Faction Lore Personality

[Gugabalog]

I once read somewhere that CEO's with a military background are less profitable during stable economic times but incur less loss of profits during troubled economic times than CEO's without a military background.

Because of the study it was suggested that military CEO's are risk averse.

Given that line of thought, what do you think of the TR's military junta?

[Marinealver]

Click on the world map.

http://www.facebook.com/PlanetSide2#!/PlanetSide2/app_184213505012414

Is it a big suprise that Russia is mostly Terran Republic, Japan is Vanu Sovernginty, and now Egypt is New Conglomerate after Arab Spring, hey is that a hotspot over Syrian Arab Republic?

[DevilzRightHand]

There is already a HUGE thread about this "faction war"
Read it and all your questions will be there you vanu scum

http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=46007

[Gugabalog]

Devilz, you dont seem to of read my post.

If military minds are risk averse how do you think this dictated the actions of the TR coup?

[Canaris]

Given that line of thought, what do you think of the TR's military junta?

Oxford writes

junta


noun

1a military or political group that rules a country after taking power by force: the country’s ruling military junta

Well there's your first mistake, the TR never came to power via force we are the democratically elected OVERLORDS of Auraxis.
So what I think is, Bad question ;)

[therandomone]

democratically elected OVERLORDS

Oxymoron,no?

[opticalshadow]

Oxymoron,no?

you can have a dictatorship, and still be democratic. it all depends on how that one guy allows decisions to be made.

[Canaris]

Oxymoron,no?

nope :D

[Gugabalog]

The current TR leadership assasinated Connery and blew up the
Discovery 7.

They came to power by use of force.

Now answer the question plz if you're going to post.

[Canaris]

The current TR leadership assasinated Connery and blew up the
Discovery 7.

They came to power by use of force.

Now answer the question plz if you're going to post.

These vicious and hurtful accusations are groundless and wholly untrue, they are no more than NC propaganda and filthy VS lies invented to undermine the rightful government of Auraxis and if you insist on perpetuating them then I must say good day to you sir.



;)

[Gugabalog]

These vicious and hurtful accusations are groundless and wholly untrue, they are no more than NC propaganda and filthy VS lies invented to undermine the rightful government of Auraxis and if you insist on perpetuating them then I must say good day to you sir.



;)

These accusations are established lore on the wiki.

The TR junta is responsible for Connery's death and D-7's destruction and the death of her crew.

Look it up on the diary entry lore section.

EDIT: Now does anyone have anything to say on topic?

[SpcFarlen]

Established on a wiki? Anyone can edit the wiki.

NC and VS are clearly trying to undermine the integrity of our great republic.

[Gugabalog]

The wiki contains a link to the source document.

http://wiki.planetside-universe.com/ps/Lore_Archive

Now stop deflecting the topic question please.

(For the specific point I'm making to the naysayers check the last popdown entry)

[opticalshadow]

the republic have given teh human race prosperity, peace, and safety. if there were only terrans on auraxis then we would be at peace.

the way i see it, these two factions can claim what they will, but by createing themselves, they plunged us into war, and their claimbs that we came to power though force, wont mean anything, when thats the goal they strive for.

their very existence invalidates their claims to be fighting for peace, or freedom. when they wish only to cause death, and impose their view on the people of this planet.

[Canaris]

The wiki contains a link to the source document.

http://wiki.planetside-universe.com/ps/Lore_Archive

Now stop deflecting the topic question please.

(For the specific point I'm making to the naysayers check the last popdown entry)

actually it's quoted from the historical archives on the Planetside 2 website media section, I of course have reviewed all these records and found several of them to be incomplete, corrupt or clearly doctored by pugnacious agents of chaos. As is the case with the one you cling to as the truth.

[FINALCUT]

you can have a dictatorship, and still be democratic. it all depends on how that one guy allows decisions to be made.

True. As much as I hate to agree with a TR. Remember Hitler was elected by the German people. Well,technically HE wasn't elected,but the Nazi party was elected to office,they then appointed Hitler to Chancelor,so yes,a Dictator can be elected.

That is what happened with the TR. We elected them,now we decided it was a mistake,so we will remove them by force. I guess in a way that would almost make the NC the Junta.:huh::rofl:

All in how you look at it I guess. One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist and all that.Look at the U.S. in Iraq,were we liberators,or invaders / Just depends on what side of the fence you are on when the bullets start to fly.

[opticalshadow]

True. As much as I hate to agree with a TR. Remember Hitler was elected by the German people. Well,technically HE wasn't elected,but the Nazi party was elected to office,they then appointed Hitler to Chancelor,so yes,a Dictator can be elected.

That is what happened with the TR. We elected them,now we decided it was a mistake,so we will remove them by force. I guess in a way that would almost make the NC the Junta.:huh::rofl:

All in how you look at it I guess. One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist and all that.Look at the U.S. in Iraq,were we liberators,or invaders / Just depends on what side of the fence you are on when the bullets start to fly.

jsut remember, while you fight to remove us, whom was elected by the freedom of the people, your fighting against the freedom you claim to cling to.

[FINALCUT]

jsut remember, while you fight to remove us, whom was elected by the freedom of the people, your fighting against the freedom you claim to cling to.

No. I am fighting against an increasingly overbearing and dominating Government that surpresses freedom more and more each day. I am fighting on behalf of Corporations that choose free market Capitalism and as little Goverment regulation as possible.

Beside,Blue and Gold looks better and our Tanks are awesomer.:groovy:

Yes, I said awesomer. It's a real word.:huh::D

[MorioMortis]

The current TR leadership assasinated Connery and blew up the
Discovery 7.

They came to power by use of force.

Now answer the question plz if you're going to post.

The Republic was legitimately in power before the Discovery 7 terrorist attacks, and it saddens us greatly to have to enforce a military regime to assure the survival of the mission. This does not, however, render our government illegitimate, and, even if it were so, we still represent the interests of the majority of the Auraxian colonies' population.

Therefore, the Republic is not a junta, it is the only legitimate governing body on Auraxis (and, for that matter, everywhere else for all we know). As such, it is reasonable to assume that we would be rather more conservative in our policies than the upstarts, as we do not make brash and foolish attempts at "revolutionizing" government; we rule justly and efficiently, as we have for more than a thousand years, with the betterment of all mankind, today and tomorrow, as our only objective. It is through stability that we assure this, and our policies reflect that, rather than a desire to escalate political and social unrest amongst our citizens.

The traitorous Sovereignty and Conglomerate, on the other hand, corrupt the free citizens of the Republic with their lies about "freedom" and "human advancement", when in reality, they only seek to establish a tyrannical and dystopian rule over humanity. Faced with the destruction of our true and just way of life, and the enslavement of our population, it is our duty to defend humanity against these muses of deceit and heralds of oppression. No compromise can be made in this conflict, for it is our survival which is in danger, and we are more than willing to fight to the bitter end to preserve it.

[opticalshadow]

No. I am fighting against an increasingly overbearing and dominating Government that surpresses freedom more and more each day. I am fighting on behalf of Corporations that choose free market Capitalism and as little Goverment regulation as possible.

Beside,Blue and Gold looks better and our Tanks are awesomer.:groovy:

Yes, I said awesomer. It's a real word.:huh::D

you call us supressign freedom, but you admit to fight to remove a power elected by the people.

you are trying to betrey the foundation of freedom, the ability to vote for what we want. and you would replace it with a corporation. a thing that runs on monetary means, which have never worked in any government the human race has seen. it only breeds corruption.

i can admit, we might not have the absolute best way of doing things, but what we do have is proof our way has led to a long period of peace, that happiness was shared by our entire race. and that history shows how your way of doing things inevitably fails, how bad things become.

our way of life might not be fairy tale, but its the best history can ever show proof of.

[FINALCUT]

you call us supressign freedom, but you admit to fight to remove a power elected by the people.

you are trying to betrey the foundation of freedom, the ability to vote for what we want. and you would replace it with a corporation. a thing that runs on monetary means, which have never worked in any government the human race has seen. it only breeds corruption.

i can admit, we might not have the absolute best way of doing things, but what we do have is proof our way has led to a long period of peace, that happiness was shared by our entire race. and that history shows how your way of doing things inevitably fails, how bad things become.

our way of life might not be fairy tale, but its the best history can ever show proof of.

Yea,but your Tanks suck.:groovy:

[Malorn]

TR are not a dictatorship. Its in the name - Terran Republic.

[Solidblock]

People make out as if Discovery 7 was a complete TR leadership effort. As far as I know it was simply one radical man who happened to have been a part of the TR, that does not make the TR illegitimate, however stealing weapons and supplies and trying to go against the vote the people ratified to implement martial law is hypocritical and counter-productive. Corporations are nothing but another evil, a hypothetical victory for the NC would just mean a super-modern feudal era dominated by the rich. The TR have historically been the binding force of the 6 great powers in the 2400's. For 1000 years man has grown faster than ever before and once this rebellion has been shut down, theTR can return to its peacetime ways.

[Gugabalog]

TR are not a dictatorship. Its in the name - Terran Republic.

That was not the thread topic.

[Solidblock]

That was not the thread topic.

Agreed, even if it's against my own. Check North Koreas official name..

[Gugabalog]

This thread was so derailed. Can a mod please lock it?

*Shame the TR didn't try to engage in productive discussion absent of any moral high ground for any side instead of erroneous denial of the lore*

[Psyche]

Terran Republic are the official government faction and no they are not a Junta.

They aren't the Actual Government body just a Martial [Emergency] wartime authority. In times of emergency, Martial Law is normal 'until the government declares the emergency over'.

Since the government (Terra) hasn't intervened/communicated that the emergency has passed [in this particular case, open rebellion/revolution/dissident behavior/activity that threatens the State/Government/Population as a whole] then Martial Law (Military Authority) remains in effect.

So yeah, like it or not Terran Republic are the official government entities (though they may be found at fault pending after action review by Terra).

[Gugabalog]

Did you not read the OP? It's not about the nature of the faction itself, it's about the nature of military minds supposedly being risk averse.

This has nothing to do with moral high ground.

As I asked, can a mod please lock this derailed thread?

[Solidblock]

Before this is locked then, may I claim victory for the mighty Terran Republic?

[Malorn]

What was the point of this thread? I didn't understand the OP.

[Solidblock]

Yeah, care to elaborate Guga? You seemed to really want this debate anyway.

[Gugabalog]

It was to discuss the supposed risk aversion of military command mindsets given the data of a CEO's military background being directly linked to success during stable and unstable times.

Smaller gains are made during stable times with lesser losses or continued gains during unstable times with a much greater frequency than those CEO's without a military background.

Given this line of thought how do you think a risk averse mentality played into the TR's actions leading up to the civil war? (Waterson's treason aside)

[Solidblock]

Ahhh right, I could just be a little bit dim. But you mean in the way TR leadership were naive and careless about how they dealt with the situation on board the colonisation fleet? Yeah, I believe that the situation was a lot stickier and complicated than the lore written in the wiki describes, the TR had to balance on a high rope between being too ruthless and being weak. I honestly believe they did the right thing however and aside from one person in the TR who perhaps with a few other radicals blew up the Discovery 7, I believe they weren't that risk averse at all , in fact I like to think they were incredibly cautious, even taking the military backgrounds into account.

[Canaris]

The truth is in my signature Gug

If it's a lie, then we fight on that lie. But we gotta fight

Not that I'd ever admit it to a NC or VS :devilwink

[Psyche]

The Risk Adverse mindset is probably the primary reason for the conflict. Ie. Damage control to contain a threat by force typically escalates a situation to full military conflict as opposed to a tense diplomatic stand-off.

However, I don't think waterson can officially be called a traitor yet [I haven't read the details or Waterson's orders to judge the integrity of his actions]. A security risk could've forced/obligated him to commit his acts, which could be as simple as someone taking 'possession' of sensitive material/items/area's or a breach of containment [deployment of potentially hazardous/dangerous technology for example].

Sensitive materials/information/items are, by standard damage control emergency procedures, 'locked down' meaning no one [including the security forces] are supposed to be doing anything with them that isn't necessary to contain them [like keeping an armed weapon/reactor from detonating they would be permitted to maintain it but not more than that or maintaining sensor monitoring of technology/anomalies to maintain awareness of it with the sensor logs being sealed otherwise - no publishing/releasing them to non-containment personell].

[Canaris]

I'm just a humble patriot of the Republic :trrocks:

[Gugabalog]

I suppose there might of been a republican guard contingency to do what was done and some officers were simply afraid to follow through.

Hm...Republican Guard....reminds me of Iran....

[Canaris]

I suppose there might of been a republican guard contingency to do what was done and some officers were simply afraid to follow through.

Hm...Republican Guard....reminds me of Iran....

France to, viva Garde Républicaine :lol:

[Gugabalog]

Ah. Touche.

Perhaps it's not so totalitarian as it is socialist. (Which is what I believe it to be and is what redeems it in my eyes, its socialism, otherwise it would be a literal thousand year reich.)

Otherwise, any ideas regarding whether or not Waterson was acting on a contingency?

[Psyche]

Ah. Touche.

Perhaps it's not so totalitarian as it is socialist. (Which is what I believe it to be and is what redeems it in my eyes, its socialism, otherwise it would be a literal thousand year reich.)

Otherwise, any ideas regarding whether or not Waterson was acting on a contingency?

Got a link to the Lore about it, I could probably spot them easily enough depending on how much info is present.

[Edit: Okay, Read through Donaldson's Log and the TR anouncement about the D7 incident. Didn't see anything about treason. Looks like a terrorist act but could've been Security escalating since Connery isn't following standard security protocols {even he is obligated to follow them - his overrides are temporary and subject to review} - also...Why the Heck is Connery on the Fleet to begin with - thats putting government integrity/security and viability 'at risk' {meaning he isn't considered president/leader if he's under duress/captivity - his leadership is invalid in such circumstances} and putting a head of authority in a position of risk without declaring an auxillary {ex. vice president}[which would have primary review authority in any questionable situations] is inherently reckless and justification for review/impeachment investigation/proceedings. Leaders give up their personal freedoms for the duties/obligations of leadership or they simply aren't leadership, thats common across all government structures I'm familiar with.]