Countermeasures for tanks

[NewSith]

WTF is that? Any thoughts?

I mean smoke? In space travel future?

[sylphaen]

Let me be cynical for a second:
Tanks are meant to be the punching bags and justification for engineers and aircav. They do not need to be given countermeasures.

[NewSith]

Let me be cynical for a second:
Tanks are meant to be the punching bags and justification for engineers and aircav. They do not need to be given countermeasures.

Let me be educational for a second:
Some unknown magazine called something like Computer Player states that there will be countermeasures for tanks.

[Sirisian]

Hopefully it's like this:
http://sirisian.com/pictures/tanksmoke.gif

[Alduron]

WTF is that? Any thoughts?

I'm for it. I like the idea of smoke, especially if it has volumetric properties like the clouds. I'm hoping we get hand canisters, too. I'd like to see some additional countermeasures like the Trophy system. Obviously it would have a limit amount of protection.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGF7x3TVNCQ

I mean smoke? In space travel future?

At what point in "space travel future" does smoke stop doing the role it is intended to do? Does it not obscure vision in the future or something?

[NewSith]

I'm for it. I like the idea of smoke, especially if it has volumetric properties like the clouds. I'm hoping we get hand canisters, too. I'd like to see some additional countermeasures like the Trophy system. Obviously it would have a limit amount of protection.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGF7x3TVNCQ

Somehow I imagine a chuff missile to counter it.

[sylphaen]

Thanks for the info, Sith. I shall remain pessimist about PS2 tank play until I see it in action.

As long as I have no idea about tank armor values and how long they can survive while under fire (i.e. how long they are supposed to survive when taking missiles in the ass), I will keep thinking their role is one of puppets to be shot by other playstyles (i.e. Aircav and engineers). I may avoid some disappointment that way.

BF tank play was boring as hell while I loved PS1 tanks.


EDIT: just to be on topic, a active counter measure modules could be an entertaining gameplay feature. They could make a lot of stuff from the basic idea of adding a module that can be activated at the right time to do something that will help out your vehicle one way or another.

[Cosmical]

I understand what your saying about smoke. This is the future, a future of navigating black holes and suns int he vastness of space. Yet pop some smoke and we have no idea how to compensate "WHERE DID THEY GO!!?"

One of two things. This is just an interesting mechanic adding some veriaty to tank game play beyond "who is the most accurate slug fest". And two, if you want a reason story wise, were on the frontier out in space. Whereas we do have access to super technolgies, the less they cost in resources to make per unit the better. Simple war logistics, not everyone gets the best equipment because its deemed more worthy to get more units out on the field. Otherwise every soldier nowadays would enter the battlefield in 300,000 dollar kevlar combat suit.

I just hope that there are a wide selection to choose from, that all compliment and counter each other. I would love to be able to pop smoke and drop a mine behind me when im in trouble to escape hairy situations. I hate when vehicle combat is just "WELL NOW I SIT HERE AND KNOW I LOSE BECAUSE THEY GOT THE FIRST SHOT ON ME".

[2coolforu]

I understand what your saying about smoke. This is the future, a future of navigating black holes and suns int he vastness of space. Yet pop some smoke and we have no idea how to compensate "WHERE DID THEY GO!!?"

One of two things. This is just an interesting mechanic adding some veriaty to tank game play beyond "who is the most accurate slug fest". And two, if you want a reason story wise, were on the frontier out in space. Whereas we do have access to super technolgies, the less they cost in resources to make per unit the better. Simple war logistics, not everyone gets the best equipment because its deemed more worthy to get more units out on the field. Otherwise every soldier nowadays would enter the battlefield in 300,000 dollar kevlar combat suit.

I just hope that there are a wide selection to choose from, that all compliment and counter each other. I would love to be able to pop smoke and drop a mine behind me when im in trouble to escape hairy situations. I hate when vehicle combat is just "WELL NOW I SIT HERE AND KNOW I LOSE BECAUSE THEY GOT THE FIRST SHOT ON ME".

You'd be surprised how well some tactics last, just look at nowadays when we have FLIR and all manner of visual aids that you would expect to defeat smoke but there's a constant battle going on between the defensive and offensive weapons and techs.

Since FLIR exists there is infrared smoke with chemicals that absorb the infrared wavelengths thrown in. What we do know is that humans will have eyeballs for a long time, and it's unlikely that anything that would defeat smoke/IR Smoke will ever be engineered into our biology.

I think smoke is an excellent weapon for a game if done right because its a intellectual, interactive tool. 'High tech' crap like active defense systems are boring because its just a passive upgrade that requires no input. Smoke can be used to maneuver, to trick and deceive attackers.

[Alduron]

I think smoke is an excellent weapon for a game if done right because its a intellectual, interactive tool.
I want to strap a few cans to a Reaver and sky write messages over the battlefield.

I understand what your saying about smoke. This is the future, a future of navigating black holes and suns int he vastness of space. Yet pop some smoke and we have no idea how to compensate "WHERE DID THEY GO!!?"

2coolforu has some great points. If used strategically, smoke can be a really useful tool. I wouldn't ever recommend popping it just to sit in it, but it will definitely give you a few seconds to gain an advantage or retreat.

[Lonehunter]

An EMP would be nice, or that smoke that can scramble missile locks. Tanks certainly won't be the punching bag of vech combat, Sunderers will

[Geist]

Hopefully it's like this:
http://sirisian.com/pictures/tanksmoke.gif

If it actually looked like that when popped, I'd use it everywhere, safe area, dangerous area, in a line of tanks going to the next base, rolling out of the vehicle bay, in the shower, at the gym... :brow:

[Alduron]

An EMP would be nice, or that smoke can can scramble missile locks. Tanks certainly won't be the punching bag of vech combat, Sunderers will

EMP's were mentioned for the Sunderer I believe. I can only imagine that it would also be an option on the tank.

Lock-ons are a bit harder to avoid in a tank. I would be surprised if they didn't give some method of warding off locks for a brief time.

[Sirisian]

If it actually looked like that when popped, I'd use it everywhere, safe area, dangerous area, in a line of tanks going to the next base, rolling out of the vehicle bay, in the shower, at the gym... :p
I'd prefer if such things were resource based honestly. A choice among many. Being able to use it every spawn with a tank for instance might get a bit intense. I believe the same comment has been said for a few other ideas.

If anyone remembers BF2142 and their momentary shield system. Adding a module like that with a long recharge to push back a fighter that makes a quick pass on you or if you saw a rocket launch across the map at your vehicle would be nice to active. That kind of tactical choices where you decide "I'm gonna use this to protect myself from that" is one of my favorite things.

[Traak]

.

[Zulthus]

Smoke, fine. Anything that redirects missiles away from the tank, NO.

[Sirisian]

Smoke, fine. Anything that redirects missiles away from the tank, NO.
Care to go into depth? Are you against countermeasures for all vehicles? If so explain.

// edit: I asked because I'm a huge fan of players having a lot of choices in how to react to threats. So having the ability to defend yourself as a choice (not an automatic defense system) is a nice feature in my opinion.

[Whalenator]

If lock-on and the empire's specific type of secondary guidance system (IE: Laser for NC) do the same amount of damage, Lock on will be easier. BUT, Laser-guided will not be averted by smoke or flares (Although it would it real life)

[Knocky]

EMP's were mentioned for the Sunderer I believe. I can only imagine that it would also be an option on the tank.

Lock-ons are a bit harder to avoid in a tank. I would be surprised if they didn't give some method of warding off locks for a brief time.


What possible reason do you have to think that tanks would be given an EMP blast? Sundys should be the one and only vehicle blessed with it.

Ward off lock-ons? If tanks move into areas without infantry support then they deserve the ass kicking that they are about to receive. At least they will if they are facing the Lions. We know exactly how to use a jammer + AV weapons.

The Punisher is your friend....learn to love it!

[StumpyTheOzzie]

I'm for it. I like the idea of smoke, especially if it has volumetric properties like the clouds. I'm hoping we get hand canisters, too. I'd like to see some additional countermeasures like the Trophy system. Obviously it would have a limit amount of protection.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGF7x3TVNCQ



At what point in "space travel future" does smoke stop doing the role it is intended to do? Does it not obscure vision in the future or something?

I wonder how TROPHY would work if I popped some smoke before I shot the tank with an RPG?

[Bags]

Care to cite some sources?

[Canaris]

actually I'd be against tanks having a lot counter measures for the simple fact this is a game, wouldn't things get a little imbalanced if you can't blow them up with conventional weapons.

Game > Reality

[exoteror]

I would love smoke for tanks but alass I have never seen it done well in games. The video of the tank popping their smoke looked awesome, that would be great to defend squishys nearby the tank providing a realistic use in game warfare.

[CutterJohn]

An invulnerability field like BF2142 had on its tanks would be pretty cool, I think. Gave you 3s of invulnerability on a 30s timer. Hardly OP, but definitely handy if used at the appropriate time.

Can't think of much else that would really work as an activatable countermeasure for tanks though, without seeming wildly out of place.

[Forsaken One]

An invulnerability field like BF2142 had on its tanks would be pretty cool, I think. Gave you 3s of invulnerability on a 30s timer. Hardly OP, but definitely handy if used at the appropriate time.

Can't think of much else that would really work as an activatable countermeasure for tanks though, without seeming wildly out of place.

BF2124 is the only Battlefield game where vehicles were even remotely balanced. looooong CD +one countermeasure (not shield + smoke.) + the fact that the tank had real hitboxs and if a engy shot the tank in the back it was a one hit kill.

It made the drivers have actual skill and awareness other then just driving around like a derp, auto winning purely because they were in a vehicle like most of the other battlefields.

I could see the very short shield. but as the fact that there will be many, many more tanks on the field I'd like to see it have a maybe 3 minute+ CD while still only being able to be used for 3 seconds. anything shorter and they will just be leap frogging each other with the shields to do a mod like push that can't be stopped which will be highly stupid.

[NewSith]

Care to cite some sources?

Care to read the 1st page of the topic?

[CutterJohn]

I could see the very short shield. but as the fact that there will be many, many more tanks on the field I'd like to see it have a maybe 3 minute+ CD while still only being able to be used for 3 seconds. anything shorter and they will just be leap frogging each other with the shields to do a mod like push that can't be stopped which will be highly stupid.

I disagree and think that would be awesome to see people actually able to pull something like that off reliably. :D


Agree with the comments about 2142 though.. easily the most underrated BF game. Tried a lot of new things and mostly succeeded.

[Ragotag]

I think smoke is a great idea as both a countermeasure verses laser guided munitions as well as for cover, fire & maneuver. However, EMP seems more like an area effect weapon than a defensive countermeasure. The Dev's also mentioned countermeasures verses minefields, but haven't mention anything like reactive armor plates; IMO, reactive armor would be a great countermeasure to add into the game.

[Talek Krell]

There's a bottom armor slot item that greatly reduces mine damage. That may be what they were referring to.

[Whalenator]

I never understood why people hated on BF2142.
Titans were the best idea in the history of ideas. Make a fucking Sequel already

[Bags]

Care to read the 1st page of the topic?

I see no links.

[NewSith]

I see no links.

OMG, Bags you're either trolling or very bad at understanding what I say.

I can't link it, because it is in the latest PCGamer. And the scan of one of magazines was deleted, due to scans on public sources harming their copyright and income.

[Bags]

OMG, Bags you're either trolling or very bad at understanding what I say.

I can't link it, because it is in the latest PCGamer. And the scan of one of magazines was deleted, due to scans on public sources harming their copyright and income.

Let me be educational for a second:
Some unknown magazine called something like Computer Player states that there will be countermeasures for tanks.

What's all this about then?

[NewSith]

What's all this about then?

Paraphrase "Computer Player" and you'll get the answer...