Smoke post Maurader Buff...a sign of things to come for all vehicles?

[TheRagingGerbil]

The GroundPounder has a pretty incredible rate of fire, as well. It can be used to saturate an area and can really destroy enemies in that area. When used against vehicles, it doesn't do huge damage in a single hit, but its high rate of fire (three per second) combined with the increased ammo counts (clip size increased from 20 to 50 and your ammo box changed from carrying 50 mortar shells to 100 mortar shells) should allow you to freely utilize this weapon in the manner it was intended. (NOTE: The clip size and ammo box changes are coming in the patch after next.)

The bolded part shows the increases in clip size and ammo box size. 200% increase is incredible. I can't wait to see the numbers for all empire vehicles.

Link:
http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/planetside/Forum16/HTML/000910.html

[dscytherulez]

Thank god...after certing in that buggies I was pissed off how many times i hadda run back to base to rearm. I definately want this.

[Liquidtide]

Yeah dsythe I know too well you drive that thing :)

[Firefly]

He also posted this:

we've already announced that the Deci will be going to AV soon. (Patch after next.)

[BDMJ]

Goddammit, now I will have to choose between the thumper and deci :( I can't have my cake and eat it too.

[Jagd]

Wtf? Lame ass.

/heads off to start a flame war at the OF

PS: About the deci, marauder changes woo!

[Zatrais]

I wouldn't hold my breath for ammo increases in the mag for the other buggies. Increasing the mag isn't as much a buff as its a fix. They increased the refire rate x3, decreased the splash by half and reduced the damage of that weapon by 3x whitout increasing the ammo in the mag so it could actually fire for more than 5 seconds or so.

I'd be more exited bout the increases in torque that SJ mentions and other changes (deci going AV).

[dscytherulez]

Wow I didn't know the deci was planned for AV...Cool, 2/3 of my chars have AV and not SA lol.

[TheRagingGerbil]

Deci changes are stupid. I'd prefer to see the addition of a single shot Deciesque weapon, one more powerful then the deci, but only effective against vehicles.

Yay for the TR I guess...even though I'll be on the recieving end...

[Majik]

As long as they are fixing ammo boxes, how about showing the skyguard some love. Damn thing eats ammo faster than a personal shield eats stamina.

And while I'm thinking of it, didn't they say they would be resizing the AV ammo to make the weapon more attractive to carry by eating less of our inventory for those oversized boxes.

[Jagd]

Well now suddenly AV will be the must-have cert, but what good is that. They shouldn't be messing with things like that this late in the game's life, unless it's a purely *positive* change for all players, like the vehicle cert thing. Dammit. I am really pissed about this.

[BDMJ]

Guess what, SA is now worthless =/ Way to kill infantry versatility devs.

[Majik]

Guess what, SA is now worthless =/ Way to kill infantry versatility devs.

:confused: :confused: :confused: Worthless :confused: :confused: :confused:

The Thumper is one of the most versitile weapons in the game. I often carry one loaded with EMPs for all those occasions you come across the random vehicle running from a tower, or that overly mined CY. Not to mention the suppression factor you get using it with Plasma in secondary mode at a backdoor.

[Dharkbayne]

Hooray! A BUFF! NOT A NERF! WTG DEVS!

[Queensidecastle]

Kickass about the Buggies, those have always been my favorite vehicles. I am currently certed in assault buggy because you can drive it in Rexo and the Marauder bringing 3 Rexos to a tower = asskick (much better than that gay surgile mosquito hotdrop)

However the Decimator change sucks. It does nothing at all for AV and nerfs SA in the process. Now everyone will cert in AV just to carry a decimator and Still Ignore Empire AV weapons because they suck

[Vis Armata]

Of course, there haven't ruled out a new class of weapon for the SA category. It's unlikely, but you never know.

As far as the ammo capacity on the buggies, the Enforcer's rocket capacity is pretty large as it is. I doubt that the Enforcer will be getting an increase in rockets. I think they're already 50/box.

I do like what Smoke said about the buggies:

Buggies are the equivalent of Light Horsemen. You ride them to battle, they have great heavy weapons against infantry, some light offensive capability against vehicles...but if facing tanks, you're best off either getting out of Dodge or dismounting and using Decimators.
Buggies run the battlefield - until the tanks show up.

[Jagd]

Meh, deliverers will still be the light vehicle of choice for the early stages of continental invasion.

If you are against the decimator move, please post in that thread like I did and beg them to keep it in SA as well. Since they tweaked the vehicle cert rules to accomodate harasser/mosquito pilots I'm sure we can convince them to do the same for this change by leaving the deci in SA while allowing AV users to buy them as well.

STOP THE INSANITY!!!

[Warborn]

It makes sense for the Decimator to be in AV. Given that the Striker is so much ass I think it's a really welcome change, as Striker alone isn't even close to worth 3 cert points. I understand it'll screw with your layout and that of others, and that they should have made this change a lot earlier, but that's how these games go. They're never really done being balanced until a couple years after release.

[Jagd]

Yes, but when you go and mess up peoples' characters you have to be backwards compatible. It's the only fair thing you can do for paying customers. Ever hear of grandfathering? There are new laws and regulations (of all stripes) that don't have to apply to people who were doing something the old way before the new rules were passed. They do it because it is fair and even-handed.

[Majik]

So now people are upset because the devs took the 2nd most overpowered weapon in the game, and are grouping it with the most uncerted weapon in the game, which actually serves the same exact function as it, when they should have been gouped together to begin with. Let's see AV 3 points, SA 3 points ....hmmmm... which means if most of the SA users were only certed in it for the decimator anyway they loose exactly 0 points in the transition. Of course for the users of SA who have it for the other weapons, 3 cert points to still use 3 weapons(including AT) seems pretty fair to me.

[Queensidecastle]

It makes sense for the Decimator to be in AV. Given that the Striker is so much ass I think it's a really welcome change, as Striker alone isn't even close to worth 3 cert points. I understand it'll screw with your layout and that of others, and that they should have made this change a lot earlier, but that's how these games go. They're never really done being balanced until a couple years after release.
Yeah except the problem is that the Striker will still suck ass and nobody will use it. The only difference here is that SA was nerfed. AV isnt getting buffed because they are all still going to suck. However SA is getting nerfed Moving the Decimator just means that I have to cert different to get it and I lose the thumper...not cool

[EarlyDawn]

What is it, in everyone's opinion, that makes the Decimator "Special", or "Nonconventional"? I think it belongs in AV, but I'm interested to hear from the other side of the fence.

w00t to Buggy Buffs. I remember back in beta when I wanted to be a Empire-Buggy Combat Engineer. Ah how things have changed.

[Queensidecastle]

I never had a problem with Deci being in SA. It made it a great cert to have especially along with the Thumper. What makes the AV cert suck is not that it doesnt have the Decimator, its that AV sucks and your better off with a Decimator in all cases unless you want to kill MAXs from a distance.

So instead of making AV not suck by giving them variable damage to certain targets (more for tanks, less for buggies, and the current damage to MAXs) they Nerf SA instead? I just dont get it

[Liquidtide]

Not my precious grief machine (i.e. Thumper). It's my main weapon in so many Loadouts :( this saddens me. I use the Decimator too, I usually carry one in my 4th slot just incase a Max or Lightningt crosses my path, but I cannot afford to recert in AV as well as SA which I actaully use. This sucks.

[Madcow]

Love it.

[Incompetent]

The deci move sucks, it would be ok if they made it available to both but don't kill SA to save AV.

[SecondRaven]

This should be intresting.....

[EarlyDawn]

I still want to know what's special about the Decimator. It's like the LAW. I don't understand why it should be grouped with a grenade launcher, dumbfire rocket launcher and alien radiation gun. The only thing making it remotely unconventional is it's disposable nature and remote detonating.

[Liquidtide]

The deci move sucks, it would be ok if they made it available to both but don't kill SA to save AV.

What is our problem, AV sucks. But the Devs adding the decimator as a "bonus" to make it more attractive is like McDonalds putting a 50 dollar bill inside every filet o' fish. The sandwich sucks even with the 50 dollar bill, this might make it seem better but the sandwich still sucks. Same thing with AV, it sucks, so instead of it sucking with a silver lining, bring it up to par. By the name alone AV should be the strongest, but it all plays second fiddle to Decis.

Solution... make AV and decis at least equal, but at the same time nerf it to a 3 shot kill on Maxes and 4 on Lightnings/Mosis. This will require people to land all deci shots on a max and have mroe than 1 decimator to take out a small vehicle.

Done for now, someone else run with this idea.

~Tide

[Firefly]

The Decimator acts like an anti-armor weapon, like the LAW or the AT4.

People use the Decimator to take out MAXes. They also shoot them at vehicles.

People use the Striker to take out MAXes. They also shoot them at vehicles.

Decimator belongs in AV. I got Special Assault specifically for the Thumper. I used the Decimator maybe three times, and I stopped when I emptied fifteen of the fuckers in a stationary Vanguard and it didn't die.

Have a nice day.

[Firefly]

I think your intelligence needs a buff. Or at least your spelling and comprehension.

[EarlyDawn]

The Decimator acts like an anti-armor weapon, like the LAW or the AT4.

People use the Decimator to take out MAXes. They also shoot them at vehicles.

People use the Striker to take out MAXes. They also shoot them at vehicles.

Decimator belongs in AV. I got Special Assault specifically for the Thumper. I used the Decimator maybe three times, and I stopped when I emptied fifteen of the fuckers in a stationary Vanguard and it didn't die.

Have a nice day.Preach it. :love:

[Madcow]

The alternative was probably to bring the AV weapons up to Deci level damage and nerf the Deci to be significantly less effective (as it probably should have been all along). It's an undeniable fact that it made no sense for the best AV weapon in the game to not fall under the AV cert. People are so busy worrying about how it will impact their individual play that they're crying about an obvious fix. It didn't make sense, they're changing it to make sense, and everybody (including those crying about it) knows it.

[Liquidtide]

I think your intelligence needs a buff. Or at least your spelling and comprehension.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Rbstr]

WOOOT! finaly they are moving the deci, and i can find more marouders to kill, its the only thing i heven't ever killed with my reaver.

The only thing is the Empire AV weapons still suck, they should buff those at the same time.

[Vis Armata]

Once groups of 6-10 start using empire-specific AV in the same location, I doubt that the weapons will look bad.

[Firefly]

That's practically what you have to do NOW, use them in mass attacks, to get one catastrophic-kill on anything bigger than a Harasser.

[JakeLogan]

WOOHOO the mara will be useful (still want the 302 or even better a 460 :rock: and not the shitty 3.0 liter) Well I think the change is right and even if I didn't I have AV and SA certed :D
Oh and Firefly :rofl: that was great

[JakeLogan]

just cause ur all fuckin american dicks who think their sooo great :| i fuckin hope korea bomb u! and iraq will get their own bk! plus r prime minister is a dick for bummin up to u! but he speaks for himself not the country. who r a bunch of fucking ***** anyways! dunno how english ppl cud move and turn to such dickheads! let me just say them trade centers were blockin my garden view, im glad they were destroid and all them ppl died! made u fucking realise u rnt powerful u just think u r!
Dude hope you never meet me in real life because if I meet you I'm gonna beat the living shit out of you. I lost my brother when the towers went down. and that its a ban poll is going up. Everyone please direct your attention to the Ban Poll in the Lounge forums.

[Onizuka-GTO]

I think this is a good idea, and its not nerfing SA because you still get two great weapons! Also they should buff up AV weapons, and buff up the thresher! I :love: the Marauder, now its going to be even better.

:groovy:

P.S: what's wrong with the fillet'O'Fish?! I :love: that burger! It's the only thing I buy from McD's. If you want a real burger you go to BurgerKing! Got the URGE? :p

[Firefly]

u americans r a bunch of tossers bye x
That's okay. We kicked your ass in the American Revolution and we saved your ass in World War One and Two. We may be tossers, but you lot are all salad-tossers, sucking the farts from our collective asses.

Have a nice day.

[Queensidecastle]

:banplz: :ban:

[Rayder]

England and Iraq were allies? England and the U.S. were allies?


plus iraq u tked us all the time more than the iraqqys

[firecrackerNC]

Lol learn to spell dumbshit,I cant wait for the good ole banstick to pop out and get shoved up your sorry misguided ass.You have no fucking clue as to what your saying and know nothing about history except what your 4th grade teacher tought you last week.Buy a clue and kill yourself,I'm sure no one would ever miss a piece of trash like you anyway,in fact im sure everyone who knows you would be most happy.

[JakeLogan]

Lol learn to spell dumbshit,I cant wait for the good ole banstick to pop out and get shoved up your sorry misguided ass.You have no fucking clue as to what your saying and know nothing about history except what your 4th grade teacher tought you last week.Buy a clue and kill yourself,I'm sure no one would ever miss a piece of trash like you anyway,in fact im sure everyone who knows you would be most happy.
Direct your attention to the Lounge forums.

[Rayder]

Double post yes, but screw you

we won many wars! were more powerful than america until ww1 and ww2 when we lost the empire! but we hav more countrys on r side than u! as the rest of the world hate u but china! So if we were to start a war hmm lets see australia! iraq! korea! japan! africa! south america! canada! russia and im sure many more! so fuckin beat ur arse 100/1. cud now anyways haha wankas
There are two Koreas, Australia and Canada don't count. Wtf is South America? We just slapped Iraq. Russia knows it's good to ally with us. Africa has an army? France will throw it's bread... at you.

[firecrackerNC]

we won many wars! were more powerful than america until ww1 and ww2 when we lost the empire! but we hav more countrys on r side than u! as the rest of the world hate u but china! So if we were to start a war hmm lets see australia! iraq! korea! japan! africa! south america! canada! russia and im sure many more! so fuckin beat ur arse 100/1. cud now anyways haha wankas


just shows are fucking stupid you are.You sound like someone from Counter-Strike "OMG WE HAV MOR PLAYAS THANS U!!!WE BEET UR ARSE!@11" does mommy know your on her computer? Anyway Australia,Canada,Japan,and my guess Africa would do anything due to without us there economy fails and they fall into depression killing themselves.As for the rest,lol what a joke.I have respect for England because I've met people from there and they were quite normal and polite but you must be the village idiot to be this retarded.

[Everay]

i dont feel like giving a history lesson, but i shall, WW1, you were losing, the last major push that the germans were making consited of over 2 million soldiers, because the troops in the eastern front were freed up because of russia surrenduring, with america entering the war, it provided support, troops, and equipment, granted, at first the dough boys were sloppy, primarily because it was americas first war in a long while. after america entered the war, the germans soon began to fear us, calling the marines, Devil dogs. yes, america went in late, and that is fine by me, you dont go to war unless you have a reason to.

world war 2, no, america didnt have a reason to go to war, and infact, was in the proccess of signing a peace treaty, as i said, you dont send boys to die unless you have a reason. and no, d day wasnt the british idea, why you ask? because america had done several operations just like it already, IE in africa against the afrika core, and italy as well. and Dday was executed just like those landings, at dawn, on good conditions, at the shortest rout possible. a

veitnam, are you stupid? at least 200,000 vietnamies died, compaired to 50,000 americans, and the objective was to make the south vietnamies army capable to fight their own war, which, when we did, we left, yea, ill admit, alot of our guys died, but hey, thats war.

also, yes, england is the home to many great inventions, however, just because they were invented there does not mean you are able to take credit, judging by your "slang" your a retard, thus, dont take credit for others intellegence.

one more thing, by america going into iraq, and defeating them mostly by ourselves, we showed the world, that america is more powerful than the EU, or the UN, and it hit them hard, and now jock sharak and france are now seeing, that after making so many insults to america, and americas response saying "STUF noob you cant get contracts from the iraqi people" im pretty sure now that he is regreting what they did. heh, such a silly fad that started in france, being critical of america.

[MrCovertMan]

jesus christ i think i'll get back on topic for the sake of sanity
I am sooo damn happy they are making both these changes. Now I can shoot a lightning afar with a Lancer and then when they say "Hey did a bee just sting me?" and come my way they get a nice wasp sting in their neck

[Onizuka-GTO]

Well at leased Porkfryer showed us that stupidity is a multi-cultural trait, which means we all have something in common to talk about.
:lol:

(Though the USA still wins with the most Stupid people online by default Majority :p )

Oh and one more thing, It's spelt "arses" not "asses" the American English version. If you must sprout nationalistic rubbish, please use the Queen's English.
Makes you sound more British. :rolleyes:

P.S: To Everay, us brit's weren't saved by the Americans, It was the Russians.
For the Motherland! :lol:

[JakeLogan]

Pork just so you know as of 6:17pm Eastern Standard Time a total of 15 people wish to see you banned.

[BadAsh]

I know it's pure cheeze to quote yourself, but I thought this appropriate:

Ok guys listen up. PorkFryer/EviloHomer is just a forum Troll who makes moronic posts with the intent to upset other people posting on the topic thread. So the horrific grammar and comments from way in left field are deliberate for his own amusement purposes. Every time you reply in rage to this goober you are feeding the fire. Trust me, use the ignore option and moron-be-gone. FIN

So please just ignore this guys attempts to change the topic and or start a flame war. This is what he wants and you are giving it to him. Use the ignore feature and be done with it.

Hamma, this might be a good time for you to execute some judgment and just ban this guy. He is nothing but trouble and has effectively disrupting what would have otherwise been a reasonable game discussion thread. This is not the first time nor will it be the last if the pattern he established holds true to course.

[Rbstr]

lol yes u wernt in r ww1 and ww2 it took u along while to join! even then u were useless! and u only joined cus u were attacked so not to help us out! plus if england didnt exist nor wud u :) plus if england was taken over by germany u wudda lost too! we saved ur arse just as much as u saved r's! d-day was r idea so if that never happened u wudd lost! Also they had enough troops far deep into r lines and if no treaty was signed they say the germans cudda taken us! erm and veitnam was a greta war wasnt it! u fought it alone and lost! yep u ran away! plus iraq u tked us all the time more than the iraqqys, shows how smart u guys r lmao! plus england was home of many things that hav been invented! if it wasnt for us u wudnt be who u r! the tossers who thought they were too gd!

ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING! Without the US in WW2 you would have been nazi meat!

For the love of god, decent typing, coherent language, and death to all people that deserve the title fuctard plz ban him.


disclaimer: I do not hate england infact I would like to go there sometime, maybe even to study, but you pork forced me to diss them.

note i used teh edit button to correct my misstakes to the best of my abbilities and didn't do a double, triple, or quad post that you invented

[Onizuka-GTO]

Erm....actually we were holding up quite well, the USA was watching the out come of the Battle of Britain. If we had lost that the USA would not of came to our help, or at the very leased much muuch later. After you had dealt with the Japanese of course, which by then Hitler would be Half-way though the British Midlands.

<-Did "A" Level History- Ah sorry for being a Historian :doh:

Erm..Yes they need to buff up the Lancer, and the Thresher...

[Gigabein]

bye bye porkfry! Onizuka is what I like to consider the typically charming Brit. Pork is the outlier on the statistical graph of dumb-asses.

AV is going to be pretty fearsome now. Deci is good for close range, and hopefully enough people will start carrying the other AV to "take out" longer range targets. Deci still needs a slight dmg nerf vs maxes (3 direct hits instead of 2). I'm not familiar enough with the empire-specific AV to comment on possible buffs. Sorry SA-users but the free ride is over!

[Spee]

Erm....actually we were holding up quite well, the USA was watching the out come of the Battle of Britain. If we had lost that the USA would not of came to our help, or at the very leased much muuch later. After you had dealt with the Japanese of course, which by then Hitler would be Half-way though the British Midlands.

<-Did "A" Level History- Ah sorry for being a Historian :doh:

Erm..Yes they need to buff up the Lancer, and the Thresher...


*Applauds Oni-GTO's ability to keep cool under American Folk bashing his country.*

[TheRagingGerbil]

I leave for a couple of hours and my post get hijacked in all sorts of wrong ways...

:(

PS - :wave: Spee

[Spee]

I leave for a couple of hours and my post get hijacked in all sorts of wrong ways...

:(

PS - :wave: Spee


hi2ugerbil

[Firefly]

*Applauds Oni-GTO's ability to keep cool under American Folk bashing his country.*
HER.

[Liquidtide]

lol yes u wernt in r ww1 and ww2 it took u along while to join! even then u were useless! and u only joined cus u were attacked so not to help us out! plus if england didnt exist nor wud u :) plus if england was taken over by germany u wudda lost too! we saved ur arse just as much as u saved r's! d-day was r idea so if that never happened u wudd lost! Also they had enough troops far deep into r lines and if no treaty was signed they say the germans cudda taken us! erm and veitnam was a greta war wasnt it! u fought it alone and lost! yep u ran away! plus iraq u tked us all the time more than the iraqqys, shows how smart u guys r lmao! plus england was home of many things that hav been invented! if it wasnt for us u wudnt be who u r! the tossers who thought they were too gd!

Letter to Porkfryer,

You have been nothing but a moron since you started posting here. You post about 15 times a day, none of which is relevant, most of the time has nothing to do with Planetside. You can't form a complete thought or even type correctly, I hope you are perma banned and your life sucks.

Translation for Porkfryer "u hav been nuthing but a moroon since u starded posing here. u post uber times a day, no relevant stuf, most of the time has nuthing to du with planetside. u cant form a compleet thaut or even tipe correct. I hope u r permabanned and ur life sux."

[Warborn]

WW2 was the world's greatest tragedy, and both the US and UK were a collection of heroes for pulling through. These sorts of dick-swinging contests are a disgrace to all the Brits and Americans who died together on the battlefield as allies. So just drop it. And buff the Striker.

[Onizuka-GTO]

I think they are going to fix the striker soon, I mean its not right that the locking system cant pick targets when it's close to a structure.

[Visor]

I have to agree with pork on one thing that the americans did come late like 5 years late (if my history is right) but that is not the reason you should insult your allies. Half the countries pork named dont have an army, no offence to Canada but what do they have up there in the frozen north, they are peace keepers they wont fight they will help by aiding but not directly.

Pork probably can reply now because he got banned already and is maybe starting a new acount to continue his trolling.



Resume discussion: The AV is still bad even with the deci because everyone will use the Deci all the time but it makes AV more appealing to those addicted to the deci.

[Firefly]

The Striker is a giant piece of shit. That certification has zero use for any TR, unless they keep a store of Lancers and/or Phoenix in their wall locker.

Not only is the Striker utter garbage, but the certification is a waste because there are no other weapons. At least with Heavy Assault you can find some enemy weapons around in abundance.

[Queensidecastle]

Resume discussion: The AV is still bad even with the deci because everyone will use the Deci all the time but it makes AV more appealing to those addicted to the deci.
I wouldnt say its going to be more appealing. Rather I am going to be FORCED to drop my assault buggy to get AV so I can continue to use the Decimator. I am not going to do it because I want to or because I percieve that AV is good now. AV is still going to be shite and I will still be forced to cert it anyway.

Thats what is so irritating about all you folks missing the point. While moving the Deci to AV "makes sense" it doesnt change the fact that:

A)AV still sucks
B)SA is now super nerfed
C)All dedicated combat grunts instantly lose 3 cert points

If they just tweaked AV properly, none of that shit would be necessary

[Jagd]

Exactly! It is the laziest possible way to fix AV, it makes my stomache turn. Those bastards are dancing around like GW Bush at a press conference, lying about patch timing and pretending they actually have several programmers left on the project. If they want to fix AV, fix the AV weapons, don't take a half-assed approach. Bill Gates would be proud of SOE on this one.

[Onizuka-GTO]

If only they didn't nerf the Lancer..... :(

[Madcow]

I wouldnt say its going to be more appealing. Rather I am going to be FORCED to drop my assault buggy to get AV so I can continue to use the Decimator. I am not going to do it because I want to or because I percieve that AV is good now. AV is still going to be shite and I will still be forced to cert it anyway

AV won't be shite, or else you wouldn't be certing it. Deci is AV, and you obviously don't think it sucks, therefore you're looking at certing AV.

Thats what is so irritating about all you folks missing the point. While moving the Deci to AV "makes sense" it doesnt change the fact that:

A)AV still sucks
B)SA is now super nerfed
C)All dedicated combat grunts instantly lose 3 cert points

A) Has been addressed. Deci is going to be AV, you like Deci, therefore you like AV.
B) Just stop with the ridiculous exaggerations, please. SA is 3 certs, you'll still get 2 (3 with Radiator) useful weapons with that. How many certs is the Bolt Driver? Oh, that's right. It's 3. Odd that you haven't been campaigning about that being unfair, and the Bolt Driver is useful in far less situations than the Rocklet and Thumper are useful. How about you just be glad about how long you had it entirely too good instead of complaining that it's now far more even?
C) I'm pretty confident they can adjust. The playerbase for the most part received free certs when they started grouping vehicles and MAXs. This makes sense, and people are whining because they like the Deci and don't want to have to change the way they play. BDMJ seems to be the only person I've seen who pretty much just admits that it makes sense but he doesn't like it because it will negatively impact him personally.

[ChemicalHex]

I kind of saw the Lancer nerf coming though. When you're cutting through snipers with an AV weapon like a hot knife through butter, something is wrong :p

[Onizuka-GTO]

mmmm....true.....but its the snipers faults really, they just can't aim proper... :lol:

[Firefly]

What the fuck is with this SOE bashing? What makes you think it's a fix to AV? You can't fix AV unless you fix the shitty empire weapons. The Decimator has been, and always should have been, an AV weapon. That's where it belonged from the get-go, and even one of the developers agreed.

You use the Decimator for what? Taking out MAXes and the occasional vehicle.

You use the empire-specific AV weapon for what? Taking out MAXes and the occasional vehicle.

I fail to see what this crybaby bitching and SOE/PS developer bashing will accomplish. The Decimator's ONLY positive feature is the massive damage it does. It's a dumbfire weapon- I dare you to try hitting a fast-moving target in a hot combat environment. And I guarantee you, if you're shooting any anything with a worthy driver and worthy gunner, you're going to get your ass waxed. And if not, then the dude deserved to get Decimator'd

[Queensidecastle]

Indeed. The Lancer just sucks now at anything that isnt a light buggy/MAX/Lightning. If your wasting your time firing clip after clip after clip after clip on heavy vehicles then you would be a lot better off using Decimators and just try to lead them. Sometimes you can hit mossies and reavers, but in that case its mostly supression fire. At least the striker is 10x better at scaring away aircraft and even sometimes vehicles. The strongest role a Lancer has is killing Skyguards but you can do that with anything. Neither has the capabilities of the Phoenix. Constantly pounding AMSs, repairing vehicles, and Vehicle terminals in enemy bases makes the Phoenix the clear king of AV

[ChemicalHex]

Agreed. The lancer was never good at hitting anything in the air besides a galaxy. Whenever i saw a reaver it was like instant death. You might as well bend over and kiss your ass goodbye, and send the guy a tell say "your welcome, for the free bep.".

[Majik]

My favorite use for the lancer has always been the quick removal of spitfires. No weapon takes them out faster at distance. Combine that with a thumper full of EMP grenades and you can negate CE in a few seconds. I still see benefit to spending all 6 cert points to have both weapons.

[Jagd]

What the fuck is with this SOE bashing? What makes you think it's a fix to AV? You can't fix AV unless you fix the shitty empire weapons. The Decimator has been, and always should have been, an AV weapon. That's where it belonged from the get-go, and even one of the developers agreed.

You use the Decimator for what? Taking out MAXes and the occasional vehicle.

You use the empire-specific AV weapon for what? Taking out MAXes and the occasional vehicle.

I fail to see what this crybaby bitching and SOE/PS developer bashing will accomplish. The Decimator's ONLY positive feature is the massive damage it does. It's a dumbfire weapon- I dare you to try hitting a fast-moving target in a hot combat environment. And I guarantee you, if you're shooting any anything with a worthy driver and worthy gunner, you're going to get your ass waxed. And if not, then the dude deserved to get Decimator'd

If it was always intended to be that way, then why wasn't it always that way? I'll bet you're one of the smacktards who believes it is ok to revise history because it is easier than admitting you lied or were wrong in the first place. The balance pass was the time to make changes like this, and if we have to live with the spectre of having our favourite loadouts and character setups being pulled out from under us at random points in the future, why bother paying these people money to "improve" the game? Give me a break, improving the game means fixing the broken parts. Like the Lancer and the Striker. That is where the SOE bashing comes from, because it is clear (to all but the willfully ignorant) that this is a clever attempt at sidestepping the real problem and the potentially difficult steps needed to resolve it properly.

[Madcow]

Yeah, based on your poll results things are clear to all but the willfully ignorant.

History revision. That's hilarious. You're grasping at straws, man. It's a game, and you're a bright enough guy to know that the Deci belongs in AV regardless of how hard the pill is for you to swallow because it impacts you directly. I can't help but think back and laugh, there I was complaining about the Interlink Benefits being added and the way that it impacted cloakers dramatically, that they'd add something late in the game that could screw a whole class of characters, and there was you saying to adapt. Take your own advice. Adapt. It makes sense and you know it, you're not convincing anybody with your poor arguments.

[Onizuka-GTO]

My favorite use for the lancer has always been the quick removal of spitfires. No weapon takes them out faster at distance. Combine that with a thumper full of EMP grenades and you can negate CE in a few seconds. I still see benefit to spending all 6 cert points to have both weapons.

yes yes, I find it great for taking out spitfires and mines.
In fact after I take a tower i put on my Anti-deployable favourite combo to clear the surroundings which is basicially a few EMP grenades, a lancer and ammo. And if a vehicles comes round, at lease I can throw a few lancer bolts to say hello before I die. :lol:

[Jagd]

Nobody has explained to me how this fixes the Striker's lock on, or the Lancer's ineffectiveness. I'm sure I will adapt, which actually means that I will have to give up the thumper and the rocklet so I can keep my decimator. And oh joy, I can get a useless weapon that I can't actually carry around in my Agile armor without gimping myself vs infantry. Maybe it's not the end of the world, but for something that could so easily be tweaked to not mess with a single player's setup, it seems absurd that they wouldn't even consider it.

And yes I remember the fun we had with ILF, but you should also recall that I am a longtime SOE-basher basher, and now I am starting to see things differently.

[Firefly]

If it was always intended to be that way, then why wasn't it always that way? I'll bet you're one of the smacktards who believes it is ok to revise history because it is easier than admitting you lied or were wrong in the first place.
I can't answer why, you'll have to get SmokeJumper or Sporkfire to explain that one- I know Sporky visits this forum, perhaps he'll say hello and grace you with an answer.

As for history revision- I fail to see where this applies to anything I said or you said. The Decimator is a tube-launched dumbfire anti-armor weapon, used against heavily-armored MAXes and armored vehicles. Whereas Special Assault seems to be non-rifle type grenade and explosive weapons designed to destroy soft ground targets. IE- Thumper, a grenade/explosive used to take out deployables and infantry and Rocklet, an explosive weapon used to take out deployables and infantry. Now, I have rarely seen a Decimator used on a troop, and any fucking moron standing still to get hit with one deserves it, and I rarely see someone waste a Decimator on deployables. Instead, I see the Decimator used to take out vehicles and MAXes. Which is exactly what the Phoenix and Striker are used for.

Funny how logic works, eh chap?

[Dharkbayne]

Hmm, he's in the IRC channel right now, I'll ask him and answer you guys in just a few minutes

[Queensidecastle]

A) Has been addressed. Deci is going to be AV, you like Deci, therefore you like AV.
B) Just stop with the ridiculous exaggerations, please. SA is 3 certs, you'll still get 2 (3 with Radiator) useful weapons with that. How many certs is the Bolt Driver? Oh, that's right. It's 3. Odd that you haven't been campaigning about that being unfair, and the Bolt Driver is useful in far less situations than the Rocklet and Thumper are useful. How about you just be glad about how long you had it entirely too good instead of complaining that it's now far more even?
C) I'm pretty confident they can adjust. The playerbase for the most part received free certs when they started grouping vehicles and MAXs. This makes sense, and people are whining because they like the Deci and don't want to have to change the way they play. BDMJ seems to be the only person I've seen who pretty much just admits that it makes sense but he doesn't like it because it will negatively impact him personally.

A) Wrong. Currently with SA you get 3 usefull weapons. AV sucks and has no usefull weapons (not including Phoenix) so when Deci gets moved to AV I am not paying 3 certs for 3 usefull weapons, I am paying 3 certs for 1 usefull weapon. How can you not understand this?

B)Still get? Why do I have to "still get" anything? It shouldnt be getting nerfed in the first place. Sure this is a buff to AV users, but it is a massive nerf to SA users. WTF couldnt they just buff AV because it is still going to need it even after the Decimator moves instead of nerfing SA?

C)Your going to try and gloss over the fact that people are going to be out 3 cert points if they want to continue to use the same weapons and just dismiss it by saying to adapt? How asinine. Of course we are going to adapt, you either adapt or just quit playing, but it severely severs any good will you might have with the company. As was already pointed out, cert changes like this should have been made during the balance pass, not nearly a fucking year after release. If they wanted to make a case for some horribly overbalancing issue with the Decimator that warranted such a move after nearly a year I would like to hear it, otherwise I have heard nothing that justifies screwing SA troopers out of 3 certs if they want to continue enjoyment of the game.

"Makes sense" isnt fucking good enough to make this kind of change nearly a year after release. I want to hear the balance arguments as to why this is necessary

[Queensidecastle]

I want to follow that up by saying what the Devs should have done first is get AV where it needs to be before cannabalizing another cert. Not after. Before. Then the folks like myself who will have to spend 6 points instead of 3 to continue using the same weapons could see some value in the new arrangement. Right now there is no value in the new arrangement.

If any devs are reading this:
Boost AV (ammo boxes, tweak damage) and Boost SA (ammo boxes) BEFORE you move the Decimator (if we have no other choice) if you want to do it right

[Madcow]

First of all, I'm all for addressing the current AV weapons and making them useful. I've never argued that. Secondly, this poor me crap about your precious SA getting some long overdue attention is just pathetic. The game hasn't been out 'nearly a year' at all, MMO games take a lot of tweaking for the first 2 years. We all know this. Many players have gotten to used to having a cert that was just too damned good for the price. The main reason it was too good for the price is that it included an AV weapon, even though it wasn't an AV cert. To add insult to injury, it also happened to be the best AV weapon in the game. The Deci always should have been a common pool AV weapon to give people certed in AV the choice of empire specific (which hopefully get some love) or common pool Deci. Any player in this game not thinking only of themselves sees this for what it is. The right thing to do.

[Queensidecastle]

Your certainly entitled to your opinion and I agree with you on most things, but we arent going to agree at all on this one

[Visor]

"Makes sense" isnt fucking good enough to make this kind of change nearly a year after release. I want to hear the balance arguments as to why this is necessary

But the deci cahnge does make sense and they are working on empire AV as soon as the lock on bugs get fixed the TR will own with the striker the VS will own with the starfire while the NC will own with the pidgeon, i mean sparrow.

It balances out quite well on average but indevidually something will always be worse thats the way it was meant to be different.

[Visor]

Did anyone read the topic this has nothing to do with the vehicals.

[Madcow]

But the deci cahnge does make sense and they are working on empire AV as soon as the lock on bugs get fixed the TR will own with the striker the VS will own with the starfire while the NC will own with the pidgeon, i mean sparrow.

It balances out quite well on average but indevidually something will always be worse thats the way it was meant to be different.

The lock on bug impacts the Striker and Sparrow only, the Starfire lock is gold.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Oh and if you people look atthe other thread lots of changes have been said by smokejumper, but strangely he hasn't mention anything about fixing the Striker lock-on bug but he mention the obvious more ammo per box, decimator move, ammo clip size for weapons, Jackhammer nerf, and blahblahblahbikinipokadottedswimsuitpervertsblahbl ah...

go check it out!...or you already have...?
I think this thread going to be obselete... :rolleyes:

[Onizuka-GTO]

Anyway.... :rolleyes:

[Firefly]

also in iraq u shot more english that iraqqys and u were bein commanded by r sas :P
Our troops weren't commanded by your SAS, poor ignorant buffoon.

But let's assume for a second that you're right, that your puny five-year-old mind can grasp military doctrine and the chain of command and concepts such as OPCON.

So what does that say about your leadership?

[Onizuka-GTO]

erm.....I'm sorry if i'm wrong, but isn't the SAS suppose to be the 1337-est British Military Force that can go anyway get the job done, kill a few dangerous baddies, and disappear without any need of extra support and supplies?

[Firefly]

More or less. So that doubles the unlikelihood of PorkFryer's grandiose claim of national superiority through the use of British SAS troops leading American forces.

That only happens in GI Joe.

[TheRagingGerbil]

Sigh...might as well move this to the Political Debate forum...

[Firefly]

MARAUDER BUFF WOOHOO! (back on topic, happy?)

[Jagd]

No, you're still a fucking idiot.

[Majik]

Ok , this is the first and hopefully last time I will ever say this...

LOCK THE THREAD PLEASE and stop this useless argument

[Firefly]

No, you're still a fucking idiot.
This coming from the guy who cried about having to change from SA to AV like it was a major blow to his cert points.

[Jagd]

It is a blow, dumbass. I have to lose my thumper and rocklet to keep the decimator. The current AV weapons are still unusable with Agile armor, assuming you want to carry some kind of defense against infantry, you know, like everybody needs to. Since I don't have room to keep both AV and SA, then I obviously don't have room to pick up a ReXo cert either. In case you're curious as to why it annoys me so much, this is my setup...

Advanced Hacking
Special Assault
Infiltration Suit
Air Support & Cavalry
Ground Support & Transport

Now it will be Anti-Vehicular instead of Special Assault. I'll still get my decimator, but I'll be carrying a punisher instead of a thumper with jammers, and will probably end up dying a hell of lot more on runs to interlinked facilities. It's annoying enough having to make an extra trip in agile what with the spitfires/crouch walking, and now one trip may not even be enough to make it through.

[Hezzy]

That's okay. We kicked your ass in the American Revolution and we saved your ass in World War One and Two. We may be tossers, but you lot are all salad-tossers, sucking the farts from our collective asses.

Have a nice day.

Calm down mate... Theres no need to bash all brits...

That guy is a disgrace to the english commonwealth.

EDIT: Infact, give me it's IP and me and Frag will sort him out Badarse-Brit stylee

[Queensidecastle]

You have to be brain dead to not understand the SA nerf so let me explain it once again.

1)AV sucks (except Phoenix, so if your NC this doesnt really affect you). The details about ammo boxes and the fact that AV will also be getting looked at for balance implications came after we were told that the Decimator will be moving. So if we can expect patches in the order we were told them, then the Decimator will move to AV before AV gets buffed. This is significant because currently the SA cert has 2 very ausome weapons in it and AV has none. Moving the Decimator at the current time will put 1 good weapon into the AV class forcing people to spend 3 points that they would not spend in any other case.

2)SA is getting nerfed because it is loseing 50% of the reason you spend 3 points to Cert it. AT weapons have a whole host of issues that make them impractical so counting the Radiator at this time is pointless. The Decimator and Thumper are ausome. Troopers like myself will now have to spend 6 points to do what we have been doing with 3. For almost everyone that means you have to drop something and that just sucks ass.

Having said that, if AV rocked then it wouldnt be so bad because then you would be getting 2 good weapons for your 3 points just like you always got and that would leave just the issue with having to spend 3 points for a Thumper. However with the upcoming ammo box changes and the Core Combat fixes making AT weapons desirable and obtainable, the SA cert will be worthy of 3 points

The bottom line here is in what order these patches arrive. If they move the Deci and then we have to wait weeks for these other changes then it is a big fat nerf that sucks. That is how this information was given to us originally. A statement that the Deci was going to move and no information about ammo boxs, AV changes, and other necessary items. If they patch in these ammo boxs and core combat fixes then the SA nerf wont suck, it will just be annoying but acceptable. So myself and others were completely justified to be angry about the original announced change because if that was going to be the only change, then it would have been a massive stupidass nerf

[Jagd]

Not to mention the fact that SmokeJumper pretended that it had already been announced and then refused to answer when asked where his alleged announcement was. Maybe he was burnt out and forgot he wasn't supposed to be talking about that stuff yet, but he sure let the cat out of the bag, and it almost seems like they had to spill all the other info in a hurry to try and cover up his mistake. Nobody has yet provided any proof that the decimator move was already announced, and this big ammo pass announcement for the "patch after next" smacks of damage control.

Whatever, taken in context I can live with the decimator change, but mostly because of how huge a buff my infiltration suit is receiving by way of the grenade storage tweaks. Seriously, that change alone would make almost anything bearable.

[Gigabein]

Queensidecastle: So you're saying you're mad because you're losing your free AV ride?

[Firefly]

Calm down mate... Theres no need to bash all brits...
My reply was a direct response to America-bashing. It was limited specifically to him.

I'm sure you understand, since all the Americans here were pissed off at comments directed at us. Just like all the Brits would be pissed off if they thought my "bash" were directed at any and all Brits, instead of specifically designed to taunt PorkFryer.

As I have served side-by-side with Royal Marines, Royal Army, and SAS soldiers and thoroughly enjoyed my tours of service, I can readily say that I absolutely loved serving with British troops. How's that for taking the wind out of Brit-bashing sails?

[Madcow]

Whatever, taken in context I can live with the decimator change, but mostly because of how huge a buff my infiltration suit is receiving by way of the grenade storage tweaks. Seriously, that change alone would make almost anything bearable.

I'm excited about that too, but I refuse to look at it as an infil buff (even though Smoke is obviously hoping it looks that way). The grenade change will help most ground troops in the game, this will free up a good amount of storage space for people who use loadouts with grenades. It's no more an infiltrator buff than the Boomer placement change they made a bit ago. It helps infiltrators, it's not for infiltrators.

[Firefly]

It helps infiltrators, it's not for infiltrators.
Respectfully disagree on this point.

Anything that helps infiltrators, who are widely-regarded as being the best concept with the poorest support and implementation, is considered by all user-friendly infiltrators and those who love them... to be a buff for them. :D

[Queensidecastle]

Queensidecastle: So you're saying you're mad because you're losing your free AV ride?
Thats actually a pretty humorous twisted bit of perspective. Free AV ride? Funny, I thought that I had been spending 3 points on a multi-use cert that has been the same cert since the release of the game for almost a year. I can see how you would logically imagine that scenario. Wait, no I cant because that would be retarded

[Onizuka-GTO]

That only happens in GI Joe.

But erm...GI Joe has no British Soldiers in it....its about an American GI Joe going about Rambo style.... isn't it?
:p

[Jagd]

Yes the buff will affect everyone, however in the scheme of what you can carry in Agile and Reinforced it's a tiny little buff, vs the infiltration suit which can now store enough jammers to get through an area lightly defended with deployables, and even toss a few plasmas in there increasing our damage potential several times over.

[Firefly]

Whether they pulled it out of their ass or not. Look at it this way. And this isn't a logic thing, a twisty thing, or anything else, just an attempt to compromise on viewpoints and find a happy little tree in the middle ground.

Heavy Assault: four certs, one weapon (presume you don't loot).
SA Currently: three certs, three weapons (presume no CC)
AV Currently: three certs, one weapon (again, presume no loot)

SA future: three certs, two weapons (no CC, presume there's no cross-cert use of Deci)
AV future: three certs, two weapons (presume no cross-cert usage of Decimator)

Now, I put HA in there because it's four friggin cert points for one weapon. I put current and future SA/AV simply to show that at least it brings a little balance. I thought it was ludicrous to pay three and four certs for one weapon, and then have a cert with three weapons at three certs. At least now (and this is the middle ground) you get two weapons for three certs, as opposed to one for three.

EDIT:
But erm...GI Joe has no British Soldiers in it....its about an American GI Joe going about Rambo style.... isn't it?
No. There are Brits in GI Joe. And the UK version of GI Joe is "Action Force".

[Queensidecastle]

As far as the infiltration topic, I agree. It is not for infiltrators but it will help them. I almost never see infiltrators using grenades ever to attack with and on the rare occasion I do, its plasma and they dont have a chance at actually killing you with them. The only time Grenades are good for Infils is if they are pitching them off walls or down stairs and that is no different that anyone else does with thumpers and tends to be grief heavy. Grenades have always limited the inventory for infiltrators to the point of not being usefull since killing people wilth pistols and boomers is 10x more consistant. With this change grenades can actually be used as weapons and enough jammers can be carried that you can drop some CE w/out sacrificing your inventory options

[Rbstr]

Whether they pulled it out of their ass or not. Look at it this way. And this isn't a logic thing, a twisty thing, or anything else, just an attempt to compromise on viewpoints and find a happy little tree in the middle ground.

Heavy Assault: four certs, one weapon (presume you don't loot).
SA Currently: three certs, three weapons (presume no CC)
AV Currently: three certs, one weapon (again, presume no loot)

SA future: three certs, two weapons (no CC, presume there's no cross-cert use of Deci)
AV future: three certs, two weapons (presume no cross-cert usage of Decimator)

Now, I put HA in there because it's four friggin cert points for one weapon. I put current and future SA/AV simply to show that at least it brings a little balance. I thought it was ludicrous to pay three and four certs for one weapon, and then have a cert with three weapons at three certs. At least now (and this is the middle ground) you get two weapons for three certs, as opposed to one for three.

EDIT:

No. There are Brits in GI Joe. And the UK version of GI Joe is "Action Force".

I totaly agree with your assement, SA doe not stand for All Purpous(sp) Assualt it stands for Special Assualt, special as in special case senerios.

3 certs for 1 ineffective weapon is just a bit overpriced. But 3 certs for one overpowered weapons and one ineffective weapons about to be buffed is ok just about right.

IMHO the RR and thumper are good enough to merit a 3 cp cert all on thier own.

Most people get SA just for the Deci anyway, it not like your losing anything

[Madcow]

I'm still dumbfounded that 3 certs is acceptable for the Bolt Driver alone and a 'ripoff' for the Thumper and Rocklet.

[Firefly]

I almost never see infiltrators using grenades ever to attack with and on the rare occasion I do, its plasma and they dont have a chance at actually killing you with them. The only time Grenades are good for Infils is if they are pitching them off walls or down stairs and that is no different that anyone else does with thumpers and tends to be grief heavy.
They do limit the inventory, but I use them frequently in various capacity.

I've killed a few goobers with Plasma. I tossed a Jammer at someone because they were looking for me with darklight, and then I AMP'd his ass. I also use the Jammer to set off my ACE boomers that I place when Flail hunting. Another trick I use is carrying a frag grenade to divert attention from myself (in addition to possibly damaging a target), and then using the diversion to put bullets or a knife in someone.

They have their uses, but you are correct. They are by and large useless except under exceptional use.

EDIT:
I'm still dumbfounded that 3 certs is acceptable for the Bolt Driver alone and a 'ripoff' for the Thumper and Rocklet.
The Bolt Driver is almost a one-shot kill weapon, two shots at optimal. The three-cert cost for that one weapon is acceptable to me, and thus not an issue.

[Queensidecastle]

Thats because it is a pure false analogy and false analogies dont make any sense

The sniper at 3 certs has been that way since release for almost a year. The SA cert has been in tact at 3 weapons since release for almost a year. So if you have a problem with that inequity, then you have had a problem with it since release. If you havent had a problem with that then you considered each package worth its 3 points. Removing Deci from SA reduced the value of the SA package. Its really not rocket science.

[Madcow]

Killing with plasma 'nades as an infiltrator used to be one of my joys, but I got fed up with the inventory restriction so I'm hopeful I can get that going again. Stand on top of a tall rock in a high traffic area and rain hell down on a number of people, watch them drop as they run around looking for the guy with the Thumper.

[Warborn]

The Rocklet and Thumper will also be much more practical after the ammo changes next patch.

[Madcow]

The Bolt Driver is almost a one-shot kill weapon, two shots at optimal. The three-cert cost for that one weapon is acceptable to me, and thus not an issue.

And I agree with that, I don't think it's unacceptable. The Bolt Driver is also useful in less situations than the Rocklet and Thumper. I don't believe 3 certs for those 2 weapons is out of line either.

Thats because it is a pure false analogy and false analogies dont make any sense

The sniper at 3 certs has been that way since release for almost a year. The SA cert has been in tact at 3 weapons since release for almost a year. So if you have a problem with that inequity, then you have had a problem with it since release. If you havent had a problem with that then you considered each package worth its 3 points. Removing Deci from SA reduced the value of the SA package. Its really not rocket science.

SA has always been underpriced for what it was. I've said it before and I've seen others say it before. You had a bargain bin cert and got used to it, that doesn't mean that the change is wrong. Did they reduce the value of the SA package? That's certainly one way of saying it, although I would say they made the package more in line with the cost. The K-Mart cert is gone, hallelujah. The analogy is still intact and rocket science is kept safely away from this board. I'm sure NASA is breathing a sigh of relief.

[Firefly]

Removing Deci from SA reduced the value of the SA package. Its really not rocket science.
Sure it's not, except when you fail to factor in this:

The Rocklet and Thumper will also be much more practical after the ammo changes next patch.
The ammo increases bring it somewhat back up. AND it's not going to be a gap in coverage, since it reportedly happens in one patch.

It's not a false analogy to say, "three certs for three (or four) weapons is overpriced compared to four certs for one weapon or three certs for one weapon or three certs for one empire-specific piece of shit." It's just a failure to face facts and use a little math.

[Queensidecastle]

I already had a complete discussion on the fact that Sony decided to tell us the Deci was moving and didnt announce any of those other changes. Now that we know what else is coming, it is not nearly as bad. This is still contingient in what order we recieve the patches. Why do I have to type this over again?

[Firefly]

Because you keep repeating the same argument. And you ignore the fact that according to the Ammo Change notes, it says these changes are supposed to happen "patch-after-next". Ammo changes and weapons changes.

[Queensidecastle]

Killing with plasma 'nades as an infiltrator used to be one of my joys, but I got fed up with the inventory restriction so I'm hopeful I can get that going again. Stand on top of a tall rock in a high traffic area and rain hell down on a number of people, watch them drop as they run around looking for the guy with the Thumper.
Agreed. However you were spent after like 1 minute and were unable to take anyone one-on-one. Multiple trips to terms is not how I like to play

SA has always been underpriced for what it was. I've said it before and I've seen others say it before. You had a bargain bin cert and got used to it, that doesn't mean that the change is wrong. Did they reduce the value of the SA package? That's certainly one way of saying it, although I would say they made the package more in line with the cost. The K-Mart cert is gone, hallelujah. The analogy is still intact and rocket science is kept safely away from this board. I'm sure NASA is breathing a sigh of relief.

Thats certainly your opinion, but comparing the current sniper cert's value to the current SA cert's value is a false analogy. They do completely different things and that is combined with the fact that is has been this way since release. I have never once in my time playing Planetside seen anyone try to argue that "the SA cert should be nerfed because it has 3 weapons for 3 points and the sniper cert only has 1 weapon for 3 points" It would be a stupid argument and it is no different when used to downplay the nerfing of SA.

However as I said before, this is all contingent on what order we recieve these new patches. The Devs blundered in the way they released this information to us. Announcing a huge nerf before announce a massive set of buffs? Of course people are going to be confused and pissed

[Queensidecastle]

Because you keep repeating the same argument. And you ignore the fact that according to the Ammo Change notes, it says these changes are supposed to happen "patch-after-next". Ammo changes and weapons changes
You have failed reading comprehension 101. When this whole argument started, we did not know about all the buffs coming down the line. Now we do, so the situation is changing somewhat

[Firefly]

I didn't fail Reading Comprehension 101. I'm an English major, but thanks for the well wishes.

I realize that we didn't know everything. However, even after the changes were announced, you're still saying the same thing. You break the cycle with a bit of "Yes this was before I knew the change was coming" or "what order are these patches coming in", but you actually appear to be the one who failed reading comprehension by trotting out the same argument time and again, with minor variations or interjections to the contrary.

[Jagd]

Firefly, I want a Big Mac combo supersized. It's not going to fetch itself.

[Firefly]

Firefly, I want a Big Mac combo supersized. It's not going to fetch itself.
You're right, they mostly cripple or kill the animal that goes in there, if at all.

So get your lazy ass up and get one your damn self.

[Jagd]

Earn your minimum wage you bitter child! Earn it!

[Firefly]

Factoring in that I work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, I make about $1.87 an hour for base pay. That's why in one week I will be a civilian with a job making at least three times my current annual pay.

[Jagd]

Where's my fucking Big Mac, punk? I want to talk to your manager.

[Queensidecastle]

He pissed on it. You prolly dont want to eat it now

[Jagd]

That's ok, whoever thought Thousand Island dressing was good on a hamburger should have been shot, not made into a billionaire.

[Jagd]

You know, there should be a moral to end this thread... What did we all learn in class today, kids?

[Queensidecastle]

Ban Porkfrier?

[Jagd]

No, we figured that out many threads ago... I'm thinking something that ties the theme of managing customers expectations to the age old adage "don't argue with people who have a vested interest in something, unless you're feel like arguing until the conversation turns into a chat about supersized combos."

I think it was Milton Berle who said that initially.

http://www.newprophecy.net/Milton_Berle_dies.jpg
In Memorium

[Queensidecastle]

I know I am old and crabby but not that crabby

[Jagd]

LOL! I wasn't referring to you, buddy.