Does anyone else miss ANTs?

[wave]

I really feel that it added a more dynamic element to PS1. Just another of the many things that are not in PS2 that reduce the depth of the game. I guess this new iteration of game is really going to be more FPS than RTS.

Now that I have had my whine thread I will not make another.

[Bags]

They were cool in heavy base sieges, tedious otherwise.

[ringring]

Yes ....

[Marinealver]

I miss other things more.

Time to go back on to planetside 1 to drown my sorrows away.

[SixShooter]

When ants existed many hated making ant runs. Wait for it.. wait for it.. Someone is going to post how they logged onto the game for years just to make ant runs. TROLLOL.

Ant runs were all I ever did, never even fired a shot for years....
:rofl::lol::rofl:

I don't miss ants but I miss the little games within the game, that ants, modules, oshur islands, and llu runs brought.

Other than ants, everything else you've listed did not come into PS1 until the "bending" well after launch. There's no reason to think that stuff like that won't be introduced further down the road.
:cheers:

[maradine]

I intensely disliked ANT runs, but am not opposed to a similar mechanic replacing it. I suggested having to ferry drop-in replacements for shield gens in some thread or other.

Basically, less Desert Bus, more combat drop.

[Thomas]

I remember one of my funniest memories of PS1 was when an ANT was dropped out of a galaxy from the top of the map right onto the base wall where half my squad were standing. I guess I miss them but 90% of the time they were just tedious.

I'd rather have a system where the base starts to lose power and go neutral if it isn't connected to a friendly hex for a while.

[Illtempered]

ANT hotdrops and ANT races into a last-stand base were some of the most exciting times of the game for me...especially when it took large coordination to get it done, like air cover for the Gal from the warpgate, popping reveal to see if any cloakers were waiting by the silo with an OS ready, and clearing the silo of enemy CE, which usually took a coordinated rush from inside the base.

[EVILoHOMER]

I made ANT runs for the whole 3 months I played in 2003 until a patch ruined ANT runs and so I quit because SOE dumbed down the game. I hate PS2 now because it feels like some dumbed down COD clone because bases don't have power.

[Tiberius]

I loved the dynamic of a base going neutral in a big fight if the empire couldn't get an ANT in, it broke gridlock in big fights.

Bringing an ANT into a hot LZ was really fun. I always volunteered for it, especially when it was so hot you had to drop it in with a galaxy.

They definitely need them for the big bases.

[Hosp]

I loved the dynamic of a base going neutral in a big fight if the empire couldn't get an ANT in, it broke gridlock in big fights.

Bringing an ANT into a hot LZ was really fun. I always volunteered for it, especially when it was so hot you had to drop it in with a galaxy.

They definitely need them for the big bases.

This.

[Timealude]

Heres one argument I have against ants, I think the newer people to PS will find it off putting and instead of actually going out and grabbing one to back fuel bases they will just move with the zerg like they normally do...I saw a shining example of that today.....

I was a lone infiltrator at dahaka and i was picking off targets when i saw a AMS. Well I went and followed it behind the base and yelled out in region chat that there was an AMS there. Only 2 people showed up while the rest played around like idiots and it resulted in them taking back the point as well getting the shields back up while everyone just sat around doing nothing till it was too late and they took the base back and pushed us back. If you were to yell for someone to grab an ANT in this game i dont think alot of them would leave just for the fact they would miss out on the cert points awarded.

I loved the ANT in ps1, but in ps2 I dont think it would work because there arent that many people still willing to play as a team.

[fod]

i miss them :(

[Mox]

I liked ant runs and hunting them. I would suggest to bring a similar mechanic back into the game.

[Captain1nsaneo]

Ants are part of a larger system that's currently absent. Mainly the ability to attack behind lines and draining with its taste of covert opts. Was talking with an old outfitmate today and he mentioned that there's nothing in the game right now that after a several hour fight you can just load up and get a change of pace by doing.

The game is very focused on combat and support roles that aren't on the front line really don't exist. This along with no infiltrators means that there are no roles that low FPS players can do well.

[Rolfski]

We're not all PS1 vets here, please explain ANT runs.

[PredatorFour]

All bases in PS had a power source called NTU. When topped up the bases would be 100%. When the base got low it needed an ANT (small vehicle, no weapons) to carry NTU harvested from a warpgate to the base to stop it going neutral. If the base went neutral an enemy faction could move in and hack/ try to take the base. So even if you didnt have a direct link to the base(lattice system) you could use spec ops to blow everything in the base to drain it of NTU, then fill it with your own ant whilst your team had hacked the base.

This allowed for some hero ant runs when your base was overwhelmed by the enemy and about to go neutral. A galaxy or lodestar would fly in and drop the ant at the NTU silo to refill just before the defenders ran out of rescources.

[Captain1nsaneo]

We're not all PS1 vets here, please explain ANT runs.

I'll add a few more details but PredatorFour has covered most of it.

PS1 bases have basically 3 states, friendly, neutral, enemy as opposed to PS2 bases which are just friendly or enemy. They also have a power percentage that ranges from 100% to 0%. Bases use their power to repair parts of the base that are damage or destroyed. So if the turret or equipment terminals in the base are damaged the base will automatically repair them with some of its fuel. No power and the base goes green or neutral.

ANTs were fairly tough little 1 man vehicles that had enough to fill 2 bases from 0% to 100% and took a while to fill to give the sense that you're actually filling a lot of resources. If you knew this ratio and time was REALLY important then you'd only fill half way before loading up or making a run for it to the base.

This mechanic did several things. It gave a role for support players (charging the base gave 20 BEP [battle EXP] per 1% to everyone in the ANT driver's squad), it gave a fall back mechanic when the defenders of a base were holed-up so well that you couldn't force them out, and it gave a way to circumvent the lattice system taking a base that you wouldn't normally be able to attack.

The epic ANT runs that most people talk about are regarding the holed-up scenario. You could load small vehicles into galaxies and then air drop them. So you'd fill up an ANT in a warpgate and then fly it over a base that was being sieged that was about to hit 0% and bail out in an attempt to fill the silo and power the base.

There are also times where this system punished lack of team play as when you were about to cap a base and it was low on NTU/fuel there was a chance that the base would go neutral and your hack would fail because there wasn't any power and you wouldn't get any exp for the capture.

This mechanic led to cat and mouse games where you had to protect your ANT until you were sure you could fill safely while enemies actively sought to prevent bases being filled.

One of my favorite stories heavily involves the NTU fuel system. VS were locked out of the good fights due to pop being low and the TR/NC were having a big fight on a cont we didn't have access to. However, one of the bases in the south of the cont was getting very close to being out of fuel so I shipped off and set the base up to drain faster and rigged mines by the silo while I setup an AMS and made a call or two for backup. Cut to about a half hour later the base is now the starting point for the VS zerg and we had a beach head on a cont we normally wouldn't have been able to access.

This is one of several systems that you'll hear old PS folks gripe about not being in PS2 and I think you'll agree that we have good reason to gripe.

[blbeta]

I am trying to like PS2, but it just seems so many of the strategy elements are stripped because they didn't fit "fast" gameplay style the want in PS2. Truth is PS1 gameplay just needed some tweaks to speed it up, not a complete revamp.

I still have hopes for PS2, but I don't see my hopes even coming close to being met by 11/20/12.

[Rolfski]

This is one of several systems that you'll hear old PS folks gripe about not being in PS2 and I think you'll agree that we have good reason to gripe.

Adding base power as a game resource that needs to be replenished from the Warpgate by some single purpose special support vehicle sure does sound like a game mechanic that allows for additional interesting tactics.

Having said that, I can probably understand why they have left it out though as it sure adds complexity to a game that already has a high learning curve. Also, driving it makes you pure logistics without an opportunity for you to fight back and I think that is not what the devs are after in PS2. They probably want any logistics role (engi, medic, sunderer, galaxy) to have the fun of fighting as well in PS2 which I can approve upon.

[Captain1nsaneo]

They probably want any logistics role (engi, medic, sunderer, galaxy) to have the fun of fighting as well in PS2 which I can approve upon.

The problem with that is then there is only 1 kind of fun.

[Redshift]

When ants existed many hated making ant runs. Wait for it.. wait for it.. Someone is going to post how they logged onto the game for years just to make ant runs.

ANT's were fantastic, but only in heavily sieged/defended bases.
TBH it wouldn't be hard to keep them but without the annoying bits, just make deserted bases auto refill NTU's, then you only have to fill active bases.
You'd at least the keep another layer of gameplay and strategy, and you'd still keep those awesome moment where some crazy gal pilot drops an ANT on <10%

Not that it really matter since a defense doesn't last long enough to actually drain a base in PS2

[TheSaltySeagull]

I never liked NTU in ps1. The idea was kinda cool but its implementation was horrid. Because bases lost NTU regardless of if there is activity at them or not which meant you often had to fill bases nobody was at and sometimes on empty conts. That was not fun it was boring. The epic ant runs people like to reference where they had to avoid the enemy and slip past them to refill a base made up like 10% of the runs you would do. The other 90% was driving back and forth from the warp gate on a milk run.

If they do bring NTU back they need to change the way it drains so you dont have people doing boring bitch work of filling empty bases that have no enemies around them. It needs to be less mundane and more relevant to the fight at hand.

[GuyFawkes]

Adding base power as a game resource that needs to be replenished from the Warpgate by some single purpose special support vehicle sure does sound like a game mechanic that allows for additional interesting tactics.

Having said that, I can probably understand why they have left it out though as it sure adds complexity to a game that already has a high learning curve. Also, driving it makes you pure logistics without an opportunity for you to fight back and I think that is not what the devs are after in PS2. They probably want any logistics role (engi, medic, sunderer, galaxy) to have the fun of fighting as well in PS2 which I can approve upon.

I miss ANTs like a hole in the head.

Everything said about their role, CaptainInsaneo made great points about it, is true, and made for some great points of reference.

The downside, howether, and probably the reason the devs have steered clear of it so far, are two fold.

Firstly, the reality was that it always ended up being like waiting for a bus. Don't get any for ages then 3 turn up at once. Players would drop what they were doing, go get an ant, drive to the warpgate, refil, then drive to the base and find 2 others filling up and you just wasted 30 minutes for nothing. So, people tended to just not bother after this. Ant's were a nice flow of additional xp, something valuable for new players and anyone needing it. But because of the point I just made, filling ants ended up being done by CR5's with no need for the xp, flying galaxies and dropping ants on bases instead because noone wanted to do it.

The second point, which exacerbated the first point, is that you had several persistant gonad infiltrators that would spend most of their time doing nothing but draining bases anywhere and everywhere they could, and it would be a timesink of tedium cat and mouse style going around refilling bases with barely any significance. You may catch them and kill them, they would just respawn and go pick another continent to harrass, rinse and repeat. This was made even worse when they gave tools to increase base drain.

NTU's did have their plus points, but on the flipside had such tedium that its no surprise they removed it.

[Captain1nsaneo]

The second point, which exacerbated the first point, is that you had several persistant gonad infiltrators that would spend most of their time doing nothing but draining bases anywhere and everywhere they could, and it would be a timesink of tedium cat and mouse style going around refilling bases with barely any significance. You may catch them and kill them, they would just respawn and go pick another continent to harrass, rinse and repeat. This was made even worse when they gave tools to increase base drain.

Mmmmmmmmmmm good memories. Eventually we had draining down to a science. Managed to drain Amerish's capital right out from under a 40% NC pop. That job took some work.

In our defense the reason we're out there draining is because the main fight was an exercise in futility and we're blowing off steam by causing damage to back lines. At least that's what's going on when we're draining for draining's sake. Most of the times we're trying to open up another front and when doing that there's certain bases that you go after because when cycling through the maps there are bases that are normally passed over by the eye. Zots on Hossin and Atar are good bases to get drains off on. However, people know about these things so you have to take that into account when picking a target.

More info about NTU, they don't drain just sitting there. Amp stations prevent that and can bring bases up to 100% over time. As for multiple ANTs showing up that got better in later years because cr5 chat became pervasive. Team work and all that.

[PClownPosse]

Oh man, the ant. All of these memories flooding back.

Yeah base filling was tedious at times but it was also nerd-raging fun, whether you've spent twenty minutes driving and filling one up only to get blown up on the way back or blowing up other people's ants after they made the long trek, lol.

[blbeta]

I won't say it's the ANT specifically that I miss, but rather some form of that mechanic.

Siege of a base you can't take out right, but deny them the "supplies" they need to keep it. I just like all the little things that PS1 provided for strategy.

I haven't played PS2 a lot yet, but I certainly have not had that siege feeling on offense or defense. The bases are so open that I have been at.

[PClownPosse]

Ant bombs.

I think they patched it out, but I kind of remember full ants being used as ramming weapons at one time, that would spectacularly explode upon impact, taking everything around it with it. The hilarity and rage that would ensue.

[GuyFawkes]

Mmmmmmmmmmm good memories. Eventually we had draining down to a science. Managed to drain Amerish's capital right out from under a 40% NC pop. That job took some work.

In our defense the reason we're out there draining is because the main fight was an exercise in futility and we're blowing off steam by causing damage to back lines. At least that's what's going on when we're draining for draining's sake. Most of the times we're trying to open up another front and when doing that there's certain bases that you go after because when cycling through the maps there are bases that are normally passed over by the eye. Zots on Hossin and Atar are good bases to get drains off on. However, people know about these things so you have to take that into account when picking a target.

More info about NTU, they don't drain just sitting there. Amp stations prevent that and can bring bases up to 100% over time. As for multiple ANTs showing up that got better in later years because cr5 chat became pervasive. Team work and all that.

Don't get me wrong , in early part of ps1 it was a science to base draining. Outfits like MOX specialised in it on werner. I just hope they bring in a similar system in ps2, but instead of ants they make it a pipeline system to break, as well as some sort of vehicle to use in emergencies type of thing.
I'd like a whole support type of logistic/engineer stuff in time, bridge building, resource pipelines, laying trenches, minefields, erecting bunkers into the game if they truly want to add more sandbox elements in game as they said they hope to.

[PClownPosse]

You have to admit, ps1, from classes, customizability, game mechanics (such as the ant), wealth of play styles and games within the game, was brilliantly conceived and designed. Just the technology lacked the vision at the time.