Placing an Importance on Alliances?

[eMaGyN]

What thoughts do you have on the idea of inner faction alliances?
Has the NC or the VS started any thing similar to this idea?

:love:
eMa

[Jakal]

what you mean like terran ally with nc to go kill the vanu?

[eMaGyN]

Hrm... what i actually meant was if the individual outfits who were NC came together under a single organization as an alliance.


but either way is good for discussion.

:love:
eMa

[Jakal]

I dont think an thing like that would work. I mean if i ran a clan i'd want to keep control over it. No point if your going to be some lvl. 5 commanders errand boy.

[Sputty]

Depends on how they run it. I think AGO is doing a good job with it as it allows the outfits have their own freedoms but still allowing them to come together easily and fight when it's necessary

[Hife246]

I would, an Alliance doesn't mean the higher rank of teh 2 gets control.. its we'll work together and share help but I control my guys and u control yours atless otherwise specified.

[Jakal]

I thought u meant like all the forces of one empire are under the control of ine overall supreme commander. If it's just cooperation then yeah defenitely. Especially specialized outfits like all pilots and such

[afex]

alliances will be important when trying to take out heavily defended base.

you simply will need the # of ppl

[Ouroboros]

Why not create an elected senate or parliment to discuss matters. This way at least most people can agree.

[Streamline]

Im' not at liberty to discuss it. :love:

[txMaddog]

There probably are Alliances, either formal or informal. Some Outfits (Clans, Guilds, whatever) will probably hang out together even if they aren't allied.

We'll have to wait and see what develops. :)

[Nightmare]

Originally posted by Ouroboros1
Why not create an elected senate or parliment to discuss matters. This way at least most people can agree.
That's too much politics, we're just supposed to fight. We don't really need a senate either, just get 2 outfit leaders to agree on teaming up for an assault and then attack.

[LesserShade]

I think alliances will be important. They worked in DAoC :shrugs:

[Hamma]

I think they will be a big part. Lots of #'s will be needed

[tmax]

the only possible way this will ever happen is if one empire controls the entire contenent...then the other two MIGHT work together to get it back even but for the most part that would be like americas teaming up with iraq to fight a war

[DarkDragon00]

Terran Elite Airborne Regiment

SHHHHhhhhhhhhhhH!

eMa dont give away our secret..! Damn Vanu and NC should stay confused while the Terran Outfits become opganized and stronger. Now you gave them an idea.

AGO FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-Dark- CO [TEAR]

ps- i really dont think there is anybody in VS or NC strong enough to pick up the weight of something like this (only eMa can) so the Terrans now have an alliance advantage. Contact eMa or me if ur the leader of a terran outfit for some info on alliances (go with eMa she can sign u up, i can only give you TEAR's support and contact eMa), together the Terran will become a force to reckon with.

[Big Bro]

Haven't read this whole thread but I'll say what I feel at the risk of repeating someone...

Alliances will be a big key to the success of any faction.

The larger outfits (100s of people) will not necessarily need to worry about being in an alliance, as they have the numbers to do most things.

The smaller outfits (< 20) will NEED to buddy up with other outfits in order to do some good.

So there you have it. Small outfit = needs alliance. Large outfit = doesn't need alliance.

All in all, I think they are good no matter how big you are.

[DarkDragon00]

I say bull SHIP to u Big Bro. Anyone can get an advantage from being in some sort of buddy system. Doesn't matter if they are bg or small.

-Dark- CO [TEAR]

[BigDickMccoy]

I agree....Even if you have an outfit of 100's not everyone will be logged on at the same time, there will have to be intra-faction alliances or the faction will do poorly. Even in the military, diffrent regiments/divisions/brigades work with each other because it makes them stronger. I figure everything will run more like rl than most other FPS's because it will be ongoing and need lots of coop

[Vimp]

I posted a thread in the official VS forum with regards something simelar to this topic.

Link: http://boards.station.sony.com/ubb/planetside-vanusovereignty/Forum2/HTML/000797.html

Unfortunatly I havn't seen much of any intelligence in responses to my thread. But never the less I feel it has potential.

[Serious Styles]

well lets say two groups want one HGE group destroyed.

Lets call this HUGE group Rome and lets call the smaller but still large groups Attilla and than even smaller groups Visigoths, Alans and Burgundians. Now all these groups share one interest. They want Rome dead so they agree to alliance but soon after Rome is gone things fall apart and the cycle begins again.

If any of this doesnt make sense shoot me k thanks

[Diego]

Alliances will be a good and bad thing, at least I think so.

See, some outfit leaders want to just have there own squad/outfit and there own men. They want to be in charge and if they are large enough, they won't need alliances. But if they are small, like some outfits, they might not mind alliances, perhaps to find a home if theres is overun, or a place to hang out and make base for the time being, or to even make some more friends to frag with.

But as far as I go, I don't know if I'd want to make alliances, simpy because I don't know what I would gain from it besides another text document on my desktop until I find the time to make another .php page for my website to put them on...

-Diego

[NewmanOnIsland]

I see this entire dynamic happening at one time or another, and a form taking shape inasmuch to the working, player continuity�s, success. This large a group will go through many and adopt many types of organization, many will also fail. My advice to you all is to remember to approach both the micro and the macro part of this game with open minds.

AND HAVE FUN OUT THERE YA!



ps great topic

[Airlift]

The main benefit of an alliance over an uberguild is in the reduced administrative overhead. The cost of the alliance is in reduced communication between cells. For an alliance to really pay off, it will need a good site that allows high levels of coordination between the outfits.

[eMaGyN]

I, myself, never mentioned anything about the AGO ;)
Although this idea is no secret. If you listened carefully there was talk about the AGO on the outfit roundtable weeks ago.
If the other outfits involved agree, we might go public with this idea whenever the site comes back up.

:)

:love:
eMa

[Chanfan]

I think that, of course, there will be alliances between outfits.

The whole idea of an outfit is what? To work together.

How could two (or more) groups with this as their basic tenant not work with each other?

I know some groups will either be too elitist, too different in purpose or function, or whatever, to work well with some, or perhaps most, other groups. But I think that most outfits will at least be willing to work together.

Unlike other FPS's, a clan/guild/outfit's goal isn't to defeat all other outfits - but all enemy outfits and troops. Since you are on a side in a war, this changes the dynamic quite a bit.

I think that even larger outfits will need, or still gain advantages from, linking up, even with smaller units. Sure, if you have 100 folks on-line, you are set to attack that base - but it will work even better if that 20 man outfit is attacking a different base at the same time, with the idea of drawing off reenforcements.

I have some experience in a - erm, different - environment were I am part of a team, linked up with other teams of different sizes and skills, and groups of "lone wolfs". This is in a two-sided war format, with each side being made of various groups and individuals. Typically, if there's a few groups, we usually make plans and cooperate (you take their left, we'll take their right flank). If it's a larger conflict, and there's lots of troops, we tend to have an overall commander, with the heads of the different bodies of troops advising with ideas and opinions on his/her groups capabilities. Each group gets a task as part of the overall plan (which, of course, tends to go out the window right after contact with the enemy, but that's war).

I don't see why PS would work too much differently, I'd expect outfits to work together - the difficult part is organization and chain of command structures. The side that gets this well worked out for their outfits will have a distinct advantage.

[Hellsfire123]

Originally posted by DarkDragon00
Terran Elite Airborne Regiment

SHHHHhhhhhhhhhhH!

eMa dont give away our secret..! Damn Vanu and NC should stay confused while the Terran Outfits become opganized and stronger. Now you gave them an idea.

AGO FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-Dark- CO [TEAR]

ps- i really dont think there is anybody in VS or NC strong enough to pick up the weight of something like this (only eMa can) so the Terrans now have an alliance advantage. Contact eMa or me if ur the leader of a terran outfit for some info on alliances (go with eMa she can sign u up, i can only give you TEAR's support and contact eMa), together the Terran will become a force to reckon with.

uhhh...... www.housevarnay.com and www.sghq.com . House Varnay is an alliance of vanu and sturmgrenadier....well we all know they wont need much help....

Where exactly was that advantage? i missed it.....

[Big Bro]

Originally posted by DarkDragon00
I say bull SHIP to u Big Bro. Anyone can get an advantage from being in some sort of buddy system. Doesn't matter if they are bg or small.

-Dark- CO [TEAR]

Not sure what you mean here DD...but it will matter if you are "big or small". I don't care how great a team you have, numbers will matter. You need bodies to make things happen.

You can buddy up all you want to with your friends and make a great team, but it won't matter in the war unless you coordinate with the overall effort.

All I was saying is that the bodies can either come from a huge uber-outfit...or from a banded-together collection (alliance?) of smaller outfits. Either way, you need the numbers. That was my point initially if I didn't state it well enough.

[OmnipotentKiwi]

Simply put, more #s is important, so is alliances.

[RageMaster]

All those wannabe commanders who would'nt fight under a level 5 commander because they like to be at the top of the chain better wise up.

Level 5 commaders have lead LOTS of squadmates to LOTS of BEP, earning them enough CEP to max out their command rank. If you see a level 5 commander you can rest assured his strategy and skill is sound enough to do extremely well with a large group of people, and they have all the features that are unlocked by their command rank. So, if you do actually suck at commanding, no-one would want to form up under you, as they can quite clearly see your leadership skills are n00b.

Therefore, if lower commanders of outfits want to forgoe participating in a battle lead by a lvl 5 commander, I'd happily take their place. I know my team would have a distinct use on any strategy he wants to pull, I have a chance to work with and learn from and talk to a 'better' commander, I'd have a chance to score some great BEP for myself and my own outfit, I'd have an awesome and challenging gaming time under his command, and myself and my own outfit members would benefit from this.

But if you want to stick to smalltime, its your choice.

[RageMaster]

And I dont believe outfit numbers will be greatly important, as faction numbers will be equal. Outfit success will be all about being as combat effective as you can be, whether you have a 10 man or 100 man outfit.

If I have an outfit of five, who work better than your outfit of ten, sure you'd kick my ass. But if I focused my efforts with another small outfit of 5, we'd outclass you. Combat Effectiveness... seriously. Forget about large numbers.

[AztecWarrior]

I am sure that taking a base with a clan of five stealthers will work.

NOT!

I think that, for that to work, you need a distraction. So maybe six will work.

[mikkyT]

Alliances are a great idea... but I think that they will be implemented by default.

Your alligence is your alliance - eg if your NC then your alliance is NC.

Your commanders have command channels which are viewed by any NC commander regardless of what outfit they are in.

So I think the game is going to handle this without having to make artificial alliances (With IRC channels and such) its going to be handled in-game without us having to do some work to make it work (like we have to in EQ etc).

But Im going to have the alliance Northern Auraxis Treaty Organisation (NATO) for the NC as our sanctuary is based in the northern hemisphere :)

[mikkyT]

Level 5 commaders have lead LOTS of squadmates to LOTS of BEP, earning them enough CEP to max out their command rank. If you see a level 5 commander you can rest assured his strategy and skill is sound enough to do extremely well with a large group of people, and they have all the features that are unlocked by their command rank. So, if you do actually suck at commanding, no-one would want to form up under you, as they can quite clearly see your leadership skills are n00b.

AMEN!

Thats why its pointless forming up alliances out of game as the leaders of these alliances have never lead a planetside group and have no CEP.

Im not going to sumbit myself to a commander who may be less experienced than myself just because he has got some 1337 web skillz and has made an alliance website and spoke to some outift leaders and got them to sign up!

This is going to be done IN GAME I tell ya!

[eMaGyN]

I dont think that you fully understand the importance of an alliance organization outside of the game, i would explain myself in a more complete aspect, but i see you're NC, and i don't want to give you too much help.

:love:
eMa

[mikkyT]

I dont think that you fully understand the importance of an alliance organization outside of the game, i would explain myself in a more complete aspect, but i see you're NC, and i don't want to give you too much help.

I dont think you fully understand the importance of an alliance organization inside of the game, I would explain myself in more complete aspect, but I see you're female, and I don't want to give you any help :D

[mikkyT]

Look I'll put it this way, I understand perfectly what your saying. But I don't see the point. Your not here to organise mega-raids against a dragon thats going to pop up in X number of hours after the servers come up and you need to arrive at the buff point before uberguild002..

Things in this game will be moving a lot faster and the need to plan IN GAME will far outweigh the need for external planning.

I've been in, and lead, alliance organisations in previous MMOs (namely EverQuest on the Tunare server, the Tunare-Europa alliance, later became the uberguild Tide) and I perfectly understand the need to have a focal point for such alliances, where they are needed.

I just don't think Planetside is of the game where such focal points are needed.

Unless the leader of the alliance is the very same person with battle rank 20 and is teh uber commander for the TR/VS/NC then its pointless.

Raids and such will be dictated far more by the state of the nation in game than anything outside.

[mr_luc]

In DAoC, Alliances worked incredibly well on the RP servers. All told, if you added up the active players in some of the biggest alliances, you ended up with 3/4 of the players in a Realm. The Greater Albion Alliance was unstoppable. :) The teamwork -- especially the coordination of supplies to build seige weapons, that was my job for a couple a Relic Raids -- was stupendous; we completely held some of the most important choke points, just laid down a wall of fire that our forces could retreat past.

We're talking about an ATTACKING force of over 200 people -- at 3:00 in the morning! (Not counting those that held the retreat points with the siege weapons, there were 20 or so of us the 2 times we did that). The organization was stupendous. If your computer didn't die from the graphics lag, and if your connection held up under the beating, you got a taste of the first truly massive, really interactive warfare in an MMORPG.

It's a shame the combat was so gay. :( I mean, for a game with PvP combat on that scale, it dumbs down the whole thing to make the combat point-and-click. As the game evolved it became apparent that the most important factors in winning a 1 on 1 match up were your relative skill levels first, the classes you were second (some classes had no hope against other classes, it was just formulaic do this then this then this and you win), and third, stupid interface things -- can you click on them (or hit the 'select nearest enemy' button) quickly? Got them selected? Hit the hotkey for your cast! Watch it cast! Cast the correct spell to follow that spell! If you were a melee it was even worse -- the interface and player movement was designed for Everquest, and it worked fine for that type of game -- but melee was a mess, the control system was bad enough that they threw it out the window and said 'screw this -- here's lock-on, if you're close enough to the enemy you have selected you become a homing missile'.

But even those limited and counterintuitive combat dynamics weren't useful 99% of the time. 99% of the time, it was a mismatch that you couldn't do anything about. 2 out of 3 times, the levels weren't even enough to provide a fair fight, and you won (or lost) easily with no problems. The rest of the time, it was a class mismatch -- they had, say, a melee class, and you were a caster with a root spell, there was a simple procedure to follow, and if you followed it you always won, no matter what the other guy did. There was ONE way to play a given class, some classes were MORE powerful period, and the only excitement came when occasionally someone did something out of the routine -- ooh! He forgot to root me! Whee!

Heh, mad rantage here . . . I type at 65 wpm on average, but much higher when I'm ranting about DAoC.

But honestly, I see player alliances evolving VERY quickly as long as PS includes good tools like a friends list, both a clan and an alliance chat channel, etc.

[Manitou]

Well said, mr_luc!

[RageMaster]

People who have plans to stay 'the commander' in their pre-release outfit are deluded.

The chances are that they've invited someone who is better at commanding teammates than they are. When their outfit gets wind that their current leader is suxor compared to this hardcore mofo subordinate, chances are they'll change their outfit to rally under a leader who will do more for them.

Commanders will have to have something special about them, seriously. And you'll see no idiot commanders in PlanetSide, they just wont happen.

[mikkyT]

/applause RageMaster

[Zatrais]

Alliances will be important cause well when all comes to all, numbers will win the game imo.

As Stalin (99% sure it was him) said, quantity has a quality in its own.

[Donkeysmiler]

Speaking of alliances, the AGO site (not to mention the CDL site) are finally back up :)

http://ago.dragonwolves.com