Make Badges mean something....

[Daimond]

Please read full post. seems a number of you just glanced over picking out a few things and posting, then reading the post and thinking about the context. not all of this was to be taken as literal, this was a quick Idea to start a new topic of talk, not people randoming reading blerps of the post.

I had a random though and desided to post the topic and only then though of some of the details as i went, so balance at this point of the post is to start people in a new direction of though.

I have played since beta and seen alot of changes, there is alot in the game now that gives me a minor advantage over a newb already that does not change the out come of the fight to kill me. eg.. I get a free rexo siut, an HSR, Elite Weapons with out even certing in any weapon and such, I still get killed as fast in battle. also a Lib pilot sooner or later get a merrit to now pull a Vulture lib class. and as in the BFR if you do get implanted and do spent the time get a merrit to alow you a fly varent BFR.

As badges stand now they are not worth anything for 95% of them. Sure the odd one like flying the lib long enough will get you an upgrade on it, is great and all by why have we not expanded this. I have always though most badges not all are like a kind of levelling up in a particular area/class/Play style.

Now I’ll explain this farther, and remember this that that the effects are like Implants only get so many at a time and only when equipped, but also not powerful enough alone to be much different just an added bonus.

Now lest start off with say Medic, as they heal and rez people they will work their way towards badges as normal but every badge or every other badge that gain boosts that ability a little, but not much. Eg... bronze badge will let them rez someone 1 second faster, silver 2 seconds faster, say by plat they only use 50% the med units to rez some one. So in this essence every level could be something totally diff then the next but if say in this instant they wore all 3 of thoughts listed badges they would be able to rez people 3 seconds faster and only use half the clip say instead of all of it. Little added bonus to a particular role played for a long time. Can use this for healing badge as well.

Now let’s move to something different like say a sniper. Lest say first couple of levels here give slight increase to dmg, eg by silver badge when wearing both you can do 5/8 dmg to a Rexo instead of only ½ but do 7/8 dmg to someone in slandered armour. And maybe by plat you get a .5 second reload time. Let’s also take it to another area here while we’re at it, say for a different badge under the same weapon. But remember under this situation it would take a long time to gain badges and work your way up as you only gain way to badge is by the accual kill shot. But have an AV badge maybe have to start out with maxes cause you would have to hope for a lucky shot on a tank otherwise would take like 10 rounds. But for maxes if I remember takes about 15 sniper rounds. So say like other badges you need to kill 100 for first lvl and so on, lvl 1 would maybe boost your dmg to AV, so only needing say 13 rounds to take out a max, and maybe 6 by plat, with combination of last few badges.

This can be for Driver and gunners of things as well, say an example is guy got plat driver skill, when wearing this badge he can drive anything in a rexo suit. Or at lvl one he gets 1 min off his timer to pull another if he dies fast. This one though may only be useful in heavy battles where you die a lot because you don’t retreat or such.

Do remember too that if a person is set up for a role it takes a few min to change out your badges for a different role to gain a bonus. Such as say a hot dropper on a tower, say he’s set up for air combat bonuses. He decides to in the middle of battle drop on the tower to help out inside, he’s no better then the next grunt unless he goes off and spends a few mins to change out his badges to that style of play to gain a possible slight edge to survival on his side.

Now let’s run out a squad situation against say just no bonus grunts here. And some of these are just rough not much though in accrual bonus details or balancing in some things. Say on a gen drop and hold situation, 1 squad might hold out better depending on whom they have in there and their badges they wearing. EG… guy set up for fast rez and another for fast heal, but both took 50% less units used, one guy set up for say 1/3 more dmg using nades and 1/8 increase to AOE splash size. And 1 max let’s say a scat max say used all his badges to gain 50% fire speed.

Now another squad doing same thing might be out fitted different and not do as well, and this also depends on what the enemy is setup for as style of play. There can be say 10 badges with 5 lvls per weapon or such, but you only get to pick say 3-4 at a time to combined to give you a possible edge/Bonus in that style of play over another guy in style of play. Cause it takes time to change them out and if really needed could always set up a timer such as in like recert between changes to help in balancing.

[Duffman]

Started reading it... please space your paragraphs. Not being an ass or grammar nazi just your post is hard to read.

[Daimond]

sorry did it in word, and just copy and pasted, should of looked at it before submiting it. as I see it turns out spacing is not copyed to forum :)

[Grimster]

Don't like this idea. Badges and merits should not have that much impact on the stats of your character. Just my opinion though.

[Daimond]

Don't like this idea. Badges and merits should not have that much impact on the stats of your character. Just my opinion though.

Do remember this was just a quick and rough layed out idea with some things like say the senario in the gen, if it was balanced. This post is to just layout a new Idea of topic to discuss and get some feed back. but things like rezing say its 15 seconds to rez a guy, striping 3 seconds off the time cant be that unbalanced. but thats what this topics about.

[Bags]

Don't like this idea. Badges and merits should not have that much impact on the stats of your character. Just my opinion though.

I agree. Achievements should not affect gameplay. It will become like an mmo rpg if the bonuses of playing a lot and having played a longer time begin stacking up.

I wouldn't be against it being able to see what merits a friendly has (their names) or them maybe changing the look of your tank / med app a bit, but I don't think it should unlock bonuses.

[wildcat140679]

Planetside battle rank system works so wel because it doesn't make you better in anyway, only more versatile. Introducing a level system that enhances or boosts certain aspects of the game like you suggest with your badges/merits will disrupt this fine balance.

Nevertheless I do agree that a badge or patch is some what dull.
So instead of improving stats on weapons or tools, how about only changing the looks. Like with high battle ranks and command ranks they get different armour pieces and a backpack.

[ArcticPrism]

No please. Part of the attraction for Planetside is that long term players and new players are on pretty equal footing.

[CutterJohn]

I could see the merits giving non combat advantages.

Example..

Tank driver

Bronze - 20% reduction in spawn timer
Silver - 20% increase in repair rates for tanks you own.
Gold - 50% reduction in base nanite cost when you pull tanks.
Platinum - Can spawn an enemy tank once every 2-4 hours, and repair pads work for you without dropship/continent benefits.

As others have said, I would not want to see performance change. Thats one of the awesome things about planetside.

[TRex]

I'd much rather have something simpler , say like a pilot having a kill tally on the side of their aircraft like they do in real life during the war. Not for trivial stuff like a mossie mowing down infantry, but for air-to-air combat in 1v 1 etc. For a certain amount you get a notch on side , and so on. Scalps, in other words.

Or in case of heavy tanks , a regular driver/gunner team can do a little graphical make up to their vehicle like bull horns on front /spray paint ie camouflage it a bit . Nothing to change balance of the game , just something to reward them for teamwork and keeping that outfit ethos going.

If your a commander/cr5 , give them something to show that they have elected /been elected to lead a continent or global like a General's stripe, and sub-commanders similar . Everyone under their command could see where they were on the map. On flip side of this , killing a general could stop him from using /global or /cont all or orbitals for a few minutes . This would make him an important target and likewise someone to defend at all times. That way also you would separate the real leaders who want to command from the gung-ho type who just wants cr5 for the os's.

[Tool]

I could see the merits giving non combat advantages.

Example..

Tank driver

Bronze - 20% reduction in spawn timer
Silver - 20% increase in repair rates for tanks you own.
Gold - 50% reduction in base nanite cost when you pull tanks.
Platinum - Can spawn an enemy tank once every 2-4 hours, and repair pads work for you without dropship/continent benefits.

As others have said, I would not want to see performance change. Thats one of the awesome things about planetside.

These aren't bad ideas at all actually, if the cert system is anything like it used to be (if even still used) things like this would really help promote specific playstyles and benefit those with dedicated roles.

[Sifer2]

Yeah this is not a bad idea. Advantages should not be huge but a little boost for focusing on a playstyle for a long time does not seem like a bad thing. In a way would just encourage specialization an teamwork that much more. Just please don't make it too much of a grind. I hated how like in Battlefield you had those real mundane tasks to earn badges like spend 20 hours sitting in a Tank.

[Grimster]

These aren't bad ideas at all actually, if the cert system is anything like it used to be (if even still used) things like this would really help promote specific playstyles and benefit those with dedicated roles.

I agree, I really like CutterJohn's take on it. These benefits do minimal impact on the actual fighting but still provide players with a benefit worth pursuing and like mentioned in previous post it promotes specific roles.

I assume that when you say respawn timer you referring to the cooldown of the vehicle? :)

[CutterJohn]

I assume that when you say respawn timer you referring to the cooldown of the vehicle? :)

Yup.


Harder, of course, would be bonuses for infantry weapons and whatnot. No timer. Minimal nanite cost. Can't be repaired. I'm not sure what, if any, non combat bonuses could be applied, since there are really no 'costs' to ownership of them that can be scaled back. They are free, infinite, and indestructible.

[Sgteppinjer]

but who was phone?

[Firefly]

Badges mean jack and shit to me. I don't wear merits. I don't need a merit. I have all the badges I need - a TR logo and my outfit logo. The rest is inconsequential - I don't look at yours when I kill you, and I don't stare at my battle buddies' badges because that means I'm not watching my sectors of fire.

The end.

[Sirisian]

Badges mean jack and shit to me. I don't wear merits. I don't need a merit. I have all the badges I need - a TR logo and my outfit logo. The rest is inconsequential - I don't look at yours when I kill you, and I don't stare at my battle buddies' badges because that means I'm not watching my sectors of fire.
hehe someones hardcore. :lol:
http://assaultwars.com/pictures/ptsdos.png

I liked the idea of having badges like "50 bomber kills in a row" or "10 sniper kills in a row". Stuff you can show off and be proud of. Achievements I don't think ever hurt this game. Even when I had the vulture it wasn't hard to get. I'm not really a fan of them unlocking things though.

[Furret]

You walked a very thin line when you suggested this.

A lot of the players are very much against having playtime or rank or whatnot give you a combat advantage, however slight.

Cutter John was definitely on the right track though, if there are advantages for merits/badges, they shouldn't have any effect in combat situations.

BAD
Extra damage
Faster reload time
New weapons
Better scopes
Less recoil
Larger clips
More armor
Faster travel (vehicles)

GOOD
Decals
Customization
Coloring
Notches/Kill Tallies
Spawning enemy vehicle types

IN BETWEEN (with explanation)
Decreased rez time
-As long as the bonuses aren't ridiculous (no more than 15-20% increase at maximum level) this could easily be implemented
Decreased vehicle spawn time
-Again, the maximum level shouldn't be "spawn vehicle cooldown reduced to 0" but more of a 10-20% decrease thing.
Decreased repair time
-Same as previous, not too major, but noticeable on larger vehicles

[Daimond]

yup its a fine line and I knew that :) but its a topic that has not been discused and though would make a good interesting different topic to explor.

In the beginning when they were brought out, badges/merrits were supose to have something that went along with most of them, be them dumb/funny or accualy mean something. But in the end a few were removed and only 2 remain that I know of and nothing els happened with them.
1. badge was for lib to at some time pull a vulture.
2. badge is for BFR to pull fly variant.
At one time though that might be removed now that I know of, was if you ran over enough people you got a whorn to use while driving lol.

I my self dont look at or care about badges/merrits cuase they mean squat. But at one time there was an out look of something weather dumb funny useful or just stupid behind it. but figered just incase they happen to be in next game then lets spew out some idea, hope they pick up on some to use, so we not get some usless thing there again.

Yes some ideas can be out there and to much, but some tweeks might not be. There was at one time roumors about the badges giving you the free weapon class if you reach Plat lvl. but never heard anyone accualy getting that. I did get Plat Sniper some time ago and never got it my self but I was not holding out hope, just though that would be a need bonus cuase I could spend that 3 points some where els.

[PsychoXR-20]

No please. Part of the attraction for Planetside is that long term players and new players are on pretty equal footing.

This can also be flipped around and be a turn off. The fact that after playing for years and years you have nothing different than what a player who just started playing doesn't bode well with some. If PS:N wants to be as successful as it possible can, it needs some form of player retention.

As others mentioned, any form of game play advantage is a huge no-no. You are right, and I agree 100% that the fact that a player who starts paying PlanetSide today, has just as much health, does just as much damage, runs at the same speed, reloads just as fast, shots just as (in)accurately as someone who has been playing since beta is PS's biggest strength. But PS:N needs some sort of player progression whereby players can feel they are achieving things and being rewarded for their play style.

It's a very thin line as to what is acceptable and what is not as far as rewards go, but people will be more inclined to keep playing if they have that carrot on a stick, knowing that if they repair just a little more, they will get some sort of bonus, if they rez just a few more people, they'll get a new item to play with.

[Bags]

This can also be flipped around and be a turn off. The fact that after playing for years and years you have nothing different than what a player who just started playing doesn't bode well with some. If PS:N wants to be as successful as it possible can, it needs some form of player retention.

As others mentioned, any form of game play advantage is a huge no-no. You are right, and I agree 100% that the fact that a player who starts paying PlanetSide today, has just as much health, does just as much damage, runs at the same speed, reloads just as fast, shots just as (in)accurately as someone who has been playing since beta is PS's biggest strength. But PS:N needs some sort of player progression whereby players can feel they are achieving things and being rewarded for their play style.

It's a very thin line as to what is acceptable and what is not as far as rewards go, but people will be more inclined to keep playing if they have that carrot on a stick, knowing that if they repair just a little more, they will get some sort of bonus, if they rez just a few more people, they'll get a new item to play with.

You get merits and people respect / recognize you. That and gameplay is enough retention for me.

[PsychoXR-20]

You get merits and people respect / recognize you. That and gameplay is enough retention for me.

That might be enough for YOU, and it was enough for me too for a long time, but what about everyone else? PlanetSide requires people, it cannot survive with only a tiny population like a traditional MMORPG could. If you want to attract the CoD players (as much as you may say you don't want them, you really do, more people means bigger, and more frequent battles), and the Battlefield players, hell, lets go so far as to say other MMO players you're going to need more than just meaningless .jpgs and recognition.

You could even go as shallow and do something similar to what BF2142 did (its the only BF game I have played so I don't know if the others did it to) and reward players for doing difficult things. Once I got my basic weapons platinum, as fun as it was to get, I had no real incentive to go out using a Supressor any more. But if things like the final get x kills in one life were repeatable, and if you were rewarded for kill streaks and other difficult accomplishments (x pistol kills in one life, x knife kills in one life, x vehicle kills in one life), more players are going to stick with it instead of getting to BR20, playing around for a month or two, realize that they aren't really getting anything, and cancel their sub in favor of playing a free FPS.

[Bags]

Make the merits flashier then. (If they did this it'd have to be when you next die and not in combat) Announce it to everyone around you in chat.

Repeatable merits is fine too.

[Valverde]

I completely agree with the Original Poster. When I reviewed the Badges I saw that for hacking you need kill?!?!? That doesn't even make sense. I can see you need a certain number of base take overs or tower take overs, but kills... no way. Same should be for the medic and so on.

[Grimster]

Make the merits flashier then. (If they did this it'd have to be when you next die and not in combat) Announce it to everyone around you in chat.

Repeatable merits is fine too.


Or they could stick a big neon sign on you. :)







Yes that was sarcasm for anyone not gifted with the ability to notice such things. :)

[Canaris]

I think Furret is dead on the money with his post.

I played APB where they allowed you to upgrade yourself and weapons as a reward for game play but as a consequence of allowing veteran players to have these *buffs* it did punish new players by having them gangbanged so many times that I know plenty just went "F-this why am I playing a game where it is almost impossible to kill the enemy"
The new players have to put up with a heck of a lot of grief that doesn't make the game appealing.

While in theory it's a good idea to reward veterans it can be a practical nightmare for others and if you want to keep them playing to increase server populations, this isn't the way to go

[Valverde]

Just giving the Veteran Players Acknowledgment and keeping the content coming is enough. As a Veteran Player all I want is for others to know I am a Veteran, that I have successfully handled myself in combat or my chosen Specialization. I personally do not need access to "pimp" or even "bad-ass" weapons/armor/transportation.

If they could do anything more I would say, do more with medals/merits/rank/ribbons/awards. These only need to be aesthetics but give me medals or merits or ribbons for capturing a base or helping defend or takeover a planet or system.

[Hamma]

I think Furret is dead on the money with his post.

I played APB where they allowed you to upgrade yourself and weapons as a reward for game play but as a consequence of allowing veteran players to have these *buffs* it did punish new players by having them gangbanged so many times that I know plenty just went "F-this why am I playing a game where it is almost impossible to kill the enemy"
The new players have to put up with a heck of a lot of grief that doesn't make the game appealing.

While in theory it's a good idea to reward veterans it can be a practical nightmare for others and if you want to keep them playing to increase server populations, this isn't the way to go
ugh man, nice on bringing up APB.

The way that APB did it was HORRIBLE and meant that people with no life ran around with insane weapon bonuses and armor. It was near impossible to combat them - APB had a shitload of potential but it was all lost with that very mechanic at least for me.

[Effective]

I'd be fine with cosmetic changes, but anything else I think would be silly.

[Highwind]

I think that detailed character pages should be viewable in game for yourself as well as allies and enemies (to a degree). These character windows when initially pulled up would be generally be small and off to the side as part of the interface just there to give a quick view showing some highlights about the player like total kills by empire, configurable "trophy merit" slot (think like Starcraft 2 if you've seen that) and Cert breakdown if the player is friendly (enemies this part wouldn't show to prevent "inspecting" being used for an edge). An advanced button or details button would expand that small window out to show more or less the players full merit history similar to how it is currently only better.

Remember that everything can be changed and built from the ground up in PSN, this is a whole new modern game, and it should have interfaces with features that reflect that. Being able to view the statistical success of another player, even on other empires, I think is important because it will help enforce that prestige factor that a lot of players enjoy.

To become infamous or well known by your enemies was great, be it at the outfit level or player by player. I think that having a player "inspect stats" feature in the game in addition to cross faction whispers would make any kind of respawn timer/mechanic more passable. To be able to go "who was that guy that just killed me?" and be able to see "Hmm that was Dreamer, is one of the top players on that empire" is a valuable addition to the game in terms of recognizing extraordinary service as a vet player of PSN.

In terms of Merits / Achievements upgrading or unlocking features for the player? I support it along the lines that others have said in this thread, balance should be preserved, and more or less new players should have a fair enough experience going toe to toe with a Vet.