Cloaker and a more complex hit box?

[Irish]

was just browsing and came across an idea that i hadnt really thought of before, and noticed i hadn't read anything about. since the hit box for landing damage is more keen on recognizing where the shot lands (ie. head) is it a non issue that cloaking directly up to your enemy and putting 3 pistol shots into his head wouldnt be about 1000x more effective since HS's actually mean something..

in ps1 there was a proverbial "set" amount of shots it took to kill someone, now with head-shots and the ultimate element of surprise im thinking it can make a pretty potent mix. not that its a bad thing...but because of the lengthy time to kill in pS1 the overpoweredness of an invisible assassin was kinda moot..apologies if this was brought up before

[NCLynx]

Depends on what class they're sneaking up on and how strong their pistol is species to be I would assume.

[headcrab13]

in ps1 there was a proverbial "set" amount of shots it took to kill someone, now with head-shots and the ultimate element of surprise im thinking it can make a pretty potent mix. not that its a bad thing...but because of the lengthy time to kill in pS1 the overpoweredness of an invisible assassin was kinda moot..apologies if this was brought up before

When Planetside launched the TR's Repeater was really deadly, even to Rexo. You could drop even the most heavily armored target in less than 7 or 8 rounds. There were times that an Inf could defend a hack by himself against a steady stream of enemies.

Eventually they realized this was overpowered and Rexo was buffed up to the point where Infs with guns were almost useless, and they were no longer fun to play.

Of course, there will be a whole different dynamic in PS2 with Infs being able to carry rifles, but I hope they'll balance close quarters pistol use as well.

[CutterJohn]

Headshots are not a set multiplier. They are set on a per weapon basis, so any OPness can be adjusted without mucking anything else.

[Toppopia]

Were pistols decent in first Planetside? Because it would be cool to beable to get lots of certs for pistols to make them a deadly weapon in close range and a weapon to be feared, not just "oh look, he has a pistol and shot me 10 times, now i can shoot him and kill him because pistols are weak".

[Toppopia]

Pistols were for cloakers and nothing else in PS1, and the only reason cloakers used them was that it was the only weapon type that fit in their slot.

They basically only worked against clueless opponents with bad aim, which was 90% of the community, so I guess they were pretty good.

So are they now a weapon for any class in Planetside 2 or is it still restricted?

[Toppopia]

So could other classes carry 2 weapons?

[Toppopia]

So if we are lucky pistols will be powerful enough to be usable then.

[headcrab13]

Headshots are not a set multiplier. They are set on a per weapon basis, so any OPness can be adjusted without mucking anything else.

True, that's a good point. I hope the pistol multiplier is adjusted so that headshots feel powerful enough (2-3 shots for a kill), yet it doesn't take 20 shots in the torso to do the same amount of damage.

[Captain1nsaneo]

So if we are lucky pistols will be powerful enough to be usable then.

Don't believe the talk about pistols not being useful in PS1. All of them were built with cloakers in mind, even the newer 10mm ones. My personal favorite was the AMP which had high RoF and a bloom to match but in single shots was pretty accurate. At point blank you could take down even shotgun users.

[Sledgecrushr]

A cloaker dual wielding pistols would be bad assed.

[PredatorFour]

Yeh the pistols were badass when used in the right cirumcstances. My fave is the repeater which i have to loot cos im vanu. If you sit on top of a base you can snipe people on the other side, even with the beamer too. The enemies wouldnt have a clue where you were firing from. Anyone who says the pistols were crap just simply didnt use them for long enough to get to grips with them.

With headshots tho the cloaker could be OP but no doubt there is already countermeasures for that in place. Things like the stamina drain and sensor jammers not too mention the new darklight .. What ever they have im sure they`ll make it tough for us cloakers, its not going to stop us gettin the kills tho;)

[WorldOfForms]

I can see pistols being way more useful in PS2 for several reasons:

- Every class automatically carries one (in PS1 it used up valuable space you could use for something else).

- Most classes won't be able to carry two (or more) heavy weapons (in PS1 you could easily carry a shotgun, a rifle, AND an anti-vehicular weapon.

- Headshots

- More limited ammo. Since it looks like you won't be able to fill your backpack with ammo, and you know you always have a pistol, it will become a proper side-arm, as it was meant to be in PS1.

- probably a cert tree for pistols, making them even more viable.

Yay for pistols!

[Shlomoshun]

I'd really like to see a good cert tree for pistols. Some good sights/certs to allow for them to be either lower bloom for distance use, or some additional damage up-close for the cloakers.

Also a side suggestion. Anyone heard of any sort of 'stun' being put into the game. It'd be cool to earn a cert for a 'pistolwhip' which would offer a very quick stun on an enemy at point blank range...Just a thought.

[JimmyOmaha]

Without the cert tree, the pistol will probably fill the roles of; finish a guy off 1v1 if your clip runs out. Or an "Oh crap, I'm outta ammo."

But I totally agree, there should be a cert-tree to make it badass, and maybe focus on cloak-users. :]

[Xyntech]

Well the pistol should never be more powerful than some of the other options, so if you have a rifle with you I'm sure it will be as you say Jimmy, a low ammo contingency option.

Still, there will presumably be more options for it than that. If it can be suppressed, it could be a more stealthy option even for non cloakers. Conserving ammo could be useful sometimes even when you still have quite a bit of ammo left. And let's not forget the all important gloat kill, killing someone with a weaker weapon just to fuck with them or because it's fun.

Primarily I see the pistol mostly being used as a supplemental weapon to fill gaps in a players loadout. Maybe a player is carrying all AV or explosive weaponry, so they'd use a pistol as their only viable ranged option.

Obviously the cloaker will be the most obvious one to use a pistol frequently though, and I think this is appropriate. That just means that they will have even more fun taking advantage of all of the pistol customization options.

Being able to balance headshot bonus damage for each weapon should make overpowerdness pretty avoidable. If all classes share the same pistol, I would say they should primarily balance it against cloaked users. If each class gets its own pistol customization tree, the problem isn't even a problem at all.

Personally, I'd generally like to see head shot bonus be something along these lines:

Sniper Rifle > Pistol > Rifle

But everything should always be done with an eye towards optimal balance.

[Kilmoran]

As a cloaker, I use pistols for maxes. I sometimes use an AMP or a repeater for infantry just because it gives me range. Most of the time, I use a knife, which can be as powerful as a bolt driver. All of that said, I doubt cloakers will be over powered in any sense. Even if they can kill fast, they can, at least currently, die faster than they can kill.

[Rbstr]

I like the idea that a pistol can pop someone with a couple good shots to the noggin. For any class. Makes it a legitimate sidearm.

I hate it when pistols are just peashooters.

[Grognard]

Well the two characteristics that would impress me about pistols, thereby making it attractive to use, would be...

1. Small ammo size, so you can carry a lot in less space.
2. Fast reload time (speed loader).

For me, those two characteristics / certs, would make it worth using.

+plus the gold plating, I really liked that...

[Minor]

Hi,

I was reading the dev interviews in the 2nd post "what we know about planetside 2".

In one of said interviews, the dev says that players will no longer have armor but shields.

In another response, the interview asks whether or not headshots = kill.
The response was headshots = headshots.

Thus, I deduce that heavier "armor" will only in reality constitute more powerfull "shielding" and a headshot will have the same effect on the "shield" as would a center mass hit.

Thus you will not be able to headshot kill with an inf, at least anymore than you could as an infantry using the same gun. So, an inf might be more usefull as a sniper.

[Erendil]

Hi,

I was reading the dev interviews in the 2nd post "what we know about planetside 2".

In one of said interviews, the dev says that players will no longer have armor but shields.

In another response, the interview asks whether or not headshots = kill.
The response was headshots = headshots.

Thus, I deduce that heavier "armor" will only in reality constitute more powerfull "shielding" and a headshot will have the same effect on the "shield" as would a center mass hit.

Thus you will not be able to headshot kill with an inf, at least anymore than you could as an infantry using the same gun. So, an inf might be more usefull as a sniper.

If I read your post correctly, it appears you're assuming that shields give you ubiquitous protection around your whole body and thus taking more damage for a headshot will not occur.

This is incorrect.

Think of shields in PS2 as more like "regenerating armour." :) All weapons will have a multiplier applied to the damage they do if you hit someone in the head. The exact multilplier is determined on a per-weapon basis, so some weapons will benefit more from a headshot than others. And some will get a x1 multiplier, meaning they'll do no extra damage from a headshot.

Here's Higby's comment from last year's reddit Q&A (http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/comments/il5og/hey_rplanetside_im_matt_higby_the_creative/)

The system allows us to have different damage bonuses for each weapon. This way we can make it so that sniper rifles give a 200% bonus making them OSOK on headshots and chainguns get a 0% bonus making it make no difference. Other guns like pistols or assault rifles might be somewhere in between based on how rewarding we feel precision should be with each of those weapons/weapon types. Vehicle weapons will likely have a 0% bonus.
Exact balance for this is not final, but that's the general idea that we're going with and we'll tweak as necessary.

[Xyntech]

I hadn't seen that specific clarification from Higby. Thanks for that. That sounds like it is right in line with where I was hoping they were going with headshot bonuses. As always, it seems like it will be easy to tweak if it's not quite right when beta starts.

[Minor]

Thanks for the clarification :)