An alternative to spotting?

[DayOne]

So there has been a lot of discussion about spotting and if it will be implemented and if so, how it will work. I believe I may have come up with a solution that allows for effective intel gathering that relates back to your team without those annoying triangles all over your HUD.

Hot zones!

A very simple idea that could be a very good game mechanic.
Basically, every capturable area (I'm assuming for this that it will be hex's) has a rating of how many enemies have been spotted in it.

If you are overlooking an enemy base you spam hit the spot key and the rating for the hex's over the base will go up. Now your team mates know that that bio-lab they were planning to attack is crawling with enemies and they will need reinforcements!

This allows effective intel gathering, if you don't have a mic, without any of the draw backs being able to see individual enemies from across the continent.

A simple colour coded or number system would be fine for representing the 'heat' of an area.

Thoughts or suggestions on this?

[Lonehunter]

Planetside 1 all ready had hot spots just based on active people fighting, no spotting involved.

I'm not sure if regular spotting has a place in PS2. Seems like it would become spam since PS2 will have more then double the amount of people playing as BF3. Plus things like Enhanced Targeting showed the enemy's health/armor with their name.

[DayOne]

The point of this system is that it gives information on how many enemies are in a particular area. It would help both in battles and for planning them as you could send a recon guy out and then see that he spotted very few enemies, so you can send a small attack force and take the base.

[ringring]

The point of this system is that it gives information on how many enemies are in a particular area. It would help both in battles and for planning them as you could send a recon guy out and then see that he spotted very few enemies, so you can send a small attack force and take the base.

In PS1 there was a reveal enemy function for cr4/cr5 (the difference being the radius of the reveal). This showed red dots from trooper and vehicles. It also showed any nearby freindlies too.

However, only the person doing the reveal could see it. They then had to communicate back to the rest of the platoon.

There was a cool-down of 20 minutes.

Is that what you meant? Did you mean all members of the platoon would be able to see it?

In practise it was most used on two circumstances.
1. When you are respnding to an enemy hack and you know there is enemy then but you want to know where they are and preciose numbers in the base.
2. Most often, when you're going to do an OS. The reveal would give you targetting information.

[Tool]

The point of this system is that it gives information on how many enemies are in a particular area. It would help both in battles and for planning them as you could send a recon guy out and then see that he spotted very few enemies, so you can send a small attack force and take the base.

Using the tactical overlay, population %s, hotspots, reveal enemies and common sense, it was extremely easy in ps1 to figure out the relative strength of an enemy force.

Along with regular communication it was generally easy enough to relay information to friendlies.

With that said, ps2 may use different tools to accomplish the above. As far as a spotting mechanic, i think such a tool could be given only to the recon or stealth type classes. Spotting enemies that show only on their own squad/platoon tactical map. General map icons representing infantry and vehicles. Wouldn't follow them on the map unless direct line of sight is maintained.

[Rbstr]

I'd rather not have the "doritos in the bushes" of BF but instead have spotting place markers on a fairly wide-area radar/map in the HUD.

This in conjunction with a fairly sophisticated enemy position detection system system of stationary and deployable sensors and non-invisibility stealth mechanics for infantry and vehicles.

Spotting would put even stealth characters on the map...but only a dot for a short time where they were spotted and only for people who are in the spotter's group (Squad/Platoon, maybe outfit with outfit bonuses). It wouldn't follow them like it would if they were sensor detected.

[Soothsayer]

Should combine with mission system to automatically generate missions based on the information that is relayed.

Xp for the spotter, xp for the one that completes the mission that is generated.

[Espion]

PS1 has always had spotting... not sure why so many people are bent up on how it should be implemented. Look at a player until their name appears, now they're on radar for a minute. If you're in a squad or platoon, it's now on their radar too.

I don't want to see giant arrows of people's heads and through walls/mountains just because someone spammed a button in their direction. Being on radar and identifying whether it was softie/max/vehicle(shape) was pretty much perfect. Being tied to squads was also good. Combine all that with assists XP this time around and you're good to go.

[Figment]

You know what happened with Base Alerts in PS once they were introduced?


No alert: hack on
"Oh, low pop, let's go resec. May be a ghost or small squad. Send just a few to investigate, kill 'm quick so we can get to our main fight."

Just Hot Spots: may die out, CE might disappear
"Oh something's up, could be a squad prepping the base, send a scout to investigate. We'll finish up here then come along just in case."

Pop juts went up to Yellow Alert, hack may or may not be on yet
"Couple squads, let's see if we can't get them out before they're set up."

Orange alert - lot of hot spots
IF Base == "Interlink" OR base == "Tech Plant"
IF Spawn == true
IF Gen == true
THEN GOTO "Base"
"Base" == $"Farm"
ELSE GOTO "Elsewhere"

Red Alert
IF NewCont == true
IF Time > 10 mins
THEN ZergRecall
ELSE DoNotBotherWillFail GOTO Farm


Sorry, my coding language is old and unused for at least 8 years. ;)

Basically, only suicidal maniacs of the intelligent kind would bother to attempt resecures of bases that looked like suicide missions. When indicators did not exist, people would go into the unexpected and often FIND the unexpected. After they came to be, people started drawing prejudiced conclusions out of self-conservation. As such, they missed tons of resecure opportunities because even if it says "Red Alert", it does not say if it is well defended.

[DayOne]

By "how many enemies" I didn't mean the specific number. Density is probably better. The whole system is designed so you know how dangerous going into an area is, how much chance there is of you coming across enemies. But to do this a player would have to spot enemies visually and instead of saying "Hey, there's a lot of enemies over here" you spot the enemies and the zone becomes "hotter" so everyone else know that there are not many/a few/lots of enemies there.

[Figment]

Density is a bad indication of enemy power. It just makes it more impossible to go there because you make players reluctant to go there on quantitive instead of qualitative information.

[Figment]

To come back on my last post, may I suggest something?


Make /sitrep useful: make it into an actual location report that's clickable on the map, instead of a way for CR4s to tell CR5s they suck. :p

EDIT: *goes to make proposition post* >.>

[ringring]

Higgy has a point.

[Figment]

What's a Higgy? O.o

[Yutty]

I like tribe ascend's spotting where you have to put the arrow over an enemy and press a button like alt to spot them so teamates can see a icon above their head

[Gonefshn]

I don't see how spotting is necessary for PS2. Or atleast in a way thats similar to battlefield where it reveals exact location.

Maybe when you "spot" or click on an enemy you see in the distance it triggers voice macro commands.

In the old game you could go through a list of macros using buttons to say things like "incoming MAX units!" maybe in some form you could have spotting trigger these sorts of audio cues that would relay basic information to people near you. In the real world all you can do is describe if your on the ground as a soldier. Simple descriptions would be enough. For more detailed information people are going to take care of that anyways in chat and in voice channels. With so many players playing you will always have something to do and shoot at.

keep spotting simple, let someone shout out if they see a MAX or a cloaker nearby so I can keep wits about me, but no more information is needed, especially when it can be taken care of in chat and voice channels.

[Espion]

I like tribe ascend's spotting where you have to put the arrow over an enemy and press a button like alt to spot them so teamates can see a icon above their head

The way it works in TA is exactly how it should never work in any game. You point out in the open and spam alt to place huge arrows over people's head that you can see through walls/terrain. It's one of the worst mechanics ever put in a shooter.

The way it works currently in PS is near perfect, and ridiculously balanced by comparison.

[Figment]

What you describe Espion is pretty much how it works in World of Tanks - only there the marker is added automatically... >.> If you want to state you target something you can create an even bigger termporary target and it even lights both you and your target up on the map.

The targeting is very useful for attracting attention to something, what annoys me is the automated healthbars upon visibility. Scouting should never be done by the computer IMO. Once you got your cursor right over the target or tap the target, sure.

[Immigrant]

I enjoyed spotting and find it very useful in games like Battlefield. So I would like for it to somehow be implemented. As far it concerns infantry I think spotting should be restricted within a squad (10 people). Alerting your team mates there's a sniper on the roof or a tank approaching is never a bad thing.

However it would be cool if infantry units could also somehow alert tanks and aircraft (outside your squad) of immediate danger to them like AA site and also of potential targets to large for infantry to take on themselves. Spotting info sent from infantry should be limited to vehicles within a certain radius. Maybe this kind of spotting should be made into a certification so only people really interested to invest points could do it. This would also reduce the amount of outgoing spotting info.

[Marinealver]

The point of this system is that it gives information on how many enemies are in a particular area. It would help both in battles and for planning them as you could send a recon guy out and then see that he spotted very few enemies, so you can send a small attack force and take the base.

Oh you are talking about the old tactical display on the maps. Yeah I used to use them. Even use some squad WP to act as a free-fire zone for wraiths. Also used the tactical to spot an incomming Gal Drop on a contenant that was secure of enemy forces. (It was the bright single block that was moving to a base.) Heck I could even spot a lone biffer walking about on that map. It wasn't as bright as a full gal but it did leave a tactical imprint.

[Marinealver]

You know what happened with Base Alerts in PS once they were introduced?


No alert: hack on
"Oh, low pop, let's go resec. May be a ghost or small squad. Send just a few to investigate, kill 'm quick so we can get to our main fight."

Just Hot Spots: may die out, CE might disappear
"Oh something's up, could be a squad prepping the base, send a scout to investigate. We'll finish up here then come along just in case."

Pop juts went up to Yellow Alert, hack may or may not be on yet
"Couple squads, let's see if we can't get them out before they're set up."

Orange alert - lot of hot spots
IF Base == "Interlink" OR base == "Tech Plant"
IF Spawn == true
IF Gen == true
THEN GOTO "Base"
"Base" == $"Farm"
ELSE GOTO "Elsewhere"

Red Alert
IF NewCont == true
IF Time > 10 mins
THEN ZergRecall
ELSE DoNotBotherWillFail GOTO Farm


Sorry, my coding language is old and unused for at least 8 years. ;)

Basically, only suicidal maniacs of the intelligent kind would bother to attempt resecures of bases that looked like suicide missions. When indicators did not exist, people would go into the unexpected and often FIND the unexpected. After they came to be, people started drawing prejudiced conclusions out of self-conservation. As such, they missed tons of resecure opportunities because even if it says "Red Alert", it does not say if it is well defended.
You forgot if Gen is down then genhold.
Also if tubes/ Gen / and CC is fin but NTUs 40% look for a sneak drain.
If everything is down and and destroyed look for bored players.