Does Planetside 2 have the same HA weapons?

[EVILoHOMER]

I don't think I've seen them yet and just wondering if we know that Planetside 2 will have them?

[GTGD]

Yeah, the MCG, JH, and Lasher are all confirmed and we even have a picture of the MCG. But no info whatsoever about any of them.

If any dev is reading this, could you make it change? (yes we're spoiled with the amount of info and footage we've been shown...but...YOU DID THIS TO US)

[captainkapautz]

I think the new Jackhammer should be some kind of Autocannon, ya know slowfiring high caliber, kinda like a manportable Bushmaster, instead of a shotgun.

Never liked the rather narrow role of the JH in PS1, didn't matter much back then cause most every infantryfight was indoors or otherwise close quarters, but with the more open battlefield in PS2 I just feel that a shotgun-HA would be to specialised.

[Bags]

I think the new Jackhammer should be some kind of Autocannon, ya know slowfiring high caliber, kinda like a manportable Bushmaster, instead of a shotgun.

Never liked the rather narrow role of the JH in PS1, didn't matter much back then cause most every infantryfight was indoors or otherwise close quarters, but with the more open battlefield in PS2 I just feel that a shotgun-HA would be to specialised.

"I'm Terran, change the enemy's iconic gun~"

anyhow, NC max' gun stayed a shotgun.

[Purple]

the JH should fire elephant shot for ranged attack. like in the dukes of hazard.

[Sabot]

You kidding me? Didn't matter where you were... all you heard was BANG BANG BANG, and you were dead in 2.5 seconds. 'Random smurf name "JH picture" your name' ;P
Nah but honestly... you have tons of other weapons to use in open terrain.... VS HA is best in corridors and cramped spaces as well... The HA weapons are kind of iconic to the faction and I wouldn't want them to change.

[captainkapautz]

"I'm Terran, change the enemy's iconic gun~"

anyhow, NC max' gun stayed a shotgun.

My NC-main in PS1 likes to disagree, but if you want to think that way go ahead.

I just hope there are some common pool HAs as well and not just MCG, JH and Lasher, especially since I can't steal enemy empire guns any more.

[ThermalReaper]

Youtube, y u no have lasher videos?

But I'm assuming there is a huge chance of it. They would be just cruel if they put in iconic vehicles like the magrider and leave out weapons.

[Kriegson]

NC and I agree that the Jackhammer should be changed. There's a nice thread on the idea vault regarding a high power, low RoF rifle that fits the NC better than the lead spewing jackhammer of old imo.

Never made sense to my why the faction based around slow, powerful and accurate weapons (initially, you have to control them) would field a close range lead spewing scattergun.

[Hmr85]

NC and I agree that the Jackhammer should be changed. There's a nice thread on the idea vault regarding a high power, low RoF rifle that fits the NC better than the lead spewing jackhammer of old imo.

Never made sense to my why the faction based around slow, powerful and accurate weapons (initially, you have to control them) would field a close range lead spewing scattergun.

Probably because we literally destroyed shit in doors and the thing hit like a mag truck at close proxemity. Many TR and VS still fear that weapon even today it is all they talk about. :D

[The Kush]

I think the new Jackhammer should be some kind of Autocannon, ya know slowfiring high caliber, kinda like a manportable Bushmaster, instead of a shotgun.

Never liked the rather narrow role of the JH in PS1, didn't matter much back then cause most every infantryfight was indoors or otherwise close quarters, but with the more open battlefield in PS2 I just feel that a shotgun-HA would be to specialised.

GTFO

Please don't ever request to change the name of the legendary jackhammer. That is the dumbest request I have ever seen and I have been playing PS since 2004.

[The Kush]

NC and I agree that the Jackhammer should be changed. There's a nice thread on the idea vault regarding a high power, low RoF rifle that fits the NC better than the lead spewing jackhammer of old imo.

Never made sense to my why the faction based around slow, powerful and accurate weapons (initially, you have to control them) would field a close range lead spewing scattergun.

Umm excuse me? Who the fuck are you?

No. We do not want our jackhammer changed. The jackhammer is the heart of the NC. Just like the lash and mini are for the VS and TR. Each weapon has advantages and disadvantages. Quit crying.

[KTNApollo]

GTFO

Please don't ever request to change the name of the legendary jackhammer. That is the dumbest request I have ever seen and I have been playing PS since 2004.

He didn't say anything about changing the name. Read better.


Umm excuse me? Who the fuck are you?

No. We do not want our jackhammer changed. The jackhammer is the heart of the NC. Just like the lash and mini are for the VS and TR. Each weapon has advantages and disadvantages. Quit crying.

And doubleposting. Classy responses too. You can't speak for the entire NC so please stop saying "we." I'm sure plenty of NC are worried about how useless the JH will be outdoors and in open spaces (and from what we've seen, there is a lot of open space and outdoors).

[proxy]

Probably because we literally destroyed shit in doors and the thing hit like a mag truck at close proxemity. Many TR and VS still fear that weapon even today it is all they talk about. :D

^ this

[PeteHMB]

I'm sure plenty of NC are worried about how useless the JH will be outdoors and in open spaces (and from what we've seen, there is a lot of open space and outdoors).

Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about shotguns outdoors...but then, it would appear there's plenty of obstacles and indoor areas that it would dominate in as well. Mixed feelings but I'm going to wait for Beta to make a firm decision on like/dislike.

[Bags]

Every faction has an LMG for outdoors, I don't see what the problem is.

[captainkapautz]

Every faction has an LMG for outdoors, I don't see what the problem is.

The problem is that atm, to me, it seems that LMG+AV is just the better choice over all, if HA is just gonna be a simple copy+paste from PS1 gameplay-wise, but I'll wait until I actually see the "new" HA before going further into that.

[Zekeen]

I think the new Jackhammer should be some kind of Autocannon, ya know slowfiring high caliber, kinda like a manportable Bushmaster, instead of a shotgun.

Never liked the rather narrow role of the JH in PS1, didn't matter much back then cause most every infantryfight was indoors or otherwise close quarters, but with the more open battlefield in PS2 I just feel that a shotgun-HA would be to specialised.




http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a45/Zekeen/NCjackhammercolored-1.jpg

Like this?


http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=41754

I've had this idea before too. I created a replacement to make the NC more balanced in combat, rather than only good at 10 foot range. It was initially made to take the role beside the Jackhammer and take on the main responsibility, but then people wanted it to BE the Jackhammer, so I ended up redesigning a new Jackhammer as an Autocannon with the potential for Flak style rounds instead of a shotgun with close range capacities only.

After all, the Jackhammer is the only ultra close range HA. The MCG and Lasher can at LEAST hit medium to long range target, and deal some damage to tanks. Jackhammer couldn't do either, so it was TOO good at close quarters, it's why they kept nerfing it.

[Atheosim]

This one is for beta. We'll see if the NC still likes to have a close range advantage at a med-long disadvantage.

[Kriegson]

@Zekeen
Yeah, in most games where you have automatic shotguns they tend to either be OP or shite considering that it only does one thing very well in concept, and ends up either shredding people or being largely useless due to lack of versatility and mediocre damage.

As captainkapautz points out, there's little reason to use anything other than LMG/AV as far as we know. The LMG has quite a bit of versatility considering; you can run and gun (with so many rounds in a mag, inaccuracy can be overcome) you can shred people in close quarters and fire in controlled bursts to kill them at a distance.

For the jackhammer to be useful, it either needs to have decent range (not likely with a shotgun) or kill virtually anything within it's range faster than they can kill it if you get the first shot and don't miss the ones after. And that's not a very fun thing to be on the receiving end of.

Ergo, a more balanced, versatile design would be desirable.

[Ratstomper]

A lot of very passionate speculation in this thread. Especially for something none of us have tried yet. Looking at the designs they've done so far, I've got faith that they'll tweak the JH as necessary. As a single unit for the NC, I don't want the jackhammer to change to something else. It's iconic, serves well in the purpose it was designed (like every other weapon in the game) and is just totally badass.

[Kriegson]

A lot of very passionate speculation in this thread. Especially for something none of us have tried yet. Looking at the designs they've done so far, I've got faith that they'll tweak the JH as necessary. As a single unit for the NC, I don't want the jackhammer to change to something else. It's iconic, serves well in the purpose it was designed (like every other weapon in the game) and is just totally badass.

I agree on pretty much all counts, but there's no harm in speculating some alternatives. Who knows? Maybe down the road it might be added as another faction weapon?

At any rate though, the "purpose [the jackhammer] was designed" is an extremely narrow one. Kill things quickly in close range by projectiles all over.
However, with the recent addition of the flamethrower the Jackhammer is debatable in regards to a niche, however minute it may have been.

I do hope they are receptive to our feedback regarding the JH once we get our hands on em. =/

[Shade Millith]

Youtube, y u no have lasher videos?

But I'm assuming there is a huge chance of it. They would be just cruel if they put in iconic vehicles like the magrider and leave out weapons.

You mean like leaving out the Lancer? (Granted, I'm almost 100% sure they're bringing it back, as they've said they're having more than one AV for each faction. Which is good, because screw locking weapons)

[Sabot]

You mean like leaving out the Lancer? (Granted, I'm almost 100% sure they're bringing it back, as they've said they're having more than one AV for each faction. Which is good, because screw locking weapons)

No Lancer is a game breaker for me... and I'm almost serious in that statement.

[Goldeh]

GTFO

Please don't ever request to change the name of the legendary jackhammer. That is the dumbest request I have ever seen and I have been playing PS since 2004.

Call it the "Hammer of Jack"

It'll have a 3% drop right off in the corner highlands carried by a man named Snafu who you need to...

..Oh wait, wrong game.

[mynameismud]

I think the jackhammer shouldn't change a whole lot.

Just give it a realistic shotgun range, not the unrealistic stereotypical 5-10 foot range in most games. Real shotguns aren't like that.

[Kalbuth]

A plea for (or against) the Lasher

I'm preparing to get killed on sight by my fellow Vanus here, but please, please, consider completely change the Lasher mecanics. Or just remove it to a completely different HA.

The lasher is, simply put, the worst weapon design I ever saw in any FPS I played. Granted, I may not have a huuuuge experience, but ffs, seriously, who thought about this originally?

The Lasher is the only infantry weapon you'll ever see which is designed to miss.
It fires slow ass orbs (I don't think I played with the latest incarnation, bear with me, but this won't change the core, stupid, mecanics and design), making a hit completely dependant on your ennemy kindly strafing into it as soon as you get past 10m, and after a few shots your CoF is wide enough that actually aiming is useless.
It's so much designed to miss that the creator of this PoS has gone through the whole process of giving it some kind of retarded reward for missing, "awww, look, I'm sorry, you did much to try to hit, but this won't cut it, so, I'll give you a slight damage on your ennemy, even if he evaded".

So all in all, it's going to be a frustrating weapon on both sides : the VS trying to aim will more often than not rely on luck to land his shots, passed a certain distance, and the ennemy will dodge and still be hit.
Where the Lasher was shining was in spamming tight spaces.

Please, PS2 creators, make the PS2 Lasher award actual aiming and dodging!

[Pella]

After analyzing map layouts, The whole game seems far more open. With indoor fights allot wider than the original PS1 where the Jack Hammer is far more superior for indoors.

All i can say the MCGv2 is going to be badass.

[VanstK]

You mean like leaving out the Lancer? (Granted, I'm almost 100% sure they're bringing it back, as they've said they're having more than one AV for each faction. Which is good, because screw locking weapons)

What gave you that ridiculous idea? This post here (http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?p=721091#post721091) contains a photo from E3 of some of the cert trees for the VS, including some of the ones for Heavy Assault, and this image in particular (http://www.hamma.ws/ntemp/Infantry/Heavy%20Assault/HeavyAV.jpg) ought to reassure you.

[JesNC]

Well, since we haven't seen any HA except the MCG and no gameplay time whatsoever, I think the devs are putting a lot of thought into HA design and balance.

I expect all 3 ES Heavy Assault to be much more comparable in regards to range and TTK.

[Xaine]

Well, since we haven't seen any HA except the MCG and no gameplay time whatsoever, I think the devs are putting a lot of thought into HA design and balance.

I expect all 3 ES Heavy Assault to be much more comparable in regards to range and TTK.

Well said.

They're all going to fill more or less the same role anyway, as they're all under slung weapons, there will be differences in how they fill their roles, but I'm pretty sure they will all be close range man destroyers.

I'm interested to see how fast they bring down a max.

[DOUBLEXBAUGH]

All we know about the ESHAs is that they will all be hip slung with no ADS mechanic. We have seen the MCG and we have seen a concept art that COULD be a NC chain gun (new JH?). The Devs have also used the names Jackhammer and Lasher in interviews, but those could just be place holders till they finalize the guns.

If the concept TRay showed us a long time ago is a NC chain gun, I'd be fine with that change. What I really hope for is that they don't bring back the Lasher. It was a very annoying gun that caused all kinds of lag, and was never once balanced properly.

[mirwalk]

Well maybe they will tweak the JH like they did in BF3. Flechette (sp?) rounds for some tighter grouping and range, slugs, and buckshot.

Dare I say 12g frag rounds??? <<-- so many would cry foul if they were anything remotely like BF3.

Biggest issue with the JH is like people said it was for very short distance, the shot spread and damage falloff was bit much.

The lasher and chaingun could be used at range, sometimes to good effect. The only way you could get the JH to come closer to that would either, A: change the rounds to give you tradeoffs for range, Or B: do like the scatter max in PS1 and have a on the fly modifiable choke on the shotgun to change ranges.

[Deadeye]

Well maybe they will tweak the JH like they did in BF3. Flechette (sp?) rounds for some tighter grouping and range, slugs, and buckshot.

Dare I say 12g frag rounds??? <<-- so many would cry foul if they were anything remotely like BF3.

Biggest issue with the JH is like people said it was for very short distance, the shot spread and damage falloff was bit much.

The lasher and chaingun could be used at range, sometimes to good effect. The only way you could get the JH to come closer to that would either, A: change the rounds to give you tradeoffs for range, Or B: do like the scatter max in PS1 and have a on the fly modifiable choke on the shotgun to change ranges.

I actually had some success in BF3 with slug rounds and I think it would be great to have slugs as either an alternate fire mode or, since they're so in to customization, as an optional loadout for the JH. Use slugs outside and once the fighting moves indoors, switch back to pellets.

Will we be able to change classes or loadouts at stations or are you stuck with what you spawn with?

[mirwalk]

Can change loadouts at equipment stations, but if the base is not yours, you may need a hack cert to use that station.

[Hmr85]

This one is for beta. We'll see if the NC still likes to have a close range advantage at a med-long disadvantage.

Idk why everybody keeps underestimating the gauss rifle. It was nasty at medium to long and was one of the best if not the best medium to long range rifle in the game.

Also while we are on the topic keep the JH the way it was. I personally do not want it changed. It was great for close encounters of the 3rd kind. For everybody who had issues with medium to long range...lol.... Go get a Gauss rifle and learn to shoot.

[NewSith]

Let's just hope there's no maelstrom.

[Eyeklops]

A plea for (or against) the Lasher

I'm preparing to get killed on sight by my fellow Vanus here
*The rest removed for lunacy

KOS for debasing the great Lasher of old? No problem.

But seriously, just because you can't lead/aim with it doesn't mean other people have the same problem. I want the lasher back too, but not the current PS1 incarnation with the "mini-orbs." I want the big, slow orb'd version with awesome lashes, that actually LASH. It is the only gun I have ever seen with a traveling AOE and a blinding flashlight in each shot.

All we wanted was AV secondary mode & 5 more in the clip and the old Lasher would have been boss, but somewhere wires got crossed and they changed the whole gun.

As for the Jackhammer everybody is so upset about, just add choke side-grades to it. Also, we haven't seen all the bases yet, there may still be a great number of places where extreme short range weapons will dominate.

My last note is about how the guns were held in PS1. The MCG and Jackhammer were hip fired, and the Lasher was shoulder fired. If they take anything away from PS1, I hope they make the reincarnated ES HA look, feel, and operate in a way that gives me nostagia when I use them.

[Kalbuth]

KOS for debasing the great Lasher of old? No problem.

But seriously, just because you can't lead/aim with it doesn't mean other people have the same problem. I want the lasher back too, but not the current PS1 incarnation with the "mini-orbs." I want the big, slow orb'd version with awesome lashes, that actually LASH. It is the only gun I have ever seen with a traveling AOE and a blinding flashlight in each shot.



1) Your Lasher had no CoF raise? Awesome! There's no "aiming" when you spam, fyi
2) Any warp from your opponent was making your "lead" more a wild guess than anything else. You can ** fwap fwap ** all you want, as soon as your opponent was warping, you were better with a hitscan weapon. I don't know for you, but most my serious opponents were warping, because inducing warp was inherent to mastering PS. Or perhaps I never had the luxury to play on a decent PS server (Werner Hamster to the rescue!)
3) this doesn't make the actual design of a lasher, a weapon made to miss, any less silly, and bad at both sides of the weapon

[Rbstr]

As far as the jackhammer...as an NC dude, I'd like a bit of a change in it's function and there are two routes I'd go:

A sort of heavy Gauss or railgun autocannon type thing would fit the empire's ethos quite well. Especially with the less confined infantry gameplay. Big damage on hit, maybe some AV punch, semiauto, quite small splash radius.

Or a longer range choked down shotgun. Not many pellets, again big damage, jackhammerish ROF. If it has a selectable choke, don't change anything about the gun except the pellet spread.

[Kriegson]

The way I see it, no reason to have the JH function the way it used to now that everyone will have access to the flamethrower, probably not on every class but would expect to see it on more than just the MAX.

Railgun FTW. Or at least Slugs instead of spread pellets.

[QuantumMechanic]

For those worried that the Jackhammer will be ultra close range only, and that the Lasher won't be able to hit the broad side of a barn: cuh-stoh-mah-zeshun.

No doubt you'll be able to put certs into extending the range of your Jackhammer (at the expense of damage or something), and likewise increase the accuracy of the Lasher.

As all three are iconic, I hope they add them basically as they were. And then add plenty of certificate options to balance them out.

[Xeb]

Change the JH if you like as long as you don't touch the sound it made! No doubt the TR and VS still hear it in their sleep :lol:

[mynameismud]

For those worried that the Jackhammer will be ultra close range only, and that the Lasher won't be able to hit the broad side of a barn: cuh-stoh-mah-zeshun.

No doubt you'll be able to put certs into extending the range of your Jackhammer (at the expense of damage or something), and likewise increase the accuracy of the Lasher.

As all three are iconic, I hope they add them basically as they were. And then add plenty of certificate options to balance them out.

The jackhammer's range in planetside 1 will make it unfit for even indoor fighting in planetside 2. Shouldn't have to gimp damage just to make it viable. Sure the cert option you said will probably be there. But to keep the same range as the old jackhammer almost forces you to cert and use it.

Shotguns are silly in most games anyway. cant harm a fly past ten feet pfffff nonsense.

[GreatMazinkaise]

Well, the NC Scattercannon is still a shotgun and it seems to have respectable range (didn't it always? I can't remember). Presumably we'll see more of the same with the Jackhammer. Tripleshot and the sound it makes are both Mandatory.

Really, I'd like a lot of the weapon sounds to make a return...

[Knightwyvern]

As far as the jackhammer...as an NC dude, I'd like a bit of a change in it's function and there are two routes I'd go:

A sort of heavy Gauss or railgun autocannon type thing would fit the empire's ethos quite well. Especially with the less confined infantry gameplay. Big damage on hit, maybe some AV punch, semiauto, quite small splash radius.

Or a longer range choked down shotgun. Not many pellets, again big damage, jackhammerish ROF. If it has a selectable choke, don't change anything about the gun except the pellet spread.

I like the second one; maybe with lower ROF than I think you're talking about.

It should really tear things up but be a big high risk/reward kind of deal.

[ZeroOneZero]

Why do I get this uneasy feeling that the jackhammer is going to be OSOK. High damage, big spray, aim at the head and start seeing heads pop off. Maxes are going to suffer big time as well, since there are hit boxes now. The HA weapons were fine in PS1, maybe just add a secondary fire mode on the Jackhammer which allows you to switch ranges from medium to long distance (Like the NC scatter max).

The jackhammer makes some scary sounds :(.

[GreatMazinkaise]

It always had OSOK functionality... you just had to land all the tri-shot pellets and wait forever for it to reload.

Of course, now it may be able to do it without that handicap...

[Kriegson]

Well, the NC Scattercannon is still a shotgun and it seems to have respectable range (didn't it always? I can't remember). Presumably we'll see more of the same with the Jackhammer. Tripleshot and the sound it makes are both Mandatory.

Really, I'd like a lot of the weapon sounds to make a return...

I don't recall the scatter cannon having the most impressive range, though it had 3 selections and on the tightest choke...eh...not amazing.

The scattershots from E3 though seem to have a fairly tight grouping, which is fine for the scattercannon and the generic shotgun, but not the Jackhammer. I know that realistically, if the weapon starts off too powerful, it'll probably be nerfed again and 1/3 of the playerbase complaining about it being underpowered probably wouldn't be enough to get it changed.

[vampyro]

They should just come up with new HA weapons. Theres no need to have the original ones in the game, they created too much of a balancing head ache.

[Rbstr]

I don't recall the scatter cannon having the most impressive range, though it had 3 selections and on the tightest choke...eh...not amazing.

The scattershots from E3 though seem to have a fairly tight grouping, which is fine for the scattercannon and the generic shotgun, but not the Jackhammer. I know that realistically, if the weapon starts off too powerful, it'll probably be nerfed again and 1/3 of the playerbase complaining about it being underpowered probably wouldn't be enough to get it changed.

I agree, I found the scattercannon's choke to be only marginally effective in PS1. I liked the scatter max shown at E3.
Depending on how the other empire's guns work I'd want something that can compete at a reasonable range with more than simple blind luck.
Of course if the MCG is terrifyingly short range, the JH can remain that way.

[Kriegson]

They should just come up with new HA weapons. Theres no need to have the original ones in the game, they created too much of a balancing head ache.

Hrm.....I think they probably are. It didn't exactly take them long to make the Gauss, Pulsar, and cycler...hell they even got the MAX's out for E3, but not the iconic HA weapons?

[GreatMazinkaise]

They should just come up with new HA weapons. Theres no need to have the original ones in the game, they created too much of a balancing head ache.

This is not even an option... faction Heavy Assault weapons are far too iconic to be left out.