Lasher, Jackhammer and MCG.

[Xaine]

This is the first time i've played PS1 in a while. I've seen the Lasher go through many changes, but currently i've come to the opinion that..

Its fucking awful.

You see TR running around with stolen JHs, and NC with MCGs.. and you see the VS with either... but i can't remember the last time i saw either the TR or NC with a Lasher.

I'd rather use the sweeper, and i do. The range is very short, yeah - but its TTK is actually good and it kills people? I do FAR better wth the sweeper than with the Lasher. Every time i come up against a JH or a MCG with a Lasher i get destroyed.

Am i just a baddie, or what?

[Grimster]

I remember back in 2003 or 2004 when they released that patch that made the Lasher insanely overpowered. :)

You didn't even need direct line of sight to kill with it because the lashes hurt so bad. :)

I also remember having whole bunch of those babies stashed away. Threw them away when it got nerfed. :)

[Redshift]

You see TR running around with stolen JHs, and NC with MCGs.. and you see the VS with either... but i can't remember the last time i saw either the TR or NC with a Lasher.


We have ammo for those

[Snorf]

Lasher 2.0 was overpowered, yet it was still the closest to being the vs balanced ha. They just were never able to figure out how to get it right.

[Xenostalker]

I've always wanted to post my own raging thread about how utterly useless and pathetic the Lasher is...

Thank you, kind sir. Now I can simply reply with "I agree."

But... PS2 is coming out so... :D

[Gandhi]

I like to pick up a Lasher now and then, especially for a base fight, but not having access to ammo for it makes it pretty hard. And I can't keep them in my locker without using up a bunch of space for pilfered ammo boxes too.

[ringring]

This is the first time i've played PS1 in a while. I've seen the Lasher go through many changes, but currently i've come to the opinion that..

Its fucking awful.

You see TR running around with stolen JHs, and NC with MCGs.. and you see the VS with either... but i can't remember the last time i saw either the TR or NC with a Lasher.

I'd rather use the sweeper, and i do. The range is very short, yeah - but its TTK is actually good and it kills people? I do FAR better wth the sweeper than with the Lasher. Every time i come up against a JH or a MCG with a Lasher i get destroyed.

Am i just a baddie, or what?

And funnily enough as TR I'd rather fight against the NC+JH than VS+Lasher. I think it is due to the effective range where if I keep the range long against JH I have an advantage.

Perhaps your experience is because the Lasher is an in-between weapon and by that I mean you need longer range against the JH and shorter range against the MCG so you need to fight in 2 different styles.

I'd advise not trying to use the VS MA though .... it's much easier for me to fight against than the Lasher.

[cryosin]

The problem with the Lasher is that it is simply a worse MCG.

It has a longer TTK, more recoil, slower rate of fire and you basically cant strafe and shoot the thing unless you're point blank.

The sad part is, its still our best indoor weapon outside of the sweeper(which is just worse than a Jackhammer).

I end up using it because I at least have a chance against other HA's, but it is un-deniably worse.

The Lasher was originally balanced around its "lash". It wouldn't always win 1v1, but its lashing made it very good in large numbers, which is what planetside is all about.

Unfortunately, the lash has been reduced to nothing. It literally does about 5% armor damage, regardless of which firing mode you use. That's right, 5%(maybe less?) of their ARMOR.... meaning you gotta chew through armor before it even matters. Essentially, the lash doesn't exist. Not to mention, the orb has to travel at least 10 feet before the lash effects anything.

I think if the lasher took 1 less hit to kill a rexo it would be balanced right now, but at this point it doesn't matter. They could never figure out how to balance the lash over the main target, and that's why it was always OP or UP.

[DarkSkyes]

lol the lasher is bad if you have bad aim. I actually have a better KD when I play VS than I do when play TR. If you don't miss the lasher has a much better TTK than the MCG and it matches up well with the JH at close range. If you do miss a shot though, you are dead.

If you learn how to use it the lasher is actually a very good weapon.

[Xaine]

Given that I've played several FPS games competitively, I seriously doubt my aim is the issue here.

After about 4 shots the orbs start flying everywhere in a 45 degree cone in front of you. You can burst it, but then the TTK gets even worse.

The Jackhammer actually has a semi decent range for a shotgun. You can't kill the NC before he can run at you with the JH and destroy you.

The MCG has better range, less recoil and even at point blank the TTK seems pretty similar.

But yeah, PS2 soon I guess. Just you'd think in 9 years they would have managed to balance it.

[ringring]

Don't think of the lasher as a bad mcg .... it is itself, distinct and different.

The lash itself may only do 1 hit point of damage or whatever it is, but that means that if you miss the lash will cause the mcg cof to bloom and your TR opponent will start missing shots ... the lash isn't what it was but it still has a benefit.

I repeat against TR get in close and put your better TTK to use.

[PrISM]

The older lashers were, of course better than what it is now. That being said, it's still not as useless as a lot of people make it out to be. You can still be effective at killing with it if you know what you're doing.

[Baneblade]

The concept of the Lasher is all wrong for an HA weapon. The VS needed a manportable PPA.

[infy]

Weapons in ps doesn't really matter, it's all bout your aim. Sometimes i can kill people with the lasher way faster than the mcg/jh, clientside oi?


check out some of my vids :


Inf3rNaL #1 - YouTube

[legendary]

The Lasher does it job. Stop trying to use it like the other HA weapons, it has its own sweet spot, even if it’s a bit squirrelly to aim. The lasher is a great team weapon, godly suppression.

[Zulthus]

While I'll freely admit I'm one of the guys that says 'God damn, this gun is a piece of shit' when I die to a JH or MCG, it really isn't that bad. If you don't miss a shot and you engage a MCG, you'll win. Just back off a bit from JH's because if the other person has half a brain you won't win closer than 10m.

The thing that is frustrating about the Lasher is that it never shoots where you want it to. Countless times I've tried ADADADADing enemies and when I'd go right, it'd shoot to the left, then I'd go left, and it'd shoot to the right, and I wouldn't land one damn shot. I have good days though where I tear through NC and TR alike with it.

It's really hit or miss with the gun, but if you learn how to place your shots it isn't a bad gun at all.

[Arkaiden]

Not only is it inaccurate, but the rounds are slow as dirt. Anyone even remotely in the way of a round from 50 feet out can dodge it.

Meanwhilst, I repeatedly got sniped by mcgs from 100 yards out.

[Bravix]

My major gripe is it's innacuracy and hit recognition.

I have, not making shit up here, pumped 14 orbs into a guy. Saw them hit. Then died to the guy's MCG.

Against TR, if it actually records my hits, I can charge up and do some damage.

Never have much luck against NC. It's too inaccurate. NC doesn't have to do a ton of damage to you if you have the Lasher. One little pellet from their shotgun and your aim blooms outta control. After that, you're done for.

I don't know what's up with the hit recognition...sometimes it works flawlessly, other times it leaves me going, "WTF." And its not my internet connection, because I've never had a problem with the Pulsar. I <3 Pulsar.

[Xaine]

While I'll freely admit I'm one of the guys that says 'God damn, this gun is a piece of shit' when I die to a JH or MCG, it really isn't that bad. If you don't miss a shot and you engage a MCG, you'll win. Just back off a bit from JH's because if the other person has half a brain you won't win closer than 10m.

The thing that is frustrating about the Lasher is that it never shoots where you want it to. Countless times I've tried ADADADADing enemies and when I'd go right, it'd shoot to the left, then I'd go left, and it'd shoot to the right, and I wouldn't land one damn shot. I have good days though where I tear through NC and TR alike with it.

It's really hit or miss with the gun, but if you learn how to place your shots it isn't a bad gun at all.

Thank you for your reply, and i'm not trying to be a cock here.

But didn't you just contradict yourself pretty heavily there?

You said its frustrating that it never shoots where you want it too, and then you said learn to place your shots. :P

This is why I prefer the Sweeper. Sure its worse than a JH, but fuck me, at least its reliable. I know its range, i know what it can do and what it can't do.

Every time i pick up the Lasher i just never know if its going to hit every time, or miss every time.

I do play with a 180~ ping constantly because I'm in London, that coupled with the already suspect latency issues and hit recognition in Planetside makes some gunfights rather interesting.

Like, for example, me in a tower with an AI Max. A guy runs up the stairs towards me.. i move around the corner and start blasting him in the face, he looks at me for a second, puts away his gun, turns around and runs back down the stairs in a straight line and round the corner, while i'm constantly shooting him in the back, with hit markers everywhere. In an AI MAX. Its a Rexo i'm shooting at.

He doesn't die and just runs around the corner.


The thing i'm really looking forward to in PS2, more than anything, is having it so when i SHOOT people, they ACTUALY DIE.

[DOUBLEXBAUGH]

The thing i'm really looking forward to in PS2, more than anything, is having it so when i SHOOT people, they ACTUALY DIE.

Soooooo much this. Playing PS1 these last few days I hate when I die to someone I've put 8 JH shots into and my enhanced targeting shows me that only 2 actually registered :mad:

[Pella]

Weapons in ps doesn't really matter, it's all bout your aim. Sometimes i can kill people with the lasher way faster than the mcg/jh, clientside oi?


check out some of my vids :


Inf3rNaL #1 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQNWQR8R4Q4)

3RD person view ownage ftw.

[Captain1nsaneo]

I compensate for my bad aim and lasher usage with P-Shield and a Quasar.

But yeah, it's not really that good even in groups any more. Scares ya and keeps you out of tunnels just fine though.

[infy]

3RD person view ownage ftw.

Heh, tryed to get creative on it... Its nothing special, but im working on another one right now where im trying to get some footage of me facerolling 1v5 etc.. It's my first vid anyways

[Kalbuth]

Weapons in ps doesn't really matter, it's all bout your aim. Sometimes i can kill people with the lasher way faster than the mcg/jh, clientside oi?


check out some of my vids :


[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQNWQR8R4Q4"]Inf3rNaL #1 - YouTube[/ url]

Mmmh, not to sound a prick, and knowing I'm not that good of an aim, but really, aiming and hitting in PS1 isn't difficult. Often what makes you win in your vid is more your movement (which must make you warp a lot on ennemy screen) than your aim.
After coming back to PS, I'm rather shocked how I find it easy to hit compared to my memory after having played other FPS for some years.

As for topic, the very concept of Lasher, from the beginning, a weapon which is technically going to miss, and which is given a stupid mecanism to make up for missing, is going to be a fail.
I much prefer current lasher where actually hitting is much more controllable than before, when orb was slow and CoF wild after 4 shots

[infy]

Mmmh, not to sound a prick, and knowing I'm not that good of an aim, but really, aiming and hitting in PS1 isn't difficult. Often what makes you win in your vid is more your movement (which must make you warp a lot on ennemy screen) than your aim.
After coming back to PS, I'm rather shocked how I find it easy to hit compared to my memory after having played other FPS for some years.

As for topic, the very concept of Lasher, from the beginning, a weapon which is technically going to miss, and which is given a stupid mecanism to make up for missing, is going to be a fail.
I much prefer current lasher where actually hitting is much more controllable than before, when orb was slow and CoF wild after 4 shots

I'm sure we are all well aware of that

And im getting tired of hearing this "warp" blah blah bs rofl, everyone warps just cert an aim

[Canaris]

I would love this stupid debate to be settled with PS1 stats released on which HAs since patch have been scavenged the most. From my experience I have often seen NC and TR bodies looted, while VS corpses are ignored, the Lasher is not prized.

well as Redshift pointed out one of the main reasons it's not taken is due to the fact NC & TR can't freely get ammo for it.

Honestly I've seen people handle the lasher like a pro, you need skill to wield it, how long since you all last played Planetside btw? if you've only just come back after years sabatical what are you expecting, just to pick up a gun and be god like? pffff

[Kalbuth]

I'm sure we are all well aware of that

And im getting tired of hearing this "warp" blah blah bs rofl, everyone warps just cert an aim

You're getting overly defensive :eek:

[Verruna]

In my mind planetsides netcode/player warping combined with lasher orbs having to be led and general inaccuracy of the weapon itself makes the lasher a piece of garbage in its current state. If you manage to direct hit land all your orbs its decent though, LOL. Its not completely useless but its the worst HA.

[Dart]

well as Redshift pointed out one of the main reasons it's not taken is due to the fact NC & TR can't freely get ammo for it.

Honestly I've seen people handle the lasher like a pro, you need skill to wield it

Not sure "skill" or lack thereof is an excuse. I've played with some of the best Lasher users in PS history and all of them still agree that over the course of PS it was still the worst HA.

I see no reason why PS2 shouldn't have more balanced HA however.

[p0intman]

fuck ha. guass/sweeper for the motherfucking win.

[robocpf1]

fuck ha. guass/sweeper for the motherfucking win.

I agree with p0int.

You guys use Heavy Assault?

Scrubs.

[infy]

You're getting overly defensive :eek:

Bro, you better come at me or die tryin' Show respect to the best player or face an early grave.

[GTGD]

In my mind planetsides netcode/player warping combined with lasher orbs having to be led and general inaccuracy of the weapon itself makes the lasher a piece of garbage in its current state. If you manage to direct hit land all your orbs its decent though, LOL. Its not completely useless but its the worst HA.

This. With strafe warping, the only way you will beat someone is if they strafe predictably or by luck. The warp is too fast for the lasher's orbs unless you're shoving it up their butts. So what is happening is that you are either 1) leading, in which they will not move into the orb, or 2) aim directly at them, and they will strafe away from it.

The lasher definitely has its uses, but it's nowhere near as effective as the MCG outdoors just under MA range or the JH when wallhumped. Lasher spamming doors/hallways and while retreating around corners is good. It can beat a JH pretty easily at longer ranges.

But to be honest, I only really keep HA on my VS character to loot JHs and MCGs. Recently I've been getting back into the sweeper (kept forgetting they buffed it to 12 shots in a clip) and I find it comparable. If I keep doing well I might pump those points into something more useful.

[Zulthus]

Thank you for your reply, and i'm not trying to be a cock here.

But didn't you just contradict yourself pretty heavily there?

You said its frustrating that it never shoots where you want it too, and then you said learn to place your shots. :P

This is why I prefer the Sweeper. Sure its worse than a JH, but fuck me, at least its reliable. I know its range, i know what it can do and what it can't do.

Every time i pick up the Lasher i just never know if its going to hit every time, or miss every time.

I do play with a 180~ ping constantly because I'm in London, that coupled with the already suspect latency issues and hit recognition in Planetside makes some gunfights rather interesting.

Like, for example, me in a tower with an AI Max. A guy runs up the stairs towards me.. i move around the corner and start blasting him in the face, he looks at me for a second, puts away his gun, turns around and runs back down the stairs in a straight line and round the corner, while i'm constantly shooting him in the back, with hit markers everywhere. In an AI MAX. Its a Rexo i'm shooting at.

He doesn't die and just runs around the corner.


The thing i'm really looking forward to in PS2, more than anything, is having it so when i SHOOT people, they ACTUALY DIE.

Well no, what I'm trying to say is that if you just pick up the Lasher and go without any experience it is the most frustrating gun in the game because it doesn't ever shoot where you want it to. Once you use it enough however you start to learn where the orbs go in the cone and you can compensate your aim for it. It's taken me a long time with the new Lasher but I'm starting to get pretty good with it. If you're further away from an enemy than the distance between the two doors on a tower, never aim straight at him. You'll have to move the crosshair slightly to the left or to the right. If your first shot goes left, the next is going to go right. Etc.

[Xaine]

Well no, what I'm trying to say is that if you just pick up the Lasher and go without any experience it is the most frustrating gun in the game because it doesn't ever shoot where you want it to. Once you use it enough however you start to learn where the orbs go in the cone and you can compensate your aim for it. It's taken me a long time with the new Lasher but I'm starting to get pretty good with it. If you're further away from an enemy than the distance between the two doors on a tower, never aim straight at him. You'll have to move the crosshair slightly to the left or to the right. If your first shot goes left, the next is going to go right. Etc.

Ah i see, thank you for clarifying.

[SKYeXile]

I posted a HA balance thread that like everybody agrreed with...SOE then instead of only simply increasing the clip size to 40 and adding AP giving it a base single target damage of 1040 which is made up by the lash effect. made it equal with the other HA's, but instead they increase the orb speed, buff the clip and add AP and made it fucking OP, they then nerfed the lash, nerfed the clip and we;re left with the POS we have today.

hopefully with PS2 there will be several HA's so we might not get totally fucked this time.

The main issue with the lasher was always that you kill 2-3 people then you gotta reload, the MCG or JH you just hero mow cunts.

[Neurotoxin]

Damage isn't the issue with the lasher, it's time-to-kill, part of that is accuracy and part of it is the time it takes between firing and making contact.

Old Lasher issues: Slow travel speed, not effective against AV, can hardly hit moving vehicles except at point blank.

New Lasher issues: Lash effect is near-useless, lower 1v1 or group fight TTK vs moving targets than other HA, can only reliably hit moving vehicles about 50m away, still can't effectively take non-AI MAX 1v1 with AV rounds.

Just give us the original lasher back but make the orbs travel faster. Maybe make us use a different ammo type for the AV rounds (even though that is very non-VS).

[Wahooo]

Damage isn't the issue with the lasher, it's time-to-kill, part of that is accuracy and part of it is the time it takes between firing and making contact.

Old Lasher issues: Slow travel speed, not effective against AV, can hardly hit moving vehicles except at point blank.

New Lasher issues: Lash effect is near-useless, lower 1v1 or group fight TTK vs moving targets than other HA, can only reliably hit moving vehicles about 50m away, still can't effectively take non-AI MAX 1v1 with AV rounds.

Just give us the original lasher back but make the orbs travel faster. Maybe make us use a different ammo type for the AV rounds (even though that is very non-VS).

But the faster orbs with the lash was what made the uber-lasher so uber.

As was said earlier in this thread the original idea of a "lasher" and to balance the slow inaccurate orbs by adding the lash was just a bad idea. There was some discussion on the PS forums back during the OP lasher days that whatever they did seemed to increase hit detection of the lash possibly?
Anyway the Lasher now could use very slight tweaks. Basically shrink slightly the starting COF and give it one more shot before it blooms.

[Captain1nsaneo]

Lashers:
v1.0: Crap (low damage, low rate of fire, slow moving orbs)
v2.0: OP (higher rate of fire, no damage degradation)
v3.0: Mediocre (decent CoF, low TTK, less ammo than other HA)
v4.0: Op (orb speed increase, lash does a crap ton of damage)
v5.0: Today (AP Mode, no lash damage)

Obviously these are just the big changes and it should be noted that around v3.0 and before the lasher did decent damage against armor and infantry. You could hold back doors with just a horde of lasher users and not worry about MAX crashes. After its AV nerf a suppressor with AV ammo had a faster TTK on MAXs and that was including the switch time.

The lasher does have 1 consistent good point. The lash can be used to light up cloakers. Substitutes for plasma.

[SKYeXile]

Damage isn't the issue with the lasher, it's time-to-kill, part of that is accuracy and part of it is the time it takes between firing and making contact.

Old Lasher issues: Slow travel speed, not effective against AV, can hardly hit moving vehicles except at point blank.

New Lasher issues: Lash effect is near-useless, lower 1v1 or group fight TTK vs moving targets than other HA, can only reliably hit moving vehicles about 50m away, still can't effectively take non-AI MAX 1v1 with AV rounds.

Just give us the original lasher back but make the orbs travel faster. Maybe make us use a different ammo type for the AV rounds (even though that is very non-VS).

If they give the old lasher back it would be best to no increase the travel time but leave it slow and upp the damage slightly(not the lash though) so while its hard to aim, you would be rewarded with a good TTK if you do aim well.

its stupid the the gun thats hardest to aim has the same TTK as the other guns.

[SKYeXile]

Oh fuck no. I just want a totally new PS2 redesign, and all will be forgiven.

well yea, but this is PS1 discussion.

for PS2? Vortex whip or bust.

[Leet]

Weapons in ps doesn't really matter, it's all bout your aim. Sometimes i can kill people with the lasher way faster than the mcg/jh, clientside oi?


check out some of my vids :


Inf3rNaL #1 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQNWQR8R4Q4)

Thanks, this helped me a lot.

What's the first dub song btw?

[infy]

Thanks, this helped me a lot.

What's the first dub song btw?

Camo & Krooked - All Fall Down

[Effective]

This is the first time i've played PS1 in a while. I've seen the Lasher go through many changes, but currently i've come to the opinion that..

Its fucking awful.

You see TR running around with stolen JHs, and NC with MCGs.. and you see the VS with either... but i can't remember the last time i saw either the TR or NC with a Lasher.

I'd rather use the sweeper, and i do. The range is very short, yeah - but its TTK is actually good and it kills people? I do FAR better wth the sweeper than with the Lasher. Every time i come up against a JH or a MCG with a Lasher i get destroyed.

Am i just a baddie, or what?

I don't have many issues with the lasher personally, at most, I might miss 1 or 2 orbs, but I usually hit everything. Unless someone gets the jump on me and I'm not really paying attention.

The major reason you don't see alot of TR/NC running around with Lashers is they're a pain in the ass to store. In it's own sweet spot the lasher is better then both. The JH is superior at short range, the mcg is superior at long range.

Are you a baddie? Maybe, but just with a lasher.

The problem with the Lasher is that it is simply a worse MCG.

It has a longer TTK, more recoil, slower rate of fire and you basically cant strafe and shoot the thing unless you're point blank.

The sad part is, its still our best indoor weapon outside of the sweeper(which is just worse than a Jackhammer).

I end up using it because I at least have a chance against other HA's, but it is un-deniably worse.

The Lasher was originally balanced around its "lash". It wouldn't always win 1v1, but its lashing made it very good in large numbers, which is what planetside is all about.

Unfortunately, the lash has been reduced to nothing. It literally does about 5% armor damage, regardless of which firing mode you use. That's right, 5%(maybe less?) of their ARMOR.... meaning you gotta chew through armor before it even matters. Essentially, the lash doesn't exist. Not to mention, the orb has to travel at least 10 feet before the lash effects anything.

I think if the lasher took 1 less hit to kill a rexo it would be balanced right now, but at this point it doesn't matter. They could never figure out how to balance the lash over the main target, and that's why it was always OP or UP.

You're wrong on a couple of points. The lasher's TTK is actually superior to the MCG's in rexo vs. rexo. MCG has a faster agile TTK, but then the sweeper beats both weapons in terms of agile ttk's. And it's very possible to strafe with the weapon, it just requires a funny thing called practice.

Making it require 1 less orb would basically make it a jackhammer with more range. The issue is not the damage, the TTK, the projectile speed or it's lash. The major issue is that the COF simply expands to it's max to quickly, making it a bitch to land that final orb on a target. Such as, simply decreasing the MAX cof slightly would fix this issue OR 1 less shot before the lasher COF begins to bloom.

Given that I've played several FPS games competitively, I seriously doubt my aim is the issue here.

After about 4 shots the orbs start flying everywhere in a 45 degree cone in front of you. You can burst it, but then the TTK gets even worse.

The Jackhammer actually has a semi decent range for a shotgun. You can't kill the NC before he can run at you with the JH and destroy you.

The MCG has better range, less recoil and even at point blank the TTK seems pretty similar.

But yeah, PS2 soon I guess. Just you'd think in 9 years they would have managed to balance it.

Planetside is not most other FPS's, and I despise it when people try to compare it to other FPS games. Most FPS's weapons do not have travel time for their bullets, the only weapons in PS that lack travel time are shotguns, so every other weapon in the game requires a set amount of time for the projectile to reach the target. This obviously affects the lasher the most. So rather then straight Aiming being the issue, the ability to lead the target is what most players who complain about the lasher suffer from.

I usually land all but 1 or 2 of my orbs, and those are the last ones where the COF begins to expand.

You should never lose to a JH if he requires more then 4 shots to kill you.
You should never lost to an MCG at > 10 meters.


Not only is it inaccurate, but the rounds are slow as dirt. Anyone even remotely in the way of a round from 50 feet out can dodge it.

Meanwhilst, I repeatedly got sniped by mcgs from 100 yards out.

Stop using the lasher in situations it's not meant to be in. Think of it like a shotgun in terms of range. Try using a pulsar.

My major gripe is it's innacuracy and hit recognition.


Everyone suffers from hit recon issues. It's only happened one time with my new comp/internet, but it did take 50 mcg rounds to kill a rexo chinese player. It's not really the lasher, but an overall CSHD issue.


------------

For the posts regarding warping. The MCG suffers just as badly as the lasher against warpers, and you're fooling yourselves if you think it doesn't, the JH is fine with people who the simple method of waiting for the enemy to get into the crosshairs before firing.

-------

Regarding Lasher vs. MAX, every AP HA except AP JH is meh against max units.

--------

Regarding the old lasher's lash, this was retarded OP in several ways. 2 VS could hold the back door of a base without having to do anything but reload and get ammo, the lash completely prevent pushes down corridors unless you had an assload of max units. Then on top of that, it made it so hard to sneak into bases as a cloaker where passing lasher fire proceeded to melt your face.

In short, mixing HA ttk's with Special assault attributes is dumb.

[Kalbuth]

For the posts regarding warping. The MCG suffers just as badly as the lasher against warpers, and you're fooling yourselves if you think it doesn't, the JH is fine with people who the simple method of waiting for the enemy to get into the crosshairs before firing.


As I'm probably the only one having mentioned warping, really guys, relax. It's like I insulted you. Not my intention.
1) I never ever mentioned lasher suffering more from warping
2) I'm not even complaining about it. Just mentionning facts.

[UnknownDT]

I don't have many issues with the lasher personally, at most, I might miss 1 or 2 orbs, but I usually hit everything.

Not versus me lol.. but that's cause I'm so amazing and my strafe is untouchable.


and also.... WHY in the HELL are you guys even arguining over this retarded subject. This game is dead and has been for years and will be even more in a month. Silly kids..

[Canaris]

Not versus me lol.. but that's cause I'm so amazing and my strafe is untouchable.


and also.... WHY in the HELL are you guys even arguining over this retarded subject. This game is dead and has been for years and will be even more in a month. Silly kids..

I think this thread started in the PS2 section on how the OP hates/dislikes the lasher and doesn't want to see it return to the sequel in it's current form and the whole mess got bumped down here by some pious mod ;)

[Effective]

As I'm probably the only one having mentioned warping, really guys, relax. It's like I insulted you. Not my intention.
1) I never ever mentioned lasher suffering more from warping
2) I'm not even complaining about it. Just mentionning facts.


Actually I wasn't referring to you at all, there are at least 2 people who directly complain about the lasher versus warpers. Had you been the only person to mention it, I would have quoted you directly.

You barely mentioned warping at all in your posts. Shouldn't you not be so overly defensive?

[Espion]

The problem with the Lasher is that it is simply a worse MCG.

It has a longer TTK, more recoil, slower rate of fire and you basically cant strafe and shoot the thing unless you're point blank.

This isn't true for rexos, only agiles. Against agile I can't remember the exact numbers but MCG should have a slightly lower TTK if it's not near identical (7mcg shots vs 4 lasher shots iirc). And against rexo the TTK for lasher is 1.0s, and for MCG 1.33s.

The lasher has just always had problems with hit detection since the changes, and with all the lag that has continuously build up or been added by SOE via server moves and loggin, it just kept getting worse to the point where it feels like the MCG has a shorter TTK because it's less impacted by the lag (even though it still normally takes 2-3x as much shots as it should to kill someone with it now)

[Metalsheep]

I'd rather use the sweeper, and i do

The Sweeper is the best CQB gun in the game, imo. it has the range and TTK to go up against the MCG, it out ranges the Jackhammer, and can also beat the Lasher. I love that there is a MA weapon that can let people go toe to toe with the HA guns.

[jakaul]

Let's be real here, this is mostly about skill and less about weapons. This is about one empire that tends to bring more skilled players to its side to make up for the shitty weapon that we're given. I will give you a breakdown of the average player for each empire - and this is scientific fact based off of empire-ical evidence (lol, witty). I will utilize my vast knowledge of movie characters to illustrate as I question how well read most TR and NC soldiers are.

TR - You look cool with your goggles and daunting (that means scary for you NC folks) red and black colors. The MCG shoots a lot of bullets in a short amount of time, so you guys apparently think you're Jesse Ventura from Predator. You ain't got time to bleed, huh? A sexual Tyrannosaurus? You obviously ain't got time to realize distance is your friend when it comes to doing battle. While you're running forward singing tyrannical anthems blasting lead, you come into the killing zone of both other empires' HA weapons. Brawn but no brains. Wah, my TTK is so much longer than everyone else's - take it from me, who is used to being so much longer than everyone else - your TTK is only longer if you both don't miss, which means you need to play to your strengths (hint, it's the same thing that really hot chick does to you - keeps her distance). No, not having time to bleed isn't a strength. Nor are goggles. You look stupid. Two out of three empires agree.

NC - Hoooly crap. You're "rebels" with big guns and horrible aim. Fight the power, fight the tech nerds. Reminds me of Arnold Schwarzenegger as the Terminator with your big ass shotgun, sunglasses and grim expression. Boom, click, boom, click, boom, click, boo...oh hell, I died. Hey, I have an idea, why not jump in a huge suit with an even BETTER Boom Clicker and shields to make up for my horrible aim? My bullets SPREAD so there's more chance that one of the tiny bastards will hit something other than a wall! I digress since the Scat is a whole different level of stupid that belongs in a different game like Blacklight Retribution. But anyway, it's fitting that your tag line is "I'll be back" because you try to engage the other empires from 50m with your 10m ownage gun and then you scamper off to get your silly fat MAX suit. I mean, why wouldn't you need 600 armor and shields against that agile? Breaking news - the Terminator still dies. Even after he gets a Falcon because his Scat is on a timer.

VS - Here's the time I get real on this thread. The VS brings the most skilled players due to the nature of their Heavy Assault weapon. You don't really know where the orbs are going. You don't really know if they're going to register when they hit. But, you damn well know it's going to be a bad ass light show for the whole ride. People accuse us of doing the ADAD strafe while shooting pretty orbs of some crazy shit all over the immediate area. We're straight John Travolta - from our Staying Alive inspired warp, to our technological might like Battlefield Earth, all the way down to your questioning of our sexuality. You know what, we even toss in some Phenomenon with our knowledge that we're probably going to die in the very near future, but only after we Change The World (if you get that reference, bonus points). It takes skill to kill people with a weapon that's so unreliable. Especially in purple. Pew pew bitches.

In summary, the evidence above has clearly shown a distinct lack of skill on the part of TR and NC players when it comes to heavy assault weaponry. Well, NC lack of skill is kind of all around to the point you're not entirely sure why they're still performing basic human functions, but that's just getting personal.

[Wahooo]

/thread

[legendary]

Let's be real here, this is mostly about skill and less about weapons. This is about one empire that tends to bring more skilled players to its side to make up for the shitty weapon that we're given. I will give you a breakdown of the average player for each empire - and this is scientific fact based off of empire-ical evidence (lol, witty). I will utilize my vast knowledge of movie characters to illustrate as I question how well read most TR and NC soldiers are.

TR - You look cool with your goggles and daunting (that means scary for you NC folks) red and black colors. The MCG shoots a lot of bullets in a short amount of time, so you guys apparently think you're Jesse Ventura from Predator. You ain't got time to bleed, huh? A sexual Tyrannosaurus? You obviously ain't got time to realize distance is your friend when it comes to doing battle. While you're running forward singing tyrannical anthems blasting lead, you come into the killing zone of both other empires' HA weapons. Brawn but no brains. Wah, my TTK is so much longer than everyone else's - take it from me, who is used to being so much longer than everyone else - your TTK is only longer if you both don't miss, which means you need to play to your strengths (hint, it's the same thing that really hot chick does to you - keeps her distance). No, not having time to bleed isn't a strength. Nor are goggles. You look stupid. Two out of three empires agree.

NC - Hoooly crap. You're "rebels" with big guns and horrible aim. Fight the power, fight the tech nerds. Reminds me of Arnold Schwarzenegger as the Terminator with your big ass shotgun, sunglasses and grim expression. Boom, click, boom, click, boom, click, boo...oh hell, I died. Hey, I have an idea, why not jump in a huge suit with an even BETTER Boom Clicker and shields to make up for my horrible aim? My bullets SPREAD so there's more chance that one of the tiny bastards will hit something other than a wall! I digress since the Scat is a whole different level of stupid that belongs in a different game like Blacklight Retribution. But anyway, it's fitting that your tag line is "I'll be back" because you try to engage the other empires from 50m with your 10m ownage gun and then you scamper off to get your silly fat MAX suit. I mean, why wouldn't you need 600 armor and shields against that agile? Breaking news - the Terminator still dies. Even after he gets a Falcon because his Scat is on a timer.

VS - Here's the time I get real on this thread. The VS brings the most skilled players due to the nature of their Heavy Assault weapon. You don't really know where the orbs are going. You don't really know if they're going to register when they hit. But, you damn well know it's going to be a bad ass light show for the whole ride. People accuse us of doing the ADAD strafe while shooting pretty orbs of some crazy shit all over the immediate area. We're straight John Travolta - from our Staying Alive inspired warp, to our technological might like Battlefield Earth, all the way down to your questioning of our sexuality. You know what, we even toss in some Phenomenon with our knowledge that we're probably going to die in the very near future, but only after we Change The World (if you get that reference, bonus points). It takes skill to kill people with a weapon that's so unreliable. Especially in purple. Pew pew bitches.

In summary, the evidence above has clearly shown a distinct lack of skill on the part of TR and NC players when it comes to heavy assault weaponry. Well, NC lack of skill is kind of all around to the point you're not entirely sure why they're still performing basic human functions, but that's just getting personal.


Wall of text critical strike. Could you please articulate your message in the form of a picture please? :groovy:

[jakaul]

Wall of text critical strike. Could you please articulate your message in the form of a picture please? :groovy:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/fallenhaze/morepewpewles.jpg

[JayX]

The VS brings the most skilled players due to the nature of their Heavy Assault weapon. You don't really know where the orbs are going. You don't really know if they're going to register when they hit. But, you damn well know it's going to be a bad ass light show for the whole ride.

Lmfao..

[ringring]

Best thread ever and the longest lived.

It's antecedants began on forumcide but refused tho die and migrated here. I bet this thread is already making plans, we will see it in PS2 Beta forums and then in the live forums too.

Mark my words!

[Baneblade]

Bro, you better come at me or die tryin' Show respect to the best player or face an early grave.

Best player... never heard of you.

Edit: I suppose I should mention the Lasher is my favorite of the three and the one I do best with overall. I'm rarely use the Jackhammer and the planets usually have to align for me to not embarrass myself with it.

I prefer in this order:

Lasher, Gauss, Pulsar, MCG, Punisher, Sweeper, Cycler, then Jackhammer.

[neonlazer]

I dont use the lasher because you have seperate ammo..gauss and MCG use the same ammo so easy to pick up MCG and go shoot..lasher..not so much..

[infy]

best player... Never heard of you.

Edit: I suppose i should mention the lasher is my favorite of the three and the one i do best with overall. I'm rarely use the jackhammer and the planets usually have to align for me to not embarrass myself with it.

I prefer in this order:

Lasher, gauss, pulsar, mcg, punisher, sweeper, cycler, then jackhammer.

wow, you're the sickest troll ive seen broseph

First time ive heard someone saying they don't know the King.

I don't wan't to play in Auraxis anymore

[Baneblade]

wow, you're the sickest troll ive seen broseph

First time ive heard someone saying they don't know the King.

I don't wan't to play in Auraxis anymore

Aww don't get butthurt over it.

[infy]

Aww don't get butthurt over it.

:@@@@@@@@@@

[Tzeench]

Best thread ever and the longest lived.

It's antecedants began on forumcide but refused tho die and migrated here. I bet this thread is already making plans, we will see it in PS2 Beta forums and then in the live forums too.

Mark my words!

This thread has been running on multiple forums since 2003, and to the best of my knowledge nobody in any of the threads has ever come to a concensus agreement. Shoot the OP I reckon, just don't try doing so with the Lasher/MCG/Gauss (delete as applicable) because they are shit/OP (and again).

:groovy:

[jakaul]

I don't feel you guys are taking this discussion seriously enough.

[Quard]

Due to extensive research done by the University of Leza, Lasher has been confirmed as the best weapon known to man. The research is as follows. Pocket-protected scientists built a wall of Scatmaxes and crashed a Lasher car into it at 400 kilometers per hour, and the car was unharmed. They then built a wall out of Lasher and crashed a car made of Scatmaxes moving at 400 kilometers an hour into the wall, and the wall came out fine. They then crashed a Lasher car made of 400 kilometers per hour into a Generator, and there were no survivors. They crashed 400 kilometers per hour into a Generator travelling at Lasher. Western Cyssor was powerless for hours. They rammed a wall of Scatmaxes into a 400 kilometer per hour made of Lasher, and the resulting explosion shifted the Auraxis's orbit 400 million kilometers away from the sun, saving Auraxis from an Azure Twilight Max Crash the size of a small meteor that was hurtling towards mid-western Forseral at 400 billion kilometers per hour. They shot a Scatmax made of Lashers at a car moving at 400 Generators per hour, and as a result caused two wayward Galaxies to lose track of their bearings, and make a fatal crash with two bases in downtown Cyssor. They spun 400 kilometers at Lasher into MCG per Scatmax. The results were inconclusive. Finally, they placed 400 Dragonforce albums per hour in front of a Generator made of Scatmaxes travelling at kilometers per Lasher, and the result proved without a doubt that Lashers were the best weapon of all time, if not just the best weapon known to man.