Empire Switching Penality Proposal

[teratravp]

I'm still on my trial and can't use the official messageboards yet, but when I register I'll put this there. Right now I'll try for some feedback here.


Empire Switching Penalty

In the game of PS, on each server you use, one character must be defined as your Primary Character. This character's empire is the one you are assumed to be playing for. Theoritcally since this is a war game you should only be playing for 1 empire at a time. However you are able to create different empire characters on different servers with no adjustment penalities, just not multiple empire characters on the same server without a penalty for the non primary empires.

The new adjustment will be that when you play a character that is a different empire then your primary empire you suffer a Switch Penalty - Health and Shields both diminished 50% to start, down to 0% over 7 days at which time that character will become your primary character and that empire your empire for that server.

Your primary character is determined PER server, therefore you can have different empire characters on different servers with no penalty. The purpose of this penalty is to discourage balance overturns and rushes that debilitate the game.


follow?

[HawkEye]

emipre changing shit is fine as is. the 12 hour timer is enough.

[Krinsath]

Don't think that really resolves anything. Just makes things annoying for people who have multiple characters that they enjoy.

This is a result of the server merge. I had 2 major characters thrown into the same server, but different empires. Why should I be punished because the Devs can't fix bugs fast enough to keep a stable playerbase?

The current system is about as good a solution as any since there is only 2 good servers for most people (or 1 for the Wernerites).

The bandwagoners won't be stopped by this system, it's just a harassment for those who enjoy the different dynamics of the three empires.

It's a war game, yes...but this system would make PS very stale and cost more players.

[321]

I think 12 hours is enough.

[ORANGE]

I'm not happy with empire switching but can't think of a way to make it better so I will shut my mouth

EDIT: There are a couple of ways around the 12 hour rule that I have heard of from friends at school

[Indecisive]

I wouldnt bother messing with it.

[HawkEye]

i think that penalty would suck for the peeps who spend an even amount of time with multiple chars in different empires on same server. and for peeps like me who have been one empire for a long time and want to have fun or try sum thing new on a different empire. ive been nc since beta and ive never changed empires. sumtimes i get bored with my Br20/cr5 char and play tr for fun not because the NC are sucking or an empire buff or nerf happens.

I hope that made sense.

[oddfish]

it did, Hawkeye, trust me.

and i agree that the twelve hours is enough, though i think eight would be enough as well..

[Lithpope]

We did not have the 4th empire problems before the server merges to the degree we have them now. There are still 3 servers (thus the opprotunity to play each empire) and servers should be single empire again. Solution: The persons chooses an empire per server and all characters of another empire on the account keep their BR and CR are decerted in everything and swapped to the primary empire. The person does not lose the character or time spent, just the empire.

[Cyrus-]

The problem with the 12 hour timer is that you're not constantly on. Let's put you in this situation. It's 9:00 at night and you're empire is getting wtf owned... so you decide to switch to the winning empire. You play it for the remaining 3 hours of your time and sleep through the other 9. What kind of penalty is that? You're all set to play either one the next day again. They need to make it so it's 6 to 9 hours of ingame time on one empire before you can switch back.

[Krinsath]

And for those who have problems getting a decent ping to the west coast....having them go to EUROPE strkes you as a sensible idea? You think the lag is bad now, wait untli the damned limeys show up on Markov with their 2500ms pings and lag the entire server. BAD idea.

[Krinsath]

The problem with the 12 hour timer is that you're not constantly on. Let's put you in this situation. It's 9:00 at night and you're empire is getting wtf owned... so you decide to switch to the winning empire. You play it for the remaining 3 hours of your time and sleep through the other 9. What kind of penalty is that? You're all set to play either one the next day again. They need to make it so it's 6 to 9 hours of ingame time on one empire before you can switch back.

The mechanism you describe is exactly the point. I play my NC character Wednesday night, I thien go to sleep, go to work the next day and then come home and eat dinner and fiddle with some stuff and then decide to play PS. Now I can't use my TR character for at least 6 hours? That's ridiculous. You'll then have tons of people who just stay logged in while they're away and completely bypass the system anyway. Again, BAD idea.

[Cyrus-]

I'd love to see how many computers can run planetside without disconnecting or crashing after a long period of time like that. Even if they stay logged on.. most people would do so at night.. a few hours before they reset the servers and everyone disconnects. And people certainly can't do it if they still want to do other things on said computer as planetside sucks up every bit of ram you might have had.

Edit: Or they could just code in something that makes you go ld if you havn't logged any keystrokes for half an hour or so.

[Krinsath]

It's a poorly thought out idea that penalizes people who can't devote tons of time to PS. They pay just as much money as you do. If the Devs feel empire switching is a huge imbalance, they will fix it. Until then, please stop tinkering with a system that works fine.

[Cyrus-]

And the fact that the people who do not play a lot and can randomly switch to the winning side penalizes the people who do play a lot. People who play a lot tend to stick with one empire over another and ALSO enjoy being on the winning side. You think suddenly losing 5 to 10% of the population to the side that's already beating you with thier over-grown dongles isn't a detriment to those who stick with one side?

What am I saying.. you're in three different outfits on two different empires.. I'm talking to someone who obviously doesn't believe in playing with the same group of guys consistently. How do you think the people in the enforcers who stick with tr feel when you go play nc because they're losing? Or visa versa for that NC outfit of yours.

[KIAsan]

I'm not happy about empire switching and there is another way to handle it, they could have allowed you to either change your other characters empire OR they could have let you move your conflicting characters to the other US server. That would also have been very fair. However, SOE choose this route, so it's in the game. There is absolutley no reason to penalize players for using their different empire characters, since it has been authorized by SOE and is in the rules.

BTW, you can exploit the 12 hour rule (I also know how to do it), however be aware, that is an exploit and should you be caught, I would hate to see a post on this board about how it's not fair.

[Krinsath]

And the fact that the people who do not play a lot and can randomly switch to the winning side penalizes the people who do play a lot. People who play a lot tend to stick with one empire over another and ALSO enjoy being on the winning side. You think suddenly losing 5 to 10% of the population to the side that's already beating you with thier over-grown dongles isn't a detriment to those who stick with one side?

What am I saying.. you're in three different outfits on two different empires.. I'm talking to someone who obviously doesn't believe in playing with the same group of guys consistently. How do you think the people in the enforcers who stick with tr feel when you go play nc because they're losing? Or visa versa for that NC outfit of yours.

For the record, I'm in five different outfits and I have 13 characters on all three empires. I'm Terran Republic, tried and true...been that way since the last p-wipe in beta...and I was NC before that. I like having a character to try out all sorts of different playstyles, so that when someone raises holy hell about something being out of whack, I have a reference for what they're talking about.

If all the empires were the same, then yes, your argument would have merit. They are all DIFFERENT and they require DIFFERENT styles. Somedays I just feel like beating the crap out of people...I take the NC. Somedays I feel like hearing lots of gunshots and seeing goggles, so I play TR. Other days I feel like pretty colors, so I play VS. That's one of the draws of PS is that you're NOT locked in to ONE empire.

Also for the record, my choice in empire IS based on the relative populations...whichever is lower is the one I go to. Why? Simple math. If 600 people are trying to kill 400 people and everyone kills 1 person, that's 200 people with no kills. Conversely, everyone on the other side got a kill, even though they lost. I root for the underdog and play accordingly. Nothing will make me log off faster than seeing the population for the empire I'm on at 36% or 37%. Dominance through numbers bores me. Dominance through skill (like owning half the world when you're the smallest population) is much more fun for me. Add in the fact that most of the people on the "4th Empire" aren't worth having on your team to begin with (they're running to the most powerful weapon because they can't win any other way...and 9 times out of 10 they still suck) and you can wrack up insane kill counts and BEP. Call me an inverse bandwagoneer if you want, that's the simple truth. Plenty of SKILLED veterans who are worth having around have the same attitude...it's better to be in a good fight and losing than be on the outskirts of a random zerg and winning. I play for the fighting, not to watch someone else fight and the map turn a certain color...that's cool if it happens, but I'm far more interested in the killing than the strategic objectives (usually).

How do the guys in the Enforcers feel? They laugh their asses off about it. If I kill one I send them a tell and they try their hardest to kill me so they can dance on the corpse, makes it more fun for everyone. Hell, one of my outfit buddies and I went into air to air duels where he handed me my ass each and everytime...was still fun as all hell. Even brought me closer to random members of my own empire, as my cloaker blows them up and they send the hate tell which then strikes up a dialog. I played cat and mouse with a TR sniper for about an hour and a half and we both had fun (especially when he finally won a round).

The 47th Mechanized has sadly fallen apart. There's only three active guys atm and neither of them are on when I am. :( But it's a Day 1 outfit and I like the name, so I stick to it.

Collision Force, eh, they invited me as an alt and they knew it was an alt...same deal as NC Kings and Caitiff. I don't feel at all bad because I was completely open about not always being around, and they decided they wanted me anyway. I'm mostly a lone wolf to begin with, mainly because I *still* hate the broken squad XP system. The Enforcers are the only group I've found worth squadding up with on a regular basis (which is why I won't leave them even to join the vaunted ranks of CDL). So please, learn your facts before you try to comment rather than reading a sig.

SpaceWolf (TR - Emerald) is a Day 2 character (took the mail a bit), GreyKnight (NC - Konreid) is a Day 2 character and DoomEagle (VS - Markov) is a Day 4 or 5 character, the first two have been in outfits since June.

I discover more about empires the more I play around. If you stick exclusively to one empire you end up very narrow-minded and believe that the other side has all the advantages and you're the victim of nerf after nerf (EVERY empire says this). I've learned that with the exception of the TR with their 150% vehicle crew gripe, most of those things just aren't true. You can't know that if you don't play it.

Your system leads to people who don't understand the other side, which will lead to endless bitching and moaning about the NC being more powerful than the TR who are more powerful than the VS who somehow are more powerful then the NC. The only time things get out of hand is when people who decide to stay on one side give up and quit just as the "5th empire"...those who switch sides to the underdogs and fight like hell for them, show up.

[Cyrus-]

Krinsath. When I say 'you people' i mean the general you.. not you specifically. Sure, YOU might get on the underdog or just pick which empire you feel like playing. But more than enough people just use it to switch to the winning side only causing their begining side to lose even more. How you use it makes no difference.. how MOST people use it is the problem.

[teratravp]

somehow it slipped my mind that there's only 3 servers now, all for specific geographic areas... so my proposal isn't any good. I'd only want it to happen if people who like empire hopping still had the option to do over different servers, but now I remember that's not an option.

still, I think, even if you guys don't realize it and think empire hopping is just part of the package, it can at times totally screw up the virtual balance. I mean people say they have restraint but in reality they all want to line up in one place... one person switches over for whatever reason, then here comes another, and another... that deflates the "war" game a bit and makes it more of you and your friends and your friends friends etc running around to the best stacked odds.

If SOE would open some more servers (hard probably because they have to get more people, which in turn is hard in a game that lost so many of it's best possible customers already) then this could resolved... but similar to surgile exploit and the required nerf I wouldn't mind if more was done to bandage population see sawing for the moment. Just give some degree of stat penalty... a timer doesn't mean much at all. And I know some of you would like to be able to pick up your most powerful char of any empire at any time... but here we go with the see saw.

[Majik]

Of course I just had a thought about the empire jumpers. Poplocked character choices on a server basis. If you maintain characters in more than one empire on a server, and one of your empire choices already has a 10% population advantage over any other, that choice is not available to play. This could keep people from jumping to the winning side, when the losing side is already undermaned.
This comes to mind thanks to the first day of the capitol fighting, when on emerald the populations were 40% NC, 42% TR, and 18% VS. Guess who was fighting for every inch of land they had all night.

[Krinsath]

Of course I just had a thought about the empire jumpers. Poplocked character choices on a server basis. If you maintain characters in more than one empire on a server, and one of your empire choices already has a 10% population advantage over any other, that choice is not available to play. This could keep people from jumping to the winning side, when the losing side is already undermaned.
This comes to mind thanks to the first day of the capitol fighting, when on emerald the populations were 40% NC, 42% TR, and 18% VS. Guess who was fighting for every inch of land they had all night.

That seems like a fairer system, but still raises the problem of what if I wanted to play my NC character that night. Which empire to play for some people is a mood choice, if they're not in the mood to play for Empire X, seems unfair to force them to do so.

Also, wasn't the first day of capitol buildings on Emerald involved with some sort of bug that had the VS stuck in their sanctuary for the majority of the evening? If I couldn't get out of sanc with my empire, I'd log off too. ;)

I think they're working on actual *benefits* for badly outnumbered forces, so that will hopefully keep the lop-sided battles to a minimum while still letting people play the game that (some) have put close to $200 into for whatever empire they want to.

[JakeLogan]

it sounds good on paper but in the end it would piss off the playerbase.

[Doop]

No! FUCKING NO! I can't lose my empire changing ability! I'll kill myself!

[Krinsath]

No! FUCKING NO! I can't lose my empire changing ability! I'll kill myself!

In that case...I change my vote! No Empire switching for anyone! :D

Ok, I'm just kidding, but I can't resist being a smartass in these situations. :) I doubt they'd ever do it Doop...so you can take the Lasher out of your mouth now...it doesn't Lash friendlies anyway. ;)