Account Wide Unlocks in Next GU

[Hamma]

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/306588877685129216


We knew this was in the roadmap but this is the first confirmation.

[Satanam]

Aw, yeah!

[Rahabib]

YAY!

[maradine]

I don't think I've seen an explanation of how exactly this is supposed to work - any thoughts?

[Rahabib]

I don't think I've seen an explanation of how exactly this is supposed to work - any thoughts?

Thus far:
"We would like items purchased with Station Cash to be unlocked across all characters on the account that can utilize them. This change would be retroactive to prior purchases."


http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/february-account-level-unlocks.82715/

[maradine]

Right, but I mean, like - class of item? If I have a Nemesis on my main, would a TR alt get a Grounder? Does it apply to certs? The exact same certs? Etc, etc.

[MrBloodworth]

Only thing that confuses me about this is, Does he mean THIS next Game update, or the one after that?


As for the topic, Quite sure even Empire specific weapons and items are the same price, that's all that matters. You buy a Chaingun, you get a lasher and Jackhammer.

Kinda simple.

[Rahabib]

Right, but I mean, like - class of item? If I have a Nemesis on my main, would a TR alt get a Grounder? Does it apply to certs? The exact same certs? Etc, etc.
Somewhere they said it would be faction specific - so no you would not get a Grounder.

It does not apply to certs since not even classes can do that.

Beyond that, we will just have to see.

[MrBloodworth]

I would like some clarification on this then.

If I buy a Chaingun, I should by rights and money paid, get a lasher and a Jackhammer for my other factions.

"Balance" should have nothing to do with it, its a money issue.

If this is not the case, then there needs to be some really good reasoning my real dollars do not seem to transfer faction. I doubt anyone can think of one.

[Twido]

I would like some clarification on this then.

If I buy a Chaingun, I should by rights and money paid, get a lasher and a Jackhammer for my other factions.

"Balance" should have nothing to do with it, its a money issue.

If this is not the case, then there needs to be some really good reasoning my real dollars do not seem to transfer faction. I doubt anyone can think of one.

I don't think that unlocking a weapon from one faction will unlock an equivalent weapon in another faction. To be honest, I don't really see why it should either.

[MrBloodworth]

I don't think that unlocking a weapon from one faction will unlock an equivalent weapon in another faction. To be honest, I don't really see why it should either.

Because they cost the same, and Rate of fire and blue orbs have nothing to do with the Value of a Dollar. Why would faction have jack all to do with it?

[Dragonskin]

I would like some clarification on this then.

If I buy a Chaingun, I should by rights and money paid, get a lasher and a Jackhammer for my other factions.

"Balance" should have nothing to do with it, its a money issue.

If this is not the case, then there needs to be some really good reasoning my real dollars do not seem to transfer faction. I doubt anyone can think of one.

I want it to be like you said, but I have a feeling they will say that isn't the case. I think it will boil down to each faction will have faction specific weapons which are account wide in the sense that if you buy a VS smg then you can use that VS smg on another VS character on your account.

I think common pool things.. like decimator, annihilator, AV MANA turret, liberator weapons, lightning weapons... stuff like that as well as camos, decals and accessories will all be account wide.

And that will mostly come down to that SOE needs to make money and that means they won't lose money on faction specific items.

[MrBloodworth]

Who would make another toon on the same faction, other than on another server?

That makes no sense. What you propose as the outcome can not be justified to me, they will loose a customer.

[Zeta]

TBH, it's the gifting items that would seem to be the most beneficial.

I don't really see myself utilizing the account wide unlocks since I'm primarily going to be focused on my main character most of the time anyways. After all, there's really only going to be one main focus/progression on your way up to all 100 BRs, and the accumulated certs that character will have earned, plus the progression towards all their Auraxium medals. Not to mention the ties/binds you'll have created between your Outfit/Outfit mates for that character.

I don't see how it's going to work anyways between characters/weapons of a different faction? Would you receive the opposing factions weapons of an equal "class" that you've already purchased on another character?

As an NC I purposefully bought some weapons that had a faster firing rate so that I could have the option of choosing between either my default slower/powerful weapons or a faster/weaker weapon. If the faster firing weapons I purchased translated over to a TR character then that would be useless because I'd already have access to all their faster firing weapons anyways.

[Frozenland]

Right, but I mean, like - class of item? If I have a Nemesis on my main, would a TR alt get a Grounder? Does it apply to certs? The exact same certs? Etc, etc.

Please, you are asking for too much.

[MrBloodworth]

Correct me if I am wrong, but there are only one type of Faction Specific weapons, and they all have equivalents in other factions.

There is no Jackhammer and a Sidegrade jackhammer. This goes for Secondary tanks guns and Maxes.

[Twido]

Because they cost the same, and Rate of fire and blue orbs have nothing to do with the Value of a Dollar. Why would faction have jack all to do with it?

Because when you spend your money to buy a chaingun, you get exactly what you paid for and you can't really blame SOE for that!

It would be nice to get equivalent unlocks in the other factions, but I don't think SOE have any moral obligation to give us it.

[MrBloodworth]

Because when you spend your money to buy a chaingun, you get exactly what you paid for and you can't really blame SOE for that!

It would be nice to get equivalent unlocks in the other factions, but I don't think SOE have any moral obligation to give us it.

Its not a moral obligation.

I will not be buying the empire specific HA gun on another faction. I have no need ( Its not where my time and money investment is ), and with the current cert system, there is still no need to even roll another toon.

They won't see the kind of money I have spent already on one toon and one faction two times.

That's for suckers.

However unlocks across factions would allow me to buy other guns if I ever play another faction. Plainly put, the lack of this will enshrine I never play another faction, nor be tempted after that to buy anything else.

[Sledgecrushr]

This is really good news. I hope there are some comparable rifle unlocks for the other factions.

[Dragonskin]

Who would make another toon on the same faction, other than on another server?

That makes no sense. What you propose as the outcome can not be justified to me, they will loose a customer.

They have to have some kind of restrictions. They are in this to make money after all. While the Jackhammer, Lasher and Chaingun are all the special HA weapons for their factions.. none of them are remotely similar. I honestly don't expect to be able to buy a Lasher for my VS (which I have) and then be able to use the Chaingun on my TR (I haven't bought yet). When you buy a faction specific weapon you are buying that particular weapon.. not all weapons in that class type that could remotely be associated. Just because a set of weapons were released at the same doesn't make them mirrors of each other.

From a money standpoint it doesn't make business sense to loose out on all that potential money when they already will make all common pool items account wide for all characters.

If I'm wrong then I would be happy, but I am not getting my hopes up. Would be nice if I was wrong.

[MrBloodworth]

They have to have some kind of restrictions. They are in this to make money after all. While the Jackhammer, Lasher and Chaingun are all the special HA weapons for their factions.. none of them are remotely similar.

They cost the same. In game faction differences should not be part of the equation. They are all HA guns, they are equivalent, each faction has one. A dollar is a dollar.

Again, for me, this is a barrier to spend any money on anything if I ever decide to try another faction. The money, time and or cert ( Time ) barrier is prohibitive.

And again, we are not talking about items that have side grades.


We need clarification.

[Dragonskin]

They cost the same.

And that means what? How is that relevant to the arguement? Most good weapons in the game are 700 SC. So you spent 700 SC and now you have access to all weapons that cost 700 SC?

[Dragonskin]

I'm not against your idea really, I just don't think it will happen that way. That sounds too good to be true. I am purposely not buying items that might be account wide like that for a reason. In case I am wrong I don't have to worry about anything.

[MrBloodworth]

And that means what? How is that relevant to the arguement? Most good weapons in the game are 700 SC. So you spent 700 SC and now you have access to all weapons that cost 700 SC?

It means that that's the only thing that matters when you are talking money.

If I buy a grounder, it should be account wide. Not gated by faction for arbitrary reasons. "Because faction" does not carry water. This is especialy true for like items that are faction specific. A 400$ TV is a TV, no matter its color.

I have also avoided buying like items that are factional for this reason, there is no value in it, its not where my time investment is.

If they choose to go "Because faction" they have lost sales on other items.

[Aaron]

It means that that's the only thing that matters when you are talking money.

If I buy a grounder, it should be account wide. Not gated by faction for arbitrary reasons. "Because faction" does not carry water.

I have also avoided buying like items that are factional for this reason, there is no value in it, its not where my time investment is.

Well, I can see why they wouldn't. Each gun has some work put into it, like the modeling, the artwork, the way it performs. It may be in the same class of weapons, but it also is a unique weapon that has had work put into it.

[maradine]

Please, you are asking for too much.

I wasn't asking for anything other than clarification. I don't run multiple characters, and for the purposes of this game I have effectively inexhaustible funds.

[MrBloodworth]

Well, I can see why they wouldn't. Each gun has some work put into it, like the modeling, the artwork, the way it performs. It may be in the same class of weapons, but it also is a unique weapon that has had work put into it.

They are all the same price.

I'm not disagreeing with those of you who think it won't be the case. I'm simply stating I will be highly disappointed, see no logic in that direction, and see it as impacting revenue in other areas.

I do not buy the same cars two times, because I switched suits. I have not yet, and will not later. For me, there would nearly no benefit from account wide unlocks in your prediction, and I have a hard time believing any responsible adult would ether.

Who has the time and money to invest in to BR 100 on three toons along with the monetary unlocks? Conversely I have time to start a new toon, from the level I have invested and have the likely hood of buying/trying truly differentiated weapons and such, ESPECIALLY if I know that investment carry over and does not end just because I went from purple to red. True revenue will come from added content.

I simply won't start over money and time wise. That's an unreasonable expectation.

[bpostal]

It sounds like there's two main schools of thought:
1: I paid for a HA faction specific weapon
2: I paid for a MCG (OR JH OR Lasher)
That's where the issue comes into play.
My personal guess is that when you bought an MCG, you bought an MCG.
I mean, SOE's gots ta get paid.

We probably will see a plea for more NS weapons after this though (Punisher anyone?).

[Aaron]

They are all the same price.

I'm not disagreeing with those of you who think it won't be the case. I'm simply stating I will be highly disappointed, see no logic in that direction, and see it as impacting revenue in other areas.

I do not buy the same cars two times. I have not yet, and will not later. For me, there would nearly no benefit from account wide unlocks in your prediction, and I have a hard time believing any responsible adult would ether.

Who has the time and money to invest in to BR 100 on three toons along with the monetary unlocks? Conversely I have time to start a new toon, from the level I have invested and have the likely hood of buying/trying truly differentiated weapons and such, ESPECIALLY if I know that investment carry over and does not end just because I went from purple to red.

I simply won't start over money and time wise. That's an unreasonable expectation.

Ah, okay. In other words, what's the point? Why would I start another VS toon when I already have a built up one? So, the only REAL benefit to account wide unlocks is if they let you have the other factional weapons in the same class. Otherwise, there is no benefit to the costumer. Is that what you are getting at?

[RSphil]

cool, tbh not bothered about weapon unlocks but cosmetic stuff would be great. my TR has more camo and stuff then my NC so account wide will be great. can wait

[Dragonskin]

Ah, okay. In other words, what's the point? Why would I start another VS toon when I already have a built up one? So, the only REAL benefit to account wide unlocks is if they let you have the other factional weapons in the same class. Otherwise, there is no benefit to the costumer. Is that what you are getting at?

That is what he is saying and he would be right except for all the common pool weapons that are not affected to by this. Classes themselves don't have many common pool outside the AV turret, decimator, annihilator and the NS-11. Vehicles on the other hand have a bunch of common pool weapons.. which would be any weapon for the sunderer, lightning, liberator or flash. The ESFs and MBTs are still faction specific so I think they will be treated as seperate even though they are all basically the same... which would be strange.

Outside of weapons there are very few faction specific decals, camo skins, or accessories.. Most of them are common pool actually. So those would all be benefitted by not having to rebuy them.

[MrBloodworth]

Ah, okay. In other words, what's the point? Why would I start another VS toon when I already have a built up one? So, the only REAL benefit to account wide unlocks is if they let you have the other factional weapons in the same class. Otherwise, there is no benefit to the costumer. Is that what you are getting at?

Yes, essentially. With the side effect of i will not be buying something on the new Toon if I did. Why would I? Its not where my investments have been made.

I think its a leap to think that ( Factional divide ) would generate more revenue then if I had everything I already bought, and the option to get more and budget.

I think we have already seen, there are tons of items, even if bundled by type or whatever, to spend money on, and there are more coming.

Why not keep the value already invested if it leads to OTHER purchases? The Opposite would be a real huge Value misjudgement. IMO.

That is what he is saying and he would be right except for all the common pool weapons that are not affected to by this.

I See no Value in treating one differently then the other. Not in terms of "Balance", Flavor, blue balls VS. bullets. This is 100% a Value decision. Faction is arbitrary in this context.

[RogueAU]

Yes! This and a cert reset = win! Test all the factions!

[FireStormNova]

I would like some clarification on this then.

If I buy a Chaingun, I should by rights and money paid, get a lasher and a Jackhammer for my other factions.

"Balance" should have nothing to do with it, its a money issue.

If this is not the case, then there needs to be some really good reasoning my real dollars do not seem to transfer faction. I doubt anyone can think of one.

Yea i would have to 2nd that , it would seem strange to me if it only unlocks that 1 factions weapons? What did i realy gain? I can make 3 copies of the same faction on my account and dont have to unlock 3X Chainguns?????
I think people or more likely to have 1 of each faction then to have 3 copys of the same faction on there account!
It would also be comforting to people that are dropping station cash that if i unlock heavy weapons i get if for all the factions not 1 , and which i think is alot of people , because lets face it how many people do you think are useing 1000 cert points to unlock some weapons?
YES IT IS A MONEY ISSUE :lol:

[Dyram]

While it is good to hear that this feature is coming soon, a number of questions and concerns remain.

Does this only apply to NS weapons across faction? What about those weapons that are singular in nature, but made to fit the ES theme (ESF rockets, for example)? How will double purchases be handled? Why not cert purchases, too?

To discuss these, let's first create an ideal scenario for players and then work back from the company's point of view. In my eyes, the ideal would be:


Any NS weapon or tool or other common items (camo patterns, vehicle cosmetics) are unlocked for all characters without question.
A weapon purchased is that type of weapon purchased. All factions have mirrored weapon types, so any unlocked that are ES would be mirrored and unlocked onto other factions, such as how Alpha Squad worked.
A purchase from the Depot/Store is a purchase, be it through Station Cash or through certifications.


I feel like this is a nice and balanced feature set that most would agree is ideal for players, if perhaps not the most profitable for the company. That said, we ought not outright dismiss ideas purely for the sake of ensuring the company makes more money. If that were the clear focus, then account-wide unlocks wouldn't even be considered.


Common Pool & Items

I think by now that everyone agrees/understands that common items and common pool weapons should be shared universally across all factions on an account, so there's not much to discuss here.


Empire-Specific Weaponry and Their Counterparts

Reading through this thread, and that of the roadmap for account-level unlocks, ES weapons for infantry and vehicles have been a major sticking point. Many players find it safe to assume these are included when it comes to cross-factional characters, but realistically many more figure that SOE will make this a sticking point and not award similar weapons. While there are arguments to be made that the purchase of a weapon is of that weapon, and not of the idea of that weapon (a Lasher, MCG, or Jackhammer being the unique ES HA weaponry rather than simply a Lasher, MCG, or Jackhammer as a singular entity), I feel that as probable as this decision is for money-making reasons, it is one that should be avoided. When Alpha Squad launched, you were not purchasing individual weapons in that package, you were purchasing one additional weapon per class, and those given are the mirrored weapons for each empire. For instance, the VS Engineer did not get a Solstice SF with underslung while NC and TR engineers got a "plain" carbine, it was balanced statistically, these weapons, and their "slots" in each class are the same. This doesn't make these weapons carbon copies of each other, but nor does this make them completely different weapons capable of different things and therefore consider individually in nature.

And what of the vehicle weapons that are all considered as ES weaponry, when in fact they are the same? The most obvious of these are the much-maligned ESF rocket pods, as they are all each a unique weapon and model and texture to fit their faction, but are, for all intents and purposes, the same weapon system (not necessarily from a damage or balancing standpoint, mind you, but they are the same weapon). The MBTs, similarly, share weapon types, if not similar weapons themselves. Everyone knows the main cannon upgrades are similar in nature to the rocket pods in this. Each tank also sees a common pool upgrade to anti-personnel and anti-armor weaponry for their secondary, but also an ES upgrade for these same things. Sure, the weapons are quite diverse between the factions themselves, what with the Saron, Enforcer (that's still what that's called, right?), and Vulcan, but each serve that same role for the vehicle (with the caveat of unique traits for each). To not share these clearly similar and mirrored weapon types would be silly.

I think it was a salient point made that having ES weapons transfer to other factions as their mirrored counterparts would actually encourage exploration of the other factions and create more purchasing opportunities, as it frees up those same weapon archtypes from the player's consideration and their mind can instead focus on other things they want. Keeping the ES weapons solely to characters of that empire means that switching to a new character with a new focus in a different faction makes about as much sense for time invested on the main character as it does now, pre-account-wide unlocks.


Certification Purchases

My greatest issue, however, resides in what seems to be the shafting of "free players." While I would never hope for nor desire the character upgrades that, to some extent, have removed the "pure skill" from the game, to also be brought over to each character (for example, no fresh character should have scopes or rail items for their weapons, nor any suit or tool upgrades, just because the player's other character does). Letting new characters clone the character upgrades would essentially make ranking up even more pointless than it is at the moment and would create an army of supersoldiers without effort spent on each.

However, the way it has been worded thus far, account-wide unlocks will not work for items purchased with certifications. Why? The simply answer is money. However, the issue is more complicated than simple dollar bills. From day one, all vehicle and infantry weapons and tools in the store have been available for purchase by money, or by certs. This was always stated as the goal during development, and it is nice to have them continue to keep that word. Personally, I don't believe in purchasing weapons that are proven time and time again to be demonstrably better (sidegrades are a nice ideal, but certain weapons just shine through), or vehicle weapons that massively increase the viability of that vehicle to play a particular role, or new roles it could not fulfill without. For the justification of free-to-play, as long as these are purchasable through in-game means, however, I grin and bear it, because it makes the company money. Those who buy weapons are not bad people, though I know some, perhaps, are a tad impatient, but given enough time, I've purchased the same weapons with certifications all of the same. These are the same items in the same store. I've unlocked them. They've unlocked them. The only difference is they got their headstart from spending cash, and that is the point of being able to buy them with money.

The way the roadmap is worded, and I'm sure it's not wrong, implies that these certification transactions will not turn into account-wide unlocks. My TR nor my NC will get even the common pool items that everyone agrees should cross that barrier. Why? Because I'm a "free player." You know, the "free player" who purchased the Alpha Squad to support SOE before the game was even released, the "free player" that spends his money on cosmetic upgrades to spend time enjoying my character and actually developing him over time rather than shortcutting to the end. I don't believe in buying weapon unlocks, but for this reason, the many thousands of certs I have spent, the (according to the player page) 160 hours of play time, most of which is sunken into weapon unlocks via certs just to try to keep up with my friends who have purchased all and dominated with those expanded capabilities, for that reason, I will get nothing. Oh, no, sorry, I will get my camo across characters and faction... yay. Why should I even bother to play at this point? If my friend's characters are all as equipped as their mains, then I will fall even further behind, not because of skill, but because of my morals in the game and how I choose to still pay SOE money and support them. My character, to date, has earned 5062 certs total, and the great majority of that (like somewhere around 4/5) is spent on similar weapons that my friends have been using for months and enjoying the whole time. One of my friends has, in a slightly longer play time, earned 8594 certs, but due to his purchasing all of his weapons to get the headstart that buying weapons offers, he's also made his character far better over time, because he has sunken each one of those certs into the character upgrades, not unlocking things. For 1.5x my play time, with similar scoring, he has been able to spend 8x more on upgrading than I have. Great. Moving this discrepancy to our other-faction alts only widens the gap and I may as well not even bother playing.

Some people would argue that by paying, they are directly supporting the company while I am not and therefore deserve special privileges, like these account-wide unlocks. To be fair to these people, I universally support unlocks for paying members, because paying twice for something is really stupid. Despite their opinions, though, I am supporting the company. Even if you took away the Alpha Squad purchase prior to release, and even if you took away my camo purchases, you'd still have a player that has sunken 160 hours into this game (actually a pittance compared to the original, but that's not an issue for this thread). At the very minimum, I've been a statistic that SOE can use for 160 hours, with long play sessions sometimes lasting all day long. More than that, however, I've enriched the play environment by simply existing within it, as all of the players have. Without us players, the game is nothing. Beyond my direct interaction with the game itself, I also promote PlanetSide to those that seek out such a game, and, as I've stated above, brought in friends that have spent quite a bit themselves. I won't define myself by someone else's money, but you can see that despite not paying for weapons, I'm still a valuable player to the company. Arguably, the amount of time I spend on simple unlocks is actually more valuable than the money SOE has received from others. Taken from a purely numerical standpoint, anyone in the US is making enough money to buy the most expensive unlock in 1 hour of work. Each unlock of the same cost (1000 certs or $7), I've had to sink in tens of hours to acquire. People may call their cash valuable, but the honest truth is that money is pointless, your time isn't. Not only is your time worth that what you can make at a job, but there's also a much greater intrinsic value to it. I chose to spend my time this way, yes, but you chose to put down $7. Why should you get special treatment while I get none?

I don't feel that people who buy their weapons have actually earned them. Does that make them a bad person? No. At the same time, though, people like me, paying SOE through other means or not, actually work very hard to earn the same unlocks. We deserve these same items in the same store to be unlocked for us account-wide all of the same.

Treat store purchases the same, don't discriminate.

Without this, you, SOE, are projecting that you don't actually care about your free players, as you had originally stated. Without this, you, SOE, look hungry for money even despite the nicety of the account-wide unlocks for paying players. Without this, you, SOE, lose credibility to trade on the idea of free players having equal rights and an equal time playing this game.


TL;DR (Really? Just read the damned post.)
I'm not asking for special treatment for free, I'm just asking to be treated equally. Don't screw me over here.

[bpostal]

I highly doubt SOE is going to not unlock NS weapons for those who used certs vs Smed Shekles. An unlock is an unlock.
I could be wrong in my thinking but again, I don't think SOE is going to differentiate between the two.

[Chewy]

What about if you buy one 700SC ES weapon for a class you get credit for one 700SC ES weapon on another toon? Same for other SC costing weapons, you get credit for ONE weapon of that cost per SC payment.

NS gear, camos, armors, stickers, and decals are easy to share to all factions, but ES stuff should be accounted for somehow unless the TOS already have a wording about this in it. Either way I can see a shit storm happening by adding shared SC unlocks no matter what SOE chooses to do. And I wish them luck.

[Rahabib]

how many of you guys visited the roadmap (http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/february-account-level-unlocks.82715/) and asked or voted up the issues you have?

[Dragonskin]

how many of you guys visited the roadmap (http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/february-account-level-unlocks.82715/) and asked or voted up the issues you have?

I voted it up and it's pointless to post a question about it in the thousands of posts that have asked the same thing that have never been answered by the Devs and no players have the answer.

The only Dev post on most of the roadmap stuff is the first one unless they had to clarify something that was misunderstood because it was poorly worded or left out of the original post.

[Badjuju]

Right, but I mean, like - class of item? If I have a Nemesis on my main, would a TR alt get a Grounder? Does it apply to certs? The exact same certs? Etc, etc.

They stated previously that faction specific weapons would not unlock for different factions. I would assume that weapons of the same "class" would fall under those pretenses.

[Badjuju]

What about if you buy one 700SC ES weapon for a class you get credit for one 700SC ES weapon on another toon? Same for other SC costing weapons, you get credit for ONE weapon of that cost per SC payment.

NS gear, camos, armors, stickers, and decals are easy to share to all factions, but ES stuff should be accounted for somehow unless the TOS already have a wording about this in it. Either way I can see a shit storm happening by adding shared SC unlocks no matter what SOE chooses to do. And I wish them luck.

I think it makes sense to only unlock the purchased weapon, not its empire specific equivalent. Sure it would be nice but in the end it is the easiest way to do things, es weapons are in fact different weapons, and it makes more sense from a business aspect. After all the vast majority of their profits come from in game purchases. I am thrilled that they are making items account wide and am not going to complain about es weapons.

Btw they stated earlier that empire specific weapons would not unlock for other factions so I would assume their equivalent would not either.

[Wahooo]

I think it makes sense to only unlock the purchased weapon, not its empire specific equivalent. Sure it would be nice but in the end it is the easiest way to do things, es weapons are in fact different weapons, and it makes more sense from a business aspect. After all the vast majority of their profits come from in game purchases. I am thrilled that they are making items account wide and am not going to complain about es weapons.

Btw they stated earlier that empire specific weapons would not unlock for other factions so I would assume their equivalent would not either.

The thing is it is a really weird grey area. I've unlocked second burster arm twice. I've unlocked MCG and Lasher but not Jackhammer. Is there a difference between these? Do I get a second burster arm for my NC toon? Do I get reimbursed for my VS second burster? If yes on both those do I get a JH and reimbursed fro my Lasher? In the sense of what I purchased there really is not a lot of difference between those two other than calling one "empire specific." "But those weapons really function differently." Ok fair enough I've unlocked SKEP and Grounder on TR... the faction specific equivalents function the exact same way but are still labeled ES. Where is the line drawn between common pool and ES specific?

I kinda believe it will be all or nothing when it comes to the weapons.

From what I can see, they were FIRST back when the subject came up very shortly after release it would ONLY be cosmetics that would be shared. Nothing to confirm/deny this would be the way, it will be has been said as far as I know.
The one thing that HAS been posted is SC PURCHASES shared account wide. To me this will certainly NOT include cert unlocks. Purchases and cert unlocks are tracked completely differently and I don't see that happening.

Either way. I think I understand where they would be coming from with cosmetics only. I would be dissapoint if that were the case but would understand. If it is weapons as well I consider myself happy.

[FireStormNova]

I don't feel that people who buy their weapons have actually earned them. Does that make them a bad person? No. At the same time, though, people like me, paying SOE through other means or not, actually work very hard to earn the same unlocks. We deserve these same items in the same store to be unlocked for us account-wide all of the same.
???????
Free game with micro transaction = to make money and why do you think the price is so high on some of the best weapons? Most people or not going to use there hard earned and few cert point to unlock a weapon for 1000 like i was saying befor.
I personaly have no problem paying a few dollars to unlock a cool weapon i like, but dont want to waste my certs on unlocking weapons when i can use them in better ways , but it is nice to have the option if you want to use your certs.
If you cant unlock the counter part weapons like in Alfa squad then Yes you should be at least able to unlock the common pool weapons for all factions!

[Rasui]

Considering every single weapon in this game has a counterpart for each faction. Not unlocking the equivalent would just be a case of laziness/difficult coding/greed. So if I have the Saron on my Magrider I want the Vulcan on my Prowler. Anything less and there's not really any point imo.

[DirtyBird]

My concern is with items I've purchased on one NC character on Briggs that I've also purchased on my Connery NC character.
With the uncertainty about Briggs longevity I created my own account wide unlock early on.
Will they refund the duplicated purchases? I doubt it.

[Wahooo]

I still feel there is probably a good amount of internal discussion within SOE on this subject would be why we aren't hearing all the details.

[MrBloodworth]

how many of you guys visited the roadmap (http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/february-account-level-unlocks.82715/) and asked or voted up the issues you have?

You will note, many people have the same want as I posted.

Fact of the matter is, if this is not cross faction "Bundles", they will lose sales. I have not had, nor will have the intention of playing another toon, and paying for the same class of gun again.

It won't happen.

If its not cross faction, that means there is little value to this change. I will continue to play one toon, and one faction. There is zero reason to roll another toon of the same faction. None. For those saying it makes more business sense, no, no it does not. Not even a little. As this change will not compel those who have not bought the HA guns on other factions to do so. Bundling up guns cross faction would however, free people to buy OTHER guns. Something they add at a regular pace.

All guns of a type ( Shotgun_01, _02, _03 ), Vehicle or otherwise should be linked.

[Rahabib]

I voted it up and it's pointless to post a question about it in the thousands of posts that have asked the same thing that have never been answered by the Devs and no players have the answer.

The only Dev post on most of the roadmap stuff is the first one unless they had to clarify something that was misunderstood because it was poorly worded or left out of the original post.

They wouldnt release it if they had no intention of ever looking at it. Just because they aren't actively posting (anywhere other than twitter) doesn't mean its ignored completely. They already stated they are going to make adjustments to the priority and implementation of items based on feed back from the road map.

I wasnt saying that you cant complain here, I am just saying you should do it in both places. The roadmap is great for the developers because they get numbers along side posts, which is helpful for them because they get quantitative data along side the qualitative posts. Gotta remember these guys look at numbers.

[Microdose]

What I don't think people are understanding is that SOE has one goal: To make Money. They are not a non-profit organization. They cannot pay their developers with the satisfaction that comes from making a great game that lots of people love to play. Servers cost money to maintain. Developers need to be paid. Execs want to live in fancy homes.

In order to make money they have created a game that is "free to play". By doing so, they entice players to come play the game and hopefully, if they like it, bring their friends. The more people that play, the higher the chances are that some will purchase Station Cash. The folks that 'support' SOE by making their game more fun to play by sinking long hours into character development (all day in some cases) are reimbursed for brining SOE more "sales leads" by being entertained for free all day, every day.SOE entertains them for free, SOE gets new sales leads. Win-Win situation if you ask me.

The second way they can make more money is to find ways to get the people who have already spent real money to buy pixel money to spend even more. Their goal was clearly stated "we are making some items account wide unlocks, to entice players to explore other factions and spend more SC". IF for every weapon that I unlock on TR, I don't have to buy on any other faction, then how is making unlocks across factions going to entice me to spend more SC in other factions?

Here I am, playing one faction, spending my SC to unlock everything on my MBT. IF the unlocks go across factions, then whether I continue playing one faction or create two more characters, each with all the MBT weapons unlocked, what does SOE gain? Nothing! What do they expect me to spend my SC on? Clearly they have thought this through and are planning to make money by making me want to purchase the Magrider special ability even though I already have the deploy ability on my Prowler. If I am a player willing to spend real cash on the game, I am going to spend it buying all the weapons that I need to be a viable Engineer, Medic, Infiltrator, Light Assault, Heavy Assault and Max for whatever faction I currently play. Unless I have to buy them again on subsequent factions, SOE does not achieve their stated goal of getting me to spend more SC by enticing me to explore other factions.

Currently, I assume, folks don't play the other factions because of the amount of time and money needed to purchase all of the extras. Currently nothing is unlocked account wide and SOE feels the need to try and make more money. If they give the players everything they purchased on faction 1, automatically unlocked on the other two, then they still make no more and no less money. Only by giving some things (Camo, decals, same exact weapon, vehicle weapons) as account wide unlocks, and keeping others (yes, I am sorry but the Saron is a different weapon than the Vulcan) faction/class specific, they might entice some players to spend some time playing other factions and spending money on SC for those secondary toons.

Obviously not every player will create secondary toons and spend SC on those toons. The fact of the matter is, if they do nothing, those players will never spend SC on secondary toons anyway so they lose nothing. If they make the change on all items across factions, they lose nothing and they gain nothing (so why spend money paying developers to include something that does not create revenue?). If they change only the esthetics, then some few players will explore and spend SC. SOE has everything to gain by going this route and nothing to lose by doing anything different.

[Redshift]

stuff

There's a sweet spot though, where the priceis low enough that loats of people buy it, and overall this generats more revenue

Currently PS2 players feel like they're being ripped off when they spend £7 on something that can't even be used on alts.

My alt chars will never have any money spent on them as is, because it's just too damn expensive, once unlocks are account wide i might be tempted because my main might use it too.

[Badjuju]

I don't feel that people who buy their weapons have actually earned them. Does that make them a bad person? No. At the same time, though, people like me, paying SOE through other means or not, actually work very hard to earn the same unlocks. We deserve these same items in the same store to be unlocked for us account-wide all of the same.
???????
Free game with micro transaction = to make money and why do you think the price is so high on some of the best weapons? Most people or not going to use there hard earned and few cert point to unlock a weapon for 1000 like i was saying befor.
I personaly have no problem paying a few dollars to unlock a cool weapon i like, but dont want to waste my certs on unlocking weapons when i can use them in better ways , but it is nice to have the option if you want to use your certs.
If you cant unlock the counter part weapons like in Alfa squad then Yes you should be at least able to unlock the common pool weapons for all factions!

I would assume the unlocks are for station cash purchases only since certs are earned with a given character to be used for that character, but I could be wrong.

The thing is that SOE needs a business plan which encourages people to spend money. I think unlocking items with certs account wide would be a bad business plan. Not against them unlocking certed weapons, i would just be surprised if SOE went for that. And again, its not like unlocking C4 on one character is going to unlock it on another. People worked for those certs as well, and as I said, certs are earned by a character for a character.

Personally I don't see the point in spending certs on weapons. I play the game, I enjoy it, so I want to give back to SOE so the game will continue to grow and improve. I am simply not going to spend that much money on cosmetic items. I have also unlocked allot of weapons and it just isn't plausible.

I guess I just don't agree with the earring thing personally. I play the game to have fun, not to unlock items. During my time having fun I happen to be rewarded with certs as well, which I am free to spend as I choose. I feel like I earned the $7 i spent on a weapon far more than I earned the 1000 certs. I had to work for that money while the certs are basically a bonus reward I get for playing a game and having fun and are used to customize my character according to my play stile.

Long story short I feel my hard earned cash is more valuable and harder earned than a reward given for playing a game which I would be playing regardless of any rewards given. One I had to work for, the other I had to have fun to earn. The only reason the option to buy weapons is in the game is so you are not required to spend money to gain power or an advantage.

[Xaine]

The main thing that pisses me off about this whole scenario is that people have upvoted something when they don't actually understand what it is.

They're NOT going to let you use a Jackhammer if you have a Lasher. You bought a Lasher, why the hell would you get a Jackhammer and a MCG for free?

That makes no logical sense and no business sense.

So really, whats happened here is, we made them waste development time on something no one wants.

Outstanding.

[Badjuju]

The main thing that pisses me off about this whole scenario is that people have upvoted something when they don't actually understand what it is.

They're NOT going to let you use a Jackhammer if you have a Lasher. You bought a Lasher, why the hell would you get a Jackhammer and a MCG for free?

That makes no logical sense and no business sense.

So really, whats happened here is, we made them waste development time on something no one wants.

Outstanding.

Allot of people understand and want this. I play the same faction on multiple servers, and even if you don't there are allot items (particular vehicle weapons) which are not faction specific. For those who have alts this is a great addition.

I personally have changed which server I play on primarily and cannot wait until I can use the say 10-12 items I've unlocked on my other character.

You can also freely delete and recreate an alt (or even main) if you choose to switch servers with them. People who have not committed allot of time to their characters may choose to do this if they have their 3 slots full.

It just frees you up to do what you want with out worrying about loosing any items you spent money on.

[Xaine]

Allot of people understand and want this. I play the same faction on multiple servers, and even if you don't there are allot items (particular vehicle weapons) which are not faction specific. For those who have alts this is a great addition.

I personally have changed which server I play on primarily and cannot wait until I can use the say 10-12 items I've unlocked on my other character.

You can also freely delete and recreate an alt (or even main) if you choose to switch servers with them. People who have not committed allot of time to their characters may choose to do this if they have their 3 slots full.

It just frees you up to do what you want with out worrying about loosing any items you spent money on.

This is fantastic, don't get me wrong.

But I seriously doubt this would have made it go to the top of the development list on its own.

As seen from this thread, a lot of people believe that they'll be getting free weapons galore.

Another thing as well, I can't actually believe this is a development option. How hard can this be to implement? Shouldn't this just be something random added in a patch?

[Badjuju]

Another thing as well, I can't actually believe this is a development option. How hard can this be to implement? Shouldn't this just be something random added in a patch?

Yea I agree haha. Hopefully it didn't take to much resources, which I can't imagine it would. They have quite a few development teams as well which are fairly specific so I doubt it took away from resources that would otherwise be used to improve gameplay/content.

They probably just put it on the list so the community could see it was in the works. I would imagine it would have went through this month regardless unless people down voted it into the dirt.

Can't wait though personally.

[Gonefshn]

I (like many of you) would like Developer clarification as to what this means.

There are the more obvious ways it would work such as NS weapons being universal to all characters on an account (Example: I buy a bulldog for my sunderer I have it on all my characters).

But how does it work for Empire specific weapon purchases like the VX6-7 for VS or a Saron cannon for a magrider???

What about the MCG/Lasher/Jackhammer????

I'd like to know what benefits I can look forward to.

[Koadster]

Who would make another toon on the same faction, other than on another server?

That makes no sense. What you propose as the outcome can not be justified to me, they will loose a customer.

I have a 2nd TR on the same server, hes a cert farmer that I can use to try out attachments or abilities without wasting certs on my main. Thats a good reason why someone would make a 2nd toon as same faction. ;)

[Baneblade]

It does not apply to certs since not even classes can do that

This statement doesn't make sense.

[ChipMHazard]

The main thing that pisses me off about this whole scenario is that people have upvoted something when they don't actually understand what it is.

They're NOT going to let you use a Jackhammer if you have a Lasher. You bought a Lasher, why the hell would you get a Jackhammer and a MCG for free?

That makes no logical sense and no business sense.

You're probably right. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot players thought they were going to be getting more items for their alts for free, when purchased once.
Well if there's something the devs are good at it's not always being all that clear on specifics.

[Bunk]

How will it work if you have for example one character TR and the other NC?

[Mox]

Where is the thread announcing a proper meta game for the next GU?

Account wide unlocks are cool but unimportant compared to this issue.....

[Twido]

Where is the thread announcing a proper meta game for the next GU?

Account wide unlocks are cool but unimportant compared to this issue.....

Account wide unlocks might be just a little bit easier to impliment.

[Silent Thunder]

Account wide unlocks might be just a little bit easier to impliment.

This basically. Hell its really just a database thing, and I guarantee any code monkey you throw at that sort of thing can bang it out in a few days tops.

[Rahabib]

T-Ray stated in FNO that they prioritize items based on when they can get them done, not necessarily by "importance." Read into that as you will.

[Sledgecrushr]

I was looking at some of the package deals the other day. Out of curiosity I clicked on a tr package and some of the rifles had been crossed out like I had already purchased them. If someone can confirm this then Im thinking rifles will be unlocked across all factions as well as vehicle weapons.

[Mox]

T-Ray stated in FNO that they prioritize items based on when they can get them done, not necessarily by "importance." Read into that as you will.

What should that mean "priorize on when they can get it done"?
Done when its done isnt priorized at all. Thats just stupid nonsense.

[Microdose]

What should that mean "priorize on when they can get it done"?
Done when its done isnt priorized at all. Thats just stupid nonsense.

It means that instead of working on everything all at the same time, the developers prioritize based on amount of effort and importance. Then they only work on the items that are slated for the current release.

Sometimes it makes sense to work on all upgrades that use the same tables or code modules at the same time. Changing a table or code for one item, and then coming back two weeks later to change it again for another item is inefficient. So some changes are prioritized to be worked on later with other similar items.

Another example would be if they can get 14 items done in two weeks but it is going to take three weeks to complete 2 more items, they may prioritize the 14 items and push them into the current release, then start working on the longer items for the following release.