Wtf did the **** ever do to you?

[Jaged]

I was randomly thinking about world events and came across one question that perplexed me. It seems that every century the **** are taking it up the ass from someone else. In ancient times it was the Egyptians that enslaved them and persecuted them. Then Hitler and the Nazis had a go at the collective Jewish behind. In modern times most of the Arab world and Mel Gibson want the **** dead.

My question is, what the hell did the **** ever do to anyone? Can anyone help me understand why that one ethnic group has been on the receiving end of so many persecutions, genocides and anal rapings through out history?

[Electrofreak]

Kinda funny, I was just talking with my friend about a court case where a bunch of Egyptians sued the **** for taking some artifact of theirs back in the days of Moses. The case was laughed out of the world court, but the Egyptians were seeking the artifact back and damages (calculated with interest / inflation over the past 2500 years to be like 200 million) and the **** counter-sued for having been enslaved or some such.

[Strygun]

The main reason most countries near Israel hate it is because of what happened in 1948. A group organized after WWII, for this explaination's sake we'll call League of Nations, decided that the holocaust was a terrible thing and that these countries should prevent anyone from ever trying to exterminate the **** again. So, this group of countries declared a parcel of land (which at the time belonged to Syria, Egypt, and Palestine) to be the nation state of Israel. They did this to create a central location for **** to call home. (At the time, there was no 'country' where **** were. They were a people group spread across the world. This happened in 600BC or so.)

Ever since, these countries have been ticked at the **** because they want their land back. That's basically it. There is a little bit of religious tie in due to these countries being Islamic, but it's mostly the land thing.

[Jaged]

The main reason most countries near Israel hate it is because of what happened in 1948. A group organized after WWII, for this explaination's sake we'll call League of Nations, decided that the holocaust was a terrible thing and that these countries should prevent anyone from ever trying to exterminate the **** again. So, this group of countries declared a parcel of land (which at the time belonged to Syria, Egypt, and Palestine) to be the nation state of Israel. They did this to create a central location for **** to call home. (At the time, there was no 'country' where **** were. They were a people group spread across the world. This happened in 600BC or so.)

Ever since, these countries have been ticked at the **** because they want their land back. That's basically it. There is a little bit of religious tie in due to these countries being Islamic, but it's mostly the land thing.
That only explains recent times. What about the Nazis and the egyptians?

[BUGGER]

I thought Israel was formed by several countries. Well theres something I never paid attention to in world history. Thanks for clearing that up.

[Hamma]

Well it turns out they have been the victims of Persecution many more times than even you thought :eek: All the way from the 3rd century BCE

Religious anti-Semitism, or anti-Judaism. Before the 19th century, most anti-Semitism was primarily religious in nature, based on Christian or Islamic interactions with and interpretations of Judaism. Since Judaism was generally the largest minority religion in Christian Europe, **** were often the primary targets of religiously-motivated violence and persecution from Christian and, to a lesser degree, Islamic rulers. Unlike anti-Semitism in general, this form of prejudice is directed at the religion itself, and so generally does not affect those of Jewish ancestry who have converted to another religion, although the case of Conversos in Spain was a notable exception. Laws banning Jewish religious practices may be rooted in religious anti-Semitism, as were the expulsions of **** that happened throughout the Middle Ages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Semitism

The Jewish people and Judaism have experienced various persecutions throughout Jewish history. In medieval Europe, many persecutions of **** in the name of Christianity occurred, notably during the Crusades***8212;when **** all over Germany were massacred***8212;and a series of expulsions from England, Germany, France, and, in the largest expulsion of all, Spain. In the Papal States, which existed until 1870, **** were required to live only in specified neighborhoods called ghettos. In the 19th and (before the end of the second World War) 20th centuries, the Roman Catholic church adhered to a distinction between "good anti-Semitism" and "bad anti-Semitism". The "bad" kind promoted hatred of **** because of their descent. This was considered un-Christian because the Christian message was intended for all of humanity regardless of ethnicity; anyone could become a Christian. The "good" kind criticized alleged Jewish conspiracies to control newspapers, banks, and other institutions, to care only about accumulation of wealth, etc.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/****

History of anti-Semitism (very long)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_anti-Semitism

All of the articles are a very interesting read if you have the time to read them. :D

[Giovanni]

It's widely know that alot of **** have an extra gland that causes them to be hated! The gland releases a pheromone that elevates the aggresiveness in an individual...

Quite deadly really!

[Strygun]

It covers the Nazis, they were in WWII. (The reason the nazis tried to kill the **** is just because they believed their race (the Aryian race) was perfect and needed to be the only race on the planet. In Biblical times, the Aryians and the ****/Israelites fought a lot.

It would take a crazy long post to explain it all. Just read wikipedia.

[Firefly]

It covers the Nazis, they were in WWII. (The reason the nazis tried to kill the **** is just because they believed their race (the Aryian race) was perfect and needed to be the only race on the planet. In Biblical times, the Aryians and the ****/Israelites fought a lot.

It would take a crazy long post to explain it all. Just read wikipedia.

Actually, most Germans didn't even care until Hitler came to power, promising a German empire that was largely lost during WWI. Hitler, despite being a genocidal maniac, was also extremely persuasive and very charismatic. Combine those two characteristics with his superb oratory skill... he even managed to sway prominent Americans to secretly support his party.

Hitler blamed his failures as an artist on ****. He dictated a book about it, promising retribution. Ironically enough, his book was dictated in a fashion that tried to make him look like a super-star of the oppressed worker. He claimed he was toiling away in the streets of Germany for "filthy ****" who promised him riches, when in reality he was living a very decent life in Vienna Austria. He tried to blame World War One on the ****. He also outlined his belief in the Aryan race, and claimed that **** (who were only about one percent of the populace) were trying to pollute this bloodline, and that the **** were in league with Communists.

Ironically enough, many of Hitler's beliefs were inspired by Henry Ford, who was a notorious anti-Semite. Yes - that Henry Ford.

[LimpBIT]

Ironically enough, many of Hitler's beliefs were inspired by Henry Ford, who was a notorious anti-Semite. Yes - that Henry Ford.

:doh: :confused: :doh: :confused:

[Jaged]

I suppose each specific example in history of Jewish persecution has its reasons. What I am looking for is one or more general reasons that the **** keep getting persecuted century after century. There may not even be one, I'm just curious.

[Strygun]

I suppose each specific example in history of Jewish persecution has its reasons. What I am looking for is one or more general reasons that the **** keep getting persecuted century after century. There may not even be one, I'm just curious.
they're God's chosen people. Most people who don't believe in God/hates God will attack His people.

[Jaged]

they're God's chosen people. Most people who don't believe in God/hates God will attack His people.

Dosen't every religion kinda belive that they are god's chosen people?

[TX3RN0BILL]

It seems more they are the elected scapegoats for everything so whenever blame is to be atrributed, everybody goes against the ****...

P.S.: The fault of all the conflicts with regards to Israel is actually british - read up on the real history of Lawrence of Arabia. As for the israeli's image though, and considering what they've been through in the Holocaust, I simply cannot understand their actions in this current conflict...

I wonder though if Mel Gibson is right when he said that the **** were to blame for all wars (with that I mean if in all countries **** were getting something out of it in terms of profit). I think you can rule out WW2, but as for the rest...

[Hamma]

Dosen't every religion kinda belive that they are god's chosen people?

Pretty much, which gets us into most of these situations over the years.

Interesting thread though keep it up ;)

[Infernus]

When you claim to be something, esspecially a group of people, chosen by God... you seem to attract negative attention for shear arrogance.

[Mag-Mower]

When you claim to be something, esspecially a group of people, chosen by God... you seem to attract negative attention for shear arrogance.

Makes sense.

[internetn]

**** are always in the shit, cause they've been picked on before, and histlory tends to repeat its self.

Think about it why hate each other when yuo can hate a ***?

[Red October]

Prior to the Temple being laid waste and thier expulsion from thier country, **** weren't getting picked on any more than any other nation at that time. If one reads the Old Testament, you see a lot of wars were they persecuted others and vice versa.

The real crap begins about the time Christianity starts to flourish (ceases in being another branch of Judaism and a religion of its own). Christ and the Apostles seem to get a make over at some point and are "de-jewed". The Jewish religion is blamed for being "Christ Killers" and Judas (a form of ***) is especialy regaurded with hatred and voila...they become a convient group to blame all the countries woes on. Particularly since they are a minority. An analogy would be here in the US in its intolerance towards non-whites and non-protestant religions.

[Firefly]

I wonder though if Mel Gibson is right when he said that the **** were to blame for all wars (with that I mean if in all countries **** were getting something out of it in terms of profit). I think you can rule out WW2, but as for the rest...
You can blame every last Crusade on Christians. There were just as many crusades as there were major wars in the 19th and 20th century. When I say "war", I don't mean pissant "Operations Other Than War" or internal civil wars.

The Korean War - not about ****. It was an international war, not just a US battle.

The Vietnam War - not about ****. This also was an international war, not just the US versus Vietnam.

Also note - **** were persecuted heavily by the Romans, though they were not extensively tortured and put to death as early Christians were. **** were actually an ethnicity as part of the Twelve Tribes - this later was practically reversed, and Judaism became mostly a religion as its bloodlines were thinned and spread out with the various Diaspora.

When you claim to be something, esspecially a group of people, chosen by God... you seem to attract negative attention for shear arrogance.
Christians believe their religion is the only acceptable way into heaven, through Jesus Christ. Isn't that arrogant? Sure, the Bible says so - in the New Testament. But the Bible also says that **** are the chosen people of G'd - in the Old Testament. So, I believe with regards to that, Christianity and Judaism are on equal footing. As far as Islam... I don't give a fuck what they think. Islam came from the same roots as Judaism, except it isn't as old.

[Firefly]

PS - thanks, Hamma.

[Jaged]

Christians believe their religion is the only acceptable way into heaven, through Jesus Christ. Isn't that arrogant?

Yea, pretty much.

[internetn]

Well then, why don't we all get rid of all thie **** and americans and we've solved the worlds problems. Oh wait and white people.. and hold on.. guys too.. there we go.

Its idiot and unintelligent to blame an entire nation, race, religion, etc. for your problems..

So go sink somewhere Red October

[Kyonye]

As for the israeli's image though, and considering what they've been through in the Holocaust, I simply cannot understand their actions in this current conflict...


I'm not trying to argue with you, but you don't seem to be seeing what is really going on. I would actually like to hear what you think, in hopes that I can correct you. This war is taking a toll on me, and the media only make it worse. I have family, right now, fighting for the IDF, in Lebanon. Then to turn around and see what the media says, just really does bring me down a little bit. Now i'm not saying Israel is completely perfect, but the media is showing straight out falsity's (sp? who knows..definately not me :) ).

[I Hate Pants]

I was told somewhere that it had something to do with the **** turning Jesus over to the romans knowing he was gonna be tortured and killed.

[Firefly]

Then to turn around and see what the media says, just really does bring me down a little bit. Now i'm not saying Israel is completely perfect, but the media is showing straight out falsity's
Brother, I'll put it to you this way.

If Al'Qaida was sitting in Tijuana shooting rockets into the US and hitting our cities, we wouldn't ask the Mexican government to get on it. Whether they actually killed anyone or not. We'd roll across, flatten that fucking town, and probably every town in a fifty-mile radius just to prove a point.

Notice that until Israel started killing women and children, the other Arab countries didn't breathe a peep. The other Arab governments, with exception of Syria, want Hezbollah gone as much as Israel. Even Lebanon doesn't care for them, but Lebanon will side with Hezbollah against Israel because it's their country. Even now, there are only random outbursts among Arab nations - and those outbursts are largely from Shiite Muslims. Hezbollah is a Shiite movement, which is why it receives attention for its links with Iran - also Shiite (and Persian, not Arabic). There are very very few governments that would have anything to do with them, and those that do are quickly silenced by other Arab nations. Most Arab nations are run by Sunni governments, and Sunnis hate Shiites almost as much as they do ****. That's why places like Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Iraq, Jordan, Egypt, etc have no desire to see Iran obtain nuclear weapons. And that's why Mahmoud Absabadgbdbjsngjsbnnajajanjan whatever his goddamn name is, is such a loudmouth prick. Because he knows that despite being Arab, the rest of the Middle East will smite him.

[TX3RN0BILL]

Well, don't expect me to say that Israel doesn't have a right to defend itself against aggression, because I'd be the first to say that it has, although I'm not a ***... but the thing is, they're doing everything wrong in this conflict. Strictly from a military point of view, the aerial bombing campaign has created what I guess amounts to at least 95% collateral damage and 5% real damage towards its intended target - Hezbollah. History teaches us that it's really hard to destroy a terrorist organization.

Take a look at Afghanistan. First there's been bombing, and a lot of it - and the only reason there was not too much collateral damage there is because there wasn't much in terms of civilian infrastructure in the first place, and second the Taliban regime preferred to hide in caves instead of behind and among the civilian population. Then came the ground forces, and not just a few - it was a lot of ground forces. THAT definitely broke any hope of Taliban sovereignty in Afghanistan. But it's also a fact that the area still isn't safe.

Now look at Lebanon. A lot of infrastructure. The country itself was actually on a good path, with hopes of becoming a tourism destination, and was building up infrastructures to sustain itself. Hezbollah learned from other terrorist organizations on how to survive a classic "onslaught campaign". They prepared well for this offensive, and from what I've learned, it was the Israelis who started their bombing and shelling campaign a couple of days before the first katyushas started to rain on Israel. The question is, which were the targets which Israel attacked first? It was the airport, the power stations, the dams, and some other infrastructure which for any self-respecting terrorist organization considers as mere extra luxury - they prepared themselves to be self-sufficient without all that. The lebanese civilian population on the other hand has been suffering the effects of war from day 1 of the israeli bombing campaign. Israel's airstrikes' chances of hitting Hezbollah are very small since all Hezbollah does is pop some rockets from civilian areas, then disappear. By the time Israel bombs the launch area, it's filled with civilians. That just plays into Hezbollah's hands by making Israel look worse and worse for the rest of the world. Destoying U.N. installations after repeated warnings to stop the attack, and then calling it an accident, well, I won't even comment that. The same goes for the destruction of ambulances regardless of checking what they contain - ambulances normally are used to carry injured people around, so the benefit of doubt should be given. Actually, Israel is currently shooting at everything that moves, in the south of Lebanon, which makes their "leave the south leaflet" campaign even more ridiculous.

Whilst it is definitely sad that Israel got itself into this mess with Hezbollah, the only way to ever make sure no more rockets fall into Israel is to commit ground troops, something the IDF is shy to do - almost cowardly about it. Why? Because they are afraid to fill caskets. But this is war, and in war there are casualties. And the best way to secure Israel would have been an all-out invasion of Lebanon. After what happened in Afghanistan and Iraq, I bet nobody would really blame Israel for doing that. Ironically, everybody is blaming Israel for NOT doing it. This aerial campaign - this shouldn't have been done in the first place. They even destroyed an offshore powerplant, causing an oil spill with international dimensions - I doubt Hezbollah would have used that power station for anything... So much collateral damage could have avoided, yet it wasn't. That's why Israel is looking real bad right now.

[Red October]

Well then, why don't we all get rid of all thie **** and americans and we've solved the worlds problems. Oh wait and white people.. and hold on.. guys too.. there we go.

Its idiot and unintelligent to blame an entire nation, race, religion, etc. for your problems..

So go sink somewhere Red October

Care to fill me in on exactly where I was blaming a race, ethnic group, etc. for any or all problems? For your info, I was putting into perspective "where" in the context of history anti-semitism seems to begin and originates. And I was using the turbulent 1960's of racial hatred and anti-Catholism, anti-Orthodox, etc. sentiments to show a parallel. If you can't seem to understand that....well...

[Infernus]

Ok then, Israel should just stop the bombing and go 1960s on the Middle East's collective ass.

This time Lebanon can be first, then Syria and Jordan.

[Firefly]

Uh... Jordan is actually not as assholish (yes I may have made that word up) as the rest of the Middle East. They're known as "moderate", meaning basically pro-Western. And Israel has no desire to re-occupy Lebanon.

[Phaden]

firefly good stuff, pretty much what i was going to say about that, and then a million times more than me

[Giovanni]

Uh... Jordan is actually not as assholish (yes I may have made that word up) as the rest of the Middle East. They're known as "moderate", meaning basically pro-Western. And Israel has no desire to re-occupy Lebanon.

They just wanna bomb the shit out of it then? Oh and nice custom title :rofl:

[TX3RN0BILL]

Actually, I was thinking more on the line of Israel going all the way to Iran but leaving Jordan alone, going directly through Iraq. That would surely help the western forces there somewhat - wouldn't be much left over after Israel is through with Iraq... :rolleyes: I wonder what will happen if they hit any western troops out there and dare say it's an accident... :rolleyes: Then again by that time the iranians would have gotten some nukes by whatever means, and turn the IDF along with Iraq into slag... killing american armed forces there would even come as a bonus... :rolleyes:

Back to serious Sam, wars normally have the side that's on the initiative (in this case one could say it's Hezbollah) forcing the other side to react, and whoever has to react normally doesn't want to have to react that way. It's not a question of wether Israel WANTS to reoccupy Lebanon, it's a simple matter that they'll HAVE TO if they ever want those rockets to stop falling on their country. Hezbollah won't give a crap for any resolution or cease-fire since they're pretty comfortable the way things are going for them. And no international force are going to get themselves killed by getting between those two conflicting sides before there's a cease-fire. That means that it'll be up to Israel to go as they initially thought they would - all the way up to the Litani border. Maybe even further, but the fact is, it will have to be the IDF's job to do what it takes to secure Israel, commiting ground troops.