The use of Medics in a fast paced game

[bennybikerboy]

I could be just worrying about something that doesn't need to be worried about, but I just thought I'd bring it up.

Are medics going to be useful in this game at all? The combat is fast and the TTK is really quick so will Medics be useful in combat? Will anyone even be a medic?

Sorry, but I'm worried.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

The fast paced combat is scaring me a bit.

[bjorntju1]

The pace is not fast enough to make them useless imo.

[Bags]

No, they're going to be useful. Higby thought it'd be fun to make 1/6th of the classes do nothing.

[MooK]

Still on the fence, but I think the faster it goes the less useful they'll be.

[Turdicus]

Nah Battlefield games like 2142 had medics and fast pacing and they were very useful. This is because its a very quick ordeal to revive someone, and reviving in the middle of a fight is better than reviving outside of it sometimes.

[Sifer2]

Well the pace is looking similar to Battlefield, and the only thing Medics are good for in that game is healing themselves or reviving people. We can already tell they are desperate to make them useful since they are considering healing grenades lol. Even the TF2 Medic didn't need that.

I wouldn't be surprised if they end up rolling Medic/Engineer into one support class.

[Kilmoran]

AoE heals.... Resing on the spot... and keeping a front line up? I think they'll be fine with team work. Not so easy to use or helpful without team work thoguh.

[Seradin]

The only reason it seems like they could be useless is because in the E3 footage everyone spawns really close to the base in the staging areas. So there is not much penalty from dying. In the real game you'll have to set up staging areas with galaxies and if you die you might have to go all the way back to your closest base.

[Serotriptomine]

"Yo bro let's roll up into this base."
"You know at least half of us will die when we touch the ground right?"
"Yeah no worries bro."
"We don't have a Medic."

"Medics? The only thing they're good for is [saving your team from having to jog / drive / fly all the way back spending more resources, maintaining a push in a specific area, etc] - reviving people bro"

"Wat"

[Shogun]

i think they will only be useful as revivers.
the classic "non advanced medic role" from ps1 seems to be dead.

there is no need for a health regenerator medic any more because you die too quickly and if you don´t die, you regenerate health on your own anyways.

so it´s only reviving and maybe the deployable health-shield we heard about, that medics will be helpful with.

[moosepoop]

in battlefield medics are a MUST. without medpacks you regen health too slowly, and the enemy can use that extra moment to counterattack and overwhelm you.

you cannot win a game in battlefield without teampwork with medics.

[Bags]

i think they will only be useful as revivers.
the classic "non advanced medic role" from ps1 seems to be dead.

there is no need for a health regenerator medic any more because you die too quickly and if you don´t die, you regenerate health on your own anyways.

so it´s only reviving and maybe the deployable health-shield we heard about, that medics will be helpful with.

Dunno, the game is slower than BF3 and I constantly need a mmedic in that game.

IDK how you guys act like you've played it since it's not even in beta yet.

[Xyntech]

With Galaxy spawns being more vulnerable, I think the revive is going to be PS2 medics bread and butter.

But healing will be very useful as well.

[Orlandun]

As a regular Medic player in Battlefield healing is plenty useful especially when used as an AOE drop asi believe it is used in PS2 (correct me if i'm wrong). With faster game play that extra couple bullets of damage you take and can mean the difference between life and death just as much as any other game, not to mention the obvious revives people already mentioned.

[blazie]

With just hearing on the Total Biscuit stream of how once a squad spawn has been used the medics will be very valuable (saves a troop spawning back at a base). So for squad work I think they will be invaluable support troops, plus when taking cover during large firefights I can see medics working constantly healing the wounded.

[Smokingrabbit]

I see your point. I have the feeling the rez's will be the most useful. The live stream was showing off a zerg battle, and it that situation i doubt many people will be waiting around for their squad mates to rez em specially when they can get back in the fight so fast from the staging points.

[diLLa]

I feel like that the medic should also be able to drop ammo boxes, and change to class to a supplier class. And balance it's offensive capabilities accordingly to avoid lone wolving.

[Bruttal]

I think medics should have a high health regen rate, but only begins after you been out of combat for a few seconds so that while your crouched down trying to revive someone alot of stray bullets isnt gonna kill you before you make the revive

[Fafnir]

I really hope, that attached smoke grenade launchers will be available for medics. I loved reviving people in Project Reality, while being under fire.

[tdopz]

You guys are talking like they don't have an actual gun. I'm pretty sure if you try to heal bot as a medic in this game you will be doing it wrong. Time will tell, but it looks like the best way to heal will be when there is a lull in the fight, otherwise you should be shooting bitches like the rest of em. It seems to be like you basically trade jump jets for the ability to revive and heal when the opportunity presents itself.

[DayOne]

E3 demo is not a good example of base fights. I think in the released version you are going to see long battles, lasting possibly hours, over bases and advanced bases made up of a gal and turrets. Lots of places to take cover and get healed up.

During the main infantry fight revival will be the big thing and at the end of battle medics will be particularly useful to heal up wounds.

This is all assuming auto healing after being out of combat is removed or it is some piece of equipment that you have to cert into.

[sylphaen]

TB E3 day3 footage showed a medic revive close to the end. Reviving forces to stay static and lasts 2-3 seconds.

IMO, maybe a tad fast but already very good for revive mechanics !
:)

[Hmr85]

Will medics be useful? Yes, for us spec op outfits they will be invaluable.

[BigBossMonkey]

TB E3 day3 footage showed a medic revive close to the end. Reviving forces to stay static and lasts 2-3 seconds.

IMO, maybe a tad fast but already very good for revive mechanics !
:)

Maggie mentioned that it was the developer rez tool, and it is probably faster than the final product will be.

But all can/will change in Beta.

[mirwalk]

Capture points is where it will shine. Get your sqaddies back up after repelling the attackers/defenders. Don't want them to get killed trying to get back to spot, you need them there to defend.

[xcel]

Did anyone actually see any medic game-play yet? I would really like to check that out.

[Maarvy]

With things like Direct beam heals in fps games your average player becomes less effective as the pace increases .

That dosent mean Healers will be garbage it just means that you will want a "good" healer . And having the AOE heal and ressing on top of that still leaving scope for a newb healer to be somewhat usefull .

[JHendy]

The pace is not fast enough to make them useless imo.

It does seem fast enough to seriously diminish their usefulness though.

[Luieburger]

I saw a Max+Medic combo defend a point against an endless wave of unorganized enemies during the TotalBiscuit stream today. Worked out swell.

[sylphaen]

Are you sure it wasn't an engineer ?

[SgtMAD]

yup, the OP is correct,none of you need medics so why bother?

I'll have 2 medics and 2 engy's in every assault squad but then that's me.

[SKYeXile]

With that Aoe heal medics are doing id considering having half a squad filled with medics so they can circle jerk AOE heals. In battlefield hero's it was the only way to roll. Im certainly going to try it in this too to see how effective it is.

[Hmr85]

With that Aoe heal medics are doing id considering having half a squad filled with medics so they can circle jerk AOE heals. In battlefield hero's it was the only way to roll. Im certainly going to try it in this too to see how effective it is.

Glad to see I wasn't the only one who was wondering if that would work. lol :lol:

[captainkapautz]

It does seem fast enough to seriously diminish their usefulness though.

No, it doesn't.

What the fuck do you guys expect the medics to do?

Keep you up with a fricken Flash Heal so you can tank better?

This isn't an RPG where the "Healer" has to keep people healed constantly during a fight.

A medic is supposed to top you up after an engagement so you don't have to wait for your regen to kick in, throw you a heal in cover during a lull in combat or pick your sorry ass back of the ground after you got a leadsandwich to the face.


P.S.: The same fucking way it was in PS1 I might add.

[Chinchy]

No, it doesn't.

What the fuck do you guys expect the medics to do?

Keep you up with a fricken Flash Heal so you can tank better?

This isn't an RPG where the "Healer" has to keep people healed constantly during a fight.

A medic is supposed to top you up after an engagement so you don't have to wait for your regen to kick in, throw you a heal in cover during a lull in combat or pick your sorry ass back of the ground after you got a leadsandwich to the face.


P.S.: The same fucking way it was in PS1 I might add.

Yep Exactly I don't want this game to go back to the old TTK its dated and TBH I don't want each fight to be an ordeal I actually like individual skill to actually mean something in a game instead of it being a big spam fest of numbers and grenades(exactly what PS1 was). As the TTKs get faster the enfasis on large zergfits instantly winning due to numbers is diminished, a small group of 10-40 people can actually make a difference, don't get me wrong there were acceptions in planetside just like every other game but usually that was the case with high HP low Damage games I mean look at Face of Mankind and Neocron then go play Battle Ground Europe. Tell me which of those 3 games made you feel like you can actually make a difference?

[GTGD]

Everybody's tune will be changing once they actually play the game and cry for a medic so they don't have to wait 5 minutes to squad-spawn in. I'll be waving my med-app around, but just for laughs ;)

[Verruna]

Medics will be invaluable in combat, both defensively and offensively. The tide changing kind of usefulness, because combat is so fast paced having a medic reviving people really does mean all the difference in capturing or defending a point rather than them respawning (somewhere) and running back. Healing may seem less important because of how quick TTK seems in this game, but it isn't either. Being in red health (and going into combat) with potentially no or very slow hp regen versus a medic keeping you in the green? Being able to take a few more bullets does matter in a fast paced game like this. :)

Thats just going over basic support abilities and not considering they don't come armed with a spitwad straw..

As a side note.. Although this game does feel more fast paced than PS1, basing assumptions off E3's footage is somethin' you shouldn't do, just because of how they set up that demo area.

[captainkapautz]

Yep Exactly I don't want this game to go back to the old TTK its dated and TBH I don't want each fight to be an ordeal I actually like individual skill to actually mean something in a game instead of it being a big spam fest of numbers and grenades(exactly what PS1 was). As the TTKs get faster the enfasis on large zergfits instantly winning due to numbers is diminished, a small group of 10-40 people can actually make a difference, don't get me wrong there were acceptions in planetside just like every other game but usually that was the case with high HP low Damage games I mean look at Face of Mankind and Neocron then go play Battle Ground Europe. Tell me which of those 3 games made you feel like you can actually make a difference?

Neocron.

Cause I owned that shit.

[The Degenatron]

I'd like to see a cert for a AOE Medic Backpack that was always on - like an area bonus given to commanders. It wouldn't heal as fast as the triggered AOE heal.

Or, it COULD heal as fast as the triggered AOE but it would cause the medic to move slower, by like 15% so that the squad would have to slow it's pace to get the benefit.

[Zekeen]

Medics in Planetside operate differently from typical FPS games. They work more in a realistic manner, generally holding the back lines of an assault. As rooms are cleared, Medics revive the fall. As stalemates occur, Medic tend to the seriously injured to let them change out with another frontline soldier. Medics aren't defenseless, so they work just as well as another soldier, but they can help recharge the fighting force.

Generally though, you will have the room behind a defensive or offensive line being filled with medics and the injured. You won't find a medic standing beside a guy healing him in the middle of close combat like Team Fortress, but you will see spread out combat over a field with medics running among the soldiers healing them.

It's always such an interesting sight and experience with medics.

[JHendy]

No, it doesn't.

What the fuck do you guys expect the medics to do?

Keep you up with a fricken Flash Heal so you can tank better?

This isn't an RPG where the "Healer" has to keep people healed constantly during a fight.

A medic is supposed to top you up after an engagement so you don't have to wait for your regen to kick in, throw you a heal in cover during a lull in combat or pick your sorry ass back of the ground after you got a leadsandwich to the face.


P.S.: The same fucking way it was in PS1 I might add.

I don't know why you chose to get so riled up over this in particular. Chill out.

I was saying that the TTK is so short that recovering isn't likely to be a pressing matter. You're going to die pretty sharpish in a firefight. There's little a medic can do about that.
If you do survive an engagement health regen will probably be set up in such a way that you're able to fully recover without the help of a medic during any lulls.

Revives will obviously be as important as ever, but I don't reckon there is enough time during a firefight for a medic to have much effectiveness while you're still on your feet. They'd have to make a medic's HP replenishment very hasty for it to have an appreciable effect when you're actually sustaining damage.

The way I worded my first post suggests that I think that they will be less useful than they were in PS1, which was my bad, 'diminished' was the wrong word. I agree, they do have a very similar role still. Personally I was hoping that medics in PS2 would be more geared towards keeping people alive than bringing them back once they've died, just as the engineer cooperates with the MAX. This isn't related to PS1.

[captainkapautz]

I don't know why you chose to get so riled up over this in particular. Chill out.

I choose to get riled up over that because you post stuff like:

If you do survive an engagement health regen will probably be set up in such a way that you're able to fully recover without the help of a medic during any lulls.

Which is plain and simple wrong, seeing as the health regen in the builds seen so far takes about half a minute to kick in, which is a hell of a long time in a battle, which makes medics more then useful.

[Blackwolf]

Dunno, the game is slower than BF3 and I constantly need a mmedic in that game.

IDK how you guys act like you've played it since it's not even in beta yet.

They typically know everything, from what I understand.

Quit dissin the FPS gods!

[JHendy]

I choose to get riled up over that...

Well don't.

It was a brief observation on my part. Probably a better idea to point out why I'm mistaken in the first place instead of getting pissy.

[Nooner]

I would hope medics would make some difference in a firefight. I played a medic for quiet some time in PS1 and loved it.

A medic or two mixed in with a squad (especially in tower situations) often turned into straight up Thermopylae sh**.

If medics in this iteration turn out to be glorified revive bots I'll play something else, because that's not fun.

[Baneblade]

The unasked question is: Will you be able to carry enough ammo to make being revived worth it?

[Ohanka]

The pace of the game looks similar to BF2 or BF2142. Medics were extremely useful in those games, so they'll be useful here :)

I plan on playing a Medic for my squads

[Ohanka]

The unasked question is: Will you be able to carry enough ammo to make being revived worth it?

Won't be an issue. Even if you're low on ammo a Light Assault can resupply you.

[Fafnir]

Won't be an issue. Even if you're low on ammo a Light Assault can resupply you.

Storm mentioned, that they are considering taking away ammo drops from LA and giving it to another class. Maybe medic?

[GhettoPrince]

yeah, the demo had 5 second respawns, everyone was spawning on top of each other and everyone had free vehicles, in the live game medics are going to be a must have for any defense or attack. With a medic, you can get a guy back in action in a few seconds. Without one, you can wait for his respawn timer, then wait for him to get gear and transport and hope he can get back to the front without getting picked off by infiltrators, wolf packs or air patrols....

[captainkapautz]

Well don't.

It was a brief observation on my part. Probably a better idea to point out why I'm mistaken in the first place instead of getting pissy.

I did, you apparently choose not to read it.

[Vancha]

I sure as hell hope medics healing ability isn't relegated just to reviving the dead. That's not medicine, that's necromancy.

[Ohanka]

The unasked question is: Will you be able to carry enough ammo to make being revived worth it?

I sure as hell hope medics healing ability isn't relegated just to reviving the dead. That's not medicine, that's necromancy.

This is one of the reasons i hate regenerating health in recent shooters and no-time respawns. No need for medics.

[outsider]

Are you sure it wasn't an engineer ?


I haven't seen the footage, but I do remember reading somewhere here that for PS2, maxs don't get repaired anymore by engineers, but only have a health bar now. I think their armour stays constant.

Which adds another really important use for medics on the front line. a max+medic combo will be a really big problem to get around

[GuyFawkes]

With Galaxy spawns being more vulnerable, I think the revive is going to be PS2 medics bread and butter.

But healing will be very useful as well.

Not forgetting you will need a tech plant to access a Galaxy.

With the resource thing too , rezzing maxes and normal grunts will be a major plus.

The size of the maps -fights going on everywhere , keeping any sort of cohesion in a squad (remember squad spawning will have a cooldown)

Medics will be the oil keeping the machine moving ,ignore them at your peril

[Felborne]

I would like to see the medic & engineer classes combined into one class. This way I can also fix up our max units and armor. I had so much more fun being able to do both in PS1. If I wanted a change of pace I would then go repair turrets or vehicles instead of just being a medic.

[Top Sgt]

I haven't seen the footage, but I do remember reading somewhere here that for PS2, maxs don't get repaired anymore by engineers, but only have a health bar now. I think their armour stays constant.

Which adds another really important use for medics on the front line. a max+medic combo will be a really big problem to get around

max's do still get repaired by engineers. it was done many times in livestream over the last few days.

They also announced they are considering allowing Engineers the ability to revive a dead max also just like a medic can do.

[Xyntech]

I haven't seen the footage, but I do remember reading somewhere here that for PS2, maxs don't get repaired anymore by engineers, but only have a health bar now. I think their armour stays constant.

Which adds another really important use for medics on the front line. a max+medic combo will be a really big problem to get around

Engineers do repair MAXes now, in fact it seems that medics don't even heal them anymore. MAXes now seem operate in the same way as vehicles.

It was mentioned during one of the E3 live streams that the devs are considering even giving engineers the option of reviving MAX units (on a longer timer than it takes for medics). Personally, I hope they don't do this. I think it would be an interesting dynamic if you needed a medic to revive the MAX and an engi to heal them.

[ArmedZealot]

I sure as hell hope medics healing ability isn't relegated just to reviving the dead. That's not medicine, that's necromancy.

I don't really get this. "Medicine" is just changing a health bar from 25%-100% in most class shooter games. Why should Planetside stick the medic into that role as well?

I would like to see medics as more combat utility rather than a patcher-upper. There should be buff and a debuff system in place like most traditional MMO's for medics to give and deal out. Spawn interference that causes an enemy to spawn with -20% health for his next life, health buffs for friendlies, speed buffs for friendlies, AOE DoT's and slows. healing should be 10% of their total value on the field, just as the engineers repairing abilities should be 10% of his value.

[Kilratha]

My main focus especially in the beginning is going to be Combat Medic/Engineer/Command. (in order of priority for me.) I was disappointed to not see more medics during the E3 demo reviving and healing
.

[ArmedZealot]

My main focus especially in the beginning is going to be Combat Medic/Engineer/Command. (in order of priority for me.) I was disappointed to not see more medics during the E3 demo reviving and healing
.

I think that is just because the pick up players they had at e3 were useless at anything but pew pew.

[sylphaen]

Engineers do repair MAXes now, in fact it seems that medics don't even heal them anymore. MAXes now seem operate in the same way as vehicles.

It was mentioned during one of the E3 live streams that the devs are considering even giving engineers the option of reviving MAX units (on a longer timer than it takes for medics). Personally, I hope they don't do this. I think it would be an interesting dynamic if you needed a medic to revive the MAX and an engi to heal them.

I wouldn't mind engineers being able to revive MAXes. They already have a very strong synergy with Engineers being the main support guys for MAXes. Of course, I assume it would involve some trade-off like losing a custom ability that could have been set for something else (like faster repair or turrets or boomers or increased resistance to explosives or etc...) since reviving is a defining skill of the medic class.

PS1 had the inventories and armor classes which defined what roles you could play. PS2 has the classes which define broadly a role and then you customize your specialization instead of an inventory.

I'll try to post a thread about how I guess PS2 might play out with customization. I think it may actually offer as much diversity in roles as PS1 did...

[Xyntech]

I'll try to post a thread about how I guess PS2 might play out with customization. I think it may actually offer as much diversity in roles as PS1 did...

I agree that PS2 has that potential. It will just work a little differently than in the first game.

The biggest reason that I don't want to see engi's revive MAXes is because I feel like it would diminish the role of the medic, who I think deserves as much support to make it a valuable role as possible.

I'd much rather give something like ammo boxes to an engineer instead of allowing it to revive MAXes.

If a squad doesn't bring MAXes, it should be able to get by with just a medic or two, no need for engi's. I believe engineers are already valuable enough that there will be reason to bring them along regardless.

If a squad decides to bring nothing but MAXes and a few supporting units, I don't want it to turn into nothing but MAXes and engi's. I'd like it to either require some medics, or for them not to have the option to get revived.

Otherwise a huge MAX crash would be able to stay alive indefinitely with 90%+ MAXes, several engineers (who could also be setting up defensive turrets), and maybe one or two medics (among hundreds of players) just in case any of the engineers happen to die.

Maybe I would accept engineers being able to revive if it was a significant trade off, like that they couldn't deploy an ACE to make any turrets or anything. Basically limit them to repairing, reviving ONLY MAXes, and shooting a rifle.