working for 19cent week right/wrong?

[Ogge]

In Indonesia you get payed 19cents/week to work at a Nike factory, do you think its right or wrong?

1: they get payed, even if its just 19cents its still 19cents.
2: they get a place to sleep and food, the food may not ge good but its still food.
3: they dont know about the world outside so they think its a good work.
4: We get things cheaper thanks to them.

so what do you think? as you see above i think its a great thing that they got a job and that they have a place to sleep and eat instead of starving to death on the streets.

[Hamma]

I think it sucks because we lose jobs here in the USA.

[Electrofreak]

Well, it depends on how much 19 cents US is worth in their money. Its not a lot to us, but remember, our money is worth more or less in other countries. Since I'm assuming that it is still drastically less than what we make, I'm going to say that it is definately wrong.

Its really cheap and pathetic of Nike and so many other companies to move their manufacturing to poor countries, and pay the people there practically nothing to work. I mean in a way, its a good thing. It provides the people of that country with a means to make money, otherwise a lot more of them would be unemployed. On the flip side, it takes jobs from Americans as Hamma said. I think that Nike should be paying these people as much as or at least ALMOST as much as what they would pay a US citizen here (basically, give the poor saps at LEAST minimum wage.)

Another thing I find ridiculous, they charge these people 19 cents a week to make shoes which they then sell for like a hundred dollars. That is seriously messed up.

[SDM]

In Indonesia you get payed 19cents/week to work at a Nike factory, do you think its right or wrong?

1: they get payed, even if its just 19cents its still 19cents.
2: they get a place to sleep and food, the food may not ge good but its still food.
3: they dont know about the world outside so they think its a good work.
4: We get things cheaper thanks to them.

so what do you think? as you see above i think its a great thing that they got a job and that they have a place to sleep and eat instead of starving to death on the streets.
You really need take your Communist ass to the pol. debate forum.

[Ogge]

[QUOTE=Electrofreak]Well, it depends on how much 19 cents US is worth in their money.QUOTE]

well there pay check is worth 19cent [US]

[Electrofreak]

wow, didn't bother to try to understand what I said did you? How much is 19 cents worth in their money? Basically I'm guessing you can buy a lot more with 19 cents over there than you can over here. That is my point. However, I'm assuming that it is comparitively much less than what a US worker would earn.

[Ogge]

no...what i ment was that you basicly get a paycheck worth of thingys you can get in USA for 19cent

[Everay]

america needs more money coming into it, and if these bastards export jobs that would go for min wage here, yea they save money, but it still keeps money from going to american citizens, not to forget america has alot of unemployed people, more jobs state side the better.

[Neon Apocalypse]

people living like that have a very very slim chance of getting to the US

it is sad that they are underpaid, but the people that hire them are underpaid as well

they all need money and there isnt much money in indonesia

the advantages of working there are that they get food, they can live, and they will always be employed, its a sucky life that they cant get any better like in the US, but its alot better than it could be in those parts

[Everay]

yea, i know, but if america gets no money to its citizens, and our standards of living decrease, eventualy america will be a 3rd world country, hell it already is in some parts, i dont know the statistics but i do know that in select parts of this country people live below the poverty line. which if im not mistaken is taking in less than 9k a year. living on that little is hard. hard to do in america that is, not in indoneasia.

[SDM]

http://www.neosith.com/OggeLog.txt

[Ogge]

SDM dont go http://www.xbox-se.com/profil/6306.jpgsilly http://www.xbox-se.com/profil/7758.jpg

[SDM]

SDM dont go off topic
That is very much ON topic, douche.

[Ogge]

i asked what you people was thinking about it, i dont need to find out what i think about it



You seem to have a problem whit me, send me a PM and we can talk about it

[Everay]

http://www.neosith.com/OggeLog.txt


i was drinking root beer as i read that, i almost spit it out.

[Ivan]

This could be a touchy subject. Cause what if the Nike factory that brought jobs into a town that didn�t really have any? When the Nike factory might of went in maybe it brought other business to that town. Think of it as what basically happened here around Steel Mills and Coal Mines. As long as the workers are being treated right and not like slaves this subject is hard to give a definite �It�s wrong� or �its right.�

True they are taking jobs from Americans, but if we were to pull out the factory now that town�s economy would crumble. Instead of everyone having a little bit of money they would now have none. You could say they should take up local jobs like fishing or farming instead of working in the factory, but even here in America if you were able to make more money at one job and that job was easier you would take it. Farming and fishing could be harder to do in those countries, so they prefer to take up a job at the factory were they can make more money and they know a bad growing season or fishing season isn�t going to ruin their business.

So I would say it tough to say its right or wrong. It all depends on each circumstance.

[Red October]

Well, like it was stated earlier. It really depends on how much 19 cents is worth. While in college one of our Proffesors was/is an Economic Consultant to the Mexican Government. We (his students) had the opportunity to visit a number of factories just south of the border (FYI, just to head off any NAFTA debate, a number of these factories have been there since the late 60's under the "Maquilladora's Program"). The workers there got free med benefits, free day care and a subsidized lunch program. If I recollect correctly, they were being payed on the average of 7 pesos and hour. I don't know the exchange rate now (and just way to lazy to look it up) I'll just use 10 peso's to the dollar: 7 x 48 hour week = 336 / 10 exchange = $33.60 USD. Not much isn't it? But we were also informed (plus we already knew) that in "non-tourist areas" that could go pretty far. They shop at stores way different than we the tourist are led to AND they are a little more self sufficient. Of course, the standard of living is WAY less than ours. There not living in middle class 1200 sq ft homes. Likewise in Indonesia, they are probally living in huts. But does that make it right? Thats the moral delimma.

But lets take this to a new twist. I recollect reading some studies where wages were increased and turnover went high. This is just an extreme example (but puts it in to perspective). In a case with a British mining company in India (I think?), The citizens were appauled when they found out how much native miners were being paid. So, with the outcry, it was demanded and granted that they would be paid half the wages where a British miner would get. The company couldn't keep the workers. The workers would work 1-6 months and quit. Why? Simply put, the wages were so high in comparison to the standard of living, all they had to do was work for a small period and that amount would take care of them for a very long time (several years). They had no expensive products to buy (since none were sold there) and they were very self sufficient (farm thier "own" lands for food, house built by themselves, etc.). Thus they had to lower the wage in order to keep the workers. One of those weird paradox's in econimics.

My own personal opinion, I think Nike is well aware of the "economics" of the situation and is exploiting it. This is unconfirmed history, but many of the major corporations-monopolies in the depression era purposely conspired to keep wages down in order to keep costs low and profits up. In Indonesia, where anti-trust laws may or may not be on the books or where enforcement is lack or corruption rampant, this could be the case.

[Sputty]

Go away Ogge. No one wants your ignorant comments here

[Ogge]

-delited-

[Everay]

we? now i can understand that my view is immoral in ways IE put people ahead of you, well i am, but im putting americans ahead of other people, is that so wrong? isnt it selfish of you to ask for america to put others ahead of other americans?

[Ogge]

i dident mean you,,, i ment sputty

[SDM]

-delited-
DIE

[Ogge]

i see some people is to stupid answer the question i asked (look at first post) just dont post if you dont have something related to the question


*** im not gone open this thread again so no need to post anymore Ogge hating thinys***

[SDM]

i see some people is to stupid answer the question i asked (look at first post) just dont post if you dont have something related to the question


*** im not gone open this thread again so no need to post anymore Ogge hating thinys***
I is to stupid?

I know where the pol. debate forum is, and am against eating people. Fucknuckle.

[Jennyboo]

I think it sucks because we lose jobs here in the USA.
:nod: :nod:

[Fragmatic]

-delited-

Speel mutch?!"!$

[Fragmatic]

http://forumspam.articblue.nl/thread_related/thread_sucks/images/0503.jpg

[Ogge]

ohh der f�rer.... :|

[Kikinchikin]

It's completely wrong. Nike is headed by greedy sons of bitches who have absolutely no regard for human life. I have been boycotting Nike for over a year now because of this.

[ZeusCali]

I is to stupid?

I know where the pol. debate forum is, and am against eating people. Fucknuckle.sdm fuck off you know he is not speaking his native language.
Speel mutch?!"!$-fragsee above

Go away Ogge. No one wants your ignorant comments hereI Don't want YOUR ignorant comments either, don't assume to think the same as everyone, you cannot use no one as you have made no poll checking the opinion and are just jumping on the kick ogge's ass wagon.


Red October i am glad some of us actually read threads and not just flame them, your post made this thread worth the read. I was starting to think this forum was just full of Brainwashed flamers

Ivan you too came in and left this thread with a good attitude thank you. You have a point.

Personally I agree with Red october when he says, that the economy shapes around the jobs in it:
high wages=high product value(hence why nike can sell at 100$ a shoe)
Low Wages= adjustment of value until life is possible to live
0 wage= life is hard, people have to fall back on the land(which cannot always hold them)

i think nike is taking advantage of a poorer country but at the same time they are making an economy possible, more as a side effect then as a main purpose.

Hamma and those that quoted him, how long would it take you working at their wages to pay for 1 tank of gas? it is not possible for these jobs to be in the US if they had nike would not exist it would be closer to payless' profit margin.

[EarlyDawn]

Nike.

Nearly Payless Profit Margins

...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[ZeusCali]

Nike.

Nearly Payless Profit Margins

...

:lol: :lol: :lol:as in they have similar profit margin as payless or as they nearly don't pay anyone thus get 100% profit margine?:rolleyes: :huh: :doh: :confused: ;) :rofl: :lol: :groovy: :p

[Fragmatic]

as in they have similar profit margin as payless or as they nearly don't pay anyone thus get 100% profit margine?:rolleyes: :huh: :doh: :confused: ;) :rofl: :lol: :groovy: :p

http://forumspam.articblue.nl/user_related/ignore/images/0466.jpg

[Everay]

hes wondering it the amount of money they make is similar to the other shoe company, Payless, or if they dont pay anyone and because of that they get 100 money back from the selling of their shoes.

[Spee]

buh

[Mr1337Duck]

There are plenty of small countries where you can get by very effectively with a couple hundred bucks, places in Africa.

[Red October]

I think the real question bogs down to this; Are the wages they are recieving enough to actually improve their standard of living? Even gradually? Or are they just high enough to lure them off the farms with a guarantee of an income (crops do fail) and there standard of living is kept at subsistance? If indeed their wage is improving life in general for them, then Nike is doing a good thing. But if its taking advantage of a situation, then they could actually be impedeing progress. The villages may for go any agricultural assistance via improved tools and/or methods(as they may view it as too risky) in order to stick with something "safe".

As for Nike itself, my understanding is that $75 of that $100 shoe goes to marketing costs. I've bought'n only one pair of Nike's and did not see any difference between thier product than those at shoe wharehouse or Payless. The only real quality shoes I've ever worn that seemed worth every penny (and then some) were my hiking shoes.

[Dharkbayne]

Ogge is a douche.

Really, 19 cents isn't enough to get anywhere, ever. It would take YEARS of work to afford a fucking bicycle.

[Fragmatic]

Really, 19 cents isn't enough to get anywhere, ever. It would take YEARS of work to afford a fucking bicycle.

2 Weeks for a chocolate bar.

[MilitantB0B]

In Indonesia you get payed 19cents/week to work at a Nike factory, do you think its right or wrong?

1: they get payed, even if its just 19cents its still 19cents.
2: they get a place to sleep and food, the food may not ge good but its still food.
3: they dont know about the world outside so they think its a good work.
4: We get things cheaper thanks to them.

so what do you think? as you see above i think its a great thing that they got a job and that they have a place to sleep and eat instead of starving to death on the streets.
Thats the way I see it to.

1.) As already pointed out, $.19 might be crap here, but over there it is obviously a pretty good thing. How do I know this? These people chose to work their, meaning it was the best they could get. which leads me to my next point:

2.) The only reason Nike opened a factory there is because of the cheap labor, make them pay higher wages and they will just pick up and move, leaving those people jobless. 19c is better then 0c.

I do agree with Hamma though, I wish America could get those jobs, but thats how the world works. It looks like America is shaping up to be more of a profesional nation, in that we outsource most of our manual labor jobs, but we also have some of the best profesional industrys. stuff like medical, engineering, etc. Pretty soon you will need a masters or phd just to be competitive in America...


EDIT:
http://www.neosith.com/OggeLog.txt
Wow, that is the dumbest outlook on life I have ever seen...

Well, if you ever feel the need to full-fill this little idea, come over to my house, I will lock you in my attic and make you do my laundry, that is unless you find out about something going on outside the attic, then of course I will have to kill you... But you where fine with that, right? :doh:

[ObnoxiousFrog]

I shall respond here with 2 pictures, one for the crazy foreigners who aren't proficient in English or logic and try to use that as an excuse to sound retarded on an English-speaking forum:

http://www.p0stwh0restores.com/uploads/Frog/engrish.jpg


The second is in response to Ogge and his crazy Communist wet dreams, as seen on the History Channel:

http://www.p0stwh0rehosting.com/uploads/Frog/ownedbyhistory.JPG

[Everay]

The second is in response to Ogge and his crazy Communist wet dreams, as seen on the History Channel:

http://www.p0stwh0rehosting.com/uploads/Frog/ownedbyhistory.JPG


Rodger Mudd OMG :rofl: :rofl:

[Hamma]

Im going to remove Ogge's post editing privs, he removes too many posts.

[Dharkbayne]

pwnt. :rofl:

[Hamma]

What was it about? Communism?

[Dharkbayne]

What was what about?

[Hamma]

Ogge's post.

[Everay]

the post he deleted and SDM said DIE?

it was something about how americans are selfish or something like that im not sure.

[Hamma]

Sounds about right for ogge

[Vick]

Some of you guys are fucking dumb. Nineteen cents is nineteen cents anywhere, your thinking of like dollars to yen or something.

Also, why is everyone calling Ogge a comunist and to take this to the politcal forum?? Communism/pilitics had nothing to do with this thread. He was asking what you thought of people getting paid 19 cents in Thailand to make shoes.

My opinion: Better then them living in the street, but really sucks.

[Everay]

vick, not really, see its called exchange rates, and 19 cents in other countries goes for alot.

[Dharkbayne]

Aye, you can get alot more with 1 USD in mexico than in USA, but still, 19 cents is NOT enough for a weeks work, no matter HOW you look at it. It would be good if there was a 125 million USD:NKD ratio, but I doubt there is.

[Vick]

BUT ITS STILL WORTH FUCKING 19 CENTS, duh.

PS1: Money does not change value just because it changes currency. If 19 cents buy a pencil here, it will buy a pencil in North Korea, it is the same amount of cash.

PS2: If nothing else, Ogge has an interesting opinion, which is alot better then many people I see.

[JetRaiden]

well, its probably not american money, like a dime nickel and a few pennies, its probably the malasian (sp?) currency, just converted.

[SDM]

BUT ITS STILL WORTH FUCKING 19 CENTS, duh.

PS1: Money does not change value just because it changes currency. If 19 cents buy a pencil here, it will buy a pencil in North Korea, it is the same amount of cash.

PS2: If nothing else, Ogge has an interesting opinion, which is alot better then many people I see.
/me applies liberal amounts of nipple cream to Vicks nub.

[JetRaiden]

/me applies liberal amounts of nipple cream to Vicks nub.
"liberal amounts"

:rolleyes:

[Dharkbayne]

3: they dont know about the world outside so they think its a good work.


So it's okay to pay someone shit for wages, as long as they don't know any better?

[Everay]

So it's okay to pay someone shit for wages, as long as they don't know any better?


what can you do, hes a commie and were capitolist pigs, fuck it all.

[Infernus]

<Ogge|food> you are the typical american <Ogge|food> cant accept difrent things

lol... your realise that those two lines contradict everything you say... 'You're Americans and you don't accept change' coming from a bastard that would hide anything different from totalitarianism from his people. Democracy? out the window... Western thinking? whats that... basically you are outnumbered vastly but still base your views on a theory that was made up during the Suffragist/Labor Unionist Period of Europe... Your beliefes are archaic, based on the thought process of a man that saw horrible working conditions so decided to write about a 'global worker uprising'... He was helluva wrong, American's didn't revolt... cause we have it a hell of a lot better then some comunist fucknut in a Soviet breakaway state... (BTW: You do know that the soviet union was poor and outdated by the time of its colapse because of governmental fear that allowing workers to use computers would allow them to gain to much knowledge.)

I defer to the the philospopher Polibus: "First, Monarchy, the rule by one. Second, Aristocracy, the rule by few. Third, Democracy, the rule by many. So warned the eye who looked through time and named corruption as the shape of all paths. Seeing kings made to tyrants, seeing councils made to oligarchs, seeing peoples made to mobs." Tyrants and Oligarchs... that is the core of your beliefes, in turn those two incite the mobs... anacolysis its called... you should learn about it.

EDIT: That was too histo-political for me... shoudln't this be sent to the board of politics...

[Dharkbayne]

I defer to the the philospopher Polibus: "First, Monarchy, the rule by one. Second, Aristocracy, the rule by few. Third, Democracy, the rule by many. So warned the eye who looked through time and named corruption as the shape of all paths. Seeing kings made to tyrants, seeing councils made to oligarchs, seeing peoples made to mobs." Tyrants and Oligarchs... that is the core of your beliefes, in turn those two incite the mobs... anacolysis its called... you should learn about it.


Holy Mc Philosophical pwnage, batman!

[Bighoss]

Holy Mc Philosophical pwnage, batman!