The Striker

[FliggenMan]

I have seen multiple posts on the need for the Jackhammer to be nerfed drastically, but personally, I am worried much more about the all powerful Striker.

The Terran Republic is about massive amounts of ballistic firepower, so the probability of a hit is increased and the sheer amount of ammo and lightning fast rate of fire whipes out the enemy. Tell me if I'm wrong.

The Striker's primary function not only doesn't follow this trend, but it completely opposes it. The Striker is a guided rocket launcher that homes in to targets. That's a missle with a feedback system that increases it's precision. That's not what the Terran is about.

Now as for the practical application, I use a VS MAX as my secondary characters. I can't walk out of a door in a TR battlefield with ATLEAST 3 missle locks, and that's not an exageration.

The Vanu Sovereignty is supposed to use precision weaponry that is versatile, but not relatively strong. The TR is not. If you give one empire strengths that the others are supposed to have, you imbalance the type of technology they have by implementing one type of technology into the other. What if you gave the Lancer the strength of the Pheonix and the guidance systems of the Striker? People tend to not notice and overpowering weapon when it's not related to the strength of it, but I do. And this is one of them.

When i see a TR anti-vehicular weapon, i see a fast firing fragmentation cannon, where the massive amount of small explosions and shrapnel eats away at yer enemy untill his is nothing but soot and boots...or something in that vicinity.

My ultimate point is this: the Striker cannot stay the way it is, and the Lancer cannot stay the way it is. Both are in each other's parking spaces, and neither of them fit well there.

[HawkEye]

i see the lancer being used against infantry and MAX. isnt the lancer anti-vehicle? i know it is suppoed to inflict a lot of damage against MAXes but it also does pretty good damage against infantry.

[Happy lil Elf]

I hate the striker. I don't wish to see it nerfed, but I hate it all the same. As a Vanguard driver I can't drive anywhere where there are TR without a perma missile lock >.<

[FliggenMan]

yes, vanu weapons are supposed to be versatile, but not that versatile. Its practically a sniper rifle.

[MilitantB0B]

HIGH ROF RPG CHAINGUN!!!!!
For the love of God, lets not go messing with things just cause. if they aren't broken (wich the striker isn't) then don't fix it. Right now the Striker is a good weapon, not an awsome one (and I don't play TR at all, so you are getting an unbaisised statement here). The fact is that what you described would be more along the same lines as the rest of the TR weapons and not be overpowered. The problem is that right now, most people are copacetic with the AV weapons, changing them would just opent the door for more whining and bitching. Each AV weapon has its own unique edge:
TR- Locking missle
NC- User guided missles
VS- Long distance, instintaneous travel time, and good against infantry.

In my book, they are all good for different things. Sometimes I would give a thousand pheonixs for a single lancer, and sometimes I would give a thousand lancers for a stiker. It all just depends on the circumstances.


EDIT:
yes, vanu weapons are supposed to be versatile, but not that versatile. Its practically a sniper rifle. Yeah, why would you ever use a lancer when you could just use a bolt driver? Oh... wait.... maybe its because a lanmcer can drop a soldier in 3 hits and a MAX in 6, and do decent damage against vehciles. Ever try to kill a MAX or vehcile with a BD, it aint pretty. Lancer is fine, just different. I wouldn't even have a problem if they boosted the AV side of it, so long as they stripped the AI side away.

[Big Bro]

I just plain disagree.

TR's strengths:
Rate of Fire
Accuracy at longer range

At least that's how I remember reading about it when the game first started. I can't see how the Striker doesn't fit the "Accuracy at longer range" category.

In any case, leave TR alone. They've nerfed TR quite enough already with changes to MAXs and such, as well as boosting VS MAX with damage and clip capacity.

BTW, I agree with the multiple posts on the need for the Jackhammer to be nerfed. When you can kill a person in fully reinforced armor (undamaged, mind you) in two shots, that's insane. Also, the Jackhammers eat through the terrible TR MAXs that people complained about and got their way.

And people wonder why there was a population shift on Emerald from VS and TR to NC...

Summary: I disagree. Striker is fine. Nerf the Jackhammer.

[FearTheAtlas]

Originally posted by =NCG=Big Bro
I just plain disagree.

TR's strengths:
Rate of Fire
Accuracy at longer range

At least that's how I remember reading about it when the game first started. I can't see how the Striker doesn't fit the "Accuracy at longer range" category.

In any case, leave TR alone. They've nerfed TR quite enough already with changes to MAXs and such, as well as boosting VS MAX with damage and clip capacity.

BTW, I agree with the multiple posts on the need for the Jackhammer to be nerfed. When you can kill a person in fully reinforced armor (undamaged, mind you) in two shots, that's insane. Also, the Jackhammers eat through the terrible TR MAXs that people complained about and got their way.

And people wonder why there was a population shift on Emerald from VS and TR to NC...

Summary: I disagree. Striker is fine. Nerf the Jackhammer.


:stupid:

[Wolfeh]

Christ , what is it with people and nerfing the TR . You've got a rail gun thats very effective at long range ,very effective against maxs an very effective against infantry . Striker really isnt that powerful . Half the time it doesnt lock onto things , the lock breaks easily we have to reload if we want to kill a fully armoured max , its pathetic against most vehicles an its actuly quite hard to shoot down descent reaver pilots . Oh and TR are ment to have a high rate of fire , i havent seen any thing mentioned over accuracy and i think the striker holds true to that .If i were to say i cant walk into an nc held base with out dieing to aload of jackhammers with a few seconds what would people say ? Go in a different way , different tactic what not . Work round weapons an dont expect em to bend to your needs :|

[MilitantB0B]

Originally posted by =NCG=Big Bro
I just plain disagree.

TR's strengths:
Rate of Fire
Accuracy at longer range

At least that's how I remember reading about it when the game first started. I can't see how the Striker doesn't fit the "Accuracy at longer range" category.

In any case, leave TR alone. They've nerfed TR quite enough already with changes to MAXs and such, as well as boosting VS MAX with damage and clip capacity.

BTW, I agree with the multiple posts on the need for the Jackhammer to be nerfed. When you can kill a person in fully reinforced armor (undamaged, mind you) in two shots, that's insane. Also, the Jackhammers eat through the terrible TR MAXs that people complained about and got their way.

And people wonder why there was a population shift on Emerald from VS and TR to NC...

Summary: I disagree. Striker is fine. Nerf the Jackhammer. Whoa whoa whoa, back the exageration train up a bit, I agreed with everything you said before and after that bolded statement. The TR MAXs are still very good. You want to see a terrible MAX? Join NC. In my opinion, TR and VS are about tired for best MAXs now. TR MAXs are still very good.

[NecroChu]

I'm a striker user and I only use it to kill maxes and flying vehicles that are slow to escape my lock. Wolfeh is right about the lock on. I can be standing a few yards away and it simply will not lock onto the target until its destroyed :confused:. Vanguards and Magriders will own me hardcore even after I hit it with 12 hits from the striker.

[FliggenMan]

Accuracy from a long range? Um that's not how i see it at all. This is what the antivehicular weapons are comprised of as of now:

Striker-Moderately strong missle, Homing capabilities, dumb fire mode as well.

Pheonix- Camera guided missle with reasonable velocity restrictions, Packs a punch like a bitch :).

Lancer- Dumb fire, fastest refire rate out of the three AV weapons. Largest clip, weakest ammunition. Can kill infantry more easily from a distance.



The Terran's weapons focus on killing their opponents quickly. Their weapons have the highest rate of fire of the 3 empires.

I rest my case.

[Wolfeh]

When the striker works it does precisely that , kill quickly an quite frankly im sick of seeing people constaly whine nerf striker

[Warborn]

Well, the Striker is ass against anything but vehicles/MAXs, which the Lancer and Phoenix are not, so hey, it all evens out. You don't like getting perma-missile lock, we don't like getting sniped by missiles fired by someone we can't even see (or perforated by a laser cannon by a guy we can barely see).

All the weapons have a benefit. They're all decent, and you don't want to start needlessly nerfing them, because the nerf bat swings both ways.

[HawkEye]

im tired of peeps complaining about jackhammer. it is a tri-barrels auto shotty it gonna kick ur ass if ur on recieveing end. other empires can use it also. if all u non NC peeps say every NC carries one. then cert in HA and loot a freaking jackhammer and were all happy. theres no rule that says u cant loot or use a jackhammer.

[ZionsFire]

:stupid: oh yeah and like i said before
ITS A FRIGGIN TRI BARRELED SHOTGUN ITS SUPPOSED TO KICK ASS! :mad: sorry guys u were makin me mad once again

[HawkEye]

:D :thumbsup:

[Deadlock]

i too am pissed off about the jackhammer whining. my rifle sucks, my bazooka punches limp wristed, dont take my shotty away from me!!! its all i have left :mad:

[Kaikou]

Originally posted by Warborn
Well, the Striker is ass against anything but vehicles/MAXs, which the Lancer and Phoenix are not, so hey, it all evens out. You don't like getting perma-missile lock, we don't like getting sniped by missiles fired by someone we can't even see (or perforated by a laser cannon by a guy we can barely see).

All the weapons have a benefit. They're all decent, and you don't want to start needlessly nerfing them, because the nerf bat swings both ways.


^^^^^AMEN^^^^^

Honestly, people whine about anything. You people cry nerf just because something can kill you. Before you cry nerf, try using it. Certify and use the weapon for awhile. Before I tried heavy assault and tried the jackhammer, I was dead set on that thing being nerfed hard. But now that I use it, I don't see a need for it to be nerfed, but rather or the other 2 HA weapons to be beefed up a bit.

The striker has it's own unique properties, as do the other 2 AV weapons. The lancer mows down infantry from sniper distance, the phoenix can be fire from somewhere completely safe and guided to a target. The striker can lock onto vehicles (by the way, the striker will LOSE it's lock if the user takes the reticle off their target. The grass is always greener on the other side, you'll all find that to be true. Just because the other empire has a powerful weapon you want it nerfed so that empire is easier to kill.

Leave the striker alone, leave the game alone, play it for what it is and let the devs fix what they don't like about it.

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by HawkEye
i see the lancer being used against infantry and MAX. isnt the lancer anti-vehicle? i know it is suppoed to inflict a lot of damage against MAXes but it also does pretty good damage against infantry.

I know. Almost how the jackhammer eats up MAXes as well as infantry, no?

Originally posted by MilitantB0B

VS- Long distance, instintaneous travel time, and good against infantry.


It's not instantaneous at all. Have you ever used a lancer? There's a delay between when you push fire and when the weapon actually fires and another delay between when the projectile is fired and when it actually hits the target. There are no hitscan weapons in PS, and the lancer isn't an exception.

Originally posted by ReaperofDeath27
:stupid: oh yeah and like i said before
ITS A FRIGGIN TRI BARRELED SHOTGUN ITS SUPPOSED TO KICK ASS! :mad: sorry guys u were makin me mad once again

That is, quite honestly, the most profoundly retarded pro-JH argument I've ever heard.

Anyway, what was this thread about? Oh yeah - the striker. Right.

My problem with the striker is that its lock radius is too large and the lock is too strong. A striker trooper can very, very easily down an enemy MAX without even aiming particularly well.

Here's a newsflash for you: the lancer has a pretty large CoF at a distance, and it actually requires that you aim at the target. What a concept that is. Conversely, the striker pretty much just kills MAXes for you. In a VS MAX, I can jumpjet behind a hill, I can run through trees, I can do whatever the hell I want and that striker lock isn't going to go away.

Earlier today a striker trooper sent me a tell saying "lol I wasn't even aiming at you" when he killed me. That pretty much summed up my one problem with the weapon: absolutely no skill is required to be ridiculously effective with it.

[HawkEye]

dude stfu what reaperofdeath said is true. a tri-barreled auto shotty is gonna kicks ass for the second time. it is supposed to do alot of damage cuz it is an AUTO SHOTGUN.

[Intruder]

Originally posted by HawkEye
dude stfu what reaperofdeath said is true. a tri-barreled auto shotty is gonna kicks ass for the second time. it is supposed to do alot of damage cuz it is an AUTO SHOTGUN.


*wonders if he knows who he just said STFU to.....

[Smaug]

I agree with TR, and the smart other-empire people here. Leave it be. Sure it doesn't fit the 'theme' of the empire. Does the phoenix fit the theme!? No I don't think so. Nowhere does it say that NC has remotely guided weapons.... But all you TR out there, don't fret if you can't destroy a max in one clip, all you have to do is just aim the thing at people :P. Whenever I see "MISSLE LOCK" on my screen, I run like hell when I'm in vech.

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by HawkEye
dude stfu what reaperofdeath said is true. a tri-barreled auto shotty is gonna kicks ass for the second time. it is supposed to do alot of damage cuz it is an AUTO SHOTGUN.

Well, then let's extrapolate this.

The Comet MAX fires hot balls of plasma at a high rate of fire. I don't know about you, but when I think of something that fires plasma at me, I would assume that this weapon would be, indeed, "kick-ass." Instead, the Comet MAX sucks. Please explain.

While we're at it, aren't grenades "supposed to do a lot of damage?" Aren't they supposed to "kick ass?" I mean, again, maybe it's just me, but since my introduction at an early age to the concept of a handgrenade, I usually regarded them as a rather potent weapon. Yet, most people in PS don't carry frag grenades.

I dunno, maybe your logic is simply too complex for me, or maybe you're a complete idiot with no real argument. Are you going to contribute to the thread or are you going to pat yourself on the back a few more times first?

Originally posted by Intruder
*wonders if he knows who he just said STFU to.....

I'm not sure what this implies but, er, thanks? :)

[Incompetent]

I can jumpjet
This three letter quote, imho, invalidates your entire arguement, anyone who jumpjets to avoid a striker, outside of extremely specific circumstances, doesn't know enough about it to comment.

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by Incompetent
This three letter quote, imho, invalidates your entire arguement, anyone who jumpjets to avoid a striker, outside of extremely specific circumstances, doesn't know enough about it to comment.

Hey, I have a fun game we can play. It's called "Keep Quotes in Context." Do you want to play? Cool, me too!

Okay, let me go first!

"I can jumpjet behind a hill" implies a lot more than "I can jumpjet." The striker's supposed to require the soldier to aim the entire way to the target, no? Due to the game's very crappy clipping for objects and lock-on, you can stand behind a building, a hill, or whatever you want and they'll still hit you.

Wasn't that a fun game?

By the way, I find it obvious that I am, in fact, a complete newb. I've been playing VS MAX since exclusive beta (where I obviously newbed it up) and throughout retail (where I am known by my nickname, "total newb omg lol") where I retain a spot on the leaderboard (that was acquired by me getting very lucky because I am a total newb.) Obviously, I know nothing about the game. Thanks for your enlightening commentary that pretty much just reinforced that I am obviously clueless.

[Incompetent]

Good, you've play a VS MAX the entire time, now, lets go fire a striker under combat conditions, the thing has the absolute bitchiest lock on any weapon that ever existed, it a leaf floats in front of you (speaking figuratively) it will break the lock. "I can jumpjet behind a hill" implies a lot more than "I can jumpjet." No, it really doesn't, anyone who touches the spacebar with a VS MAX when fighting a striker is fighting wrong, the weapon requires you to keep LOS on your enemy, and it moves very quickly, but it looses its lock very easily, so giving the enemy a better shot for even a fraction of a second, even if you're moving for cover, is absolutely retardedDue to the game's very crappy clipping for objects and lock-on, you can stand behind a building, a hill, or whatever you want and they'll still hit you. Total lie, if it hits you and your behind cover, its because you didn't move once you broke the lock, or you took cover from the wrong direction.

[Arakiel]

Much credit, Incompetent, you actually have an argument this time other than calling me a newb. Well done.

Originally posted by Incompetent
Good, you've play a VS MAX the entire time, now, lets go fire a striker under combat conditions, the thing has the absolute bitchiest lock on any weapon that ever existed, it a leaf floats in front of you (speaking figuratively) it will break the lock.


Er, no. Sorry. The lock issues have since been fixedfor the most part. It's not even remotely difficult to get a striker lock.

Originally posted by Incompetent

No, it really doesn't, anyone who touches the spacebar with a VS MAX when fighting a striker is fighting wrong, the weapon requires you to keep LOS on your enemy, and it moves very quickly, but it looses its lock very easily, so giving the enemy a better shot for even a fraction of a second, even if you're moving for cover, is absolutely retarded


I'm sure this never occured to you, but in many situations using jumpjets is the only way to find cover.

Originally posted by Incompetent

Total lie, if it hits you and your behind cover, its because you didn't move once you broke the lock, or you took cover from the wrong direction.

In a game with client-side hit detection, it's not that easy to call. Missiles regularly fly through objects and hit people around corners.

[Warborn]

My problem with the striker is that its lock radius is too large and the lock is too strong. A striker trooper can very, very easily down an enemy MAX without even aiming particularly well.

That depends. The lock requires you to keep your crosshairs trained on the target for the missiles to impact. You obviously don't need to compensate for recoil or any such thing, but you're mistaken if you believe you can simply use the weapon anywhere and no shot will ever miss. MAXs are a bit stuck unless they can find some terrain feature to move behind, but Reavers and other air targets can outrun Striker rounds with their afterburner, and can also move behind hills or trees or anything else to lose the lock. Trust me, you won't get that many kills if you automatically whip out your Striker and hold down the fire button everytime you see enemy vehicles or MAXs.

Here's a newsflash for you: the lancer has a pretty large CoF at a distance, and it actually requires that you aim at the target. What a concept that is. Conversely, the striker pretty much just kills MAXes for you. In a VS MAX, I can jumpjet behind a hill, I can run through trees, I can do whatever the hell I want and that striker lock isn't going to go away.

I really can't fathom the logic behind attempting to instruct people on the mechanics of the Lancer in an attempt to defame the Striker, when you apparently do not have much -- if any -- real Striker experience yourself.

And no, picking the weapon up and firing it a few times and then assuming you're fluent in Striker use does not count.

Earlier today a striker trooper sent me a tell saying "lol I wasn't even aiming at you" when he killed me. That pretty much summed up my one problem with the weapon: absolutely no skill is required to be ridiculously effective with it.

And of course you asked him what he meant rather than assuming the missile somehow decides its own targets, right?

Thought so.

If that quote is indeed true, then the Striker user was likely shooting his rounds at something which you happened to get in front of. So instead of him having a lock on some other enemy which was behind you, his crosshairs were over you, and therefore the Striker rounds homed in on you.

"I can jumpjet behind a hill" implies a lot more than "I can jumpjet." The striker's supposed to require the soldier to aim the entire way to the target, no? Due to the game's very crappy clipping for objects and lock-on, you can stand behind a building, a hill, or whatever you want and they'll still hit you.

It would be a funny kill if they did. Once the lock is broken, the missile continues on its same trajectory as before. So if it was going straight at you and you didn't move, even if the lock is broken, the missile will still be going straight at you. So if you were behind a building and a Striker round hit you, it's probably because the missile was going straight down at you, and once the lock was broken when you went out of sight, the missile ended up hitting you anyway.

But, I do agree with the game having crappy clipping. Some of the most minor objects can break the Striker's lock. It can be annoying.

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by Warborn
Trust me, you won't get that many kills if you automatically whip out your Striker and hold down the fire button everytime you see enemy vehicles or MAXs.


Air vehicles, no. MAXes, yes. Ground vehicles, for the most part.

Originally posted by Warborn

I really can't fathom the logic behind attempting to instruct people on the mechanics of the Lancer in an attempt to defame the Striker, when you apparently do not have much -- if any -- real Striker experience yourself.


Instructing someone in lancer usage was a reply to someone claiming that the lancer was instantaneous shot.

I've dealt with a striker on both ends (admittedly, I play TR far less than VS, but I've played around with the striker enough to develop a valid opinion.)

Originally posted by Warborn

And of course you asked him what he meant rather than assuming the missile somehow decides its own targets, right?

Thought so.


You're right, I didn't. Sorry, in the future I'll exhaustively reply to tells in the most dumbfounded manner possible in order to satisfy your craving for pointing out inane details.

Originally posted by Warborn

If that quote is indeed true, then the Striker user was likely shooting his rounds at something which you happened to get in front of. So instead of him having a lock on some other enemy which was behind you, his crosshairs were over you, and therefore the Striker rounds homed in on you.


It is, indeed, true. I used that quote as a touch of "hey, this situation was amusing" and I'm quite sure I never claimed that he was or was not firing at something that could or could not have been behind me. It was, however, illustrative of my point that using the striker doesn't exactly make you the lauded champion of FPS skill.

If you're under the impression that the striker is a weapon that requires lots of skill, you can go ahead and stop talking now. For the record, I'm quite aware that the same applies to VS AI MAX, but that's not the focus of the thread.


Originally posted by Warborn

It would be a funny kill if they did. Once the lock is broken, the missile continues on its same trajectory as before. So if it was going straight at you and you didn't move, even if the lock is broken, the missile will still be going straight at you. So if you were behind a building and a Striker round hit you, it's probably because the missile was going straight down at you, and once the lock was broken when you went out of sight, the missile ended up hitting you anyway.


I'm aware that the lock functions like that, but the lock radius on the crosshair is large enough that retaining a lock in the first place is far too easy, which has been my point from the beginning. As far as getting a dumbfire kill around the corner, I'm sure it happens (it's a fairly fast missile, after all) but I know from experience that the missile doesn't instantaneously go dumbfire and stays dumbfire the second the target moves. If that was the case, then we'd be back to the beta striker, which was quite terrible. There was a bit too much overcompensation when they "fixed" the weapon's lock, though.

[Incompetent]

first off, i would like to say thank you to I.E. for giving me the chance to type all this out twice, but since warborn basically said what i was going to say, im just gonna type random shit about the stiker most people don't know, sooo....

Er, no. Sorry. The lock issues have since been fixedfor the most part. It's not even remotely difficult to get a striker lock. All they did in beta was change one of the many factors that made the striker a bitch and half to lock with, which was the drawing LOS from your knees, it is still extremely easy to break lock on this by moving behind even the most minor objects.
Enemy Tactic, try and position yourself so you can quickly move your feet, lower legs out of LOS, and keep something behind you for the missiles to slam into when they miss. and always, ALWAYS hold the high ground.
User tactic, get as high as you can, its as simple as it is hard/dangerous.

On the topic of jumpjets, hitting the jets is an extremely bad idea except in situations to specifif to mention. Now, it seems like it might be a very good idea, after all, you move faster, and your not vulnerable to splash, but the problem is that you make your movement extremly predictable, once your in the air, an experienced striker user knows almost exactly where your gonna go, maybe even better then most inexperienced MAXes. Seems kind of stupid, since it locks on he can just recorrect and follow you no matter what you do, but this is where the bane of the strikers existence comes in, reloading. If you want to kill almost anything with a Stiker, you must reload, but the problem is, when you reload, you can't see anything in the middle portion of your screen, so an evasive MAX on the ground could break the lock and trick the missiles into hitting random terrain objects, but if you jump, you run into two problems, the missiles start moving upwards, which means they will stick around a lot longer if the lock is lost, and it is extremely easy to follow your flight path and keep the weapon locked on when you can't see your target.

Another thing many maxes do that is extremely stupid, they assume they can operate without infantry support, true, its very easy to sit up on top of a tower and maintain LOS on a MAX when he is alone, but trying doing that with snipers bolts flying around you and while getting sprayed with AR fire, also, suprisingly enough, infantry are very good for absorbing the rockets for you, since they take only minor damage from them, a quick medkit will have an infantryman in fighting order relatively quickly, so step behind the infantryman, break the lock, and let the missile slam into that poor guy or into some random terrain.

Edit: and as far as requiring massive amount of skill, no it doesn't, but it requires common sense (something most emerald TR lack to the extreme), and that you be willing to get shot to hell on a regular basis, because snipers just love shooting people that are unable to take cover, and a striker user qualifies.

[Arakiel]

I'm not calling for a striker nerf. I never was. My beef with the weapon has always been that it's far too easy to kill MAXes/vehicles with it.

I've already said anything else that would be an appropriate response and I'm not quite vain enough to quote myself.

Anyway, I'm going to bed. We can argue this tomorrow if you'd like but it's already feeling a bit circular. :p

[Warborn]

Air vehicles, no. MAXes, yes. Ground vehicles, for the most part.

You would be surprised how easy it is for a single tree getting in the way to botch your lock. As Incompetent said, the Striker takes some common sense to use. If you do not actually think about the chance of you maintaining your lock on the target long enough for the missiles to detonate, you will kill with the Striker much less often.

Instructing someone in lancer usage was a reply to someone claiming that the lancer was instantaneous shot.

I've dealt with a striker on both ends (admittedly, I play TR far less than VS, but I've played around with the striker enough to develop a valid opinion.)

I wasn't debating the validity of your Lancer comments, merely pointing out that you were being hypocritical. I say this because it would appear you do not know a hell of a lot about the Striker, yet you berate someone else for not knowing a hell of a lot about the Lancer.

You're right, I didn't. Sorry, in the future I'll exhaustively reply to tells in the most dumbfounded manner possible in order to satisfy your craving for pointing out inane details.

I could care less if you answer replies. My point was that you were using information from a tell which you apparently misunderstood as the basis for an argument against a weapon you don't understand very well. If you consider factuality inane though, well, I guess I do have a craving for the inane.



And so on and so forth.

[12tontuna]

I think the Striker is fine. I'm a Mag pilot, and it makes me think twice before rumbling over clear ground to run alot of you Strawberries over.

Needless to say, there'll be quite a few of you striker users out there waiting for me.

Now, if there's cover, I have no difficulty coming after you, sure...I'm gonna take a couple whacks, but I can break lock pretty easily.

I WAS also a lancer user, and I've had the opprotunity to pick up and use the Striker in many instances. This thing hits like a stale fart. I nailed a prowler with a full clip, and I think the driver laughed.

Seriously, the Phoenix is SO much better than both the lancer AND the striker, I don't think this arguement is warranted. I fire from where you can't see me. The only warning you get is the distinctive sound the Phoenix makes. I hit you damn near as hard as a Decimator. And when I played NC exclusively, if you weren't flying...I'd hit you 90-95% of the time. The only draw back is you are QUITE a big target if you use the Phoenix out in the open.

Again, I think the Striker is fine as it is.:D

[Smaug]

Originally posted by 12tontuna
I think the Striker is fine. I'm a Mag pilot, and it makes me think twice before rumbling over clear ground to run alot of you Strawberries over.


Heh I call them cliffords. You know, clifford the big red dog. I just thought of going with the trend of cartoons, and child icons(barnies, smurfs).

[Madcow]

The only real problem with the striker (and I'm TR and use it quite a bit) is that it's too effective against MAXs and not effective enough against vehicles. I can be standing 10 meters from a Vanguard and not be able to get a lock (or the lock will go off and on repeatedly, usually shutting off at the worst time) while I can be 100 meters from a MAX and the lock never breaks. MAXs have the added problem that normally 3 strikers will take them down, so I don't have to reload in the middle of battle.
Against heavy vehicles, the striker is pathetic. I hit an injured enemy AMS with 14 strikers before it blew last night. I've unloaded a dozen strikers into Vanguards and Magriders only to have the driver eventually make it out of my range and almost certainly repair themselves. The striker ammunition is an odd shaped box which can pretty much take up your entire inventory in a hurry, but even with my favorite saved with 15 strikers I often can't take down any real vehicles.
They are pretty well useless against decent pilots. My normal plan is to lock onto a pilot and watch their reactions. The good ones are out before a missile would have had a chance. The bad ones are so intent on their targets they often ignore the lock message. I shoot them down and yay me, I killed a newb reaver pilot. I suppose it's more gratifying that dying to a newb reaver pilot, but it's still not much of an accomplishment.
I can understand somebody who specializes in MAX not liking the striker especially, but that doesn't make it too effective against vehicles. It's pretty much an anti-MAX, anti-Harrasser missile.

[BeerJedi]

im tired of peeps complaining about Striker. it is a guided multi missile launcher. it gonna kick ur ass if ur on recieveing end. other empires can use it also. if all u non TR peeps say every TR carries one. then cert in AV and loot a freaking Striker and were all happy. theres no rule that says u cant loot or use a Striker.


This argument takin' directly from an NC backed Jackhammer supporter. Lets see how its received when used to back a TR weapon.

the original argument.

im tired of peeps complaining about jackhammer. it is a tri-barrels auto shotty it gonna kick ur ass if ur on recieveing end. other empires can use it also. if all u non NC peeps say every NC carries one. then cert in HA and loot a freaking jackhammer and were all happy. theres no rule that says u cant loot or use a jackhammer.

[MJBuddy]

i used to trash our good old pheonix..but then one of my squadmates started using it...needless to say magrinders couldnt breach the walls because he was nailing them over the wall completely

[Happy lil Elf]

While we're at it, aren't grenades "supposed to do a lot of damage?" Aren't they supposed to "kick ass?" I mean, again, maybe it's just me, but since my introduction at an early age to the concept of a handgrenade, I usually regarded them as a rather potent weapon. Yet, most people in PS don't carry frag grenades.

Hollywood misinformation correction time!
<Cue bad elevator background music, think intermission song from Monty Python and the Holy Grail>
Grenades are not all that powerful, especially not against someone in body armor. They're not really even a very potent weapon since their kill radius is so small. You can injure a decent amount of people but usually about 1/2 of their shrapnel ends up in the ground, unless you time it just right which is a bad idea since you misjudge and..well..yeah. Sure if a grenade explodes at your feet while you're weraing a t-shirt and jeans you're pretty much screwed. However if a grenade lands 10 ft to your left and you're wearing a full suit of body armor, you'll probably be annoyed by the loud pop.
<End bad background music>
<Cue Duke telling us that now we know, and that knowing is half the battle>

Anyways, as far as the Striker goes please don't give me the it doesn't hurt vehicles argument. Yeah it might take 8-10 striker missiles to drop a vanguard. Of course when threre are 2 DC MAXs, 6 guys with Strikers and spitfires all over hell, that doesn't matter too much. Yeah it took you a long time to blow up an AMS. The AMS is probably the most armored vehicle in the game with the possible exception of the Sunderer. It has a hell of a lot more armor than a tank.

That all said, the Striker does not need a nerf. It's powerful when deployed in groups which is true for most of the weapons in this game and I'm guessing how it was intended to be.

[Madcow]

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
Anyways, as far as the Striker goes please don't give me the it doesn't hurt vehicles argument. Yeah it might take 8-10 striker missiles to drop a vanguard. Of course when threre are 2 DC MAXs, 6 guys with Strikers and spitfires all over hell, that doesn't matter too much. Yeah it took you a long time to blow up an AMS. The AMS is probably the most armored vehicle in the game with the possible exception of the Sunderer. It has a hell of a lot more armor than a tank.

It wasn't just the AMS. Like I said, I've hit Vanguards/Magriders with over a dozen strikers only to watch them run and hide afterward. Of course with multiple people it is a much easier task, but there are far fewer people carrying Strikers than seems to be the general impression here. I have 1 favorite loaded with Strikers, and I use it specifically when MAXs or enemy vehicles are showing up. The Striker ammo is such a pain to have exist with the rest of your ammo I've found I'm better off just having one favorite with a few rounds of Cycler ammo and 15 shots for the Striker. So 8-10 Striker missiles to drop a Vanguard? I wish, but not true. The Striker hits not nearly as hard as the Phoenix, and unless you have multiple people unloading their Striker payload you pretty much don't have a shot of taking any of the armored vehicles before they can run away and repair.

[beavis88]

Yeah it might take 8-10 striker missiles to drop a vanguard

More like 13-15.

[Happy lil Elf]

Well considering I drive a Vanduard full time. You guys don't get to see how much damage those accursed missiles do. I'm willing to go as high as maybe 12. I'd really say more like 10 however.

Now granted this is assuming all missiles hit which may or may not be the case depending upon the skill of user and target I suppose. If you wanna test it just make a striker character on Emerald, or I can come to you, either way /shrug

Another thing to keep in mind with the vanguard. Pay attention to which side of the tank is facing you. If it's not the right side of the tank, and the tank isn't moving, bet your arse the driver is probably crouched on the other side with his repair gun out repairing it almost as quickly as you damage it ;)

[Madcow]

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
Well considering I drive a Vanduard full time. You guys don't get to see how much damage those accursed missiles do. I'm willing to go as high as maybe 12. I'd really say more like 10 however.

Now granted this is assuming all missiles hit which may or may not be the case depending upon the skill of user and target I suppose. If you wanna test it just make a striker character on Emerald, or I can come to you, either way /shrug

Another thing to keep in mind with the vanguard. Pay attention to which side of the tank is facing you. If it's not the right side of the tank, and the tank isn't moving, bet your arse the driver is probably crouched on the other side with his repair gun out repairing it almost as quickly as you damage it ;)

I will absolutely guarantee that 12 strikers will not destroy a fully healthy Vanguard. The reason I added a favorite with 15 strikers is because of this fact. When you go through your entire inventory of strikers and do not destroy a tank which is steamrolling your troops, that's a bit disturbing. The Vanguards I am referring to are not being repaired, either. I've watched in many situations including inside TR held courtyards where repair wasn't a possibility. I don't think I've ever had an encounter with a stationary Vanguard. If you need somebody to do an experiment to prove it, that's fine, but I've already done the experiment in action. With one other individual I destroyed a Magrider which had run from action in order to repair, and between the 2 of us we used 9 strikers. Remember, this was an injured tank already. The striker doesn't pack nearly the punch you think.

[Ducimus]

Originally posted by Deadlock
i too am pissed off about the jackhammer whining. my rifle sucks, my bazooka punches limp wristed, dont take my shotty away from me!!! its all i have left :mad:

The guass does not suck. Properly used, you can grease 3 or 4 people on one clip of ammo. The phoneix is a Tankers worst nightmare as well.


Originally posted by HawkEye
dude stfu what reaperofdeath said is true. a tri-barreled auto shotty is gonna kicks ass for the second time. it is supposed to do alot of damage cuz it is an AUTO SHOTGUN.

Hmm this sounds like a harkening to real world ballistics. Well since were going that route, the Mini Chaingun is supposed to kick ass because its one bump up from a standard machine gun. (think of the chaingun on a Huey Cobra gunship for example) If these weapons were scaled for "Its such and such so its supposed to kick ass" then the chaingun should turn you into kibbles n bits before you get within 200 meters of me, but it doesn't does it?

[Bottleneck]

Hrmm I wonder if were playing the same game? hehe
Im heavy weapon/AV specd and one thing I can tell you is that our missle sux! If ya dont keep your cursor right on the vehicle 100% of the time till the missle hits it flies off into never never land. Thats right its not fire and forget its fire and pray the bastard doesnt hit afterburner or drive behind a tree. Whenever I fight NC I ALWAYS drop my chaingun (absolutely useless at anything over point blank) and my striker to loot the Oneshotkillshotgunoffuckingdeath and pheonix. Great thing about the nc AV is you can be sitting inside a tower fire the missle out the door and hit something thats flying above the tower your in rofl, great weapon!
I fully agree though only thing that really needs changed in this game is the jackhammer, anything that can kill a reinforced grunt in two blasts is a "tad" overpowered. Till then ill just keep stocking my lockers with em though :) if ya cant beat em loot there corpses and join em!

[Happy lil Elf]

The striker doesn't pack nearly the punch you think.

Come gun for me and watch the tank get eaten away chunk by chunk, then say that ;)

Again, the Striker does not need ot be balanced, nerfed, or adjusted. It's fine just the way it is. But please quit down-playing it's effectiveness as an argument against changing it. The best argument for not changing it is that it's already balanced, not that it's weak.

[WritheNC]

The guass does not suck. Properly used, you can grease 3 or 4 people on one clip of ammo. The phoneix is a Tankers worst nightmare as well.

I agree 100%. The gauss rocks. You get more power per shot so it doesn't eat ammo. I like using the cycler but it SUCKS UP ROUNDS LIKE CRAZY. If there were more people skilled at using Gauss I'm sure it would be bitched about instead of JH, but it takes skill so I guess not heh.

Anyway, if you have problems with the Striker or whatever, just don't go solo. An outfit friend and I both carry Phoenix, and when you have two people(thus doubling your fire rate), its a hell of a lot easier to kill anything.

I'll say the Phoenix is really damn good. When we have an infil in the group that coordinates well with us, its like calling in an air strike. We'll be standing outside the wall, and the infil will say, "There's an enemy ams right next to me." Off go the missiles in the infils direction!

I make it a habit at least once a night to grab a striker and a lancer if I can to play around with 'em. Getting a lancer with 3 boxes of ammo feels like going to Disney World.

My only complaint about the striker is the number of missiles per box(I think its only 3). Make it 4 or 5, and it'll help a lot. Also, having 1 or 2 other squadmates and voice chat really, *really* helps taking out anything. It doesn't matter if your weapon of choice is lancer, striker, or phoenix(ok having phoenix is probably easier than the other two). Really.

[Happy lil Elf]

Voice chat makes a HUGE difference. I've tried playing pick up squads but I can't stand it. Our outfit (like many other I imagine) has it's own dedicated TS server. This makes communication and coordination oh so much easier.

[Madcow]

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
Come gun for me and watch the tank get eaten away chunk by chunk, then say that ;)

Again, the Striker does not need ot be balanced, nerfed, or adjusted. It's fine just the way it is. But please quit down-playing it's effectiveness as an argument against changing it. The best argument for not changing it is that it's already balanced, not that it's weak.

My point all along has been that people are saying the striker is very effective against MAX and ground vehicles, while I think it may be too strong against MAX but is actually fairly weak against ground vehicles. I'm not down-playing it's effectiveness, it's truly not much to sneeze at against any vehicle with real armor or any pilot worth his salt. The striker holds 3 shots, and each enormous box of ammo holds an additional 3 shots. 3 shots is enough to kill most MAXs (as you don't come across fully healthy MAXs all that often) and a dumb reaver pilot. Considering that's what the magazine holds, and you can fire those 3 shots fairly quickly, I wouldn't complain if they brought the effectiveness against MAXs down just a tad (even 4 strikers would at least give the MAX a chance to get you during the long blinding reload). If they did that, however, I would hope they'd up it's effectiveness against vehicles which isn't nearly as strong as it's being made out to be.

[Bottleneck]

13-15 if a twig doesnt get between you and the tank and break your lock

[Ouroboros]

FREAKING A WTF WHERES MY MINICHAINGUN!*(R#^ HOLY CRAP ITS A MINICHAINGUN ITS SUPPOSE TO KICK ASS AHAHHAHAHHGHAFHADGHDSG:OHGEBQW!!!!!$!@

sigh...

Well, since we're all complaining about this and that, let me have a go. The Sparrow MAX, once achieving a lock-on, 2-3 second, can look away from its target and fire and the rockets would still home in. I mean, the damn reaver/mesquito/galaxy could be over and behind a mountain before the MAX starts firing and it would still hit them. eh.

[MilitantB0B]

Originally posted by Arakiel
It's not instantaneous at all. Have you ever used a lancer? There's a delay between when you push fire and when the weapon actually fires and another delay between when the projectile is fired and when it actually hits the target. There are no hitscan weapons in PS, and the lancer isn't an exception. Travel time, buddy, travel time. Once the ashot leaves your barrel, it hits your target. No leading is nescesary, if your crosshairs are on the enemy, you lancer is hitting them. Oh, yeah, I have used it. I loot it every chance I get, it is the best AV weapon in the game in my opinion just cause it kills everything.

[MJBuddy]

good strategy i found today... had 3 terrans on my mos with strikers

i watched the rockets on radar and turn+afterburned when they got near...they wide turn and can only do it like twice...after they blew about 20 shots on me, they gave up or ran out of ammo or such

[gospadin]

I've found the striker to be a very useful weapon, but it takes some getting used to...

1) it is excellent for taking out base/tower turrets, but you can't use its locking feature if you're at a lower altitude since it will lock on the bottom of the turret and hit the wall

2) in a pinch, it will take out spitfire turrets with a single shot

3) My best successes against most targets don't involve locking in the early stages... I'll shoot a 3-round clip unguided at max 12x zoom against a stationary vehicle, then reload while they're still midair... as soon as first missile hits, I go active seeking, and can usually lock and get a kill before the vehicle is gone. I find that if I give someone the "warning" of missile lock, they tend to drive off before I can get a shot off.

4) About 10% of reaver/mosquito pilots are nearly untouchable. If we don't maintain lock on the plane during the missile's entire flight, it almost never connects. Shots aiming for the tail of a plane almost never work either because of their afterburner. Pilots who can duck low into the trees can almost always get the missiles to miss.

5) As far as MAXs go, if they have personal shield it usually takes 5-6 rounds to kill a MAX. If not, 3-5 rounds. And those Vanu who see missile lock and then hit their jumpjets, all the better... it is *way* easier to lock on you arcing through the air then hiding behind a tree. =P

--gos

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by MilitantB0B
Travel time, buddy, travel time. Once the ashot leaves your barrel, it hits your target. No leading is nescesary, if your crosshairs are on the enemy, you lancer is hitting them. Oh, yeah, I have used it. I loot it every chance I get, it is the best AV weapon in the game in my opinion just cause it kills everything.

Grats on having no clue whatsoever.

You have to lead with the lancer, because the lancer has travel time. There are no hitscan weapons in PS - none - zero.

[Tryndamere]

Grats on having no clue whatsoever.

You have to lead with the lancer, because the lancer has travel time. There are no hitscan weapons in PS - none - zero.


Grats on being nitpicky.

One-tenth of a second travel time doesn't make the gun hard to aim with.

[MilitantB0B]

Its threads like these and many others that make me think that Hamma ought to make nerf=ban just like warez=ban.
Everybody is saying:
Nerf TR! They can kill me!
Nerf NC! They can kill me also!
Nerf Common Pool! So they can't kill me!
Nerf Cliffs! Ones never killed me but they always hurt me when I jump off them!

For the love of God, please cut back on the nerf talk! Thank you. :D

[MilitantB0B]

Originally posted by Arakiel
Grats on having no clue whatsoever.

You have to lead with the lancer, because the lancer has travel time. There are no hitscan weapons in PS - none - zero. Grats on being a jackass with no common sense that can't realize that 1/10000000000 of a second is no travel time to speak of. If they cross hairs are on a surging infiltrator when the bolt leaves the gun, it will hit. Use your brain.

[Arakiel]

It has a more significant travel time than, say, every single ballistic weapon in the game that isn't attached to a tank.

If your cross hairs are over a surging infiltrator and you don't lead, you will miss unless you're 10 feet away.

[MJBuddy]

doesnt really matter, u cant shoot effectively while running with any COF weapon. if i crouch and shoot i can shoot and eliminate the deadliest...if i crouch and shoot i get shot at by people who cant aim for shit but can hit me 1/5 shots and kill me...

the gun travel lag is a retardate term of thinking, you most likely wont be sniping an infantry unit running with surge full on speed during a big battle

[gospadin]

Originally posted by MJBuddy
doesnt really matter, u cant shoot effectively while running with any COF weapon. if i crouch and shoot i can shoot and eliminate the deadliest...if i crouch and shoot i get shot at by people who cant aim for shit but can hit me 1/5 shots and kill me...

the who gun travel lag is a retardate term of thinking, you most likely wont be sniping an infantry unit running with surge full on speed during a big battle

Actually I snipe people running with surge all the time, the trick is to guess where they are going to run and make sure my rifle is sighted in properly at that spot before they get there, then still lead them almost a full sight width at 12x zoom.

If you're tracking them with the barrel of your gun, you'll never ever hit them.

--gos

[MJBuddy]

im talking about sniping WITH a lancer tho

[Hamma]

I hate the sparrow max :mad:

[Tryndamere]

It has a more significant travel time than, say, every single ballistic weapon in the game that isn't attached to a tank.

If your cross hairs are over a surging infiltrator and you don't lead, you will miss unless you're 10 feet away.


Hitting a surging infiltrator with an AV weapon? Lol, you sure set yourself up.

You're saying that the lancer is inferior because you can't hit a SURGING INFILTRATOR?! ROFL

Try that with a pheonix or Striker...

Face it buddy, the lancer rocks, is very accurate, very versatile, and very easy to use. If you think that is hard to aim with, try the bolt driver~

[Arakiel]

Originally posted by Tryndamere
Hitting a surging infiltrator with an AV weapon? Lol, you sure set yourself up.

You're saying that the lancer is inferior because you can't hit a SURGING INFILTRATOR?! ROFL

Try that with a pheonix or Striker...

Face it buddy, the lancer rocks, is very accurate, very versatile, and very easy to use. If you think that is hard to aim with, try the bolt driver~

OMFG LOL ROFL CMOS SARS LOL!@~

Did you even read the thread, or are you attempting to confirm my suspicions that 95% of striker advocates are blithering retards?

Here, let me recap for you:

Originally posted by MilitantB0B
If they cross hairs are on a surging infiltrator when the bolt leaves the gun, it will hit. Use your brain.
Originally posted by Arakiel

If your cross hairs are over a surging infiltrator and you don't lead, you will miss unless you're 10 feet away.

Now do you vaguely grasp the surging infiltrator comment? Good. I'm glad we had this talk.

While we're in "face it" mode, you might want to grasp that in order for the lancer to work obscenely well, it requires either a very poor opponent or a decent ability to aim. The striker doesn't require either.

[Holo]

My beef with the Striker is this... I don't like the fact that the user can MOVE while firing deadly accurate missles at MAXes and Reavers... I mean... He's carrying a huge shoulder mounted bazooka and he can still strafe around and jump like a monkey? Isn't that just a weeee bit unbalanced? And no, while he's strafing around he shoots not one but THREE... that's THREE missles which will take a Reaver down to about half health already... With all the other AV weapons they at least have to stand still to fire them...

Basically what I'm getting at is this... at least put some kind of lock on timer on the Striker... so an AV TR can't just waltz up to a MAX and strafe around him killing him in one clip... that's just a bit unfair...

Nothing elaborate.. just something simple like a 3 second *BING* *BING* *BING* *BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE*

That way they'd at least have to stay still before blowing the crap out of everything...

It's only fair ;)

[beavis88]

Basically what I'm getting at is this... at least put some kind of lock on timer on the Striker... so an AV TR can't just waltz up to a MAX and strafe around him killing him in one clip... that's just a bit unfair...

If I can strafe around a (non-AA) MAX and kill him in one clip, he DESERVES to die. Note that a full clip (3 rockets) will NOT kill a MAX at full health... Also, a lock timer isn't going to do shit, because generally I just dumbfire in that case -- the lock takes too much time, and often doesn't work at close range.

The answer is NOT nerfing the striker -- the answer is people with MAX armors using >1% of their brainpower...MAX, alone, in the open == meat.

[Madcow]

Originally posted by Holo
Basically what I'm getting at is this... at least put some kind of lock on timer on the Striker... so an AV TR can't just waltz up to a MAX and strafe around him killing him in one clip... that's just a bit unfair...

Nothing elaborate.. just something simple like a 3 second *BING* *BING* *BING* *BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE*

That way they'd at least have to stay still before blowing the crap out of everything...

It's only fair ;)

So the Striker should have to keep a lock on a target but the shooter can't move? That's a brilliant idea, and maybe the Phoenix could continue to be guided but could actually provide health to the enemy when it hit them? :rolleyes:

[FliggenMan]

When you say that the TR's stregnth comes from their weapon(s) high rate of fire, it means almost every weapon. It is a theme, a strength, an overall advantage that gives them the upper hand in battle.

When you toy with the weapons because of the Dev Teams own personal preference, you mess with the fabric of balance. I know everyone is thinking in terms of their empire.. i would too, and I do. But take a look at this game from an omniscient point of view, just fer a sec...

The dependent variables of Planetside weapons include these things to my knowledge:

the weight, the strength, the Rate of Fire, the precision, the aggaravating capabilities, the recoil, the versatility, the area of effect capabilities, the range limits, the velocity of guided projectiles.

Now imagine for a moment that each empire uses a "battle motif" that gives it's weapons and vehicles a strength in some of these fields and weaknesses in others.

If you ever want this game to be balanced, if you ever want to stop these kinds of posts from reappearing and instead post about in-game experiences or how you raped that VS or TR or NC last night, than you need to limit the amount of factors in this game by using a system of trends, specifically on weapons. Other than common poll weapons, which are accesible by every empire creating a cancellation of one empires weapon stregnth by the same one used by another, empire specific weapons and vehicles are the only thigs that seperate the empires other than their different colors. Empire's strengths should shine in their fighting style, instead of using a diverse weapons mixture that creates chaos of a specific trend. This game does not stress this enough because it is still in it's infant stages. Specifically on weapons. Specifically on things like the Lancer, the Striker, the Repeater, the Beamer, etc.