I have to admit, for the very first time I am extremely bored, so little to do.

[Valcron]

As I wandered around last night I got into some heavy thinking. The game design/system isn't the problem, it's the fact that there isn't really anyhing else to do or see. To me, sometimes it's the little things that really attract me to a particular game, the atmosphere, the landscapes and other odds and ends.

For instance, what essentially irks me are the sanctuaries. There's no resmblence that this is your home. All it is are some bland buildings thrown together for your vehicles, HART, training, and respawn. There isn't anything that shows off your empire. No overly disgusting propaganda, no buildings that represent govermental ownership, nothing.

Then we have continents, with bases on them, nothing else. Where is anything that even remotely represented a war in the past? No destroyed buildings, no burnt out towers, no craters from bomb shellings, nothing. It's all perfectly flat land. Even in EQ there were ruins from past empires, destroyed buildings, decayed wood, etc. I can't quite understand what their initial goals were, to me the only thing they concentrated on were "How many players can we get into one area without choking systems." Which is actually understandable.

Aside from the things I said, they need to improve on the things you can do, I understand now they're enhancing defense, but there is more that needs to be done. The original idea of empire missions was really fantastic, I wish it were in. It would be great to goto your empire headquarters, receive a mission from an NPC and wham you start it. Even something as simple as, "Escort A general from one warpgate to another, his safety is crucial as he is your top commander of X empire".

Lastly, it took me 2 years to finally get bored of Everquest. A month and a half for Planetside, that worries me. Will there be enough content and changes within the next 3-4 months? Only time will tell, I have ideas and ways to improve the game, lets hope they churn these out as fast as possible.

-Valcron


*EDIT FOR THE ASSHOLES OUT THERE THAT THINK IM COMPARING THIS GAME TO EQ. I'M NOT SO CLEAN THE CRAP OUT OF YOUR EARS*

[Fire_Monkey]

What I would suggest would be trying out different positions in PS. Like i was going to be a reinforced with HA and AV and the heavy buggy but then I got an infiltration suit and the game was so much more fun. If the customizability of your characters aren't maxed out, you might not enjoy the game as much.

[NightWalker XI]

I am with ya, just this morning I became BR 7 with my new char, and I realised this game only has one thing happening, take a base then take the other oh wait, lets take a tower too....WTF how da hell am I playing this, I usually go for games with depth, well anyway I was bored, I have posted about 20 at elast topics in the wishlsit forum asking for individual looking sanctuaries too.

The thing is, I like PS in some way, and I want it to do well but the devs want to add new stuff instead of fixing the problems

I want damage too, they say it would strain server too much, but if other games can do it so should PS, I mean, they are cheapskates, their forums (Ultimate Bulletin) costs $100, vBulletin (the one PSU uses) is better than that shit, WTF!

You gonna tell me Hamma has a bigger budget than SOE? methinks not....

Also, their staff sucks, the door bug has been reported nearly 3 weeks ago, still not a fix, bastards

[Agathon]

Hello,

I understand how you feel, but this game isn't EverQuest. It is a FPS by design, and it is always going to be repetitive. The love of FPS'ers is in the action against other skilled players. If people are not FPS addicts, then they will get bored of PS quickly. It isn't anything against you or anyone else getting bored either. Some people love FPS'ers, and other people get bored of them quickly.

PlanetSide is a FPS, and it will never have the content of other games. What makes it revolutionary has already been said many times and is OFN, but let me just say again that the ability to fight on a large scale, beyond 64 players (which was always a laggy hell anyway if tried for me), and the added skills/command abilities of PS make this game very exciting for me. Time will not change those things.

I'll always enjoy the higher level tactics and team-based play, and PS will remain the best FPS'er out there that I have ever played. Yes, they could add more things, and I know they will. I just doubt the content you are looking for will ever be a priority based on the game model PS was designed around.

Just my thoughts,

[Jarlo]

Hamma had a nice line once.. it goes something like this.

Planetside is a FPS-- the content is killing people and blowing shit up.

Go back to EQ Valcron, or be like me and alternate EQ & PS each night. Keeps both things fresh and keeps me hungry to play.

[Valcron]

Get the hell off the "Go back to EQ line" I NEVER SAID THIS GAME SHOULD BE LIKE EQ.

I was using a comparison to a specific PART of eq, not the goddamn system.

If you believe that you paying 13 dollars a month for the SAME thing and no improvements, you'll be the only one playing it.

[Arakiel]

I'd be thrilled if the lattice didn't divide all fights into either "zerg stuff" or "get zerged." That's what I think is making gameplay static and boring - when they divided the world into 3 one-hop continents for every faction with no 2 continents sharing a sanc link, they made sure to make the combat tedious and repetitive.

If they can get outfit competitions in, we'll see.. as it stands, I'm feeling the boredom vibe already.

Oh, and, hi, Valcron :P

[reaver101]

What I would like to see would be evidence that there had been a civilian population before the war and some evidence that there is actually a war going on. I'm not asking for destrucible enviroments or anything extreme, just like maybe destroyed bridges and craters around bases and such. Another thing would be more scale. Now I realize that this game is marketed as being the largest FPS out there but to me it seems to be stuck in a limbo. In my experience it seems that most of the battles are only about the size of large scale BF1942 battles. While those are very fun I am not paying 13 bucks a month to play BF1942 and can always find a mod if I get bored. PS seems to be just almost like a lot of BF1942 servers stuck together. You go fight for a base, cap it, and move on. While this is engaging for a little while it soon just dissolves into nothing more than a exp zerg. As mentioned ealier maybe missions would be a good idea. You log on, find out what your empire is trying to accomplish, form a squad and then try to help. These missions could last a day or a week, or however long it takes for it to be finally accomplished. These missions could be formed by CR5 characters and it would be up to them to recruit for their own missions. During the mission you would still get all the normal base cap and kill exp but at the end of the mission you would get a big exp bonus based on your participation, like base caps. this bonus could be like 20K or less based on how much you did to help the mission. Anyway thats my 2 cents and I don't think that the mission system would be to hard to implement, im not sure about the new art work. I really think that these missions would add purpose and history to the game. Im mean there is nothing like kicking back in a bar at the redesigned sanct and talking with your outfit about the the Great Solsar Campaign of 2003.

[Agathon]

Valcron,

I wasn't being harsh, and I don't think Jarlo was either. It was just a friendly suggestion based on what you said. I think we all agree the bugs, lag, and other issues with PS need to be fixed. We also all know new content will be coming. The changes will come. The game would be worth my 120/year as it is now...

If the lag and bugs were all fixed! hee hee

The developers have a lot of issues to deal with regarding bugs and lag, so just don't expect new content too quickly. They need to make the game stable above all else because they stand to lose more players from bugs and lag than they do lack of content--at the moment at least.

8-)

[Protst Patrotsm]

I never played EQ, but I played AC, and the cooelst thing about htta game is that there is just soooo much random shit that doesn't have anything to do with anything else. So people can do around with gigantic clubs with nails in them, or dye clothing, or throw plates at stuff. My favorite was to give monsters XP so they could lvl up and pump their stats. I do think a lot of people fial to realize that this is a FPS, not an RPG. Everytime you get a kill, somebody at heom on their compy gets pissed at you.

[Valcron]

I drives me MAD when I mention another game and people say in so many words STFU GO PLAY THAT OTHER GAME.

I am drawing comparisons, that's IT. What even bothers me more is people think you're stupid enough to actually believe Planetside should be like EQ.

[Valcron]

Arakiel,

The real issues exist that this soldier is primarily a foot soldier game. Therefore what are the real ways of getting rid of a zerg? They implemented a REALLY, REALLY, long respawn time beta. This was a bad idea, not so much that you have to wait longer, it didn't change the dynamics of the game. In other words, they thought it would reduce zerging, but it couldn't, the system would need to change from the CORE to reduce zerging. You have to zerg to take a tower or base that has enemy forces in it.


For instance, in games like Medal Of honor, Counterstrike, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Americas Army. There is ZERO zerg, because there are map goals and objectives to accomplish. You have to REALLY be skilled as per pixel hit detection exists and aiming your weapon actually matters.

I think the Zerg factor will always exist in some way or another. Unless they change the way you can capture a base or tower. I'd be interested to know if they ever thought about that.

[Valcron]

Arakiel,

On outfit competitions. How is this going to make the game exciting? This isn't going to change the boredom of the game's core.

For instance, and YES IM USING EQ AS AN EXAMPLE SO STFU BEFORE YOU SAY ANYTHING.

*AS AN EXAMPLE*, they had these Class competitions a while ago. Best warrior, best necro, etc. Each server competed and the best person from each server competed on the test server to see who the best person was. While this was fun for the moment, it didn't change anything about the way the game was played. Sure you have your little competitions, and go back to what you're doing, and that's playing the game.

[ObnoxiousFrog]

Search out the mysterious holes which exist on each continent.

[Glaynor]

First off, let me say that I have been dreaming about a game like Planetside for years. When I saw it coming out, I was more excited about this game than any other game ever (and I had Intelivision so that's going back aways).

BUT... what makes a game great is total emersion(sp?) into the world you are playing in. This game doesn't provide that. SOE thought it would be enough to just have different climates and to be honest that is not enough. It would not be difficult to add in a town, or maybe an old burnt out base or tower to fight around. Imagine the possibilities for ambushes and stuff like that.

For example, there could be designated ambush sites (like a small town along a road). If a squad is successfully able to go through the town when there are enemies in that SOI they would get a certain amount of eperience. Likewise for the people who ambush. For the people that the ambushers kill they would get multiplied experience. That would not be difficult to put in but at the same time that would allow for something different to do.

SOE desperately needs to add some character to the game. Right now, that is missing and makes the same ol' same ol capture/defend boring after awhile.

Now, I'm not quitting the game, and I like the potential of the game but potential only goes so far. Hope SOE does the right thing and doesn't sit back on their laurels.

[Happy lil Elf]

I'll answer it for him.

Tribes. People still play Tribes and Tribes 2 in competition. The class compititions from EQ are piss poor examples. Not because they're EQ related, but because in EQ the emphasis is upon how long you've played not how well you play. Sure how well you play factors in, but not nearly as much as what level you are and what gear you've farmed.

The appeal is the competition itself.

[Valcron]

Elf,

But you answered my question with the question I'm going to propose.

Aside from BIG battles, and many players in one area. What else is Planetside offering us tha Tribes 2 isn't? This is a loaded question, and I'm purposelly asking this.

My point here is this, Outfit competitions are only a little piece of the puzzle. They could help, and I'm definitely not against them, but, they do not increase the gameplay or the actual core of what this game is about. To me outfit competitions are only a My Cock is bigger than your Cock competition.

[Happy lil Elf]

I qgree with you that PS could use more, well, anything. I was just countering the compititions won't offer anything argument.

Personally I'd love to see competition servers where outfits sign up for a date and time and have a continent reserved for them. Having one outfit vs another for control of a continent would appeal oh so much more to me than the current follow the zerg mentality. Hell even maybe have different leauges for outfit size. Say like 1 platoon (30v30), 2 platoons(60v60), and 3 platoons league (90 vs 90).

[Hamma]

My quote is.

"It's an FPS, you kill people, you blow shit up. What more "content" do you need"

And that quote still stands. Im not sure exactly what people were looking for or expecting from an FPS.

[1024]

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
I qgree with you that PS could use more, well, anything. I was just countering the compititions won't offer anything argument.

Personally I'd love to see competition servers where outfits sign up for a date and time and have a continent reserved for them. Having one outfit vs another for control of a continent would appeal oh so much more to me than the current follow the zerg mentality. Hell even maybe have different leauges for outfit size. Say like 1 platoon (30v30), 2 platoons(60v60), and 3 platoons league (90 vs 90). '

this would be the easiest and probably the most fun answer. I don't see why when they can't just add in taht 11th continent, which woudl be perfectley symmetrical, they cant reserve it for outfit vs outfit battles, or platoon vs platoon, etc.


Originally posted by Valcron
in games like Medal Of honor, Counterstrike, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Americas Army. There is ZERO zerg, because there are map goals and objectives to accomplish. You have to REALLY be skilled as per pixel hit detection exists and aiming your weapon actually matters.

And YOU are wrong. There is no zerging in games liek CS and MOH not becasue there are objectives, but because there arent THOUSANDS OF PLAYERS RUNNING AROUND.

You also need to chill out, you're getting mad at people to easily.

EDIT: Oh and MOH isn't much more beyond mindless killing. Hvae you played FFA in that game? Crazy as fuck.

[Tieom]

Originally posted by Valcron

For instance, in games like Medal Of honor, Counterstrike, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Americas Army. There is ZERO zerg, because there are map goals and objectives to accomplish. You have to REALLY be skilled as per pixel hit detection exists and aiming your weapon actually matters.

Actually, I believe you are wrong on this point. First off, it's quite possible to have a zerg in those games: the team spawns, runs at the enemy, and kills as many as possible before dying. The reason no one does this, and thus there is no zerg, is because it has been sufficiently proven that this complete lack of tactics will make you lose against anyone using tactics. It takes a while but eventually people catch on when they are consistently losing that maybe they should try a different approach.
Also, in those games, it is really hard to significantly outnumber your opponents, due to server player limits and team balancing, which makes a zerg much less likely to succeed.

Back in my tribes 2 days (all of 8 months ago) you'd find many a pub where the unorganized and tactically inept team was getting demolished by the organized team. The organized team didn't even really need to be VERY organized, either. Something along the lines of "Mortar their flag, then Bob comes in, grabs the flag, and passes it to Timmy at the big hill if he's low on health" would absolutely RUIN a lot of pub teams. In combined arms games (Like T2 and PS) tactics will, 99% of the time given equal skill, destroy a zerg. The players of PS just need to learn that.

As for "You have to REALLY be skilled as per pixel hit detection exists and aiming your weapon actually matters.": If you've ever played Natural Selection (HL mod, marines vs. aliens) you'd find that the marine team has more or less standard FPS gameplay in it for the grunts. All weapons have a natural inaccuracy that does not change, no recoil, no movement penalties, etc. There is also no location damage for either side. As a grunt, FPS "Skill" comes down to keeping your crosshairs on the aliens. Largely the success of the marine team is based on the marines following the commander's orders and the commander knowing what he's doing. Better aiming skills will help, but even unskilled people if they use the proper tactics (Stick in groups, cover each other, try not to get ambushed) will succeed. This, in my mind, is a lot like PS. Awesome reflexes and mouse skills will win you one-on-one fights and help you stay alive, but they won't go very far for winning the battle against the other fifty guys on the enemy team. That, winning the battle, depends on having a good commander and everyone doing more or less what the comm says.

[Jackal]

something that i think would be neat to see is to add a fourth faction into the game. i think it would make the game lil more interesting. i also agree what you guys are saying there should be some kind of objectives that u need to fulfill would help with making the game intersting.

[Protst Patrotsm]

Wolfenstein is crazy zerg, have you ever played the d-day map? All the crappy Allies just spawn with panzers and blow shit up, then they make mad rushes to capture stuff

There is nothing wrong with zerging! This is a WAR! In wars large forces move to take stuff. Armies don't send out small parties to capture a key facility, they send an entire army there! All you people griping about zergers are just pissed cause you aren't in one and lose to them too much.

[Happy lil Elf]

I can sort of see what I think he's trying to say. I don't necessarily aggre but I can see where he's coming from. The world feels kind of bland. At first yeah I was impressed by the size of the continents, I mean they're frigging huge (although so are many T2 maps, they just only let you use a relatively small portion of them).

Beyond that though I don't get the sense it's a world. The roads aren't roads the terrain on some continents just seems....I'm not sure what the word would be, fake, unbelievable? Take oshur for instance. The entire continent seems like someone took an ocean during a hurricane, froze it and painted in brown. It doesn't flow like a real landscape. Some continents are very life like. Take Cyssor or Ceryshen. Both of those seem plausable to me when I play them.

I see what he's saying the game needs but the thing is it's hard ot give a game the feeling of depth that say Deus Ex had.

Yes "It's an FPS, you kill people, you blow shit up. What more "content" do you need" sort of applies. But if that's true why do FPS that are immersive such as Deus Ex and Max Payne do extremely well while games like Serious Sam are at best medicore cult classics? There is more to a good FPS than killing people and blowing shit up. The little things count for something as well. Do they make or break a game? Not usually, but they can sure count for replayability which in an MMO is very, very important.

I don't think he's asking for Cloaks of Flame or Fungi Tunics to start dropping off the people you kill. I think what he's looking for is being able to look around you sanc and get the sense there's a war going on. Or drive down a road that's actually a road and not just grey colored land. Or take cover in the remains of a shelled tower.

More content means more detailed in this case, not more like a MMORPG.

[Valcron]

Originally posted by Hamma
My quote is.

"It's an FPS, you kill people, you blow shit up. What more "content" do you need"

And that quote still stands. Im not sure exactly what people were looking for or expecting from an FPS.



Hamma,

You're still on the old school of thought. You've been saying that since beta. Why play planetside? EVERY single FPS out there gives you "Just a FPS" Doom, Quake, Half Life, RTCW, MOHAA, and too many to name here. Some of them have twists and turns like capturable objectives, classes, etc. But on the whole, they are all FPS's at heart.

The real question stands why are you playing this game? Things are going to change, the gameplay is going to be more tactical. Maybe a little bit more tactical for your tastes?

[Navaron]

How is PS different from any other FPS?

Zergs. Big battles.

You PAY to play PS. People expect more, because they are giving more. It's up to SOE to meet those expectations, not for the subscriber to lower theirs.

[reaver101]

I would really like to see this become more of a believable war. Sure it has the whole backstory but I bet half of the people who just picked this up off of a shelf with no prior knowledge of the game don't even know that much.

I would really like to see towns and stuff like that put in, evidence of the civilian population before the war. There wouldn't have to be NPCs or anything just towns and maybe one city per cont in edition to the bases. This would really make the game more enjoyable for me and I believe others as well.

I would also like to see the mission system I mentioned earlier or something like that put in the game.

[Lonehunter]

Originally posted by reaver101
Blah blah blah...
I would also like to see the mission system I mentioned earlier or something like that put in the game.

That's a big 10-4 :stupid:

[BUGGER]

Believable, thats what this game only needs. If any of u [i]bothered [/l] to read the first chap of my story, i describe how and why each sanc became how they are. One was a Vanu Lab, one was a heavy weapons lab, the other one was a......err, fast weapon factory (if ya kno wat i mean).

I'd like to see one big building in the middle of the sanc, something that produces their weapons, or beter yet, jsut a main hall with things n the wal telling peeps what the hell they are fighting for. Also more regular "apartment" buildings, maybe them instead of the spawn rooms at the sanc, because before the war, people acually selpt after their shifts, right? that or you die of sleep and respawn in a tube again. also i would like to see more stuff done with water and lava, like if a heavy weather system is coming, i'd like to see the water make waves, or the lava shoot fire into the air. course the waves would cause problems with the deliverer, i'm just asking for choppy water tho. and craters would be good, maybe even meteriot craters. this is all detail stuff tho......an it would probly cuase lots of new bugs.....

the missions wouldn't really work, plus if its online, it would just make the game look stupid. if it would be offline, ya kno that would take a shitload of scripting? just making a guy walk a few feet is tough.....

[Harps]

I totally agree on the sanct should be more of a Home enviorment... I mean there are no barracks or anything. If they made the sanct more city like it would be so much better and cool to be inI know this wouldnt effect gameplay because there is no need for good fps in the sanct

[Kikinchikin]

You know i used to think this time to time, but last night made me realize wut this game was about. As i recently merged my small 40 person outfit into 7th Legion, which is now 16th i points i believe on emerald with 105 members or something, I realized that their outfit is A WHOLE LOT MORE organized and theres always someone to play with. Plus now that i have a microphone and teamspeak, It's even better. Last night we had 2 squads working together, i was leading one, since im a platoon leader and another platoon leader was leading the other, with the leader of the outfit controlling the overall "training exercise". Wut we were doing was practicing working in harmony and taking orders and responding and using discipline etc, and altho it sounds boring, that was the most fun i've had in planetside i believe. Instead of mindless killing, I found that altho i only killed maybe 40 people that night, the aspect of giving my squadmates orders, receiving objectives from our leader as simple as escort the ANT from base to gate then to base, and as complex as squad 1 send half ur members to engage enemy in courtyard while other half infiltrates backdoor and squad two protect the AMS and provide cover fire, was thrilling and made the game seem like it had a point. For all who care we were on from about 8-11 doing our operation on searhus. We started with 2 bases, and at 11 we had locked it down. So all i can say is get in a good outfit, and have fun working together with them, becuz altho planetside's main thing is "massively online FPS" its other main thing is teamwork and how its crucial if u wanna succeed.

[Searo]

I don't! Doodads=Lag. 56k+Lag=teh suck. I call this the Lag Equation. Why do we need a Volcanic Eruption?
It's pretty.
So?
To satisfy people here are some suggestions.

1. Sanc. Content- In the middle, a weapons factory stands. You can go in different rooms and see your weapons being made on an assembly line. You can pick these up with an ANT and drop them off at Villas. This is basically an ANT run for little exp (50 a run).
Go to a warpgate and bring NTUs back to the weapons plant for (50 xp a run)

2. Cities. In every continent there's a city. Basically a Stalingrad type thing out of MOH. Inside is a Control Post that you can hack. Hacking it gives your empire the ability to bring an additional 100 people to that continent.

3. Pillboxes. Along the roads, add pillboxes. Large bunkers with huge machine guns.
A. Storm the back and beat the snot out of them.
B. Shell the guns with tank fire.
Make these with a CC to control much like a tower. These require ANT runs from a warpgate to power it's ammo generator (or it runs out of ammo)

4. Most Wanted Spawns- This will randomly be presented to a person at a Vehicle Terminal. When this happens, they must drive a Deliverer containing a General to another base. All enemies on the continent will be informed of this, and stopping the convoy will gain a lot of XP.
(Note: Deliverer is heavily armored and can be piloted by anyone. Also it's a good idea to take cover along.)

5. Raid- This is a "Capture" on a non-latticed base. You hack it, and when it becomes latticed you gain the base with no 15 minute wait. It's a gamble though, because if it's resecured or the lattice doesn't work, you're screwed.

6. Burnt out towns along the road-As stated above, a small town with windows to shoot out of and cars to hide behind. Roofs also offer sniping points.

7. Tech Steal- Successfully capping a new "Weapons Facility" style base gives your empire access to enemy weapons on that continent until the base is retaken or taken by another empire. Only gives the tech of the previous owning empire. Weapons Facilities have 1 entrance and are heavily defended making a zerg retarded.

Thoughts? Flames? "OMG I WANT YOU TO HAVE MY CHILDREN!" comments? :p

[Kikinchikin]

i dunno if i heard right, but not everyone can drive a deliverer

[Searo]

This deliverer can be piloted by anyone and could be called APC or something.

[starrider]

remember how before the orignal TR came to the planet there were supposed to be Vanu aleins(SP)?

well when they took out the Vanu building a LONG time ago any way of knowing that anything but empty space was once there is gone. i really dont get why they took them out i think they looked cool and added more than just empty space sparsely populated by bases and towers....also liked mentioned before the sancs are EMPTY. once i felw over the VS sanc to get from on warp to another and there aren't even towers there. just roads and hills and grass. also wouldnt there be animals???

personally i'd like se even passing evidence of something ANYTHING having been on auraxis before humans got there and started fighting. or battle scars from the earlier days in the war.

[RUEN]

What i find kinda funny is being killed by a Terran with a pulsar or other Vanu weapon, because the background story IS that the Terran are against using vanu technology, thats what this whole war between TR and VS is about... kinda dis-heartening, but funny.