So does anyone else think the class system has failed?

[EVILoHOMER]

I think my biggest problem with it is how situational it is. If you're going to pilot a vehicle then you HAVE to be an engineer, if you aren't then you're at a disadvantage because you cannot easily stop and repair your vehicle. If you want to raid a base then you go light assault so you can easily jet pack to where you want to get to. Sure you can roll other classes but light assault just makes it so easy and as you can cap with one person there is no downside.

I find if I want to defend then I have to be HA because you'll be rushed with tanks and the only way to get rid of them is more tanks or the rocket launcher. Cloakers really have no role IMO, they're either snipers or now just run around with shotguns getting a massive amount of kills. With hacking not in the game and everyone being able to cap, I don't see why they're in the game. Healers again just seem pointless, the healing mechanic is not fun and it is just easier to keep respawning rather than wasting time looking for a healer. Tbh they should have just copied the BF system of throwing a bag on the floor like they've done with ammo.


I think the best thing about Planetside was how Armour inventory space was the restriction. You weren't restricted by class mechanics, you could only do what you could fit on you. So this really balanced stuff out by itself and was for more intuitive than class restrictions. I'd just run to a term and make loadouts that I like and save them, it was far better than being restricted by a class. Now I basically have to pick a class to what I'm doing like saying piloting a vehicle and I have other abilities I don't want and wish I could spec to something else.


I would love to see the return of custom loadouts only being restricted by inventory size. I'd love to see the return of looting the enemies weapons and having to find their ammo to keep using a weapon. I'd love to see hacking back, it would be great if a cloaker could hack enemy terminals so you could use them or hacking their vehicles etc.

[Malorn]

I think its working out fine.

[Firearms]

It's a disgrace. The COD kiddies can have engineering flying cloaked medics with anti tank capabilities, why can't we!?


Fake edit: Sry wrong thread....:rolleyes:

[FortySe7en]

EvilHomer, have you noticed that in the past 4 days you have made about 10 posts and every single one of them is you bitching about something in PS2.

The class systems work exactly as they are intended. Saying snipers shouldn't be in the game, I pretty much stopped reading after that.

[Carver]

I think it's fine.

Why was the planetside 1 system so much better? Everyone that was a driver/pilot was in light armor full of repair gear. 95% of people on foot were in heavy armor with heavy assault weapons.

I think there is a lot more variety on the battlefield now. If you want those heavy weapons (or a jetpack) you have to make real sacrifices for them, and you'll require a little help from your team for ammo and heals.

[Mordicant]

I have no problem with medic. I would like a 'stand the fuck still' voice Macro but other than that give me that XP.

[PredatorFour]

Everyone that was a driver/pilot was in light armor full of repair gear. 95% of people on foot were in heavy armor with heavy assault weapons.

You are completely wrong there. Many others would tell you the same. I was always in agile, for `agility`. Many, many others across all empires did the same. We didn`t just stack our suits full of rep gear cos we used a mossie/ tank to get around.

PS 1 `s system was great because it restricted gear you could have, but made it so you couldn`t have all the best gear without ammo restrictions. You had to find the balance to suit your playstyle then you could save 10 different `loadouts` tailored to your needs on the field. Then there was looting so when you ran out of ammo(or wanted a better gun) you just looked through the enemies corpse you just killed. `Hey! i have Korndemon`s Jackhammer!` ...it added something extra to the game.

[Bravix]

Class system works as intended. I liked PS1 style, but this certainly feels more balanced. Gives everyone a role too.

They do need to add hacking back in though. Make cloakers hack 2x as fast (or faster depending on hack length). Have hacking be a universal cert.

So if hacking took a base of 2 minutes, you have hacking lvl 2 or something so it only takes 1 min 30. But if you go cloaker, it automatically halves that to 45 seconds.

[Bags]

It's terrible and hasn't increased teamwork at all from my experience. It's just an easy way to squeeze money and play time out of the players by forcing you to grind out scopes/weapons and buy skins for multiple characters instead of buying 1 skin for your character.

[PredatorFour]

It's just an easy way to squeeze money and play time out of the players by forcing you to grind out scopes/weapons and buy skins for multiple characters instead of buying 1 skin for your character.

^That there is the true reason classes are in this F2P game.

[PoisonTaco]

I just wish the assault rifle wasn't tied down exclusively to the medic and all the heavy assault has is an LMG. I'd like to have the heavy assault's AV/AA capabilities with the reliability of an assault rifle. I love the Cycler and that's why I play Medic. I just wish I could have that weapon and do more than just heal people.

[Shenyen]

@EVILoHOMER

You seem to forget, that the abilities of players in PS1 were not only tied to their inventory space, but also to their Battlerank/Certs.

If you wanted to drive a tank, you HAD to have the Repair-certs, if you wanted to play in an infiltrator suit, you HAD to have the hacking certs - well, not necessarily, but what else would you do in that suit besides sometimes killing snipers with knifes - oh, you had to get the knife boost implants for that, too.

Unless you were BR 25, you had to make compromises when choosing a role to play.

For many players, except long time veterans, the jack-of-all-trades was nonexistant, they had to choose setups you would now describe as "situational" - well, except that those were not situational, but permanent.

So even if at every single point in time your abilities in PS2 are restricted by your choice of class - one moment later these abilities can be completely replaced by other abilities, simply by changing the class.

If they would change the system in PS2 and remove classes and add customizable ability-setups, for all those who whould never (or only after years) reach a higher BR, that system would be a step backwards.

I have no problem with medic. I would like a 'stand the fuck still' voice Macro but other than that give me that XP.

Hell yeah, i would love such a macro^^

[Infernalis]

More balanced since it's easier to balance, easier to identify on the battlefield. If there are problems it lies within a class/gameplay itself (cloackers having no real role anymore).

[Tatwi]

I think its working out fine.

Owned. :lol:

Seriously though, there are a few things that I wish I could trade off to make the game play fit my desired play style,

Engineer Class
- Trade MANA Turret for SKEP Rocket Launcher
- Trade Explosives for Basic Medic Gun

That would pretty much suit me just fine 100% of the time. Perhaps the ammo + SKEP would be OP, but it's not like I am ever that far from more ammo anyhow.

One thing about the class system that is a bit silly is how quickly we can switch roles. It's a double edged sword, because in some cases I really like to be able to switch out quickly, but a lot of the time it just feels like we're negating the strategy aspect of the game by responding with the most powerful possible response, rather than adapting on the fly and making due with the units we've already placed on the field. In this vein, the /suicide command needs to go and there needs to be a 2 minute respawn timer when you kill yourself or a squad/platoon member kills you. "Everyone suicide and..." should not be a valid tactic, because it destroys the flow and function of front line warfare.

[Redshift]

The problem is it's all become rock paper scissors. You don't really have a choice in what you roll now, you just have to take what you need at the time.

At least in PS1 i had to choose to take an MCG and just hope i could sprint across the field to get in CQC, or i could think "i'm on med duty i'd better swap out my spare deci and ammo for med juice". The choice that exists now is irrelevant, the current certs don't really change anything worthwhile enough to call it character development either.

[Tatwi]

The problem is it's all become rock paper scissors. You don't really have a choice in what you roll now, you just have to take what you need at the time.

At least in PS1 i had to choose to take an MCG and just hope i could sprint across the field to get in CQC, or i could think "i'm on med duty i'd better swap out my spare deci and ammo for med juice". The choice that exists now is irrelevant, the current certs don't really change anything worthwhile enough to call it character development either.

That's a good point with the classes, but the vehicles have some useful progression. One thing that bugs me with the latest patch is the progression with scopes. All I want is the reflex. Why force me to first buy two other scopes I will never use? That's not progression, it's a nuisance. "But you can use those other scopes until you earn the reflex", but, I wont, because I don't like them...

[Helwyr]

PS2's Class system is pretty terrible, it offers the worst of both MMORPG and FPS's systems. We get the grind of the RPG and to some extent the power divide between new and old characters. We get the everybody can do everything of the FPS and consequent lack of character specialization, especially after a year or so of the game being live.

Not everything in PS1 was great, but in terms of character development PS1s Cert/Inventory system was hands down superior to what we have in PS2. It didn't feel like a grind to get to BR20/23, there was real character specialization at those battle ranks (people saying there wasn't are talking out their rear ends). There was real flexibility in choosing your character's abilities and loadouts. Everyone couldn't do everything on a whim, so we would rarely get situations as we do in PS2 where masses of people all pull tanks or all pull AA, or Snipers or whatever else they felt best suited that particular moment of gameplay.

[SixShooter]

I think its working out fine.

Ditto

Never liked the Resident Evil style inventory playing Tetris with ammo.

That's a good point with the classes, but the vehicles have some useful progression. One thing that bugs me with the latest patch is the progression with scopes. All I want is the reflex. Why force me to first buy two other scopes I will never use? That's not progression, it's a nuisance. "But you can use those other scopes until you earn the reflex", but, I wont, because I don't like them...

Same here. I really don't want to waste certs on shit I'm not going to use ever, especialy the flashlight for the rail progression.

[Marinealver]

no because there are other things that have way more fail.

Base design
World design
Vehicle design
ect...

[Babyfark McGeez]

That you now have to cert stuff you don't want, to be able to cert the stuff you do want is news to me, the last time i looked into scopes i was able to just cert for what i want with all options avaible to me from the start.

A progression system in the certs / equipment part sounds like the worst thing they could do imo, it begs the question why they would come up with such a horrible flawed system where you HAVE to spend precious certs on crap you will never use.
And unfortunately the only answer i can come up with right now is that they plan on selling a lot of cert-increasing / boosting items.

[Valcron]

I think its working out fine.


How do you figure? So you're telling me an open class system where players can equip pretty much any weapon and give players complete freedom is better than a restrictive system that lets you only equip certain weapons?

You can't sit here and actually believe that restrictive game systems are actually better than open ones, it's just not possible.

[Realmofdarkness]

The problem is it's all become rock paper scissors. You don't really have a choice in what you roll now, you just have to take what you need at the time.

At least in PS1 i had to choose to take an MCG and just hope i could sprint across the field to get in CQC, or i could think "i'm on med duty i'd better swap out my spare deci and ammo for med juice". The choice that exists now is irrelevant, the current certs don't really change anything worthwhile enough to call it character development either.

I think paper scissors is exactly the effect that WILL balance the game. There is never a situation where only one role is needed. If an assault on a base rolls alot of HA guys then Im pretty sure they will scream for ammo supply and medics. Players who roll sniper probably like to be snipers and hence most of the times always rolls sniper class independent of the situation.

Current solution will give more variation on the battlefield in my opinion and what ive seen so far it works very well. A minority of snipers,medics and engineers and majority of HA and light assault.

[Rat]

I like the class system, but I dont like the fact that anyone can change to any class at any given time, you should have to buy into a class to specialize in it, the latest cloaker infestation is a perfect example, if people had to buy into that class at the cost of not being able access another class we wouldnt see near as much spam. The same goes with vehicles...I dont feel that we need to go back to the inventory system tho.

[Aaron]

I would like to experience more specialization and character development than what the class system offers. I'm not getting a very strong sense of a "this is my character build" type of thing.

Currently, everyone has all the stuff, but you add a little on as you go. Not terrible, but could be much better.

[Canaris]

actually I don't mind the class system at all, quite like the ease of jumping from style of troopers to another.
As Marinealver listed there are far bigger fish to fry in beta atm and I would rate those way above the class system as needing attention.

[Qwan]

I think the only problem that I have is with the vehicle load out. I spend certs for gadgets for example the ams sunderer combo. It would be nice to also have the radar cloak as well. This way my ams sunderer doesnt show up on enemy radar, as my buddy's spawn at it. At the current set up I have to choose between ams or not showing up on radar. Or even the resupply and repair sunderer combo would be nice that way I can follow tanks and support them. Im just saying they should consider giving us slots and letting us decide which combo of gadgets to add on. Not just one at a time.

[Redshift]

I think paper scissors is exactly the effect that WILL balance the game. There is never a situation where only one role is needed.

It's bad FPS design and people will get really bored, really fast. No one likes getting into a 1v1 and knowing they can't physically win.

You can't try to balance it as a group because then game balance is ruined as soon as you're not in a group, which again will lead to people becoming frustrated.

[Figment]

In a FPS game the better player should always have a chance to win. Not being able to fight back is never good design.

Players aren't NPCs. As they're humans you have to account for their emotions in a game. If they feel useless, utterly incinerated without a fighting chance, they will not get satisfaction out of the game. No satisfaction == ...?

[Shenyen]

As a Combat Medic, i have a chance against anything but a MAX - but without heavier weapons, those were a PITA in Planetside 1,too.
I guess with some more cert points in stuff that isn't used to heal others, like C4, those can be brought down too.

What i can't kill is tanks and heavier aircraft - but i couldn't kill those with my hacker, medic or whatever builds in PS1.

I don't know what gives you the idea that any character could kill any other character, given "superior" skills.

There were tons of balancing problems between empires or weapons.

[Realmofdarkness]

It should always be a combination of skill and weapon choice who wins a 1vs1. Ofc a Ha will kill a med with ease if he shoot you with a rocket. But a med has a very big chance of killing a HA if he spots the HA first. A game where everyone is equal so really booring. Besides, a HA should get most of his XP from kills where a medic should get if from heals and some kills. different playstyles = more fun.

[Ghoest9]

No.

It has not "failed" at all.

It lacks some cool aspects of PS 1 - but even so it is a good functioning system.
If i was making a game from scratch i would go the PS1 route - but the route they chose for Ps2 does not make it a bad game at all.

[xSlideShow]

I agree I think they are making a mistake the more I play it. Really they are copying something when they had a great position in the past. They are in fact taking away something they could be using to their advantage by having a free form inventory. Even if it was hard to balance, from a merely marketing standpoint they would do better.

No other FPS that I know of has had such a thing. And it's aspect for this kind of game to have. Also it would appear to be a very strong spot in the minds of many players of Planetside 1. I think they would be wise to relook some of their decisions.

[Rolfski]

Coming from BF3, I have no problem with it. I think it works well in team play as you easily adapt squad tactics to the situation ("lets go all heavies to take out that tank column")

[Redshift]

Coming from BF3, I have no problem with it. I think it works well in team play as you easily adapt squad tactics to the situation ("lets go all heavies to take out that tank column")

Thats exactly the opposite of proper teamwork, that's a bunch of people picking whatever kills the nearest thing to the terminal.

That's just shallow mindless zerging, it will not keep people interested for long periods of time

[Figment]

Coming from BF3, I have no problem with it. I think it works well in team play as you easily adapt squad tactics to the situation ("lets go all heavies to take out that tank column")

That isn't squad tactics, that's being forced into a role, as you could otherwise not compete. Meanwhile you can't support others with another needed role.

True squad tactics ia about being able to setup for a variety of likely situations you may come across and planning ahead. Not react to what happens to be there and having to react in predictable ways. Certainly not about making your own unique contributions to the team effort.

The thing that isn't stimulated by this class system is creativity or "the way YOU want to play". Which as I recall, was the one thing Smedley said the game would do for you.

Right now, the class system does anything but let me play the way I want to or adapt to even a short string of situations.

[PClownPosse]

That isn't squad tactics, that's being forced into a role, as you could otherwise not compete. Meanwhile you can't support others with another needed role.

True squad tactics ia about being able to setup for a variety of likely situations you may come across and planning ahead. Not react to what happens to be there and having to react in predictable ways. Certainly not about making your own unique contributions to the team effort.

The thing that isn't stimulated by this class system is creativity or "the way YOU want to play". Which as I recall, was the one thing Smedley said the game would do for you.

Right now, the class system does anything but let me play the way I want to or adapt to even a short string of situations.

I agree. This is my biggest gripe as well, at least from what I've seen so far (which isn't much to be honest). There's really no ability for people to be either wide open in capabilities/equipment or to be extremely focused in regards to what you can equip. I really dislike the take it or leave it classifications.

[texico]

Coming from BF3, I have no problem with it. I think it works well in team play as you easily adapt squad tactics to the situation ("lets go all heavies to take out that tank column")

You may not realize if you haven't played PS1, but the Inventory system lets you do that anyway if that's what you want. All your squad can just save a "heavy" loadout in the "favourite" tab and load it up instantly at a terminal, EXACTLY like you would with the current class system.


Seriously, I've made this point a couple of times, but there is nothing to gain from the class system in terms of playstyle; anybody wanting to play a stereotypical "class" (for example medic) with the Inventory System can just build an inventory with all the typical weapons and equipment a medic would have and save it in one of the Favourites slots. THAT is a "class" system right there.

[james]

My only problem with the class system as it seems only 2 classes are really worth playing, heavy assault, and engineer. The lmg from playing with it is just better. And the max some times

[Hmr85]

The more I play PS2 the more I miss the old PS1 style setup. So much more versatility. Being confined to 5 select roles without the ability to truly customize your character is somewhat depressing. I miss my old Spec op configs and HA load outs. :/

[Mox]

I would suggest a system with equipment slots. Something a little more flexible than the class system

[Crator]

I think they could keep the class system but still allow players to mix-n-match certain equipment from other classes using load-outs. The limiting factor being battle rank. This would allow for more control over the items that can be used in this fashion. They could also make the cross-class items work in a lesser fashion then they do if using it under the main class.

[Rolfski]

You may not realize if you haven't played PS1, but the Inventory system lets you do that anyway if that's what you want. All your squad can just save a "heavy" loadout in the "favourite" tab and load it up instantly at a terminal, EXACTLY like you would with the current class system.

Well, if the old system did allow for quick swapping load-outs to respond to multiple situations (which imo is a part of squad tactics), what would be the reason then for SOE to change this? There sure must be some advantage within this class system, right?

[Figment]

Well, if the old system did allow for quick swapping load-outs to respond to multiple situations (which imo is a part of squad tactics), what would be the reason then for SOE to change this? There sure must be some advantage within this class system, right?

The sole reason they changed it, was the complaint of "universal soldiers" and generic setups. That included advanced medics and engineers healing and repairing (we had armour to be repaired instead of shields) players at the same time (technically they still had to switch out gear, but they could do the both with the same suit setup).

What those complaints didn't say was that those people doing that, had to give up valuable inventory space for that: less ammo, more support items or more variety of ammo reducing overall ammo per weapon type. They generalised at the cost of sustained fire or usage in any specialty, including guns.

Now, the reason that these occured in PS1 was because of developers not listening to players on several key points when they made changes to the game. Because initially, this didn't happen a lot as players simply could not afford it: it would cost too many certification points to specialise in several support roles. If they did nonetheless, they were dependend on other players in terms of vehicles and other support certs, or in terms of other weapons.


Now, the problem started a little during BR20, but was well under control. At BR20, you had 26 cert points at maximum level (note: you would start with 4 at BR1 iirc, you would get one implant slot at BR6, 12 and 18).

The complained setup was (Advanced [+2cp]) Medic [3cp], Engineer [3cp], Medium Assault [2cp] and Heavy Assault [4cp], Reinforced Exosuit [3cp], Mosquito [3cp] (maybe Reaver [2cp], some would include Anti-Vehicular [3cp] in that as well). That setup cost you (2+) 3, 3, 2+4, 3, 3 (+2 +3) certifications, or a total of 18-25 points total. That's actually already 69.2% without the certs in brackets, to 96.1% of their entire potential of certifications and left them with 8 to 1 free certifications to make their character a bit more unique (!).

That's not a lot more to work with and they therefore were generalists, but very dependent on others. Hence why most people didn't really make their setup like this at the time, but chose a bit more unique setup, often staying with basic medic (no reviving) and picking Combat Engineering (2cp - spitfires and mines) or other weapons (sniping [3cp] or grenade launchers [3cp]) or hacking support certs (3 + 2 cp) and of course all kinds of other vehicles.

As you can tell however, most of these people could not afford swift hacking (3-5 points) and without Anti-Vehicular, they'd be hardpressed to kill MAXes indoors unless they had proper heavy assault bullets loaded (gold ammo).

Typical implants were Surge and Audio Amplifier for this setup with an extra slot. But really, there were no other guns to specialise into aside from Sniper Rifles or Grenade Launchers as all medium weapons were in ONE certificate of 2 points called Medium Assault and all heavy weapons in ONE certificate called Heavy Assault. So it's not really surprising that a lot of people opted for the 2+4 cert as a basis. So how can one possibly complain about that simply because lack of choice made sure everyone had the same-ish guns?

If you wanted to cert into infiltration, you'd spend about 80% of your certs into infiltration usable/related support items, weapons and vehicles and all your implants on that.

Similarly, if you went infantry + full engineer + tanks, being a medic or pilot wasn't really that much of an option. A lot of people couldn't even afford the Reinforced Exosuit, let alone a MAX suit. Typically it was OR OR, not AND AND. Above all though, many could not afford a lot of personal transportation and therefore group transport units were not just viable, they were well used. Of course aircraft were used a lot, but they weren't used almost exclusively as at some points later in the game.



Now, where things started to go wrong was BR23-25. They added some more certifications points both for new players AND for the ranks 21-23. 24 gave a new cosmetic hat and BR25 a new cosmetic suit. Even if you liked having an all gold NC armour *sniff*.

Anyway. The reason they did this was because they wanted to give new players a bit more of a chance to try things out and give them some more options, while adding in new equipment as well. The devs idea then was that since people would need to get access to the new equipment - which was highly specialised due to the entire support tree for hacking and engineering in total now costing 10 points - people would need more cert points. What they forgot is that where 4/26 points was 15% of your certifications, with half a dozen more points available (and Rexo becoming free!), suddenly expensive certifications like Heavy Assault would become FAR MORE CHEAPER.

It meant that far MORE people gained access to the following certifications because they could now afford it:

- MAXes (even UniMAX [6cp], all three MAX suits: AA [2cp]/AV[3cp] and especially AI [3cp] at a discount)
- Heavy Assault [4cp]
- Aircav (Mosquito and Reaver)
- BFRs [8cp on top of tanks]
- Advanced Medic [5cp total]
- Advanced Hacking [5cp total], till then had been a true specialty mostly used by infiltrators

Now note that certs in PS1 are, unlike the class system in PS2, not related to suits (aside from purchasing their availability), but related to your character. They are innate abilities and can use them as long as you hold the proper gear.

Then later, they made the Reaver even cheaper, as if it wasn't overused already, by adding it as an end of the line option for buggies/mosquito combi cert. That again freed up extra cert points. By this time, most every player had their own transport, but still at least group vehicles like tanks, amphibious APCs and buggies had some redeeming qualities as not everyone could afford personal transports and even if they could, they'd be less powerful.

Then later, they said they'd thought about adding BR40. Now at first, BR40 was supposed to be about bragging rights. The community had explicitly stated to the devs that there should not be more certifications handed out, because the game was already at balance breaking point. SOE promised they'd not add more certification points.


Then when BR40 was actually introduced, every two ranks, you gained a new certification point... That was stupid as hell already. But wait, there was more! It was hinted there'd be a special reward at BR40. So veterans were laughing and said "A merit badge! Or maybe one free support vehicle like an AMS? Cause they wouldn't be stupid enough to give out all weapons, vehicles and suits and support certifications etc at once, now would they?".


And what happened? They did... (Note, that 'dev', since there was only one responsible for that, is still working on PS2). Now, as I said before, a lot of these things are innate abilities. So suddenly regardless of who got to the control console, you'd only have 20 seconds to keep it from being rehacked. Before, you knew to just kill the guy with the blue beam, because everyone else took a minute to hack it. It changed everything.

Suddenly, MAXes all over the place. Suddenly Aircraft all over the place. Suddenly, next to nobody used Agile suits (unless pilot or driver) or medium assault, since everyone had free rexos and cheap Heavy Assault. Everyone had their own transport, so transport units, which were already somewhat obsolete since BR23, were now rendered completely useless were it not for some situational redeeming features that had little to do with their original group transport design (like minefield sweeping with an EMP blast).

Now of course, at this time you would have a lot of setups that literally could do every support role. That had access to every vehicle. They now had jacks of all trades. And yes, that's a huge complaint from the PS1 veteran base. :/


THAT was the problem with the PS1 cert system: the second and third generation (if not third and fourth generation) of SOE developers for PS1 simply had no clue to what they were doing in terms of certification balance. The rest of the original team had either been fired, or had left in anger without knowledge transfer in either case.


So this new generation of developers, is actually the what, seventh generation of PS developers? They have absolutely no idea about the original intentions behind all the systems of PlanetSide 1 and how it worked in practice. You can tell by watching the design process take shape and how they then have to be called back by players on rather basic things at times. :/

The problem hence is, they heard complaints about "jacks of all trades" and went "oh then we must prevent any and all overlap" as a knee-jerk reaction to this complaint mentioned earlier. But the problem is not "some overlap where you can do some things in one life and a couple more things over multiple lifes" (BR20), or perhaps not even "some overlap where you can do some things in one life and quite a few things over multiple lifes" (BR23-25), but it's being able to "do far too many things in the same life and everything in multiple lives" (BR40). The system we got now is "far too little in the same life and everything in multiple lives".


Does that explain it? What bothers me is the people that pretend BR40 or even the BR25 situation is all there's ever been and misrepresenting the issue with the system.

Could some exclusivity to suit types have helped the system be better? Yes. That would be a proper refining of the free-cert system, a little bit closer to classes, but it wouldn't be an overreaction. What I find really annoying, is that the multiple-life issue is worsened and often completely ignored by those same people, since they only look at what you can do in ONE life. At least in PS1 not everyone is a BR40 from the start...



________________________________


So to sum up certs and classes from many a veteran's perspective:


Balanced PS1 (BR20): some overlap in one life, limited amount of additional options over multiple lives
Okay, but at breaking point PS1 (BR23-25): quite some overlap in one life, quite a few more options over multiple lifes
Broken PS1 (BR40): lots of overlap in one life, full options over multiple lives
Flawed overreaction PS2 (Classes): no overlap in one life, full options over multiple lives

[Shogun]

the free form inventory of ps1 was superior to the class system.

the only problem was the br40 jack of all trades issue!

now we are restricted to just one role. one very very small role, like evilhomer stated.
this sucks balls.
especially engineer and medic are very disappointing!
in ps1 a dedicated engineer could totally protect a base with a big field of CE like 25 spitfires AND 25 mines AND 25 sensors. now engineers are limited to a single mine OR one manaturret (that cannot even autoshoot or be operated by anyone else) OR something else.
and to make it totally useless the stuff even disappears when you change the class.

engineer is a total failure! and my favorite playstyle has died with it.

same goes for infiltrator. the ps1 infiltrator playstyle is not existant any more.
my second favorite playstyle!
infiltrators need things to hack, only small weapons and a infinite cloak similar to the ps1 cloak.

i would still prefer to get rid of the classes and go back to ps1 style.
there surely are other ways to prevent the heavy armor av pilots with repair and medic tool one man armies without restricting the legit playstyles.

[Hamma]

I think its working out fine.

Likewise - I don't think it has failed at all.

[PClownPosse]

The thing that bothers me the most is the equipment restrictions in regards to light/heavy/engineer/medic. Really annoying for me.

The freedom to equip any gun with any "class" (or "role" to put it loosely) was a nice feature in PS1 that, based upon what I know so far (which still isn't much), isn't possible in PS2, and I liked that capability a lot.

Ammo also is also annoying. No backpacks to replenish yourself in the field means you're leashed to an engineer or a terminal.

[Figment]

the free form inventory of ps1 was superior to the class system.

the only problem was the br40 jack of all trades issue!

now we are restricted to just one role. one very very small role, like evilhomer stated.
this sucks balls.
especially engineer and medic are very disappointing!
in ps1 a dedicated engineer could totally protect a base with a big field of CE like 25 spitfires AND 25 mines AND 25 sensors. now engineers are limited to a single mine OR one manaturret (that cannot even autoshoot or be operated by anyone else) OR something else.
and to make it totally useless the stuff even disappears when you change the class.

engineer is a total failure! and my favorite playstyle has died with it.

same goes for infiltrator. the ps1 infiltrator playstyle is not existant any more.
my second favorite playstyle!
infiltrators need things to hack, only small weapons and a infinite cloak similar to the ps1 cloak.

i would still prefer to get rid of the classes and go back to ps1 style.
there surely are other ways to prevent the heavy armor av pilots with repair and medic tool one man armies without restricting the legit playstyles.

Like allowing just one tool or limiting the amount of inventory space and splitting between support and ammo inventory, ability inventory etc? ;)

http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=46088