Say No to quick scoping.

[TheDAWinz]

Recently i was looking at a thread in which this guy was complaining about the scopes, then he points out two vids which are related to quickscoping. I qucikly facepalmed. I hate quickscoping/quickscopers and how aim assist help created this problem., they ruin the immersion and fun for many and i rather like my immersion to a empire wide battle. Last thing i want to see is quickscopeside 2. Any one else share this concern?

[Sephirex]

There will be no quick-scoping. Don't stress it.

[TheDAWinz]

There will be no quick-scoping. Don't stress it.

i hope to God not.

[SKYeXile]

Im sure with stealth they'll be overpowered enough...wont even need to quickscope!

[TheDAWinz]

Im sure with stealth they'll be overpowered enough...wont even need to quickscope!

Not unless they don't know how to tell the tell tale sign of a shimmer. Easy to spot at close ranges, not so much at long unless you have a eye for it.

[IgloGlass]

To me sniping is only entertaining when it's sniping, i.e mid-long range shooting people accurately in the head. Not pulling up your rifle from 10 meters away like a glorified acrobat jumping around and one shotting people as if you were playing a normal infantry class with an really OP gun.

No. Quick-scoping ruins games.

[TheDAWinz]

To me sniping is only entertaining when it's sniping, i.e mid-long range shooting people accurately in the head. Not pulling up your rifle from 10 meters away like a glorified acrobat jumping around and one shotting people as if you were playing a normal infantry class with an really OP gun.

No. Quick-scoping ruins games.

Yes, very sensible post! I agree 100%

[Astrok]

I would say no to quick pooping..

its kinda lame.

[TheDAWinz]

I would say no to quick pooping..

its kinda lame.

What?

[Sephirex]

I would say no to quick pooping..

its kinda lame.

Bullshit, nothing's worse when you're prairie-dogging in the middle of an important fight. I'd like to be in and out of the bathroom if possible.

[Hmr85]

I have to agree, NO to quick scoping.

[Kran De Loy]

Define quick scoping and set up a less biased poll. Shit.

As far as I know quickscoping is the act of bringing up the scope to get a sure pin point accurate shot at short and medium ranges. Quick-scoping by itself is not the problem, that's just some people's mode of operation and in the videos I've seen so far of PS2 it is not necessary for short ranges and not needed for most cases at medium range either. The time it takes to bring up a scope or iron sight is minimal at best and the accuracy does increase with the lowered movement speed.

The problem of quick scoping that most people hate is quickscoping + excessively fast TTK weapons. That is what needs to be avoided. If at all possible the quickscoping on sniper rifles could be avoided by I dunno, limiting them to the class that has the least armor, or forcing real sniper scopes on sniper rifles, minimum of x6 zoom? Just to throw some ideas out.

Please next time try to be as defined as you can about what problems you believe are possible, also please try to include solutions for the problem instead of just saying. "No. (http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m69u4xo6jr1ro2hpp.jpg)"

[OutlawDr]

I say no, but for game play reasons... not necessarily for immersion.

[Xaine]

God no.

[TheDAWinz]

Define quick scoping and set up a less biased poll. Shit.

As far as I know quickscoping is the act of bringing up the scope to get a sure pin point accurate shot at short and medium ranges. Quick-scoping by itself is not the problem, that's just some people's mode of operation and in the videos I've seen so far of PS2 it is not necessary for short ranges and not needed for most cases at medium range either. The time it takes to bring up a scope or iron sight is minimal at best and the accuracy does increase with the lowered movement speed.

The problem of quick scoping that most people hate is quickscoping + excessively fast TTK weapons. That is what needs to be avoided.

Please next time try to be as defined as you can about what problems you believe are possible, also please try to include solutions for the problem instead of just saying. "No. (http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m69u4xo6jr1ro2hpp.jpg)"

No. In all of the sense of the word, no one likes it. I don't care which shape or form its in, i hate it.

[Sephirex]

As far as I know quickscoping is the act of bringing up the scope to get a sure pin point accurate shot at short and medium ranges.

Not quite. CoD has a targeting assist that locks the scope onto the enemy for a brief second as you pull the scope up, before it enters free aim mode. People exploited this and it became a sport known as quick-scoping. You're describing just using the scope at close range.

[Gonefshn]

Planetside had the best scoping solution.

It took a moment for the shot to line up and become pinpoint. You had to actually steady the rifle to be succesful. They should do a modern twist on that system

[Dreamcast]

First of all lets be honest....You hate quick Scoping because you can't do it and other more skillful persons can:D




I do Agree that quickscoping shouldn't be possible in Planetside 2 or really difficult.


The way they can do this is by moving screws up your aiming...and by using the Planetside 1 scoping where you have to let the reticule get smaller.


That will fix quick scoping...If somebody can pull it off even with that much difficultly then he is a badass and deserves those kills.

[proxy]

As a recon I agree. Run and gun snipers are no fun. I've done it, not on purpose, but you know, you turn around and there is someone coming to I knife ya...

However, I enjoy quick pooping. Fiber is good.

[TheDAWinz]

First of all lets be honest....You hate quick Scoping because you can't do it and other more skillful persons can:D




I do Agree that quickscoping shouldn't be possible in Planetside 2 or really difficult.


The way they can do this is by moving screws up your aiming...and by using the Planetside 1 scoping where you have to let the reticule get smaller.


That will fix quick scoping...If somebody can pull it off even with that much difficultly then he is a badass and deserves those kills.

First of all lets be honest, i'm amazing at it. its stupid though, so i stopped because it ruined the gameplay for me. Please, stop making baseless assumptions before i kill someone.

[Kran De Loy]

Not quite. CoD has a targeting assist that locks the scope onto the enemy for a brief second as you pull the scope up, before it enters free aim mode. People exploited this and it became a sport known as quick-scoping. You're describing just using the scope at close range.

Wait, so the problem isn't people using the scope at short or medium ranges but rather it's a nickname for an arbitrary game mechanic from another game that was broken.

Great. Easy fix for that, No Quickscoping Autoaim! Done.

First of all lets be honest....You hate quick Scoping because you can't do it and other more skillful persons can:D




I do Agree that quickscoping shouldn't be possible in Planetside 2 or really difficult.


The way they can do this is by moving screws up your aiming...and by using the Planetside 1 scoping where you have to let the reticule get smaller.


That will fix quick scoping...If somebody can pull it off even with that much difficultly then he is a badass and deserves those kills.God I hated that. iirc I do not have the steadiest of hands so having to move the mouse to adjust my aim and seeing the reticule widen each time I did basically made it so I couldn't snipe worth a damn. I would really rather not have to deal with again. Wide cone of fire when the scope is first brought up: Okay. Wide cone of fire when the player moves: Okay. Widening cone for adjusting aim: Not so okay, I guess it would depend on how much the cone widens for fast tiny adjustments.

[Block]

Better players will always "ruin the immersion" for you. I see a lot of no to this...no to that rubbish on here these days. You cannot limit skill whatever you do...better players are better players. Quick scoping is nothing less than a very quick, skilled player with superior hand to eye coordination...those player will always find a way. If you try to artificially limit all these things we will end up with very bland gameplay/gunplay, nothing to master, everyone can obtain the same restricted (artificial) max skill level...at best....might aswell have autoaim then everyone is the same...yawn. However as I said those players will find a way regardless.

[Neksar]

What was the point of this thread again? You knew the answer before you even posted it. What else would you expect from a message board populated almost exclusively by veterans of a classic cone-of-fire-based shooter? Hell, there's probably a fair bit of people here against having aim-down-sight at all.

That said, quick scoping is stupid, but it can't exist as it does in CoD without some sort of aim assist. Unless you mean being able to pull up a scope quickly and fire, which, if it's a problem, can be remedied by implementing a delay before a scoped weapon can be fired after pulling up the sights.

[TheDAWinz]

Better players will always "ruin the immersion" for you. I see a lot of no to this...no to that rubbish on here these days. You cannot limit skill whatever you do...better players are better players. Quick scoping is nothing less than a very quick, skilled player with superior hand to eye coordination...those player will always find a way. If you try to artificially limit all these things we will end up with very bland gameplay/gunplay, nothing to master, everyone can obtain the same restricted (artificial) max skill level...at best....might aswell have autoaim then everyone is the same...yawn. However as I said those players will find a way regardless.

You should be shot. I am one of the best players of any game i know, and i hate quick scoping. Pray we never meet.

[gufftroad]

for the love of the giant space butterfly no quick scoping it is so damn annoying

[Block]

You should be shot. I am one of the best players of any game i know, and i hate quick scoping. Pray we never meet.

Be glad to meet you, I dont hate any tactic within the game rules (not cheating)...If I'm beaten in one way, and I can't compete with my current tactic/loadout/whatever... I will find another way to at least get my own back. To cut back, I'm sure you in your greatness must employ one or two tactics that someone else would "hate". Lets all face it...we only hate when we aren't winning.

[SKYeXile]

for the love of the giant space butterfly no quick scoping it is so damn annoying

Say what?

[TheDAWinz]

Be glad to meet you, I dont hate any tactic within the game rules (not cheating)...If I'm beaten in one way, and I can't compete with my current tactic/loadout/whatever... I will find another way to at least get my own back. To cut back, I'm sure you in your greatness must employ one or two tactics that someone else would "hate". Lets all face it...we only hate when we arn't winning.

I win, and i hate it when my teamates take a vehicle and use it as a transport, or they don't PTFO, or they use unfair glitches against the enemies.

[Kran De Loy]

And thus these last two pages is one of the reasons why something needs to be defined as precisely as possible.

People just go on and on about the op or the first page usually at best. In other words the community just gets a bit mob of undefined hate at some mechanic that they likely do not fully understand (like me up until about 10 minutes ago.)

Please try to edit the OP while you still can to indicate that the problem is the Aim Assist that was built into scoping is what created 'quick scoping'. Edit: Or at least tell them about that part of Quickscoping is the Aim Assist.

Btw: another reason to be as defined as possible is it actually let the Developers know what the problem is rather then just showing them this vague kindergarten drawing of a animal and telling them it's a cat and expecting them to fix it when you're actually trying to complain about is a lioness that's been eating people.

[Block]

You should be shot. I am one of the best players of any game i know, and i hate quick scoping. Pray we never meet.

I win, and i hate it when my teamates take a vehicle and use it as a transport, or they don't PTFO, or they use unfair glitches against the enemies.

See you in the field...

[Envenom]

7 CoD players lol

[TheDAWinz]

Say what?

flying spaghetti monster's cousin

[Policenaut]

I voted yes because I'm a rebel. For quick scoping to be in the game there would have to be some form of aim assist, which is generally only needed for console shooters because aiming with analogue sticks is wonky at best. The mouse/keyboard combo is far more intuitive so aim assist isn't needed. In addition, (and this is from what I've seen in the E3 coverage and demos so it might change) sniper rifles seem to be only capable of 1 shotting other infiltrators, possibly a few medium classes with headshots, and that was with the NC sniper rifle which was single shot. I don't think quick scoping will be an issue.

It's such a non-factor that I don't even know why I bothered writing that out.

[QuantumMechanic]

The OP fails to describe what quick scoping is. Not very helpful when making a poll.

Forgive my ignorance, but after reading all posts I'm still not sure what it is. Is quick scoping the CoD auto-aim feature?

Or is it simply the ability to put a short or mid range scope on a sniper rifle? (BF3 lets you do this). How is that different than putting a short or mid range scope on an assault rifle? You still have to deal with single shot, long reload etc.

[Kran De Loy]

flying spaghetti monster's cousin

I figured it was a reference to his signature.

Which by the way while unrelated to the topic at hand and while supremely cool and awesome, it's a bit too vibrant.

[Policenaut]

The OP fails to describe what quick scoping is. Not very helpful when making a poll.

Forgive my ignorance, but after reading all posts I'm still not sure what it is. Is quick scoping the CoD auto-aim feature?

Or is it simply the ability to put a short or mid range scope on a sniper rifle? (BF3 lets you do this). How is that different than putting a short or mid range scope on an assault rifle? You still have to deal with single shot, long reload etc.

It's best just to provide a video of what it is. Lord, please forgive me.

MW3 Quick Scope Montage - YouTube

[Seagoon]

Quickscoping is bad, but what really takes the biscuit is that evil HardScoping nonsense, gog damn skill-less newbs.

[Kran De Loy]

Wait, what is Hard Scoping? Is that when you're trying to get a scope out and no matter how much muscle you put into it all you get are little shavings because digging into that bucket of icecream is like trying to chip away at a block of concrete?

[Sephirex]

Wait, what is Hard Scoping? Is that when you're trying to get a scope out and no matter how much muscle you put into it all you get are little shavings because digging into that bucket of icecream is like trying to chip away at a block of concrete?

Hard-scoping is looking down your scope and aiming your shots like a regular person.

[Gonefshn]

There is also a huge difference in a hitscan game vs bullet drop with quick scope.

Harder to pull of with travel time etc.

[Seagoon]

Wait, what is Hard Scoping? Is that when you're trying to get a scope out and no matter how much muscle you put into it all you get are little shavings because digging into that bucket of icecream is like trying to chip away at a block of concrete?

What Sephirex said, its just using a scope properly.

When I was looking up what the hell quick scoping was the first time I came across the term I also found much hate for 'Hardscoping' which was the most retarded shit I had ever heard, I could not figure out how the hell 'Hardscoping' even was a thing.

EDIT:

Anyway, to add some proper input to this thread...

My issue with 'quickscoping' is the fact that it only works because for some reason as soon as the scope in animation finishes your rifle becomes perfectly accurate. Its basically taking advantage of a broken mechanic to make use of a weapon in a situation where it is rather over powered and not supposed to be used.

So i doubt PS2 will have quickscoping be a thing, since im sure the devs would have to try hard to make somthing so broken. Its ok to have sniper rifles work at close range, just as long as they are the worst option you have, maybe even worse than using a pistol.

[Baneblade]

Define quick scoping and set up a less biased poll. Shit.

You just defined it for him.

[Sephirex]

I voted yes because I know it will make me more unpopular.

That explains a lot of your posts.

[super pretendo]

Just make it similar to Arma II and you solve the problem. Making things similar to Arma II solves just about every problem. Except for optimization, of course

[TheDAWinz]

Just make it similar to Arma II and you solve the problem. Making things similar to Arma II solves just about every problem. Except for optimization, of course

Yes! Also optimization is a word for people to throw around who can't run arma 2. there are options there for a reason.

[super pretendo]

Yes! Also optimization is a word for people to throw around who can't run arma 2. there are options there for a reason.

uh, nope. If you put Arma 2 next to any other game looking at similar-looking settings, Arma 2 will be considerably harder to run.

[Wahooo]

Projectile vs. Hitscan, bullet physics and hit boxes will take care of a lot of this. However as a run and gun method quick scoping in all its various forms is a bit sucky.

The issue is not so much skilled people winning as it is skilled people doing things the game designers didn't expect. Sniper rifle's power is supposed to be balanced by their slow setup and re-fire.

[super pretendo]

Yeah, there's a reason people don't run around quick scoping in the armed forces: sniper rifles are heavy and and require setup and positioning

[TheDAWinz]

uh, nope. If you put Arma 2 next to any other game looking at similar-looking settings, Arma 2 will be considerably harder to run.

i run arma 2 max settings, view distance 10000 and have over 2000 ai battles with 45-60 fps.

[Tigersmith]

No quick scoping please.. this will really make me depressed.

[QuantumMechanic]

Thanks for the video explanation Policenaut.

Quickscoping isn't possible in PS1. When you go into scoped view you have to wait a moment for the reticle to "align", otherwise you risk your shot being horribly inaccurate.

I seriously doubt the devs would make a huge regression error by leaving something like that out. And if that was the case, be sure it'll get fixed in beta.

[Sephirex]

I hate quick scoping more than I would hate to be anally raped.

That gave me an idea for another Poll.

[Kran De Loy]

You just defined it for him.

... also please try to include solutions for the problem...

I don't do things by halves. (Usually. {Sometimes. [Okay not very often, really.]})

Projectile vs. Hitscan, bullet physics and hit boxes will take care of a lot of this. However as a run and gun method quick scoping in all its various forms is a bit sucky.

The issue is not so much skilled people winning as it is skilled people doing things the game designers didn't expect. Sniper rifle's power is supposed to be balanced by their slow setup and re-fire.
That would be fine for long ranges over 150-200m where bullet drop and travel time are more than marginal. Shorter ranges still wouldn't be fixed.

That gave me an idea for another Poll.

Or do you mean Pole?

[Sirisian]

We had a 31 page thread (http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=43238) on aim down sights that covered this. Basically asking for delays and the inability to shoot while transitioning to keep firing from the hip distinct from scoped firing.

[HeatLegend]

i hope to God not.

AAaaand Gooood SAID, LET There be No Quick Scoping. And on the eighth day he madeth No Quick Scoping.

[Baneblade]

I voted yes because I know it will make me more unpopular.

Okay Obama.

[super pretendo]

i run arma 2 max settings, view distance 10000 and have over 2000 ai battles with 45-60 fps.

You just have a really good computer then... that doesn't mean it's optimized well

[Sirisian]

I hope we get some of these videos:
MW3 xXLeGiTqUiCkSCOPEzzXx [[MLG]] ~360 NOSCOPEZZ~ .:1337:. - YouTube

[Flaropri]

Great. Easy fix for that, No Quickscoping Autoaim! Done.

Pretty sure this one nailed it out the park.

[super pretendo]

We'll only get autoaim if they need to make this game accessible to the console kiddies.

and I laughed so hard at that video, especially the power rangers and mountain dew

[vVRedOctoberVv]

Voted yes to quick-scoping, because this poll is retarded.

Artificial delays/inability to fire at any time is kind of stupid. You should be able to pull the trigger in mid animation if you want to, though your odds of hitting anything further than ten feet away are non-existent, much as in real-life.

I agree with those earlier who suggested a "No auto-aiming" thread would've at least been more useful (although still unnecessary).

Any kind of goofy shifting reticle while aiming with sights or a scope is pretty stupid, and doesn't even make sense. Again, just no automatic "aim adjustment" is sufficient. If I put my sights on your head (compensating for drop), the bullet had damn well better hit you in the head.

@the Arma 2 side topic

I play Arma 2 on my laptop. 2.3ghz dual core, ATI 5470. With graphic settings turned down, I can play more or less normally. View range out to 3 or 4 clicks. With minimal activity in the game, such as testing vehicles in the editor, I can play with graphic settings maxed.

Regarding "optimising" the game. I cannot speak to the skillfulness of their code, having not looked at it, however games of a such a large scale are difficult/impossible (to an extent) to "optimise" as you put it.

Arma 2 involves IMMENSE landscapes, and even at relatively short ranges (3k or less) you can have potentially thousands of trees/bushes/shrubs/buildings/vehicles to track. That's a lot. I don't care how you optimise it. Add in AI units, and the amount of data processed increases exponentially. Pre-progamming the AI with certain behavior is impossible on such a large scale (see previous comment on trees, etc) so it has to do an unusually large amount of "thinking" compared to most shooters. Add in MANY units, and the problem increases even further.

Same problem with Arma 2 is the same problem with the X series of games... The scale and very nature of the game is WHAT causes the "problem". Want to optimise it? Reduce it to about 1/5th it's current scope and you'll notice 90% of these problems disappear. Don't wanna do that? Then adjust your settings.

[Stew]

My New Rapid Fire and Quick Scope Modded Controller - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMM1FCacKAk&feature=related)

Yo whatsup guys! ^The voice of quick scope.

QUICK SCOPING On consoles and quick scoping on PC are 2 different thing , the quick scope COD thing is beast in COD consoles all because of the strong (( aim assist or autoaming )) in cod quick scoping on PC with no auto aim is a different thing

And i never had any issue about quick scope or crap like this lol i dont get the point of the OP and its simply stupid

iam quick scoping everytime i hit my rigth mouse and did not hold it for a while whats the point of all this ?

[Dacrim]

There will be no quick-scoping. Don't stress it.

really hope so

[Brusi]

My New Rapid Fire and Quick Scope Modded Controller - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMM1FCacKAk&feature=related)

Yo whatsup guys! ^The voice of quick scope.

The chick in that video sounded shitfaced, slurring her words hard!

TIL: wasted chicks are the voice of quick scope. Makes senses.

[CutterJohn]

I've never seen a game with speed limitations on ADS before... Why would PS1 be first? Its normal behavior.. you see someone running, you snap your gun up with the sights and shoot them.

[Flaropri]

The chick in that video sounded shitfaced, slurring her words hard!

TIL: wasted chicks are the voice of quick scope. Makes senses.

Huh, I figured it was just a young boy, rather than an "Under the Influence" woman.

[Momember]

I would just like to add that other players killing me ruins my immersion
so if you would all kindly die and let the NC take control of your bases we'll all get on just dandy :p

[Mezorin]

Voted yes for the biased poll, even if aim assist COD quick scoping is a damn bad "feature" to have in a game. If a shooter wants to hit close range with any gun using ADS accuracy they should use a reflex or holo sight and have to sacrifice the distance they would have otherwise and the accuracy should not kick in until the sight is fully up on the screen.

What we shouldn't have is "one shot" close range body shot bolt action kills with sniper rifles, and no one shot kills on heavy assaults. Same diff with the semi autos, but it should take more like 3 or 4 clean shots (or 2 to 3 head shots) to get a guy. Otherwise allow similar aiming mechanics as the assault rifles once you ADS with a close distance scope on a battle rifle or sniper rifle. Why punish a guy who uses a rifle for mid ranged or close range shots that would lose in a straight up fight with a gauss/pulsar/cycler of equal skill anymore than he is?

[Kran De Loy]

So yeah to me it seems that this thread has pretty much run it's course now.

Any more information needs to wait until it can talked about on the official beta forums. (meaning by people that have gotten to play the game and get a better feel for it.)

Man is it gonna be hard to not talk about anything in game except on the Official beta forums when PSU is just gonna get flooded with more people that want to theorycraft while all the veterans are under the NDA. :/

[Karrade]

If the rifle did this the shotgun would be pointless. - That is all.

[Mezorin]

If the rifle did this the shotgun would be pointless. - That is all.

Not really, because a shotgun has this huge cone on the screen where the pellets land, a faster rate of fire, and does not require ADS to be good. It is also less effected by accuracy messing up because of being shot at, which will make any bolt action or semi auto go to crap. What people seem to forget is that when you get in close range with a sniper rifle, often you are being shot at and that basically makes your ADS aim go to shit. If you score a hit marker, you will also never get that second hit in time if the guy is shooting you even with a hand gun. This is why even though a sniper rifle head shot might out perform a shotgun for raw burst in Magic DPS Excel Spreadsheet Land, people generally use SMGs or shoties in close quarters even in Battlefield games, unless they are trying to troll a bad team.

[xnorb]

Picking back up the idea of quickscoping (no clue what aim assist is doing
in here, we aren't talking about console games here ...)

The ONLY issue with sniper rifles in games is the quickscoping.
Remove quickscoping and you could even have sniper rifles inflict 10.000 damage
and it wouldn't cause any issues.

It's the combination of precise aiming and fast scoping in that causes problems.
Make scoping in and settling the rifle take a good second and you're set.

[Karrade]

Not really, because a shotgun has this huge cone on the screen where the pellets land, a faster rate of fire, and does not require ADS to be good. It is also less effected by accuracy messing up because of being shot at, which will make any bolt action or semi auto go to crap. What people seem to forget is that when you get in close range with a sniper rifle, often you are being shot at and that basically makes your ADS aim go to shit. If you score a hit marker, you will also never get that second hit in time if the guy is shooting you even with a hand gun. This is why even though a sniper rifle head shot might out perform a shotgun for raw burst in Magic DPS Excel Spreadsheet Land, people generally use SMGs or shoties in close quarters even in Battlefield games, unless they are trying to troll a bad team.

If I could kill people in one shot at close range with any weapon, I wouldn't need a fast rate of fire. My reflexs are pretty good, and I headshot often enough, not as good as when I was a kid, but still fast enough to outdo a shotgun with this kind of setup.

I will rephrase - For me, and those with above average reflexes, the shotgun would be outclassed. You might as well practice and skill up with this. Even being shot at, which I think you are missing the point, in a 1 shot kill system, being fired on doesn't matter as much as they are too dead to fire.

Odds are even if you miss the first somehow at that range, the second is going to finish them off before you die.

[Dairian]

The 25 people that said yes to this post are the ones doing it.

I know quick scoping is not hacking its taking advantage of a bad game mechanic. But in my eyes it right up there.

There will always be people who look for any way possible "Cheat" to win because they just don't have the skill to do it any other way. Hacking=No Skill and they know it. Therefore they hack.

[Nemeses]

Define quick scoping and set up a less biased poll. Shit.

As far as I know quickscoping is the act of bringing up the scope to get a sure pin point accurate shot at short and medium ranges. Quick-scoping by itself is not the problem, that's just some people's mode of operation and in the videos I've seen so far of PS2 it is not necessary for short ranges and not needed for most cases at medium range either. The time it takes to bring up a scope or iron sight is minimal at best and the accuracy does increase with the lowered movement speed.

The problem of quick scoping that most people hate is quickscoping + excessively fast TTK weapons. That is what needs to be avoided. If at all possible the quickscoping on sniper rifles could be avoided by I dunno, limiting them to the class that has the least armor, or forcing real sniper scopes on sniper rifles, minimum of x6 zoom? Just to throw some ideas out.

Please next time try to be as defined as you can about what problems you believe are possible, also please try to include solutions for the problem instead of just saying. "No. (http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m69u4xo6jr1ro2hpp.jpg)"

erm no you just want the poll changed to what you think it should be, don't like the poll don't bloody reply to it, we don't want any form of quick scoping at all.

[Mezorin]

I want you to try an excerise, right now. When you are done reading this sentance, aim your mouse at this smiley :) and click

When you are done reading this sentance, aim at the "Home" button on Planetside universe page. EDIT: lol, page zoomed all the way down. Just pick something else large on the screen and try and go for it.

That there is the rough comparison to getting an iron sight hit at close-ish range with a sniper rifle, and a shotgun. The smiley way longer didn't it?

Now I'll take your word on you being faster than average reflexes and a good shot. But that smiley was a lot harder to mouse over than the "Home" button, wasn't it? I'm not saying that a good bolt action or semi auto guy can't get some great close quarter clinch shots, but in terms of even reflexes and skill, an M16A3 or shotgun user will utterly destroy an M98B user if both see each other at the same time, even with the same scope attachments.

[Karrade]

I want you to try an excerise, right now. When you are done reading this sentance, aim your mouse at this smiley :) and click

When you are done reading this sentance, aim at the "Home" button on Planetside universe page. EDIT: lol, page zoomed all the way down. Just pick something else large on the screen and try and go for it.

That there is the rough comparison to getting an iron sight hit at close-ish range with a sniper rifle, and a shotgun. The smiley way longer didn't it?

Now I'll take your word on you being faster than average reflexes and a good shot. But that smiley was a lot harder to mouse over than the "Home" button, wasn't it? I'm not saying that a good bolt action or semi auto guy can't get some great close quarter clinch shots, but in terms of even reflexes and skill, an M16A3 or shotgun user will utterly destroy an M98B user if both see each other at the same time, even with the same scope attachments.

No it didn't. My speed was exactly the same, moving back and forth between a big and a small target, with a split second slow at the very last second for each. Which I just did several times over to run the test you put up. (Between the white quick reply text icon, and the small smiley) Perhaps my mouse is set up to move faster than yours?

The only issue if you do it repeatedly is the occasional miss, which is where practice comes in. Sure it'll take a higher skill level but if I can 1 shot kill at close range, and then move back to long range, I have a weapon that does it all. Missing at long range is perhaps more common but missing that close, for me, much less likely.

[Rago]

i Say Yes cause i like it.

[Mezorin]

Well, then you got some insanely good reflexes and aim and can nail some very tough shots, bravo. No sarcasm, you'd probably kick a lot of ass as aggressive recon in Battlefield 3. But you missed the smiley a few times didn't you? That slow down time to get the precision is what would have gotten you killed in a close in gun fight. The close quarter clinch sniper shot is a crap shoot at best, especially when you're fighting with a x8 scope against a moving target. I will agree that a shoty is horrid for anything beyond close quarter battle though, but in reality you could apply this to an SMG or an assault rifle (just pretend you can click and drag across your big target to see what I mean) as well as a sniper rifle.

Now I won't question your aim, but there's a reason that high level competitive play in COD, Battlefield 3, CS 1.6, and other FPSes generally use assault rifles for their team, with maybe one good distance sniper. The shots, killing power, and reliability still apply even at the highest levels of human ability start to favor the assault rifles or carbines for any close quarter fighting. So in short, at anything up to about 50 meters (give or take, depending on game), anything you could do with a sniper rifle you could do better with a carbine or assault rifle even with one shot kill mechanics. This, of course assumes that all weapons are balanced against each other for TTK and useage. I won't argue against a 13 shot gauss kill but a one shot bolt driver being unbalanced because it is, but if it was a 3 or 4 shot gauss kill (or 2 shot head) my money would be on the gauss guy.

[Zalmoxis]

Only people who can't QS hate it. I can't QS myself, nor do I have a problem with it.

If people like it and/or find it useful, let them use it. Why would you care if you got killed this way? It's your fault you died, blame yourself.

Plus, I would love seeing noob recons having a go at QS. They would make good points for my kill stat.

[Mezorin]

I can see a legitimate point on being able to fast aim *and* one shot any other infantry unit in the game. I just think that the nerf should come on the damage side, provided that the other weapons in the game have a similar level of firepower. I don't think anyone, even the career shooters want Sniperside anymore than we want Reaverside or BFRside, or any "side" besides "Planetside 2".

I also think everyone here is going off of a different definition of quick scoping than what my self or many other recon players think it is. To me, a "quick scope" is when you just hit both right and left mouse buttons together and get a perfect shot before you have even zoomed in. To many, a legitimate reflex/iron/holo sight quick (by quick, .3 of a second or .5 of a second) sight in followed by tracking, aiming and shooting a target seems to be "quick scoping" but in reality it was a clean and fast "hard scope" kill. The former gives shooters everywhere a bad name, but the later shouldn't be punished anymore than playing skillfully with any other gun. Punishing a guy who can scope in, and get a clean drag shot hit an close range is like punishing a reaver pilot with gimpy flight controls because he might fly a plane too well.

How long it takes to sight in can also depend on your gun, your scope, and your attachments. Make it so that hand guns are the quickest to aim down sight, followed by SMGs, shotties, carbines, assault rifles, battle rifles, LMGs, sniper rifles, and rocket launchers. Hip fire spread should follow a similar pattern, but with hand guns being less accurate. But once you have sighted your scope on a target, your gun should put out the accuracy on target for what that gun can do. If a guy like Karrade can sight in with a holo sight on a sniper rifle or a battle rifle and get a quick clean drag shot, he should get the hit, and the cone of fire should be settled by the time you still and sight in.

And just remember, Higby and company are putting in OCOG low powered scopes and reflex sights into the game for a reason: to give shooters (and everyone else) scopes that can track close range targets and sight in faster than a bulky scope and trick the gun out to have a bit more close range usability than it otherwise would.

[CutterJohn]

Not really, because a shotgun has this huge cone on the screen where the pellets land, a faster rate of fire, and does not require ADS to be good.

You've clearly never shot a shotgun in your life. This is 10 yards with a full choke. (http://www.flickr.com/photos/british_red/5432062916/) Buck shot will have a pattern of 12-24 inches diameter at 25 yards, depending on round and choke. Fin stabilized flechettes would be even better.

They are more forgiving, unless using a slug, but that does not mean aiming is optional. Video games have been getting shotguns completely wrong since doom.

Agree with the rest though. Using a sniper point blank in BFBC2/BF3/etc is a horrible idea, even though its a 1 shot body shot for the bolt actions.

It does not work. You miss, you die. And you miss often. I cannot imagine people purposefully going for a sniper rifle if its a 1 shot headshot.. Perhaps some few extremely confident in their skill.

[LayZ]

The only thing you should ever be able to quick scope are red dot or reflex sights, that's what they're made for. Being able to quick scope a sniper rifle is just cheap.

Planetside had the best scoping solution.

It took a moment for the shot to line up and become pinpoint. You had to actually steady the rifle to be succesful. They should do a modern twist on that system

From what I saw in the E3 vids, you'll have to steady your rifle. Its probably going to take a tad bit more skill than PS1 did.

[JxP]

Another vote against quick scoping. I think it should take a moment to bring the scope up which would eliminate that and also you could consider that the time it takes the sniper to get the weapon in position for that long range shot!

[Stardouser]

No. In all of the sense of the word, no one likes it. I don't care which shape or form its in, i hate it.

Pretty much this, although to put a more objective and avoidable spin on it, what definitely should not be done is what some other games do and give snipers one hit kills to the body that they would not otherwise get just because they do it at less than 10 meters range. Snipers are intended to be stand off weapons, artificially changing them to give extra utility for close range so that snipers have no or less disadvantage at short range is a problem in some games.

[ziegler]

Would just like to say I am against...

exploiting a game mechanic.

It's not badass, it's not skillful. It's pathetic. My kid does it on the 360 sometimes if someone pisses him off or talks smack to him. But he doesnt do it all the time, because it's boring. It's nothing more than a button press timing issue that is easily mastered.

[Exmortius]

this will not be an option, there are no 1 shot kills in this not to mention it's pc based. i wouldn't be surprised if nc snipers do get 1 shot kills on rifles but i don't foresee tr or vs getting that with shields.

[Rago]

this will not be an option, there are no 1 shot kills in this not to mention it's pc based. i wouldn't be surprised if nc snipers do get 1 shot kills on rifles but i don't foresee tr or vs getting that with shields.

This is Based on which Information ? Headshot Option is Avalible.
No offence just my Interest ?

[Sephirex]

this will not be an option, there are no 1 shot kills in this not to mention it's pc based. i wouldn't be surprised if nc snipers do get 1 shot kills on rifles but i don't foresee tr or vs getting that with shields.

There's going to be one shot kills for headshots on light armor types based on an interview between Higby and TotalBiscuit. But yeah, this will make quick scoping difficult if body shots aren't 1 hit kills.

[Exmortius]

1 hit kill will be rare and nc sniper will probably be one of the few to get that. there are headshots but they generally will still not be 1 hit kills because of shields.

[Mezorin]

You've clearly never shot a shotgun in your life. This is 10 yards with a full choke. (http://www.flickr.com/photos/british_red/5432062916/) Buck shot will have a pattern of 12-24 inches diameter at 25 yards, depending on round and choke. Fin stabilized flechettes would be even better.

I have, actually, and its much easier to hit close range skeet with a 12 gauge buck shell than it is to hit with a .308 cartridge. Real life shotguns are always way more accurate than the video game counter part, and its a bit of a trope that buck shot tends to suck beyond 10 meters in most games. Its in the similar vein that a single sniper lung shot doesn't instantly kill you, or that a leg shot doesn't blow your leg off instanty: balance tends to trump realism in most games.

EDIT: think about it, do you really want a New Conglomerate jackhammer (which fires those same shotgun shells) to hit a 1 inch group at 10 meters every shot? I can already imagine the misery we'd get from the VS and TR if that were the case.

[Karrade]

Well, then you got some insanely good reflexes and aim and can nail some very tough shots, bravo. No sarcasm, you'd probably kick a lot of ass as aggressive recon in Battlefield 3. But you missed the smiley a few times didn't you? That slow down time to get the precision is what would have gotten you killed in a close in gun fight. The close quarter clinch sniper shot is a crap shoot at best, especially when you're fighting with a x8 scope against a moving target. I will agree that a shoty is horrid for anything beyond close quarter battle though, but in reality you could apply this to an SMG or an assault rifle (just pretend you can click and drag across your big target to see what I mean) as well as a sniper rifle.

Now I won't question your aim, but there's a reason that high level competitive play in COD, Battlefield 3, CS 1.6, and other FPSes generally use assault rifles for their team, with maybe one good distance sniper. The shots, killing power, and reliability still apply even at the highest levels of human ability start to favor the assault rifles or carbines for any close quarter fighting. So in short, at anything up to about 50 meters (give or take, depending on game), anything you could do with a sniper rifle you could do better with a carbine or assault rifle even with one shot kill mechanics. This, of course assumes that all weapons are balanced against each other for TTK and useage. I won't argue against a 13 shot gauss kill but a one shot bolt driver being unbalanced because it is, but if it was a 3 or 4 shot gauss kill (or 2 shot head) my money would be on the gauss guy.

Well provided AR's or Carbines are not one shot kills but sniper rifles still are: (hopefully nothing, even NC (like the old shotty...) won't be 1SK, even Snipers but I digress)

My reflexes are still good, not as amazing as it was in my 20's :) but good now. Plenty of younger guys coming in will have good reflexes, comparative to what I have still, many will be better ;).

As an honest shooting speed - I moved very fast, I did miss the smiley a couple of times out of many. So please -do- question my aim, it isn't bad by any means, but at this close, again it isn't so much about aim, as reflexes. If I can kill an enemy 1 shot 80-90% of the time I'll take that, especially if I get a second shot most of the time after that.

Its not reflexes + aim, as a usual distance sniper would face, its just reflexes plus a bit of aim. Picture being a game designer looking for balance, I don't understand why you'd put an assault rifle vs a shotgun at close quarters? At medium range Yes!!! We are talking close in though, or alternatively long range. Medium range, heck a sniper rifle or shotgun is probably toast most of the time.

[Mezorin]

Fair enough, shotguns and SMGs should have the advantage at close range when compared with an assault rifle as a matter of good game design, I'll give you that. EDIT: ARs and carbines are good in most games because they cover a large variety of sight lines and situations well, and can make fast kills even out to medium or long range where a shotgun or sniper rifle might struggle. You will see a lot of assault rifles, LMGs and carbines out there in PS2 because (knock on wood) there will be a huge variety of sight lines and engagement distances which tend to favor the more jack of all trade guns as opposed to the old days of heavy assault rockem sockem jack hammer robot base sieges all the time.

Oh, and one last thing I should mention is that in close range, shotguns and full automatic weapons have the benefit of being able to hip fire to make their kills while a sniper rifle must zoom in to be accurate. So in context of the exercise, not only does the reply button have a wider margin of error, you also have another quarter second or more (based upon a sane zoom in time here) in which to get the shot off on the large target and an easier time tracking the target while moving than if the shot was made than even with a reflex sight on a sniper rifle. You can still get some relatively quick drag shot kills with a reflex sight on a sniper rifle in ranges less than 50 meters, or even point blank, but those same kills could be made far more easily with a shotgun or an automatic weapon with a good cone of fire.

Now if you are using a battle rifle style weapon with an infiltrator that can engage everything from 0 to 150 meters decently with a low powered scope and doing great because you are an amazing shot and smart about your peeks, I say you've found a niche and you shouldn't be any more ashamed of punking a shotgun user with a surprise point blank semi auto kill than SkyExile would be bombing a skyguard with a reaver. But just because a good reaver might be able to get the drop on a bad skyguard does not mean suddenly skyguards are always going to lose against reavers, and even with a half decent reflex scope the same is true for sniper rifles verses shotties (or automatic weapons) in close quarter combat.

[Peacemaker]

Bringing the scope up fast is fine. Moving and being able to shoot or stop and shoot fast is not fine.

[Malstrum]

I certainly hope there wont be any quick-scoping. The infiltrator is going to be a considerable opponent with what the class has to offer now, invisibility, sniper rifles, explosives, CQB weapons ect, giving them the chance to quick-scope will just promote lone wolf play to show their "skills".

Personally I love playing as a sniper, there's nothing more satisfying then taking bullet drop, time and distance into consideration, then to pull off a successful headshot is rewarding in it's self, but running from point A to B with a sniper that might as well weigh as much as a book and getting cheap kills is not enjoyable at all, especially in games like Planetside.

[Lonehunter]

Quickscoping used to be a glitch or exploit, and it really sucks that one of the most popular FPSs (CoD) deliberately put it in the game.

It better not make it's way into PS2. I keep a very clear head and don't say things like this often but quickscoping would ruin the game for me. It's such a busted mechanic I won't be able to fathom why they put it in our beloved game, and would certainly spend more time with other shooters if it happened.

[somers]

TO ALL QUICKSCOPERS- How about instead of being a 12 year old who thinks he is an MLG 1337 quickscoper and actually use your pistol for close range? -A concerned gamer

Not to sound like a dick, but quickscoping requires no talent when there is aim assist, and since this is a pc game there should be no aim assist since it was intended to make console shooters easier to handle with the first being Halo brought to Xbox

[Creezey]

I concur. I always felt quick scoping was a little gamey in the titles that I played that it was part of. I feel sniping is and should be a very deliberate process and a rewarding kill AT DISTANCE.

Can already see the scenario play out in which someone gets the drop with an AR and a scope to kill shot ends the engagement in under a second (or imagine an unrealistic amount of time). Happens too much in other shooters.