Cert Changes

[Geist]

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/cert-changes.19352/

Two major changes:

1. Many of the permanent locked certs are being added to the game and will be unlocked soon
2. The way cert points are earned and spent will be undergoing a lot of balance changes in the next few updates.

The first thing we did was shut off the cert points that were being given over time to everyone, which was a legacy feature from a different plan that we had discarded a while ago.

Cert points are now earned (actually they were earned even from before, but it wasn't as noticeable with all the offline certs). 1000 xp should equal 1 cert point.

We'll be adjusting cert point prices in the near future and possibly the cert point per xp value, so please bear with us if there are any major glaring bugs while we're updating everything - we'll try to get the transition over with as soon as possible.

Can't wait, all those locked certs sound amazing(based on the descriptions).

[IMMentat]

Its mean linking into forums some of us dont have access to. :(
(which is in itself mean considering I'm a PS2 vet w/o an invite but with 2 old accounts)

[SixShooter]

It's nice to know how it actually works now. Time to go farm some XP:D

[EvilNinjadude]

Getting the news from the forums to the twitter feed. Thanks for that, Geist!

[Kipper]

Makes much more sense to actually have to play to earn the certification points imho.

I didn't get the whole "offline cert" thing, as it doesn't encourage you to play better or reward you for doing so - and not having certs doesn't stop you from squadding with friends who do, it just makes you slightly less powerful/versatile.

[Geist]

Its mean linking into forums some of us dont have access to. :(
(which is in itself mean considering I'm a PS2 vet w/o an invite but with 2 old accounts)

That's why I quoted the relevant information. So no one will miss out. :)

Also, have you thought about getting Alpha Squad? It's a good deal and you automatically get Beta Access. ;)

[ParisTeta]

I liked the offline Cert idea, to a degree (should not be unlimited) well then, maybe a rested bonus for XP will do. I hope this means with gameplay certs come faster, but 1000xp per cert right now is very very slow, and not everyone on every task get the same xp. I sense a small problem here.

More unlockable certs? Nice but....most certs aren`t really that tempting that im absolutly looking forward to it, it`s like the old WoW talent syste, many performance increase, you have to take, but rarley fun or change of gameplay. Active talents like smokescreen, emp blast etc. thats fun, spending 270 points for 10 kph more as an ESF? nahhh. It`s Beta, but that is the situation right now.

[Rat]

wohoo...we have a reason for XP!!!

[Chowley]

Makes much more sense to actually have to play to earn the certification points imho.

I didn't get the whole "offline cert" thing, as it doesn't encourage you to play better or reward you for doing so - and not having certs doesn't stop you from squadding with friends who do, it just makes you slightly less powerful/versatile.

It was a really slow gain though. I rue the loss of offline cert gain. I can only play games 3 or 4 nights a week now these days. So it was a huge boon for me, even the small cert gain was nice. Now people with loads of time in their hands can cert themselves to fuck, and well those of us with less time on our hands meh. I hate progression systems in shooters. :P I can see merit in both systems , no doubt, but the small offline cert gain seemed harmless to me.

[Timealude]

I like the fact they did this, but wouldnt it make sense to wipe the characters now that way everything is on an even playing field?

[Geist]

I like the fact they did this, but wouldnt it make sense to wipe the characters now that way everything is on an even playing field?

There should be a character wipe next patch:

PlanetSide 2 Developer Roundtable September 2012 - YouTube

Go to 1h 42m and he starts talking about the next character wipe.

[SFJake]

The biggest sign yet that the game will turn to trash.

What the hell am I going to get by playing the way I do now? Nothing. Woohoo.

I should have known F2P games -and- MMO games always turn out to be a complete joke. You do realize this is a game killer, right? Completely destroys everything.

I was fighting for AURAXIUM offline and instead they REMOVE certs offline. Oh boy. This is so stupid. Guess this really is going to be a game for no life nerds and kids addicted to it like a drug. As sad as it can get, really.

[Kipper]

I was fighting for AURAXIUM offline and instead they REMOVE certs offline. Oh boy. This is so stupid. Guess this really is going to be a game for no life nerds and kids addicted to it like a drug. As sad as it can get, really.

Auraxium is what buys new weapons, you'll either get that by playing or using station cash - its how PS2 is going to make money, so I don't see a problem with that. If you play a lot, you get stuff for free, if you want stuff quicker, you pay a little. Most people will probably do a little of both.

Certs are what tweak what you can do into slightly better or more versatile roles - explosives, or a scope on your gun etc. You can play for 5 years and still be killed by someone has created their account with no certs. Nothing wrong with that. Someone with more certs isn't immune to dying to people without.

[bullet]

The biggest sign yet that the game will turn to trash.

What the hell am I going to get by playing the way I do now? Nothing. Woohoo.

I should have known F2P games -and- MMO games always turn out to be a complete joke. You do realize this is a game killer, right? Completely destroys everything.

I was fighting for AURAXIUM offline and instead they REMOVE certs offline. Oh boy. This is so stupid. Guess this really is going to be a game for no life nerds and kids addicted to it like a drug. As sad as it can get, really.
You're a lot better than those no life nerds and kids by going off on a rant, right?

You said your play style will be affected. How are you playing the game right now? Can you provide some feedback that can help them design a system for your play style rather than crying about how the world is ending because of said changes?

I for one think the rate of cert gains solely through XP is going to be very slow. With the changes, I think support will get the short end of the stick if they don't fix the current values for certain support actions. We need some system of rested XP while logged off or a system where you can only gain X amount of certs while logged off which is then reset by you logging in for some amount of time or possibly after a week/month/etc. I don't know, but it definitely needs some discussion.

[SFJake]

You're a lot better than those no life nerds and kids by going off on a rant, right?

I -was- one of those no life nerd kids. I know how sad a state it is to be in and I pity kids that run into this kind of game model. Of course as a kid, you don't realize the sadness of it while its happening.


You said your play style will be affected. How are you playing the game right now? Can you provide some feedback that can help them design a system for your play style rather than crying about how the world is ending because of said changes?

By not going F2P, for starters.

Auraxium is what buys new weapons, you'll either get that by playing or using station cash - its how PS2 is going to make money, so I don't see a problem with that. If you play a lot, you get stuff for free, if you want stuff quicker, you pay a little. Most people will probably do a little of both.

Can't wait to see the prices on those, probably along the line of 5 bucks a weapon, which is the kind of ridiculous price all F2P games give you.

You end up either wasting your life or spending a big amount of money. Thats F2P for you.

I'd pay 60$ if I could get a game I wouldn't have to grind, I'd have access to all the stuff at release, and could just play.

I've told them of fair payment option more than once on the Beta forums. Proper F2P is an option to spend time instead of money, -not- no option to pay a fair amount. But this isn't looking any different.

Like all F2P games I'll have to waste my time, or hundreds of dollars.

At the very least, a one-time payment (say 60$) to get both Auraxium and Cert gain offline would actually be a good deal that I'd do. I assume the rates would be decent (the previous cert gain was pretty spot on, I'd understand a slight reduction, but I'd expect to get something like flares in a day, 2 at best not a month).

That would be a fair option, for starters. That, and boosters that work with in-game time, not real time. Things like that, that shows they care about their costumers. But I don't expect those things to happen, because they are fair options. F2P is never fair.

[Electrofreak]

I play to have fun. I could probably play PS2 at BR1 with the base certs for a year without getting bored. That's why F2P doesn't bother me one bit; the grind doesn't matter to me when I can stay entertained. Having new toys to play with will be fun but I'll take them when I get them.

Either way I'll probably pick up the Alpha Squad pack soon; I'd like to support the game.

[Timealude]

There should be a character wipe next patch:

PlanetSide 2 Developer Roundtable September 2012 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSw7OYiO5vk)

Go to 1h 42m and he starts talking about the next character wipe.

Ah thanks, ya i guess i forgot what he said about that. :cool:

[SecondRaven]

Auraxium is what buys new weapons, you'll either get that by playing or using station cash - its how PS2 is going to make money, so I don't see a problem with that. If you play a lot, you get stuff for free, if you want stuff quicker, you pay a little. Most people will probably do a little of both.

Certs are what tweak what you can do into slightly better or more versatile roles - explosives, or a scope on your gun etc. You can play for 5 years and still be killed by someone has created their account with no certs. Nothing wrong with that. Someone with more certs isn't immune to dying to people without.

Dude you need to stop making sense now!!!! we will have none of that here...lol

[SecondRaven]

I play to have fun. I could probably play PS2 at BR1 with the base certs for a year without getting bored. That's why F2P doesn't bother me one bit; the grind doesn't matter to me when I can stay entertained. Having new toys to play with will be fun but I'll take them when I get them.

Either way I'll probably pick up the Alpha Squad pack soon; I'd like to support the game.

sorry for double post but meh,

Electro why would you pick up Alpha squad? Your account is already a vet account so...

[Raka Maru]

Sad to discover this, as I don't have much time to play daily.

Sooo... Offline cert gain is cut, but if you buy an implant, it is real time. This is why I would never buy a 24 hr implant. I'd end up using 2-3 hours tops and have to go back to RL for a while and my implant is gone.

Something is off here and someone needs to adjust this system.

[shamE]

This is a terrible system to earn certs.

[Whiteagle]

Sad to discover this, as I don't have much time to play daily.

Sooo... Offline cert gain is cut, but if you buy an implant, it is real time. This is why I would never buy a 24 hr implant. I'd end up using 2-3 hours tops and have to go back to RL for a while and my implant is gone.

Something is off here and someone needs to adjust this system.
Yeah, I did notice that I hadn't gained enough to unlock the IR scopes for my Basilisk logging on the other day...

Glad that I didn't set my Modular Equipment (http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=47822) unlock prices too high, and that I have a new idea to keep bases better manned (http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?p=837950#post837950) which should help a bit.

[ParisTeta]

There is alaway an implantation of rested XP, allow double XP gain for a certain depending how long you spend offline, which to use you have to play. Easy to fix that "real life syndrome" but well 1000 XP is much for me at least and you get just one Cert points. Well we see what the new cost will be, i don`t like the sound of it but well it`s beta and easy changed.

[HellsPanda]

SFjake, you do realise they will be doing a subscription model aswell right?

[SFJake]

SFjake, you do realise they will be doing a subscription model aswell right?
No, I don't, I've read nothing about that nor do I know anything about the benefits. If subscription made the grinding go away completely I'd happily pay.

But where have they said they would offer anything beyond boosters and the likes as your "subscription"? Which I have zero interest in.

[HellsPanda]

Well T-Ray mentioned it on Himvsher's stream yesterday, but its not yet been decided what will be in it, but I have a sneaky suspicion the Offline earning of certs will be for subscribers only.

[Scopedog]

Well T-Ray mentioned it on Himvsher's stream yesterday, but its not yet been decided what will be in it, but I have a sneaky suspicion the Offline earning of certs will be for subscribers only.

Yes this is a good estimation, seems very likely. I'm a little split in the matter, on one hand its nice for people with real lifes to be able to gain offline. But on the other hand those people me including can easily afford to pay a subscription for that stuff.

The thing that worries me is what you gain xp for and at what rates, base captures should be worth 1 cert as in 1000xp, and capture points needs to come up also. 100 is to low 200 seams more fair remember we get 100 per kill Res people should get a boost as medics can't shoot and Res at the same time and need a incentive for Res instead of killing.

Because peeps will search out the easiest way and spam it, Im looking at you Reaver pilots with A2G IGNORING tanks and going for softies. The A2G needs to be very limited for infantry hunting, you can't lock on to light assaults when they jump with your A2A now can you. This is critical.

[Sledgecrushr]

I really think offline cert accumulation if its done right would be awesome.

[Raka Maru]

Posted this on official forum:
----
Casual gamer perspective here...

XP translates to certs. Check
Certs are needed to unlock stuff. Check
XP boosters available in store. Check
XP boosters last only 24 hrs real time. Check
Workdays I can only play 1-2 hrs if nothing else is going on. Check

As a result, I will not waste my Araxium or real money on XP boosters because I will only get less than 10% of their worth. Translation, I will never buy these 24 hour boosters to get XP that will be used to get certs until they convert this to gaming time rather than real time. This mechanism is broken for casuals like myself.

The system is (supposedly) designed to allow you to trade your money for time, whichever you are more inclined to part with, except it is broken as I explained above.

Offline cert gain was good for me, I don't mind missing out on unearned XP if I wasn't actually playing, didn't mind paying a subscription fee, did that for years in PS1 and many other games when I had a lot of time, in between jobs, and could play for long stretches. FTP was good, because I could continue to play my favorite games, even if I was really really busy and could only play a few days a month. Didn't like subscription games and had to cancel when my schedule became busy.

In other games where there was a huge gap between noobs and hardcore (18 hrs/day) gamers I could offset this by buying gold online to get the things I wanted. In SOE's system, I would not even want to do that by purchasing XP boosts because of my reasons above (real and game time issue).

Now, since XP only translates to certs, and certs are needed to customize your basic character, there is really no way of getting my character customized to my play style except to grind. This is no longer fun.

Did I intend to spend lots of money in this game. Yes, I have over 27k of station cash waiting just for PS2 to open. Will I be putting any more in? That is iffy, because as I said, the XP boosters are broken as I found out. Will I subscribe? Probably not, because there are some months, I would only be able to play for a day or so.

Please SOE, reconsider the offline casual gamer cert gains, brainstorm how to fix them because I love this game and don't want this to fail. You're slowly losing the casuals.

[SpottyGekko]

Well T-Ray mentioned it on Himvsher's stream yesterday, but its not yet been decided what will be in it, but I have a sneaky suspicion the Offline earning of certs will be for subscribers only.

On the ingame Store screen, the second button from the top is titled "Membership", but it currently only shows a "Coming Soon" msg when clicked.

I'm very interested to see what that subscription will buy:


Server logon priority ?
Offline AUX or cert point earning ?
Base allowance of Station Cash per month ?
Store purchase discounts ?
Access to "rested" XP gain ?


If "PS2 Membership" gives attractive bonuses, I wouldn't hesitate to sign up.

[Whiteagle]

Yeah, I'm not really sure I like the idea of a "Freemium" payment system that gives subscribers a direct advantage over non-paying players...

Of course, a lot of MMO's that have Membership subscriptions simply make otherwise purchasable game-play content (such as "dungeons" or "missions") "Free" for those players as long as they are subscribed in addition to their monthly stipend of "cash shop currency"...

...I don't know how this would work for Planetside 2, unless one of the continents is going to be pay-to-play...

Ugh... I just want to avoid fourteen year-old armchair generals having max'ed out Command Certifications because Mom and Dad shelled out for a seven dollar a month-for-a-year subscriptions...

[Geist]

For anyone wondering about offline cert gain:

The idea is simple - offline cert gain will be something you pay for. Likely in a subscription and maybe outside of one.

[Raka Maru]

For anyone wondering about offline cert gain:

Sounds promising. If they had a pay for cert gain w/o subscription, it may be worth it.

[Geist]

Sounds promising. If they had a pay for cert gain w/o subscription, it may be worth it.

It's what they're going for right? Those who can't play as much can pay to keep up. The F2P model working as intended.

[SixShooter]

I'm suprised to see so many crying about the new cert system. I think it's great and I feel like I'm earning certs much faster now. 1000 XP is nothing if you're not sitting AFK in the WG. Even if you're only flying a Gal you should be getting XP from base caps and people using you as a spawn point. I also have very limited time to play but I definitly prefer this system.

[Sunrock]

I'm suprised to see so many crying about the new cert system. I think it's great and I feel like I'm earning certs much faster now.

1000 XP is nothing if you're not sitting AFK in the WG. Even if you're only flying a Gal you should be getting XP from base caps and people using you as a spawn point. I also have very limited time to play but I definitly prefer this system.

Well if it's going to be only 1k exp = 1 cert point then you're going to gain cert points slower then you do now. Right now for successfully Attacking/Defending a base you get 1 cert point now, but that is only worth 500 exp.

But if it's 1CP=1k exp + 1CP for successfully Attacking/Defending a base then it would be an other story. Not sure if that is going to be the case though.

But yea in any regards 1k exp is not really that mush consider its just 10 kills, or 10 generators destroyed, or 10 control points cape......

[artifice]

Honestly, after seeing the F2P models for Everquest, Everquest 2, and Vanguard, the fact that Planetside 2 is going to be a pay-to-win model isn't surprising at all. I probably won't be playing it now.

[SixShooter]

Honestly, after seeing the F2P models for Everquest, Everquest 2, and Vanguard, the fact that Planetside 2 is going to be a pay-to-win model isn't surprising at all. I probably won't be playing it now.

:rofl: So you jump into every thread and cry PTW!!! So funny.:rofl:

[artifice]

:rofl: So you jump into every thread and cry PTW!!! So funny.:rofl:

Your white knighting of the game doesn't do the game any good.

[Whiteagle]

:rofl: So you jump into every thread and cry PTW!!! So funny.:rofl:
Well that's because this IS a pay-to-win system...

Sorry, but a benefit that allows you to directly advance faster then your non-paying counterparts is paying for that advantage.

Now, if they made it so that members had higher resource caps and gained resources offline instead of Experience/Certification Points, while still offering XP boosting Implants in the cash shop, I'd see that as a far fairer option.

[SFJake]

In the end, F2P is never fair, unless they go for cosmetics only. I knew it would turn to hell. No company worth a damn would go F2P if they want to sell more than cosmetics. You need money and don't want that, then don't make it free to play.

This is just going to be yet another game butchered by that model because of a company's greed. When ironically, the model is inferior for BOTH the costumers AND the company.

[Crator]

Honestly, after seeing the F2P models for Everquest, Everquest 2, and Vanguard, the fact that Planetside 2 is going to be a pay-to-win model isn't surprising at all. I probably won't be playing it now.

Not sure how you can compare EQ/EQ2/Vanguard MMORPGs to PS2 MMOFPS when talking about subscription models and pay-to-win scenarios. The RPGs are not PvP centric. PS2 is PvP only. Big difference.

Should be interesting to see how they pull this off. IMO, in the short term, there will be somewhat of a pay-to-win scenario happening in PS2. Although in the other thread with Smed's post they did say they are going to give someone fairly quick access to the upgrades they want to allow them to play with special equiptment fairley quickly. That's a pretty good compromise. However, that's still a bit fishy because we are talking about classes and you don't know which class you might like over another right away. But that's the gotcha there and I don't think it's that big of a deal.

PS1 was always about being more versatile which means you could perform better for different situations that you encountered in the game. The difference with PS2 vs. PS1 in this aspect is that in PS1 any player, regardless of battle rank, could obtain any piece of equipment/vehicle they wanted (minus the BFRs and we all know how that ended up) which made all ranks equal. The difference between BR1 and BR40 was the BR40 could have more options over the BR1. But both had all the same options.

PS2 gets rid of the entire PS1 rank and certs system and goes with a detailed cert tree for individual classes. I actually don't know how they plan to tie in battle rank to what type of weapons are available in the cash shop (which are supposed to be side-grades). I don't consider weapons that have extra capabilities vs. the stock a side-grade. But it may be that they just have not implemented BR into this yet. Even still, if you give XP boosters to allow people to gain BR faster then they will still be able to PAY to obtain those side-grades with other benefits I would say that is pay-to-win.

[Kipper]

"Pay to win" means only one thing: money > all.

This is now how PS2 is slated to work. Those who spend money can obtain something quicker than those who don't, but they cannot obtain something that those who don't pay have no access to.

Pay to win would be saying "here's a gun that will do 1.5x damage, and you can only buy it with real money."

Boosters aren't pay to win because they just accelerate progress, not provide a direct advantage. They can be cash only. Likewise camo / cosmetics because they don't do anything except change how you look in game.

[Geist]

You want to see P2W at work? Look at world of tanks. You can buy ammunition that provides a clear advantage over free ammo that can only be bought with gold.

AFAIK PS2 does not nor is planning to put in weapons or ammo that provides a distinct advantage that can only be accessed with money, so no, PS2 is not P2W. Pay for convenience, pay for cosmetics, but not pay to win.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[Whiteagle]

Well I've found out that Passive Certification Point gain is something EVERYONE is getting, and Members only get a 50% boost.

That's at least a lot better then only Subscribers getting passive Certs.

[Sunrock]

"Pay to win" means only one thing: money > all.

This is now how PS2 is slated to work. Those who spend money can obtain something quicker than those who don't, but they cannot obtain something that those who don't pay have no access to.

Pay to win would be saying "here's a gun that will do 1.5x damage, and you can only buy it with real money."

Boosters aren't pay to win because they just accelerate progress, not provide a direct advantage. They can be cash only. Likewise camo / cosmetics because they don't do anything except change how you look in game.

If you can obtain something quicker then some one else you will have an advantage. Say you're the only one that pay SK for the dual photon canon and every one else waits to they have 12500 Aurixium you will for a time be unstoppable and get allot more kills then every one else only because you have a OP weapon that does 100 times more damage then the standard one. In this case you did pay to win.

[Kipper]

Um no, you paid for to get access to something quicker, it's not the same at all.

Besides, they may put BR requirements on some modules that do give you an advantage, which would negate the situation you described by setting it at a level where most people could have reasonably afforded it with auraxium (if they so choose).

[Firearms]

only because you have a OP weapon that does 100 times more damage then the standard one.

That doesn't fit in very well with the 20% mantra.

The Pay 2 Win argument is catch22 anyway. We all know that p2w means being able to buy an elite weapon/item that is not available via non payment. That's just a fact.
Making the same phrase fit a broader instance that happens to include cash is just anal (and much like the inane OMGOPBUFFnoNERF arguments, damaging if ppl in actual control listen too much)

If you drop down to the lowest rung you'll get p2w is a subscriber that gets faster cert against a non subscriber.....st00pid IMO

[SpottyGekko]

People complained endlessly about paying subs for MMO's.
Now F2P is the standard payment model (ironically), and people still complain endlessly because they can't actually play completely for free and still be equal to those that DO pay.

They insist that the Cash Shop should only sell items that are irrelevant to actual game play and progression. Of course, in that case the Cash Shop will generate pitiful revenue and the game will close down.

Each vehicle or infantry class has a fixed number of upgrade slots. Each slot has a variety of ALTERNATIVE things that can be equipped in it. So the "added power" that can be unlocked via certs is capped. One player can never stay ahead of another indefinitely, because sooner or later they will both spend the maximum allowed certs for one upgrade slot.

In a game that has 12v12 battles, 3 or 4 players with 25% advantage will most likely dominate. In PS2, we have 600v600v600 on one continent. If half of the players have a 25% advantage, it will most likely make very little difference. There are just too many interesting ways of dying when there's that many players in a relatively small area.

[SFJake]

I've never found either subscription -or- free to play fair.

So whatever.

Put a freakin' fee up front and deal with that (60$). Charge for "expansions" package every year or be not allowed to get the content of the next year (for 40$ or so). Remove all F2P and subscription bull, keep cosmetics for money for additional funding.

Everybody's ****** happy. Good money income. Happy fanbase. Give a "demo" like feature for people to get a glimpse of the game and have trial-like limits (but unlimited time). Don't call it F2P.

But they ain't that smart.

[Ipimpnoobs]

Upfront payments cause the amount of people needed for this game to work to diminish.

Sunrock has been preaching about unfair advantages. So what, as long as every person has access to it, there is no problem.

Every other f2p has a you must buy for the uber weapon. This game doesn't like the person above stated, who clearly got his sources crossed.


Your opinions imo are not valid as constructive because you say no, but do not provide an alternative solution.

Customers want everything free. Business's are in business to make money. It doesn't need to be a lose lose situation.

Here let me help you... My idea was to have player generated content (they will be implementing this by the way). This content could be sold to other players for Station cash. That cash could not only pay for a premium account which would make SOE happy but also put money in the players pocket. Imagine how far you could take this. You could even make a living off it, like players in eve online.

Now that is constructive and a win win.

Now you try...please.

[Sunrock]

That doesn't fit in very well with the 20% mantra.

The Pay 2 Win argument is catch22 anyway. We all know that p2w means being able to buy an elite weapon/item that is not available via non payment. That's just a fact.
Making the same phrase fit a broader instance that happens to include cash is just anal (and much like the inane OMGOPBUFFnoNERF arguments, damaging if ppl in actual control listen too much)

If you drop down to the lowest rung you'll get p2w is a subscriber that gets faster cert against a non subscriber.....st00pid IMO

No we all don't know that. And no that is not what pay to win means. Pay to win means you pay money to get an advantage. Same fucking deal back in the day with EQ where people payed real money to get some OP weapon that you could gind for. Back then it was considered cheating when a player sold it to an other play but its just fine now when the game company does the same thing? No its not. Its still as bad.

[Sunrock]

Customers want everything free. Business's are in business to make money. It doesn't need to be a lose lose situation.



I'm comparing the F2P business model to the monthly fee business model. And the monthly fee business model has more fair game play.

[Sunrock]

Is it true that males were required to chop off their balls to play EQ?

Only if you wanted to be server first. :p

[VikingKong]

Well that's because this IS a pay-to-win system...

Sorry, but a benefit that allows you to directly advance faster then your non-paying counterparts is paying for that advantage.
You're ignoring the fact that the "advances" don't effect your ability to kill or cap a base in the slightest. Where's the advantage? :doh:
Say you're the only one that pay SK for the dual photon canon and every one else waits to they have 12500 Aurixium
You can't buy guns with StationCash. It's Auraxium or nothing. You're arguing against something that exists only in your head.
No we all don't know that. And no that is not what pay to win means. Pay to win means you pay money to get an advantage.
That's nice and all, but wtf has it got to do with PS2? :confused:


It's amazing how much people can whine about a game they know so little about.

[Sunrock]

You can't buy guns with StationCash. It's Auraxium or nothing. You're arguing against something that exists only in your head.

In the beta? No you cant... But do you really believe that will be the case when the game go live? Hell no.

[Crator]

You can't buy guns with StationCash. It's Auraxium or nothing. You're arguing against something that exists only in your head.

Then why do they have a 'SC' tag on the weapons in the cash shop? They all currently have no value listed next to them but that's only cause we are in beta.

[VikingKong]

In the beta? No you cant... But do you really believe that will be the case when the game go live? Hell no.
That's what the devs had said, yeah. Either way, I fail to see how that could possibly be considered unfair. All the guns are equally capable of making things bleed.

[Crator]

That's what the devs had said, yeah. Either way, I fail to see how that could possibly be considered unfair. All the guns are equally capable of making things bleed.

This is just an example but they offer a heavy assault weapon that has lock-on capabilities to vehicles in the cash shop currently. I can only assume that this type of weapon won't be tagged to be bought with SC and only available to be bought with in-game currency. But right now they do show a 'SC' next to it in the cash shop so it looks pay-to-win.

[WilliamB]

Anyone know if the new rate will be the same as before or lower?

[Sunrock]

That's what the devs had said, yeah. Either way, I fail to see how that could possibly be considered unfair. All the guns are equally capable of making things bleed.

All the guns are equally capable of making things bleed? Should I read that as all weapons have the same TTK? If so I don't agree.

But if you mean this is a FPS game and skill is worth allot more then your gear in this game then a 'WoW clone' then yea. And that is way I'm ok with this game have some degree of P2W. Because all I need is a knife to kill :p

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y152/Sunrock/Planetside%202/PS2%20Knife%20Icon_zps02c593e5.jpg

[Raka Maru]

This is just an example but they offer a heavy assault weapon that has lock-on capabilities to vehicles in the cash shop currently. I can only assume that this type of weapon won't be tagged to be bought with SC and only available to be bought with in-game currency. But right now they do show a 'SC' next to it in the cash shop so it looks pay-to-win.

If you can also buy the weapon with auraxium as well as SC, then it's not PTW. Cash shop is still closed, but I'll be buying stuff if the price is right.

[SFJake]

If you can also buy the weapon with auraxium as well as SC, then it's not PTW

That is not true, period. Stop with that non-sense.

[Saintlycow]

Its fine the way it is. Now all they have to do is work on Auraxium gain rate and they're set.

Seriously, If you gained auraxium too fast, they run out of content and no one pays for shit. If you price it too low, no one plays exept the people who pay. Not quite pay to win, but close enough.

Allowing weapons to be purchased using real money is fine. As long as the balance is good

[skateboardjesus]

It'll be fine once they get more feedback on the way things are during testing. Lots of people have extreme reactions to everything.

[Galron]

ITT: Tards and idealists that don't know what PTW actually is.

Newsflash! I bought alpha squad, will most likely sub, and will probably hit up some double or triple SC days. SoE is in the process of making a wicked game, and with my current situation I very much want for them to 'shut up and take my money'.

Ive played FTP games that hid their one hit kill elite super weapons/loadouts behind either a giant wall of cash (lol moonbreakers nice try) or a looooooooooonnnnnngcat grind. (which reminds me I need to uninstall Tribes:Ascend). Both of these options drove me away from their game that I already spent the time to download/research and probably would have kept playing had their developers had their shit together when they put their revenue plan in place.

With planetside 2 they absolutely dont have the first problem, and the second problem is only a matter of balance. (can the aurax grind to get a weapon not feel like a month of playtime for one damn weapon?).

Assuming they hit the right balance on the latter, I see this as the default FTP revenue model for maximization of revenue and player retention. And no, its not pay to win. Its pay to support the damn game so people have the option of freeloading if they want to.

[Raka Maru]

ITT: Tards and idealists that don't know what PTW actually is.

Newsflash! I bought alpha squad, will most likely sub, and will probably hit up some double or triple SC days. SoE is in the process of making a wicked game, and with my current situation I very much want for them to 'shut up and take my money'.

Ive played FTP games that hid their one hit kill elite super weapons/loadouts behind either a giant wall of cash (lol moonbreakers nice try) or a looooooooooonnnnnngcat grind. (which reminds me I need to uninstall Tribes:Ascend). Both of these options drove me away from their game that I already spent the time to download/research and probably would have kept playing had their developers had their shit together when they put their revenue plan in place.

With planetside 2 they absolutely dont have the first problem, and the second problem is only a matter of balance. (can the aurax grind to get a weapon not feel like a month of playtime for one damn weapon?).

Assuming they hit the right balance on the latter, I see this as the default FTP revenue model for maximization of revenue and player retention. And no, its not pay to win. Its pay to support the damn game so people have the option of freeloading if they want to.

Amen!