Claymore sucks compare to other factions anti infantry mines

[Sunrock]

I am so sick and tiered of the claymore only have 45° trigger radius but the NC and VS have 360°

It's just pure dumb luck if some one dies to it because either it is placed so the enemy see it easily or it is easily avoided.

[Hamma]

I'm more upset about it myself because it has those massive green lasers that are easily spotted whereas the NC/VS ones are almost invisible.

[Sunrock]

Yea I forgot to mention those damn laser that indicates where you should avoid to step too if you don't want to trigger it.

[bpostal]

We'll file this under: Reasons to not waste certs on Claymores.

I'd rather put a tank mine down and shoot the damn thing.

[Neutral Calypso]

I have had good success with claymores myself.

...and also my vanu toon can confirm that the green lasers are no longer visible on them to other factions.

At least, they weren't the last time I played vanu.

The problem with claymores is they pretty much require you to place them just around corners and such. However, when placed effectively, I have had excellent success with them lately.

I'd be more annoyed with how enemies can just toss their AI mines on the run with little trouble. Though I will have to experiment with whether one can do anything even remotely similar with claymores. ~_~

[Whiteagle]

Well shouldn't the Claymore have longer reach since it's a directional charge?

[Rbstr]

As VS, I honestly don't ever notice the claymores.

But that's because I wear flack armor and walk through doors with impunity.

[AThreatToYou]

IIRC, Claymores have a farther trigger radius than NC/VS mines and can be placed on the side of a door and still trigger no matter where the enemy walks through it.

also IIRC, Claymores were basically shotgun mines that should have a long and wide kill radius, probably much more than an explosive, although it's obviously not 360 degrees.

but I'll say
I hate VS mines more than I hate claymores because I can't freaking see them. I've actually seen a couple claymores and dodged em, so there's that. It must suck for you TR having to fight two factions that don't have claymore.

[WSNeo]

I hate VS mines more than I hate claymores because I can't freaking see them. I've actually seen a couple claymores and dodged em, so there's that. It must suck for you TR having to fight two factions that don't have claymore.

Pfft, our mines are teal and purple, how can you not see them :P

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/8d3QzODB1Y0/mqdefault.jpg

[Falcon_br]

IIRC, Claymores have a farther trigger radius than NC/VS mines and can be placed on the side of a door and still trigger no matter where the enemy walks through it.

also IIRC, Claymores were basically shotgun mines that should have a long and wide kill radius, probably much more than an explosive, although it's obviously not 360 degrees.

but I'll say
I hate VS mines more than I hate claymores because I can't freaking see them. I've actually seen a couple claymores and dodged em, so there's that. It must suck for you TR having to fight two factions that don't have claymore.

So, you don´t now they got more nerfed them the other mines!
Now they don´t even have a reach to cover completely a "door" to capture point or generators, people can jump or just enter from the other corner of the "door" so the mine don´t explode.
Before the anti personal mine nerf, we could get some multikill for been directional.
Now, if we can kill one with it, we got luck!
Also, the triggering radius it the same as the other empire, but one direction only! Is just have 20% more reach that doesn't matter because you can´t place it in the middle of the door, you must place it on a corner.
And I really don´t know what is the difference in the proximity mine and the jumping mine, my suggestions to nerf them, is making the jumping one doing 50% damage to crouched infantry, and the motion mine don´t triggering unless the enemy is running with shift. So the other faction can know what is having a usefulness mine that most be combined with anti tank mines if you want to kill someone.
Also today a proximity mine just did more them 60% damage to me using full flak armor, what It was really strange, normally I just lost shields for it and it happened twice today, maybe they got buffed in the last stealth patch?

[Canaris]

There's only 2 options for fixing this that would be acceptable.

Either the TR claymores become like the Betties & Prox Mines or those two become like the claymore.

[camycamera]

I'm more upset about it myself because it has those massive green lasers that are easily spotted whereas the NC/VS ones are almost invisible.


fucking same.

edit: AND SRSLY?! IT ONLY HAS A 45 DEGREE ANGLE?! this is fucking bullshit. needs an overhaul, and that is common sense that it needs one.

no wonder i have only got 1 kill with it.

and we NEED TO BE ABLE TO PICK IT BACK UP AGAIN, SAME AS C4

[ShepardCommand]

Whining that your cheap loser weapon isn't as effective as the others?

I want a secondary weapon that doubles as an SMG. Repeater is beyond OP compared to all other faction specific pistols. Then we can talk.

[Gatekeeper]

As a VS I can say that both Betties and Claymores are effective (in killing me, at least), but Claymores are a *lot* easier to spot. Personally I'd prefer they make Betties and Prox Mines easier to see, rather than changing Claymores.

[Sunrock]

I'd be more annoyed with how enemies can just toss their AI mines on the run with little trouble. Though I will have to experiment with whether one can do anything even remotely similar with claymores. ~_~

Jup this is what anoys the crap out of me. When I'm runing after some one and they just throw a AI mine down that is totally invisible... And no I don't think you can. I have placed claymores down in front of an enemy but I think it takes a few sec for the claymore to "deploy" so as long as the enemy is moving it's just a freak chance he dies and most likely after he killed you.

Well shouldn't the Claymore have longer reach since it's a directional charge?

It has a little bit longer reach but it's not just very little.

IIRC, Claymores have a farther trigger radius than NC/VS mines and can be placed on the side of a door and still trigger no matter where the enemy walks through it.



Well regarding cover the door. If you place the claymore so it can't be seen from the other side of the door then it won't cover all of it. You can "sneek" by if you press your self against the door frail posit of where the claymore is placed.


But yes the claymore is very good if you place them at a "door" but that is the only place you can place claymores to be effective.

If you try to drop some claymore at a capture point, spawn tube or anywhere else they are far from as effective as the other AI mines.

One solution maybe is to allow TR to carry up to 4 claymores without having to wearing any suit slots that allow you to carry more. Also that after you have placed them you can fine tune there aim. That way there are more strategic value then just "door stoppers".

[Sunrock]

Whining that your cheap loser weapon isn't as effective as the others?

I want a secondary weapon that doubles as an SMG. Repeater is beyond OP compared to all other faction specific pistols. Then we can talk.

My god..... This again? Yes it is very effective at close range. But if the enemy is more then 5m away from you It's worse then the NC pistol is for an example.

Beside the knife is better option in most scenarios within the range of where the repeater is effective.

[ShepardCommand]

My god..... This again? Yes it is very effective at close range. But if the enemy is more then 5m away from you It's worse then the NC pistol is for an example.

Beside the knife is better option in most scenarios within the range of where the repeater is effective.

You sound an awful lot like the NC Max crowd.

TR have something different, something special in their own way. You really want to homogenize every little aspect of the game? I've been killed by both Claymores AND Betties. I spot MORE betties and destroy them because i expect them more often. Use the claymore's lack of frequency to your advantage, An expected AI mine is an ineffective AI mine. You really want to get rid of that advantage?

Or, if you're going to play an assault type class that frequently gets killed by AI mines, WEAR FLAK ARMOR lol

[Sunrock]

You sound an awful lot like the NC Max crowd.

TR have something different, something special in their own way. You really want to homogenize every little aspect of the game? I've been killed by both Claymores AND Betties. I spot MORE betties and destroy them because i expect them more often. Use the claymore's lack of frequency to your advantage, An expected AI mine is an ineffective AI mine. You really want to get rid of that advantage?

Or, if you're going to play an assault type class that frequently gets killed by AI mines, WEAR FLAK ARMOR lol

I have nothing against "special in their own way" as long as as it's not under powered crap.

PS: I almost always wear flack armor but I have been killed by AI mines anyway. I guessed they stacked 2 or something.


But if you try to defend that TR should have crappier things then the other two factions in the name of "special in there own way" again you can fuck off and die in aids. :evil:

[ringring]

I think claymores are fine, I get good results with them.

[Sunrock]

I think claymores are fine, I get good results with them.

You're just lucky that casual players and noobs run in to your mines. But this thread is not about if you can kill some one with a claymore or not. But how effective they are compared to the other two AI mines.

But I have 68 kills of 217 placed so it's just pure luck if you kill some one with them or not.

[ringring]

I've got 231 out of 897 fired (I don't know where to see the 'placed' stat).

That's not bad. And it can only be pure luck if you place them randomly. The fact that you place them out of pain sight and they have a directional blast makes them arguably better then the others imho.

Of course you only get kills when someone isn't paying attention, but that's the same for all CE.

I know of instances when I haven't got a kill because the NC/VS person thought beforehand that there might be a claymore just around that corner, and there was. But, so what. Part of the rationale for CE is to slow down the enemy besides getting a kill or two along the way.

[Sunrock]

I've got 231 out of 897 fired (I don't know where to see the 'placed' stat).

Fired is of course the same thing as placed. But do you fire or place a mine? Of course you place a mine and not fire it. It's just bad written syntax in the game stats that say fired.


That's not bad. And it can only be pure luck if you place them randomly. The fact that you place them out of pain sight and they have a directional blast makes them arguably better then the others imho.

How is that better? That they can only be placed behind doors? And no where else on the map. And ofcorse its pure luck if they enter the right door or not.

Allot of rooms with a generator or capture points tend to have more then one entrance. So you can't cover them all as you only have 2 claymores on you and if they jump or are careful they can avoid the mine. With the with the two other factions AI you can place them strait in the door way and they are allot less visible then the claymore.

So yes I say its damn pure luck if the claymore kills anyone because some one can actually go for an objective and pass the claymores without triggering them and ever known they where there no matter how careful you place them.

[psijaka]

I've got 231 out of 897 fired (I don't know where to see the 'placed' stat).

That's not bad. And it can only be pure luck if you place them randomly. The fact that you place them out of pain sight and they have a directional blast makes them arguably better then the others imho.

Of course you only get kills when someone isn't paying attention, but that's the same for all CE.

I know of instances when I haven't got a kill because the NC/VS person thought beforehand that there might be a claymore just around that corner, and there was. But, so what. Part of the rationale for CE is to slow down the enemy besides getting a kill or two along the way.

Had a look at my bouncing Betty stats; 560 kills out of 1418 placed. Not sure that this proves anything; I do put some thought into where I place them; just around corners, just over the top of stairs; usually on the approaches to the objective rather than at the objective (too obvious). Too expensive of resources to spam randomly.

Does anyone have info on the kill radius of the Claymore (within it's blast arc)? I would expect this to be considerably larger than for a omnidirectional mine.

[ringring]

I was defending Showshear tower on esamir this morning which became heavily under attack from the VS.

Within the space of 13 minutes I got 3 mine kills and 5 claymore kills (as well as other Rhino kills) and I died once to a vs proximity mine - that's me not paying attention :/

My main point is you don't place mines randomly and therefore it's not 'pure' luck when you get a kill. I agree that luck does play a role, but then it does in many if not all situations.

And doors aren't the only place to put a claymore, even though there are a lot of doors. Place them anywhere that you anticipate the enemy is going to run and is unlikely to spot it. Inside a bush against the wall of a building can often get a 'smart' player who is trying to flank for instance.

I like claymores.

[Canaris]

Here's what I want to see from SOE

How many Prox, Bets & Clays have been planted

How many have blown up hurting or killing people
How many have just been destroyed and what the % break down over the three factions is.

I'm willing to bet the TR is on the bottom wrung.

[psijaka]

Jump pad or elevator beam landing pads also a favourite of mine.

[Whiteagle]

Also that after you have placed them you can fine tune there aim. That way there are more strategic value then just "door stoppers".
Hell if we could just rotate the damn things 90 degrees by left clicking, it would improve them a hundred fold...

Seriously, why can't we set these things like actual Claymores along walls and in corners?

[ChipMHazard]

Here's what I want to see from SOE

How many Prox, Bets & Clays have been planted

How many have blown up hurting or killing people
How many have just been destroyed and what the % break down over the three factions is.

Looks like a job for our local fedora wearing stats man, Mr. Kelduum.

Someone fire up the fedora-signal!

[ThatGoatGuy]

As VS, I honestly don't ever notice the claymores.

But that's because I wear flack armor and walk through doors with impunity.

I don't even worry about that stuff, because I just stroll in like a badass.

[Ruffdog]

I don't have a problem with the directional aspect because of the supposed extra damage (shotgun mine, shouldn't it be N.C.?)
My problem is that it protrudes from the ground quite absurdly more than my enemies mines. Needs a trim along the top

[CraazyCanuck]

I don't even worry about that stuff, because I just stroll in like a badass.

Because of flak armor and I have resorted to dropping a tank mine with a prox mine just for good measure. Takes a little longer to set up my defenses. but if I have time, I go about with the prox/tank mine combo and then follow up with 2 bricks of c4 at the control point.

Not sure how far it takes down a max with that combo, will have to test it, but with most maxes running flak armor as well, it still may only be a mosquito bite. Hence the need for the c4.

[Canaris]

Looks like a job for our local fedora wearing stats man, Mr. Kelduum.

Someone fire up the fedora-signal!

Fedora Signal Activated!

http://image.dhgate.com/albu_285860442_00-1.0x0/sequin-led-flashing-hats-light-up-fedora.jpg

[Dragonskin]

Ummm I think the claymores are just less derp friendly.. you can't be a derp infiltrator or engie deploying them. You have to think about routes and commonly used pathways. If you want to protect a exposed control point then you don't place the claymore at the control point. You place it where the enemy is likely to cross the claymore away from the control point. You use a claymore like they do in the movies... you place it away from the exact spot you want to cover with it in a place the enemy is unlikely to suspect a claymore to be. I have quite a few kills with claymores.... you can call people idiots for walking into them.. but I place them in a lot of places people probably don't expect to cross a claymore. I also do this so that if a claymore is tripped from a direction then I know exactly which direction more enemies are likely to be coming from because people tend to follow each other in packs.

The betty and proxy are user friendly.. takes very little planning to make them effective, but the claymores are equally effective if you think about where you place them before just throwing them anywhere.

[camycamera]

I don't have a problem with the directional aspect because of the supposed extra damage (shotgun mine, shouldn't it be N.C.?)
My problem is that it protrudes from the ground quite absurdly more than my enemies mines. Needs a trim along the top

yes, another downside. i cant see proxy or bouncing Betties at all because they blend in with the purple floors, but claymores stand out like a sore thumb.

[ringring]

yes, another downside. i cant see proxy or bouncing Betties at all because they blend in with the purple floors, but claymores stand out like a sore thumb.

I never put them where they can be seen, at least not by an enemy coming from the enemy direction.

But, after reading this maybe I'll double up with claymores and a tank mine.

[Dragonskin]

Meh, if you want a true downside to the claymores it would be that once they sink into the ground they are rendered useless where as the betty and proxy will still go off. They need to fix the deployables sinking into the ground bug more than they need to fix AI mines faction differences.

[ShepardCommand]

I have nothing against "special in their own way" as long as as it's not under powered crap.

PS: I almost always wear flack armor but I have been killed by AI mines anyway. I guessed they stacked 2 or something.


But if you try to defend that TR should have crappier things then the other two factions in the name of "special in there own way" again you can fuck off and die in aids. :evil:

Vanu Lasher/Light PPA/Mag PPA, Completely useless against flak armor unless you manage direct hits in which case why are you using them at all as opposed to stronger alternatives? Strong in certain very limited situations, but useless in nearly all others.

Even more useless against heavy assaults/medics with flak armor.

You guys have crazy OP Vulcans, T9 Carvs, The most difficult to hit ESF, SMG sidearms(repeater) and the best all around Maxes.

You deserve something useless.

[Canaris]

You deserve something useless.
you taking me out on a date? :p

[Ruffdog]

LOL If you think the T9 Carv is overpowered, you are smoking crack

[DeltaGun]

I fear the claymores a lot more than the other mines because they're tougher to see around corners when you come into a building. Also, they have longer range in the direction they're pointing. So if you do see them, its often too late.

Also, the lasers showing is a well known bug. Very rarely do the lasers render for me.

[ChipMHazard]

You deserve something useless.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_K4ncs0BvIRA/SMPFt1mmsqI/AAAAAAAABUw/1ScuClxWCq0/s400/No-Country-for-Old-Men_Tommy-Lee-Jones_Josh-Brolin_Javier-Bardem_9.jpg

That's your reasoning? Ok, then let me offer up a retort. Nothing in the game should be as useless as Rosie O'donell's personal trainer; Certs, special items, weapons etc. If something is useless then it should either be removed or made useful again as to warrant players actually using said "thing". Like triage... Who the f... uses triage? As a result it's going to get changed at some point.
Is the claymore useless? No, but each AP mine should be equally useful at their task, even if they do so a bit differently.

[Dragonskin]

Vanu Lasher/Light PPA/Mag PPA, Completely useless against flak armor unless you manage direct hits in which case why are you using them at all as opposed to stronger alternatives? Strong in certain very limited situations, but useless in nearly all others.

Even more useless against heavy assaults/medics with flak armor.

You guys have crazy OP Vulcans, T9 Carvs, The most difficult to hit ESF, SMG sidearms(repeater) and the best all around Maxes.

You deserve something useless.

You forgot that we VS have the SaronHB which is better than the vulcan. Our ESF is widely regarded as the easiest to fly... personally I much prefer the Scythe to the Mossie. Our optional sidearm the Manticore doesn't suck compared to the TR's Emperor and since when did TR have the best MAX? Have you played with the VS MAXES since the update? How did TR pull ahead of NC in CQC combat? Oh and the Orion doesn't suck either... try playing another faction and you will learn to hate the Orion as well.

Meh, I do play both sides... I don't think any of your arguements are legit.

[ItZMuRdA]

Ill be honest, I assumed that the claymore functioned as a 360 degree detonation radius just for balance purposes, but am surprised to learn that it doesn't (even if its more realistic). I will say, however, even though I almost exclusively use medkits these days, I definitely find it easier to spot clays than the others, given both the green beams and high profile.

[Sunrock]

Vanu Lasher/Light PPA/Mag PPA, Completely useless against flak armor unless you manage direct hits in which case why are you using them at all as opposed to stronger alternatives? Strong in certain very limited situations, but useless in nearly all others.

Even more useless against heavy assaults/medics with flak armor.

You guys have crazy OP Vulcans, T9 Carvs, The most difficult to hit ESF, SMG sidearms(repeater) and the best all around Maxes.

You deserve something useless.

I would say had crazy OP... they been nerfed a long long time ago. But yea and do you hear me saying that they should stay that way? No.

BTW most difficult ESF to hit?! The mossy? Try to hit a scythe when it shows horizontal to you.

[lllSilencerlll]

I vote that the NC/VS mines become easier to see, like the TR.

[Lonehunter]

those massive green lasers that are easily spotted
As NC I've never spotted a VS mine unless it was too late. But the lazers are just ridiculous lol

[WSNeo]

I vote the TR stop their bitching and deal with the fact that not everything in this game is meant to be assymetrical. (Lasher, NC/TR OP rocket pods, the goddamn Phoenix).

[Dragonskin]

I vote the TR stop their bitching and deal with the fact that not everything in this game is meant to be assymetrical. (Lasher, NC/TR OP rocket pods, the goddamn Phoenix).

Games that are assymertical just promote this kind of behavior. Warhammer was like this.. DAoC... any game that has factions with unique abilities/things. People can't handle things that are not equal and even if they were then they would complain about game performance or bandwidth.. whatever that could have given the edge to the enemy.

[Mustakrakish]

I can't say there's been a single instance where I noticed the green lasers on a Claymore. Usually I only notice them because whoever dropped them placed them in a dumb place, which is about 40% of the time. The other 60%, they're actually well-placed and I don't even know the mine is there until it's detonated.

That being said, making the detection area a bit longer and giving it a wider arc than 45 degrees seems reasonable.

[ringring]

I can't say there's been a single instance where I noticed the green lasers on a Claymore. Usually I only notice them because whoever dropped them placed them in a dumb place, which is about 40% of the time. The other 60%, they're actually well-placed and I don't even know the mine is there until it's detonated.

That being said, making the detection area a bit longer and giving it a wider arc than 45 degrees seems reasonable.

It would make no difference to where I place my claymores.

Do you recall the famous quote from Willie Sutton the bank robber? He was asked why he robbed banks and he replied 'because that's where the money is'.

I place claymores in doorways for a similar reason, that's where the people go.

Of course smarter ones enter via windows if possible.

[Falcon_br]

Ok, let´s make a deal, place two green lasers coming out of the VS and NC mines and we are even.

[DarkBalths]

I think they should either:
a) replace Claymores completely with a mine just like the other factions.
OR
b) give us double the amount of Claymores. (2 at first rank, 4 at second rank)

Claymores are severely underpowered when compared to proxies or betties. As for the guy complaining about the repeater, that's a totally different issue.

[Baneblade]

BTW most difficult ESF to hit?! The mossy? Try to hit a scythe when it shows horizontal to you.

My Vanguard eats Scythes...completely different story against Skeeters.

[ThePackage]

There's only 2 options for fixing this that would be acceptable.

Either the TR claymores become like the Betties & Prox Mines or those two become like the claymore.


They should just remove the faction specific mines, and make them common pool NS mines just like the tank mines.

[Whiteagle]

My Vanguard eats Scythes...completely different story against Skeeters.
Eh, that's more because the Scythes is SOO easy to fly, most Vanu Pilots suck hard...

I used a Scythe in this comic for a reason after all:
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j65/Whiteagle/AAcomic.jpg

[Dragonskin]

http://www.twitch.tv/zethiann/b/395942419

Ok, well found proof that people that say they can see the beams are not crazy. Watching streams today at work and came across this... So at the 18:50 mark he walks up to A point in a tower and clearly visible as day.. 2 green beams.... He plays NC and on ultra settings.. this was recorded this morning.

So... seeing that. Yea, that needs to be changed so allies can only see it or just the person that laid the claymore.. that is pretty lame.

[Falcon_br]

http://www.twitch.tv/zethiann/b/395942419

Ok, well found proof that people that say they can see the beams are not crazy. Watching streams today at work and came across this... So at the 18:50 mark he walks up to A point in a tower and clearly visible as day.. 2 green beams.... He plays NC and on ultra settings.. this was recorded this morning.

So... seeing that. Yea, that needs to be changed so allies can only see it or just the person that laid the claymore.. that is pretty lame.

Dude, everyone know that the enemies can see the beams, only those blind ones claim they cannot see it.
Just ignore people who claims the beams are friendly only, they just can´t accept that claymore really sucks bad.