Real priority audio vs audio minimap spotting

[RoninOni]

http://mordorhq.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2666&p=61808#p61808

having a discussion on another board I frequent and we were discussing Higby's stream and someone mentioned it appeared that there was automatic audio minimap spotting (that is, you briefly light up on the minimap when you fire your [unsilenced, like another weapon option] firearm)

We are somewhat distraught by this as we know first hand the effect it has on stealth and flanking.

We were also spoiled by fantastic audio systems that actually prevented the need for audio spots, as the audio itself was the only clue you needed, and you could then use loud ambient noise (say from tanks rumbling by or firing) to mask your own gunshot noise as you would IRL. (of course, EA implemented audio spotting alongside the high quality audio of bad company 2... I just never noticed having never needed it. In BF3 some glitch with their audio system however nullified the audio's reliability in audible locating)

so anyways, just posting this here hoping to grab the attention of some dev that comes along this forum 8)

If at all possible, we believe it would make for a far more interesting and tactical game if sound direction and priority was how people would locate source of gunfire in game as it would be so much more realistic, without falling back on "newb assists"

Discuss and cheers ;)

[Fanglord]

I think if its gonna be in maybe cert it, the higher the cert the further away you can autospot the person. But really I don't think it should be in at all; take blacklight for example theres no mini map therefore no auto-spot and its really not that difficult to tell that someone is shooting around you.

Edit: also dat bridge.

[RoninOni]

I think if its gonna be in maybe cert it, the higher the cert the further away you can autospot the person. But really I don't think it should be in at all; take blacklight for example theres no mini map therefore no auto-spot and its really not that difficult to tell that someone is shooting around you.

Edit: also dat bridge.

If it's a cert then everyone with over X amount of time will have it anyways.... Although having an investment required prolly would alleviate it some so I would upvote that option in lieu of real positional audio.

I kinda understand the logic to audio minimap spotting... IRL if someone shoots a gun, the noise it makes is actually rather informative to it's relative direction (and more than just in 90 degree increments but within 5-10 degrees accuracy depending on the observer) as well as range.

However if they can accomplish that with in game sounds... then IMO that would be far FAR preferable to falling back on this simpler, visual mechanic.

The visual method ALWAYS lets you know EXACTLY where an enemy is when they shoot. The priority based audible positional system on the other hand, a sniper can use an enemy tank near his position that's shooting to cover the sound of his own rifle shots.

As I mentioned to the guy I was talking to in the thread I linked in my OP here, I'm not even sure it's currently technically feasible given the scope and scale of PS2... however if it IS possible, it would be an AWESOME addition IMO.

[Gortha]

Automatic Minimap-Spotting is the death to a game for me.

I hated BF3 "Normal" Servers for it and played only on Hardcore and Custom Servers with Spotting off and no 3d Spotting too.
Only Silenced Weapons helped in BBF3.

I really, really hope there will be no Automatic Minimap-Spotting just by shoting your Weapon...

[BlueSkies]

I think if its gonna be in maybe cert it, the higher the cert the further away you can autospot the person. But really I don't think it should be in at all; take blacklight for example theres no mini map therefore no auto-spot and its really not that difficult to tell that someone is shooting around you.

Edit: also dat bridge.

lol, no. They just have a built in wall-hack :huh:

[RoninOni]

I wouldn't go so far as to say "Death of the game"

but it would unquestionably be a negative IMO

[SFJake]

I support this. Automatic audio spotting is ridiculous. It just is.

[Lord Paladin]

Just to play devil's advocate.

What about people with a hearing disability?

[SFJake]

Just to play devil's advocate.

What about people with a hearing disability?

What about people with no eyes?

What about people with no arms?

[BlakKy]

The first Call Of Duty had spotting right.

There was no mini-map, justa compass. When someone fired their weapon a red dot appeared on the edge of the compass to give you a general idea of where the shot came from.

[RoninOni]

Just to play devil's advocate.

What about people with a hearing disability?

They'd be at a disadvantage in the real field... and already are really anyways for that matter as there are lots of key/important sounds.

I know you're just trying to play the advocate here but I don't think it's an issue.

Maybe if you completely mute all game sounds then it can be enabled... and it would give you a couple visual queues to make up for the vast amount of information you're missing (like text prompts when people ask for ammo/health, etc) but that's more of an accessibility addon than valid as part of core design IMO...

[Fanglord]

lol, no. They just have a built in wall-hack :huh:

I've found that to be perversely balanced. :S

[Duskguy]

think there should only be manual spotting. and the wall hack thing i hope they turn down so that you can only see so far ahead. watched e3 videos and people were seeing teammates and enemies through the wall across half the facility...that i hope changes as much as the auto audio spotting from weapon fire.

[vasito]

Automatic minimap spotting is RETARDED. Please dont include in the game!!!

[AThreatToYou]

I've always preferred having liberal spotting. I like to shoot at folks cause the bottom line is, if you can be seen then someone is going to see you and shoot at you so I don't care if they can see me as long as I can see them too.

[MrBloodworth]

http://mordorhq.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2666&p=61808#p61808

having a discussion on another board I frequent and we were discussing Higby's stream and someone mentioned it appeared that there was automatic audio minimap spotting (that is, you briefly light up on the minimap when you fire your [unsilenced, like another weapon option] firearm)

We are somewhat distraught by this as we know first hand the effect it has on stealth and flanking.

We were also spoiled by fantastic audio systems that actually prevented the need for audio spots, as the audio itself was the only clue you needed, and you could then use loud ambient noise (say from tanks rumbling by or firing) to mask your own gunshot noise as you would IRL. (of course, EA implemented audio spotting alongside the high quality audio of bad company 2... I just never noticed having never needed it. In BF3 some glitch with their audio system however nullified the audio's reliability in audible locating)

so anyways, just posting this here hoping to grab the attention of some dev that comes along this forum 8)

If at all possible, we believe it would make for a far more interesting and tactical game if sound direction and priority was how people would locate source of gunfire in game as it would be so much more realistic, without falling back on "newb assists"

Discuss and cheers ;)


In PS1 all gunfire, footsteps and such were 3D positional audio. That undoubtedly is in PS2 as well, as its an engine audio level function.

There was also a mechanic in game, using devices/sensors/base features that would place a user on the mini map for a short time due to movement or sound. Its a game mechanic with counters and amplifiers ( Such as the audio implant, Jammer grenades, Sensor Disruptor ) or the mosquitoes radar feature at certain speeds.

I believe the second is what you are seeing, that, and in combination with being spotted by another faction ( Witch also put you on the map, there was no key-press needed, its an "eyes on target" spotting ) and or motion sensors.

But, one does not preclude the other as some have suggested.

[LordSlack]

I think the best case compromise and solution is for gunfire to show up as tiny radiating rings on the minimap when bullets are fired, but the shooter is not Flagged for any period of time. You can see the "noise" on the battlefield from a gun, but you don't become a dot for 6 seconds after you release the trigger. This is more realistic as far as needing a visual cue for gunfire, and eliminates the cheapness of seeing which direction an infiltrator runs After he is done shooting. There's no way to know that data without omnipotent information being given to you by a satellite or something.