Capture by proxy?

[NexAnima]

So I was watching a few videos and came across this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLakXgelJGY&feature=relmfu#t=41m30s

What bothers me here is the fact that the point is being taken but all you have to do is stand there and watch the doors...No more "Oh shi- I need to hurry the F up so I can see whats going on around me". How can they even call this "Hacking"?

Imo, when taking a point, the one taking it should be (like PS) locked into working on the hack and have others protecting him/her.

Thoughts?

[Krawanan]

I agree with this, however we will know for sure in beta, maybe this system works better with how they have made ps2, keeping in mind that the TTK is MUCH shorter.
So maybe hacking would become impossible or REALLY hard if they use the same system as in ps1

[NoDachi]

Its fine the way it is.

The hacker still can't do anything else than look around. Which with the new TTK is fine, because at least if gives them a slight chance to react.

[Seagoon]

All I would like to see is an animation of the guy pulling out a REK and hacking it.

[NoDachi]

That would be nice :D

[Klockan]

I don't see why you would make capturing a point alone into a gamble. In PS1 it was necessary since there capturing a point heavily disrupts the activity in a base but in PS 2 capturing a point just gives your team a small capture trickle so it doesn't make a difference at all unless you also can defend the point which is hard if you are alone. So you basically want them to implement a frustrating feature from the original game that doesn't fill a purpose any longer since the defenders have an uncomrpomisable spawn location. As for realism I am sure that I can sit and do things on a computer while still noticing and seeing if someone enters the room.

[Rago]

Lets try it First the new System sounds Promising to me, like it is, right now.

[RSphil]

it looks fine as it is tbh. you dont get it straight away. you hack it but have to defend it it still takes a few seconds and as said you cant do anything else while hacking. we will see in beta how it all works out.

[proxy]

Girl, you know its true.

I'll be capturing all up and down dat map.

Werd,

proxy

[Biohazard]

PS1:
You cant look around, move around, or fire

PS2:
You cant move around, or fire.

[DarkChiron]

ps1:
You cant look around, move around, or fire

ps2:
You cant move around, or fire.

any change is bad and should be fought against!!!!

Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aawr!

[GreatMazinkaise]

PS1:
You cant look around, move around, or fire

PS2:
You cant move around, or fire.

Pretty sure you can fire but it cancels the hack...

[ChookWantan]

Girl, you know its true.

I'll be capturing all up and down dat map.

Werd,

proxy

Best comment.

[Otleaz]

They need to encourage teamwork every chance they get.

This discourages it.

[DarkChiron]

They need to encourage teamwork every chance they get.

This discourages it.

I think a distinction needs to be maintained between 'discourage' and 'doesn't require'.

[Littleman]

I think a distinction needs to be maintained between 'discourage' and 'doesn't require'.

This is true on so many other topics as well...

[Otleaz]

I think a distinction needs to be maintained between 'discourage' and 'doesn't require'.

True, but they should still be using this opportunity to encourage teamwork.

[Airanuva]

True, but they should still be using this opportunity to encourage teamwork.

They do that on a number of occasions already...
Besides, this is probably only one of the types of captures, there may be ones like in PS1, where you need to wait in order to capture the base. (only have the time reduced when near the front line, because 15 minutes is long time to sit around and do nothing. It can be that long behind the lines, but otherwise...)

[Otleaz]

They do that on a number of occasions already...
Killing things while standing next to each other doesn't count.

[Airanuva]

Killing things while standing next to each other doesn't count.

I meant with all the ships that have more than one seat and getting into enables voice chat so that you can better coordinate with the pilot, the galaxies and the sunderers...
Team work will still be a necessity to succeed in the game, you just don't need to be in a group in order to do anything at all.

[Otleaz]

I meant with all the ships that have more than one seat and getting into enables voice chat so that you can better coordinate with the pilot, the galaxies and the sunderers...
Team work will still be a necessity to succeed in the game, you just don't need to be in a group in order to do anything at all.

12 guys pressing a button because one guy on VOIP says to? Sure that could be called teamwork, but it is nothing compared to relying on your allies to keep you alive while you are defenseless, and can hardly be reason enough to forgo it.

I agree that you shouldn't need a squad to to do everything, but capturing a base point is kind of a big deal. One lone wolf shouldn't be able to rambo it.

[Klockan]

Killing things while standing next to each other doesn't count.
Spotting encourages teamwork and didn't exist in PS1.

[Otleaz]

Spotting encourages teamwork and didn't exist in PS1.

Spotting also has a side effect of making people less inclined to use VOIP, which is the foundation of any legitimate teamwork.

Also, I never said there was no teamwork, though the majority of it is just gimmicky bullshit like spotting. It is teamwork though, no matter how gimmicky and bullshit it is.

[SixShooter]

They need to encourage teamwork every chance they get.

This discourages it.

I can't see squads just sending one guy in to hack and have to fend for himself because he has the magic abilty to turn his head while hacking. Of course his squadmates are going to go in and protect him. I see this a lot on these forums where people think that teamwork should be forced. It's a choice and PS2 provides tons of opportunities for people to take advantage of good teamwork. You guys are making way too big of a deal over this kind of stuff.

[Otleaz]

I can't see squads just sending one guy in to hack and have to fend for himself because he has the magic abilty to turn his head while hacking. Of course his squadmates are going to go in and protect him. I see this a lot on these forums where people think that teamwork should be forced. It's a choice and PS2 provides tons of opportunities for people to take advantage of good teamwork. You guys are making way too big of a deal over this kind of stuff.

I think the people against it are underestimating a feature like this.

It completely changes the flow of the game to make for an extremely satisfying experience. You don't even need to lock their screen; you could make it so they drop their weapon and need to go through the weapon switching animation to defend themselves. It still puts them at a severe disadvantage without being as cumbersome.

[NexAnima]

My original argument was two parted. While I'm not thrill with the change, I'm not immovable object when it comes to changing features.

My issues with this one in particular

1.) No immerse interaction when taking a point. Essentially its just king of the hill. Any jarhead can just run in there and recode the command terminal. I'm sorry but I want to have Sgt. Johnson manning the keyboard shouting he'll have it in 10 seconds, while I yell back saying he has 5, While my squad takes defensive positions (no, I don't RP but I do get into it especially under high risk situations).

2.) While we haven't seen the other facilities and how their points are capped, just in this demonstration makes me feel the need for a dedicated hacker is now gone. Why would you run a squishy infiltrator when you can use anything other then maxes and vehicles to take it (not entirely sure about HA). I know the roles have kind of changed but why kill one working feature to implement an old used up one.

I understand that the TTK is much quicker but the cap speed is ridiculously fast it takes like ten seconds to cap a point by any soldier class. It's probably just me but the flow seems off. In most of the videos, I'm seeing 1 person take the point some times followed by another. The siege battles seem over, which kind of makes me feel sad.

Once again I'm not saying "OMFGBBQ NEVR CHANGE IT!!!1", I'm just asking that maybe we could look at it?

[DarkChiron]

I think the people against it are underestimating a feature like this.

It completely changes the flow of the game to make for an extremely satisfying experience. You don't even need to lock their screen; you could make it so they drop their weapon and need to go through the weapon switching animation to defend themselves. It still puts them at a severe disadvantage without being as cumbersome.

I think something like this probably SHOULD be the case, actually. I don't think it's an unreasonable level of vulnerability. I still would not like to see it go back to where you couldn't watch for guys coming up behind you.

The system as I see it is already going to require teamwork. As fast as it seems the defending team will respawn, I don't think taking a base by yourself where there is actually defenders will be viable. Especially not when they get a HUD indicator telling them what capture points they're losing.

[Marinealver]

Where the hell is my REK?

[GLaDOS]

12 guys pressing a button because one guy on VOIP says to? Sure that could be called teamwork, but it is nothing compared to relying on your allies to keep you alive while you are defenseless, and can hardly be reason enough to forgo it.

I agree that you shouldn't need a squad to to do everything, but capturing a base point is kind of a big deal. One lone wolf shouldn't be able to rambo it.

In the instances we've seen, it's not that much of a big deal. It's kind of like capturing a flag in a BF3 Conquest match or a COD Domination match, it can easily be undone by the enemy with little effect in most occasions.

[Froglicker]

I like the system they showed at E3 so long as:

-hack terminal must remain in view
-can hack while cloaked (AFAIK there is no more perma-cloak)
-all weapons are unequipped during hack (equipping a REK is purely cosmetic, and thus optional. I personally don't care for REKs because lore-wise it just seems like a "push here to autohack" device)

Someone mentioned somewhere that hacking should be a minigame which I thought would be really neat. If it were a simple typing game, something similar to Blacklight's or Mass Effect 2's hacking game (both boiled down to a matching game), it'd work well I think. You'd still be able to see what's happening around you but doing so splits your focus and thus slows your progress. It'd make the hacker more vulnerable than the current system, but doesn't leave him defenseless. It'd allow for skill or cert-based hackers (i.e. skilled players would make matches faster, while certs reduce # of req. matches for a complete hack, or reduce penalties for errors). It also makes more sense lore-wise (if your military facilities can be autohacked left and right by any soldier, you're doing things wrong. Update your security!).