Eldanesh
2004-06-07, 07:36 PM
http://psforums.station.sony.com/ps/board/message?board.id=psdevdiscussion&message.id=26011
Now, I have used AI and AV maxs extensively on all empires, and I have come to few conclusions about maxs and a max�s role in the game.
1: They are support certs. They play an important role in a squad, and a mix of heavy infantry and maxs is far tougher than a greater number exclusive to either.
1a. They are not intended to work by themselves, while they can in situations like defense and holding a line, their inability to hack or repair reduces their ability to solo for any period.
1b. A max with infantry amplifies their number because attackers either have AV out and get killed by grunts, or have their AI guns out and get killed by the max.
1c. A max should not be a Swiss army knife like infantry, nor should a AI max be guaranteed to kill an infantry rexo/av grunt 1v1.
1d. An over buffed class of maxs would be detrimental to gameplay.
2: AI max was perfected in the Scattercannon.
2a. The SC�s role interacts perfectly with its empire ability because it can control crowds and just right into the fray with a short-ranged choke.
2b. The AV damage of the SC is just right for locking down spawn rooms and defending itself from other maxs.
2c. The TTK of the SC is perfect to shred infantry while still giving grunts a time to get in a kill.
3: VS and TR maxs lack an AI max that has the same potential as a SC.
3a. TTK on DC is such that it is a little too easy for a grunt to turn a corner get hit once and retreat.
3b. Aside from infantry stopping power, the VS/TR AI maxs lack the ability to kill armor efficiently, in max v max, both bend over, AP mode or not, and tubes take too long to kill as well.
3c. TR max ability is far less effective without an indirect fire AI max.
This brings me to what I envision maxs as, not overpowered killing machines, but as infantry support. Scattercannon is perfect, it is what an AI max should be. Quasar kills infantry just fine, it tends to bend over to anything armored however. DC suffers from the same problem, but its also a bit too slow at AI work as well.
What I would like to see is the AI maxs as not just anti-infantry, but anti-max as well. The AV max should be modified into less of an overspecialized, nigh-pointless anti-max max and more into an outdoor max. Projectiles that lock on similar to strikers, but do more damage to hard targets (You know, TANKS!) if they are going to make max armor separate from tank armor, then they might as well buff AV damage.
(By the way, I think the Deci is **bleep**ing perfect as is and it is a BAD idea to nerf its damage to maxs, I do like the idea of separating damage for max v max combat, however)
IMO, the idea of separating maxs into the roles of AI, AV, and AA was a bad idea in itself, range brackets seems more logical, i.e. rename AI maxs something like Assault maxs and a similar style of name for AV like Ranger.
New AI max could cover close range much like current SC does, Not having explosive weapons means they would have a faster TTK max vs max than the new AV max.
The new AV max would cover the outdoors for a certain distance, striker-like range means they could go outside and have limited air cover as well as vehicle defense. Fast-fire dumbfire mode would allow for no damage degradation, giving it a decent range. The new AV max should kill other maxs about as fast as a new AI max would, just it will end up hitting itself a lot up close, thus it loses effectiveness indoors.
Now� What I would do about the current AI maxs: General buff to AV damage, All have about the same TTK on maxs, scattercannon would still have a slightly faster one up close, followed by the DC, then Quasar because of range differences. The DC would get a slight reworking on empire ability and damage distribution. Imo, SC should be doing 100% damage unlocked, while this is all theoretical percents, what it means is, it should have a sweet sot for killing infantry while unlocked where it kills faster than any other AI max. This should mean: quasar has longest effective range, DC had good range, but kills most efficiently up close/medium, and SC retains its short-range killing, with 1/3 speed choke shots for range.
DC should use a capacitor. 110% with the same CoF as normal. The catch, its an inverted capacitor, call it a heat meter. It should last for a good 7-10 seconds of constant firing until the gun locks up. The TR gets to keep their lockdown as well, however. 120% faster TTK and no heat buildup/ very slow heat buildup.
For what its worth, that�s what I think a maxs role should be and what the maxs should be. For those too lazy to read it all, its giving the MA/HA rock/paper/scissors range setup to maxs and actually making the AV max worth the 3 certs. Also make the AA max 3 **bleep**ing certs already!
I finally got around to compiling my views on maxs, would like opinion from you guys. :)
Now, I have used AI and AV maxs extensively on all empires, and I have come to few conclusions about maxs and a max�s role in the game.
1: They are support certs. They play an important role in a squad, and a mix of heavy infantry and maxs is far tougher than a greater number exclusive to either.
1a. They are not intended to work by themselves, while they can in situations like defense and holding a line, their inability to hack or repair reduces their ability to solo for any period.
1b. A max with infantry amplifies their number because attackers either have AV out and get killed by grunts, or have their AI guns out and get killed by the max.
1c. A max should not be a Swiss army knife like infantry, nor should a AI max be guaranteed to kill an infantry rexo/av grunt 1v1.
1d. An over buffed class of maxs would be detrimental to gameplay.
2: AI max was perfected in the Scattercannon.
2a. The SC�s role interacts perfectly with its empire ability because it can control crowds and just right into the fray with a short-ranged choke.
2b. The AV damage of the SC is just right for locking down spawn rooms and defending itself from other maxs.
2c. The TTK of the SC is perfect to shred infantry while still giving grunts a time to get in a kill.
3: VS and TR maxs lack an AI max that has the same potential as a SC.
3a. TTK on DC is such that it is a little too easy for a grunt to turn a corner get hit once and retreat.
3b. Aside from infantry stopping power, the VS/TR AI maxs lack the ability to kill armor efficiently, in max v max, both bend over, AP mode or not, and tubes take too long to kill as well.
3c. TR max ability is far less effective without an indirect fire AI max.
This brings me to what I envision maxs as, not overpowered killing machines, but as infantry support. Scattercannon is perfect, it is what an AI max should be. Quasar kills infantry just fine, it tends to bend over to anything armored however. DC suffers from the same problem, but its also a bit too slow at AI work as well.
What I would like to see is the AI maxs as not just anti-infantry, but anti-max as well. The AV max should be modified into less of an overspecialized, nigh-pointless anti-max max and more into an outdoor max. Projectiles that lock on similar to strikers, but do more damage to hard targets (You know, TANKS!) if they are going to make max armor separate from tank armor, then they might as well buff AV damage.
(By the way, I think the Deci is **bleep**ing perfect as is and it is a BAD idea to nerf its damage to maxs, I do like the idea of separating damage for max v max combat, however)
IMO, the idea of separating maxs into the roles of AI, AV, and AA was a bad idea in itself, range brackets seems more logical, i.e. rename AI maxs something like Assault maxs and a similar style of name for AV like Ranger.
New AI max could cover close range much like current SC does, Not having explosive weapons means they would have a faster TTK max vs max than the new AV max.
The new AV max would cover the outdoors for a certain distance, striker-like range means they could go outside and have limited air cover as well as vehicle defense. Fast-fire dumbfire mode would allow for no damage degradation, giving it a decent range. The new AV max should kill other maxs about as fast as a new AI max would, just it will end up hitting itself a lot up close, thus it loses effectiveness indoors.
Now� What I would do about the current AI maxs: General buff to AV damage, All have about the same TTK on maxs, scattercannon would still have a slightly faster one up close, followed by the DC, then Quasar because of range differences. The DC would get a slight reworking on empire ability and damage distribution. Imo, SC should be doing 100% damage unlocked, while this is all theoretical percents, what it means is, it should have a sweet sot for killing infantry while unlocked where it kills faster than any other AI max. This should mean: quasar has longest effective range, DC had good range, but kills most efficiently up close/medium, and SC retains its short-range killing, with 1/3 speed choke shots for range.
DC should use a capacitor. 110% with the same CoF as normal. The catch, its an inverted capacitor, call it a heat meter. It should last for a good 7-10 seconds of constant firing until the gun locks up. The TR gets to keep their lockdown as well, however. 120% faster TTK and no heat buildup/ very slow heat buildup.
For what its worth, that�s what I think a maxs role should be and what the maxs should be. For those too lazy to read it all, its giving the MA/HA rock/paper/scissors range setup to maxs and actually making the AV max worth the 3 certs. Also make the AA max 3 **bleep**ing certs already!
I finally got around to compiling my views on maxs, would like opinion from you guys. :)