The Basics of Religion.

[eMaGyN]

I think i'm really taking a chance here.
I want this thread to be civil... and the basis is religion, which can be very controversial and emotional, but i'm asking you guys to clearly think out your actions and words and the please post. Please do not just post "There is a God." or "There is no God." Include your reasonings, your doubts, your thoughts...
I think that this topic is extremely interesting and something that will teach us a great deal of things.


My conscious is telling me not to post this thread, but my heart is encouraging it. Please dont prove me wrong. Respect each other's differences.
Hopefully we will learn new things and different aspects.

:love:
eMa

[Drahkas]

Well I guess i'll be the first to say that I'm an athiest. My mother is catholic and I might have been also if I hadn't been taught history in school. Fact is, I belive that religion was made up to explain everything that we, with our limited technology, could could not. Science has most of the bases covered at this point...
The other reason would be... well just think about all of the harm it's done, from the early christians in rome to terrorism today.
I am, however, thinking a lot about buddhism. I haven't really had the time to study it more, but I think some of the basic consepts involved are very logical...

err i guess i'm done :)

[Rayzer]

eMa I'm not really sure what you are looking for. Are we here to talk about the existance of somthing greater? A God in some religions?

Personally, I think the debate is rather meaningless. Not that I think religion or more importantly spirituality is meaningless. It is just that faith in something greater is just that faith. I could site you a thousand reasons why there is no God or no greater force. However, that has no bearing on your faith or belief. No one can prove to anyone else that God does or does not exist. It is something we come to believe or not believe on our own. In a similar fashion you could spend thousands of lines detailing proof of some greater force and I could simply dismiss it and come up with my own explinations.

So if you are interested in discussing Religion I am happy to partake. Although, I must say that I generally have issues with most Religions. Spirituality is another discussion entirly. So if you want to clarify what you want to talk about I would be happy to join in.

But, I'm not going to debate the existance of a greater force. Humans are just not built to change their minds on that issue through debate. Your own personal answer to that question comes from within. And in seeking an answer to what you believe it is often helpful to talk to others. But don't ask them if God exists or not.

:love:

[Rayzer]

"The other reason would be... well just think about all of the harm it's done, from the early christians in rome to terrorism today."

That is true and it is not. At the core of it all human's simply used organized Religion as a vehical to promote their own ends. They use it to manipulate others. At the same time those same religions have been used to do a lot of good in the world. Yes, many have beliefs and practices that I don't agree with. But, these doctorines chance and evolve over time, like everything.

In many ways I find lots of faults with organized religon. Partly because of some of the practices and many times because they are used as an excuse for actions not in line with the basic philosophy of those religions.

What am I trying to say here? Hmmmm. If you take any relgion and analyze its practices and teachings. Then you use a bit of compassion and common sense ( You know, ignore things like slavery and smiting down someone who looks at your wife.) they all have a great deal of value. Unfortunatly, many times people choose not to use them in that manner, and instead they grab hold of those parts that bennifit themselves and their goals and they use the religion to manipulate people.

Hope that all makes sense :)

[Squeeky]

I dont believe in organized religion. I believe in everyone having there own beliefs.

I think religion is a fancy way of sating what do you believe in?

I am not atheist (i hate labels) but like i said i have my own beliefs. I believe god is non-existant. I do belive in destiny, i believe you have a purpose in life, and you were put on earth for a reason. I believe in fate, and i believe such things as sinning. But to a certain extent. Sinning to me is doing something in which you know is wrong, whenever i feel i have sinned, i make an effort to take an action (wether it be pysichal, verbal etc... whatever) to do something good to right my wrong. I've re-typed this reply 3 times now and i think that my belief on "religion" would take pages upon pages to explain. Something i dont wanna do :D

[ChrisMOG]

Nobody knows/has any proof (I mean REAL proof) so I think we should just all be silent.

[Airlift]

We could talk about dozens of centuries of atrocities committed in the name of religion. We could talk about how governing bodies have been using religion as a giant boot to maintain a steeply casted society since there has been such a thing as society. Or we could get into how blind faith brings out the violent nature in humans in fear of our own mortality.

I'd rather talk about Planetside.

[Rayzer]

No Chris, nobody does. But that is one of the wonders of faith that amazes me in a lot of people. How they can hold on to the belief dispite people constantly trying to prove that there is no such thing. If that faith can help that person bring a little less suffering to the world, then it is a wonderful thing.

I don't think not talking about these things is the right way to go. I really really oppose preaching at people though. However, humans are quite capable of having a meaniful discussion about the issues without forcing their views on anyone else. A sharing of ideas rather than stating, "My way is right and yours is wrong."

:)

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Airlift
I'd rather talk about Planetside.

Pet peev of my right here. If you don't want to get involved, don't. Nobody is forcing you, and you shouldn't try to shoot down a discussion because you don't personally agree with it.

[Rayzer]

"We could talk about dozens of centuries of atrocities committed in the name of religion. We could talk about how governing bodies have been using religion as a giant boot to maintain a steeply casted society since there has been such a thing as society. Or we could get into how blind faith brings out the violent nature in humans in fear of our own mortality.

I'd rather talk about Planetside."

Or we could talk about a 25 year old woman, having spent 2 years of her life battling cancer. Finally at peace in her last days because of her faith and belief that she is going to a better place. Her struggle having inspired her sister to form a foundation to help childern through there battle with cancer.

It is easy to look at the big picture and condem things that have happened. But don't ever forget people like Martin Luther King or Mahatma Gandhi who used their beliefs to make the world a better place.

[Airlift]

Don't go getting all short with me, Warborn. Not only was I not shooting down the discussion, but I threw in three full subtopics (which I'll add is THREE more than your post).

So bring a better flame or have a seat in the back.

[ChrisMOG]

Well, when people are taught by their parents at an early age to believe something, like religion or even racism/hate, it is very hard for people to forget them. I guess its like social programming; once they are taught how to act regarding certain things, they just follow their programming...with very few people deviating. People blow themselves up over this stuff.

:/

[DiosT]

Lets see.. fun subject...


I'm Agnostic, defined by Webster as "one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god" which is what i believe some people who call themselves "atheists" really mean...


My parents were both catholic, and tries to raise me catholic, but when i was entering my pre-teen/early teens, I started asking myself "What is this all about?"... then my father was diagnoused with brain cancer, and died 2 years later, and That just completely shattered my 'faith' in any one, or any specific, god...

since then i've basicly stood by that, I dont believe in organize religion either, IMO Organized religion was founded of control, long ago the roman catholic church had complete control over someone's life... and as it was said on TribesTalk Recently, more people have probably been killed by catholics "in the name of god" then have been saved by the 7th? commandment of the Catholics saying "though shall not kill"...

I do not force my beliefs on anyone, nor do i seek out others who believe what i do, It's my personally belief, voiced here because you asked, Flames against me = pointless, and i wont flame others beliefs... because beliefs... are just that... what you believe, and no one has a right to control what you believe... *cough catholic church* =)


Last note, most religions claim their god is 'merciful', well I live a good, acceptable, and generous life, and dont violate any 'universal religious' rules (dont kill, steal, etc.), so if 'god' is truely merciful, he'll accept me whatever religion I choose to, or choose not to, believe in...

[Drahkas]

I guess i'm lucky to have a parent that allowed me to choose when I was old enough... I am just starting to care about such things.
If i ever have kids I'd treat them the same. It seems like brainwashing to me, forcing children into your own belifes.

[Rayzer]

At the same time Chris there comes a point in a persons life when they must question what they were taught. Really figure out for themselves if they believe everything. I was rasied Catholic, went to church every Sunday. I would hardly consider myself Catholic now. Christian maybe. I'm with Squeeky, I have my own religion :)

People blow themselves up because they have been manipulated and controlled by other people who used a religion as a tool. But at the heart of the matter are people who did this to them. It is not neccessarily the religion's fault.

[eMaGyN]

I believe in the spirit world. I believe that you are born to parents that you chose, and that your life is to serve a purpose.
I think there is a spiritual form that is a leader... a "God". I'm not sure of his form... but i believe that God is not one gender, or that there is a father god and mother god. I think the basis of many things is balanced... and that the spiritual leader (or God) should become the aptitude of that balance.

People are born with similarities that bind them together. The basic charateristics are those that forge this bond between each individual. The want to love, the need to survive, every emotion... all subconsciously emitting from each of our souls. I believe it is our souls that act as a common line through out the entire population of this world, and the next. I think a person's soul grows with each encounter. Each person that I meet, that i become known to, adds a part to who I am. The biggest thing about growing... and living, is meeting individuals that teach you of things. Wether they be good or bad, situations will arise through relationships and lessons are to be learned. I believe that things happen for a reason, and that situations, no matter how horrendous or terrible, were set on your path so that YOU encounter them. I do think its a test, not necessairly for God... but for yourself.

I believe in reincarnation. I seriously don't believe that my entire life will end at my last breath on this one. Once you reach the after life, you are given a choice, either to stay in the afterlife, or to return to the world and live again. Ever met someone and you just click? That person who you can somehow just instantly get along with and act like you've known them for a longer time than what you actually have? Its someone you have encountered in a past life... or someone who you have met too soon...and their role will play a larger part in a life to come. I do believe that what you put out comes back to you three times fold. Another aspect in which i believe... those things that you have talent in...are things that you lack talent in the after life. You are sent to the earth to improve on things that you lack in the after life. Heaven is not perfect... but it is harmonious.

I don't believe in Hell. In no way, shape, or form do i believe that God would send his own people into torture. People need chances to redeem themselves. What you do in this life will predetermine what happens in the next. There is a repercussion for every action, and it will reflect back on you in your next life.

I believe the bible is misleading. I refuse to make the bible the rock in which i rely on. People have a problem with that...they tell me it is the word of God... but it isn't... It is the translation by Man on the word of God...I think many things are fables. I believe that Jesus had a family, he was a father with children. I do believe that he performed miracles. I just think there was an essence in which people lost touch of from then...to now. I'm not entirely sure if i believe in the tale of Adam and Eve... I am completely in support of the idea of evolution. I think God planned for evolution to occur and i think the Big Bang theory played some role in it...but evolution is the cause in which we live as who we are today.

Those people who live their lives, believing that they are doing the best in their ability to stay in good hopes for a better after life... face it, if you were born in a different country or culture you're religion would basically be something outside of what you have now, and you may be the ones practicing the beliefs of a foreign religion. Beliefs are closely related to geography, and God would never punish someone who believe for their entire lifetime that they were doing something that was pleasing to him.

Um, there is probably more... but i don't want to bore you. Thanks to those who read a portion of my reply...and love to those who took the time to read my beliefs...but mostly, learned more of me.

So... um, i suppose in closing... i'll leave you with this.

God has created all people and through all people he has a purpose for them...
God has created Satan, Buddha, Mohammad, Jesus, Confuscious... and so, true religion lies somewhere between each of their teachings.
Because who are we to say they were wrong... when it may have been their purpose.

:love:
eMa

[Rayzer]

DiosT,

I like your post. :love: I believe organized religions can serve a purpose. In trying to understand what we believe in, it is not always possible to simply think to yourself and come up with an answer. Finding out about what other religion's believe can be a big help. It is very interesting to see what religions belive and show, at their core, and then see how people choose to use them.

In many ways I'm sad that I was raised Catholic. Because when you look at the heart of Christianity there are many many wonderful teaching. But I too am jaded by many of the things that I have experienced and I often find it hard to see them in a posative light.

But, you can take pieces of religions and use them to help you with spirituality. Rather than simply following a religion for the sake of doing it.

[Airlift]

There is nothing wrong with having faith as long as you beware those who would use your faith as a tool. For the sake of argument let's say there is a God and Devil and for the sake of further argument let's say that there is one "Right" religion and a million-zillion wrong ones.

My question is this: who was responsible for the Crusades? God, the Devil, or the Pope?

[Drahkas]

but... this isn't an argument... an argument is exactly what this thread is trying NOT to be

[Airlift]

Ok, for the sake of Discussion then. I didn't mean to invalidate my question by inciting an argument :D

[Rayzer]

Can't answer your question Airlift because I believe none of the premises behind it. How if you do, then you have to answer that question for yourself.

eMa. I'm still trying to figure out how to respond to your post :love:.

It might take me a few days. ;)

[Airlift]

But I already know my answer, and I also don't believe the premises behind the question. That's why I said for the sake of argument and then corrected it down to the sake of non-argument.

The question doesn't really have anything to do with there being only one true god or if you get down to it even about God at all, but the nature of man. It boils down to: In your heart, do you think God wants us to kill each other, is it the Devil making us do it, or is it just our own politics?

I don't want to answer the question myself because I want to know what others think. I'll come back with my honest opinion on religion if you're really curious, but don't expect it to be some great revelation. I'm as clueless as the rest of humanity when it comes to the incomprehensible.

[eMaGyN]

Airlift i understand you.
For the longest time i resented God... in fact, to this day... i still don't enjoy using the reference "God" when what i actually mean is my Spiritual Guidance...
I held this resentment because i believed that he sent those people to partake in the crusades...and to kill in his name...but i've come to realize that the minds of the human race are twisted... and that for the majority...as to what i believe, they don't truly understand.
I believe it wasn't god's will... and although some people argue that he knew that this would occur... i don't think that is the case... what happens on earth is through the free will of the people who act out... what they committed, i believe they faced repercussions, acted out by God, in their next life....
Men's interpetation was wrong... and i think... God cried for those people...

:love:
eMa

[Nohimn]

HERE I AM!! THE RADICAL ATHEIST THAT WILL TURN THIS POST INTO A FLAME POST!! jk... it's just like i said in the other post, expressing my opinion as an atheist often offends... so here I go (everyone, PLEASE try to tolerate)....

I think that there is no logic behind god. You can't say that there is no logic in the non-existence of god, because you are trying to call god into existence (which you can't do). when you say that there is no logic in the non-existence of god, you are declaring he exists, where there is no logic behind, which in turn, makes the non-existence logical. Get that? if not, post, I'll try to answer your questions (I'm REALLY bad at explaining crap)

[Hamma]

I think its a waste of time, I just live my life day to day :p

but on a sidenote, religion, politics. These threads never end up well.

[�io]

Originally posted by {{eMaGyN}}
I believe in the spirit world. I believe that you are born to parents that you chose, and that your life is to serve a purpose.
I think there is a spiritual form that is a leader... a "God". I'm not sure of his form... but i believe that God is not one gender, or that there is a father god and mother god. I think the basis of many things is balanced... and that the spiritual leader (or God) should become the aptitude of that balance.

(....)

Um, there is probably more... but i don't want to bore you. Thanks to those who read a portion of my reply...and love to those who took the time to read my beliefs...but mostly, learned more of me.

So... um, i suppose in closing... i'll leave you with this.

God has created all people and through all people he has a purpose for them...
God has created Satan, Buddha, Mohammad, Jesus, Confuscious... and so, true religion lies somewhere between each of their teachings.
Because who are we to say they were wrong... when it may have been their purpose.

:love:
eMa

Holy shiznit!!!

I read the whole thing and it's almost exactly my way of thinking.

I believe when we die we get reincarnated, if you did good you evolve, become a better person, if not you digress and have to start anew. I also believe that "our souls act as a common line through out the entire population of this world, and the next. I think a person's soul grows with each encounter" and that our souls recognize each other, they travel in the same basic group over and over again. As for a god i dunno, part of me does believe in a higher being but than the rational part wonders how and why he/she/it would just sit around and watch us and why doesn't he/she/it prevent the bad things or help us in time of need.

[OneManArmy]

Well, I believe in a god. I think the bible is one of the greatest books ever written. I also don't quite see it the way most churches I've been to do.

I know there is a god because I can�t believe that all of this just popped out of nowhere. I also can�t believe that in the entire universe we are the only intelligent life forms. I couldn�t imagine all that space would be for naught. If there are other intelligent life forms, what do they believe?

I say the bible is the greatest book ever written. I am not saying it answers all and should be followed word for word. But it is full of wonderful stories and great inspiration. Is it the word of god? Maybe. Does it contain some fiction? Probably. It was written and translated by humans after all. But none the less it does show what wonderful people humans can actually be.

I don�t quite follow most organized religions. It is well documented that early on the church and faith in general was used to control people, to make money off of people and used as an excuse to kill people. There many, many different religions through out the world. From today�s biggest cities to the smallest hut in Africa religion is diverse. If only one religion can be true, who�s to say it�s not some tribe in a small village in the middle of a jungle that knows the right path? I grew up on Catholicism, now I attend a Christian church (not regularly) but I am also very fascinated in the beliefs of Buddhism. I feel there is something to be learned from every culture.

[Navaron]

Thanks eMa, this is why little hamma ran away. You're sleeping on the couch tonight.

[Airlift]

Thank you, Ema. That is precisely what I was getting at, and your answer segues directly into my opinion. I think that the truth is fleeting and the more man touches religion, the farther away it flies. I won't say there's One true religion, but to find the most accurate view of the truth I would suggest Taoism. There are only two texts which have remained unchanged since 500 BC. It is usually overlooked in Theology courses because it doesn't have the trappings of modern religion. The problem is that unless you read chinese, you're getting at least one translation removed, but the trick is to find as many different translations as you can and compare them. In the end, it is still only a book, and it's on the reader to make what they will of it.

I grew up in an aggressive christian church that took nearly everything in the bible literally (which of course threw the congregation into fits of contridiction and second-guessing). Had my entire family not been kicked out when I was young (Iff'n they's the One True God, I'm burning) I would probably be either buried deep in it or moving far away to escape. When I did get kicked out, I was pretty full-on lost, having just been told that I was no longer invited to participate in the religion I was indoctorined with since I was a toddler. So over my teenage years I studied as many other religions as I could find, and I came out pretty disenchanted with what I learned. Taoism was the only thing that spoke to me on a deeper level, and it isn't a practiced, organized religion. That formed my opinion on practiced, organized religions.

Or I could have summed that entire story up to say that Religion is a beautiful thing, and it is a shame that man had to come along and fuck it up.

[eMaGyN]

Originally posted by Rayzer
[B
Or we could talk about a 25 year old woman, having spent 2 years of her life battling cancer. Finally at peace in her last days because of her faith and belief that she is going to a better place. Her struggle having inspired her sister to form a foundation to help childern through there battle with cancer.

[/B]


I :love: you Rayzer. This is an amazing concept. Thank you.

:love:
eMa

[eMaGyN]

Airlift...
I think in a lot of ways your situation can prove to be very beneficial...I was also actually shunned from a community that i grew up with because i spoke my thoughts of how there was no hell fore say...
and i think... its helped me. Because once you get so deep into strict religious communities you become extremely narrow minded...and extremely short sighted...
that was the last thing i wanted to happen to me.

and i do believe that people have lost touch with God... but that doesn't mean that God has lost touch with his people.
I don't believe that we will ever be able to fully comprehend the true meaning...and truth behind religion... but i do believe there are souls that are closer to the meaning... and souls that have touched it.

I decided that i wouldn't let my ostracization to ruin my drive to learn... as did you, which... in more ways than one... makes me feel connected to you on various levels.

I know that you are this amazing person... I catch this large sense of selflessness that just emits from you...

just because men have manipulated the words of God doesn't mean that his message to us is tainted... those words are here... inside us.
at least thats my opinion.

:love:
eMa

[Airlift]

Thank you, eMa. Seems like I start a lot of posts that way :D

What I find amazing is that the thread has stayed so civil. I expected it to hit the fan and catch fire in the first 10 posts.

Now what am I gonna with all this popcorn: :confused: :confused: ;)

[eMaGyN]

yeah, its something i'm grateful for...
I trusted the PSU community and they proved me right :D
Thanks guys! :love: ya.

:love:
eMa

[Hijinks]

Religion is the opiate of the republicans.

[DiosT]

pass it around airlift =p the page will catch fire soon 'nuff =)



Anyway, i believe just about anything is -possible-, yet at the same time i dont think it's likely..

I'd like to think after i die I dont simply end there, but, believing anything more then that would be hope, or faith if you prefer, that there is an afterlife...


no i guess i'm kinda on the side of living on only in the memories we instill in the people we leave behind... and once you're forgotten that's it... i guess that's why i'm constantly depressed? I dont seek out to make a 'name' for myself that'll be remembered more then a month after i'm gone, but as long as I'm living I'm going to do my best to enrich the lives of all my friends and family, and any others that i can help.. and if i do get a chance to live again, or continue on in an afterlife, then That'd be a pleasant end, and i'd finally be able to relax not needign to worry about my friends safety and wellbeing, hopefully...

[tazz]

I dont really know much about religion, as i dont really think about it all that much.

My opinion is that all religions have the same god, only through time they got different opinions and ideas and changed there god accordingly. Becuase if you look at the very basics of all religions, they are pretty much the same, but in different languages.

There is more to say, only to little words to say it in.

[Lexington_Steele]

All of the following is merely my take on things and is not intended to be read as fact.

I see religion as a tool for those seeking spirituality. There are just a number of things you have to keep in mind.

Organized religion is a good place to give you direction in a seach for spirituality. Organized religion is not to be the end of that search. I think that everyone should reach a point in their search where they cast off the structure of organized religion and have spirituality become very personal to themselves. However I believe that it is very helpful for some people to have an organized religion to start their search from and as a forum to begin discussion and questioning.

Holy books are there to offer you questions to ask yourself and think about. Holy Books are not there to present you with all the answers, or to tell you how to live. Life is not as easy as following a printed list of rules, and it is not as boring either.

The person behind the pulpit does not necessarily know more than you and is not privy to information that you do not have access to. However they do spend their lives thinking about and discussing spirituality with their colleagues, so they often have interesting and well thought out ideas on the subject.

As far as my exact personal beliefs, they seem to flip flop. At times I subscribe to something similar to the transendentalist idea of the oversoul (this concept probably predates trancendentalism).

The idea here is that there is a universal oversoul. Whenever anything is born, a chunk of this oversoul is broken off and enters a creature. Throughout the creatures life(using the term creature very loosely) this chunk grows and evolves. When a creature dies, the piece of soul returns the collective oversoul. So your soul is composed of pieces that have been part of the soul of many other creatures. When you die, the sections of your soul will end up being recycled and will become the part of the souls of many other future creates.

The reason why I like this idea is that it seems to make natural sense to me. It is very similar with what happens in nature with what we are physically made of. When we are born, we are made up of many particles (atoms, subatomic particles, ect) that have composed many things before us. When we die, our pieces will become part of future things (trees, grass, maybe other people). The idea here is that you soul works in a similar way.

At other times I see myself as a very self contained entity and that when I die, there will be a part of me that will continue on in some other shape or form, but will still continue to identify itself as a singular, self contained entity (possibly still calling itself Lex). Withing this belief I flip flop between whether there is a singular driving force behind the universe or whether we all have the potential to become the driving force of a universe.

These two ideas are a bit conflicted in which direction I should head in a quest for spirituality. One involves trying to relate to the rest of the universe while seeking out this thing that I am ultimately a piece of. The other is trying to get in touch with something strictly within myself.

Well after all that rambling, I hope that I didn't bore you too much. I also hope that this will give you new ideas, new things to think about and new questions to ask yourself.

[Tobias]

there are powers far greater then us out there, thats my only real thoughts on god.

[Nohimn]

nobody flamed me.......... THIS IS A FIRST!

[Sandtaco]

I'm in between atheist (someone used a fancy word that better suits me but oh well) and catholic. I was raised catholic, and currently go to an all guys catholic school (it's not that bad, you'd be surprised how many girls you can meet at the parties) but anyways... I'm really not sure what to believe in now. I do think that there is destiny, but I don't think that there is a god. Sooo.... I'm not sure what I would be "classified" as :confused:

[Nohimn]

agnostic

[Doobz]

i wanna see one of those conservative bastards read this thread and say all gamers who play games with violence are mentally unstable and the like.

very nice thread here, i enjoyed reading it

[Nohimn]

hurrah! ANOTHER ATHEIST! good-bye... you're not checking back...

[Denali]

First of all, Nohimn are you asking to be flamed??? Masochist or something eh? Now that's out of my system...


I could go on a nice, long, uninformative rant on this topic like I did in the "greatest misconception" thread, but instead I'll just dole out moral support. eMa, I liked your thread. The fact that you know what you believe in and why is good stuff, you're lucky. I'm not sure what I believe in half of the time. I know that there is a God, but whether his name is Jesus, Allah, Yahweh or whatever I don't know. I don't know where he is at this moment, or how active he is with human beings at this very moment. I'm not sure if the Bible is the flagstone we should build our world upon or merely a torch to set us down the right path. I do know that I can feel God sometimes, when looking into the eyes of a newborn child, when being surprised by an old friend or making an amazing touchdown pass. I feel that sometimes when I talk aloud to myself (and try to bite me ear...j/k) that someone really is listening. Who what when where and how I dunno. Maybe that's the fun of it ;) To the agnositc crowd, hey you have just as much hard evidence as the God-fearing believers do that there is a greater being watching over us, I say believe in whatever creams your twinkie. Damn, I ended up with a rant anyways. Oh well.

den

[Airlift]

I have an allegory and a followup question for anyone that wants to take it:

Let's geek out for a second. You buy a new computer, and it has a big ole 3 gigs of ram. You load up your Planetside beta and a lot of that memory gets written to. Those memory addresses are born into the purpose of holding a bit, which they carry out well enough if the dimm is good. Eventually the memory will be released, only to be rewritten when the next process needs it. When you're playing, you don't think about whether each of your bits is healthy until the beta crashes to desktop. It isn't that you don't want your memory to work, you're just too busy doing other things. The individual memory addresses might as well not exist for you because you don't think about them. To your bits who may be dying awful little ram deaths, you would seem like a cruel and vengeful user. Many would doubt your existence, and really that's ok with you as long as your computer works. The moral of this story is that even if you don't believe in God, you should try to be a good bit and deliver your 1 or 0 intact at the end of your cycle.

Having said all that, my question is do you think the Tron 2.0 PC game is going to be any good?

[Lexington_Steele]

Airlift, in answer to your question Confucious says:

Man who keep feet firmly on ground have trouble putting on pants!

[Hijinks]

Originally posted by Airlift
I have an allegory

Allegory is the last refuge of the wicked.

[Rayzer]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
All of the following is merely my take on things and is not intended to be read as fact.

I see religion as a tool for those seeking spirituality. There are just a number of things you have to keep in mind.

Organized religion is a good place to give you direction in a seach for spirituality. Organized religion is not to be the end of that search. I think that everyone should reach a point in their search where they cast off the structure of organized religion and have spirituality become very personal to themselves. However I believe that it is very helpful for some people to have an organized religion to start their search from and as a forum to begin discussion and questioning.

Holy books are there to offer you questions to ask yourself and think about. Holy Books are not there to present you with all the answers, or to tell you how to live. Life is not as easy as following a printed list of rules, and it is not as boring either.

The person behind the pulpit does not necessarily know more than you and is not privy to information that you do not have access to. However they do spend their lives thinking about and discussing spirituality with their colleagues, so they often have interesting and well thought out ideas on the subject.



/nods

Very good post and basically identical to how I view Religion. People often fail to note the difference between religion and spirituality.

At its core Hinduism is a beautiful religion and subscribes to the belief that you should use the image of The Divine that suits you the best. How many Gods does a Hindu believe in? 1-3-33,333 is the answer. You use the image of The Divine that helps you the most to become more spiritual. But in the end, they are all the same thing. Anyway, its been a while since I've discussed this stuff and I don't want to get my facts wrong.

But eMa. Thank you for this thread, too often I don't take the time to think about these things and just go on ignoring them. Thanks for the reminder. :love:

[Tobias]

Everyone but chuck has their own opinion about relgion, and for the most part nothing anyone can say will change that, and know one truely knows who, if anyone, is right.

[OneManArmy]

One.. never knows tobias.. While probally no one will change there mind. it always is possible. free speech and strong ideas are a powerful thing.

[Airlift]

Originally posted by Hijinks
Allegory is the last refuge of the wicked.

One-line posts are the last refuge of the guy with nothing to say.

Hi, this is line two of this post :D :eek: :D

[Mtx]

Originally posted by Airlift
One-line posts are the last refuge of the guy with nothing to say.


I'm going to Heaven one day.

Who's with me?!

;) :D

[Nohimn]

Denali, I'm not asking to be flamed! THAT'S WHAT PISSES ME OFF!! because I'm an atheist and I explain why (people usually ask anyways, so it doesn't matter), I end up getting flamed by assholes!! I was somewhat happy that this thread so far didn't include any flaming!! that's the kind of arrogance I worry about when I mention that I am an atheist


sry for the flame... just continue talking regularly.....

[SandTrout]

I'm not going to read through this entire thread.

Any debate over religion is pointless. Relegion is based off of faith, something that doesn't require a reasonable explaination. My guess is that we are just here as entertainment for the gods(yes, plural), which play only a very limited role in the world. They probably have rules about how they are alowed to affect the world, so that they can get the most fun and/or chalenge out of it.

Don't know anything about the afterlife, because I haven't been there yet.

[Airlift]

You should have read the thread, there's not really any debate. Everyone simply stated their opinions and why they felt the way they do.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by SandTrout
I'm not going to read through this entire thread.

Any debate over religion is pointless.
I disagree. When we discuss an issue we force ourselves to re evaluate and organize our own ideas as we are putting them to text.

We also get to hear the thoughts of other people and may gain new insight on the issue and gain new questions to ask ourselves. This in turn gives us new ideas on the subject and our own beliefs begin to evolve.

[Nohimn]

there's something that I read in "The Salmon Of Doubt" that was very interesting.... I'll post it in while..... hold on.....

edit:: sorry... I can't find it.... it was VERY interesting though...

[eMaGyN]

lol, i'm sure it was ;)


I think it is good to talk of these things, it makes you think about your faith and beliefs...
I believe in a lot of ways, its those who do not want to discuss religion that are strict in their ways... or completely nonchalant about the scenarios in its entirity...

but i wish you would take the time to read at least some of the post... that way you can learn, if not about the person who you are... then about the people we are.

:love:
eMa

[Nohimn]

nicely said ema. I couldn't have said it any better. :love:

[eMaGyN]

Aw, thank you Nohimn :love: