Kill Streaks

[Snowfake]

Just watched this video YouTube - ***x202a;PlanetSide 2 - Massive Huge Scale PvP Combat***x202c;‏ and the guy mentions how players will have feed back in the form of killing spree popping up.

Its no real big deal really but iv always associated such things as HEAD SHOT! and RAMPAGE! popping up on my screen from games I class as arcade FPS's.

For me Planetside has always been a thinking mans shooter and the fact that they want to include such things in the game make me think its going to be aimed towards the masses and therefore the game will be dumbed down.

Thoughts?

[Bags]

I'm hoping it's either an XP bonus or a little pin ala Battlefield I think it is? As long as it doesn't cover half my screen and doesn't give abilities ala COD I don't care.

The average PS player doesn't get kill streaks.

[2coolforu]

The insta-win AC-130 and Chopper gunner killstreaks in CoD were some of the worst ideas ever, it's a rich get richer, poor get poorer gameplay gambit and rewards camping and using unfair tactics.

Seriously, killstreaks = bad. Oh I see you are dominating n00bs, now get a chopper to dominate them even more! muahaha!

[basti]

I dont want killstreaks at all, as they just add up to the "I DONT WANT TO DIE" crap. Often enough you will end up in a stalemate that you can only break out of by pushing hard. But people dont do that if they then loose their kill streaks.

[Rarntogo]

I absolutely agree with everything said so far. Kill streaks etc... only add selfishness to the game and one of the things I love most about PS is the unselfishness the game is built around. Team based tactics at the forefront. Sure... a single player can just do his own thing and thats fine. No problem with that. I just dont want to see 30 people outside a tower afraid to go in and take it because they are afraid to die. This would bring much sadness to me. If I wanted to play that way I would play one of the other billion FPS games out there. Planetside is different. I hope it always stays that way.

[Bags]

I absolutely agree with everything said so far. Kill streaks etc... only add selfishness to the game and one of the things I love most about PS is the unselfishness the game is built around. Team based tactics at the forefront. Sure... a single player can just do his own thing and thats fine. No problem with that. I just dont want to see 30 people outside a tower afraid to go in and take it because they are afraid to die. This would bring much sadness to me. If I wanted to play that way I would play one of the other billion FPS games out there. Planetside is different. I hope it always stays that way.

People already play selfishly. Those who do will continue to do so, and this just gives them a nice pat on the back. Those who are team players won't be convinced to killwhore just for a pat on the back.

Killwhores gonna killwhore, supportwhores gonna supportwhore.

[BlazingSun]

I think you are again seeing a problem when there is none.

[Gwartham]

No they must buy the rights to sounds from unreal tournament, that's exactly what Pside2 needs!!!!

[Lunarchild]

No they must buy the rights to sounds from unreal tournament, that's exactly what Pside2 needs!!!!

Sexy Announcer (climaxing): Monster Kill!

[LordReaver]

Being rewarded for kill streaks promotes tactics. It doesn't really matter what the rewards are. People play smarter so they can get a better ratio. What you guys really want, is the gameplay to not slow down, which kill streaks do. They already said the gameplay will be faster moment to moment, so I don't think this is something that can really be criticized until we see more of the game.

I wouldn't worry about rewards that net more kills. SOE might make bad decisions sometimes, but they are not that stupid.

[2coolforu]

Being rewarded for maintaining a K/D is the number one way to force people to exploit glitches, camp, use the most horrible tactics and generally create a bad play environment. Not only that but it's a stupid 'rich get richer' promotion, good players get even better and the bad players are put at a huge disadvantage, just look at modern warfare 2 and how many people camp with nothing but explosives and how the kills can suddenly become hugely inbalanced by one lucky killstreak and the hordes of people that disconnect due to an AC-130.

Killstreaks are the No:1 way to alienate the new and less skilled.

[Bags]

Being rewarded for maintaining a K/D is the number one way to force people to exploit glitches, camp, use the most horrible tactics and generally create a bad play environment. Not only that but it's a stupid 'rich get richer' promotion, good players get even better and the bad players are put at a huge disadvantage, just look at modern warfare 2 and how many people camp with nothing but explosives and how the kills can suddenly become hugely inbalanced by one lucky killstreak and the hordes of people that disconnect due to an AC-130.

Killstreaks are the No:1 way to alienate the new and less skilled.

You are rewarded for maintaining a good k/d. You spend less time dead and more time getting more kills. And planetside players are already lame.

Not sure what killstreaks have to do with the rich get richer... so what some dude gets more xp for getting more kills, you should be rewarded for playing well.

[Rbstr]

I really doubt we'd get COD-style killstreaks.

Think BC2, instead. You get some more points..not even that many. Yeah K/D whore snipers are present...but they've been around since the original game, which lacked the point system. People camp because no one likes to die, regardless of extra rewards.

[2coolforu]

You are rewarded for maintaining a good k/d. You spend less time dead and more time getting more kills. And planetside players are already lame.

Not sure what killstreaks have to do with the rich get richer... so what some dude gets more xp for getting more kills, you should be rewarded for playing well.

I'm OK with killstreaks giving a small xp bonus that pops up on your screen, I'm not OK with UAV's and Airstrikes being given out as rewards which is a 'modern FPS style' of Killstreak reward

[Bags]

I'm OK with killstreaks giving a small xp bonus that pops up on your screen, I'm not OK with UAV's and Airstrikes being given out as rewards which is a 'modern FPS style' of Killstreak reward

I'd frankly be shocked if they did this. We already have OS.

[Rbstr]

...Has anyone asked about the return of the OS?

Surely it's skill-tree based?

[Volw]

...Has anyone asked about the return of the OS?

Surely it's skill-tree based?

I think it was mentioned at some point during the q&a ... not 100% sure.

[Bags]

...Has anyone asked about the return of the OS?

Surely it's skill-tree based?

Command Rank has been replaced with a commander cert tree. I imagine CR5 OS is deep down there.

[Higby]

I'd frankly be shocked if they did this. We already have OS.

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

[Bags]

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

>Implying the second scenario won't be balls to the walls fucking awesome.

Anyhow, glad to hear.

[2coolforu]

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

Cthulu as a killstreak reward, hells to the yeah.

[Rbstr]

That was a superb answer in many ways.

[Raymac]

I'm soooo certing Space-Kraken!

[moosepoop]

There are an upside and downside:

kill streaks will slow down the pace of the game, which is GOOD in planetsides case.

on the other hand it discourages teamwork


i also wanna point out while in call of duty players look down on camping, in planetside defence of locations and staying at one place is a vital part of the game.

[SKYeXile]

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

so this is confirmation we wont be seeing any space krakens?

[moosepoop]

the kill streak awards can be abilities that enhance the teammates, instead of abilities that enhance just yourself. maybe a temporary 10% damage buff or resistance

[Bags]

the kill streak awards can be abilities that enhance the teammates, instead of abilities that enhance just yourself. maybe a temporary 10% damage buff or resistance

Or they could be this:

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

[moosepoop]

if they do that theres no point to kill streaks at all. in fact casual people who also played cod would probably complain.

[Bags]

if they do that theres no point to kill streaks at all. in fact casual people who also played cod would probably complain.

Good.

[moosepoop]

good if you wanna play with 150 people on the entire server in 3 years.

[2coolforu]

if they do that theres no point to kill streaks at all. in fact casual people who also played cod would probably complain.

The people who want an AC-130 gunship for camping for a while are exactly the people we don't want.

Also Planetside had almost 100,000 Subscribers in total in its prime - this only dropped due to BFR's and Aftershock

[Bags]

good if you wanna play with 150 people on the entire server in 3 years.

>Implying the part of the call of duty community that would quit over killstreaks is the only part of the FPS community.

[moosepoop]

The people who want an AC-130 gunship for camping for a while are exactly the people we don't want.



even people who dont care about kilstreak will notice, if the game says it has kill streaks and turns out to be a "good job!" pop up.

kill streak came from cod. the overpowered nuke everyone on map mentality comes to mind just by the word killstreak. either make it satisfying or dont include it at all.

[Bags]

even people who dont care about kilstreak will notice, if the game says it has kill streaks and turns out to be a "good job!" pop up.

kill streak came from cod. the overpowered nuke everyone on map mentality comes to mind just by the word killstreak. either make it satisfying or dont include it at all.

I find being told I did a good job and being rewarded bonus xp to be quite satisfying.

We're not all twelve year olds.

[2coolforu]

even people who dont care about kilstreak will notice, if the game says it has kill streaks and turns out to be a "good job!" pop up.

kill streak came from cod. the overpowered nuke everyone on map mentality comes to mind just by the word killstreak. either make it satisfying or dont include it at all.

If someone won't buy a game because of something as small and stupid as lacking a tactical nuke for getting 25 kills then they aren't going to stick around for long because they probably have the attention span of a 2 year old that's drank 5 litres of coffee.

[moosepoop]

kill streak came from call of duty. the word kill streak elicits images of the 25 nuke and rediculous gunship rampages. if planetside uses that word its going to attract those kind of people. and those people are gonna be disappointed and it will lead to massive population loss.

give something tangible and solid or dont include killstreak at all.

[2coolforu]

even people who dont care about kilstreak will notice, if the game says it has kill streaks and turns out to be a "good job!" pop up.

kill streak came from cod. the overpowered nuke everyone on map mentality comes to mind just by the word killstreak. either make it satisfying or dont include it at all.

kill streak came from call of duty. the word kill streak elicits images of the 25 nuke and rediculous gunship rampages. if planetside uses that word its going to attract those kind of people

We don't want that kind of game, this game is called Planetside. If we make it Call of Duty just to attract players Then I may as well buy and play fucking Call Of Duty Comprende?

[Coyote]

I'd like to see Killstreaks in a form of the "Bounty" that Infantry Online (another SOE game. To be considered by myself an MMOFPS, even though it has an Isometric view.) whereas the better you do, the higher your 'bounty', the higher your bounty, the more xp you get from your kills. If you got killed, the person that killed you got your bounty, it is a simple enough system. If you didn't kill someone in a certain amount of time, your bounty expired.

Now since this is an FPS, I don't think it could just be ported from Infantry Online, instead I think it should be looked at as something that goes on in the backround. Maybe a number on your information window when you bring it up to see how you are doing. As you get more and more kills without deaths, you start getting more XP then you would normally. Obviously it could be Meta-gamed, obviously it could be abused, but the XP gain increase shouldn't be an immense thing, like, 2% more exp, or 5% more exp per kill/assist/whatever.

It would at least reward you for not being an idiot and charging in to get 1 kill for 1 life.

It shouldn't reward people that sit around doing nothing though. As in Infantry you'd loose your bounty for going AFK, so it should at least be an active thing to reward decent/lucky active players. It should not be something to depend on to level.

[Bags]

If kill streaks come from Call of Duty then what the fuck are quake and UT?

We don't want that kind of game, this game is called Planetside. If we make it Call of Duty just to attract players Then I may as well buy and play fucking Call Of Duty Comprende?

And this.

[moosepoop]

We don't want that kind of game, this game is called Planetside. If we make it Call of Duty just to attract players Then I may as well buy and play fucking Call Of Duty Comprende?

including the term "killstreak" in the game IS going to attract those kind of players, whether you like it or not. so either give a cool and fun killstreak or dont include it. dont be half assed and limp and try to atttract cod fans, then disappoint them.

[Rbstr]

kill streak came from cod. the overpowered nuke everyone on map mentality comes to mind just by the word killstreak. either make it satisfying or dont include it at all.

No, no it didn't, not unless you've only played one FPS in the last 5 years.
BC2 has reward for kill streaks as does TF2 for some cases, Unreal has had it, without rewards (though, really, M-m-m-MULTI-KILL is it's own reward), forever.
Wolfenstien Enemy territory servers occasionally had both crazy and mundane kill streak rewards. Also counter strike and day of defeat, to name only game's I've played where it's been acknowledged somehow and I remember it.

[Bags]

including the term "killstreak" in the game IS going to attract those kind of players, whether you like it or not. so either give a cool and fun killstreak or dont include it. dont be half assed and limp and try to atttract cod fans, then disappoint them.

You can't be serious that people buy COD solely for killstreaks?

[SKYeXile]

No, no it didn't, not unless you've only played one FPS in the last 5 years.
BC2 has reward for kill streaks as does TF2 for some cases, Unreal has had it, without rewards (though, really, M-m-m-MULTI-KILL is it's own reward), forever.
Wolfenstien Enemy territory servers occasionally had both crazy and mundane kill streak rewards. Also counter strike and day of defeat, to name only game's I've played where it's been acknowledged somehow and I remember it.

UNSTOPABLE!

[moosepoop]

No, no it didn't, not unless you've only played one FPS in the last 5 years.
BC2 has reward for kill streaks as does TF2 for some cases, Unreal has had it, without rewards (though, really, M-m-m-MULTI-KILL is it's own reward), forever.
Wolfenstien Enemy territory servers occasionally had both crazy and mundane kill streak rewards. Also counter strike and day of defeat, to name only game's I've played where it's been acknowledged somehow and I remember it.

people are going to think about modern warfare 2 when they hear killstreak because that game sold millions of copies around the world. not some obscure ancient dinosaurs from before gaming went mainstream.

[Bags]

people are going to think about modern warfare 2 when they hear killstreak because that game sold millions of copies.

when I hear call of duty the first thing that comes to my mind is not kill streak, and vice versa.

[moosepoop]

thats because you probably havent played cod much or have the memory of a goldfish.

i still have nightmares of killcams of aimbotter with the gunship.

the devs mentioned a killstreak reward, most teens are gonna think of cod.

maybe you have some weird age phobia, i want a lot of people to play this game.

[Coyote]

when I hear call of duty the first thing that comes to my mind is not kill streak, and vice versa.

The first thing I think of when I hear Call of Duty is the pandoras box of high-pitched screaming, yelling, crying, racist, anti-everything, cussing, loudmouthing that consists of 96.9% of the entire CoD online community.

I don't want 96.9% of the CoD community in Planetside. It's not my planetside to dictate, but having players that will never be happy will always result in more people being unhappy because of that first person's unhappyness.

[Rbstr]

people are going to think about modern warfare 2 when they hear killstreak because that game sold millions of copies around the world. not some obscure ancient dinosaurs from before gaming went mainstream.

Yeah, Battlefield Bad Company 2 and TF2 are obscure and released before "main stream gaming".

PCs were never used to play games before the Xbox 360 and PS3 were invented. Those consoles were also not the 2nd and 3rd generations of consoles from their respective companies either. I didn't play Goldeneye and boast about going on killing streaks against friends before I could drive a car.

Dude, you're fucking stupid.

[Bags]

thats because you probably havent played cod much or have the memory of a goldfish.

i still have nightmares of killcams of aimbotter with the gunship.

the devs mentioned a killstreak reward, most teens are gonna think of cod.

I asked my friend first thing that comes to mind when I said Call of Duty

"Clusterfuck"

I asked him first thing that comes to mind when i say kill streak

"mm-m-m-m-m-onsterkill kill kill killl"

[moosepoop]

sounds like you guys dont like cod not because of gameplay mechanics, but theres average normal people playing on them. u sound like bitter omega males.

[Evilmp]

PCs were never used to play games.

Agreement is had. All hail notepad.

[Bags]

sounds like you guys dont like cod not because of gameplay mechanics, but theres average normal people playing on them. u sound like bitter omega males.

I just realized I'm arguing with someone named moosepoop.

Why the fuck do I bother...

[moosepoop]

i dont know, but all i wanted to say was if devs mention not just killstreak, but "killstreak rewards", its gonna raise comparison to cod. no need to vent all your omega male rage on me, bro.

*flex biceps

[Coyote]

sounds like you guys dont like cod not because of gameplay mechanics, but theres average normal people playing on them. u sound like bitter omega males.

We don't like CoD not based on all of it's gameplay (to be fair, as far as a full encompassing video game it is fun, and interesting when all players are interested in playing the game)

We don't like CoD based on the fact that is has changed the entire genre for the worse, making our game devs that once wanted to make games fun and interesting look at dollar signs and go "I want dollars. Fuck game design." it's been coming on strong for a long time now, long past are the AAA games being developed for Niche crowds with small audiences, we now need to make dumb games for dumb people (looking at you, Zynga)

We're being elitist not because we're elitist, we're being elitist because the attitude that modern day games brings directly clash with our original ideals and how we 'grew up' in video games. We look back at Nostalgia and see video games you've never heard of before. You look back at Nostalgia and only see games that most will agree, while fun, were damaging to the games industry as a whole and only served to be cash cows in the long run.

I don't think my post made any sense.

[Rbstr]

Funny thing is I've played COD quite a bit. It's more of a real life I can shout at you face-to-face friends game than an internet game.

Compared to staring wonder-eyed at nintendo 64 under the tree when I was 12 to today I see little but a sum-total of progress. Except DLC, that shit is annoying.

[moosepoop]

coyote, im not disagreeing with you that going mainstream, video games have attracted a lot more average people. the jocks in school that used to mock "gamerrrs" now play games too.

im just saying, just dont include killstreak rewards, period, and it would attract less of these people. if the management forces the devs to include it, make it not game breaking, but it has to be still fun and not pointleslly redundant. aight?

*rubs testicles

[Effective]

As long as I can turn off the audio for the kill streaks I'll be fine. I'm one of those players who rely's on sound to the point that if my headset dies I'm about as useless as it's going to get in terms of playing agmes.

Don't want to get 5+ kills only to die to a cloaker I didn't hear pulling his pistol.

[Firefly]

CoD didn't invent killstreaks. What the fuck kind of fairy dust are you smoking?

[ZeroOneZero]

Do we at least get to choose the announcer? If not, then toss that shit in the trash. I don't need to know I'm owning, I can tell just by getting private msgs from the opposing team.

[SKYeXile]

Do we at least get to choose the announcer? If not, then toss that shit in the trash. I don't need to know I'm owning, I can tell just by getting private msgs from the opposing team.

H-H-HH- HACKER!

[ZeroOneZero]

H-H-HH- HACKER!

I've learned from the best
(COD kiddies).:cool:

[moosepoop]

CoD didn't invent killstreaks. What the fuck kind of fairy dust are you smoking?

cod invented killstreak rewards

why are you such a negative nancy

[morf]

cod invented killstreak rewards



Bullshit. I remember kicking a turtle shell in super mario and knocking off 10 turtles and getting a 1up. Pretty sure that was pre-cod.

[krnasaur]

so this is confirmation we wont be seeing any space krakens?

no space krakens= no buy, sorry higby, its a pass

[moosepoop]

sounds like u guys are deeply insecure about call of duty. im glad the developers of plaentside are planning to cater to cod fans, just to make you guys penis invert into your bodies.

[krnasaur]

sounds like u guys are deeply insecure about call of duty. im glad the developers of plaentside are planning to cater to cod fans, just to make you guys penis invert into your bodies.

Cod does some things right, but it does alot wrong.

[Rbstr]

I don't even understand you anymore. You want UAVs and stuff, or not?

[2coolforu]

cod invented killstreak rewards

why are you such a negative nancy

http://verydemotivational.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/demotivational-posters-cant-tell-if-trolling.jpg

[Wakken]

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

I lol'd so hard :lol:

[Rarntogo]

Oh my god. Who let the children out of the playpen? If you want to play COD or whatever game is perfect in your eyes because you get instant gratification (candy when you poo in the toilet instead of your pull ups) then go play it! Leave us grown ups that simply want to have fun without the need for a pat on the back every 30 seconds, alone. I know you might think we need you to tell us what is good, and what isn't, what real fun is....but we don't. We will get along just fine without you. It'll be a struggle but we'll muddle through. Just go away and have your fun.

[Elude]

I better hear things like monster kill and godlike in ps2.

[Wakken]

I better hear things like monster kill and godlike in ps2.

dont forget unstoppable

[BlazingSun]

I know some will cry out loud again, but a small XP bonus for a killstreak would be no mistake. Just a message on the screen that tells me that I'm doing alright in combat, but does nothing else is kind of pointless, as I do not need the message to figure that out.

[Rarntogo]

Originally Posted by Higby View Post
I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

Seeing something like "good Job!' would be fine with me. Nothing wrong with a little recognition. I've played plenty of killwhore deathmatch games and it's fun and all. I would just prefer that Planetside not become one of those. In my opinion PS has never been about just simply getting kills. If I want to get PwNz0r'd but some HaXx0r with 1337 SkiLlz0rz I'll play something else.... ;)

[Death2All]

I'd be shocked also. It's going to be more of the "Good job! you killed 10 dudes in a row without dying, you're doing awesome!" on screen notification variety than "unleash a massive space-kraken on your foes after you kill 10 guys in a row".

I was really against killstreaks in PS till you said this :D

[Aractain]

If you kill someone who is on a kill streak, you should get a xp, resoruce, skill timer bonus lol.

[Gandhi]

If you kill someone who is on a kill streak, you should get a xp, resoruce, skill timer bonus lol.
UT voice: COCKBLOCK!

[Redshift]

Seems a bit silly to reward the killwh0ring rather than the people actually playing the game :P

[Bags]

Seems a bit silly to reward the killwh0ring rather than the people actually playing the game :P

I heard you win the game by throwing yourself at the enemy without firing a shot.

We need support streaks!

[Volw]

I heard you win the game by throwing yourself at the enemy without firing a shot.

We need support streaks!

M-m-m-mmonster Heal!

[Bags]

M-m-m-mmonster Heal!

I would be beyond happy to hear that.

But seriously, if you can revive as medic, why not have revive streaks?

[Zulthus]

M-m-m-mmonster Heal!

LUDICROUS HEAL!!! HOLY SH-

[LordReaver]

Arguments against games designed for the masses are full of shit. You are basically saying the minority is better, but the majority of people seem to disagree with you.

When it comes to games like COD, what you witness is called a "vocal minority". Where the smaller group are more vocal about their beliefs than the "silent majority" a.k.a. the bigger group of people. When this happens, the media get's skewed, because the only data they receive is biased. So it may seem that everybody you meet hates COD, but this is simply not true, and quite the opposite.

Things in COD, like trash talking and nukes are appealing to more people, than they are displeasing. People want to do it, and it's making Activison money. This is why they don't make any real attempts to quell it.

Now games like PS2 work better with a bigger population, so trying to make this game more niche, would actually be worse for the games health. SOE understands this. This is why they are trying all these new things. They are trying to attract more people. Some of the things might put off PS1 players, but honestly, they are trying to make the game better overall.

[Hamma]

Well said!

[ShowNoMercy]

I play as a medic/hack/gal pilot primarily. If they add kill streaks then i was support streaks dammit. if i drop 10 people out of a gal, and they get 10 kills, i want a 10 support streak. If i heal someone then res another then heal yet another and they go on to kill 5 people, you guessed it - 5 support streak.

These guys can't just cater to the kill whores. This is an all fps, and the largest mmo is an rpg. They need to accentuate some aspects of the game that an rpg player might find more appealing, I.E. flying/driving in a non-combat capacity or being an engineer/medic/hacker. Maybe crafting too, wait nvm thats a horrible idea

[Tool]

Arguments against games designed for the masses are full of shit. You are basically saying the minority is better, but the majority of people seem to disagree with you.

When it comes to games like COD, what you witness is called a "vocal minority". Where the smaller group are more vocal about their beliefs than the "silent majority" a.k.a. the bigger group of people. When this happens, the media get's skewed, because the only data they receive is biased. So it may seem that everybody you meet hates COD, but this is simply not true, and quite the opposite.

Things in COD, like trash talking and nukes are appealing to more people, than they are displeasing. People want to do it, and it's making Activison money. This is why they don't make any real attempts to quell it.

Now games like PS2 work better with a bigger population, so trying to make this game more niche, would actually be worse for the games health. SOE understands this. This is why they are trying all these new things. They are trying to attract more people. Some of the things might put off PS1 players, but honestly, they are trying to make the game better overall.

Agree 100%, thank you.

PS2 doesn't have to be a Battlefield or CoD clone but it can't be a PS1 clone and hope to succeed either.

[2coolforu]

Arguments against games designed for the masses are full of shit. You are basically saying the minority is better, but the majority of people seem to disagree with you.

When it comes to games like COD, what you witness is called a "vocal minority". Where the smaller group are more vocal about their beliefs than the "silent majority" a.k.a. the bigger group of people. When this happens, the media get's skewed, because the only data they receive is biased. So it may seem that everybody you meet hates COD, but this is simply not true, and quite the opposite.

Things in COD, like trash talking and nukes are appealing to more people, than they are displeasing. People want to do it, and it's making Activison money. This is why they don't make any real attempts to quell it.

Now games like PS2 work better with a bigger population, so trying to make this game more niche, would actually be worse for the games health. SOE understands this. This is why they are trying all these new things. They are trying to attract more people. Some of the things might put off PS1 players, but honestly, they are trying to make the game better overall.

Although the argument only works if the games are in the same genre, whereas Planetside and CoD are aimed at a totally different platform and have a very different genre. Even with the FPS genre there are plenty of sub-genre's to be decided from, even then argument from majority is totally bogus anyway, I bet a lot of the people in Call of Duty love killstreaks when they get them but conversely when they join a game in which the opposition has an AC-130, Chopper-Gunner and two harriers camping their spawn they just instantly quit out of it.

Even then is 'Call of Duty' the majority, it isn't on the PC gaming platform by quite a way.If I asked the average xbox player what a 'dedicated server' was they probably wouldn't know or care, does that mean servers are a bad idea for Planetside? You see how this argument breaks down across such a generic and multi-platform game like CoD?

I'm all for having player skill be rewarded though, I'd like killing sprees to be registered but not rewarded with something like a death-raining AC-130. But it's been made clear that this isn't the case, I'd rather have a system like Battlefield's where every small assistance is counted and rewarded, you get points for assisting in kills, points for spotting enemies, points for suppressing an enemy. Similarly people who drive a tank should get 'assist sprees' or at least be rewarded for driving the vehicle efficiently, people who heal many people should be rewarded, people who deploy combat engineering that is very effective and does a lot of damage should be given rewards.

There are limitations to how much can be tracked and rewarded obviously, but kills shouldn't be given all the limelight.

[Raymac]

Now games like PS2 work better with a bigger population, so trying to make this game more niche, would actually be worse for the games health. SOE understands this. This is why they are trying all these new things. They are trying to attract more people. Some of the things might put off PS1 players, but honestly, they are trying to make the game better overall.

This is an extremely important point that we all need to remember to keep perspective. The devs have made it abundantly clear as of late that they want and value our feedback, but it's going to be up to them to weigh our opinions. Right now we are a minority, but an important minority. I don't think we want PS2 to be a niche game just for us. We want it to be a massive success that we can enjoy for the next decade.

[Kietharr]

There needs to be an option to turn them off, otherwise I don't care about kill streaks or achievements so long as they don't give you any real advantage. I don't think you should get an OS for getting 50 kills in a row, pretty sure that's now how the military works IRL either.

Below this line is a long somewhat unrelated rant, read at your own risk.
__________________________________________________ ___________

Lordreaver, keep in mind that that is what makes ACTIVISION and CALL OF DUTY money. This is PLANETSIDE. The fanbase does not necessarily have that much of an overlap. Many people who play Call of Duty like it because of the theme, they like the 'modern warfare' fighting in the desert aesthetic, they feel that it makes the game cool or realistic. A game with laser guns or magic spells won't necessarily appeal to them. I think SOE would be smarter to try to work to reclaim the playerbase of Planetside and the playerbases of similar sci-fi games.

There's this strange idea in the industry that niche games are inherently less profitable than broader games. This simply is not true whatsoever. Take for example, DAO verses DA2. DAO was much more of a niche game than DA2. It took more after classic DND style gameplay, though it wasn't as oldschool as something like Icewind Dale, it was definitely a more traditional, niche fantasy RPG.

DA2 was homogenized and simplified to appeal to the masses. It sold less than half the number of copies that DAO did in the first 10 weeks. It's MUCH easier to convince a Fantasy RPG fan to play a Fantasy RPG game than it is to convince a 'modern warfare' FPS fan to play a Fantasy RPG game. That simple fact keeps niche games in a much healthier spot than people seem to realize. Hell, ever played the Witcher? I think that game was about as niche as you could possibly get and it was still pretty profitable.

If I wanted to play Call of Duty I'd go buy it. I don't think all games should try to mimic them or use Call of Duty mechanics as an industry standard just because more people play it. Hell, World of Warcraft is the most popular MMO in the world, should Planetside try to mimic their mechanics because 'that's obviously what players want'?

Also keep in mind that COD hasn't even outsold Ape Escape (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises) yet, should SOE consider adding an ape capturing minigame to draw in the huge Ape Escape fanbase? If they did would you still defend it as them trying to make the game better overall?

[2coolforu]

Also bear in mind CoD's fanbase is mostly in consoles and they won't change easily, it seems like a good idea:

1 : Introduce CoD Style Gameplay
2 : CoD fans like that
3 : ?????
3 : 12 Million people buy the game
4 : Profit

However people won't change brands easily, they'll buy CoD because it's what they know, there are plenty of games that have tried to copy call of duty and they have all failed. Games like Homefront have totally flopped and basically gone dead within months, others like Bad Company and Bad Company 2 have enjoyed some success but are still own a fraction of CoD's base, and with Battlefield it has gone from one of the fundamental PC gaming titles with lots of E-Sports coverage - 2142 and Battlefield 2 were massive games - to moderately successful games with some critical acclaim,

Just look at the Xbox live most played games

http://majornelson.com/2011/05/25/live-activity-for-week-of-may-16/

Even Call of Duty 4 has more players than B:BC2, GTA IV also; I play on the Xbox and GTA IV and CoD 4 are effectively dead and these are getting more UU's than BC2. Copying CoD is not the way to go, the best thing to do is make a good, unique game, which seems to be what the devs are doing. Obviously it can't be Planetside 1 as the genre and tech have come quite a way, the gameplay needs to be sped up, the UI needs to be flashier and elements like headshots and upgrades need to be put in because that's what people expect.

However copying CoD and expecting the gamers to flood in has never been a good strategy and inevitably the developers that did this have produced games that drop out of memory fast and die quick deaths. I mean how many people remember GRAW 2, Rainbow Six Vegas 2? There are plenty of CoD clones out there.

[Tool]

There needs to be an option to turn them off, otherwise I don't care about kill streaks or achievements so long as they don't give you any real advantage. I don't think you should get an OS for getting 50 kills in a row, pretty sure that's now how the military works IRL either.

Below this line is a long somewhat unrelated rant, read at your own risk.
__________________________________________________ ___________

Lordreaver, keep in mind that that is what makes ACTIVISION and CALL OF DUTY money. This is PLANETSIDE. The fanbase does not necessarily have that much of an overlap. Many people who play Call of Duty like it because of the theme, they like the 'modern warfare' fighting in the desert aesthetic, they feel that it makes the game cool or realistic. A game with laser guns or magic spells won't necessarily appeal to them. I think SOE would be smarter to try to work to reclaim the playerbase of Planetside and the playerbases of similar sci-fi games.

There's this strange idea in the industry that niche games are inherently less profitable than broader games. This simply is not true whatsoever. Take for example, DAO verses DA2. DAO was much more of a niche game than DA2. It took more after classic DND style gameplay, though it wasn't as oldschool as something like Icewind Dale, it was definitely a more traditional, niche fantasy RPG.

DA2 was homogenized and simplified to appeal to the masses. It sold less than half the number of copies that DAO did in the first 10 weeks. It's MUCH easier to convince a Fantasy RPG fan to play a Fantasy RPG game than it is to convince a 'modern warfare' FPS fan to play a Fantasy RPG game. That simple fact keeps niche games in a much healthier spot than people seem to realize. Hell, ever played the Witcher? I think that game was about as niche as you could possibly get and it was still pretty profitable.

If I wanted to play Call of Duty I'd go buy it. I don't think all games should try to mimic them or use Call of Duty mechanics as an industry standard just because more people play it. Hell, World of Warcraft is the most popular MMO in the world, should Planetside try to mimic their mechanics because 'that's obviously what players want'?

Also keep in mind that COD hasn't even outsold Ape Escape (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises) yet, should SOE consider adding an ape capturing minigame to draw in the huge Ape Escape fanbase? If they did would you still defend it as them trying to make the game better overall?

Dispite the bit of Logic Leaping you have in your post, your point is understandable. Planetside was unique in a few ways but at it's core is an FPS. In todays FPS games it's apparent what players gravitate to as far as gameplay is concerned.

Nine years ago those trends were not as defined nor technology close to what it is today. Much of what made Planetside what it was, was not necessarily due to a solid design choice but rather a comprimise. It's clear the PS1 team was unable to do much of what they wanted to accomplish, which in many ways differed more than what PS1 ended up being than what they aim to create in PS2.

Some games do things right while doing other things poorly. Without looking at those things they did right, learning from them, then building upon them in your own way no progress will be made.

Planetside must succeed, not only for Sony but for the potential of the MMOFPS genre as a whole. It needs to innovate, show the possibilities, draw in players from many games who can safely say that this is the definitive MMO to play.

[Raymac]

Look, Planetside 2 isn't going to be be Call of Duty or Battlefield, but it will incorporate some of their features not all of their features. It's that simple and shouldn't be that controversial. In fact, I think SOE would be extremely foolish if they tried to make a huge mmofps without looking at what fps games are doing currently.

[Kietharr]

Another example of corporate failure applicable to this situation is the failure of Wal-Mart in Germany (http://www.atlantic-times.com/archive_detail.php?recordID=615). Wal-Mart looked at the German market and said 'well, our model is PERFECT in America! These people will LOVE it!' and proceeded to open and close their stores within a few years, taking a billion dollar loss.

They overlooked the fundamental fact that GERMANS are not AMERICANS. I think DA2 made a similar mistake by assuming that by making the game easier and more friendly to FPS gamers they'd get FPS gamers into the market. They utterly failed and managed to piss off their original fanbase in the process which is going to cost thousands of sales of DA3 because COD players are generally not Fantasy RPG players.

I'm not saying that Planetside 2 should be nothing more than a prettier version of Planetside, but SOE needs to take a good hard look at what they're doing before they do it with this sort of thing. Blindly lunging at new mechanics because 'the other guys are doing it with their customers and it works' is a recipe for disaster, not success.

[Tool]

Another example of corporate failure applicable to this situation is the failure of Wal-Mart in Germany (http://www.atlantic-times.com/archive_detail.php?recordID=615). Wal-Mart looked at the German market and said 'well, our model is PERFECT in America! These people will LOVE it!' and proceeded to open and close their stores within a few years, taking a billion dollar loss.

They overlooked the fundamental fact that GERMANS are not AMERICANS. I think DA2 made a similar mistake by assuming that by making the game easier and more friendly to FPS gamers they'd get FPS gamers into the market. They utterly failed and managed to piss off their original fanbase in the process which is going to cost thousands of sales of DA3 because COD players are generally not Fantasy RPG players.

I'm not saying that Planetside 2 should be nothing more than a prettier version of Planetside, but SOE needs to take a good hard look at what they're doing before they do it with this sort of thing. Blindly lunging at new mechanics because 'the other guys are doing it with their customers and it works' is a recipe for disaster, not success.

Do you feel that's what they're doing? "Blindly lunging at new mechanics?" Trust me, I do understand your criticism and in a lot of ways you have very valid points. However little is known aside from SOEs intention of drawing more FPS players in. How far the difference between PS1 and PS2 is yet to be fully understood, crying foul now seems like your jumping the gun a bit does it not?

[Kietharr]

Do you feel that's what they're doing? "Blindly lunging at new mechanics?" Trust me, I do understand your criticism and in a lot of ways you have very valid points. However little is known aside from SOEs intention of drawing more FPS players in. How far the difference between PS1 and PS2 is yet to be fully understood, crying foul now seems like your jumping the gun a bit does it not?

SOE has a history of doing this. See SWG's CU which made the game more like WoW, dozens of patches and expansions targeted at making EQ2 more like WoW, ect. Then see the populations of said games collapsing, the changes were made in response to falling populations but instead of stemming the loss they exacerbated it.

[Tool]

SOE has a history of doing this. See SWG's CU which made the game more like WoW, dozens of patches and expansions targeted at making EQ2 more like WoW, ect. Then see the populations of said games collapsing, the changes were made in response to falling populations but instead of stemming the loss they exacerbated it.

You do have me there, they have made a lot of mistakes in the past, it would seem silly not to assume past mistakes can't be repeated.

At this point it's mostly an argument about preferences in gameplay. Some people feel strongly one way or another. While others just hope to see PS2 succeed either way.

I try to look at the announced changes in an optomistic light and to me much of it is very logical from both a buisness perspective and gameplay perspective. I would not have said the same thing about the CU or NGE if they were explained and tested before release however.

We'll have to wait for more information I guess to make really sound judgments on how things are or should be.

[Rbstr]

Well, to be honest, SWG's combat system was terribly broken when I was playing...which I believe was prior to the CU. You simply had to have doctor buffs to even wear worthwhile armour. Mind/action/hp was cool, but the way abilities used them ending up killing yourself.

[Bags]

There needs to be an option to turn them off, otherwise I don't care about kill streaks or achievements so long as they don't give you any real advantage. I don't think you should get an OS for getting 50 kills in a row, pretty sure that's now how the military works IRL either.



Higby confirmed that killstreaks are just pats on the back and don't reward you with anything like an OS.

I recommend reading this post: http://www.planetside-universe.com/forums/showpost.php?p=573319&postcount=1

[Tool]

Well, to be honest, SWG's combat system was terribly broken when I was playing...which I believe was prior to the CU. You simply had to have doctor buffs to even wear worthwhile armour. Mind/action/hp was cool, but the way abilities used them ending up killing yourself.

Oh absolutely, Pre-CU gameplay in SWG wasn't without its faults but one cannot ignore the outcry which dwarfed the release of BFRs, that came with the NGE release.
The failure to work with very players who were voicing their opinions left ripples through SOE and it's games. A whole team has been deticated to creating their own server featuring that pre-CU gameplay, from the ground up mind you, for a few years now. Something like that should speak volumes.

It was that mistake of doing what SOE thought was best and failing; not only the referenced example but others, although perhaps less impacting, have taken place.

So there is justification for having doubt, even with a new title.

[Kietharr]

Well, to be honest, SWG's combat system was terribly broken when I was playing...which I believe was prior to the CU. You simply had to have doctor buffs to even wear worthwhile armour. Mind/action/hp was cool, but the way abilities used them ending up killing yourself.

SWG's combat was no gem but doctor buffs were pretty much the root cause of nearly all of the inherent imbalances in it. What they should've done was toned those down and toned player damage down a bit, instead they revamped the entire system in what may have been the overreaction of the decade.

Aside from craptacular combat, pre CU SWG was probably the best sandbox MMO ever made. The crafting, the skill system, both were the best I've ever had the pleasure of using. But unfortunately they're both gone now.

Also the entertainment system was revolutionary but the only game that actually picked up on that (and improved on it to boot) was LOTRO. I still don't quite understand why no other major MMORPG since has done it, it was surprisingly popular even for how simplistic it was.

[headcrab13]

I dont want killstreaks at all, as they just add up to the "I DONT WANT TO DIE" crap. Often enough you will end up in a stalemate that you can only break out of by pushing hard. But people dont do that if they then loose their kill streaks.

You could also balance that out by rewarding courageous players who charge into a hail of gunfire and manage to take a few enemies with them. That way you could either get a bonus from a string of kills out in the open (say knifing a line of snipers on a ridge) or get a bonus from rushing a red-hot tower door and surviving for a certain amount of time or pushing the enemy back.

Let's be honest though, we've all had those days where you run solo through a tower and gun down ten people in a row, and it'd be nice to get some kind of recognition or bonus for it.

-HC13

[Headrattle]

SOE has a history of doing this. See SWG's CU which made the game more like WoW, dozens of patches and expansions targeted at making EQ2 more like WoW, ect. Then see the populations of said games collapsing, the changes were made in response to falling populations but instead of stemming the loss they exacerbated it.

Not only SOE but much of the MMOFPS world seems to do it. One of the reasons that most new MMORPGs fail is because they try to emulate WoW too much. The problem is that WoW already does WoW and dragging players away from WoW to play a different game that has many of the same game mechanics just doesn't seem to work. You need to be different. Having Planetside 2 contain a lot of factors that seemingly make CoD successful will make for an unsuccessful game. COD already has a place. You need to make something better. And that is the tricky part.

IMO: Killstreaks should have an Xp bonus and maybe a little "hey good job" but that is it.

[Hamma]

Which is what they are going to be! :D

[Tybo]

Being rewarded for maintaining a K/D is the number one way to force people to exploit glitches, camp, use the most horrible tactics and generally create a bad play environment. Not only that but it's a stupid 'rich get richer' promotion, good players get even better and the bad players are put at a huge disadvantage, just look at modern warfare 2 and how many people camp with nothing but explosives and how the kills can suddenly become hugely inbalanced by one lucky killstreak and the hordes of people that disconnect due to an AC-130.

Killstreaks are the No:1 way to alienate the new and less skilled.

Bingo.

[megamold]

Bingo.

its been confirmed that there will be no advantage to be had with killstreaks except for a little xp and a "pat on the back" i dont see how this can in any way give ppl incentive to be tards, killstreaks or not everyone still counts how many kills they have made ( holy warmonger 5 kills in a row im AWESOME ) exept now you will get a message that says how much you rock and give you a small treat for it

i would also like to point out that there are 2 types of killstreaks , call of duty style or unreal tournament style.
the difference being that in cod every kill you make counts toward your killstreak as long as you survive
in UT its only a double kill if you kill the 2nd guy within 2 seconds of the previous kill
a UT style killstreak system would mean that these streaks are for the assault type players or for the "cannon fodder" ( and lets just admit that every army needs cannon fodder :) )
and i dont see a problem in rewarding players who go "balls to the walls" insane into the courtyard so that the others can stream in, with a little extra xp and a "hey good job man !"

and what i take out of the q&a is that you will be rewarded for teamwork more then for killstreaks with commanders setting missions for other players wich reward with xp and whatnot
more xp from capture when in squads etc etc ...
these are all ways to get players to be active in squads and tactics and the war as a whole
i also dont think that killstreaks will be one of the key selling point for the game ( hey buy this game it has killstreaks just like in cod !!! ) i think they will have much more interesting things to attract ppl with, just off the top of my head : hey buy this game it has massive battles with thousands of players at once !

and unless i'm mistaken the real world army does pretty much the same thing , dang you killed 50 enemy's and showed complete bravery and skill in holding that line , here have the medal of honor

edit: i know the moh is only awarded very rarely but you get my point :)

[Chaff]

I dont care much for kill streaks, but it can be a decent barometer of a players skill.

Me ? I don't want to hear any trumpets go off when someone hits a particular kill streak number. If a player hits a milestone it can be a private acknowledgement. If some Global chat message goes out to acknowledge a kill streak, than that clown should be marked for death.....once you're over 10 in a row.....everyone over BR15 has him on their map.....after 15 kills in a row....everyone over BR12 has them on their map....after they go over 20 in a row, both enemy empires can see this asshat is "special" and hunt him for a little XP and the thrill of putting a huge ego in check.

If a KIll Streak goes in PS2, it needs countermeasures. Maybe those with Adv Targeting implants get a extra "boost" on their radar, so there is a sliding scale that works against kill streak arrtists (kill whoring).

Killl a guy on a Killstreak - and you should get a little extra XP/BEP

....the longer the Kill Streak....the more enemy players can see him on their radar....kind of a Kill Whore Bounty to keep people from obsessing on a killstreak at the expense of their squad/empire objectives.

ALSO;

When I hear CALL OF DOODY

....I think of a piece of shit with a cell phone butt-dialing me.....

[Death2All]

I dont care much for kill streaks, but it can be a decent barometer of a players skill.

Me ? I don't want to hear any trumpets go off when someone hits a particular kill streak number. If a player hits a milestone it can be a private acknowledgement. If some Global chat message goes out to acknowledge a kill streak, than that clown should be marked for death.....once you're over 10 in a row.....everyone over BR15 has him on their map.....after 15 kills in a row....everyone over BR12 has them on their map....after they go over 20 in a row, both enemy empires can see this asshat is "special" and hunt him for a little XP and the thrill of putting a huge ego in check.

If a KIll Streak goes in PS2, it needs countermeasures. Maybe those with Adv Targeting implants get a extra "boost" on their radar, so there is a sliding scale that works against kill streak arrtists (kill whoring).

Killl a guy on a Killstreak - and you should get a little extra XP/BEP

....the longer the Kill Streak....the more enemy players can see him on their radar....kind of a Kill Whore Bounty to keep people from obsessing on a killstreak at the expense of their squad/empire objectives.

ALSO;

When I hear CALL OF DOODY

....I think of a piece of shit with a cell phone butt-dialing me.....

Why punish a player who is doing well? What purpose does that serve? Yeah, he gets extra XP for his streak, but why does he have to appear on everyone's radar just because he's doing well? You said if there's a global message announcing it, but you went on to elaborate in great detail what should happen so it leads me to believe you want this for killstreaks no matter what.

In my opinion you should be given a message like what Higby said "Good job on killing those people blah blah blah" and maybe a small XP reward/bonus for your streak. Nothing to major so it doesn't promote camping, but just enough to make you feel good for getting that streak.

But in my honest opinion killstreaks promote camping no matter what and put an emphasis on K/D. Emphasis on K/D is god awful for an objective game and shouldn't even be part of it.

Plenty of people play way more defensively when going for merits in PS1. Mostly in part to how the "unique" kill system works. The player had to of been a life for about 30 seconds (not sure on that) and you had to of not killed them 30 minutes prior (or that) for it to count as a kill for your streak. So if I just happen to kill some guy who has only been alive for 20 seconds and then I encounter him again after he's been alive for 2 minutes, because I killed him before and it hasn't been 30 minutes it doesn't count towards my streak. You play defensive as all Hell so you can get your crappy pixelated merit that you can wear on your arm that no one will recognize or care about but you.

Add in game actual bonuses for getting a streak? Campfest 2012. I know I added what I wanted if there were to be a reward for killstreaks. I don't want them in game at all, but if there absolutely has to be them then that would be the system I'd be most happy with.

[Chaff]

DeeTwoEh,

Can't argue with your counter-post. Even though you seemed opposed to my post you still come across as anti-camping.
My ideas may be too much, but I'm looking for ways to minimize target practice for ego. PLAY THE GAME of PLANETSIDE - not some arcade-like quest for top-score. Keep TEAMwork at a premium. Guys will always solo. Keep cooperation, Squad play, Outfit play, and empire play as the prime mechanisms to progress in the game.

I want a game where 99% of the players are focusing on the Squad/Outfit/Empire mission and not worrying or even paying attention to K/D ratios. Check your stats when you log off or on.

I'm not sure how to do this (minimize camping). I'm anti-camping/farming. You're right that good/better players should not be punished. Puttting a bounty on them after a certain streak level raises the stakes for a player who is focused on their streak. It doesn't punish them as much as it may serve to keep them in check and make it too frustrating to pursue Stat-Camping for super-long periods of time.
I think some counter measure(s) to camping may be valid. I'm babbling now......

[1Shotwonder]

Just hope they just dont pop up and block your view of what your doing cant tell you how many times ive been killed by that and I think it will be pretty gay unless they put it in the chat box top message or something.... its really uneeded

[Bags]

Just hope they just dont pop up and block your view of what your doing cant tell you how many times ive been killed by that and I think it will be pretty gay unless they put it in the chat box top message or something.... its really uneeded

Yeah, if I just killed five people in a row without dying I'm pretty sure I can figure out on my own that I'm doing a bitchin' job.