Infiltration Suit weaponry

[GunboatDiplomat]

I've read conflicting reports on just what weapons the I.S. can use. Some say it's pistols and knives only, others that they can't use rifles. Could anyone who knows which one is correct please let me know?

Thanks.

[Camping Carl]

I've heard that it's pistols and knives only.

[Sputty]

Heh, by "they can't use rifles" meaning guns larger than pistol. So yeah, pistol and knife only.

[GunboatDiplomat]

Thank you CampingCarl and Sputty. You have dashed my hopes and shattered my dreams. Have to use the I.S. like I play Thief2 then.

[GunboatDiplomat]

It's just that www.planetside.stratics.com has all the weapons in lots of different categories, like SMG and Missiles. There was a "Rifle" category, so I got confused as to which was the case.

[Camping Carl]

Thank you CampingCarl and Sputty. You have dashed my hopes and shattered my dreams.

You're welcome, that's what we're here for. :D

[Sputty]

PSU, shattering dreams since 2002. :D

[�io]

The stealth can't grab anything bigger than pistols, be it the SMG(aka Suppressor), a rifle, a rocket launcher, whatever. :)

[Sputty]

Yeah, it's a good diea or else every sniper would be basically invincible. Well, anything with a gun for that matter.

[Sandtaco]

Thank you CampingCarl and Sputty. You have dashed my hopes and shattered my dreams. Shattered your dreams!?!?! The fuck? What do you want Infiltration to be like?!?! Yeah lets just give I-S rifles and rocketlaunchers that way the can be the uber-soldier.

[Sputty]

Calm down. Heh, maybe he does....Although it would be stupid if they could have a rifle or higher. Very stupid indeed.

[Lexington_Steele]

I am pretty sure infultration suit can carry grenades.

[GunboatDiplomat]

I was only REALLY hoping for the Supressor (silenced!!!), but pistols, knives and grenades will suit me fine. And Santaco, judging by the picture, we're on the same side, so don't be too worried about me running around in a suit you can't see with a Lancer or something.:) , but like everyone says, that isn't going to happen anyway, it would unbalance the game far too much. I just wanted to be filled in on the facts.

[Sputty]

Exactly.

[�io]

Yeah a lot of people wanted the Suppressor with the stealth suit. I don't mind much though. I doubt i'll be using it that much, the way things are going i'm gonna be in a vehicle 80% of the time. :(

[afex]

Originally posted by GunboatDiplomat
It's just that www.planetside.stratics.com .... blah blah

Mistake #1

[�io]

:lol:

PSU 0wnz j00!

[Shyfted One]

MAG-Scatter = ultimate infiltration suit pistol :D Sneak up on them, get within a decent range, BAM! Muahahaha

[Sputty]

Originally posted by afex
Mistake #1
:rofl: That's right. PSU is thge best PS site out there, and one of the best game based sites in general.

[Daedalus]

hmm,yes...the pistol only rule for the I.S. seems preety balanced
Yea, if the I.S could carry rifles then they would be unstoppable (imagine cloaked snipers :sniper: :scared:)

1 question:When someone wearing a I.S moves , does a faint outline appear?

[Muffman]

All I've got to say is WTF?!?! What is the point of even having a silenced weapon if you can't even use it with I.S.? Sure, you could just use the regular armor, but whats the fun of that? I don't really understand this :confused:

[Sputty]

Ok,think oif this, an invisible armor guy, nades a group of soliders then opens up with the suppressor from behind. There goes 20+ gyuys easily. They ahve no idea where to shoot at all.

[Daedalus]

Yea Muffman , Sputty's right,think about it!
A I.S could kill 1 guy,or 2-3 if they're not lookin' but not a whole squad!
Well , maybe if the squad if heavily wounded and he throws a grenade at them...

[Sputty]

Infiltraotrs are recon troops, not for combat.

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Daedalus
1 question:When someone wearing a I.S moves , does a faint outline appear?

It's similar to this. (http://www.blizzard.com/images/ghost/screenshots/ss12.jpg)

[Sputty]

It's a ripple-like effect.

[Sandtaco]

I doubt i'll be using it that much, the way things are going i'm gonna be in a vehicle 80% of the time. So Dio... that means I get a ride wherever the hell I want?

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Muffman
All I've got to say is WTF?!?! What is the point of even having a silenced weapon if you can't even use it with I.S.? Sure, you could just use the regular armor, but whats the fun of that? I don't really understand this :confused:

Why would a guy in an I.S. need a silenced weapon? If there are many guys in the base or something, killing someone in there through any means will alert them. And once they're alerted, you're in trouble. Honestly, I think the Surpressor has limited value as a sort of sneaky weapon. I could see it being use for a base rush, where people move very quickly and use Surpressors to make sure they catch people off-guard, but even that would be a rare scenario. Killing people while being stealthy seems to me like an oxymoron in PS.

[Sputty]

Especiallyu since it says 'someone' killed 'someone' so you 'll know someone on your side died.

[Daedalus]

Originally posted by Warborn
It's similar to this. (http://www.blizzard.com/images/ghost/screenshots/ss12.jpg)

That's starcraft:ghost,and there you deal with A.I opponents
Pretty visible to me,i hope it's not that visible in the game

[Sputty]

He knows it is. The faster you move in the I.S. the more visible you become. No pics of cloaked I.S. have been released.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by Muffman
All I've got to say is WTF?!?! What is the point of even having a silenced weapon if you can't even use it with I.S.? Sure, you could just use the regular armor, but whats the fun of that? I don't really understand this :confused:

Why would anyone in real life use silenced weapons? We don't have invisible infultrations suits (that I know of).

Remember, just because you are not invisible does not mean you can't be stealthy.

[Sputty]

Exactly, use a standard or agile armor if you really want to be stealthy. You can also fight. If you really want a weapon above a pistol to sneak around it's not really sneaking, more like fighting.

[Navaron]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Muffman
All I've got to say is WTF?!?! What is the point of even having a silenced weapon if you can't even use it with I.S.? Sure, you could just use the regular armor, but whats the fun of that? I don't really understand this
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



"Why would anyone in real life use silenced weapons? We don't have invisible infultrations suits (that I know of).

Remember, just because you are not invisible does not mean you can't be stealthy."

THis is the 342 time I've agreed with lex in a week. Somethings wrong, run to church now.

In response: Have you ever played Splinter Cell??? Raven Shield? If you're using a Silenced weapon, don't stand out in the open - duh.

[Sputty]

You forgot about MGS!!!!!HOW?!?!?!?!?Anyway, yeah, exactly. Being stealthy in an I.S. suit wouldnt be great anyway. People with implants could see you just as easily and your armor would be lower.

[Warborn]

That's starcraft:ghost,and there you deal with A.I opponents
Pretty visible to me,i hope it's not that visible in the game

That's what the I.S. sort of looks like when it's moving quickly. As the description says, if you don't move, you're invisible. So it'll be very similar to the Predator cloak in AvP2.

[Shyfted One]

Originally posted by Warborn
So it'll be very similar to the Predator cloak in AvP2.

Do you have or play AvP2? If you do then stop by my clan's evac server :) "[Alpha] Evac Revival!"

As for the topic, I pretty much agree that you can't really try to be a stealthy and fight at the same time. This isn't some facility in a remote location involving a handful or guards who never seem to be in a group, this is WAR! The suits main use is really just for recon. Don't expect to be able to take on a squad in it.

[balab]

no reason why we can't give the IS a pair of binoculars :D

the ultimate scouting machine.

[Sputty]

Yeah, but they can get the "zoom" implant. That would work just the same.

[RabidPlatypus]

even with the pistol I doubt weapons will be anything but a last resort for infiltration.

[Sputty]

That's why they only gave it the most basic weapons.

[Warborn]

That's pretty much it right there, Rapid. IS's offer no armor. If you get into a firefight, unless you have surprise and great aim, or your opponent is badly wounded, you will very likely die before you can kill him with a pistol.

Do you have or play AvP2? If you do then stop by my clan's evac server "[Alpha] Evac Revival!"

I only really like the Survivor game mode for regular AvP2, where the Marines have one life and the Aliens have unlimited, and you get points for surviving the longest. That's really the only kind of regular AvP2 I ever really enjoyed.

However, I did think that AvPx or whatever it was called (it's a mod) was fantastic. Truly a great mod, and I wish more servers ran it. The Predator was a little more balanced, as were the Aliens, and the various interesting classes you could be (Combat Synthetic to Alien Queen) really topped it off. I never got tired of playing it, but I couldn't ever find a server for it.

no reason why we can't give the IS a pair of binoculars

It'd be nice if they could have some kind of a occular modification which provided zoom and maybe even Night Vision, but required you to buy an equipment Cert to use. Only someone in an IS would be able to use it though. It would be especially nice because people in IS's will have such limited equipment selection, not being able to use virtually all weapons, and something like that would give them something else to spend certs on that they could actually use.

[Sputty]

Yeah, and if they could relay "pictures" or something along that line to commanders...heh..that'd be interesting and suepr useful

[�io]

Originally posted by Sandtaco
So Dio... that means I get a ride wherever the hell I want?

:lol:

The way things are going yeah, i've scratched hacking off my list of certs/jobs, if sniping isn't balanced than that will be going off to, only other jobs/certs for me will be engineer and vehicles. :)


Also i agree it would be cool if the "I.S." had a special scout equipement and i also seriously hope you can kill a light armor in one blade hit with the 2nd fire. :)

[Sputty]

That would make the rifle more useful to the I.S. than a pistol...heh..

[Shyfted One]

Originally posted by Warborn
However, I did think that AvPx or whatever it was called (it's a mod) was fantastic. Truly a great mod, and I wish more servers ran it. The Predator was a little more balanced, as were the Aliens, and the various interesting classes you could be (Combat Synthetic to Alien Queen) really topped it off. I never got tired of playing it, but I couldn't ever find a server for it.

InfamousAndy, the oldest member in Alpha, helped Karnivore a lot in testing that mod. It was a great and you're right about there never being a server around with it on. Andy has been working on his own mod for a while now and his newest version is going to add new types of weaponry and try to balance the game as much as possible, should be pretty good once it's finished. A few clans are plannign to put it on their server once it's done, so I'll put up a post in the Lounge about when it's released incase you're somewhat interested.

Specific certs would be nice since those who use the IS will already be very limited due to their small inventory and combat effectiveness.

[Tobias]

an IS with melee boster and doing secound attack would proably do tons of damage, proably a kill if you knife them in the head and they are a light. If not, whip out your pistol and start shootin. Keep regen implant or get the medical skills and heal, then go on to your next kill.

[Warborn]

Keep regen implant or get the medical skills and heal, then go on to your next kill.

Unless the enemy is totall unorganized, there won't be a next kill. Once you blow your cover and reveal your presence, people will be specifically looking for enemies in an IS. If you're in a base, they'll spray corridors and rooms before entering, and they'll probably travel in groups and use grenades a lot also. Unless you're just dicking around, and not trying to actually accomplish any sort of mission, you're better off using your implant slots for more important accessories.

[Tobias]

Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

[SpaceDrake]

Originally posted by Tobias
Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

Bah. We "IS people" create enough havoc to distract the guys inside the fortress to weaken the defenses so that the main assault force can barge in without taking as many casualties as they might otherwise take.

As for killing people... give a group of 10 guys in IS suits Beamers for anti-vehicle work or MAG-Scatters for anti-troop work and a good knife, and we'll kill plenty of people. :D

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Tobias
Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

They go out with no armor and no weapon bigger than a pistol, while you hide in the bushes and fight from 100 yards away. I think we both know who the real men really are.

As for killing people... give a group of 10 guys in IS suits Beamers for anti-vehicle work or MAG-Scatters for anti-troop work and a good knife, and we'll kill plenty of people.

Shotguns can fire solid slugs too. I'm sure the MAG-Scatter will have anti-armor rounds also. But, realistically, I don't think you're going to be able to hold enough anti-armor rounds in an IS to seriously harm, let alone take out any vehicles or MAX suits before you and your 9 friends are wiped out. They're pistols, after all. And you have no armor. If 10 guys with no armor and pistols could kill a lot of people, I'd be worried what 10 guys with Reinforced armor and heavy weapons and rifles could do.

[chaos1428]

Exactly, Warborn.

I 'can' see how a few more I.S. will be a little more effective, but I'm sorry, 1 worthless soldier + 9 worthless soldier = worthless squad. (worthless in the aspect of combat)

[SpaceDrake]

I still think that people underestimate the power of an IS suit. While we'd be worthless in a traditional firefight, much of the power of the IS suit is it's element of surprise. When they first get into a base undetected, they can gang up on individual guys and kill them before they know what hit them, or sneak up on a control/rearming center, toss plasma grenades in there (the IS suit can carry a few grenades IIRC), and then pump shotgun blasts/laser beams/rapid-fire pistol rounds/magnum shots into the ensuing chaos. The real trick would then be hiding yourselves while they search for you, and then causing more havoc with the search teams. Meanwhile, while the base is having to devote precious resources to hunting you down, the assault force you've been in contact with since the beginning starts it's assault on the now-distracted base. :D

And what about taking out remote defenses? The guys manning those will probably often find knives sticking out of their backs if they're not really careful (and if the infiltrator is really patient, not even then would he be entirely safe.) Or the infiltrators hack the security systems of a base, and suddenly nothing in the base works at all? The possibilities are endless. They're certainly not the ultimate soldier - but I certainly think they're more useful than people give them credit for.

(And I'm sorry, but if ten guys set their Beamers to anti-vehicle mode and shoot in unison at a Galaxy, it at the least will be too rickety to try and land in a hot LZ.)

[SandTrout]

We dont want the assassins from DAoC in this game. There needs to be another armor suitible for combat than just the stealth suit(which shouldnt be suitable for combat).

You either sneak, or your fight, chances are you cant do both.

[SpaceDrake]

Well now, keep in mind that once the initial element of surprise wears off, an IS group has to be REAL good at hiding and sneaking if they expect to survive more than a few seconds. Once the *** is up, they should have to think fast or they're dead.

I don't want uber invisible guys - I'm enough of an MMOG veteran to know that's a bad thing (TM). But if they're as useless as people make them out to be, what's the point?

[chaos1428]

SpaceDrake

I didn;t say they were worthless. In fact, attacking a base would be harder without them. I was just simply saying, fomr a combat standpoint, they SHOULD be worthless. If you ever played DAoC, then you know what SandTrout is talking about.

But hey, if you can manage to round up 10 I.S. guys, then more power to ya. Thats the beauty of MMOG's, creativity. Sometimes its for the better, sometimes its for the worse, but nonetheless, people. People make the game. If you can get 10 I.S. guys together, and start terrorising the battlefield, then shit ya man, do it. My point is simply that one I.S. should be worthless in combat. I.S.'s main concern should not be how mahy kills he can get, it SHOULD be taking out remote defenses. It SHOULD be hacking terminals. It SHOULD be to scare the bajesus out of base defenders.
So if anyone misunderstood my original point, I hope that clears it up :)

[NapalmEnima]

I think you gues are ignoring an important weapon available to everyone save MAXes.

Grenades.

If an infiltrator drops a plasma grenade on your head... chances are you'll just die.

But I think an infiltrator that has to kill someone has already messed up.

I see their role as more intel/sabatoge. Scoping out the enemy defenses, camping out near the command terminal or generators, waiting for the signal from their subtlety-impaired compainions outside.

When that signal is given, say goodbye to the gens, wall turrets, and command consol. It's been said you can hack the fixed turrets to disable them. To bad you can't actually take control of them... that would rock. Imagine a squad of infiltrators taking over all a bases turrets right before their friends arrive. Mayhem.

Suddenly going from fragile infiltrators to turret operators (heavily armed and armored) would most likely be a fun experience. I wouldn't envy the defenders...

[Ludio]

I think people dont understand SpaceDrake (if I'm wrong about this then sorry), while they are useless in traditional combat, a well played IS will never let people have that chance. They are sort of like snipers, if you can kill a person before they know you are there, then you are safe, a sniper is useless in 'traditional' combat, but he is still deadly. I too agree that their main role will be disruption of base defense by hacking the systems and such, but they can also take out a few defenders.

Perhaps the best comparison would be to TFC spies (although of course an IS suit is different because its invisible as opposed to looking like the enemy). They can kill heavily armed people with suprise, but they are useless when revealed. This means that an infiltrator will be able to take out a few people, but when faced with a group or someone who is extremely cautious and clears rooms with grenades then they will be dead, or at least on the defensive. They are not going to be unstoppable tanks, they are going to be patient and deadly killers who will only take out a few people, but more importantly cause fear in the enemy ranks. If the people defending a base have to clear a room with a grenade first, or travel in groups then the IS has done a fine job, regardless of how many people he has killed, he has lowered the efficiency of the defenders, allowing the attackers to take the base with less casualties.

Oh yes, and by a few people, I don't mean all at once, they will hunt individuals and ambush them from behind one at a time, with secondary knife attacks, or use grenades. Thats not to say they will be uselss if there is more than one person, just that they will have to be very good. If an IS gets more than a few than it means that the base defense is probably lazy and deserves to die :devilwink

And if you thought that hacking a console was stressfull because you cant see whats going on around you, imagine counter-hacking a console when there is an IS running around in your base. :scared:

And I am not just a person trying to justify their role in the game, I really want to be a MAX heavy assault guy, lets see some IS try and backstab a walking tank!

[Zatrais]

So let me get this straight, you IS people are going to run into a base and start to knife people whit a knife that makes a sound in its secondary fire mode and hope to kill the person before he/she turns around and blows you away whit a jackhammer(or anny other weapon)..... Beeing stealthy is going to be hard, sound magnification, darklight emiters and just plain kick ass sound systems or headphones are going to be bad for you IS folks.

btw NapalmEnima could you point out where you got the info that a MAX can't use grenades? MAX's still got hands that could be used for grenade lobbing tho not for handeling anny equipment... I know a dev has stated that MAX's can't use anny BANKS, hacker tools, medkits etc but never heard them state it about grenades... heck MAX's might be able to use a pistol and grenades.... *shrug*

[�io]

People really should read our site a bit more. :)

Mechanized Assault eXo-suit
These are the big armors that have incredibly large weapons and special abilities. The drawback to these suits is that most miscellaneous equipment (like ACEs, BANKs, Med Applicators, etc.) can't be used due to the extreme clunkiness of the armors.

Just think of a MAX as a walking tank. No nades, no rifles, no REKs, nothing. :)

[Zatrais]

It dosn't mention grenades and i'm not sure if grenades are included in misc equipment.... it's a weapon afterall not something it'd put in the same category as medkits

[Sputty]

You can't use grenades, I'm sure. They've mentioned it multiple times. The hands are just guns anyway.

[Zatrais]

Show me where they state that you can't use grenades in a MAX. And all the MAX's has atleast 1 hand thats not used, why should't it be able to grab a grenade and throw it....

[Sputty]

It can hardly move it's hand and MAXes can't sue weapons. A grenade is a weapon.

[Zatrais]

You're just pulling answers from thin air Sputty, if you can't prove that a dev has stated it then don't say it as a fact.

[Sputty]

They've stated they can't use weapons! Read the paragraph on MAXes.

[Zatrais]

*sigh*
Grenades are used from the inventory, no weapon slot for grenades. What the no weapon could and most likely means is that they can't use pistols, rifles and knifes.

Little info has been released about grenades.. we just know they can be set to detonate on impact or whit a 2 fuse and that they come in different types.. thats bout it.

[Sputty]

They can't have any epuipment like medic things and such.

[Zatrais]

they can't USE it but that dosn't mean they can't carry medpacks/other equipment in their inventories for team mates and such.

difference between beeing able to carry and beeing able to use.

[Sputty]

So? You said you thought they could use them....ehhh..

[Zanzibar]

Originally posted by a Newbie
*sigh*
Grenades are used from the inventory, no weapon slot for grenades. What the no weapon could and most likely means is that they can't use pistols, rifles and knifes.


MAX's dont have an inventory, they have a 'box' where other people can store items/weapons.
oh and if you read the MAX paras then youll see that it says that they cant even use ACE's BANKs or MEDKITs let alone pull out a pin from a grenade!!!

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by Zatrais
*sigh*
Grenades are used from the inventory, no weapon slot for grenades. What the no weapon could and most likely means is that they can't use pistols, rifles and knifes.

Little info has been released about grenades.. we just know they can be set to detonate on impact or whit a 2 fuse and that they come in different types.. thats bout it.

I thought you had to switch out a weapon to your inventory and switch the grenade in to use it.

I could be wrong.

MAXs can carry grenades, but I would assume that they can't use them.

[Sputty]

I remember Dave saying that in a thread. Someone could find it. I'm a little too lazy.

[Zatrais]

......

Zanzibar did you just pull that from your ass?

Where did you get the information that they have a box where other people can store things and no inventory?

And why would they need to pull the pin out of a grenade? You studied the arming mechanism of the grenades in Planetside or something?

edit:

Just so it's clear, i'm not saying MAX's CAN use grenades. I'm saying that so far a dev has not stated that MAX's can't use grenades so it IS a possibility that a MAX can use one. I atleast can't remember reading that a MAX's can't use them or find proof that they can't.

[Daedalus]

Man , is thread gonna be renamed to "MAX suit dicussion" or what?This is getting off topic
Anyway,can the IS cloak for a short time or a long time?And can it recharge its batteries?
:confused: :confused: :confused:

[SpaceDrake]

Er, right... anyway. :p NapalmEnima and Ludio hit the nail on the head. I don't expect IS guys to be capable of taking a base by themselves, even if you were to get more IS guys in the base than other people. (Hell, coordinating that many IS guys would be a nightmare.) If you unload even half a clip into an IS guy with an assault rifle they should fall over, and a SINGLE headshot should be enough to bring one down (since they don't have a helmet.) But a dedicated squad of IS guys should be capable of causing sufficient havoc within a base to soften it up for an assault (even at the price of their lives) or scope out the base and provide good recon for the main assault force. And since I enjoy causing wanton chaos so much, I've found my calling in life (as it were.) :D

Oh, Napalm, Ludio... if you like doing this sort of thing as much as I do... http://planetside-universe.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1652 :brow:

Just an idea. ;)

[Sputty]

It's always cloadked depending on your speed.

[Airlift]

I would attach one infiltrator to each squad for looking around corners and such. He would not engage even if he gets a target alone and unaware anyway, because the stealth would be one of two hackers in the squad. He's just going to be eyes for the squad. Theoretically.

[Tobias]

max's cant use gnades.



Thats all there is to it, now shut up and eat j00 beans.

[MooKoo]

i would not think that MAX peopel could use nades because they wouldn't be able to throw them i mean look at their arms its hard enough to move

[NapalmEnima]

Originally posted by Zatrais

Just so it's clear, i'm not saying MAX's CAN use grenades. I'm saying that so far a dev has not stated that MAX's can't use grenades so it IS a possibility that a MAX can use one. I atleast can't remember reading that a MAX's can't use them or find proof that they can't.

Correct. No dev has specifically stated that a max cannot use grenades.

However, I know I'm right, and here's how:

Point 1: To use regular equipment (and more importantly to our discussion, grenades) you have to put it into a pistol slot and equip it.

Point 2: MAXes do not have pistol slots... or rifle slots. They have a single weapon system that cannot be switched save at an inventory terminal.

Conclusion: No grenades, REC, BANK, ARC or any other funny acronym.

And for my supporting evidence, a couple screenshots from PSU's media gallery.

1) A regular joe infantryman... notice the weapon slots in the lower right corner:

http://planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?cat_id=29&img_id=1

Notice that this person has only two weapon slots... a pistol and a rifle. This poor shmoe is in standard armor (25 points of armor, says so in the top right corner)

2) A Vanu MAX. Note that there are no weapon slots of any kind. This is the only screen-shot taking max we pictures from. Two of em:

http://planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?cat_id=32&img_id=3

and

http://planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?cat_id=32&img_id=6

Note that there are no weapons slots in the lower right corner, just the one big Vanu arm cannon thingy.

And note that this, the lightest max, has either 650 or 850 points of armor, it's hard to read.


I feel confident, given this evidence, that MAXes cannot use grenades, tools, or TOILET PAPER. They MAY be able to use their limbs as melee weapons, but other than that, they're stuck with that primary weapon system. And 650+ points of armor.

Poor thing. :rolleyes:

Does that satisfy you Zatrais? If not, I may have to resort to my namesake in order to secure your agreement. :twisted:

[�io]

Nicely done! :thumbsup:

[Sputty]

Exactly. That's jut a collection in one post of what we were all saying for a couple days.

[Zatrais]

Yeah, that satisfies me. Nicely done post that has some proof in it.
Just stating something whitout proving it is not something i'll accept hehe but NapalmEnima\s post is proof enough for me.

So no ghetto bombing by spamming nades whit a VS MAX as i jump over the wall.. bummer hehe. But hey, whats those 2 numbers? Current ammo in the gun and the total ammo? Or ammo for secondary and primary fire mode... hmm