Flails and snipers and draw distance (oh my)

[Arkaiden]

What would everyone like to happen with these in PS:N since sniping/artillery and their usefulness is very much tied to what sort of draw distance the game has.

[DviddLeff]

Draw distance should be as high as possible; currently its too low (especially as I seem to remember it being further in the early days).

With the flails and bolt drivers they currently have very easy to see projectiles, so its simple to find the origin and take them out. Personally I feel its too easy, in PS2 it should be a lot harder to find snipers at least.

[krnasaur]

In today's war most snipers don't use tracers (for obvious reasons). Why would they in the future?

[Sirisian]

In today's war most snipers don't use tracers (for obvious reasons). Why would they in the future?
Try to separate real life from a game's gameplay decisions. Just because it doesn't exist or make sense in the real world doesn't mean it won't serve as a valid gameplay consideration.

I hope sniping and artillery are still there. Flails were never tied to the draw distance. :rolleyes: Were you using them for short range targets?

I'm hoping the draw distance is configurable to be fairly long, but at the same time I understand that it requires more bandwidth to send data for a larger area of interest so anything a little over the current render distance should be fine.

[morf]

Draw distance isn't much of a technical consideration, at least on the server side. Planetside actually draws objects much further away from you than the fog allows you to see, and then places a layer of fog over it. I can only conclude that they did this so that snipers can't hit you from ridiculous distances.

Personally I think that the boon for snipers in PSN should be hitboxes so that they can actually kill someone with a single headshot. I'm not opposed to a longer distance, but if that happens there should be a downside like projectile arc for the bolt driver, at least at very long distances. You shouldn't be able to 1 shot someone with pixel perfect aiming from 300+ yards out.

[Sirisian]

Personally I think that the boon for snipers in PSN should be hitboxes so that they can actually kill someone with a single headshot.
I don't think that will be happening anytime soon without a revolt. (http://www.planetside-universe.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35881) :lol: The poll in that thread speaks for itself.

[DviddLeff]

I fully support head shots, as I made clear in that thread :p

I hope that snipers and almost all projectile weapons have an arc for that matter, making the game that much more player skill based.

[Furret]

Sniping should allow headshots. Thats the point of sniping, to have to be very precise.

Not trying to bring the headshot thread here, but i'm gonna post this anyway.

imo, these are the two best ways to implement headshots.

-only sniper rifles can get headshots, which are one hit kills. To balance this in CQC, the crosshairs are large when you're not scoped in (like in CoD).

-Headshot ammo. A headshot does more damage (NOT ONE HIT KILL NECESSARILY) and a body shot does significantly less damage.

Example: Lets say an MCG firing standard rounds kills in 10 bullets. the target has 100 hp and each hit does 10 damage. If you use headshot rounds and only hit the body, it takes 30 hits (3.33 damage per shot) If you hit their head however, it only takes 5 hits (20 damage per shot). Using these headshot rounds would probably be a disadvantage to you, because the MCG is inaccurate.

Example 2: The suppressor (standard assault rifle). again, 10 hits, 10 damage a piece. Headshot rounds are also 3.33 for bodyshots and 20 for headshots. Because the suppressor is a much more accurate gun (I'm also hoping for iron sights for the non-HA weapons) it would be much more advantageous to use headshot rounds if you're willing to take your time and place your shots.

Example 3: The bolt driver. I think the bolt driver does 70 damage out of 100? We'll use that as the base for now. Nobody wants to go through the trouble of hitting someone (calculating bullet drop, travel time, enemy's future position, wind??) only to have them flinch a bit and keep running. Headshot ammo with a sniper rifle would increase the damage to 100 (kill any non-MAX infantry) with a headshot, and reduce the damage to 49 for a non-headshot. The reason the damage is so high for a non headshot is because the normal distance you will be sniping people is so large that headshots will be very difficult to get, especially if the target is sprinting.

[Kogashuko]

I am sorry if you get hit in the head with even that little pistol in anything other than max armor you should be DONE.

Without some reaslism you have people jumping around and running into rooms with and killing everyone that is lower level that does not have the uber chaingun.

[Baneblade]

Ah, the days of Artillary Vanguards... before they did no damage outside of draw distance.

[Traak]

Without some reaslism you have people jumping around and running into rooms with and killing everyone that is lower level that does not have the uber chaingun.

The only level low enough to not get access to the MCG is people who don't play Planetside.

So who are the "lower level" players that don't have the "uber chaingun."? WoW players?

[Vancha]

I'd hate to see snipers getting one-shot-kills in PSN. Sniping was great in Planetside because it took two hits. It was those snipers who'd wait for a wounded enemy or could reliably hit an enemy on the move that separated the "good" snipers from the whack-a-mole snipers that could only land one shot on stationary targets.

It doesn't take skill to headshot a still target. Headshots would reward the bad snipers more than the good ones.

Edit: And I'd imagine most people would like as far a draw distance as their computer could handle. My sniper being able to fire further than I could see would be one of my only criticisms of sniping in PS.

[Furret]

I'll agree, it doesn't take skill to hit a target thats standing still in the head.
But if you add bullet drop, it'll take a few seconds to line up. If you're standing around in the open for that long without moving, you're asking to be sniped.

EDIT: as for draw distances, I'm half and half on a maximum draw distance, or having it be an option that you can set.
I think if you could only do damage in a certain range (current draw distance), but could still see that farther distance, the game would stay balanced, and not give too much of an advantage to people with better graphics cards. I will agree, that playing on a supercomputer should not give you the ability to snipe someone from one base to another, but if its a flat stretch, you ought to be able to see almost all the way.

[CutterJohn]

Problem with snipers in PS were they had no counters other than other snipers. In BF style games, sure, they have snipers with 1 shot kills. But those snipers were vulnerable to normal rifle fire, which reached out that far, or to AT weapons which will kill them in one hit, as with grenade launchers. They also tend to have muzzle sway and bullet drop for the snipers, and 15 or 25 bullets.

I can't agree with buffs to sniping like increased range, camo, one shot kills, no bullet trail, without making them much more vulnerable to return fire from non sniper weapons such as MA and AV. I generally just disapprove of the notion of people being able to shoot from safely beyond the reach of others.

[DviddLeff]

Plenty of counters to snipers in PS; mainly aircraft or vehicles.

As infantry its an issue yes, but that's mainly as there's little cover available for infantry out in the world.

If head shots are in I want bullet drop (remember the Phalanx turret already has bullet drop).

[Sirisian]

Heh no counters to snipers. :lol: I use to low bomb them on the ridges or kill them from far away while cloaking.... or boomer them or spitfire them. Snipers are rather vulnerable with their sniper rifle out.

[BorisBlade]

Heh no counters to snipers. :lol: I use to low bomb them on the ridges or kill them from far away while cloaking.... or boomer them or spitfire them. Snipers are rather vulnerable with their sniper rifle out.

Keep in mind that a new ps game wont be so devoid of cover. no more flat surfaces with nothing to hide in. Even some basic foliage will conceal snipers well in any modern game. That alone will be huge for snipers allowing them to hide much better. Bullet tracers need to stay. It adds to the back and forth. Headshots are lame, its far easier to blance this game if they are not allowed. Snipers already do great damage and have a great role. With the addition of more cover they can do even better.

However i do like the idea of some kind of camo, nothing too crazy but somethin above the normal suit. Possibly some sniper only suit with camo that has the inventory of agile (or maybe rexo depending on the bonuses ill mention in a sec), the movment of rexo. And armor between agile and a stealth suit. Its benefits would be the camo and maybe some other sniper bonus like zoom level/bloom reduction speed/advanced targeting/or some other sniper-ish bonuses. Giving it somethin unique is whats key to keeping lots of variety and specialization in the game.

Possibly even have different types of camo you can choose from. Or maybe the suit has different modes of camo you can switch between on the fly. Since the game should have real foliage, you wouldnt use any of the invis crap, but instead you could have a jungle camo, snow camo, desert/brown grass camo, temperate forrest camo, urban camo etc. And i dont just mean the lame "pattern camo" i mean you literally have eitehr the fake foliage on your suits or the more "fluffy" style of suits you see in some of the more modern combat style games. Having it change on the fly definately gives it the more futuristic PS feel and makes it very unique. Having real camo means you could use it well when sniping from cover but not while trying to hide with even some limited invis/transparency option in wide open spaces.

Sniping is very good in PS atm, but there is always room to expand and make it better. Expanding is the key, not redoing core aspects of it (aka instagib head shots and no tracers.)

[Baneblade]

I think bullet tracers across the board are too obvious. The only thing without them are shotguns.

[Traak]

I think bullet tracers across the board are too obvious. The only thing without them are shotguns.

I think unseen and unfindable enemies are just too unbalanced to go without tracers. Reminds me, once again, of UT.

[Senyu]

On regards of bullet tracers, it would be unfair in a practical sense that Vanu weapons are energy thus leaving a trail and the majority of the other factions weapons are bullets. Though removing bullet tracers from weapons ALL factions share would be alright in that sense.

[Baneblade]

I think unseen and unfindable enemies are just too unbalanced to go without tracers. Reminds me, once again, of UT.

Hit Direction is a better way tbh. Let weapons have tracers or not based on what they are. But give all empires weapons that should have them to balance the VS Disco Balls = Might thing.