How Big Are The Maps?

[Firefly]

I've seen a few people wondering how big the maps are in Planetside 2, with at least one comment along the lines of, the maps don't look that big because of the bases. Ignoring that, because I think the bases are probably twice as big as the original game, I found this image online whilst researching another MMO.

The image below is a stack of maps that show just how large many video game worlds are. With this comparison, now you can make your own determination as to how large Planetside's continents will be. I'm only posting the link since PSU's forums automatically resize an image.

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2011/11/dfda00860c2fb9fd3d17030d5a70c2c1.jpg

[SuperMorto]

Load of info here about this

http://www.planetside-universe.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38452

And there is another post somewhere but I cant put my finger on it!

Edit ahhh right I see what you mean, we can only imagine for now, we have a 95% complete map, but thats it, the rest will be speculation for now.

[Vash02]

LOTRO 30,000 square miles? I've played that game alot, its big but it aint that big. I could run end to end in an hour or so.

how many of these figures are actually equivalent to real life?

[bjorntju1]

I've seen a few people wondering how big the maps are in Planetside 2, with at least one comment along the lines of, the maps don't look that big because of the bases. Ignoring that, because I think the bases are probably twice as big as the original game, I found this image online whilst researching another MMO.

The image below is a stack of maps that show just how large many video game worlds are. With this comparison, now you can make your own determination as to how large Planetside's continents will be. I'm only posting the link since PSU's forums automatically resize an image.

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2011/11/dfda00860c2fb9fd3d17030d5a70c2c1.jpg
Wtf? Burnout Paradise's map is bigger than WoW?

But anyway, Higby said in a interview (http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/10/26/planetside-2-battles-set-on-eight-by-eight-kilometre-continents/) that the continents are 8x8 km in size. As far as i know that is the only info we have at this moment.

[LZachariah]

I believe I heard that each continent is 14 k. sq. That's pretty damn big, especially if each block of it is jam-packed with important terrain (ie, crags, trees, rivers, etc). In the gameplay video, there was one open stretch of flat desert (wherein the Prowler tanks were fighting... each other, it seemed :D ) but apart from that, the terrain was diverse and complex.

And for the record, 30,000 sq. kilos (for Lord of the Rings) sounds insanely large; I imagine that figure is incorrect.

~Zachariah

[Vash02]

There does seem to be alot of bullshitting in regards to map sizes by game devs. someone with a twitter account pester Higby if his 8x8 km number is actually 8x8 km in the real world.

[EASyEightyEight]

In most cases, it's based on the units of measurement presented in game. 10 meters in Planetside may be a longer distance than 10 meters in WoW. The characters might just travel faster in game A than they do in game B, artificially shrinking the map. Etc.

The maps are to be taken with a grain of salt. I wouldn't consider them very accurate, since it's impossible to maintain any kind of consistency in measurements between them.

[Quantumplation]

In the gameplay video, there was one open stretch of flat desert (wherein the Prowler tanks were fighting... each other, it seemed :D ) but apart from that, the terrain was diverse and complex.

~Zachariah

Keep in mind that "diverse and complex" terrain doesn't mean every bit of the terrain is hilly, cliffy, craggy, etc. In order to have good variety, there does need to be large stretches of flat terrain, because something like that has it's own tactical implications and leads to completely different battles (like the prowler fight you saw there vs an infantry invasion of a mountainside.)

[SuperMorto]

Keep in mind that "diverse and complex" terrain doesn't mean every bit of the terrain is hilly, cliffy, craggy, etc. In order to have good variety, there does need to be large stretches of flat terrain, because something like that has it's own tactical implications and leads to completely different battles (like the prowler fight you saw there vs an infantry invasion of a mountainside.)

Honestly man, imagine a flat large plane, and your on foot alone, and all you see is a 100 Scythes inbound!

HOLLLYYYY FOOKINGGG HELLL!!!!!

I cant wait for this game!

Sorry to go off topic.

[Hamma]

Cool image Firefly!

I had the same response about LoTRO.. but I havent played it since the first year it came out I know they have added on to it.

[Stevo IRL]

Hopefully though their won't be tons of "dead" space. Other large scale games like Arma do , imo, a decent job of creating a interesting world to observe while driving through or flying over. Hopefully the map won't be littered with generic road to base A,B,C. Would like to see some variation and not giant motorways heading towards all the bases.

[SuperMorto]

I have a strange feeling every map will be very different this time, well they where different is PS, just the PC powers back then couldn't really handle much, but now the brush is much smaller and the canvas is way way bigger. And all of what we have seen so far looks fantastic. I would like to see a baron continent, a place where you would most certainly die if you got caught short.

I still think we are going to have base A, B, C, D on each cont, but they will be better placed and much more detailed. As we all know every base looked the same in PS lol.

[Stevo IRL]

I have a strange feeling every map will be very different this time, well they where different is PS, just the PC powers back then couldn't really handle much, but now the brush is much smaller and the canvas is way way bigger. And all of what we have seen so far looks fantastic. I would like to see a baron continent, a place where you would most certainly die if you got caught short.

I still think we are going to have base A, B, C, D on each cont, but they will be better placed and much more detailed. As we all know every base looked the same in PS lol.

Well I do hope they have taken some real world inspirations when designing some of the layouts for the maps. Aesthetics are definitely going to be very different (we'v seen a very Red Faction inspired Cont already) but I would be somewhat disappointed if the layout of routes to bases was a simple node based system where every road was pretty much a straight path. I think this is the harder thing for designers to account for because in other large scale games you could just say "Well this is a straight road but we ll have it run through a small village that will act as a cross roads of some sort" thus giving some form of variation of the landscape while travelling.

At the end of the day you'd want "artificially" create hot spots that may not be player capture able but still hold strategic importance though in PS1 it always seemed to equate to "a bridge". Even if it was something small as a small mining village with two to three buildings next to a road it would add so much in terms of adding atmosphere to the maps but also adding in subtle strategic objectives.

[Miir]

I did my best to recreate the map of Indar based on the screen shots. Assuming the 8km x 8km is correct you can see how it compares to BF3 Caspian Border at the bottom.

On Caspian border from end to end of the 1.7km took (approx):
3 min 30 seconds on foot (full sprint)
1 min 37 seconds in a tank
19 seconds in jet (no afterburner)
30 seconds in a helicopter

http://s224245511.onlinehome.us/INDAR.jpg
http://s224245511.onlinehome.us/INDAR.jpg

[acosmo]

hopefully indar is only a test continent then

[Stevo IRL]

hopefully indar is only a test continent then

Hope so cause it seems a bit blandish.

[Quantumplation]

That map seems misleadingly oversimplified. The terrain looks far more varied and hand-crafted in these screenshots:

Here, (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1754) and
Here, (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1766) and
Here. (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1761)

Also keep in mind, it looks like almost every screenshot we've gotten is from the area depicted by that third picture (base sitting between some craggy mountains), so the amount of variety from that one location is very promising.

[Stevo IRL]

That map seems misleadingly oversimplified. The terrain looks far more varied and hand-crafted in these screenshots:

Here, (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1754) and
Here, (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1766) and
Here. (http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/viewer.php?img_id=1761)

Also keep in mind, it looks like almost every screenshot we've gotten is from the area depicted by that third picture (base sitting between some craggy mountains), so the amount of variety from that one location is very promising.

This for me is the most encourage SS.

http://www.planetside-universe.com/media/main/psnext/twitter/20111117_4ec5ab0f19883.jpg

Looks like there could be small hubs near crossroads.

[Ailos]

Caspian border is one of the largest ever maps for the Battlefield series. MW and BF fanboys will have a meltdown if they step foot on even the smallest of PS2's continents.

As far as size goes, I wouldn't be worried about it too much. I think from the Firefly's comparison picture, TD2U should be the next realistic approach (since that game also HAS to use at least semi-realistic sizes because it's a realistic driving sim). But it being so much larger in appearance could probably be primarily attributed to the fact that the whole point of the game is to drive FAST. From point A to point B on roads. While PS2 will have roads, nobody says we need ever follow them. So even though the continent is smaller it'll feel a lot bigger simply because there is meaningful real estate spaced closer together. Whereas in PS1 batllefronts moved 200-600 meters at a time (from one bridge to the next, or from one cliff to the next), battlefronts in BF2/3 move only 10-20 meters at a time (from one building to the next). I would anticipate PS2's frontlines to behave closer to their BF3 counterparts.

[DviddLeff]

PS had most map sizes of 8x8 with cyssor 12x12 or so I thought?

[Levente]

Caspian border is one of the largest ever maps for the Battlefield series. MW and BF fanboys will have a meltdown if they step foot on even the smallest of PS2's continents.

As far as size goes, I wouldn't be worried about it too much. I think from the Firefly's comparison picture, TD2U should be the next realistic approach (since that game also HAS to use at least semi-realistic sizes because it's a realistic driving sim). But it being so much larger in appearance could probably be primarily attributed to the fact that the whole point of the game is to drive FAST. From point A to point B on roads. While PS2 will have roads, nobody says we need ever follow them. So even though the continent is smaller it'll feel a lot bigger simply because there is meaningful real estate spaced closer together. Whereas in PS1 batllefronts moved 200-600 meters at a time (from one bridge to the next, or from one cliff to the next), battlefronts in BF2/3 move only 10-20 meters at a time (from one building to the next). I would anticipate PS2's frontlines to behave closer to their BF3 counterparts.

Caspian border is one of the smallest in bf history my friend. El Alamein is still the biggest map in BF

[Erendil]

Well I do hope they have taken some real world inspirations when designing some of the layouts for the maps. Aesthetics are definitely going to be very different (we'v seen a very Red Faction inspired Cont already) but I would be somewhat disappointed if the layout of routes to bases was a simple node based system where every road was pretty much a straight path. I think this is the harder thing for designers to account for because in other large scale games you could just say "Well this is a straight road but we ll have it run through a small village that will act as a cross roads of some sort" thus giving some form of variation of the landscape while travelling.

At the end of the day you'd want "artificially" create hot spots that may not be player capture able but still hold strategic importance though in PS1 it always seemed to equate to "a bridge". Even if it was something small as a small mining village with two to three buildings next to a road it would add so much in terms of adding atmosphere to the maps but also adding in subtle strategic objectives.

IIRC, SOE played around with real US Geological Survey data when testing out the PS1 engine and how it calculated the varied topograhy of its game maps. Looking at PS1's maps it looks like they wanted to give them a "realistic" feel (well, most ofthem anyway. Not Cery or the Battle Isles obviously :cool: ). I think they did a pretty good job.

Higby has stated that they're hand-crafting each PS2 map to make every square inch unique, contestable land to fight over. There are bases, towers, bunkers, mineshafts, etc all over the map. And not even PS1 has any simple, straight repetitive roads. I highly doubt PS2 will have them since they've said they want to encourage us to fight every where on the cont, not just around bases like much of PS1.

hopefully indar is only a test continent then

Indar is a recreation of Ishundar - a desert cont from PS1. So Indar will look pretty desolate and I doubt it's a "test" map. They have stated there will be multiple biomes in the game so I suspect there will be conts that have forests, swamps, savannahs, and icy tundras just like PS1.

PS had most map sizes of 8x8 with cyssor 12x12 or so I thought?

Each square on a PS1 cont map is 400m x 400m (BI's are 200m x 200m). So Cyssor for example is ~ 18 x 16 squares, or about 7.2km x 6.4km in size if you don't include the surrounding water.

Of course, the question becomes, "how long is 1m perceived to be in the gameworld?" In PS1 1m was somewhere about half the length of an actual meter perceptually-speaking. So, if PS2's meters are closer to the real thing (and looking at those amp station screenies I think they are), then PS2's 8km x 8km maps are going to feel much larger than PS1's.

[Skepsiis]

Higby also mentioned including more vertical playgrounds...so the planetside2 continents should hopefully feel more three dimentional, and more densely packed with strategic chokes and points of interest, so therefore bigger although you might realistically be able to fly end to end in an aircraft in less time than a ps1 cont.

[Zulthus]

Caspian border is one of the largest ever maps for the Battlefield series. MW and BF fanboys will have a meltdown if they step foot on even the smallest of PS2's continents.


Lol. Most BF2 maps were bigger than Caspian Border. BF3 is small.


I hope the PS2 maps end up being at least the same size as PS1s, hopefully larger. The bigger the better.

[Hamma]

Nice comparison Miir! :D

[CyclesMcHurtz]

That map seems misleadingly oversimplified.

We use the actual terrain data to generate those maps, but we can't include all the details - they just get too "busy" and become unreadable.

[Furret]

I'm starting to get a little tired of all the sterotyping against mw3 and bf3 players. I play mw3 and ps, and i dont have 'meltdowns'. Its a completely different game. Sure, if you said: play team deathmatch on cyssor 6v6, i would quit, but THEY'RE NOT THE SAME TYPE OF GAME.

For all the shit this community gives to small-scale fps gamers, you ought to take a step back and realize they're different games for different people.

Sorry for ranting, but I'm just annoyed that 90% of the planetside community thinks of smaller-scale FPS gamers as unevolved insects with little to no intelligence.

[Vash02]

I'm starting to get a little tired of all the sterotyping against mw3 and bf3 players. I play mw3 and ps, and i dont have 'meltdowns'. Its a completely different game. Sure, if you said: play team deathmatch on cyssor 6v6, i would quit, but THEY'RE NOT THE SAME TYPE OF GAME.

For all the shit this community gives to small-scale fps gamers, you ought to take a step back and realize they're different games for different people.

Sorry for ranting, but I'm just annoyed that 90% of the planetside community thinks of smaller-scale FPS gamers as unevolved insects with little to no intelligence.

Someone needs to call pest control, we got another one. :D

[Hamma]

I think lots of folks are just frustrated with the cookie cutter state of gaming in general and are hoping PlanetSide 2 breaks the mold of the rinse repeat game.

[Quantumplation]

We use the actual terrain data to generate those maps, but we can't include all the details - they just get too "busy" and become unreadable.

Oh, you misunderstand me, When I say misleadingly oversimplified I was referring to this map:
http://s224245511.onlinehome.us/INDAR.jpg

from Miir. His rendition makes it look small, cramped, smooth, and uninteresting (no offense, I'm sure it was a quick recreation, I just don't want other people to get the wrong idea.)

[cellinaire]

I'd be really worried only if all continents in PS2 have the same size. (which is highly not likely :lol: )

[Straws]

Even if the maps end up being smaller than the ones we had in PS1, they would actually be bigger since we, as players, will be fighting over more than just facilities, towers, bridges (which serve as chokepoints) and the brief moments we experience on the main routes between facilities, towers and warp gates.

[Raymac]

^ This. In Planetside, we would just skip over large portions of the maps and really only fight most of the time within the SOI of a base. The rare occasions when we did fight out in the field, it was mainly because the 2 bases were nearby each other much like those Dagda v Gwydion fights on Forseral.

It sounds like the PS2 maps are going to feel much bigger because of the incentives to actually use more of the terrain.

[Straws]

Which reminds me, please please please, say 'no' hot-dropping (or similar features), or at least give it a significant cooldown. Travelling from front to front should be meaningful. Convenience is important, but not to the detrimental effect that PS, and pretty much every MMO eventually works towards.

[acosmo]

the distance you traveled from staging area to combat zone made the actual combat feel much more significant.
not all downtime was bad in my opinion. i think downtime gave players time to socialize and chat before getting into the action. the fact that anything could go wrong at any point also made it just feel all the more real.
downtime where you got to listen to the hum of the engine and look at the surrounding scenery and wait for your pilot/driver to reach the combat area was definitely a planetside moment.

[Ailos]

the distance you traveled from staging area to combat zone made the actual combat feel much more significant.
not all downtime was bad in my opinion. i think downtime gave players time to socialize and chat before getting into the action. the fact that anything could go wrong at any point also made it just feel all the more real.
downtime where you got to listen to the hum of the engine and look at the surrounding scenery and wait for your pilot/driver to reach the combat area was definitely a planetside moment.

+1

[Quantumplation]

the distance you traveled from staging area to combat zone made the actual combat feel much more significant.
not all downtime was bad in my opinion. i think downtime gave players time to socialize and chat before getting into the action. the fact that anything could go wrong at any point also made it just feel all the more real.
downtime where you got to listen to the hum of the engine and look at the surrounding scenery and wait for your pilot/driver to reach the combat area was definitely a planetside moment.

So much this. When I heard that Galaxy dropships would be respawn points and even potentially have equipment terminals, the vision that came to mind is being able to, in a limited way, walk around inside the galaxy as it flew over the terrain. The amount of atmosphere this would create as you flew to your destination, with minor flight turbulence, etc. as you waited in hushed silence to jump out of the galaxy... The thought of that kind of atmosphere sent shivers up and down my spine.

[HELLFISH88]

the distance you traveled from staging area to combat zone made the actual combat feel much more significant.
not all downtime was bad in my opinion. i think downtime gave players time to socialize and chat before getting into the action. the fact that anything could go wrong at any point also made it just feel all the more real.
downtime where you got to listen to the hum of the engine and look at the surrounding scenery and wait for your pilot/driver to reach the combat area was definitely a planetside moment.

+1

I agree. "Downtime" and "travel" have a place in the Game because we are MMO. MMO's attempt to create a dynamic living world and Travel and downtime are a part of such a world. The key is to find a balance. Have enough immersion but at the same time keep the game fun and engaging.

[Infektion]

oh yea 500mi^2 back in 1999! I LOVE Asherons Call... played it 2000-2010, since I was 13 to 23, on and off like a bad girlfriend. :rofl:

Asheron's Call, the only TRUE PLAYERKILLER game.
Rell Hell + OG Rell Hell | Harvestgain. Griefer extraordinaire.

http://neptunegames.com/ac/dereth.png

[cellinaire]

oh yea 500mi^2 back in 1999! I LOVE Asherons Call... played it 2000-2010, since I was 13 to 23, on and off like a bad girlfriend. :rofl:

Asheron's Call, the only TRUE PLAYERKILLER game.
Rell Hell + OG Rell Hell | Harvestgain. Griefer extraordinaire.

http://neptunegames.com/ac/dereth.png

Oh, so many fond memories whenever I hear any news related Asheron's Call..
(I only played Asheron's Call 2, though. Someday I also want to play the first one because I don't care about graphics if the game is fun and atmospheric enough.)

And I have to agree with acosmo. There at least has to be good portion of empty, open spaces to run around and just explore in any mmo, IMO. (oh and how much I liked Dark and Light... well the overall gameplay, polish and graphic were not good when it was alive)

[Chug]

Acosmo said it all

[Raymac]

Yeah, not all downtime is the same. Some are awesome, and some are not so much. There is a difference between the downtime defending a hack on a continent where you have a 9:1 pop advantage and the downtime as you are headed to a hot drop zone....like this:

Band of Brothers - Normandy Jump EP 2 - YouTube

[cellinaire]

Yeah, not all downtime is the same. Some are awesome, and some are not so much. There is a difference between the downtime defending a hack on a continent where you have a 9:1 pop advantage and the downtime as you are headed to a hot drop zone....like this:

Band of Brothers - Normandy Jump EP 2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbSZPxRtmbI)

Ditto.

(and I personally hate game-worlds which is too much jam-packed with objects, details, and contents in tight spaces. I personally prefer game-worlds having some portion of open, void places(with no special purpose or fancy lore attached to it)). ;)

[Miir]

If the maps are 8km by 8km in size. Anyone care to guess how high the box is on the Z axis?

Do you think it will be an 8km x 8km x 8km playable space?

[Infektion]

Yeah, not all downtime is the same. Some are awesome, and some are not so much. There is a difference between the downtime defending a hack on a continent where you have a 9:1 pop advantage and the downtime as you are headed to a hot drop zone....like this:

Band of Brothers - Normandy Jump EP 2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbSZPxRtmbI)

yo, I f*ck*ng love band of brothers. Got all DVD collection, and this just inspired me to watch them all tonight...

but anyways, 8x8 km is still massive, 1 km = .6 miles, so technically, it's 5x5miles estimate, to roughly make a 25mile^2 map, obviously all of it wont be of use, but even 17-20 miles of actual playable land is more than enough.

[Tikuto]

Band of Brothers - Normandy Jump EP 2 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbSZPxRtmbI)Interesting...


Hotdropping one-by-one instead of all together may be cool to see.
Keeping the platoon all together could be done by the Galaxy landing.

[Infektion]

Interesting...


Hotdropping one-by-one instead of all together may be cool to see.
Keeping the platoon all together could be done by the Galaxy landing.



you saying you don't want the magical "poof" drop? I do ;)

[MercDT]

I think it would be pretty neat if galaxy drops were 1-by-1 like in the video, but I would be pretty happy if we could all drop out (in animation) through the back hatch of the drop ship instead of just "poofing" out of it.

We're probably going to the get the latter anyway.

[sylphaen]

You could do it the way you wanted in PS1 and it worked fine. Why should that change and why should we be forced into a specific way to drop ?