GU07 Updates Vanu Changes & Global Camo Selector

[Hamma]

Didn't see this anywhere yet.

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/322838527857549312

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/322839093492973568

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/322845507858862080

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/322865591960604672

[Hamma]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

[Timealude]

but in this game aside from tanks theres no point in long range engagement as it doesnt help you take territory so even if we have no bullet drop up close TR and NC can still hurt us rather quickly.

[Vashyo]

I feel this change happened to get people to go back to the dying VS population.

They're gonna have the most versatile weapons if this happens. It's not a major change but still, they have similar level stuff in all scenarios + they never have to compensate for the drop

[Laelm]

So, VS weapons will have no downsides...fantastic. Why not just give their weapons an overall buff while they're at it?

[Ghoest9]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.


They have to be better than everyone else because not enough people want to be a purple alien.

[Tom Peters]

Wait, global camo selector? What does this mean?

[Vashyo]

They have to be better than everyone else because not enough people want to be a purple alien.

They need more clothes than skin-tight spandex :)

or just make em all black, that should get all the "cool kidz" to join

[Gimpylung]

We suffer a severe ranged damage penalty Hamma, its disproportionate to the supposed advantage we have without bullet drop.

You can compensate for your bullet drop by aiming a fraction higher, I can't compensate for the damage fall off however.

[Elahhez]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

I will switch Vanu<->TR weapons with you any day, Hamma ;)

[Narrack]

So, VS weapons will have no downsides...fantastic. Why not just give their weapons an overall buff while they're at it?

Though i mainly play NC i do have a low level VS i play with my irl friend and even though there's no bullet drop VS weapons stop dealing decent damage at ranges far shorter than feels reasonable (the damage seems to drop off considerably in just the distance of a biolab aircraft launch pad) and their guns though admittedly i only have access to the default weapons just don't feel as useful so this buff does indeed feel called for.

[Thunderhawk]

I expected there to be an outcry about the damage fall off removal, but what you don't realize is that having it in was a cheap way to balance the weapons.

It's not the way it should have been in the first place.

Someone list me the TR and NC "negativities" here so we can compare all 3 empires, because frankly, Bullet Drop is much more acceptable and can be compensated for by actions of the player, compared to knowing that no matter what you do, at a certain range, you just dont hit like the other guy.

All TR and NC players had to do with take into account the drop and hey presto, they still hit you, where as we could not do anything - unless you consider running head on towards the enemy was an acceptable way to "compensate".

If they introduce Bullet drop for the VS guns, we'll happily take it, I'm sure they're thinking of something.

[Necroe]

We suffer a severe ranged damage penalty Hamma, its disproportionate to the supposed advantage we have without bullet drop.

You can compensate for your bullet drop by aiming a fraction higher, I can't compensate for the damage fall off however.

^^ this.

other factions can overcome theyre disadvantages - shooting in bursts, aiming higher, but our miraculous no bullet drop doesnt help when we suffer a dmg penalty (and bullet drop doesnt come into the equation most of the time)

[Assist]

FUCK YEAH!
Higby you are AWESOME!

[Sledgecrushr]

Im pretty happy with it. Whatever it takes to fill the vanu ranks.

[bpostal]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

I suppose, but on Miller the VS is usually the lowest pop anyway so I don't mind that much.

[Assist]

We suffer a severe ranged damage penalty Hamma, its disproportionate to the supposed advantage we have without bullet drop.

You can compensate for your bullet drop by aiming a fraction higher, I can't compensate for the damage fall off however.

It's more the bullet drop over range is very overstated. It's quite literally nothing at 65m, which is where our damage loss starts.

[SokarGoldberg]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

How do they come up with changes like this? Totally useless. What kind of downside do those weapon have? It is unbelievable that those weapons get buffs while NC always gets debuffs even the weapons are shitty already.. WTF!

The more the game progresses the more I regret that I have spend money on it! And this didn't change for any of the updates they did.

Each update has some little fun thing aside with a big disapointment rolling in. Each weapon I bought last month got debuffed and each of the weapons I bought lost the reason why I decided to buy those weapons in the first place... I wouldn't have choosen this weapons that I now have to live with.

For me this only concludes one thing.. I will not invest in weapons anymore. Some advice: Learn to play with the already maxed debuffed weapons.. with those you can't get disappointed again.. over and over again.

[camycamera]

It's more the bullet drop over range is very overstated. It's quite literally nothing at 65m, which is where our damage loss starts.

then they should change it to 100m, not remove it completely just so more people go on. and i'm pretty sure that TR on Briggs is the lowest pop, but that doesn't mean they suck. if anything we are doing fine, the other day we took over esamir thanks to an alert event.

population doesn't mean anything, having brains does :D

god damnit Higgles.

[Ghoest9]

It's more the bullet drop over range is very overstated. It's quite literally nothing at 65m, which is where our damage loss starts.

Well I can tell you that VS slug guns are much better weapons than NC slug guns already - because of the no drop. They were one of the few VS weapoins that had similar damage drop off to NC and TR at range.

[AThreatToYou]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

It's asking for a rebalance, and I think it's a step in the right direction.

Well I can tell you that VS slug guns are much better weapons than NC slug guns already - because of the no drop. They were one of the few VS weapoins that had similar damage drop off to NC and TR at range.

this, too

[Assist]

then they should change it to 100m, not remove it completely just so more people go on. and i'm pretty sure that TR on Briggs is the lowest pop, but that doesn't mean they suck. if anything we are doing fine, the other day we took over esamir thanks to an alert event.

population doesn't mean anything, having brains does :D

god damnit Higgles.

I think it's more to do with the fact that the VS faction downside is the only downside that cannot be compensated for by player skill.

[Aaron]

I wouldn't mind that they increase the difficulty of VS weapons for more effectiveness. They could decrease bullet speed, for instance.

[SternLX]

What!!!? You mean I won't feel like I'm shooting off sticks of soft Butter anymore!? Awesome!

[Boildown]

Can anyone taste that? Its the flavor of the month, and its changing.

Something else cool for GU07: Global camo selector for all loadouts for infantry, vehicles and weapons!

Yay! Something I asked for! Not all of it, but at least some of it.

[Mordelicius]

They have to be better than everyone else because not enough people want to be a purple alien.
^ I was going to make a long post how VS whine and complain about their population in the official forum, in-game and (most likely) dev twitter but that's a more concise and direct explanation.

And I was going to suggest ( in a soon to be GU7/8 wishlist thread) about giving more penalties to weapons with High rate of fire + High accuracy. Now they've buffed it even more :lol: Now, the Vanu has their accuracy (small cone, recoil), no drop, TR's high rate of fire, and now the damage to boot.

Here's why high accuracy + high rate of combination is overpowered already.
- Those two are the biggest characteristic strength in low TTK.
- They excel in line of sight war (hard to poke your head out or move out of cover when being fired upon hence enemies are easier to pin down or kill; amplify this effect when there are more players in an area)
- They excel in shooting moving targets (especially with the bad hit registration).
- They excel in headshots.

[Koadster]

I just hope the buff max dmg resistance vs VS weapons. They always kill me way faster turn tr/nc. Well really maxes in general need a large inf weapon resistance boost.

[krnasaur]

global camo selector is exactly what I wanted.

seriously, this is awesome.

[Frozenland]

I feel this change happened to get people to go back to the dying VS population.

They're gonna have the most versatile weapons if this happens. It's not a major change but still, they have similar level stuff in all scenarios + they never have to compensate for the drop

The thing to keep in mind is that Vanu weapons have relatively slower bullet velocity. That is the same as having bullet drop. So it balances out.

[Artimus]

^^ this.

other factions can overcome theyre disadvantages - shooting in bursts, aiming higher, but our miraculous no bullet drop doesnt help when we suffer a dmg penalty (and bullet drop doesnt come into the equation most of the time)

The NC guns, unless your know your gun is still hard to land hits at distances. I cant speak for the TR guns nor VS guns.

The fact of the matter is the 3 factions all have distinct strenghts and weakness. To me, it seems like some of you want balancing to the point were every faction is the same which is simply not the case.

If the devs were worried about this I don't think Higby would have twerted it.

[Fishy]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

sounds to me like the "additional damage penalty" was some additional damage the Vanu got when being shot at (to compensate on no bullet drop), and that now they are removing that.

I heard that for GU8 they are giving the VS Aircraft carriers, X-Fighters, and laser swords to offset the bad haircut of female #2 from the character creation selection screen.

[Dragonskin]

Sorry, but as a TR we still have the biggest advantage on most weapons... mag size. I will take extra bullets over zero bullet drop any day.

The camo selector is pretty nice.

[Snoopy]

NC Forum Warrior OP.

[Tenhi]

There are so many missconceptions about Vanu weapons its not even funny.

http://ps2model-axiom.rhcloud.com/#dmg/la/1/22/24

Thats how the dmg fall off works right now. At the same starting tier of 143dmg we fall "slower" until ~71.2m. After 71.2m we fall below the TR/NC weapons. Basically VS weapons allways dealt MORE damage under 71.2m but LESS over 71.2m. With the changes VS/TR/NC will be exactly the same fall off wise.

We have the same Magsize as NC, but lower dmg per bullet. TR has larger Magsizes but same dmg per bullet (VS standard LMG dmg is 143, TR is 143 too. TR has 1 167dmg LMG, VS has 2. VS standard Carbine is 143dmg... same as TR. VS has 1 167dmg carbine, TR has 0). Vanu has the lowest dmg per magazine. BUT we reload faster. Now think what you want more in CQC... fast reload or a larger(more dmg) magazine? The Carv has a 99 bullet magazine with a 5.4sec short reload (99 bullets or you get the long reload ;)) and 750rpm. It takes 99/(750/60) = 7.92s to dump your whole magazine. The Orion has 750rpm and 49 bullet magazine with a 2.8sec short reload (again 49 for the short reload)... thats (49/(750/60))*2 + 2.8sec = 10.64secs to dump 98 bullets. They both deal 143dmg@10m. So basically the Carv 9 deals the same damage faster... because it has a bigger magazine. Its the same for Carbines. If you dump 39 bullets and then reloads you deal your damage faster than a VS Carbine that reloads at 29 bullets and shoots another 10 bullets.

Then about "no bullet drop" as an "advantage". The normal bullet drop is 11.25m/s (meter fall/flighttime). Lets just use the same weapons again. The Carv 9 has a bullet velocity of 600m/s. So if your target is 70m away it takes 70/600 = 0,1167s to flythat distance. With 0.1167s flight and 11.25m/s drop you get 0.1167 * 11.25 = 1.3125m drop. If the average player model is 1.8m high (thats an assumption) you will still hit him even if you aim at his head. Also because the recoil allways pulls your weapon upwards you will hit even "better". To completely miss the 1.8m character you need to be at a distance of (1.8/11.25)*600 = 96m... if you aim directly at the head at 100m you will miss because of bullet drop. How often do we fight at 96m?

Also you can simply adjust to bullet drop by getting used to it. I play a NC as 2nd char and its really not that hard. It might take some time but you also need time to learn the recoil for every new weapon. On the other hand have you ever tried to compensate for damage fall off? Its not possible. The only thing you can do is get closer... and that is often not a very good option.

Next point. "Accuracy" the accuracy (CoF/Recoil) is almost the same for TR and VS. There are some exceptions but overall its pretty much the same (and that goes for CoF AND Recoil). And if we are talking about long range accuracy... the NC wins... why? Because they have very low CoF with a higher recoil (highest NC recoil with 0.55 is the SAW, highest VS recoil is 0.45). That means that their first few shots will almost hit the same spot. The SAW has a CoF of 0... that means the first shot is pin point accurate. There is a reason why the SAW is the best long range LMG in the game (if you cert it out, but even uncerted)... simply because of the low CoF. You cant compensate for CoF other than burst firing, but you can "easily" compensate for recoil. This also not only applies to LMGs, even the NC Carbines and ARs have low CoF. Thats also why I dont get the "NC is CQC faction" thingy... they have low RoF, high damage, low CoF, high recoil weapons... that SCREAMS long range combat.

One thing that I find quite funny is that VS has slightly higher (on average) bullet velocity than TR. Not sure why that is.

Oh and a small paragraph about RoF. On average the TR RoF is higher. The other factions have some weapons in the high RoF tiers but its only a few.

896rpm - 1TR/0NC/0VS
845rpm - 2TR/2NC/2VS
800rpm - 4TR/2NC/2VS
750rpm - 7TR/1NC/2VS
698rpm - 3TR/0NC/6VS

I think you can see the trend here. TR has the fastest RoF. Is it "unfair" that not all TR weapons have high RoF but some VS/NC ones get the same RoF? Not sure. Its more a matter of supporting different playstyles if you ask me...

Edit: Also if you really want to "nerf" something about the VS weapons because we lose the damage fall off... nerf our bullet velocity. They used that to balance our shotguns and I think it works. We have no bullet drop but we need to lead more because our bullets take longer to reach their target. Sounds fair if you ask me. (That is if VS weapons need a nerf at all ;)).

Edit2: Also seeing that the average score for infantry combat is dominated by TR on ALL classes (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AmUavphHXmIxdFhHUzJfN1VYalRnWS0xMnBUdTJpM 1E&gid=37) buffing the VS doesnt seem that odd. Whats odd is that they dont buff the NC weapons a little bit. The NC weapons are constantly underperforming, HA/Inf are the only classes where it take 2nd place... and MAX where its first ;).

Also I dont think that "no damage fall off" is such a cool thing that tons of 4th empire/new player will go to VS. IMHO VS has an issue with its overall design and "feel" than with weapons/vehicle. Our weapons SOUND incredible weak. If you are a long time VS only player and test a SAW... the sound will knock you out of your spandex. Even the fast firing TR weapons sound way better. An other thing is the look of the weapons... they look like they are made out of plastics. If you compare them with the NC weapons that LOOK like real weapons... its just bad. Also talking about the colors... I'm not one of the "purple is gay" crowd... but I think there are many that think such silly things. If you want a more "neutral" color for VS... why not green? Red/blue/green would be pretty good for 3 factions. You can discern them easily AND green is more "accepted" than purple. Also green can go very well with the whole "alien"-thingy ;)

[Falcon_br]

Yeah, I agree with him, nerf VS bullet speed and we can live with that.
I am already tired of dying to head shots from the Vanu battle rifle.
Today we were attacking jaeger crossing and I was using the squad waypoint to measure the distance.
The firefight was happening at 200-300 meters I was using the tmg-50 to get some kills, also tried the Sabs-13 with some kills, but I gave up and started sniping and killing non stop, too bad in the first respawn I was still with the silencer equipped and for that distance, you can't hit moving target with it.
If we were fighting the Vanu, we would have the upper hand because of the damage, now, we will be losing it because on that range, bullet drop is a big factor!
Or just remove the bullet drop from the game and let the sniper war start! Not all shooters have bullet drop today, and none of them are real bullet drop.
I think that only in the arma series the game have a real bullet drop of 0 increasing 9,8 m/s/s. A bullet drop of 11,25 m/s is really strange to understand for a real shooter, but maybe they got the average bullet drop in 200m and made it linear.

[ChipMHazard]

Looks fair enough, although they will probably end up making the VS rounds a bit slower to compensate.
Same reason why VS shotguns have slower moving projectiles than the rest, to better balance out their no drop slugs.

[Snydenthur]

Looks fair enough, although they will probably end up making the VS rounds a bit slower to compensate.
Same reason why VS shotguns have slower moving projectiles than the rest, to better balance out their no drop slugs.

Even if they buffed the bullet velocity, it wouldn't really make a difference. If someone just sits there taking damage from long range, he/she will die to a bullet moving much slower too. And even a high bullet velocity wouldn't make killing a moving target at long range much easier.

I think that is the best possible buff they could give. It doesn't really have any effect on the gameplay but it's a buff so people might think vanu became better. In reality we just go from no advantage and one tiny disadvantage to no advantage and no disadvantage.

[Timealude]

I think that is the best possible buff they could give. It doesn't really have any effect on the gameplay but it's a buff so people might think vanu became better. In reality we just go from no advantage and one tiny disadvantage to no advantage and no disadvantage.

Which is what the devs seem to have planned for us all along, we are in between the NC and the TR as far as differences go.

[Jaybonaut]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

We don't shoot the fastest, we don't have the most ammo, and we don't hit the hardest - instead, we don't have bullet drop.

Bullet drop is not a negative once you've played a TR or NC character long enough, since it becomes second nature. It isn't some big huge advantage for VS.

[Jaybonaut]

I am already tired of dying to head shots from the Vanu battle rifle.


Sorry but everyone in my outfit thinks the Eidelon is a piece of junk.

[Germanius]

Where is the balance? Will TR and NC also be buffed?

[Lucecarentes]

Using VS weapons at medium or long range is pointless thanks to the massive damage decay we have, this will finally fix this problem.

Also to the TR and NC whiners, you guys do realise the only + our weapons have is no bullet drop, TR has a higher fire rate and more ammo per magazine while NC has alot more damage while we have.... no bulletdrop and nothing else so stop your QQuing. Honestly you guys act like bulletdrop is something hard to controll, did all of you play COD before planetside 2 ? Play ArmA and a bit of Battlefield and you'll learn to controll bulletdrop pretty fast. I don't have any issues with bulletdrop on my NC on woodman, actully i perform better with my NC than with my VS.

test the VS weapons yourself, no don't just play for 5 minutes and get 1 kill and than say "duuur i killed sumthing , dis wepon is obviously OP, imma go whine on the forums" play for 10 or 20 hours with a VS and try using our guns at long range, you'll go nuts how bad they are due to the lower damage.

[ChipMHazard]

Where is the balance? Will TR and NC also be buffed?

I don't see what kind of buff TR firearms would need.

[Snoopy]

^Nor the NC...

Clearly NC is so under powered, that's why they have the highest populations and most 4th factioners on ever server.

[Merzun]

Don't know why they do this other than bringing more people to VS. At the moment in my opinion there is a good balance for most of the weapons. Also there is no huge bullet drop for VS at range. For comparable weapons VS need 1 bullet more to kill at distances past 65-75 m. This is compensated by better accuracy and easier control.

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/proof-that-vanu-is-op-right-now.72684/

[Rothnang]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

How so? They do less damage than NC weapons and have smaller magazines than TR weapons. The only upside they ever had was the lack of bullet drop, and bullet drop isn't exactly a huge benefit. At the most common combat ranges you can't even tell the difference between a gun with bullet drop and without bullet drop.

I would take bullet drop any day for 10 more rounds in the magazine. In a game where most of your ability with firearms is determined by your ability to compensate for recoil it's patently absurd to act as though it's a big deal if you also compensate for a tiny little bit of bullet drop while you're at it. Any good player does that without even thinking about it.

This isn't like War of the Roses where you have to aim a crossbow 3-4 meters above someones head if you want to peg them at 100 meters. You just aim at someones forehead and still hit them in the mouth.

[Dougnifico]

I hope it helps their population. They really need it, and I hope they take it from the NC. Still, I think this should be dusted off once again...

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/Tren40/Difficulty_zpsbdab2876.jpg

[Rothnang]

Vanu is in no way the easiest faction to play, and in all honesty, anyone who ever said that is an idiot.

This just goes right along with some clowns proclaiming since beta that "Vanu weapons have no recoil" and "No bullet drop is a huge advantage".

Vanu weapons have gotten 2 major buffs since beta, one to their bullet speed and one to their reload speed, and now to their dropoff - and all that while people were shouting about how OP and easymode vanu weapons are.

Either the devs have completely lost their mind and keep buffing the strongest guns or the whole notion of "easymode guns" is bullshit.

[Snydenthur]

I hope it helps their population. They really need it, and I hope they take it from the NC. Still, I think this should be dusted off once again...

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h285/Tren40/Difficulty_zpsbdab2876.jpg

What makes vanu "easy mode"? I have tried nc too. Default weapon with no attachments and I didn't notice any difference in weapon control compared to any vanu weapon. It's not like the recoil in this game is hard to control. Only thing that matters in this game is the first shot recoil. That is pretty much very balanced. Comparing carbines though, vs has the worst. Vx6-7 has the first shot recoil of an enormous 0,9. Next worst carbine was from tr, something 0,705. Didn't check all of them but by the looks of things, most carbines seem to hover around 0.6-0.7 recoil for the first shot.

[Whiteagle]

How do they come up with changes like this? Totally useless. What kind of downside do those weapon have? It is unbelievable that those weapons get buffs while NC always gets debuffs even the weapons are shitty already.. WTF!
The NC's weapons aren't shitty, they just favor longer engagement ranges and accuracy.

Only reason you think they suck is because we got stuck with a bunch of shacks for "Bases" that make everything either CQC or a Vehicle farm.
The new bases on the Test Server will hopefully fix this.

[Sturmhardt]

I don't get the Vanu change at all, there's no downside to their weapons anymore.

I guess it's the upside of running around in purple spandex. Nobody would choose the gay faction if it didn't come with an advantage.

[hashish]

The thing to keep in mind is that Vanu weapons have relatively slower bullet velocity. That is the same as having bullet drop. So it balances out.

This is true.. Alot of you guys who dont play as VS as their main character talk alot of shit when it comes to our VS weapons lol.. Some1 here said we have low recoil and small cone of fire which is BULLSHIT hahaha, only like 2 or 3 weapons on VS are like that as they are with other factions.. We too get alot of recoil and huge cone of fire on our guns, also our bullet travel time is significantly slower than NC or TR, so in a way this acts as bullet drop because instead of shooting above we have to shoot infront and anticipate movement which is actually much harder..

The buff should be welcomed by all.. If any of you NC and TR guys whine about it then your all a bunch of pussy-cats (dnt wanna be rude here :p) lol

[Thunderhawk]

The more people that I thought knew about the game keep posting about this change, the more I realize a lot of people have the innate human nature of "omg the enemy is getting changed, not fair, stamp stamp stamp feet"

If you can't see why this change is coming into play, then you need to stop looking at it from your faction's tinted glasses.

[Whiteagle]

The more people that I thought knew about the game keep posting about this change, the more I realize a lot of people have the innate human nature of "omg the enemy is getting changed, not fair, stamp stamp stamp feet"

If you can't see why this change is coming into play, then you need to stop looking at it from your faction's tinted glasses.
Hey man this is why I bothered rolling VS and NC characters on the test server before a TR one, and then make a point of using Stock as much as possible.

[NoblesseOblige]

Long time lurker, first time poster. Decided to come out of the woodwork so I could give my two-cents. Granted, most of my experience is anecdotal and I have no hard stats or data, but there ya go.

I usually main an NC on Waterson, but from time to time I hop on Miller as a VS. I can tell you from personal experience that bullet drop is not as big of a deal as you think. I typically run a Medic with a Reaper DMR. Now supposedly, NC weapons have the most egregious bullet drop of the three empires, but I literally had never noticed bullet drop being a major factor until recently. The zerg and I were assaulting the last few TR bases on Amerish and were cleaning up around the warpgate. We reached a point where the TR were on one end of a canyon and we were on the other and we were trading shots back and forth. I ended up certing a 6x scope just for that encounter. That was the first time I ever had to noticeably compensate for bullet drop.

Cut to Miller, where the VS and I are assaulting an NC base on Indar (AMP Station?) We breached the wall and were trying to get inside. My main role is sniper for this character. I was perched on a wall taking pot shots at NC troops running out of the vehicle area. My pinpoint accurate sniper rifle didn't really mean much of anything because I was at a distance where damage degradation was a factor, so while it took me anywhere from 2-4 shots to drop someone, it would take them 2-3 bullets from an assault rifle to drop my shields. The only reason I was able to get kills that run was because I was smart enough to know when to cloak and change cover. I ended up getting an SMG for my infiltrator, just so I wouldn't have to worry about the damage loss.

My point is, like a previous poster said, bullet drop is something that can be compensated for with a higher zoom scope and a little skill. Damage degradation for VS weapons is something that happens, no matter what you do. If in the course of balancing, they decided the damage drop was in fact necessary, I would like to suggest that the damage drop off happens at a distance where bullet drop is an actual real factor, because at the distance where the VS sniper rifle starts to lose damage, the NC assault rifles just barely start to see bullet drop.

[Assist]

Long time lurker, first time poster. Decided to come out of the woodwork so I could give my two-cents. Granted, most of my experience is anecdotal and I have no hard stats or data, but there ya go.

I usually main an NC on Waterson, but from time to time I hop on Miller as a VS. I can tell you from personal experience that bullet drop is not as big of a deal as you think. I typically run a Medic with a Reaper DMR. Now supposedly, NC weapons have the most egregious bullet drop of the three empires, but I literally had never noticed bullet drop being a major factor until recently. The zerg and I were assaulting the last few TR bases on Amerish and were cleaning up around the warpgate. We reached a point where the TR were on one end of a canyon and we were on the other and we were trading shots back and forth. I ended up certing a 6x scope just for that encounter. That was the first time I ever had to noticeably compensate for bullet drop.

Cut to Miller, where the VS and I are assaulting an NC base on Indar (AMP Station?) We breached the wall and were trying to get inside. My main role is sniper for this character. I was perched on a wall taking pot shots at NC troops running out of the vehicle area. My pinpoint accurate sniper rifle didn't really mean much of anything because I was at a distance where damage degradation was a factor, so while it took me anywhere from 2-4 shots to drop someone, it would take them 2-3 bullets from an assault rifle to drop my shields. The only reason I was able to get kills that run was because I was smart enough to know when to cloak and change cover. I ended up getting an SMG for my infiltrator, just so I wouldn't have to worry about the damage loss.

My point is, like a previous poster said, bullet drop is something that can be compensated for with a higher zoom scope and a little skill. Damage degradation for VS weapons is something that happens, no matter what you do. If in the course of balancing, they decided the damage drop was in fact necessary, I would like to suggest that the damage drop off happens at a distance where bullet drop is an actual real factor, because at the distance where the VS sniper rifle starts to lose damage, the NC assault rifles just barely start to see bullet drop.

I get what you're trying to say, but you used the wrong gun my friend! The Sniper rifles are mirror images of each other on the opposing factions, the NC/TR/VS Snipers all work identical.

[NoblesseOblige]

I get what you're trying to say, but you used the wrong gun my friend! The Sniper rifles are mirror images of each other on the opposing factions, the NC/TR/VS Snipers all work identical.

Ah, see I didn't know that. I don't really snipe on any other empire, so I guess that show's my ignorance on the subject. To be fair, I have noticed the same problem with other VS weapons. It's probably why I don't play on Miller as much as I'd like to because while bullets are hitting me like a truck, at certain distance, I feel like my little "pew pew" lasers barely tickle.

[KaskaMatej]

I get what you're trying to say, but you used the wrong gun my friend! The Sniper rifles are mirror images of each other on the opposing factions, the NC/TR/VS Snipers all work identical.

Spectre and Phantom, semi-automatic sniper rifles, have lower minimum damage, 250 damage at 200 metres (compared to 334 damage at 75 metres). NC/TR will always have a 3-shot-kill while VS will have to hit 4 times at 100+ metres for a kill (discounting headshots at stock suit slots).

Only bolt-action sniper rifles are reskins with identical stats.

[AThreatToYou]

I kind of want them to return NC to hardmode faction balance to the game by buffing VS.
Also, that "Easy/Medium/Hard" image was created near release, where the vanu really were easy mode. I wouldn't have said NC was hardmode, but hey, apparently it was.

[Silent Thunder]

I kind of want them to return NC to hardmode faction balance to the game by buffing VS.
Also, that "Easy/Medium/Hard" image was created near release, where the vanu really were easy mode. I wouldn't have said NC was hardmode, but hey, apparently it was.

Yea Late October/Early November the faction balance we pretty bad at times. Now its more that one faction has 6 of one, the other a half dozen of the other, and both sides seem to think that the other's is more.

[Carbon Copied]

Probably the best place to post this for those that missed it :confused:

http://www.twitch.tv/las0m/b/390420726

[Gonefshn]

Having no bullet drop is not even an advantage. I have never noticed the bullet drop once playing NC or TR.

Though maybe they could just remove the vanu's lack of bullet drop so people don't whine.

[Ghoest9]

Having no bullet drop is not even an advantage. I have never noticed the bullet drop once playing NC or TR.

Though maybe they could just remove the vanu's lack of bullet drop so people don't whine.

Ive noticed it frequently with slugs.

[Tenhi]

Ive noticed it frequently with slugs.

Then again Slug Shotguns are the only weapons where you will notice it. Simply because they have veeeeeery slow bullet velocity.

[Gonefshn]

Then again Slug Shotguns are the only weapons where you will notice it. Simply because they have veeeeeery slow bullet velocity.

This guy.

Honestly I notice bullet drop so little that rather than argue with NC and TR players that the Vanu's range damage degredation is a way worse flaw than having bullet drop I'd rather SOE just make our guns work the same.

NC and TR are going to be mad if Vanu weapons still have no bullet drop and also Work the same with damage degredation. Personally I don't call it an advantage, so if you honestly need to make it completely fair just make vanu weapons have drop.

[Juryrig]

I've mainly played VS since launch, with an NC alt. As a noob I found the VS guns much easier to deal with...at launch. I also have little experience with FPS so my skill level is basically zero.

Then when playing my NC recently, I've noticed the difference - it's easier to hit things with the VS weapons, but much easier to KILL, especially at mid range, with the NC guns now.

About an hour ago I started a TR, just for comparison.

Haha. Hahaha. Hahahahahahahahaaaaa.

Dear god, the VS guns are shit by comparison. I have a real lingering loyalty to my VS, but it really feels gimped, and I'm not just referring to the purple spandex suit.

[Electrofreak]

After watching Higby's sneak peek (http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=54432) I suddenly understand the VS change. VS pops are dwindling, and introducing detailed weapon stats with the weapon falloff graphs would cause a lot more VS to bail when they see those graphs.

[Falcon_br]

Ok, so lets remove the weapon drop from the game, just leave it to the bolt action sniper rifles, like it is in battlefield.

[KaskaMatej]

just leave it to the bolt action sniper rifles, like it is in battlefield.

All guns in Battlefield (since Battlefield 2) have bullet drop. You might not notice it if you don't use high powered scope.

[psijaka]

Bullet drop is only really significant when long range sniping, so I hardly think that having no bullet drop and no damage drop off is OP.

[KaskaMatej]

Strange nobody mentioned the Lasher:

http://i.imgur.com/ovKzeXS.jpg

[Isokon]

Strange nobody mentioned the Lasher:

http://i.imgur.com/ovKzeXS.jpg

I thought that was cool, not just because it looks good. It's the first time (I think) they went and made a visual change to one of the already existing guns.

[Koadster]

Haha. Hahaha. Hahahahahahahahaaaaa.

Dear god, the VS guns are shit by comparison. I have a real lingering loyalty to my VS, but it really feels gimped, and I'm not just referring to the purple spandex suit.

The grass is always greener :rolleyes:

[Juryrig]

The grass is always greener :rolleyes:

Yeah, I thought that when I posted it. I'm trying to amass playtime on all three so I can see whether there really is a difference, or whether it's just familiarity v novelty.

[Thunderhawk]

Finally I am seeing people that have played all three factions come out and speak sense.

I too have characters on all 3 empires hence my frustration with some of the uneducated responses to the damage degradation debate on this thread.

Glad common sense is now prevailing.

[Falcon_br]

Well, the original concept it was the Vanu had less damage from range because they won't miss because of the bullet drop.
But now that we have played countless hours, we can easily compensate bullet drop, but the Vanu can't compensate the damage fallout.
But now, the Vanu will have the same damage and no bullet drop? I really think the long ranges fight will favor the Vanu players. As I said, maybe removing bullet drop from the game is not a bad decision, just keep it on the sniper rifles and lets live with it.
And for those that still think all fight are from close range, guess what, the Vanu damage is the same as everyone in the ranges told here! To be smaller they must be beyond 65m, and as I said, there are lots of firefights over 100m in the game, just press B and learn to single shot your enemy!

[Jaybonaut]

I guess it's the upside of running around in purple spandex. Nobody would choose the gay faction if it didn't come with an advantage.

When do I get to break it to my wife that you think we are gay? The 'Vanu is homosexual' intentional insults really need to stop.

[BlaxicanX]

To be fair, playing the gay faction doesn't make you gay. It just means you're playing the gay faction. And what's wrong with that?

This homophobe over here..

[Snydenthur]

To be fair, playing the gay faction doesn't make you gay. It just means you're playing the gay faction. And what's wrong with that?

This homophobe over here..

And what makes it gay faction? Color? Come on, what year is this again?

To those that want to remove our useless benefit or give it to others too, what would you then give us as a benefit? I gladly switch no bullet drop for bigger clips or more damage. Oh, maybe we should get a smaller cone of fire. I'm up for that. Or no first shot recoil multiplier, yeah, that's it.

[Varsam]

This notion that VS weapons will suddenly have no weaknesses is lolworthy. They'll still have damage dropoff, just like every other gun. They'll still have some of the smallest LMG magazine sizes in the game. They'll still have mediocre projectile velocity. They'll still have recoil, CoF bloom, muzzle flair, movement multipliers, etc etc... just like everyone else. The ONLY difference now will be that they'll have no bullet drop. And I'm going to go ahead and say that if you think that that's anything more than an interesting but inconsequential quirk, you have clearly not spent any appreciable amount of time playing cross-faction. Either that or you don't play infantry enough.

[BlaxicanX]

And what makes it gay faction? Color? Come on, what year is this again?


What? No! C'mon bro, we're not idiots.

It's obviously the spandex.

[Sir B Smythe]

Sod the pointless argument about weapons...... Yay global camo button :D

[ThatGoatGuy]

With the global camos thing, I have a bit of an annoyance. I can use my multiuse camos on all three factions, but I bought the digital camo set on the weekly sale (I know, digital camos are empire specific), it's a bundle so why shouldn't it be for every char?

[CraazyCanuck]

Thanks Higby! Maybe now i won't cringe everytime I get into a med-long range infantry engagement. Especially when up against the NC and the SAW. That weapon is insane with the TMG-50 a close second.

Started playing my TR and NC toons more because of my frustration with the VS infantry weapons at range. Here's hoping I can shelve my TR and NC now.