AA/AV Weaponry changes soon?

[WritheNC]

I saw this last night. Had to go back to page 5 to find it on the OF

http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/planetside/Forum8/HTML/014593.html

SporkFire on thread:

AA/AV weaponry is one of the Designers' main focuses right now. We are talking about it, discussing feedback and coming up with ideas every day on the subject. We will be releasing these revisions soon. So far, it looks it will be a fairly comprehensive adjustment to several key weapons. We're happy with how certain weapons in each class work. But there are some that need help.

Well if they wanna divide AA and AV and make them a bit more specialized, I have a feeling something is gonna change about the Striker more than the Lancer or Phoenix...

I have no opinion on any of this; just letting you all know =P

[Madcow]

Interesting. That post is so purposely vague that there's no way you can even read much into it. I'm a bit surprised, but if they do decide to find a way to split AV/AA it might be interesting. I'm curious what kind of certs we'd be talking about if they did, it would be rough to spend certs and spoil inventory room on AA.

In regards to the Striker, I personally think it's a bit too overpowered against MAXs, a bit too underpowered against land vehicles and pretty close to just right against air vehicles. They need to figure out the wacky lock on the thing as well, I can lock a MAX from 250 meters away and not lock a tank 20 meters in front of me sometimes. Considering it's technically supposed to be AV it has the most trouble there.

[Cease]

This scares me for many reasons. I have a bad feeling this is going to fuck a lot of things up.

[Sputty]

I guess I'll be get SA again soon

[WritheNC]

There's no way of knowing what they're gonna do really.

I have AV and SA. If they did screw up AV, I know I have plenty of things I'd like to spend those points on.

[Mejwell]

I find it interesting that so far everyone believes they'll only SCREW UP anti-vehicle weapons, and that there's no way they could improve them in the slightest.

[WritheNC]

Good point. I think they should make them stronger actually, now that I think about it.

It takes 10 Phoenix rockets to take out a tank of any empire...needless to say, it doesn't happen much, even if there's me and 2 other phoenix users. There's nothing more frustrating than "investing" 7 phoenix into a Magrider, then see it ride off to repair. Then a MAX walks around the corner and you have nothing left to kill it with

Make the decimator 400(its 300 damage now, right)?

Make the Phoenix 300 from 250, and carry 2 rockets before a required reload. Dumbfire is a discretionary balance issue I'm not going to go into.

Make the Striker lock on dependant on what you're shooting at. Don't change larger vehicles or aircraft, but make it take a while to lock onto smaller things, like MAX'es and Wraiths. After all, they are smaller and probably generate a smaller signature to lock onto than a tank or reaver would. If they're close, that's what dumbfire is for so you don't have to worry about a 5(arbritrary number I just threw in there) second lock on time on a max, for example. Up the damage to 225.

Lessen the Lancer damage to soft targets and up the hard target damage from 125 to 175. If someone wants a "realistic" argument of how a laser beam can cut steel better than flesh, here: Its an energy beam that actually disrupts the makeup and electron configuration of metal atoms, causing them to actually chemically repel each other for a split second(ie. there's a big hole in your tank where the laser passed through), rather than bonding like they normally do. Of course, since we're carbon based lifeforms, we're not metal, and it only hurts us because of the force/heat of the blast blah blah blah etc. etc.

I'm bored. :( I think I need a woman or something.

[Cease]

Mejwell,

It's not that I don't think they can't improve them the slightest. It's that I worry they will improve them too much and the domino effect that will have on the game.

When we are struggling for a cap and the heavy armor rolls in, you see a difference. They make an impact, even on tower caps. That in turn makes having Tech Centers vital to your continental campaigns. I worry that if they boost AV too much then vehicles lose their impact and Tech Centers become nothing more than a logic step in the Lattice. I worry that vehicles will become nothing more than transport from base to base.

[SumYungGui]

well, I want my lightning to last more than two decimators but that's a seperate topic.

as far as the difference between AA/AV there is definitely some problems in the game. primarily the striker. I just don't see how they justify giving the TR such incredible flexibility as well as such raw firepower. one cert, the AV cert, is enough to be able to effectively combat every single thing in this entire game other than the three basic armors and the infiltrator suit. THAT is the kind of 'flexiblity' the VS should have gotten, not 'instant switch AP mode' bullsh!t.

yes, I know, reavers fly away, MAXes hide behind rocks, tanks dodge between trees etc. etc. whoop-de-friggin-doo-dah, they do the exact same thing to other empires too. I DARE you to try to take out a reaver or a liberator with the lancer or pheonix. I dare you...

[Madcow]

Originally posted by SumYungGui
yes, I know, reavers fly away, MAXes hide behind rocks, tanks dodge between trees etc. etc. whoop-de-friggin-doo-dah, they do the exact same thing to other empires too. I DARE you to try to take out a reaver or a liberator with the lancer or pheonix. I dare you...

I'll give my sympathies to the VS in this regard, but as long as the NC have their AA MAX which only costs 2 certs, is great at AA and excellent at AI they get no slack.

The Lancer could use a buff to it's AA/AV properties, but it will also need to be fairly neutered against AI.

[SumYungGui]

you can hack the balls off of the lancer's anti-infantry damage without anesthesia using a blunted spork until the cows come home and I would be totally ecstatic AS LONG AS it gets some semi-respectable AV damage and loses either the CoF bloom or the half second firing delay. if you sit at the equipment terminal creating your inventory favorites and you decide you'll take out a gigantic box that has six rounds in it to use against infantry you're an idiot to begin with, and vanu 'flexibility' can take a flying leap naked with power tools off a bridge using a bungee cord. flexibility equaling 'jack of all trades master of neither jack nor shit' does NOT work in an FPS.

sniping is, as has been pointed out many times on this very forum, a game of 'guess where your target is going to be and let the CoF settle down'. that works very well as a balancing factor against infantry running around the courtyard of a base when you're shooting the bolt driver, it does not work at all against a reaver afterburning it's way from one horizon to the next or a vanguard hauling ass through your courtyard causing many walking and shooting things to be come dead and not-shooting things when you're trying to use an anti-vehicle weapon. why vanu has to put up with this while the terrans can do a fuggin line-dance with their anti-vehicle weapon and still kill the target because of lock on and more damage I will never know.

and the pheonix? meh, the pheonix has issues I will admit. the steerable missiles thing is very nice and all, but it needs a dumbfire mode with uber fast reload for such times as S.N.A.F.U.

[WritheNC]

Here's another thread where Spork replied.

http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/planetside/Forum8/HTML/015194.html


From Spork:

As I have said previously, we are spending a lot of time on AV and AA right now. The Phoenix is one of those weapons that will see some adjustments. We have a couple of ideas for it and they pretty much match yours. It's just a matter of selecting the set of adjustments that makes it feel powerful to the NC without making it feel overpowered to the TR and VS.

Among these, dumbfire is a probable change.Thing is, we are doing a largescale change here that will involve coding in addition to just tweaking parameters, so the timing on the Phoenix love is still up in the air.

:love:

[Mejwell]

I feel ashamed to put such a succinct reply to such an in-depth thread, but I think that my opinion can best be summed up by saying that I would really appreciate it if the AV weapons were made much more damaging to vehicles and much less effective versus infantry in general. I know it's not exactly "realistic" (and I use the term loosely, keeping in mind that three dominions fighting beyond a wormhole isn't exactly realistic) for rockets and explosives to do only minor damage to infantry, but I think it would help the gameplay.

The way I see it, the Anti-vehicle certification should be devestating to vehicles, but lacking to infantry.

The Special Assault certification should be, as it is, fairly versus both Infantry and Vehicles (but devestating to neither).

The Heavy Assault certification should be excellent versus Infantry, but lacking versus vehicles (as it is now).

Of course, there are exceptions to these broad rules: it shouldn't take you a full MCG clip to kill a Basilisk, but I think those are some general guidelines that should be followed.

[TheRegurgitator]

i think the pheonix should do more damage per shot rather than lower damage and 2 clip think about it you shove one missile thing into the barrel and you shoot 2 out? wtf

[Lonehunter]

I've been checking out the official forums lately and by the looks of it they're gonna nerf the striker.

[Mazzic]

On the Striker. Yeah, people have been bitching about it how good it is. I don't think it should be nerfed. It does what it should do, put fear into the hearts of Tanks and Airfcraft. After all. People have been complaining about the Jackhammer for ever. Did it get nerfed? No, because it does what its supposed to do.

I do think that the phoenix should have a dumbfire mode. Don't see how you could raise the rate of fire though.

Anti-V in general doesn't need to be boosted against Armor. If anything I think that Armor on all the heavy vehicles should either be raised or deflect more damage. But, thats asking for somthing that'll never happen.

Originally posted by WritheNC
It takes 10 Phoenix rockets to take out a tank of any empire...needless to say, it doesn't happen much, even if there's me and 2 other phoenix users. There's nothing more frustrating than "investing" 7 phoenix into a Magrider, then see it ride off to repair. Then a MAX walks around the corner and you have nothing left to kill it with


This is a flawed argument. You aren't supposed to be able to solo a Tank. As it is now...2 or 3 people can take down a tank or aircraft in short time. You are required to work together and not be some SuperSoldier. Armor on the battle field is supposed to inspire fear in infantry. Not be Rocket magnets that die in 30 seconds flat.


MAX. It's been said that Max armor was designed for indoor combat. You aren't supposed to be able to walk out onto the battle field and lay waste to everything you see. This is part of the SuperSoldier complex. As with armor on the battle field. Max's should inspire Fear in infantry with Indoor combat. If the Max is dying too quickly. He/she needs to re-evaluate their tactics and get some support from squad members.

[noxious]

Mazzic says what I wanted to say quite well. The tanks SHOULD take a long time to kill. The are a supportive weapon and their importance on the battlefield is vital (though often overlooked).

As for the lancer I think it is fine (and this is coming from someone who played TR primairly, and has been playing VS primairly for the last three weeks now). It does more damage per clip than the stryker, and is an excellent anti-spitfire weapon since one shot takes out a turret, however, unlike the NC and TR AV weapons, one shot doesn't mean as much with the lancer. The trigger delay is not a big deal, at short-medium range I don't miss anymore, and at long range the COF (and occassionally I admit my inability to aim perfectly) does inhibit it's ability, but it's already got a near-instant hit projectile working in it's favor. Yes, it's harder to hit a fast moving reaver, but a reaver can simply outrun a stryker missle, so it's got an advantage there. Sorry if I kind of rant, but I do love my lancer and I think it, paired with a lasher, makes an amazing combination of firepower.

I think the stryker is fine too, when you see "Warning: Missile Lock" you run your ass off like anyone with half a brain would do. It's inability to kill a max in one clip is also a bonus for them.

Then you have the phoenix. I laugh at it. I hope they are going to help it a lot.