Balance Pass Adjustments

[Indecisive]

Based on the feedback we have received, the following adjustments will be made to the balance pass before it goes live:

quote:
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1) Magrider handling improved significantly. (See notes about "momentum killer" feature that's coming soon.)

2) Lightning handling: The "off-the-line" speed was improved, although the max speed and time to max speed are essentially unchanged. But the Lightning has a faster acceleration curve from a stop now.

3) The "bleed %" on the explosion of the Magrider's main cannon has been increased so that it does more damage at the edge of its explosion. This allows the main cannon to have more of an effect against infantry than before.

4) Direct-hits by tank shells (150mm and 100mm) will now kill infantry immediately. However, near misses will still leave infantry relatively untouched.

5) NC MAX recharge rate on shield capacitor is doubled (recharges more quickly).

6) Reload time on the TR MAX Pounder is increased (4 seconds instead of 2). This helps prevent the Pounder from being the ulitimate defensive machine by allowing attackers to charge in while it's reloading.

7) NC Scattercannon damage vs. armor is turned back down to 5. Its damage vs. armor was increased slightly from 10 to 11.

8) The following vehicles had their weapon systems changed so that they had more positional flexibility (typically up/down angles were increased):
* Magrider (main cannon shoots up at 45 degrees and depresses down more. Flux cannon shoots up at 45 degrees now also.)
* Vanguard (weapons systems now depress down further...but not much more)
* Prowler (no change...these turrets already changed in the initial balancing pass)
* Lightning (weapons systems now depress down further)
* Enforcer (Firebird missile launcher now fires up to a 45 degree angle and depresses slightly more down for better defense against infantry.)
* Thresher (much higher vertical inclination, 85 degrees)
* Galaxy (side guns have much greater vertical range (up and down) and the rear gun can elevate slightly higher)

9) Striker buffer time (before losing a lock-on) has been increased to make the Striker easier to use.

10) Lancer CoF settles down more quickly after pivoting left or right with the weapon in-hand.

11) Mini-Chaingun now has a slightly reduced maximum CoF bloom when firing or taking damage, and it now has a bit looser CoF when standing (giving MCG users a reason to crouch so they gain max CoF tightness).

12) NC MAX Scattercannon no longer has a forced zoom mode. Your view remains normal even though the shot spread tightens at each of the firing modes (primary is the loosest spread, but most damage at close range, whereas tertiary is the tightest spread, but does less damage up close).

"Momentum Killer" Feature (TBD)
When vehicles hit other soldiers or other vehicles, they will do damage as normal. However, that vehicle's momentum will be slowed significantly, and that vehicle will have to accelerate again to attain max velocity after such a collision. This results in vehicles still being able to kill infantry by running them over, but also reduces that vehicle's momentum so that it's more of a target on the battlefield, and so that other infantry have a few extra moments to scramble to safety after the tank squishes a few of their friends.


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Victor Wachter
Community Relations Representative
Many questions can be answered by reading the PlanetSide Game Info and FAQ




HOLY 0WNAGE BATMAN!

[Sentrosi]

Wow, Momentum killer........The end of mass mowing down people.

Thank god they addressed this.

[Neon Apocalypse]

They need to fix that on AMS and Vanguard really badly, ive seen more mowing with those than the mag.

[Kikinchikin]

Well that has restored a lot of faith i lost in the devs when they announced their initial plans, altho im not sure about the pounder reload thing...

[Eldanesh]

4) Direct-hits by tank shells (150mm and 100mm) will now kill infantry immediately. However, near misses will still leave infantry relatively untouched

So does this mean we can't point the vanguard turret in the general direction of several infantry and kill them all any more? ;)

Hafta say, I have liked every thing about balence pass but what has been doen to enforcer and lightning. (Can't say if maurader had it happen too, 'cause I can't jack them on the test server.)

Enforcer+Lightning both had armor buffs, in the case of the lightning, by quite a lot (~800?) but in the enforcer by about 200. Now, this is good and in line with the rest of the armor buffs, however both of those two vehicles had such a nerf in acceleration and handling that odds are, that armor is not going to save you when you can't accelerate fast enough to put distance between yourself and the target. (handling is like a boat now too)

However, just my little complaint, but things are looking up as far as the patch goes. (Also that angle buff on the firebird rocket will help so much for hitting skeeters as well as the occasional infantry, I am happy and will prolly learn to live with it. :love: )

[Slice]

I agree with the entire patch except the whole striker nerf. That's my only beef. Otherwise, great job devs.

[Hamma]

Interesting.

[Black]

Interesting.

Very :D

[1024]

other infantry have a few extra moments to scramble to safety after the tank squishes a few of their friends.

:morbid:

[Veteran]

How is a near-miss by a 100+ millimeter shell not instantly fatal? Sounds like the Mag's main gun is now more effective at AI than the Vanguard's, which makes it better AI and AV. Odd.

[dscytherulez]

Yeah, i dont quite understand the whole tank thing. They already need direct hits to kill you, it takes like 2 van shells if theyre right next to you so as it is. Youd think a tank would have a little more...umph...ya know? How many non direct hits will it take now?

And one question, is the striker thing a buff or a nerf, because it says "easier to use" but ppl are saying it was nerfed.

[ajohn505]

It seems that with this and core combat, I may have to actually subscribe to the game again just to give it another go round.

[Lise]

9) Striker buffer time (before losing a lock-on) has been increased to make the Striker easier to use.

11) Mini-Chaingun now has a slightly reduced maximum CoF bloom when firing or taking damage, and it now has a bit looser CoF when standing (giving MCG users a reason to crouch so they gain max CoF tightness).

"Momentum Killer" Feature (TBD)
When vehicles hit other soldiers or other vehicles, they will do damage as normal. However, that vehicle's momentum will be slowed significantly, and that vehicle will have to accelerate again to attain max velocity after such a collision. This results in vehicles still being able to kill infantry by running them over, but also reduces that vehicle's momentum so that it's more of a target on the battlefield, and so that other infantry have a few extra moments to scramble to safety after the tank squishes a few of their friends.


OMFG SEX W/ DEVS PLZ

[WritheNC]

Very nice, except for the near-miss no longer instantly kills...

What the hell is a near miss? I mean, if a shell lands a meter away, you should still be dead, regardless of whether its a 100mm or 150mm shell.

[Incompetent]

I like everything but the pounder reload thing, i'm a bit uneasy about that. It already has to reload twice as often, now it's gonna take twice as long? The only thing it was good for before was defense, now it's going to be so easy to slip in under a volley it'll be nearly worthless. In the past it's been shown time and time again, TR infantry cannot stand up against enemy HA alone once the fighting gets indoors, now they take away the lynch-pin of our defensive tactics.

[ChewyLSB]

The new "near-miss" tank system is good, IMO. This may make Vanguard users actually *gasp* USE their machine guns.

[Infernus]

Nearmiss is understandable, people complain about how the splash of a vanguard shell kills them in 1 shot so what do they do, they reduce the splash's damage for both tanks. But hey aint that why they have machine guns (which got a buff in the balance pass)?

[Veteran]

I agree the Pounder nerf was unwarranted. With the existence of the Decimator, and the fact that it's a very common weapon (I dropped prepatch Striker for Decimator and never looked back), the Pounder is now a walking deathtrap. Between Decimators and ScatterMAXs forcing the Pounder to eat its own splash damage, I don't see this as a viable MAX platform.

The only advice I can offer to Pounder operators is to feint, i.e. stop firing when you're not out of ammo to trick the enemy into charging you. Problem here is you're most likely going to eat a Deci hoagy.

Too bad Decimator puts AV to shame. It should really be common pool AV. Special Assault would still be worthy if it were just Thumper and Rocklet Rifle.

Just my opinion.

[Acaila]

Nice fixes.

[Kikinchikin]

yeah i hate the pounder reload nerf now that I think about it. It's already soooooooooo long when u reload and see a reinforced with a deci round the corner and blast u while ur reloading. Sigh That really hurts me, becuz pounder is the only "weapon" I use now, since I am infiltrator. (altho i can use boomers and the amp quite good.

[TheN00b]

just wondering, do u guys think the Pheonix or the Deci r better as an AV supplement to the Jack?

[DramaticFanatic]

I think the pounder reload time increase is just fine. If you have a *good* team, you will be covered by them while you are reloading, and you will be repaired when receiving damage. Just a thought.

[Jagd]

N00B: Decimator delivers the most AV damage of all infantry weapons, but it requires a lot more skill than the empire specific AV weapons because there is no lock on or ability to steer the missiles, and it is a pretty slow moving rocket.

And I'm glad about the tank splash damage reduction, again they are adding to the game's realism; real world tanks use armor piercing shells that are basically big, heavy chunks of lead that use sheer weight to break through their target's skin. They're not at all like artillery shells which are designed to throw shrapnel about and rip through soft targets, although it's incredibly rare for games to try and be realistic about it.

[Incompetent]

I think the pounder reload time increase is just fine. If you have a *good* team, you will be covered by them while you are reloading, and you will be repaired when receiving damage. Just a thought.Thats the problem though, the pounders are the only thing that can stand up to the enemy in a straight fight and keep them at the bottom of the stairwell. We CAN'T cover them because the moment they reload a hoard of jackhammers will Surge in the door, up the stairs and kill all of the supporting infantry before they can blink.

Edit: we have some extremely good weapons, but none of them are geared for that kind of combat, we used to rely on our Pounders to keep us alive when we were stuck in those situations, but now we are just going to be slaughtered.

[Jagd]

How about we wait and see it live before losing all hope?

[Rbstr]

I have to say the MG's on a vanguard are the work pieces of shit in the game, the COF blooms like crazy and its COF is huge to beging with, the only time i have eer been able to kill infantry with it was one time when a guy TKed me so i jumped in a got him backwile he wasn't watching(wast Shells on a TKer no way)

[WritheNC]

Thats the problem though, the pounders are the only thing that can stand up to the enemy in a straight fight and keep them at the bottom of the stairwell. We CAN'T cover them because the moment they reload a hoard of jackhammers will Surge in the door, up the stairs and kill all of the supporting infantry before they can blink.

Actually I think the new NC maxes will pose more of a problem after the balance pass. If 3 or 4 walk in together with shields up, and if any of them get behind the maxes and start causing havoc, the TR maxes will likely have to unspike. Dunno what the VS would do though.

I have to say the MG's on a vanguard are the work pieces of shit in the game, the COF blooms like crazy and its COF is huge to beging with

Did they buff the vehicle machine guns yet? Or is that part of the balance pass? I don't remember.

[dscytherulez]

I do believe that is in the balance pass

[dscytherulez]

And I'm glad about the tank splash damage reduction, again they are adding to the game's realism; real world tanks use armor piercing shells that are basically big, heavy chunks of lead that use sheer weight to break through their target's skin. They're not at all like artillery shells which are designed to throw shrapnel about and rip through soft targets, although it's incredibly rare for games to try and be realistic about it.

Have you ever been shot with a real tank shell IRL? The explosion alone even if it wasnt near you would kill you, or at least knock u out and give u a serious concussion.

If you needed to directly hit someone with a tankshell IRL, why would we even use tanks today? They would be worthless.

[Jagd]

Actually, the M1 Abrams fires little rods of depleted uranium that punch through armor and then proceed to ricochet around inside the helpless target causing electrical fires and punching holes through the crew. I did some more reading on this though, and apparently they also have explosive shells (anti-infantry) that they use when they're attacking, say, a group of Iraqi civilians. Same thing with WW2 tanks, they had one type of shell for hard targets, and another for soft.

But anyways I still think it's a good idea to nerf the splash. When a vanguard is parked outside a tower, you simply cannot get past the doors alive if it's spamming shells into the wall.

[Hamma]

Momentum killler is my fav change :p

Pounder remains to be seen.. can't forget there are a ton of other changes in this patch so its hard to say how it will affect the pounder.

[Duffman]

I did some more reading on this though, and apparently they also have explosive shells (anti-infantry) that they use when they're attacking, say, a group of Iraqi civilians.


wow i think i lost almost all respect i had for you

[Jagd]

If you can't stomache cracks about bloodthirsty soldiers, what in heaven's name are you playing first person shooters for?

[Kikinchikin]

was waiting for someone to comment on that...

[Happy lil Elf]

that they use when they're attacking, say, a group of Iraqi civilians.Anyone else miss the real Jaged and wish "Jagd" would bleed to death after trying to screw his daddy's beartraps?If you can't stomache cracks about bloodthirsty soldiers, what in heaven's name are you playing first person shooters for?To amuse myself. Not to take cheap shots at the US military, that's for damn sure.

[Jagd]

:rolleyes: I sure hope you guys are Iraqi if that offended you. If you're Americans, then you better elect a sane president next time or you can just shut the hell up.

[Incompetent]

Least i checked, Bush was not on the ground in Iraq, lets not go insulting the honor of people who are worth 3 times as much as you are over the decisions of someone else, alright.

[Jagd]

How about somebody starts a thread in political debate if they feel like hashing this out any more. Personally I'd rather hear peoples' thoughts on the balance pass, not a bunch of people feeling sorry for the poor, downtrodden US military (!!!)

[Happy lil Elf]

How about somebody starts a thread in political debate if they feel like hashing this out any more. Personally I'd rather hear peoples' thoughts on the balance pass, not a bunch of people feeling sorry for the poor, downtrodden US military (!!!)

You shouldn't talk. It makes you look stupid :(

[Jagd]

Send me a PM if you feel like flaming, little man. I type fast and am happy to explain why you're wrong. ;)

[TheN00b]

i dont generally tend to agree or even respect jagd, but in this case i feel that he was right, even tho his wording was rather morally crude. i suggest we do not continu spamming this thread, and instead carry on in the politik forum

[Hamma]

:rolleyes: I sure hope you guys are Iraqi if that offended you. If you're Americans, then you better elect a sane president next time or you can just shut the hell up.
If you ever bring political debate into the game discussion forum again, you will be burned at the stake and then banned.

Thanks. Anything that continues along these lines will be deleted.

[Duffman]

If you ever bring political debate into the game discussion forum again, you will be burned at the stake and then banned.

Thanks. Anything that continues along these lines will be deleted.

sry for starting that whole thing didnt expect it to get crazy

and on a lighter note

GO CUBS

[TheN00b]

GO MARLINS. theyve been my favorite team 4 years, and now they finally hav a chance 2 show the rest of te world how k00l they r. Pudge-Man is l33t!

[Kikinchikin]

yeaaaaaaaah lets just kill this thread now. plzkthxbye

[Hamma]

Back on topic plz

[Happy lil Elf]

Yes'm Hamma :(

Jagd if you really want to play with me in a flame war feel free. I think we'll have to pick another play ground though.

[Indecisive]

Awww. My poor thread has been shot in the face then train wrecked :(

[SandTrout]

Thats the problem though, the pounders are the only thing that can stand up to the enemy in a straight fight and keep them at the bottom of the stairwell. Let me get this streight, you're bitching about only haveing one unit that can keep hordes of enemy soldiers pinned down at the bottom of the stairwell?

Tell me, what units/weapons do the NC and VS have that can do that? Absolutely none. The closest thing they have is the thumper, and oh yeah, thats fucking common pool.

I thought for a while that you were a respectable poster JagD, but now I realize that you're nothing but a troll that doesn't bother to think out a single post before hiting the submit botton. The Iraqi Civilian crack should prove my point to any sceptics. I feal bad for the TR haveing you to represent them.

[Indecisive]

Quote:
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Thats the problem though, the pounders are the only thing that can stand up to the enemy in a straight fight and keep them at the bottom of the stairwell.
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Let me get this streight, you're bitching about only haveing one unit that can keep hordes of enemy soldiers pinned down at the bottom of the stairwell?

Tell me, what units/weapons do the NC and VS have that can do that? Absolutely none. The closest thing they have is the thumper, and oh yeah, thats fucking common pool.


:nod:


OMFG SEX W/ DEVS PLZ


Indeed. Indeed.

[Veteran]

This is really more for the political discussion forum, guys.

Jagd has a right to free speech, btw. It's not like civilians haven't been gunned down, either.

[Eyyeball]

I think the problem is that TR Infantry is meat against the other empire's HA without the Pounder to back them up. So if the devs nerf the pounder into a useless ball of reloading fluff then the TR is screwed like a drunk cheerleader on prom night.

I will now refrain from flaming the hair right off of Jagd's nut sack with a blow torch because Hamma has been really cool to my outfit and he asked us nicely.

[Bismarck]

I will now refrain from flaming the hair right off of Jagd's nut sack with a blow torch


ow.

[Veteran]

The TR has indeed relied on the Pounder to make up for its lack of a heavy assault weapon. Only now is it shown just how inferior the MCG has been. If the new MCG rivals the Jackhammer, then the loss of the Pounder won't be severe, otherwise TR will be in for an ass-kicking.

[Jagd]

LOL! And I'm the one accused of derailing the discussion...

[Lise]

Well, concerning the Pounder, even you hardcore anti-Pounder freaks have to admit that four seconds means Pounders are practically sitting there saying "rape me!" In larger battles the problem can be solved by several Pounders coordinating their firing, so that one is always firing while the other reloads. But in small fights? Pounders'll be feeling the hard Deci love (as if they don't already.) Come on.

2 seconds seems good to me. 3 perhaps. 4 is a bit too much. (And if you say a second doesn't matter in combat... you haven't played enough PS, IMHO.)

[Veteran]

Exactly. A second can be an eternity. Also, what about when you're at half a clip and you decide to reload for safety's sake? Four seconds of vulnerability? A guy could pop out from behind a barrier, dodge behind it, decide to risk it and fire 2 Decimators in that time. Even if you finish reloading before the second Decimator, you have no guarantee of killing him before the second one hits. No sir, I don't like it. Then again, I don't have Pounder certified. I was sick of ScatterMAXs owning me indoors. I imagine it's going to be a lot worse now.

It would have suited me just fine if they had given every empire exactly the same weapons and vehicles. At least then we'd know if it was our skills or the weapons that were doing the work.

edit: That gives me an idea. Make the reload time for MAXs depend on how empty your clip is. Something like .1 second for each round that needs to be reloaded.

[Incompetent]

Tell me, what units/weapons do the NC and VS have that can do that?What weapons do we have that can stand up to the Jackhammer in CQB? We are ungodly fucked without the Pounder, due to the simple fact that a TR infantryman is just cannon fodder the second the fight moves inside. If we don't have our MAXes, what do we have? Our Cycler, well that will do fine if were being rushed with Punishers, our MCG, maybe if we can talk you into trying to shoot it out down the hallway. The Thumper, we might get one shot off before your shoving a jack down our throat, Rocklet has the same problem. Punisher might scratch them before they kill us, ooh but the sweeper is exactly the same right, cept for the fact that you'll start the fight with 1/3 damage because the jack can afford to spray you with fire while he closes and you can't shoot back, and if he gets close enough he can just tri-shot you to death before you can get your second shot off.

[Jagd]

I dunno Incompetent, I love being a TR grunt and I only use Special and Medium Assault. You're right, when a jackhammer gets the jump on me or when they outnumber us I'm fuct, but the same thing applies to the MCG; the first player to land a solid hit will usually prevail. Especially if you are being a sneaky bastard, and trying to come from unexpected angles all the time.

[Happy lil Elf]

Jagd. Please be mre consistant. You can't be a raving jackass in one post, then make reasonable counter arguments in the next. That's my niche damnit :p

[Jagd]

That's the thing Elfie, like most people there is more to me than a couple rude comments. If I had to break it down, I'd say you could make me up out of the following items:

1 part Asshole
1 part Law Student
1 part Violent Game Lover
1 part Treehugger
1 part Businessman
1 part Aging Raver
2 parts Your Daddy

:p

[Happy lil Elf]

You had me until treehugger :(

For that I'm afraid.....we must kung-fu fight!

[InfiniteStorm]

I must say something reguarding the Tank shell splash damage. I think it is kinda good the splash was reduced on the cannon and the chaingun was buffed. I don't think I've ever seen a Vanguard kill anyone with the chaingun in a long time. Has anyone actually used the Mag and seen its AI capability? You guys are complaining cause it will take 2 shots instead of 1 to kill and infantry with your gun when I've hit an agile 3 times in the chest with the main cannon of the Mag and not killed the guy. You guys wonder why we do so much mowing. Also the front gun on the Mag is just as useless as the chaingun on the Vanguard. Takes about 30 shots to kill anyone.

The Vanguard is still the best tank out there. I play VS and if I see a Vanny driving around I know I'm screwed and immediately look for cover. Most of the time I get mowed anyway. I can't wait for the momentum change for all the vehicles. Especially the AMS :rolleyes:

[TheN00b]

lol, i luv r pretty ickle tank

[shadowseed]

Oh god, the sooner they put in the momentum feature the better. Im really getting tired of stepping out of towers im my max to have some GIT in an AMS come zooming towards me, and no matter how far move out of the way, the shitty client-side hit detection gets me every time!

[Veteran]

"Early Next Week" is on its way out... Can someone please tell me when the balance pass is going live? I can't bring myself to play until it does, because I feel like I'll just need to unlearn a lot of what I've learned, so I'm pretty anxious to see it.

[Nitsch]

Oh god, the sooner they put in the momentum feature the better. Im really getting tired of stepping out of towers im my max to have some GIT in an AMS come zooming towards me, and no matter how far move out of the way, the shitty client-side hit detection gets me every time!

Maybe people will start to deploy AMS's instead of using them has mowers.

One time i saw 5 friendly ams's driving around mowing people, but when i died there wasn't an ams for me to respawn at.

[Hamma]

"Early Next Week" is on its way out... Can someone please tell me when the balance pass is going live? I can't bring myself to play until it does, because I feel like I'll just need to unlearn a lot of what I've learned, so I'm pretty anxious to see it.
Nobody knows :eek:

[DarkDragon00]

:rolleyes: I sure hope you guys are Iraqi if that offended you. If you're Americans, then you better elect a sane president next time or you can just shut the hell up.

I agree with u jagd.

on the notes at hand i think the Air Vechs are the most screwed in this whole patch and there has been nothing said by the devs about how/if they are gonna fix it. The AV weapons need a buff and to keep the deci in line it deserves a buff too, but maybe the maxes should get a boast in armor or something.