The 4th faction

[Corvo]

We all know the current state of things allows players to switch between their characters on the same server instantly. Changing allegiance is a matter of seconds. This allows people to sabotage defenses from the inside by blowing up sunderers and shooting people in the back.

Just now I wanted to fix a quick fight so I went to the crown held by TR as usual. In the next 10 minutes or so I was gunned down twice by some friendly HA who just kept spawning and shooting his own faction in the back until his weapons got locked. When I spawned near our AMS Sunderer I noticed two AT mines conveniently placed under it so that any explosive - a frag, an AT grenade or a c4 would set it off.

This needs to be dealt with ASAP. I think they should introduce a timer that would start ticking every time you switch faction and wouldn't allow you to switch back for a period of time. This wouldn't solve the problem as people will just create BR1's to do the dirty job but would at least make it a bit more annoying for existing accounts.

I'd like to hear what you guys think about it.

[Kerrec]

Lame strategies that involve switching teams to sabotage and grief at the benefit of another team is not the "4th faction".

They are 2 separate issues.

[Aaron]

Yeah, I've had my AMS blown up by friendly tank mines as well. I think some basic restriction such as a timer would be good enough.

[Nur]

They should place a timer of about 8 hours on the same server at least.

[EVILPIG]

A timer is completely unnecessary. Use your heads. If someone wanted to switch and grief, they can simply use another account. If they want to switch and grief on their main account, have at it. At least it will mean something if they get banned.

Timers are lame. Empire switching on same account is not an issue.

[Bloodlet]

I would like to see a timer as well for same server different faction characters. Not specifically for same team sabotagers but simply to try to enforce some measure of faction loyalty. I realize they could just get a second account but that second account won't have boosts, premium benefits, or account wide unlocks that the first account would have unless that person was willing to spend the $$ on that second account.

[EVILPIG]

I would like to see a timer as well for same server different faction characters. Not specifically for same team sabotagers but simply to try to enforce some measure of faction loyalty. I realize they could just get a second account but that second account won't have boosts, premium benefits, or account wide unlocks that the first account would have unless that person was willing to spend the $$ on that second account.

Which is utterly lame to force on players. What if you had characters on different servers and they merged? Now you a ridiculous timer? Griefers are an issue that goes beyond this and players shouldn't be penalized or limited because of it.

[NewSith]

Yeah, I've had my AMS blown up by friendly tank mines as well. I think some basic restriction such as a timer would be good enough.

Sometimes when you place an AMS inside a biolab v-bay locking AMS placements everywhere else (when you can have up to four of them inside the base courtyard) having it destroyed by friendlies isn't wrong.

[bpostal]

Sometimes when you place an AMS inside a biolab v-bay locking AMS placements everywhere else (when you can have up to four of them inside the base courtyard) having it destroyed by friendlies isn't wrong.

While I agree, I have to add that I personally view it as a dick move. Of course, dick moves are plentiful in PS2 so I can't really complain.

On the original topic, the free to play nature of the game allows such griefing to occur. Even a timer wouldn't make any difference because, as has been pointed out, it's easy peasy to log off, switch accounts and go about your dickery. Plus when that throw away account gets banned, it means little to nothing. Unfortunate really, but what can ya do?

[EVILPIG]

While I agree, I have to add that I personally view it as a dick move. Of course, dick moves are plentiful in PS2 so I can't really complain.

On the original topic, the free to play nature of the game allows such griefing to occur. Even a timer wouldn't make any difference because, as has been pointed out, it's easy peasy to log off, switch accounts and go about your dickery. Plus when that throw away account gets banned, it means little to nothing. Unfortunate really, but what can ya do?

To add to that, when you make a new account for SOE, you can do it on the fly and you don't even have to verify email. Just Create Account, mash buttons with @hotmail.com on end and you can log in into the new account.

[bpostal]

To add to that, when you make a new account for SOE, you can do it on the fly and you don't even have to verify email. Just Create Account, mash buttons with @hotmail.com on end and you can log in into the new account.

Really?! I mean...that's...just...damn.

[Dragonskin]

I echo Evilpig on this. If people want to grief on their main account.. let them. They would be stupid for doing it and will eventually get caught.

People that intend to grief others will just make endless accounts to do so.

[Corvo]

Lame strategies that involve switching teams to sabotage and grief at the benefit of another team is not the "4th faction".

They are 2 separate issues.

My bad, they sort of are :) But you get the idea.

[BlaxicanX]

The 4th faction is a boogeyman, like hackers, whose effects aren't nearly as tangible as people think they are.

I mean, really guys- you're vastly underestimating human beings and their general laziness. Do you really think someone would be so bored as to:

1. Roam a base as a defender, scout out everything in the base and look for the least defended areas (which in itself is an impossibility, since nothing in this game is very static at all, and defenders are constantly changing positions, going to where the fighting is, or dying and respawning elsewhere).

2. Log-out, log back in as some alternate account.

3. JUST so that they can hop into their ESF, fly back to the base and... attempt to sneak in and undermine the defenders, and then die 10 seconds later.

That's insane, and paranoid.

As far as team-killing, how do you know that this guy is some "secret NC spy" who's logged on to his TR account specifically to "undermine the war effort", despite the fact that each faction has hundreds of players online at any time, and killing three teammates or blowing up one or two tanks is just a drop in any factions' ocean?

Insane, and paranoid.

Like, when you're playing Halo as the blue team, and some asshole teammate keeps killing you and tea-bagging your body, is your first thought "he's a spy from the red team!" No, it's "oh look, some bored asshole is griefing me."

[Ruffdog]

Don't tank mines have IFF, like Claymores?

We need some sort of nanite-explained system where C4 and the such cannot deal damage to friendly vehicles.

Bosh, no more spy paranoia.

[Dragonskin]

Insane, and paranoid.

Like, when you're playing Halo as the blue team, and some asshole teammate keeps killing you and tea-bagging your body, is your first thought "he's a spy from the red team!" No, it's "oh look, some bored asshole is griefing me."

This made me laugh. That's exactly it.

That and people are just stupid. I shot a friendly last night with a tank shell. Why? Because I was in my prowler in a line of prowlers firing on the base in fron to us. I am sure that the people I killed didn't think "those damn 4th faction people are sabatoging the back lines"... he probably thought "why that dude TK me? Asshole!" even though he clearly walked into the line of fire.

[OCNSethy]

Don't tank mines have IFF, like Claymores?

We need some sort of nanite-explained system where C4 and the such cannot deal damage to friendly vehicles.

Bosh, no more spy paranoia.

Yes they do. However, the way it was described, they can also be set off by a nade or shooting them.

[Binkley]

On the original topic, the free to play nature of the game allows such griefing to occur. Even a timer wouldn't make any difference because, as has been pointed out, it's easy peasy to log off, switch accounts and go about your dickery. Plus when that throw away account gets banned, it means little to nothing. Unfortunate really, but what can ya do?

SOE has the ability to hardware ban the real bastards.

[Helwyr]

Anything SOE does to make switching factions on the same server more difficult and less convenient is a good thing.

I don't have an answer on how to stop it altogether in a free to play game, but I think the best success would be via the metagame and its impact on the individual player. It needs to be constructed in such a way that as an individual player switching factions on the same server feels like it's a zero or negative sum game where gains made for fighting for one faction are going to be felt negatively on an individual level on the other two factions. So in essence as a 4th empire player you begin to feel like your playing against yourself, which only the masochistic would enjoy.