complaining about something which will be fixed soon. They are hiding bad press which wouldn't be there if the game was in good shape, plain and simple. If you choose not to understand that, so be it. Just try not to use the word ignorant when dealing with someone whose experience with the topic at hand you yourself do not know the extent of. History, as we all know, has a habit of repeating itself.

[Prowler]

I am a Realdoll. :o

[Trol]

Originally posted by TekDragon
They said at the first announcment of the package deal that SWG will not be included in it. They made some BS excuse about different developers/marketers. Fact is they know EVERYONE is going to want to play SWG and they dont need to package the subscription up to attract people. I concur. PS was a poorly developed game (considering its potential) and it needs all the help it can get. SWG does not.

Well in that case, no SWG for me.

[Led]

I want to be a tall skinny gay fashion designer named Carlos.

"Simply faaaaahbulous! Mmmnh!"

[TekDragon]

Led you need to tell me what server you play on when you get in game. My guild is going to need a Nazi bitch :)

[Robot]

Originally posted by Led
I want to be a tall skinny gay fashion designer named Carlos.

"Simply faaaaahbulous! Mmmnh!"

there's a mexican place around here called senor carlos. it has the absolute most heart-stopping mexican food in like forever, and it costs like $15 for three tacos

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Robot
there's a mexican place around here called senor carlos. it has the absolute most heart-stopping mexican food in like forever, and it costs like $15 for three tacos

*hands Robot the "most random post ever" award*

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by TekDragon
That will be a game that will actually be WORTH the monthly fee.

so i guess your saying ps isnt? and if thats what you meant them im also guessing you cancelled your account.

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Onizuka
so i guess your saying ps isnt? and if thats what you meant them im also guessing you cancelled your account.

Brilliant :) Thats correct, im saying PS was not worth $50 at release and so far they have done nothing to warrant $13 additional dollars.

Yes, they made their own engine. I dont care, so did the designers of Quake. Yes, they have server costs they need to pay. We all know (or at least we all SHOULD know) that this game requires 1/100 the server space of games like EverQuest, StarWarsGalaxies, and Asherons Call 1 & 2. 13 dollars a month for a game that doesnt warrant 6$ a month is pathetically greedy.

$50 to get a handful of uninspired "futuristic" weaponry, 5 cookie cutter bases, 3 factions that are nothing but replicas of each other (ONE medium assault weapon each, ONE heavy assault weapon each, and ONE vehicle assault weapon each = laziness), and 2 faction specific vehicles?

Then I have to pay 13$ for 2 pen sketch pictures of 2 common pool vehicles that took less than 4 hours for a programmer to think up and put in the game?

No thank you.

Yeah PS is MMORPG. But ive had bigger and better and cooler and faster and more intence battles in Tribes 1 and 2. Not to mention battles in Tribes 1 and 2 relied on skill and twitch, not whether your using this weapon or that weapon. No. In Tribes a plasma bolt to the face kills you just as fast as a disc launcher or a mortor or a laser bolt. They all took skill and a pro with a weapon had a chance against a pro with another weapon regardless of range (jackhammer can suck my dik you no skill newbs, try hitting someone with a disc laucnher flying 50 meters in the air at 90mph).

Asherons Call 2 failed because Turbine made a pretty game with no content. SOE has made the same mistake with PS. Only thing that keeps PS from failing completely and utterly is that its got the title of "massively multiplayer" and suckers will continue paying, not realizing that whats the point of having 1000 people when you cant get 100 of them in a single battle.

[Lexington_Steele]

Note to all, SWG is very Buggy right now. Unacceptably buggy. I would wait a month on it. However it is somewhat fun, although I am not sure it could hold my attention for 6 months.

[TekDragon]

The game is still under NDA so I have to phrase this in a hypothetical manner.

Hypothetically server problems relating to the final stages of Beta are not only expected, they are desired. The testing servers a hypothetical developer would use would be much smaller than the full blown servers. Thus they could be more easily
"stressed" and the bugs can be kinked out in the last few days.

Hypothetically a game similar to this one (wink wink) recently opened their doors to a huge new batch of testers in so that the beginnings of stress tests could be done. Hypothetically that company wants to get the biggest of the kinks out while still under the NDA.

Hypothetically, of course. ;)

[Warborn]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Yeah PS is MMORPG. But ive had bigger and better and cooler and faster and more intence battles in Tribes 1 and 2. Not to mention battles in Tribes 1 and 2 relied on skill and twitch, not whether your using this weapon or that weapon. No. In Tribes a plasma bolt to the face kills you just as fast as a disc launcher or a mortor or a laser bolt. They all took skill and a pro with a weapon had a chance against a pro with another weapon regardless of range (jackhammer can suck my dik you no skill newbs, try hitting someone with a disc laucnher flying 50 meters in the air at 90mph).

The "problems" you listed with PlanetSide reflect about as poorly on it as my "problems" with Tetris not having decent enough RPG elements would reflect on Tetris itself.

PS wasn't made to be the next big death-match, pros-eat-newbs-by-the-dozen game. It was intended to be a sci-fi war game set in the future, with less focus on the individual and more on how said individuals can work as a team. While I would agree that PS still has some work to do to better achieve that goal, it is by no means not worth the money. As long as you didn't buy it thinking it would provide you with an experience that it wasn't designed to fulfill, you will have fun.

[OneManArmy]

phew!, eh this is another RPG set in a different world... same old shit different day. Of course, I hate RPGs so Of course I'm gonna be biased, but hey deal with it, I'm not asking you to think like me so dont start. Just merely saying that my sources have revealed that while a cool game for what it is you still do the S.O.S

"hey lets find a butterfly to attack...." "hey lets attack here lets attack there, oo look I found a hat......" "ooo lets click attack button, sit back and hope i win....." ...yawn...

[Happy lil Elf]

War,
Don't bother arguing with Tek. You see he's never wrong and anyone elses opinion is absolutely worthless and simply stating it gets you a quasi-intillectual arrogant flame.

Tek,
You've cancelled your PS account. Hallelujah, get off the forums already :p Oh, and EQ had a skill system. You had to use all of your skills or they would be essentially worthless. Simply had a leveling system on top of that. Comparing games like Final Fantasy to SWG isn't the best strategy right after saying how you hated leveling since esssentially that's all those games were aside from the plots. Not knocking the games I love the FF series and FF4 (2 in the states) still gets many hours of play on my computer through ZSNES and is probably my favorite RPG of all time. Another thing to keep in mind is EQ was not really designed as a PvP game. Sure you had that option, but the game was definately not designed around that idea. Not really suprising that PvP in EQ is, well, shitty.

Now on to SWG. I've talked to many a beta tester, whether it be EQ guildy, PS outfit mamber or just random friend from past games like Tribes 2. The only opinion I've gotten back is: It could be a great game, but right now there's so many bugs in the game it's actually more of a chore than a pleasure to play. Admittidly I haven't talked to all of them in the last month but out have talked to 3 or 4 and that's still their opinion across the board. I seriously doubt the game will be flawless on release and I also doubt it's launch will be anything near as smooth as Planetside's if they go through with this release date.

It really saddens me to see them rush this game. Personally I'd rather they keep it in Beta until Novemeber(ish) and squash all the bugs. Would be interesting to see a absolutely stable launch.

Oh and back at E3, I think last years...maybe not been awhile, it was stated the first expansion would be the ability to buy you own starship and possibly customize it. That right there would sell me on the game no matter how buggy it is :lol

Bit off subject but my dream would be a Privateer style game set in the Star Wars universe. A game with essentially no end that allowed you to buy and upgrade ships combined with a Jedi Knight?dark Forces quality FPS. Kinda doubt it'll ever happen though /sigh

*edit*
And there are no Americans in Baghdad, right guys?

Thank you War, I think I almost wet myself :rofl: Always nice to end the day witha good laugh ;)
*edit*

[Darksim]

Its Tek!

http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/assets/Ferrous.jpg

[Hamma]

Server space does not judge the monthly price. :lol:

PS requires serious bandwidth to keep everyones ping time low.

[aiwest420]

ok, for those who actually played SWG beta, i have some questions:
1)how is the game compared to planetside?
2)is it worth the money?

also, is there anyway i can try it out before i buy it (im thinking fileplanet PS beta deal)

ps, dont reply to my questions if you're going to say "OMG IT SUX" or some other stupid shit :)

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by aiwest420
ok, for those who actually played SWG beta, i have some questions:
1)how is the game compared to planetside?
2)is it worth the money?

also, is there anyway i can try it out before i buy it (im thinking fileplanet PS beta deal)

ps, dont reply to my questions if you're going to say "OMG IT SUX" or some other stupid shit :)
You can't really compare the two. I would say that PS had a more bug free launch than SWG will.

Is it worth the money? That is a tough one and depends on what you feel is worth $50 + 14.99/month. I think you would have to decide for yourself. It is not a "you must buy this now," but at the same time it isn't crap.

There will be no way to try out the game without purchasing it.

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Hamma
Server space does not judge the monthly price. :lol:

PS requires serious bandwidth to keep everyones ping time low.

Negative Hamma. Coding is what keeps people's pings low. Sending the smallest packets possible between the server and the client is what keeps your ping in da green. Bandwitdth plays a part but once you get to a certain level the price doesnt go up exponentially anymore. In fact ive heard many times my brother (vice president of technology at LI in Washington DC) comment on the continued drop in broadband prices at the higher levels as new technologies come out.

Server space DOES take up a lot of the cost for MM games. Problem is, what exactly is PS using its server space for?

Do the PS servers have to handle:
1. Large charachter databases with potentially hundreds of items stored on a charachter (and in the charachter's bank)
2. Hundreds of static NPCs across the server, each with their own scripting and AI (they are making townsfolk move and converse realistically in SWG).
3. Thousands of "mobs" across the server, with each type using varying depths of AI scripting (each mob type is supposed to have varying levels of hostility and behavior).
4. Huge amounts of resources. Including: crafted items, mob dropped items, craftable components, and base resources.. Also tabulating and keeping track of the decay on all of the above (with the exception of perma items).
5. Player run houses. Player run villages. Player run towns. Player run CITIES. Player run MILITARY BASES. Player run WORLDS.

Well? Do they Hamma? No, of course they dont. Heres what they have to handle:
1. Charachters that take a tiny fragment of space to store compared to MMORPG charachters (which is fine, its a FPS).
2. 5 bases *snicker*
3. Less than 2 dozen weapons *snicker*
4. A handful of vehicles *snicker*
5. Ummm...
6. .....

Nope, thats it. THATS what your $13 a month is going into. To pay the devs for doing jack shit. To pay the server bill that doesnt cost anywhere near that.

Yeah right :) We both know where 85% of your subscription is going to: into the pockets of SOE execs.

[NightWalker XI]

FF XI is gonna blow all these wannabe games out of business..

[Sp3ctre]

^Yep I agree, FF XI is gonna rule^

I generally think Star Wars is complete bollocks in any form, like Harry Potter, Ms Dynamite and Nicole Kidman. I can't stand the story, the 'acting', the world, the complete nobhead fans and the crappy guns.

All these games do is leech off a license

[Warborn]

Originally posted by TekDragon
stuff

That's only partly true. In order for the packets to be small enough, a lot of stuff had to be simplified in the game. No NPCs, no hit detection, no complex equations for determining damage incurred (or general combat equations for hit/miss readings). So, yes, the coding plays a big part.

However, to say that PS doesn't take a lot of bandwidth to run is ignorant at best, intentionally misleading and malicious if I were to be realistic. PS takes probably around the same amount of bandwidth as MMORPGs take to function in order to achieve a ping which is much lower than a standard MMORPG's (most MMORPGs cap the bandwidth allocated to each player well below the 56k modem level, thus causing the incessant rubber-banding and whatnot). To keep this low ping for thousands of people playing the game around the clock, you're looking at a hefty monthly fee for bandwidth.

But, the subscription fee isn't spent entirely on that. The live team which is used to keep PS updated and functioning smoothly also needs to be paid, and they're paid out of the game's monthly earnings. Furthermore, all secondary employees (ex. CSRs) also require a salary, and again, PS's monthly fee is tapped to pay for them also. There are probably a couple other cash sinks involved, but I'm tired and don't feel like trying to remember them.

While a successful MMOG can be profitable, saying that 85% of the monthly fee is pure profit is completely ridiculous. I seriously question whether or not you truly care what the facts of a given situation are, or whether you strive to keep the wool pulled tighly over your own eyes so that you can believe to be true whatever doesn't conflict with your own personal opinion.

[ZionsFire]

always a good response from warborn:nod:

[OneManArmy]

wow, tekdragon is an asshole..... :no:

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by OneManArmy
wow, tekdragon is an asshole..... :no:

:D man i see you online a lot :D :) :lol:

[OneManArmy]

yea.. thats what happens when you don't have a life ;) :tear:


**edit** speaking of, holy shit I'm a 1337 whore and I didn't even know it, must of just happend....:eek: :eek: I've definatly got to get out more....

[TekDragon]

*sigh* ok, apparently half the people read and didnt comprehend. The other half simply didnt read.

Warborn, it was a nice reply but your fanboyism permeated into it and you went off topic a number of times and flamed me on shit i never said (you just imagined i said it, i guess).

However, to say that PS doesn't take a lot of bandwidth to run is ignorant at best

hahaha :) Apparently you dont know much about how servers and multiplayer gaming works. Bandwitdth is only needed when your transfering information between the client and the server. In a MMORPG there is TONS of information that has to be sent back and forth. Every NPC or charachter that comes onto your screen has to be sent. Every house or weapon laying in the dirt has to be sent.

SOE has stated (and prided themselves) on the fact that theyre coding requires very little bandwitdth. They send out only a tiny amount of information because, quite frankly, this game doesnt have alot of stuff that needs to be sent back and forth. No hit detections, no player databases, no NPCs, none of that.

SOE even went so far as to say they were coding the game so that it would work just as well for 56k users as it would for high ping. That further shows just how little they intend to put into their bandwitdth bill.

FINALLY: even if SOE DID decide to dump a ton of money into bandwitdth you need to realize something War. Bandwitdth is cheap as dirt when you get to the higher levels.

Now that you got what i was referring to when i said bandwitdh, lemme get into the two other main points: salary for dev staff and paying the server bill.

The server stuff i went into in-depth in the other post. Im gonna assume you understood it cause you didnt touch the subject.

But, the subscription fee isn't spent entirely on that. The live team which is used to keep PS updated and functioning smoothly also needs to be paid

My whole point was that for a MM game this dev team is pathetically small (or just spent all their time high/drunk). What exactly HAS the dev team been doing? This game has been under design for THREE YEARS and all they have to show for it is an engine and a handfull of shit content that any coder could put into a game in a month.

FIVE fucking base designs for a game focused ENTIRELY on capping bases!! Hello? LESS than 2 dozen weapons spread over THREE factions in a game BASED on killing people. Only THREE futuristic weapons (beamer is a POS and doesnt count) in a game which is supposed to take place a thousand years in the future. TWO empire specific tanks in a game where they expect armor vs armor battles to be key.

To sum this all up for people who dont have 4th grade reading skills:

1. This game has almost no content (by content I mean weapons, base designs, vehicles, misc skills, etc).
2. This game uses 1/100 (an overestimate im sure, but i like being safe) of the server space and processing power of games like EQ, AC2 and SWG.
3. This game was coded and designed so that it would use as little bandwitdth as possible (which gets dirt cheap at high levels anyway so its a mutet point at best)

So what are you paying $13 for War?

You paying $13 for server space that runs a tiny fraction of what other servers cost? You paying $13 for devs salaries that have put a pahetic amount of content into the game? You paying $13 cause... oh wait, thats all i can think of.

Lets face it War. This game takes a fraction of the money to develop and keep running as a MMORPG does. Despite that, they shafting you for the same cost.

wow, tekdragon is an asshole.....

Wow, coming from a pathetic spammer that must be high praise? Just how many hours did it take you to get to l33t whore? I know for a fact ive been here months longer than Oni and hes already spammed his 7th grade ass up to Admiral.

Just because I dont think this game is worth $200 a year doesnt mean im being an "ass hole". It just means i think the devs should either give us content that deserves $200 a year, or lower the price.

[OneManArmy]

well, your opinion differs from mine, therfore you are an asshole. :D

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Every NPC or charachter that comes onto your screen has to be sent. Every house or weapon laying in the dirt has to be sent.

aren't all of the hits calculated clientside in ps?

and there are still weapons and ammo in the dirt, ps is not exempt from this magical bandwidth rule

Originally posted by TekDragon
SOE has stated (and prided themselves) on the fact that theyre coding requires very little bandwitdth. They send out only a tiny amount of information because, quite frankly, this game doesnt have alot of stuff that needs to be sent back and forth. No hit detections, no player databases, no NPCs, none of that.

No player databases? how do you keep your characters? the magical computer fairy?

there are no body hit detections (specific body parts) but there are hit detections, and they do take a lot of bandwidth. (that's why they had to remove body hit detection.)

no, it does not have npcs or anything like that, but the fact is, it has PLENTY of other things that take up bandwidth to replace the normal loot weapons kill monsters everquest thing.

Originally posted by TekDragon
SOE even went so far as to say they were coding the game so that it would work just as well for 56k users as it would for high ping. That further shows just how little they intend to put into their bandwitdth bill.

wouldn't a 56k connection take more bandwidth, as it strains harder on the connection to pass through at the same speed?

Originally posted by TekDragon
FINALLY: even if SOE DID decide to dump a ton of money into bandwitdth you need to realize something War. Bandwitdth is cheap as dirt when you get to the higher levels.

do you have their exact bandwidth costs?


Originally posted by TekDragon
My whole point was that for a MM game this dev team is pathetically small (or just spent all their time high/drunk). What exactly HAS the dev team been doing? This game has been under design for THREE YEARS and all they have to show for it is an engine and a handfull of shit content that any coder could put into a game in a month.

Yeah, because, y'know, you can now write complex game engines with impressive vehicle physics in 5 months entirely from scratch

Please go and find a coder and get him to design a game exactly like planetside, bug free, in 5 months, then

Originally posted by TekDragon
FIVE fucking base designs for a game focused ENTIRELY on capping bases!! Hello? LESS than 2 dozen weapons spread over THREE factions in a game BASED on killing people. Only THREE futuristic weapons (beamer is a POS and doesnt count) in a game which is supposed to take place a thousand years in the future. TWO empire specific tanks in a game where they expect armor vs armor battles to be key.

a) Level design, gasp, DOES take a long time to actually do. it isn't just, "hey guys, sit down and make a temple"

b) weapons do, infact, take time to code. there's no magical template for making a new machine gun, and you'd probably complain that all of the weapons are the same if they did that

d) all of the weapons are futuristic. just because something doesn't fire light bolts, it doesn't not make it futuristic. (portable chaingun? hello?)

Originally posted by TekDragon
1. This game has almost no content (by content I mean weapons, base designs, vehicles, misc skills, etc).
2. This game uses 1/100 (an overestimate im sure, but i like being safe) of the server space and processing power of games like EQ, AC2 and SWG.
3. This game was coded and designed so that it would use as little bandwitdth as possible (which gets dirt cheap at high levels anyway so its a mutet point at best)

1. "Less than two dozen weapons" doesn't amount to content? That's two dozen weapons. 24 minus some. you didn't learn math, did you?

base designs? the whole point is on capturing bases, not looking at the pretty designs.

vehicles? i don't know if you've checked, but there's a modicum of different vehicles sitting in the launch pad.

misc. skills? that's horribly broad. there's a wide range of implants and medical etc. certificates, if that's what you mean

2. again: you have NO idea of the bandwidth costs. you're trying to cover up your obvious lack of knowledge with smoke and mirrors. unless you can magically show me the figures.

3. it was coded that way, yeah; that's not to say it doesn't use up a lot of bandwidth, dude.

Originally posted by TekDragon
Just because I dont think this game is worth $200 a year doesnt mean im being an "ass hole". It just means i think the devs should either give us content that deserves $200 a year, or lower the price.

guy, i just don't think it's a good idea to be saying that we're stupid for paying $200 for "no content" when you're actively praising sw:g.

(edit: i shortened it a bit on things i just repeated)

[OneManArmy]

I know we all read P to the A but it bears posting


Star Wars Galaxies

Wed, June 18 2003 - 8:29 AM
by: Gabe

I have gotten a few mails from people asking how they will be able to meet up with me in Star Wars Galaxies when it ships next week. The quick answer is you won�t. See, I�m not actually gonna get it. Not right away at any rate. I can�t really talk about why right now, I may make another post once the game ships. There is a good chance I�ll pick it up when player owned vehicles come around or I might just wait and take another look at it when the space expansion launches. Either way you won�t be seeing me in the game anytime soon. I apologize if this puts a damper on your galaxies fun. Don�t worry though, you�ll be having so much fun running for hours between towns that you won�t even notice I�m missing.

[TekDragon]

Robot. Whatever dude. You can ignore everything i say and focus on the tiniest shit, thats fine.

If you honestly think that the PS player databases take up more than a tiny fraction of what it takes to store a MMRPG charachter, your an idiot.

If you honestly think that the tiny amount of information (players and weapons) can compare to the hundreds of NPCs, AI scripting, houses, cities, resources, decay, etc, etc, etc that have to be sent back and forth between client and server in a MMORPG... your an idiot.

If you honestly think that by catering to 56k users instead of high speed users that it takes MORE processing power and MORE bandwitdth... your an idiot.

If you honestly think that making a base design ("hey guys lets make a temple" as you put it) takes more than a few hours of work... your an idiot.

If you honestly think that having a halfdozen variants of a damned machine gun and only 3 inspirational weapons in a game supposed to set 1000 years in the future is "fine" then... your an idiot.

If you honestly think that the handful of crap they gave us at release is worth 50$ just because they made their own engiine.. your an idiot.

If you honestly believe that the content weve gotten added to the game so far (oooh, i loved those 2 pencil sketch pictures) is worth an additional $13 a month... your an idiot.

Just my opinion. I dont like getting shafted up the ass, maybe you do.

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that the PS player databases take up more than a tiny fraction of what it takes to store a MMRPG charachter, your an idiot.

what, and you do? did you take economics 101 or something?

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that the tiny amount of information (players and weapons) can compare to the hundreds of NPCs, AI scripting, houses, cities, resources, decay, etc, etc, etc that have to be sent back and forth between client and server in a MMORPG... your an idiot.

realistic physics scripting and detection takes up faaaaar more bandwidth than ai scripting. houses and cities are replaced by sanctuaries and bases/towers. resources are measured by ntu's. i don't see your point.

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that by catering to 56k users instead of high speed users that it takes MORE processing power and MORE bandwitdth... your an idiot.

you're sidestepping the question instead of actually correcting me. you're becoming a straw man, fast.

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that making a base design ("hey guys lets make a temple" as you put it) takes more than a few hours of work... your an idiot.

making it fair and balanced for the player? making it challenging? adding in where all of the terminals will go? that doesn't require more than, "a few hours of work?"

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that having a halfdozen variants of a damned machine gun and only 3 inspirational weapons in a game supposed to set 1000 years in the future is "fine" then... your an idiot.

what were you expecting besides assault rifles and shotguns? some sort of fantastic new weapon system? all of the futuristic weapons are based off of their modern day equivalent. you're basically expecting them to be computer fairies, again

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly think that the handful of crap they gave us at release is worth 50$ just because they made their own engiine.. your an idiot.

i wonder where i said that

oh, i didn't.

Originally posted by TekDragon
If you honestly believe that the content weve gotten added to the game so far (oooh, i loved those 2 pencil sketch pictures) is worth an additional $13 a month... your an idiot.

i don't think paying $13 for everquest is worth getting an additional zone maybe once or twice every year. i see that this now makes me stupid. thank you for opening my eyes!



and, really, i don't think i can trust that i'm an idiot from a guy who can't even use, "your" and, "you're" in the correct context. my an idiot.

[Hamma]

This thread sucks now.

[Warborn]

Warborn, it was a nice reply but your fanboyism permeated into it and you went off topic a number of times and flamed me on shit i never said (you just imagined i said it, i guess).

Ok, first thing, the only thing I am a fanboy of is World of Warcraft. I enjoy PS a lot and understand the necessity for a monthly fee, but that doesn't mean I'm a fanboy. My opinion simply differs from your own.

As for the rest, I'm not going to bother. When you make a comment saying that the dev team must either be pathetically small or spending most of their time getting high/drunk, it's pretty obvious that you're not here to discuss anything. You're here to be upset.

Originally posted by Hamma
This thread sucks now.

Quoted for emphasis.

Also,

Gabe:
Don�t worry though, you�ll be having so much fun running for hours between towns that you won�t even notice I�m missing.

Heh!

[Robot]

Originally posted by Hamma
This thread sucks now.

i just had a coca cola, and i think my bladder is about to explode

he;pl

[Airlift]

Frankly, I'm suprised that you guys still respond to TekDragon. Are we all suddenly forum newbs again?

[TekDragon]

Thats pretty fuckin ironic comin from you Airlift.

I just like how no one can ever tell me why PS deserves a $50 box price and $13 a month besides the following:

1. Duh, they made thier own engine! Thats like.. incredible! Game developers should get, like, mad extra props for that!
2. Five bases and a handful of crap weapons qualifies as "extreme" content that obviously took up many years worth of coding to put in.
3. YOU SUCK!

Sadly it seems to be number 3 is the most prevalent reason. Robot im not talkin about you. Im speakin to that spam/flamer Airlift. Your a little bitch.

[Navaron]

Somebody sure seems to want a lift on the ban wagon. Ease up man, it's the internet.

[TekDragon]

Nah Nav. I just get sick of the little **** running around here who dont understand the meaning of "constructive critisism" and whos idea of making a counter-point is to pop up and flame the other person.

Too many ass-hats around here. Airlift aint the only one.

BTW: i love your sig pic with rumsfield and the noobie. Do you have an original pic of that without the Bohica pic on it? Just rummy and the quote w the hat? :) Id like to pop it on my website (w full props to you guys)

[Hamma]

According to you everyone is an asshat, what you need to do is chill out :p

[Pilgrim]

Tek...

Can't help but notcie that every time you post a thread goes in the crapper.

SWG will be kewl. It'll probably be rocky on launch, find a game that isn't, will probably attract lots of fans of both MMO and the movies, and will do really well. More power to them. is it worth MY 14 bucks a month... no, why because it's not my type of game. I've tried the tread mill games, they hold little apeal to me, and I get borred extremely fast. Then you have the end-game that always ends up being a no-tallent key mashing contest, in which the person with the most free-time wins. Not my cup of tea, so I'll pass, regardless of what else they put in.

PS on the other hand is my thing. I can kill a person who plays much more then me, simply beacuse I'm better then them, be it from twitch, organization, or just numbers, I get to win.
So PS is worth my 13 bucks because I enjoy what I'm doing, if at any time I stop enjoying it I'll stop paying, the same thing I'd suggest anyone else to do.

Y'see how easy it is Tek when you're not an attention whore. If you don't like the number of facilities, the weapons, or the game play, that's fine, many people don't... move on, but beating that dead horse just so you can feel important is stupid, and getting kinda old for the rest of us.

You don't like PS because it's not what your dope addled mind thinks it should be, kewl, see ya, have fun playing something else, maybe we'll be in a game together someday we both like! Untill then BYE BYE.

To end this little rant, I'll quote Cioran.
"I never met one interesting mind that was not richly endowed with inadmissable deficiencies."

PAX

[Airlift]

Asshat I may be, but you are singemindedly fixed on the idea that your opinion is the only one that is valid and objective. You consistently post moronic shit and expect us to flock to you and prove why the game is worth your money. Then when we fail to have the interest to reply to your garbage, you seem to assume that transforms your opinion into fact.

One day, I'm sure the wisdom will be granted you to realize that we don't give a fuck if it is worth your money. For all I care, you can take your fifty dollars, cash it in for quarters and shove each and every one up your worthless ass.

Hugs and kisses, shitfist.

[TekDragon]

......

I wunna punch your ass out... but I liked your post too much :)

Fair enough, but id like to say i started out by saying SWG was worth the price. Someone asked me, then, if i did not think PS was worth the price. I gave my answer. Someone said i was wrong.

Dont think i ran into the thread to spout some anti-PS shit. I have alot of hope for this game and I really want it to (eventually) be a good game.

Oh, one last thing. Dont tell me FPS aint where I think its at. Boy.. if we do meet in a CTF in Halo 2, T3, or HL2... youll be goin to sleep crying. My l33t skillz will not be tarred :)

[EDIT] This post was originally for Hunter.

Airlift - lol, you little pussy. Dont act like i preach gospel. My opinion was asked and i gave it. If you dont LIKE my opinion then tell me im wrong and why. Dont just tell me im stupid without disproving any of my points. If you cant do that, dont post mother fuker. I dont recall there being a special invitation for you to come in and post your infantile judgements on other peoples' posts.

NS on the quarters though :)

[Airlift]

You are the one who acts like you're preaching the gospel, you dumb shit. You repeat the same fucking points over and over, but they were stupid nonsense the very first time you raised them. You are so fucking hung up on your vision of the game that you don't have a single clue about the real thing. You talk about the code as if you knew a variable from your asshole, but it is obvious from the ignorant shit you say that this just isn't true.

You talk about content like you would recognize solid game design, but your ideas are ridiculous and would turn the game into yet another piece of shit RPG. Go play Neocron you cocksucker. It has all the bullshit content you could ever want. Or better yet, stfu and go hypothetically play the SWG beta.

Again, I'm not going to deconstruct your arguments because they are not worth my time. However, I enjoy flaming your gay ass, so I'll continue to give your posts all the attention they deserve.

[TekDragon]

Again, I'm not going to deconstruct your arguments because they are not worth my time. However, I enjoy flaming your gay ass, so I'll continue to give your posts all the attention they deserve.

Thats EXACTLY the BS I expect from ignorant fuks like you.

You say that i rant and that my ideas would ruin PS. Fact is you dont even READ my fukin posts. You have NO idea what i say. You just see my Pink Floyd logo and you turn into an insta flamer.


How the hell would making more base designs ruin PS?
How the hell would putting in more vehicles, equipment, armor, and weaponry ruin PS?
How the hell does pointing out the fact that PS has 1/100th the content and uses 1/10th the server space and processing power of a MMORPG and therefore should not cost the same... make me into a jerk?


You cant answer a damn one of those. Yet those are the points i make that you flame me on.

Your nothing but a fanboi flamer Airlift. You dont even realize that i WANT PS to be a great game. I WANT it to be worth the amount of money they charge. Just because i say "It is not worth the money" does NOT mean I am saying PS is a horrible game and anyone that plays it is a ***. Thats just the direction you take it when you DONT READ MY FUCKING POSTS.

[Airlift]

Oh, I read your posts. They give me no end of amusement. I read the posts when you were bitching your ass off that you couldn't get the game to run on your super machine that pwnz every other modern game. I read the posts when you were claiming to be the only one who could write an objective review because all the industry sites and magazines are taking bribes. I read the posts where you claim repeatedly that PS will flop because it doesn't follow your vision. And I read all your bullshit posts in this thread.

Let me address your most recent "arguments" now for the record and to the satisfaction of your little condascending dickless ass. Pay attention, cos I'm only responding to these once:

How the hell would making more base designs ruin PS?

This isn't one of your ruinious ideas (like all the earlier posts where you push things like hundreds of weapons and NPCS), but it is still pointless and would not improve the game. There are a set number of base designs to create consistency of tactics. Unlike a FPS that ships with 20 maps, there are well over 100 bases in this game. Rather than make each one unique they opted to create several layouts that will become familiar to the players so that they can fight over/in the bases instead of wandering around them aimlessly.

If you have ever played a FPS (like the veteran you claim to be), you would know that the real game doesn't even start until both sides have a working knowledge of the maps. With varied terrain in the SOIs, it is unlikely that anyone is going to "know all the maps" in PS, but everyone who has graduated from newbdom should have a working knowledge of the base layouts.

Even tho there are only 5 layouts, it still takes the average player a long time to get the hang of which objectives are located where on each one. I've been on TS with some hardcore players and sometimes they still ask where the cap room is on a particular base.

BTW, You are a fucking moron for thinking that more is automatically better. Chess has but a single map and it pwns your sorry ass.

How the hell would putting in more vehicles, equipment, armor, and weaponry ruin PS?

Oh WOW! You mean you had the brilliant fucking idea that they should put more content in the game? HOLY SHIT! You are a genius. Dumb shit, no one is arguing that they shouldn't put in more content, we're just not all bitching that they aren't putting that content in fast enough. That's just you.

You do keep coming back to the idea that the game should have hundreds of weapons to satisfy your content cravings, but that is just plain retarded. You should be able to identify the weapons that are being used around you, so that you can vary your tactics and strategies to fit the situation. If we had hundreds of weapons, they would be A) a lot of reskinned, remodelled, rePEATS. B) way out of balance with each other, causing players to use only a fraction of what is available to them. C) more memory intensive than this game already is because there are now a dozen shotgun models instead of two, and the same goes for every other major class of weapon.

How the hell does pointing out the fact that PS has 1/100th the content and uses 1/10th the server space and processing power of a MMORPG and therefore should not cost the same... make me into a jerk?

It doesn't make you a jerk, it makes your idea stupid. Your precious RPGs don't really have all the content you think they do. Sure, they have a shit ton of 6/23 swords that drop from different models or varying skins, but killing the rat/bat/snake/orc pawn on a fucking treadmill so you can go to a new zone and kill identical but bigger mobs does not make a content rich environment. NPCs that wander aimlessly around a zone or sit all damn day on a static spawn do not make good content. How many dungeons did your precious EQ have when it shipped? By my count it was 10. Well, by your reckoning, that makes twice as much content as PS has, I guess this game really will flop. :rolleyes:

Have you ever played a MUD before? If you had, you would have recognized EQ and its ilk for what they are the first moment you played one. MMORPGs as they have been introduced so far are nothing more than a 3d interface laid over a simple MUD engine. Items may have varying stats, but they al fall into a few classes (ooh, a 1hb, 2hb, these staves are oh so different from each other even though the models are the same and the character wields them both the same too!) that aren't even very different from each other.

Wait wait, I was wrong. That last point does make you a jerk, because you don't have a clue how much processing power any of those games require or are given because you have never been thru the god damned server rooms. Do you know what they are hosting on, how much ram or disk space is required, what pipes they connect with, how much data is being transmitted over those pipes? No, no, no, and no. You only know your touchy-feely magic "content level". You are sick in the fucking head if you think you even have an idea of what is going on under the hood of any of these games. I know I don't, but unlike you, I can appreciate the complexity.

Make new points, your current selection is tired. We can start digging up your old ones thru the search page if you want. There was some comedy gold in there, to be sure.

[Sp3ctre]

God Tek, you need anger management, or need to lay off the drugs! It seems like ur against the whole board on this one. And from an outsider of this argument (me), you do sound like an asshole.

If someone thinks 5 bases, no good weapons etc... is worth $13 a month, then it's worth $13 a month. The huge amount of people who do think it's worth that means that you may have too high standards for the miniscule amount of money that is $13.

BTW, why the hell do you class none of these weapons as futuristic? A laser beam is just a light ray thats wavelength is really small. A laser is practically a pin point flamethrower, as it just cooks stuff (Like a microwave). Why does a futuristic weapon have to shoot Star Wars-esque pretty laser beams?

A laser beam will do a lot less damage than a huge slug of metal. A futuristic weapon 1000 years into the future wouldn't need ammo. I think a 3 inch pure diamond (Hardest substance on Earth, if you don't know) bullet filed down, so that at 5000x magnification it's still sharp, is gonna do much more damage than a shiny green stick of light. If this game was realistic and DID have weapons like this, it would be unplayable and boring.

People will still be using assault rifles in the future

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by Airlift
Oh, I read your posts. They give me no end of amusement.

me 2 :love:
well im done argueing with tek or any of the other people that call me a "child".

Theres just people on this planet that will complain about anything, and pick at every little thing you say. They are there and they are abundant. Its just part of life i guess.

/me yawns

[FearTheAtlas]

Originally posted by Hamma
This thread sucks now.
:stupid:

[Jarlo]

Wow what was once an interesting thread is now one of the worst in the forum.

:spam:

[Hamma]

Please people, I beg of you. USE THE IGNORE FEATURE

[Airlift]

sigh, ok ok. I will stop. It's just soooo fun to roast him.

All day long, foot up a dog's ass.... That's my pleasure!

[TekDragon]

Airlift you will be the first person I have ever used the ignore feature on.

That post you considered "flaming me" was pathetic. You took my point on bases, which has always been a corner stone of my arguments, and side stepped it. You went off on some BS tangent about chess and newbs not understanding the battlefields. You actually managed to twist it around into making the point that "anyone who wants more content is an idiot".

Then lets skip down to this one:
How the hell does pointing out the fact that PS has 1/100th the content and uses 1/10th the server space and processing power of a MMORPG and therefore should not cost the same... make me into a jerk?

Your responce to this one was unworldly. Ive come to the conclusion you are either a very bad arguer, or you are simply too stupid to understand basic english. Let me try again.

I AM NOT SAYING PLANETSIDE SHOULD HAVE SWORDS, SPELLS, QUESTS, NPCS, OR MOBS. If you honestly thought thats what im saying... your an idiot.

Its called a PARALELL. I am COMPARING the developmental process of TWO different games. Yes, I understand they are different games. Do YOU understand what a comparison is? When you get to the 6th grade they will expect you to know how to comprehend simple parallel comparisons.

In an MMORPG, ill take EQ just to be fair, the developers have a ton of work to do. Lets take a look at the things the EQ team has to worry about that the PS team does not:

AI scripting for NPCs and MOBs **this is huge, months and years of work**
Huge, game-wide economic system balanced through MOB drops, terrain resources, and NPCs
Charachter databases that have to potentially store 100's of items (compared to the max of a dozen items in PS)
NPC quests and MOBs that continue to be balanced with players as they advance (it is an RPG, after all)

Now lets see what the PS team did in their 3 years that the EQ team did not have to worry about

An advanced FPS physics engine
Z-axis movement and vehicles that take advanatage of it


Ok, now that weve succesfully compared the extra things each dev team accomplished, shall we look at the content that EACH team had to do? Lets not and say we did. We both know that the EQ team put in 100x the content that the PS dev team put in.

DISCLAIMER
This disclaimer is here to prevent people from side stepping again (Airlift). I am NOT saying PS should be an RPG. This has merely been a COMPARISON of the amount of effort the seperate dev teams put into their individual games.

Anyone with an ounce of perception can see that the EQ team (or the UO team, or the SWG team, or the AC team) put in hundreds more hours of coding and work than the PS team.

Now, Finally, ill get it the last point:
How the hell would putting in more vehicles, equipment, armor, and weaponry ruin PS?

Great fucking job side-stepping this one too Airlift. You make it sound like no-one disagrees that adding more content is a good thing (even though you said im an idiot for wanting more content above), yet im an idiot for complaining that they arent adding it fast enough.

Wrong. Im "complaining" that they didnt put the content in during the last 3 years the game has been under development, then they had the nerve to release the game at a $50 box price. THEN, they expect us to pay $13 again when, so far, they havent given us a damn thing except the *promise* of a friggin common pool vehicle.

My complaint is not JUST the content, Airlift. My complaint is the lack there-of, coupled with the high price. I no doubt understand that some people find this to be a fair trade. I am merely saying that **I** do not. I suspect many other people do not as well, but they dont wish to post here cause they will get assaulted by fanboy flamers like you. In some ways the PSU forums are not a friendly place. It is painfully obvious when it comes to the matter of constructive critisism of this potentially great game.

[Robot]

i'm just not going to reply anymore, because it's like playing tennis with a rock

[Onizuka]

man thats so long you should publish it, "how to try to make everyone feel stupid" by tekdragon.

Airlifts cool, whats wrong with you... prowler is too.

ugg my severe add is kicken in............ ... ..what will 25 prunes all eaten at once do to your intestines? :)

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Robot
i'm just not going to reply anymore, because it's like playing tennis with a rock

Thats exactly how I feel. Im glad somene else understands it. Only in my case replace the word "rock" with "spiteful, ignorant fanboys".

[TekDragon]

man thats so long you should publish it, "how to try to make everyone feel stupid" by tekdragon.

Oni, seriously. Go somewhere else little boy.

Cant you see that Robot, Airlift, and I dont need a little child following us around posting senceless drivel after every post?

I may not like either of them, but at least they manage to post something worth reading. All you can do is follow us around and post cheap shots between each debate.

STFU and go home.

[Onizuka]

hmmm i never cussed you out and tried to make you feel bad. just chill tek, chill. its just forums... and there should be a nice environment for everyone.

im not sure why it didnt occur to you that i was joking and playing around. so just cool it man :love:

[Airlift]

:rofl:

* On the one hand, I told Hamma that I would stop...
* On the other hand, I am a sucker for the low hanging fruit.

* Back on that one hand, he's allegedly ignoring me anyway...
* But still on the other, I would love to call his bluff and pull another PoS response out of him.

* On that first hand, I don't want to help TekDragon turn this forum into yet another flaming garbage pile...
* Damn that second hand, I really do love TekDragon in all his idiot-boy glory and could go back and forth with my pathetic flames until the work day is done.

Ok, ok, ok. I deleted the really good stuff and will say only that ... nevermind.....

You win Hamma. It's a good thing I really like PSU, or I'd be trucking down the road to banville right now.

[TekDragon]

You win Hamma. It's a good thing I really like PSU, or I'd be trucking down the road to banville right now.

Word.

No Airlift, i did not ignore you. That would be less than honorable. My honor demands I defeat you in fair combat, or die trying.

One day Airlift... we will meet again. On that day, in that thread, the devastation shall go unchecked. The flames will reach up into the sky as a beacon of devastation for all. On that day, Airlift, i will not hold back. It will be the recknoning, and all will feel its wrath.

*bows*

:p

[eMaGyN]

Things have definitely...definitely changed around here...

I'm disappointed :(


:tear:
eMa

[FearTheAtlas]

Not changed, just mutated :rolleyes:

[Airlift]

eMa, that's what happens when teh :love: retires from service in PSU. It isn't fair for you to be disappointed in us, we are what you left us to become ;)

Tek, I'll see you then :D

[TekDragon]

Its not all that bad ema. Theirs just a few "touchy" subjects that have people firmly entrenched on both sides. PS is one of them, the marijuana debate is another.

Once a week or so a topic pops up that flares it all up again, but 95% of the threads are cool here.

Whatever you do.. dont go to the PnsNdbt thread ;)

[Robot]

i made a finger out of silly putty

WORSHIP ME

[Prowler]

Hi eMa. :wave:

[Hamma]

Its just this thread that sucks.

[Prowler]

Originally posted by Hamma
Its just this thread that sucks.


Yep. ;)

[EineBeBoP]

Originally posted by TekDragon

Whatever you do.. dont go to the PnsNdbt thread ;)


HEY.... WHATS WRONG WITH THE PnsNdabut THREAD?!
lol

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by Robot
i made a finger out of silly putty

WORSHIP ME

*bows down before robot*

wait a sec, a finger. hmmm

[Prowler]

I don't think thats a finger.:p

[Matuse]

Airlift you will be the first person I have ever used the ignore feature on.

No Airlift, i did not ignore you. That would be less than honorable.

That you do not consider following your own stated word to be honorable describes your greatest fault as a human being to a "T".

I've never seen you even vaguely entertain someone else's opinion. Rigidity of thinking is the sign of low functioning intelligence. You present your opinions as facts. You flame without just cause. Your momma dresses you funny too.

You don't play Planetside. The door is *pointing* thataway.


ps: I find it highly ironic that someone who is being a proponent of SW:G has the nerve to call ANYONE a fanboy. Jesus wept.

pps: SW:G will be a big dollop of pure unadulterated ass because of its playerbase...even leaving aside chowderheads like TekDragon, there are the inevitable tens of thousands of 8 year olds who only bought they game because it has darth vader on the box. Doesn't matter what the game engine is like, the players will ruin it just as fast as you can log in for the first time (which as I understand it from speaking to beta testers is quite a challenge by itself).

[TekDragon]

Matuse ive never even seen you before. Who the fuk are you to come over here and judge me? Little bitch.

Dont get all high and mighty on me for something small and petty. Me and Airlift were going back and forth. The fact that i acknowledged that I did not ignore him and had no intention of ignoring him a mere couple posts later should have been the end of it. What the hell was the point of bringing it up and assigning a huge social failing to it?

You sound like some little bitch from college that failed his psychology class.

ps: I find it highly ironic that someone who is being a proponent of SW:G has the nerve to call ANYONE a fanboy. Jesus wept.

Guess what dipshit? I bitch about some of the features of SWG too. You should see some of the flame wars started on the official forum because I thought the PvP aspects werent being given enough attention.
You dont seem to realize the difference between a fanboy and a fan. Im a fan of both PS and SWG. I want them both to be great games. I also point out their failings. A fanboy is a completely different story.

pps: SW:G will be a big dollop of pure unadulterated ass because of its playerbase...even leaving aside chowderheads like TekDragon, there are the inevitable tens of thousands of 8 year olds who only bought they game because it has darth vader on the box.

Funny. I could look at you and say PS must suck cause its got little bitch-asses like you running around. I dont.
Furthermore whats this BS about 8 year olds running around screaming about Darth Vader? You idiot. Most little kids these days dont even know about Vader, nor do they care.

Star Wars is a game for my generation, the generation that grew up with the Battle of Hoth and the Death Star getting pwned not just once, but twice.

These new fanboy SW kiddies wont be interested in SWG. Why? Because there aint no god damn jar-jar.

Get a clue be4 you start spouting ignorant shit.

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
These new fanboy SW kiddies wont be interested in SWG. Why? Because there aint no god damn jar-jar.

because the magical medium of, "video" has not been invented yet that allows kids to see videos from before their time!

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Robot
because the magical medium of, "video" has not been invented yet that allows kids to see videos from before their time!

Exactly! That, and the fact that kids these days are a bunch of un-cultured monsters.

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Exactly! That, and the fact that kids these days are a bunch of un-cultured monsters.

i..... i.....

.....gah, no, nevermind

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Robot
i..... i.....

.....gah, no, nevermind

:D

Scoooooooooooooooooore!!

[Onizuka]

is it me or does tek argue too much. at least he cant hear me.... hehe i prolly get flamed for this

[Robot]

Originally posted by TekDragon
:D

Scoooooooooooooooooore!!

i think you're really missing the point

[eMaGyN]

How about we all agree to disagree..and leave it at that.

Everyone must learn to do what each individual feels is best... what each person derives the most fun from...some of us, that is PS...some of us, it is SW:G... in the end, it doesn't matter...

We all just need to calm down and realize one thing. PSU is a great community because of the enormously talented and respected people that have created / became a member of this oh so growing community...that is an accomplishment... Not for just the legion of PS fans... but Gamers as a whole.
Never let a difference divide the members of PSU... it will only disrupt the great things that our people have worked hard for here. Be proud to be a member of a great online community...and become civil.

:love: you guys.
eMa

[Prowler]

Wow, that was beautiful. :)

[TekDragon]

*sniffles*

*lights up a blunt and passes it to Airlift and Robot*

:love:

[Matuse]

Matuse ive never even seen you before.

Your loss.

Who the fuk are you to come over here and judge me? Little bitch.

So, you judging everyone else is fine, but nobody can judge you. Hypocrite. Proof follows:

Funny. I could look at you and say PS must suck cause its got little bitch-asses like you running around. I dont.

Yes, having previously stated to never having seen my posts before, because I don't agree with you or like you, or respect you in any meaningful way, I'm a "bitch-ass". Judge not, lest you be judged, and all that rot.

What the hell was the point of bringing it up and assigning a huge social failing to it?

Yes, fie on me for being "old school" where when we said things, we meant them.

You dont seem to realize the difference between a fanboy and a fan.

I do, actually. Thanks for playing, and for completely missing the point.

Im a fan of both PS ...

I'm right on the verge of believing that, when you insult anyone who defends PS to any degree, have claimed to have cancelled your account, and spend most of your energy on the forums deriding the game.

Furthermore whats this BS about 8 year olds running around screaming about Darth Vader? You idiot. Most little kids these days dont even know about Vader, nor do they care.

Yes, the poor kiddies these days who have grown up without the benefit of VCRs. And of course the original trilogy was not released in theatres a couple years back, followed by numerous reruns on Fox and USA. Nope, didn't happen.

The kids who showed up at halloween last year wearing storm trooper and vader masks were actually an acid flashback...all the more astounding when I've never done acid.

You thinking that the game is not going to be populated with the largest collection of immature (through age or inclination) tardboys in the history of the universe...is just naivette taken to a degree of extremity that I had heretofore not believed possible. If I cared enough to visit whatever SW:G forum you plan on habitating when the game goes into release, I would really love to see you whining about them there once you've been exposed to the horror.

These new fanboy SW kiddies wont be interested in SWG.

Just like none of them are/were interested in any of the jedi games that have been released in the past couple years. My question for you: How much training did it take to so egregiously talk out of your ass while making it look like you are being sincere?

[Happy lil Elf]

Awww, christ. Here we go again :sick:

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
Awww, christ. Here we go again :sick:

Damnit Elf. I was about to open up a can of woop-ass 'TekD' style.. then i choked on your post.

Matuse whatever man. Your whole argument on PS seems to be that "TekD doesnt think PS is worth $200 for a year of play. TekD is an ass hole. Therefore, PS must be worth $200 for a year of play."

Fuk you bitch. Try attacking some of my points and maybe ill give you some respect. Until then i WILL judge your punk ass.

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Fuk you bitch. Try attacking some of my points and maybe ill give you some respect. Until then i WILL judge your punk ass.

**looks up at post** ooh see how nice tek is......
Matuse you da man..... OWNAGE

(can someone post one of those owned pics)

[Matuse]

Your whole argument on PS seems to be that "TekD doesnt think PS is worth $200 for a year of play. TekD is an ass hole. Therefore, PS must be worth $200 for a year of play."

No. You being an asshole is really quite independant of your opinion of PS. I care not a whit about what you think of PS, to be honest. What makes you an asshole are your incessent whine-fests about what you don't like, and the fact that you hang around forums devoted to a game that you don't like, and where (if you hadn't gathered this fact yet) nobody seems to like you.

You don't even contribute entertaining discussion on non-PS issues. Just long repetitive diatribes where you espouse your viewpoint (often an opinion with no basis in objective fact) as the only valid one in existance, and consider anyone who disagrees with you to be a "bitch".

If you had so much as a single iota of intellectual honesty in your "arguements", you would find that people respond to you considerably better.

Try attacking some of my points

Try making some.

and maybe ill give you some respect.

Yes, I live and breath for YOUR respect. Damn, someone O.D.'d on self importance pills today.

[TekDragon]

the fact that you hang around forums devoted to a game that you don't like, and where (if you hadn't gathered this fact yet) nobody seems to like you.
If you had so much as a single iota of intellectual honesty in your "arguements", you would find that people respond to you considerably better.
Yes, I live and breath for YOUR respect. Damn, someone O.D.'d on self importance pills today.

Ok, so let me get this straight.

You have read none of my arguments (you admit to this). You have considered none of my points (you dont even acknoweldge them). You spend an entire page of writing doing nothing but personally attacking me.

Then you tell me I dont belong on the "lounge" forum?

Lets see... how shall I oh so carefully respond to this..

Fuck you. You are nothing but a hypocritical, fanboy, child. Never have I see ANYONE argue like you. You have not only chosen to ignore every intellectual point ive made.. but you spend an entire page ranting on a personal flame.

Im reporting this post to Hamma. I dont know WHY the hell you would necro-post on this thread, bring it up, ignore all the points I (and others) made, then flame the hell out of me.

Oh and Matuse?
and the fact that you hang around forums devoted to a game that you don't like, and where (if you hadn't gathered this fact yet) nobody seems to like you.

I hang out in the lounge because I enjoy the community and the community enjoys me. Yeah, a topic develops now and then that splits the community down the middle (marijuana). And yeah, some issues (like PS) I have a grand total of one person on my side (actually i got quite a few supporters, but i only depend on my own points in an argument).

Just because 5% of my time on the lounge is spent on spirited debates doesnt mean shit. Just because some idiot fuckin fan boy wants to focus on that 5% (and i use focus in the loosest sence of the word, you dont even read my posts, just flame me) doesnt make a bit of difference in my world.

How about this Matuse? Ill make you a deal:

If three (thats it, just three) people of rank admiral or above tell me they honestly dont want me on the PSU lounge, ill leave. Simple as that.

[EDIT]
Just out of personal bafflment I forgot to mention this in the above post. Why the hell are you accusing me of flaming people who like PS and not making any points?

As I recall every damn post i make is that
1. I dont think people who like PS are wrong.
2. I think PS should have more content and less bugs for it to be worth so much money.
3. I desperately WANT PS to be worth the money they charge.

Just because you call a flower a pile of shit doesnt make it a pile of shit. Just because you flame me and say that I dont make any points, doesnt make it true.

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Fuck you. You are nothing but a hypocritical, fanboy, child.

Oh this is getting nice and heated up, yumm :)
But tek has to do this because matuse is just completely owning.... very good.

Because he likes ps and is wondering why someone who doesnt is posting on a ps fansite, he is called a fanboy........ not right.

[Airlift]

Im reporting this post to Hamma.

WTS? I'm gonna have to go ahead and call bullshit on this one. Reporting that post to Hamma would be like calling the cops b/c someone stole your chillum.

[TekDragon]

Airlift me and you have probly flamed each other the worst (other than this ass-wipe) over this issue.

Despite this you (sometimes) managed to make (meager) points. And you also (made attempts to) counter my arguments.

This guy didnt even read my posts. He just saw the topic was against his definition of PS, and chose to fire up the flames.

[Led]

Originally posted by TekDragon
necro-post

HARRRRR NECROPOST#!%

http://users.ev1.net/~bajah/insanecleric/necropost.jpg

GO GO SLEEP DEPRIVATION AND COFFEE!# MY CEILING IS ON FIRE#?

[TekDragon]

:eek:

Damnit LED I thought id escaped your evil clutches. Why must you haunt me like some evil, psycho bitch, spell checker thingy?

:love:

[Airlift]

My point wasn't whether we were arguing or merely flaming (and I'm going to ignore the little mini-flames in parenthetical, because Hamma has asked us to stop), it was simply that it is ridiculous to repeatedly roast other people and then report someone for flaming you in the same thread, despite the context or lack thereof.

[Led]

SWG CHARACTER ART WHEEEEE#!^%

http://users.ev1.net/~bajah/insanecleric/swgconcept.jpg

SOMEONE HELP ME I AM RUNNING LOW ON COFFEE

[TekDragon]

:eek:

Im gonna have fun hunting your ass down LED. Please tell me your playin a rebel :)

[Led]

Too many rebels!#% I WILL BE THE ICE CREAM AND PANTIES GESTAPO

[TekDragon]

I contend that writing a page essay on your opinions, then counter attacking your opponents opinions, then adding a few flames when your opponent doesnt address your points.. is ok.

Writing a page essay with the sole content being flames and insults for another person, without offering any points/counterpoints, is wrong.

Theres a huge difference between the first and the second.

The first is a logical argument between two or more people (the maturity of the people can vary wildly, hence the occasional flame).

The second is a one-sided personal attack for no reason other than to attempt to hurt the other person's feelings.

[Airlift]

We'll see how Hamma responds to your report. :D popcorn:

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Led
Too many rebels!#% I WILL BE THE ICE CREAM AND PANTIES GESTAPO

Led what the fuck did you drink/smoke this morning? Can I have some?

Please?

[Led]

SLEEP DEPRIVATION AND COFFEE AND AN ICE CREAM BAR!#%^

[Powerflux]

Oh gosh... This thread is a damn BOOK. Fuck it.

[Led]

This thread is almost as big as two XBoxes lolol/#!% *explodes*

[Powerflux]

http://deadline.phalanxhost.com/matt/screenShot0024.jpg

Heh heh.

[Robot]

i used to play a brawler

but now i can get incapitated by a womp rat. :(

[MuadDib]

The ONLY way to play is a male wookie dancer wearing garish clothing....

[Hamma]

OMFG 12 FPS!@$@!$@!@#$

[EineBeBoP]

are we allowed to show screens yet?
i thought the NDA was sstill up?

[kelisis]

No, it's down now.

[Hamma]

/me emails this thread to SOE

[Violator]

Originally posted by Prowler
Very Interesting.

yes very interesting:nod:

[Matuse]

Incoming War&Peace, Vol. 1....

You have read none of my arguments (you admit to this).

Patently untrue. Please quote relevant sections of where I indicated this. I will admit to skipping many of your posts, when after reading some of it, it becomes blatantly apparent that it is nothing more than a (very slightly) reworded version of an earlier post...winning an arguement through repetition buys you no yams in my book. Oh, changing your arguements from being listed by number to being indented with bullet points does not constitute a different arguement.

Then you tell me I dont belong on the "lounge" forum?

Reading comprehension is not a strong point with you, is it? Hard to believe when you are directly quoting me, but here it is again:

You don't even contribute entertaining discussion on non-PS issues. Just long repetitive diatribes where you espouse your viewpoint

I would indeed be quite happy if you were to leave PSU entirely, but while your "arguements" are uninteresting, nowhere do I say that you should leave the lounge specifically.

You are nothing but a hypocritical, fanboy, child. Never have I see ANYONE argue like you.

First, I'd dearly love to know where you come by calling me a PS fanboy. I await with baited breath your "proof" of this. Self pwnage is a rare thing to see, I will greatly enjoy your demonstration of it. That is of course, on the very reasonable assumption that you won't simply admit to being wrong. Do you have it in you?

For the rest...this is a big LOL...I guess because you saw me use the word in a previous post, and it has lots of letters in it, you feel an authority on calling me a hypocrite...please show with as much detail as you can possibly muster how I can even remotely fall into that category. YOU on the other hand are a poster boy for it. Proof follows:

Im reporting this post to Hamma.

Yes, in the very same thread where Hamma asked you to chill out. The same post where you have said "fuck you" to me at least 3 times. You don't even see the hypocrisy, do you?

I dont know WHY the hell you would necro-post on this thread

Let's see...the same day as my first post on this thread there were at least 17 replies previously (probably more, I only went back 1 page), including 4 from YOU. WARNING WARNING DANGER WILL ROBINSON --- Dead thread alert!!!!

Why the hell are you accusing me of flaming people who like PS and not making any points?

To be more accurate, you flame people who like PS without making any NEW points. Why should I bother to re-state what Airlift and other have already said? Unlike you, I don't believe that the way to convince people of your viewpoint is to hammer it into their head until they give up. Come up with something new.

He just saw the topic was against his definition of PS, and chose to fire up the flames.

Maybe you are simply confused about what the title of this thread is, but it has NOTHING to do with PS. Look at the top there, where it says "GALAXIES SET TO LAUNCH THIS MONTH". Oddly enough, when I clicked on this thread, the only person who I knew had posted here was Chryse as the thread originator. As for firing up the flames...you really think my first post was flaming? Personally, I think you got your panties in a knot because you have this great faith in SW:G, and can't stand the thought that it won't be fantabulous. But then, you also think that Ralph Koster is a good game designer, so maybe there is no hope for you at all.

Robot-
but now i can get incapitated by a womp rat.

Robot is TEH SUK...I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back home.

[simba]

Originally posted by TekDragon
Thats pretty fuckin ironic comin from you Airlift.

I just like how no one can ever tell me why PS deserves a $50 box price and $13 a month besides the following:

1. Duh, they made thier own engine! Thats like.. incredible! Game developers should get, like, mad extra props for that!
2. Five bases and a handful of crap weapons qualifies as "extreme" content that obviously took up many years worth of coding to put in.
3. YOU SUCK!

Sadly it seems to be number 3 is the most prevalent reason. Robot im not talkin about you. Im speakin to that spam/flamer Airlift. Your a little bitch.
couldent agree with u more. And I dont really know how u can call the "weapons" in the game weapons coz they dont look like weapons, they dont shoot like weapons and so on.

[simba]

Originally posted by Hamma
According to you everyone is an asshat, what you need to do is chill out :p
hes just saying wot he feels about PS, wots wrong with that?

[Onizuka]

Originally posted by simba
hes just saying wot he feels about PS, wots wrong with that?

let me get this straight..... YOU are defending tek??? oh boy oh boy

[simba]

Originally posted by Onizuka
let me get this straight..... YOU are defending tek??? oh boy oh boy
it is not me who cant take crap taken by someone who dont like the same game as u do, so yes.

also 4 any1 whos interrested, a new (I think) SWG movie is out
http://swvault.ign.com/articles/425/425301p1.html

And I dont have any idea why hamma hasnt closed this thread yet.

[Hamma]

This thread isnt breaking any rules.

And why did you bump it?

[Airlift]

Originally posted by simba
couldent agree with u more. And I dont really know how u can call the "weapons" in the game weapons coz they dont look like weapons, they dont shoot like weapons and so on.

Suck it, Trebeck.
I answered his points directly and he chose to pretend like I avoided them.

[shootx]

i'll stay outta choosing sides for this one.... the skill system is pretty kool........but swg needs alot more fixs b4 it comes out.......cough cough lets hope it's release doesn't turn out like EVE's release cough cough........dam eine learn to cover your mouth.....i think i cought what u had :)

[Strygun]

I didn't read this whole thread because it's 7am and I didn't really feel like it, however I wanted to make this comment:

Anyone else noticing a trend? Weren't people this excited over PS? And then when it was released, all the people who were excited about it began to complain and list every problem with the game. Lag, balance, graphics, etc etc etc. From what I understand from *very* trusty sources, is that this game won't be near ready for release when they say it will be. The amount of complaining about lag or balance or any kind of changes will be immense.

I'm just going to watch this game from a corner in a..*cough* galaxy far far away*.

I doubt it will make it anywhere.

[TekDragon]

I'm just going to watch this game from a corner in a..*cough* galaxy far far away*.

Laaaame.
;)

And thanks Simba for not insulting and flaming me just because I didnt type "PlanetSide is the best game in the world and doesnt have any problems or lackings".

[Chryse]

Originally posted by Strygun
Anyone else noticing a trend? Weren't people this excited over PS? And then when it was released, all the people who were excited about it began to complain and list every problem with the game.The problem is that hype gets people all worked up about a game, sometimes a few years ahead of time, and that people let their imagination take over, thus forming expectations that can never truly be realized.

Nothing destroys a game faster than raised and, sometimes, unrealized expectations. That's what my experience has shown me, anyway.

[TekDragon]

I have to diagree. Personally, i believe what makes a bad game is lazy game developers who dont give a shit about the quality of the game they put out, so long as they get their paycheck.

That laziness is why i didnt like Asherons Call 2. That laziness is why im unhappy with PlanetSide.

Maybe its not the devs fault. Maybe its the marketing staff's fault for saying "Hey, put out a game with pretty graphics and absolute shit for content and we can charge $13 a month on top of a $50 box price!!".

Developers should have pride for the games they make. Its why Ultima Online was so great. Its why Half Life, Halo, and Tribes were great, and its why people are looking forward to the sequels.

Making a game just to collect a paycheck is just wrong. Im sad thats what Sony has decided to use as its business model.

[Grunt]

CONTENT does NOT make a game good or bad. Each individual makes up their own mind about every specific game they play. Is it fun or not? That's a very hard thing to describe to somebody and everybody's opinion is different.

If a game is fun, you pay the money and play it. If it's not you don't. It's that simple. From the looks of it SWG will be even buggier that PS was at launch, and of course PS WAS buggy. No doubt about it.

SWG will succeed on the basis of the license.. even if the game itself sucks people will still play it. I'm a huge starwars fan but nothing in that game is hugely different than any other damn RPG on the market. The genre is just too repeitive nowadays and there's no innovation. Kind of like how every RTS game is the same thing now.

Planetside doesn't really innovate either. It's just a FPS with more people. Which is what I want and what I think is fun. So I play it.

Now if you're done trolling just for the sake of trolling, you can take the rest of your opinions and shove them up your hairy wookie ***** :)

[Airlift]

This thread will never die... Flame springs eternal.

[TekDragon]

CONTENT does NOT make a game good or bad.

Let me get this straight. You tell me that my argument of: "If PS had more content (ie: bases, weapons, strategies, stuff to fight over, etc) it would be a better game and worth the money", is NOT valid because:

1. Content does not make a good game.
2. Its impossible for anyone to say what will make a good game because everyone has different opinions.

First of all, let me say that your theory invalidates the existance of all game reviewing magazines and sites in existance. If I cant say "Ok, this game has shit for content and isnt worth $13 a month" how come a game reviewer can?

Second of all, let me say that if I ever enter the marketing world with a shitty product, you will be the first person i call [SOB] Grunt. I will charge you exorbitant amounts of money for a product worth a tenth of that. You will gleefully pay me because "content does not make a good game". *snicker*
I think marketing staffs have names for people like you... they call them "suckers".

-----------------------------------------------------
I'm a huge starwars fan but nothing in that game is hugely different than any other damn RPG on the market. The genre is just too repeitive nowadays and there's no innovation. Kind of like how every RTS game is the same thing now.
Then, after making the above point (which i so happily counter-pointed), you then make a judgement on SWG based on *gasp* CONTENT. Im not an english major.. but i believe we call that "Irony". Im also not a social science major.. but i believe we also call that "being a hypocrite".

Besides, what crack pipe are you smoking from?

Heres a list of the skill sets (called professions) in Star Wars Galaxies (note these are only the beggining professions. The devs have promised several more soon after release):

Artisan, Brawler, Entertainer, Marksman, Medic, Scout, Architect, Armor Smith, Bio Engineer, Bounty Hunter, Carbineer, Chef, Combat Medic, Commando, Creature Handler, Dancer Doctor, Droid Engineer, Image Designer, Merchant, Musician, Fencer, Pistoleer, Pikeman, Ranger, Rifleman, Smuggler, Squad Leader, Tailor, Teras Kasi, Swordsman, and Weaponsmith.

Each of those professions contain 18 skills. Each of those skills paths give you bonuses to your skills, commands, abilities, and knowledge (schematics).

Just as an example i will pick a skill at random from the.. 558 skills available.

Expert Counter-Sniping Techniques:
Skill Mods:
Block +5
Defense Vs. Blind +10
Defense Vs. Dizzy +10
Defense Vs. Posture Change +30
Defense Vs. Stun +10
Commands and Abilities Gained:
Flushing Shot 2 (Ability)

[SOB]Grunt. I dont know about you, but 558 unique skills, each of which offer new abilities and skills.... thats what i fucking call content. Thats what i call a dev team that isnt sitting on their ass waiting for the next paycheck.

You can sit there and defend PS till your blue in the face. . You can defend its 5 fucking base designs for the entire world. You can defend its "3 unique weapons per empire" BS. You can defend the fact that every time you log on you do the same damn crap every time.

I was hoping for more from a MMOFPS. I was expecting something more to do than:


Spawn
Rush enemy base
Die
Repeat till base is captured


I was expecting real strategies and fights over terrains. I was picturing massive vehicle battles over broken mountains. Instead I get to zerg rush a fucking base with my squad over and over until we disable the spawn tubes. *insert sigh here*

Maybe im an idiot for actually wanting more for the fact that im paying more. Maybe some of you are right. Perhaps paying more for the same old shit (possibly less of the same old shit, we dont even get jetpacks) is the way of the world now.

Pardon me while I go bang my head into a wall at how weve fallen.

[TekDragon]

Powerflux, can you please remove the pic? Its f'ing up the size of the thread making it hard to read people's posts. Thanks.

[Onizuka]

i could care less if this thread ever dies and i dont know why anyone would want it too. its quite amusing actually

contributing to the current debate:

Truthfully, to someone who has a lot of money or places a relatively low importance on money in general, it takes very little to justify a $200 expenditure.

i agree with airlift totally and especially on this point. Teks logic falls short in many area of which airlift has already pointed out.
Even someone who places much value on money, over the course of a year (and it is doubtfull the person will play that much) 200 bucks still justifys the expenditure.

I would guess this has to do with game addiction

[TekDragon]

Oni. I cant see what you write, but i can see when your the latest poster on a thread.

Its interesting cause i NEVER see anyone reply directly to you, or quote you. If it wasnt for the fact that the thread gets bumped and it says "Latest poster: onizuka", i wodnt know you existed.

Im saying this cause im 99% sure you either just insulted me, or you posted something that contributes abolutely zilch to the current debate, thus spamming (which you know i hate).

I dunno why i wrote this. Im bored and I thought it was funny. Im willing to lay down $20 that Oni's last post was less than 50 words (im sure im being generous there, its prob 10-20) and contributed zero points on the current debate.

Someone tell me if im wrong :)

[Airlift]

Try not to own yourself Tek... Onizuka didn't mention you at all. You had the length and debate level down fairly well, 23 words and nothing about the subject of SWG, Planetside, or their comparitive value.

I'm gonna get back into this because I am equally bored, but I'm going to be extra nice so we don't offend any of our readers' sensative nature.

I just want to point out what I consider to be one of the bigger fallacies in your logic:

If PS had more content (ie: bases, weapons, strategies, stuff to fight over, etc) it would be a better game and worth the money
The above is garbage because the sentance goes on way too long for its own good. It would be a good solid statement to say:

If PS had more content (ie: bases, weapons, strategies, stuff to fight over, etc) it would be a better game

The problem is that you presume to see into the hearts and wallets of your audience. Truthfully, to someone who has a lot of money or places a relatively low importance on money in general, it takes very little to justify a $200 expenditure. To someone with very little money or who is extremely frugal, it takes a great deal to do so. Then there is the reviewer's tilt. You write a review based on your own desires and expectations (which is fine) and then sell it as objective truth (which is what will get you flamed every time). To quote the dude, "that's just like... your opinion, man." Everyone has their own opinions, preferences, expectations, etc. Most of everyone will respond negatively to being told that someone else's dissenting opinion is fact.

Whoops, that was way too long for a minor side point, but I'll leave it since we're being graded on word count ;)

In any case, the important distinction that you are not making is that the quality of the content is at least as important to the value of the game as the quantity. That was the point I made when I dissected EQ's masses of content (which you dismissed as off topic even though you claimed I couldn't recognize your parallels [/ironic]). It is fine for you to reskin a Blackburrow gnoll and call him a Splitpaw gnoll, but don't expect me to give you much credit for the additional content.

I would take a few well done and more importantlywell balanced weapons over a drove of poorly thought out and implemented ones without hesitation.

Underlying the entire debate is this: The developers chose to take a bare-bones essentials approach to Planetside in order to deliver on Massive, sacrificing many of the grander ideas that did not fit the core focus of the game. That is not only for technical and performance reasons, but also for usability purposes. The game has enough complexity to make for a sharp but thankfully short learning curve. There is a lot of intricate relation between the equipment, guns, and vehicles that do exist. Everything has a specific purpose (except maybe the beamer...) and everything serves its purpose well.

Obviously the sacrifices that came with the game design are unacceptable to you. If you were in the beta, then you were a sucker for buying retail, and I can understand the need to lash out on the forums. If you weren't in the beta and it came as a suprise what you spent your money on, I can also sympathize with your bad purchase. The rest of us knew what we were buying into, and as such we have no compelling reason to post little tirades against the game and all the people who are satisfied with their purchase.

Just in case that wasn't extra nice, here are some smileys for you:

:D :) :cool: ;) :p :eek: :love: :D :D

[TekDragon]

Airlift, first of all id like to thank you for the smiley :love:

I think you went slightly off course though. I completely agree with your "to each their own" style of thinking when it comes to personal opinions on the value of a game (or any product). I will NEVER tell ANYONE to not buy this game. I will simply say that, in my opinion, it is not worth the money. That has always been my stance.

I believe we see eye-to-eye on that issue.

However, you forget that personal opinion is not 100% of the issue. In fact, its only a small one. The mass public opinions are far more important than any number of personal opinions.

This is why we have game reviewing sites. They play the game and test it in various ways (categories like graphics, sound, gameplay, learning curve, etc) against other games of similar genres.

When you look at PlanetSide in that regard is when you start to see my opinion. PlanetSide is, plain and simply, a half-assed attempt at a FPS. It can be seen by comparing it to other games of the same genre like Halo, Half Life, Tribes, etc.

Now, again, were not getting into personal opinions here. You may say you hate Halo. Thats fine. Personally, i hate Half-Life. But I still acknowledge that it was a groundbreaking game that offered graphics, sound, AND gameplay content.

I admit to liking PlanetSide. I thought it was kinda fun. However, i do not find it worth the money.

Airlift, you seem to think thats not a valid argument tactic. Therefore, ill try to use a parallel.

Lets say you enjoy driving convertable vehicles (any make, any model, so long as its a convertable). Lets say a good number of people enjoy driving convertables. Now lets say a high profile vehicle manufacturer came out with a 2004 model convertable.

Pretend its the first convertable vehicle to have this new engine with a high HP (not insanely high, just 50-75 higher than the usual engine size). People are excited about it. Now, lets pretend that this vehicle manufacturer made this 2004 vehicle with the following (in parenthesis are the parallels to PS):

-Convertable (FPS)
-Brand new engine (MM aspect)
-2002 Body style (graphics)
-Sub-average sound system (in game sounds)
-No power steering, no air conditioning, no traction control, no fog lights, cloth seats, etc etc (lack of any comparable content like HL, Tribes, or even Halo has)

Now, lets pretend that this vehicle manufacturer charged 250 thousand dollars for this car (roughly 4 times the amount of other convertables).

Would you buy it? No. Of course not. 250 thousand is alot of money. Its prepostrous to blow that much money.

However, the ratios and comparisons were all valid when comparig the situation above to PS. You may not think $200 is much, but i personally dont believe in spending FOUR times as much for a game that offers me LESS overall enjoyment than a $50 game.

[Onizuka]

HAMMA pleas help, tek is bashing me even though hes ignoring me...... how does he manage to do this. please, do something with the ignore feature!

[Grunt]

Tekdragon: So if CONTENT is king, why the hell was / is Tetris so popular? There's tons of games available that aren't necessarily based on content. It just so happens that an RPG IS based on content.

Oh wait a minute.... Planetside isn't an RPG and SWG is? Hmmm, that would mean that SWG is SUPPOSED to have more content huh?

[TekDragon]

Your an idiot. Period.

Tetris had tons of content. It had a SIX block types, a high score system, variable speed and difficulty levels, and a good control scheme. When you consider the fact that Tetris was one of the first releases for the original gameboy and was a puzzle game... Tetris rocked ass on content, graphics, and gameplay.

RPGs back in the day also had content. Yes. They have very varying levels of content and its all compared differently. The original Zelda games, FF games, and Ultima games for the NES were all great games. They had excellent content, graphics, and gameplay for their times. Some RPGs released back then sucked mad dick. Crystallis for example.

Now, this isnt 1985. Is it? No. Its 2003. Therefore in order to judge PlanetSide we have to judge it with other games in similar categories.

Im pretty sure anyone with 5 IQ points to rub together would understand that comparing PlanetSide's content to Tetris's content is a futile endeavor. Ill make a special case for you, though :)

---------------------------------------

Now, about comparing PS to recent MMORPGs. It can be done. Easily. Your problem is your being close minded about it.

You think that because I point ot the 1000s of hours the SWG team spent on "tailoring" and "fishing" amd the RPG content.. that I belive PlanetSide should have tailoring and fishing and fucking gardening.

STOP BEING AN IDIOT

Your not earning *ANY* points by pointing out that PS is not an RPG. We all know that.

My comparisons of "content" are simply parallels of cost vs product. I look at what the development teams of SWG, AC, AO, and UO did. I see how much work they spent in doing AI scripting, economies, balanced levels/classes, quests, 1000s of items, player housing, player towns, etc, etc, etc.

Then I look at the PS content: 5 bases, 3 unique weapons per empire, 2 unique vehicles per empire.
THEN I look at the PS gameplay: spawn, rush base, die, repeat till cap base, start over.

First of all, the content took about 1/100 the time/effort as the SWG and UO team did. It probly took about 1/10 the effort of the Halo team.

Second of all, the gameplay is exactly the same as if I were playing in a Tribes "domination" match on a 64 player server.

[DISCLAIMER: the above was an understatement. A 64 player server in Tribes in a good mod has way more action, content, and fun-factor. The above was simply for a general gaming comparison]

The question is not: "Why would I pay $200 for PlanetSide?".

The question is: "Why would Sony charge $200 for PlanetSide".

The first question is a personal one, open to personal opinions and preferences.
The second question is a broader, more professional one. Try focusing on it, instead of attacking me personally.

[TekDragon]

BTW: Powerflux i put you on ignore until this thread debate is done with or it moves to page 5. Your pic is b0rking up the thread. Nothin personal man.

[Airlift]

However, you forget that personal opinion is not 100% of the issue. In fact, its only a small one. The mass public opinions are far more important than any number of personal opinions.

This is why we have game reviewing sites. They play the game and test it in various ways (categories like graphics, sound, gameplay, learning curve, etc) against other games of similar genres.

When you look at PlanetSide in that regard is when you start to see my opinion. PlanetSide is, plain and simply, a half-assed attempt at a FPS. It can be seen by comparing it to other games of the same genre like Halo, Half Life, Tribes, etc.

You can't bring mass opinions to play here, because the mass opinion does not agree with you. The vast majority of the published reviews rate the game very highly. That was one of my first problems with your anti-ps rants, that you claimed professional reviewers must be biased by preferential treatment because they did not share your disappointment with the game. It isn't that you had negative things to say about the game (I have plenty myself), The trouble is that you weren't leaving room for the possibility that your experience and feelings towards the game were actually in the minority.

One thing I would like to see is a point by point comparison between what you consider to be the content of Halo versus the content of Planetside. I'm glad you brought that one up, because I'm fairly familiar with Halo and it's got roughly the same amount of content, only with a single-player slant rather than being an online-only game.

Now, on to your car comparison. I personally would not pay $250,000 for any car. On the other hand, if I brought home $250,000 in a week, I would buy the car if I felt even the slightest whim to do so. Cranking your numbers back to the scale of the game, there are a whole lot of gamers who clear $200 in a week easily. You could do that waiting tables.

Sorry to jump around in your post, but there is one more thing I want to touch on:

I admit to liking PlanetSide. I thought it was kinda fun. However, i do not find it worth the money.

Airlift, you seem to think thats not a valid argument tactic.

You've got me all wrong. It is completely valid, and I'm saying it is the only argument you have to stand on. It's fine for you to not think the game is worth it, or even to hate it (as surely some players did -- not that you did, but someone has to hate it). It is fine for you to keep posting your opinions about it. We leave fine behind when you make wild assumptions about the underpinnings of the game to support your argument. So let's just agree that none of us knows about the storage, server requirements, bandwidth, and netcode of PS or any of the games we've been comparing it to. We can only speak with authority about our opinions and about the experience of playing the game itself.

fair?

[simba]

Originally posted by Airlift
Suck it, Trebeck.
I answered his points directly and he chose to pretend like I avoided them.
woah, insulting me for having an opinion, not that I know wot trebeck is but im pretty sure its an insult.

so sorry 4 the opinion air.

[Airlift]

Simba, did you even read the post you quoted and claimed to agree 100% with? It was full of insult directly to me.

[simba]

yeah I read it, and agreed

[Airlift]

Good, then you understand why I think you can suck it. Suck it long, suck it hard.

[simba]

**quote**

I just like how no one can ever tell me why PS deserves a $50
box price and $13 a month besides the following:

1. Duh, they made thier own engine! Thats like.. incredible! Game developers should get, like, mad extra props for that!
2. Five bases and a handful of crap weapons qualifies as "extreme" content that obviously took up many years worth of coding to put in.
3. YOU SUCK!


yeah, sounds more like ur the insulter.

[simba]

Originally posted by Hamma
This thread isnt breaking any rules.

And why did you bump it?
I think ive seen a few other that u closed that wasnt breaking any rules.
dunno why I bumped it, wanted to say wot I think.

gonna sleep some now air.

[Airlift]

GG leaving all the insulting shit out this time. Too bad it's still in the original post and the post where you quoted it...


Originally posted by TekDragon
Thats pretty fuckin ironic comin from you Airlift.

I just like how no one can ever tell me why PS deserves a $50 box price and $13 a month besides the following:

1. Duh, they made thier own engine! Thats like.. incredible! Game developers should get, like, mad extra props for that!
2. Five bases and a handful of crap weapons qualifies as "extreme" content that obviously took up many years worth of coding to put in.
3. YOU SUCK!

Sadly it seems to be number 3 is the most prevalent reason. Robot im not talkin about you. Im speakin to that spam/flamer Airlift. Your a little bitch.



couldent agree with u more. And I dont really know how u can call the "weapons" in the game weapons coz they dont look like weapons, they dont shoot like weapons and so on.


Now then, in case you still don't see where I'm the insulted, let me repeat it for you:

Robot im not talkin about you. Im speakin to that spam/flamer Airlift. Your a little bitch.

Maybe the broken english threw you off. He's not saying that I have a little bitch. He's saying that I am a little bitch. Further, he calls me a spammer and a flamer. Then, if you look back on the top of that quote, you will see how ironic he felt my post was, then he goes on to say why... which includes three arguments that I NEVER FUCKING MADE, JACKASSES. I didn't say shit about the technical hurdles or how cool it was that PS uses its own engine. I never made a peep to indicate that I thought of five bases as a lot of bases. And I never tried to say that the amount that Tek sucks has anything to do with the quality or value of the game.

Try comprehending what you read next time, then think about it for a while before you quote it.

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Airlift
Simba, did you even read the post you quoted and claimed to agree 100% with? It was full of insult directly to me.
Originally posted by simba
yeah I read it, and agreed
:rofl:
Originally posted by Airlift
Good, then you understand why I think you can suck it. Suck it long, suck it hard.
:rofl: :rofl:
Originally posted by Airlift
Maybe the broken english threw you off. He's not saying that I have a little bitch. He's saying that I am a little bitch.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: *insert dying from laughter smiley here*

Its true!! Its so true!!

*wipes tears from eyes*

:love:

[OneManArmy]

...so...uh....what was that about Star Wars Galaxies now?....:confused:

[Sp3ctre]

Why can't everyone agree to disagree? Some people think PS is worth it, some don't. Some people like Star Wars, some don't.

Where's the :love:?

[FearTheAtlas]

I think the :love: was nerfed in beta...

[Powerflux]

Hmm. Seems that I can't remove the screenie.

The administrator has specified that you can only edit messages for 1440 minutes after you have posted. This limit has expired, so you must contact the administrator to make alterations on your message.

[simba]

airlift, u saw wot I quoted 4 u? If u did, then u might understand wot I agree with him on.
In fact, I also wonder how it could take 3 years 4 the developers to come up with all that shit, but u dont seem to be able to answer that.
And I dont think u will, so im just wasting my time here. *trebeck leaves thread*

[Airlift]

Of course I can't answer it cos I'm not a soe developer. Sorry that you wasted all that time. What else would you have done with it?

[TekDragon]

Originally posted by Airlift
Of course I can't answer it cos I'm not a soe developer. Sorry that you wasted all that time. What else would you have done with it?

I think your taking the question to literally.

Back up, look at what other game developers (specifically FPS developers and MMRPG developers) do in 3 years.

Then look at what the PS team has done.

Can you at least admit that there is a difference in the effort put into both games?

Airlift, neither me or Simba is really even focusing on the fact that the PS devs did less than the EQ devs or the UO devs. What were saying is that, since its obvious LESS effort was put in... why are we paying the same amount?

[Airlift]

Nope. I do not see how much less effort was put into this game than that other one that you're talking about. Has it started to sink in yet that I don't agree with you that the content of the game is crappy, and/or lacking? If not, please note that I do not think the content of planetside is crappy and/or lacking. Warning: This may not be in agreement with your opinion.

You can explain to me exactly the difference in effort between Planetside and Halo, or Planetside and EQ/UO, any game you want. Do Neocron, I guess it was the next closest thing we've seen to a MMFPS. I'll go over it with you but we're not likely to get anywhere because we do not agree.

PS. I don't agree with the words you are posting. It does not help that I am currently also still having fun playing the game that so little effort was put into over 3 years.

[TekDragon]

You suck.

[Airlift]

http://www.clanstfu.com/images/ownercycle.jpg

[QuakCow]

i just want to say the skygaurd is in-game aleady an the liberator is comign within 2-3 weeks

[Sandman]

RL friend of mine is doing beta and it sucks ass. and PS costs enough money monthly already, SWG is a rip at $15 a month