Absurd, utterly absurd.

[MrVicchio]

Certain passages of the Bible can be construed as hate literature if placed in a particular context, according to a Canadian provincial court.

The Court of Queen's Bench in Saskatchewan upheld a 2001 ruling by the province's human rights tribunal that fined a man for submitting a newspaper ad that included citations of four Bible verses that address homosexuality.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=31080

[mistled]

People hate being wrong. But the column is correct. This would never happen to the Koran.

[Lexington_Steele]

Which part of it do you feel was absurd? The fine, or fact that some guy posted the ad?

[mistled]

I find it absurd that the guys actually sued and won. But you knew that before you posted. :p

[Bighoss]

what the hell is this world coming too ???

[archaic1128]

I agree it is quite absurd. What ever happened to freedom of speech?

"This would never happen to the Koran."

Very true, there are numerous events taking place now where Islamics are killing Christians just because they're Christian. I'm not talking about a few murders, i'm talking by the thousands. The sad part is that the governments of these nations stand by and watch the persecution and do nothing about it. What really irks me is that our so called free press never reports on the persecution of Christians, but if the Islamic's get attacked by Christians in any form the press is all over it. Here's a few articles if interested.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.asp?ID=4560
http://conservativetruth.org/archives/tombarrett/12-16-01.shtml

[ABRAXAAS]

If you publish hate material in any form you should be sued,
simmple fuck freedom of speech when it's desighned to attack people its like the damn KKK fuck it and fuck them.

He got what he deserved .

[MrVicchio]

Ahh the spam squad led by Abraxxas has struck. Go away kid, no one is gonna bite that loaded pile of dingo dung you are trying to pass as intelligent thought.


ANY WAY:

Whats absurd is that a Homosexual can frely promote his beliefs, but if someone is offended by them and promotes why they feel such a choice of lifestyles is wrong.. they are offending people and promoting hate speech.

Whatever, a revival of tradintional morals and values is comming, and people will realize how absurd the world is.

Sorry Hamma, but that one caught me all pissy last night.

[Bighoss]

does anyone feel now that if anyone doesn't sugar coat something it is considered offensive?

ABRAXAAS we have to let people say what they want because slowly but surely other things will be outlawed making us the terran republic !

vicchio how the hell did u get so smart?

[ABRAXAAS]

Its not a matter of free speecha its a matter of purpously attacking someone for there way of life . That add attacked the gay and lesbian population . It didnt say "I dont believe in people being gay " It said being Gay is wrong and these quotes from the bible say you should be killed " its the difference between right and wrong . Its right to have beleifs its wrong to force those on other and attack there beleifs . get your head out of your ass learn the difference.

[MrVicchio]

But those same people of the GLBT community can freely post "ITS OKAY TO BE GAY!" Which offends a large number of people?

Absurd.

[mistled]

Exactly, the absurdity is that I can't state my beliefs without being called a bigot, but the person calling me a bigot can, even though his comment is slander because it specifically attacks me, but my statements are simply a statement of what I believe to be true; directed toards an action and not at any person in particular.


MrVicchio is the man... why do you think he joined {BOHICA}

[mistled]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
its wrong to force those on other and attack there beleifs . get your head out of your ass learn the difference. No one tried to force their opinion on anyone. That's like saying that Pepsi is forcing me to drink Pepsi by telling me to in an ad. That's ludicrous. Get your head out of your ass and learn the difference.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio

ANY WAY:

Whats absurd is that a Homosexual can frely promote his beliefs, but if someone is offended by them and promotes why they feel such a choice of lifestyles is wrong.. they are offending people and promoting hate speech.
A homesexuals beliefs are not founded on hate. A homosexual hater's beliefs are founded on hate. Do you see the difference.

I am definately not for creating a social environment where hate is a family value.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by {BOHICA}mistled
Exactly, the absurdity is that I can't state my beliefs without being called a bigot, but the person calling me a bigot can, even though his comment is slander because it specifically attacks me, but my statements are simply a statement of what I believe to be true; directed toards an action and not at any person in particular.


I have no right to punch you. But if you swing at me I have the right to defend myself and I have the right to sue you for assaulting me.

[archaic1128]

"Its right to have beleifs its wrong to force those on other and attack there beleifs . get your head out of your ass learn the difference."

But it's ok for a person that believes in that life style to force his/her opinions on us? Talk about hipocracy in it's finest form.

You are obviously offended that someone who believes in the Bible posted an add containing scripture.

As far as that add attacking anyone, i don't recall the add mentioning any names of people who were personally attacked.

P.S. Vic, lets hope it's sooner than later.

[ABRAXAAS]

Listen to what your saying its completely different ones is saying its ok to be gay the other is threataning them .

look at the difference the 1st one is an example of free speech they say its ok to be gay ,there not attacking streight people there not saying streight people should be gay or they deserve to die.

the 2nd is saying being gay is wrong and they deserve to die that is a flat out attack and that crosses the line from free speech to hate literature ,wich is wrong .

look at it like this if I say I dont belive in judisim thats (freedom of speech) if I say Judism is wrong and **** deserve to be killed then I just crossed that line . its a simple thing just because my name is ABBRAXAAS doesnt mean I cant make sence ones in a while

[mistled]

Ah, there's the problem. Why is it that whenever someone doesn't agree with a person's actions, they hate them?? I don't hate gays. I just don't believe in homosexuality. I also don't believe in premarital sex. According to the view presented here, I must hate millions of people in the US. I don't. Just because I disagree with something doesn't mean I hate the person. People aren't that shallow.

[ABRAXAAS]

holly fuck im not talking about you im reffering to the article
:mad:

[Denali]

People are surprised that the bible is laced with anti-gay messages? C'mon. Look at Saddam and Gamhorra (sp). Look at a million other examples of gay=sin. Does that mean everyone should be killed?? It also mentions something about "Thou shall not kill" somewhere in there, people like to skip over that part of the bible :) So the bible does not say "gay people suck, go kill them all" but to me implies that you will be judged when you die, and being gay isn't going to help your cause. The fact that people are surprised that the bible is anti-gay is beyond me...the stupidity of the public never ceases to amaze :)

[mistled]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
I have no right to punch you. But if you swing at me I have the right to defend myself and I have the right to sue you for assaulting me. No one assaulted them. Quit trying to act like saying that I disagree with something someone does is the same as my assaulting them. I disagree with almost everything you type, but you aren't going to sue me for it are you??

[afex]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
A homesexuals beliefs are not founded on hate. A homosexual hater's beliefs are founded on hate. Do you see the difference.

I am definately not for creating a social environment where hate is a family value.

basing your opinions on the actions of radicals is always a good way to have an intelligent discussion. :rolleyes:

if i went out right now and held a "its not ok to be gay" parade, i'd probably get sued/fined. chew on that one next time you see the gay parade on TV.

[archaic1128]

Mistled,
That's exactly my point, did this guy state "I hate gays because of these passages in the Bible"? NO, this is why it's absurd, he quoted scripture and got sued for hate. I don't see anywhere this guy openly stated he hates homosexuals.

[mistled]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
holly fuck im not talking about you im reffering to the article
:mad: chill, I was replying to Lex with that post. You just happened to reply while I was typing. :)

[ABRAXAAS]

Originally posted by {BOHICA}mistled
chill, I was replying to Lex with that post. You just happened to reply while I was typing. :)

ok sorry :D

[Zatrais]

How can you draw a connection between thinking someones lifeset is wrong and hating them? Hate is a pretty damn strong word, well least it used to be.. seems like hate isn't annything more than what dislike used to be these days.

If i say i think islam is a bad religion whit the wrong values, i automaticly hate muslims?

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
But those same people of the GLBT community can freely post "ITS OKAY TO BE GAY!" Which offends a large number of people?

Absurd.

Do you really believe that people don't have a right to their own sexual preferance?

Do you also believe that homosexuals deserve freedom from harrasment. I don't see homosexuals launching anti-heterosexual campaigns.

BTW it is ok to be gay. They are not hurting anyone. If they are not hurting anything, not damaging society and not infringing on the freedoms of others why shouldn't it be illegal to harass them?

[ABRAXAAS]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Mistled,
That's exactly my point, did this guy state "I hate gays because of these passages in the Bible"? NO, this is why it's absurd, he quoted scripture and got sued for hate. I don't see anywhere this guy openly stated he hates homosexuals.

Ok come on your telling me that if I post a nazi war rally speech stating that **** deserve to die that since these are not my words I cant be held responsible . he sure as hell didnt post that stuff not believing in it .

[mistled]

Originally posted by Zatrais
If i say i think islam is a bad religion whit the wrong values, i automaticly hate muslims? I wouldn't say it too loudly it you do, you might get sued. ;)

[archaic1128]

Assbraxus,
Did you ever stop to think maybe this guy was doing what the bible tells him he should do? That being go out and proclaim the word of god, teach people their wrong doings, try to convert the willing etc. So basically what your stating is it's OK to sue someone for religuos beliefs, no?

[ABRAXAAS]

Yes Im saying its ok to sue someone for there religious beleifs if there forcing it on others ,its that line again once you cross over from your beleifs to the world of forcing those beleifs on someone it becomes a bad thing .

[mistled]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
Ok come on your telling me that if I post a nazi war rally speech stating that **** deserve to die that since these are not my words I cant be held responsible . he sure as hell didnt post that stuff not believing in it . If you want to get down to it, the thing the guy ran only had references to it. I don't know about the rest of you, but if I see something like that that is obviously against something I believe (like if it was the US flag crossed out), I wouldn't go look at the references. What are these guys doing, looking to get pissed off??

Also, aren't these references about Levitical law?? This is like my breaking out Hammurabi's Code and getting bitched at because someone doesn't agree with one of the laws in it. The guy doesn't seem to be pushing for homosexuality to be made illegal, even though he might believe that it should.

I think the whole point of this thread was to point out the hypocracy in the fact that if someone thinks that homosexuality is wrong, they evil, but the people who think they are evil are just fine.

[mistled]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
Yes Im saying its ok to sue someone for there religious beleifs if there forcing it on others ,its that line again once you cross over from your beleifs to the world of forcing those beleifs on someone it becomes a bad thing . You still haven't said how this is anymore forcing of beliefs on someone than any other advertisment.

[ABRAXAAS]

Im over exagerating to prove my point here.

basically . Beliefs in anything (ok)

using your beleifs to attack someone (bad)

its easy :D

[archaic1128]

Please explain to me where and how he is forcing his religous beliefs on the homosexual community. I just don't see where he is FORCING his beliefs. It's kinda like posts in this forum, if you don't like the topic don't read or respond. Noone can force you to follow their beliefs unless you are willing to follow, period.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by {BOHICA}mistled
No one assaulted them. Quit trying to act like saying that I disagree with something someone does is the same as my assaulting them. I disagree with almost everything you type, but you aren't going to sue me for it are you??
First off that comment is out of context. I was responding to your scenario of someone calling you a bigot for your views.

If I say that being Christian is an immoral lifestyle I should expect to be attacked. That is directly assaulting Christians. If I made such comments I would not get away with it. I would bet that no major newspaper would allow me to run an ad that had a big picture of a cross with a big red slash through it.

[ABRAXAAS]

he's not forcing his religious beliefs on them hes using his beleifs to publicly attack gay people . and its wrong .

[mistled]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
I would bet that no major newspaper would allow me to run an ad that had a big picture of a cross with a big red slash through it. But if you did, I don't think anyone should be allowed to sue you for it. They would get pissed, of course, but that should be all. I do try to play by the same rules for everyone. While neither his ad nor the one with the cross with a slash over it would be in good taste, I don't think that people should be sued over either one.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by afex
basing your opinions on the actions of radicals is always a good way to have an intelligent discussion. :rolleyes:

if i went out right now and held a "its not ok to be gay" parade, i'd probably get sued/fined. chew on that one next time you see the gay parade on TV.

Holding a parade without the propper permits will get you fined and an "its not ok to be gay" parade would be less likely to be aproved by a city.

One promotes hate and the other does not.

You would probably get aproval for holding a "hereosexual pride" parade. You don't see gays holding "its not ok to be heterosexual" parades.

[MrVicchio]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
A homesexuals beliefs are not founded on hate. A homosexual hater's beliefs are founded on hate. Do you see the difference.

I am definately not for creating a social environment where hate is a family value.

Ahh equating religious belife with hate. And hwo did you arrive at that conclusion? "A man should not lie with another man as he would a woman" Damn thats is hate speech!

[Bighoss]

its easiest put this way. In our retarded society anything that isn't sugar coated is considered offensive, racist, and insulting.

I say we need to eat more soup and gravy. Everyone was a lot tougher then:D these kind of discussions didn't exist.

[archaic1128]

"he's not forcing his religious beliefs on them hes using his beleifs to publicly attack gay people . and its wrong ."

Ok, where does he personally attack someone? Did this guy physically attack someone for their lifestyle? Did this guy personally attack a "named person"? Did this guy state HE was going to kill them? I believe the answer is NO.

My point being that if someone or a group is allowed to sue for having read something that hurts their feelings there would be no end in the lawsuits. It's ridiculous that a court would even allow someone to be sued for hurting anothers feelings. Physically attacking someone or threating someone is a different issue entirely.

[Bighoss]

well put

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Assbraxus,
Did you ever stop to think maybe this guy was doing what the bible tells him he should do? That being go out and proclaim the word of god, teach people their wrong doings, try to convert the willing etc. So basically what your stating is it's OK to sue someone for religuos beliefs, no?

I could also quote verses in the bible that would suggeest tolerance of people with different lifestyles.

Picking and choosing what you wish to ignore for your own adjenda is not necessarily justified.

The bible says that slavery is ok. Would this guy be in the right for enslaving someone? Would that not also be following his religious beliefs?

The moment your beliefs are effecting other people your religious freedom changes.

This guy has every right to hate gays and believe what he wants. He does not have the right to publish an ad that promotes hatred in the community.

[Bighoss]

I think its funny that if a guy walked down the street wearing a pink thong and written on his back with black marker it said "GAY AND PROUD" he would be cheered but if a guy walked down the street dressed casually and had a sign saying "Hetero and proud" he would be considered evil.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by {BOHICA}mistled
If you want to get down to it, the thing the guy ran only had references to it. I don't know about the rest of you, but if I see something like that that is obviously against something I believe (like if it was the US flag crossed out), I wouldn't go look at the references. What are these guys doing, looking to get pissed off??
Publishing an add that promotes hatred of gays is not socially acceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred of Muslims is unacceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred Christians is also unaceptable.

We are not trying to create an environment that promotes hatred.

[archaic1128]

Ok Lex,
This is where you get it wrong. Tolerance is part of the christian community. Yes God tells us to tolerate different lifestyles.
Now please show me where this guy publicly states he HATES homosexuals. I believe this ad simply states Gods beliefs and Gods rule. So to be politically correct for you immoral liberals the homosexual community should be sueing God as he is the one who threatens to kill homosexuals.

[ABRAXAAS]

Im done .

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Please explain to me where and how he is forcing his religous beliefs on the homosexual community. I just don't see where he is FORCING his beliefs. It's kinda like posts in this forum, if you don't like the topic don't read or respond. Noone can force you to follow their beliefs unless you are willing to follow, period.

Children under the age of 13 might see the ad and have their opinions swayed. Their thinking will be hey, this is in a newspaper so it must be true. Not everyone in society has the ability to make up their own mind.

[Bighoss]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Publishing an add that promotes hatred of gays is not socially acceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred of Muslims is unacceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred Christians is also unaceptable.

We are not trying to create an environment that promotes hatred.

this south african guy expained to me once that people don't hate other cultures and races because they really hate them. Its that they are like another tribe who they are no use to and don't like. Hate is instinctual and it will never go away.

[afex]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
Im done .

you were done before you first posted in this thread :lol:

[afex]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Publishing an add that promotes hatred of gays is not socially acceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred of Muslims is unacceptable.

Publishing an ad that promotes the hatred Christians is also unaceptable.

We are not trying to create an environment that promotes hatred.

NEWSFLASH!

nobody is promoting hate. we're promoting our opinion which happens to be the opposite of theirs. almost everybodies arguement here is that it is "hate" literature, and promoting "hate" is wrong.

where's the hate?

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Ok Lex,
This is where you get it wrong. Tolerance is part of the christian community. Yes God tells us to tolerate different lifestyles.
Now please show me where this guy publicly states he HATES homosexuals. I believe this ad simply states Gods beliefs and Gods rule. So to be politically correct for you immoral liberals the homosexual community should be sueing God as he is the one who threatens to kill homosexuals.

This guy did not reference any scripture about tolerance. He posted scripture that referenced intolerance.

The message the ad reads (to anyone not thouroughly farmilliar with the bible) is that Christianity is intolerant of gays.

So someone who was raised to beleive that Christianity is right, but did not thoroughly investigate the bible, will get the impression that they are justified in actively being intollerant of gays.

Posting out of context Bilble quotes is a dangerous weapon and should be checked.

Saying that these lines are rules straight out of God's mouth is posting out of context. If you are not farmilliar with historical bible research, you don't realize that the bible was written by humans who were divinely inspired. Humans are not perfect and may misinterpret or include their own political adjendas. The bible has also gone through many translations. I wonder if this guy uses electricity on the Sabbath. Isn't that breaking one of gods rules? Or do we think some of "God's rules" are outdated?

The Bible has been used to promote many evil adjendas. Just because they are quoting scripture does not mean it is acceptable. Context is very important.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by afex
NEWSFLASH!

nobody is promoting hate. we're promoting our opinion which happens to be the opposite of theirs. almost everybodies arguement here is that it is "hate" literature, and promoting "hate" is wrong.

where's the hate?
I am sorry but you are wrong. A "Homosexuality is not ok" parade would promote hatred of homosexuality and homosexuals.

That is alot like saying that the KKK does not promote hate. In theory it doesn't, in reality it does. Promoting intolerance promotes hate.

NEWSFLASH!
We aren't living in a theoretical fantasy land. We live in Reality. Promoting intolerance of gays promotes hatred of gays.

[ABRAXAAS]

Originally posted by afex
you were done before you first posted in this thread :lol:

FUCK YOU, YOU LITTLE BITCH !! im sick of you done fucks on this board so many fuckin baby's and religious americans thinking your so fuckin ritious. YOUR A FUCKIN BITCH!

Thats it im done with this website and FUCK ALL OF YOU! that have done nothing but critisize me since ive been here.

I do not need this websites aproval to play planetside nor do I need the aproval of any of you .


To the staff: You have a great site its just to bad its filled with FUCKIN IDIOTS!!


:mad:

[mistled]

:huh: whoa... uh... wha?? you need a hug?? :hug:

[MrVicchio]

Anything that does not Promote the Liberal Ideals of Life are hate speech

Anything that is not Pro-Gay is Hate speech.

Lex, that sums up your point.

My point, the one that irked me, was that you can say "Yes to Gay Life" But you cant say "No to Gay Life"

Disagreement based on religious beliefs is not hate. If disagreement is hate, then the world must be a hateful place to you.

[Lexington_Steele]

Plain and simple, if more of the anti-gay lifestyle sentiment was presented in society, would hate crimes on gays go up?

[afex]

Originally posted by ABRAXAAS
FUCK YOU, YOU LITTLE BITCH !! im sick of you done fucks on this board so many fuckin baby's and religious americans thinking your so fuckin ritious. YOUR A FUCKIN BITCH!

Thats it im done with this website and FUCK ALL OF YOU! that have done nothing but critisize me since ive been here.

I do not need this websites aproval to play planetside nor do I need the aproval of any of you .


To the staff: You have a great site its just to bad its filled with FUCKIN IDIOTS!!


:mad:

i guess i offended him with my hate speech? :confused:

[mistled]

Oh, I don't know... there are a lot of people hating the french right now and I haven't seen any reports of violence against the french yet... just people talking about it

[MrVicchio]

So, for fear of "hate" crimes, those of us offended by the Gay Life style must be silenced for FEAR of inciting hate crimes??

Please, what is a hate crime?

Two brothers in Kansas killed 5 people and nearly a 6th.

the people were forced to have sex with each other, oncluding same sex, were raped then shot, execution style in a field.

One group was white, the other black, yet no hate crime filed.

Hate Crimes are bogus BS.

[Navaron]

Seems to me that nowadays, it's "hip" to go against the moral grain. It's nothing new. You've just got the children of hippies living up to their parents expectations. However, when a moral person comes against something immoral, then they are "the Man" whose close minded and evil. People like to rebel, we live in a society with no real problems, so we make them up. The we fight our windmills, and we sleep better at night. It's nothing new.

[MrVicchio]

BTW I DONT CARE if you are gay, stra8 a pre- or post-op TS, lesbian or whatever.. YOUR LIFE.. just don't tell me I HAVE to accept it, but then accuse me of hate when I say no, I dont have to accept it.

[archaic1128]

Romans 1:,
Is to long to post, but merely reflects how Roman is trying to show the non believers God's way. I assume the guy used this passage is to show the homosexual community that their are living in sin and these passages reflect Gods word.

Leviticus 18:22, You shall not lie w/ a male as you would a woman; it is an abomination.

20:13, If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have commited an abomination; they shall be put to death, their blood is upon them.

Corinthians 6:9-10, Do you not know that the unrightous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor theives, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.


Now, in Lectivus 20:13 They shall be put to death literally means God is dooming them to eternal damnation. As you can see in the following passage, will not inherit the kingom of God. It does not state that we should go out and kill homosexuals. Where does any of this show HATE? Please get a grip. Am i going to get sued now,LOL?
:love:

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
Please, what is a hate crime?


In the context of this discussion, violence against gays becays of their sexual preference.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
BTW I DONT CARE if you are gay, stra8 a pre- or post-op TS, lesbian or whatever.. YOUR LIFE.. just don't tell me I HAVE to accept it, but then accuse me of hate when I say no, I dont have to accept it.

You are fine not accepting it. It is not fine when you go on a campaign against it.

[archaic1128]

Lex,
Where in this guys ad or in my scriptures that were posted do you see VIOLENCE? Ther is no violence, just moral people disagreeing w/ the homosexual lifestyle. Oh thats right were forcing our veiws and our lifestyle on the homosexual community by disagreeing w/ it.

[Arshune]

I'm not going to get in on this argument, but I'm going to say one thing...most educated Christians know that the Bible was written by men and is therefore not necessarily the accurate word of God. Unless it's a direct quotation of Jesus or it's the 10 commandments, don't listen to it.

Edit: And even the 10 commandments can't be proven to be the word of God, they're just 10 simple rules that make you a better person.

[mistled]

So when political candidates have entire campaigns around how wrong their opponents are, they should be sued??

[mistled]

Originally posted by Arshune
I'm not going to get in on this argument, but I'm going to say one thing...any TRUE Christian knows that the Bible was written by men and is therefore not the accurate word of God. Unless it's a direct quotation of Jesus or it's the 10 commandments, don't listen to it. Please don't talk about 'true' christians with stupid comments like that, ya troll.

[archaic1128]

"I'm not going to get in on this argument, but I'm going to say one thing...any TRUE Christian knows that the Bible was written by men and is therefore not the accurate word of God. Unless it's a direct quotation of Jesus or it's the 10 commandments, don't listen to it."

Oh i get it, now i'm not a TRUE christian? give me a break .

[Arshune]

Alright, fine...the word true was a poor choice. But still, a book that is several thousand years old isn't the best place to get ideas to apply to the modern world is all I'm saying.

[Navaron]

You're gonna aquire a "troll" status quickly if you don't start finishing those sentences with IMO.

[archaic1128]

Oh i see, so what you're saying is God's word gets antiquated? It doesn't apply to todays world? what the hell are you talking about?

[archaic1128]

BTW, i'm still waiting for Lex to show me where in those passages shows hatred. As i cannot see hatred in them. Please include why the guy deserved to get sued for posting those passages, thx.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Lex,
Where in this guys ad or in my scriptures that were posted do you see VIOLENCE? Ther is no violence, just moral people disagreeing w/ the homosexual lifestyle. Oh thats right were forcing our veiws and our lifestyle on the homosexual community by disagreeing w/ it.

Hate crimes on gays exist. (even Mr V would like to beleive that they don't)

Creating an environment that is more intolerant of gays would increase the number of hate crimes on gays.

Allowing anti-gay advertisement would add to creating an environment that is intolerant of gays.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Oh i see, so what you're saying is God's word gets antiquated? It doesn't apply to todays world? what the hell are you talking about?

Do you use electricity on the sabbath?

[Arshune]

archaic1128-I'm saying that those aren't really God's words (IMO). The Bible is still a book, regardless of its religious significance, and someone had to sit down and write it. God didn't just open up a celestial printing press and start dropping them down among the populace.

I'm not a Christian, but I used to be. One of the reasons I dropped it was the Bible. Another was the common belief among christian doctrines that going to church every Sunday somehow makes you a better person and more worthy of getting into heaven. There's a lot of crazy garbage in the Bible, there's even a passage that says if a woman is having her period and she touches a man, that man is stained with sin for several days.

Don't yell at me for expressing an opinion in a thread that's mostly about just that-opinion.

[archaic1128]

Yes, i do. What the Sabbath is meant for is for one to not WORK, take time to reflect on ones life, spend time w/ loved ones etc. It does not in any way reflect upon the use of electricty.

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Children under the age of 13 might see the ad and have their opinions swayed. Their thinking will be hey, this is in a newspaper so it must be true. Not everyone in society has the ability to make up their own mind.

Holy crap. That is what I thought when I read this.

Lex, you are saying that it should be illeagal to try to sway someone's opinion by exposing them to a thought. You would have free speach baned from all places if you truely belive what you wrote. Think about it a little.

This thread is not about weather homosexuality right or wrong. It is about people no longer being able to express themselves freely without fear of being sued/arrested. A hate crime is a punishment for a thought. Thoughts should not be punished, only actions. A person hateing another group should be used as a motive in their conviction, but when we start punishing thought, we begin down a path of oppresion and totalitarianism. One step at a time, the govornment gains dictation on acceptable thought.

Sometimes I wish I could find I hole to crawl into and hide while the world destroys itself and becomes what it set out to prevent. I understand how the "Savage" in "A Brave new World" fealt now.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by Arshune
I'm not going to get in on this argument, but I'm going to say one thing...any TRUE Christian knows that the Bible was written by men and is therefore not the accurate word of God. Unless it's a direct quotation of Jesus or it's the 10 commandments, don't listen to it.

Edit: And even the 10 commandments can't be proven to be the word of God, they're just 10 simple rules that make you a better person.
"TRUE" is not the right word. But I would say that most educated Chritians understand this.

Unfortunately most Christians are not very educated with regards to Christianity.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
Yes, i do. What the Sabbath is meant for is for one to not WORK, take time to reflect on ones life, spend time w/ loved ones etc. It does not in any way reflect upon the use of electricty.
Do you eat shell fish?

[Arshune]

There, I edited that post...jeez, one little word and everyone complains.

Oh, and FYI to all those who support the Bible as irrefutable and infallible-there are several instances of inconsistency within the text, and there are also several passages that are in direct contradiction of other passages. That's what I'm basing my opinion that the Bible was made by men on.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by SandTrout
Holy crap. That is what I thought when I read this.

Lex, you are saying that it should be illeagal to try to sway someone's opinion by exposing them to a thought. You would have free speach baned from all places if you truely belive what you wrote. Think about it a little.

This thread is not about weather homosexuality right or wrong. It is about people no longer being able to express themselves freely without fear of being sued/arrested. A hate crime is a punishment for a thought. Thoughts should not be punished, only actions. A person hateing another group should be used as a motive in their conviction, but when we start punishing thought, we begin down a path of oppresion and totalitarianism. One step at a time, the govornment gains dictation on acceptable thought.

Why isn't pornography legal for children under the age of 18?

There are just things that we don't want our children to be exposed to. Hate is something I don't want our children to be exposed to.

[archaic1128]

"I'm not a Christian, but I used to be. One of the reasons I dropped it was the Bible. Another was the common belief among christian doctrines that going to church every Sunday somehow makes you a better person and more worthy of getting into heaven. There's a lot of crazy garbage in the Bible, there's even a passage that says if a woman is having her period and she touches a man, that man is stained with sin for several days.

I do not go to church every sunday. I haven't went to church in years. No where in the bible does it state you MUST goto church to be a good christian. Although i have been an altar boy and went to church more in my youth than most people do in a lifetime.

As far as not having sex when a womans time is in, did you ever think of the meaning behind it? Just take a look at diseases and how they are spread, think about that for a bit.

As far as yelling at you i did not mean it that way. I was utterly shocked that you would state only a true christian believes that the Bible is just a fairytale.

[Arshune]

No no no no, I mean it actually says if she so much as touches the man, he's considered stained. That strikes me as being a little crazy.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by {BOHICA}Navaron
You're gonna aquire a "troll" status quickly if you don't start finishing those sentences with IMO.
You are going to aquire troll status if you keep attacking arshune and not arshunes argument. This is the second thread you have done it in.

[archaic1128]

Arshune, that is my belief of the context. I highly doubt it means the feeling of a woman. "Stained" if you think about it, when you have sex w/ a woman during her time, you do get stained. Blood to Blood contact, a way for most lethal diseases to communicate.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by Arshune
There, I edited that post...jeez, one little word and everyone complains.

Oh, and FYI to all those who support the Bible as irrefutable and infallible-there are several instances of inconsistency within the text, and there are also several passages that are in direct contradiction of other passages. That's what I'm basing my opinion that the Bible was made by men on.
BTW I was agreeing with your post. I just didn't like the word true thrown in there.

[archaic1128]

"Oh, and FYI to all those who support the Bible as irrefutable and infallible-there are several instances of inconsistency within the text, and there are also several passages that are in direct contradiction of other passages. That's what I'm basing my opinion that the Bible was made by men on."

Please feel free to enlighten me.

[MrVicchio]

Lex,

Chew on this, after 9/11 there was NO RISE in hate crimes against Muslims.

So lets see, an attack of that magnitutude produced NO RISE IN HATE CRIMES.

Yet the objection to the gay lifestyle MIGHT thus we cannot allow it.

Your logic is flawed, baseless and unfounded, no, its founded in fear, and the use of that said fear to curb the free speech of those that disagree with you and your beliefs. That is reprehensible.

[afex]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Why isn't pornography legal for children under the age of 18?

There are just things that we don't want our children to be exposed to. Hate is something I don't want our children to be exposed to.

this discussion would probably go a little smoother for you if you would talk about the subject at hand rather than continuously bringing up your own little arguement about hate. you're the only one talking about it here.

we're all talking about hypocrasy and free speech.

[MrVicchio]

Okay, as for the Bible,

Yes, it is nopt perfect, it has some flaws... induced by man. That is a given.


There are FAR more flaws with following the tenents of secular humanism then follwoing the Bible.

[Arshune]

archaic-Well, for starters...in the very beginning the story of Adam and Eve contradicts the events laid out with the story of how God created the world. There's some more in there too, I just don't remember exactly what and where they are.

Also, wasn't this argument about a Canadian court decision? Canada has far different free speech laws than the United States, and as ridiculous as they are, that's how they do things up north.

[archaic1128]

I'm still waiting for Lex to enlighten me as to where he sees hate in those passages and as to why the man deserved to get sued for a hate crime.

[Arshune]

I don't think it's necessarily the passages themselves that are hateful, it's just the way the guy used them.

[MrVicchio]

Originally posted by archaic1128
I'm still waiting for Lex to enlighten me as to where he sees hate in those passages and as to why the man deserved to get sued for a hate crime.

Because they MIGHT cause SOMEBODY to get angry next time they saw two men holding hands aand then he MIGHT think about doing SOMETHING to them.

That is not allowed in his view of the world.

[Unregistered]

The bible was written by men and no one, not even the pope will deny that fact.

First off to give a little insight into Christanity, and some of the more apualing things in the bible you have to understand that it is not One Book. It's not even 2 Books. It is a colection of many, many books.

First off you have the Old Testament, which most of the Jewish Faith is based on. There are many, many, strict religous rules that stem from the old testement including the one about Woman that you keep brining up.

No joke, God was one fucked up prick back in those days. He'd lay waste to entire cities with fire and brimstone if you pissed him off, and if that didn't work he'd just flood the whole planet.

Enter Jesus & The New Testament

God, getting sick and tired of kicking our asses sends his kid down here to talk some sence into us. A long the way he forms up Religous Cult of 12 guys and they go out preching the Word of the Lord. (Much of the New Testament is written by the Aposoltes, that's why they say "A reading from the book of John"). Well most people didn't like him chalenging established Roman religion so they killed him.

The Aposletes wrote wrote of Jesus' teaching after his death, and they were later collected into what we know as the bible.

The important thing to keep in mind is that Nonthing from the Old Testament holds true After the Death of Christ. His last words of "Forgive them for they know not what they do" spared the earth from another flood, or worse.

So anyone that wants to hate on the bible or point out it's contriditions should keep in mind that the things layed out in the Old Testement have no berring on the New Testament.

In short:

God = Grumpy Old Prick that will turn you into a pillar of salt if you cross him, and don't even think about worshiping that Golden Cow!

Jesus = Peace Loving Hippie son of God. Took over the Family bussiness of running the earth, got killed for it, forgave us all and now him and the old man keep to them selves unless you go looking for them.

It's really that easy.



[Now to start a new topic about Free Speech vs Hate]

[archaic1128]

"I don't think it's necessarily the passages themselves that are hateful, it's just the way the guy used them."

Hmm, i beleive the guy just posted the scriptures with passage number and a picture of 2 guys holding hands w/ a circle and slash. So if the passages aren't the offensive part then that means the graphics after them was the offensive part......interesting but i still don't see why that is considered a hate crime.

[Navaron]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
You are going to aquire troll status if you keep attacking arshune and not arshunes argument. This is the second thread you have done it in.

Bite me Lex. I was staying out of the arguement. I was also giving him advice, cause he just got lit up for that True thing. IMO is a free ticket. Can you hear me down here? Or should I shout so it reaches your perch?

[Navaron]

Unreg, that was the most interesting interpretation of the bible I have ever seen. I'm not even disagreeing with it. Ha.

Yep, it's also why **** don't eat pork. Old testament.

[Bighoss]

Originally posted by Unregistered

No joke, God was one fucked up prick back in those days. He'd lay waste to entire cities with fire and brimstone if you pissed him off, and if that didn't work he'd just flood the whole planet.

God, getting sick and tired of kicking our asses sends his kid down here to talk some sence into us. A long the way he forms up Religous Cult of 12 guys and they go out preching the Word of the Lord


I like this god fellow:twisted:

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Why isn't pornography legal for children under the age of 18?

There are just things that we don't want our children to be exposed to. Hate is something I don't want our children to be exposed to.

That law is hardly enforced because of the anominity of the internet, and pornography is hardly a form of speach. Pornography is suposedly an "art" and is not saying anything in particular other than "beat your meat".

However, the thought of pornography and sex is not banned for people under 18. There is a "Man Boy Love" association that supports relationships between men and under-aged boys, but it is protected by free speech because it doesn't have pornography on it.

This supports my point that only actions and some items can be made illeagal, but not thoughts.

[mistled]

Lex, if you want to see hate, you only have to look to this forum's view on Christianity. I have never once seen you defend it from attack, so please don't act like you are simply standing against hate. People on this thread are standing against a man who stated his view in print because he claims to be a Christian. If he was muslim, all that would have said is that it happened in Canada and their laws are different.



This thread is not even about Christianity. This thread is about a court deciding that someone placing their view in print can be considered a hate crime. Nothing more, nothing less. Now why don't you all go elsewhere and quit assaulting Christians (since that's what you see stating an opinion as, assault) for thinking differently that you do.

- mistled

[archaic1128]

Unreg,
Very nicely stated, took the words right outta my mouth- except the prick part :)

The problem is people, who have not studied the bible or it's meaning both new and old, just don't realize how easy it is.
They would rather hate, ban and teach us how we are wrong.

Ohhh lex, where ya hiding? I would like an answer to those passages, please.

[Unregistered]

I have an intersting take on religion to say the least. The thing that I have always found to be the most interesting is that the big 3 (****, Christians, Muslims) all beleave in the Same God. They just dissagree on when he stoped talking to us.

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Unregistered
I have an intersting take on religion to say the least. The thing that I have always found to be the most interesting is that the big 3 (****, Christians, Muslims) all beleave in the Same God. They just dissagree on when he stoped talking to us.
:stupid: Thats why I think we're here for God's entertainment.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
Lex,

Chew on this, after 9/11 there was NO RISE in hate crimes against Muslims.

So lets see, an attack of that magnitutude produced NO RISE IN HATE CRIMES.

Yet the objection to the gay lifestyle MIGHT thus we cannot allow it.

Your logic is flawed, baseless and unfounded, no, its founded in fear, and the use of that said fear to curb the free speech of those that disagree with you and your beliefs. That is reprehensible.
My logic is not flawed and it follows a clear outline.

And btw, hate crimes on Muslime did go up after september 11th.

The fact that you want to ignore a social problem is reprehensible.

[Navaron]

/clank - - Court is adjourned, judgement has been passed, all rise..........

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by afex
this discussion would probably go a little smoother for you if you would talk about the subject at hand rather than continuously bringing up your own little arguement about hate. you're the only one talking about it here.

we're all talking about hypocrasy and free speech.
Obviously there is the free speech issue here.

However there are time and reasons why this is not a universal freedom. You do not have the freedom to scream fire in a crowded building. You do not have the freedome to openly make threats on the president. There are ratings on movies so that children can not get in. There are curse words and nudity that are censored on television.

You do not have the freedom to say whatever you want, whenever you want, in whatever medium you want. Your freedom of speech is very often limited because it is felt to have an advese effect on society.

Here, there is a reason that the ad should have been censored. There is a reason that the freedom of speech was suspended. The reason here is that it promotes the hatred of the gay life style.

I appologise if the connection to hatered is beyond you.

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
The fact that you want to ignore a social problem is reprehensible.

Who determines what is a social problem, and who says that we are ignoreing it. Just because you consider something a social problem doesn't mean you can force your view on other people. That is what "Hate Crime" laws are there for. Not to punish crimes, but to threaten someone to not speak up against you.

Our possition is that trying to force someone to believe something is wrong, even if we disagree with the person. We will try to convice the person that he/she is wrong, but we wont sue them because we disagree.

I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to say it with my life.I think it goes something like that.

[Lexington_Steele]

Sandy sandy sandy. You do not have the right to say whatever you want in the US. It is plain and simple.

[Arshune]

That's true, if you were to say something like "I'm gonna kill the president" they can arrest you for it.

[archaic1128]

"I appologise if the connection to hatered is beyond you."

Lex, please explain to me what part of this guys ad was worthy of a hate crime? What part of this ad is promoting "hatred" towards homosexuals? Is it the scriptures or the graphics after them that promote this so called "hatred"?

Being offensive is not a hate crime. I get offended everyday by something i see or read, but i don't run to the nearest attorney suing someone for it.

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Sandy sandy sandy. You do not have the right to say whatever you want in the US. It is plain and simple.

That will be true very soon, but it is not quite yet. I am against is blatent erosion of our rights, and if it gets byond a certain point, I sudgest that we consider the govornment unlawful and move to put mor competent leaders in its place.

Just accepting it will not make it better, it will only goad them to do more, faster. If you try to keep me from saying what I believe, you had better be ready for my violent reaction.

As for saying "I'm going to kill the president," that is a threat, and you are admiting that you will make an atempt on the president's life. This article, however, is saying that god is against homosexuality, not that the guy is going to go hunting for homos. There is a big diference there.

Lex, you wouldn't happen to be a member of the commmunist party, would you? You can tell the truth, the right of free speech that you denounce protects you.

[Lexington_Steele]

Lex, please explain to me what part of this guys ad was worthy of a hate crime? What part of this ad is promoting "hatred" towards homosexuals? Is it the scriptures or the graphics after them that promote this so called "hatred"?

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Hate crimes on gays exist. (even Mr V would like to beleive that they don't)

Creating an environment that is more intolerant of gays would increase the number of hate crimes on gays.

Allowing anti-gay advertisement would add to creating an environment that is intolerant of gays.

[Navaron]

Do anti drug comercials create more druggie beatings? I think not.

[BaD]

Anyone can look in the bible and fdin lots of individual things that say this and that. Personally i grew up the grandson of a minister so yes i went to church but that was so long ago...i dont remember much. People cry out and fight out against gays every other day and they quote the bible...but i dont see anyone quoting the bible fighting murder...fighting premarital sex.

People judge gays just like the the bible says not to do, doesnt the bible also say somewhere in there that all sins are equal? So isnt a man who judges and hates a gay person just as damned as the person he curses for his way of life?

Personally i was offended by that guys article, it says "hey if your gay you deserve to die" why? because im different?

These days everyone talks about religion, they talk about god and respect and everyone elses point of views. To me all religion is the same, there might be differences in teachings and books, but to me there is something out there, greater than us, waiting for us. Am i a christian? no, but i believe some of the same things. Am i a muslim? no, but i believe in some of the same things as they do. How could any one religion be the truth? so many out there, everyone screaming that youll burn in hell if you dont follow us lol.

We'll be judged in due time by god, judged by the people we met and the way we treated people. Someone who hates, i wont judge them, ill just not respect them, but just because someone is gay, that doesnt make me not respect them. Oh well, this is my babble, if only it was in real life and not some forum, public speaking is one of my favorite things to do.

AuTo|BaD

[archaic1128]

Using Lex's theory-Allowing pro-same sex gatherings or ads will increase the sentiment towards people who don't believe in it as well.

Therefore, such outings/ads should be considered hate crimes, give me a break. You'll need to come up w/ something better than that lame excuse.

[SandTrout]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Hate crimes on gays exist. (even Mr V would like to beleive that they don't)

Creating an environment that is more intolerant of gays would increase the number of hate crimes on gays.

Allowing anti-gay advertisement would add to creating an environment that is intolerant of gays.

That's a very nice theory, but reality doesn't always fit a theory. We can decide what is right and wrong from our own viewpoint, but when you try to force(not convince) others into following your beleif, then you are infringeing on their rights.

Then again, you don't value rights, do you Lex? You just want everything to follow your code of right and wrong and ban anyone who disagrees.

You're the reason we have the first amendment, otherwise the Gov. would allready be arresting people that disagree with it's politics(seen with the "Red Scare", but was ended with a Supream Court ruleing)

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by SandTrout
That will be true very soon, but it is not quite yet. I am against is blatent erosion of our rights, and if it gets byond a certain point, I sudgest that we consider the govornment unlawful and move to put mor competent leaders in its place.

Just accepting it will not make it better, it will only goad them to do more, faster. If you try to keep me from saying what I believe, you had better be ready for my violent reaction.

As for saying "I'm going to kill the president," that is a threat, and you are admiting that you will make an atempt on the president's life. This article, however, is saying that god is against homosexuality, not that the guy is going to go hunting for homos. There is a big diference there.

Lex, you wouldn't happen to be a member of the commmunist party, would you? You can tell the truth, the right of free speech that you denounce protects you.

Why didin't I have the right to view pornography until the age of 18?

Why is it illegal for me to threaten the president?

Why is it illegal to yell fire in a crowded building?

Why is it illegal to misquote you?

Why can you sue me if I quote you out of context?

Why can you sue me if I openly insult you or your reputation?

Why can't certain words be said on network television?

Why can't nudity be shown on network television?

These are all violations of the right to free speech. Why do they exist?

I am not a communist. Pure communism does not work, just as pure capitalism does not work. I am very much for free speech. I just understand that there are times and places where a freedom of speech is not appropriate.

It is not like this guy can not publish his ad anywhere. There are many mediums that would have picked up the add where he would not have been fined. He picked an inapropriate place to publish it. He can spew his anti gay propoganda until he is blue in the face. There are just some place that he can not publish it.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by SandTrout
Then again, you don't value rights, do you Lex? You just want everything to follow your code of right and wrong and ban anyone who disagrees.
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

You feel murder is wrong and the people who commit murder should be arrested. You feel that stealing is wrong, even if it is the needy who are stealing. You (probably) feel that people who refuse to pay income tax are doing wrong and you would see them arrested.

That is your code of right and wrong and you arrest anyone who disagrees with it. This isn't as simple as more freedoms = a better society.

Until you are living in pure anarchy don't accuse me of valuing my rights any less than you.

[MrVicchio]

Lex, Your logic IS flawed. Please, SHOW US this "increase" in hate crime against muslims.

So far, my google search showed a spike, immediatly after 9/11 and then it dropped ot pre-9/11 levels.

To expect NO backlash after the murder of 3000 americans in the way that occured would be absurd.

That it "spiked" means NOTHING. There was no lasting "backlash"

If a man says "I am Proud and GAY!" good for him.

But if another man were to say "I am Straight and find Homosexuality a sin!" To you, that is inciting hate.

Of course, after reading many of oyur post, I have come to the conclusion that you are an elitist.

You feel only your views, and those that share your views are valid. You make non-sense arguements, such as "Why cant I look at porn before the age of 18?" and "Why cant I threaten the President? Those are violations of my free speech!"

What mularky. Why can't you buy porn till you are 18? Cuase this is a Moral Society. If you want to buy Porn, move to France, they got porn that is banned in most civilized countries.

You claim to be against "inciting hate" Yet you use the line about threatening the President to back your own arguements.

Elitistism is Tyranny by the minorty. You are a wanna be Tyrant.

[MrVicchio]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/02/18/nxeno18.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/02/18/ixnewstop.html/news/2003/02/18/nxeno18.xml

Move to the EU, Lex, if you arent all ready there, they are your kinda people.

[MrVicchio]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele
Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

You feel murder is wrong and the people who commit murder should be arrested. You feel that stealing is wrong, even if it is the needy who are stealing. You (probably) feel that people who refuse to pay income tax are doing wrong and you would see them arrested.

That is your code of right and wrong and you arrest anyone who disagrees with it. This isn't as simple as more freedoms = a better society.

Until you are living in pure anarchy don't accuse me of valuing my rights any less than you.

If a needy person steals... you think it aint a crime?????????? You feel it is Justified???

With freedom comes responisbility, without which society collapses.

[Bighoss]

my fucking god, everyone next stop 1984.

Something has to be done I can't take this !!! Politcal correctness is like new speak in 1984. there are gonna be god damn thought police :eek:.

If somone has a different opinion than the majority they get arrested !

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
If a needy person steals... you think it aint a crime?????????? You feel it is Justified???

With freedom comes responisbility, without which society collapses.
No, I think it is a crime. I was not suggesting that murder should be legal either. I also thing you should pay taxes.

Iwas just stating how there needs to be a ballance of what you are free to do and what you are not free to do.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/02/18/nxeno18.xml&sSheet=/news/2003/02/18/ixnewstop.html/news/2003/02/18/nxeno18.xml

Move to the EU, Lex, if you arent all ready there, they are your kinda people.
You can't get rid of me that easily. ;)

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
Of course, after reading many of oyur post, I have come to the conclusion that you are an elitist.

You feel only your views, and those that share your views are valid. You make non-sense arguements, such as "Why cant I look at porn before the age of 18?" and "Why cant I threaten the President? Those are violations of my free speech!"

What mularky. Why can't you buy porn till you are 18? Cuase this is a Moral Society. If you want to buy Porn, move to France, they got porn that is banned in most civilized countries.

You claim to be against "inciting hate" Yet you use the line about threatening the President to back your own arguements.

Elitistism is Tyranny by the minorty. You are a wanna be Tyrant.
You see not giving teenages pornography as part of a Moral society.

I see not presenting gay bashing to teenagers as part of a Moral society.

I swear that you don't even read my posts:
Just a few posts up you suggested that I though stealing should be legal.

The whole thing with the president, that was giving an example of a time where we should not be allowed the freedom of speech. I fully support the idea that it is illegal to make threats on the president. I stand by the fact that I am against inciting hate.

I do not support making porn for legal for kids to buy. I was giving an example of where it is ok to limit the freedom of speech.

Ahh so you did see the spike in hate crimes against muslims after 9/11. So you do recognise things that events and things that are in the media do effect levels of hate crimes.

Mr Vicchio, if you really want me gone that badly I will never post again. I am not trying to piss you off. I am not trying to upset you. Just say the word and I will leave this forum.

[archaic1128]

"I was giving an example of where it is ok to limit the freedom of speech."

Lex,
Noone here is disagreeing w/ the fact that there are certain limitations to freedom of speech. The fact of the matter is whether this ad is promoting hatred or not.

Personally, i feel the gay community used this as a stepping stone. Whats next, getting sued for protesting a gay parade?
This is a small step towards utter stupidity on the governments part, like it or not.

example: It's ok for anyone to openly condemn a christians beliefs, be it the media or a protest, but it's not ok to condemn the gay community?

example: it's ok for the blacks to have an all black college but it is not ok for the white people to have an all white college, thats racism.

Same thoery, same double standards, same hipocracy..get it?

[Navaron]

Well said.

[Subliminal]

One thing that bothers me about the gay and lesbian (hey nobody complained about them) "communities" are that they have to hold parades and stuff. IMO i thinkt they are shoving their lifestyle and culture in my face and it pisses me off to a certain extant. They make too big of a deal about their sexual preferance and In some ways it draws alot more attention to them (which for some reason i think they like) sadly most of it is negitive attention. Yes society is full of hetrosexual stuff and im sure they think we stick it in their face but (and dont cry when i say this cause i hate PC) too bad so sad most of us have one preference and you will have to deal with it. So basically i think they have the right to do whatever the hell they want but dont come barkin up this tree if I wanna talk about it, i can im an american just like you so if i say something you dont like do the american thing and call me names back :D

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
[B]
Personally, i feel the gay community used this as a stepping stone. Whats next, getting sued for protesting a gay parade?
This is a small step towards utter stupidity on the governments part, like it or not.

Stepping stone to what? Is this a secret gay plot to try and take over the world? ;)

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by archaic1128
[B]example: It's ok for anyone to openly condemn a christians beliefs, be it the media or a protest, but it's not ok to condemn the gay community?

example: it's ok for the blacks to have an all black college but it is not ok for the white people to have an all white college, thats racism.

As far as example one. I don't think it is openly ok to bash christianity either.

As far as the black college thing, I am sure that you could get into a black college. If you apply to a black college and you had credentials above their standards they would be forced to let you in. If you really wanted too, I am sure you could appeal any kind of rejection all the way up to the supreme court.

[archaic1128]

Lex,
I believe you are wrong to a certain degree. First, if my memory serves me correctly someone tried that route and got rejected, all the way up the ladder. I will try to find the info pertaining to it for you.

Second, i don't believe that an all black college is required by law to have a certain percentage of whites or other to meet set standards.

The whole point being is many groups,races etc have played the perverbial double standard to it's fullest to gain acceptance in society. However, when it comes to the groups, races that are against said groups, races, the race or hate issues seem to be in place to favor them. If that makes sence.....

edit- In other words, if you're white anything you say regarding a minority is considered racist. Any crime committed against a minority is considered a hate crime.

Just recently during a AfroFest, some blacks grouped up and ran the streets looking for white people. They were beating on these white people on an average of 15-1, yet this was not considered a hate crime. Mind you they did not attack anyone but white people. Put it the other way around and every white person involved would've been imprisoned for committing a hate crime. This is right?

Again, just another version of hipocracy that the gay community took advantage of by suing this man.

[Ludio]

In the forum of life, the guy who posted that add is a troll.

DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!

:D

[MrVicchio]

Lex,

I Do read your posts, and the point I am trying to make, and the one that keeps slipping over your head, is that for society to work properly, it has to be a two way street.


Archiac and others made it rather clear, if you can say your lifestyle is right, I should be ablke to say its wrong.

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by MrVicchio
I Do read your posts, and the point I am trying to make, and the one that keeps slipping over your head, is that for society to work properly, it has to be a two way street.
Nothing is slipping over my head. You are the one that thinks that ignoring social problems will make them go away.

If I am coming so far out of left field then answer me this; why did the court rule against the guy with the add? Oh, this two way street concept must have been over the judges head too I guess. Is that your argument when anyone disagrees with you? I guess it is easier to just call people stupid than to think about how to address existing social problems.

I am sure the notion, that spreading hate is generally bad for society, is not over your head?

[MrVicchio]

First, its a Canadian court, and they are different then we are.

Secondly, I am not ignoring anything, I never implied such. You see a spike a in mulsim hate crime for a SHORT time after 9/11 and the sky falls, I say, that it's wrong, but understandable.

You see a small precentage of hate crimes against gays, and you think the sky is falling, I say its wrong but people suck.