The Jackhammer [Archive] - PlanetSide Universe

RykerStruvian

2013-04-25, 09:13 PM

Whats the point of the Jackhammer? Other shotguns, excluding pump action shotguns, are comparable to the Jackhammer if not better at being shotguns than the Jackhammer. The Jackhammer has a further range than the other shotguns, but considering the magazine size and the amount of shots it takes outside of close-range (would take about 3-4 shots), it makes the Jackhammer a poor choice in comparison to other close-to-medium range guns, like SMGs.

So whats the point of the Jackhammer? It only fits one attachment, it is out-damaged by other shotguns at close range, and it is out-damaged by other guns at further ranges. It doesn't really serve a purpose or am I missing something?

Yes, it can fire off three rounds in a quick burst but it doesn't make sense. It takes one shot to the head to kill infantry at close range or two to the torso at close range. Three round burst is only really viable against MAXs, but even then you would use something like a decimator.

I just don't see a point in using it. For being a faction special its bad :l

DirtyBird

2013-04-25, 09:21 PM

And thats why 99.9% dont use it.
Its shit.

MercDT

2013-04-25, 09:29 PM

Yeah...I just don't SOE ever doing anything about it. I feel it's more of a balancing issue now more than ever and that they're just afraid of making any tweaks to it due to all the shotgun negativity that has been going around lately.

So we're stuck with a faction specific shitgun for now.

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-25, 09:34 PM

And we have the MCG, GOML

moosepoop

2013-04-25, 09:39 PM

they should make it more like the classic jackhammer in ps1, 3 hit kill with 20 round magazine.

Ghoest9

2013-04-25, 09:42 PM

And we have the MCG, GOML

Stop whining about the MCG.

Its not great but its not bad either - it has a niche.
The Jackhammer simply is worse than then other shotguns. It has no specific situation where you would ever choose it.

that said - it doesnt really matter - its just kind of lame

NapalmEnima

2013-04-25, 09:56 PM

I recall Higby saying they're doing a balancing pass on a number of the existing weapons. The MCG is supposed to start firing immediately and increase it's rate of fire as it spins up. I suspect the JH will get some luv too.

In PS1, it just had the sweeper to be compare to... now, with the shorter TTK. The jackhammer would have to be pretty goddam deadly to out-do the pump action shotguns. Like... "broken" deadly. A piston with a 10+ round magazine that did more damage and was better over range. "Broken" deadly.

So do you nerf the other shotguns to make the JH stand out (and deal with the wailing and gnashing of teeth sure to follow), or make the jackhammer an unbelievably deadly super weapon (and deal with the wailing etc etc)? Maybe it should launch velociraptors instead.

Good game balance is not easy. I sometimes feel a little bad for game designers... then I come to my senses and realize THEY WORK IN THE GAME INDUSTRY.

RykerStruvian

2013-04-25, 10:08 PM

Thats pretty much what I'm thinking. The Jackhammer itself, because it is a shotgun, is a really difficult thing to balance. As it stands right now as a shotgun, its still very deadly up close like other shotguns. The issue though is that the main benefit it has over other shotguns is that it can engage targets from a further distance, but even then that distance still renders the gun to be pretty useless due to low magazine size and the fact there other guns available which can do the job of killing better.

I understand they want to make money but releasing new shotguns without fixing the ones you have already, or rather releasing new guns without fixing the ones you have already, just seems like a dirty, greedy money grab. Even though I'm sure thats not the case.

Either way, I just wish the faction heavy weapons were spruced up already. Its been a couple of months as it is. And people are going to complain anyways about changes.

Methonius

2013-04-25, 11:27 PM

I don't think its as shitty as ppl say I went on a 73 kill streak with it once with triple burst on.

Mustakrakish

2013-04-26, 02:23 AM

Let me start off by saying that I love the Piston. Less so after the shotgun balance pass, but love it nonetheless. I used to think that the Jackhammer was a huge turd with a box magazine strapped to it. I recently demo'd the Jackhammer and after I got used to the differences between it and other shotguns, I bought it immediately. Now I rarely (if ever) use the Piston on my HA loadouts.

The Jackhammer has a lower maximum damage than other shotguns, but a higher minimum damage value and much less severe damage degradation with distance. It's also got a very tight spread, even at its maximum effective range. Basically it operates like it's got Slug Ammo but doesn't require you to be as precise with your aim. On top of that, the reload speed is blindingly fast.

In short, the ranges the Jackhammer works best at are just slightly longer than the maximum effective range of other shotguns. This caters a lot better to my particular playstyle than the other shotguns currently available.

The only real downside to the Jackhammer is the agonizing pause between shots in burst-fire mode, which makes it pretty useless. I can fire off three shells in semi-auto mode faster than I can in burst-fire. The relatively small magazine size (6 stock, 10 w/ extended mag) in combination with the low damage per shell also means you'll spend a lot of time reloading, although the quick reload times help offset that a bit.

In the end, if they made bust-fire mode a bit faster and made the magazines bigger (maybe 10 stock, 20 w/ extended mag), the Jackhammer would go from being the red-headed stepchild of shotguns to being a truly fearsome weapon.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the Jackhammer doesn't suck per se; it's just that the most effective way to use it is more of a learning process than instinct.

leifnielsen

2013-04-26, 02:42 AM

Maybe it should launch velociraptors instead.

THIS.

leifnielsen

2013-04-26, 02:45 AM

I sometimes feel a little bad for game designers... then I come to my senses and realize THEY WORK IN THE GAME INDUSTRY.

You should feel bad for them. They get paid shit.

MGP

2013-04-26, 03:43 AM

Quard

2013-04-26, 04:18 AM

lasher

Emperor Newt

2013-04-26, 05:10 AM

Lasher at least has it's uses. Although it is getting less useful with Max players ranking up their flak armor. In groups the Lasher still is an awesome AI weapon. A lone lasher is a free kill in 1on1 situations.

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-26, 07:54 AM

Stop whining about the MCG.

Its not great but its not bad either - it has a niche.
The Jackhammer simply is worse than then other shotguns. It has no specific situation where you would ever choose it.

that said - it doesnt really matter - its just kind of lame

This comment is so ignorant that all I can do is this...

Funny Black Guy Laughing - YouTube

I'm not saying either of the heavy faction specific weapons is better than the other, I'm just saying that each is equally hard to use. I would have to say I feel the worst for the VS, their gun doesn't even do direct damage!

Whiteagle

2013-04-26, 09:54 AM

In the end, if they made bust-fire mode a bit faster and made the magazines bigger (maybe 10 stock, 20 w/ extended mag), the Jackhammer would go from being the red-headed stepchild of shotguns to being a truly fearsome weapon.
I'd be alright with this, a faster burst wouldn't make it any worst then a One-hit Pump-action and all the other Heavy Chain Gun Specials have deep Mags anyways.

Ghoest9

2013-04-26, 09:59 AM

This comment is so ignorant that all I can do is this...

Funny Black Guy Laughing - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4yWbdwtzW4)

!

In other words you dont actually have a point - youre just trying to vaguely promote the lie that TR is at a disadvantage.

Dragonskin

2013-04-26, 10:19 AM

I'm not saying either of the heavy faction specific weapons is better than the other, I'm just saying that each is equally hard to use. I would have to say I feel the worst for the VS, their gun doesn't even do direct damage!

Haha, ok... you are in The Enclave. Your fearless leader went out of his way one day to try to show how bad the MCG was before the buff that was supposed to fix spin up. He goes on kill spree after kill spree all while mowing down people and talking about how terrible the MCG is.

Sorry, but Buzzcut isn't a super skillful player. That is why he always gravitates to whatever gives him an edge and he freely admits that.

I would link the recording, but it looks like I can't get to any of his recording right now. He spent 45 minutes to an hour killing people with only the MCG.

Anyway, back on topic. The Jackhammer isn't terrible.. it's just not great. I was actually killed by one last night at a good range... for a shotgun it's range is impressive. As for why that is a good thing.. you can kill things at multiple ranges without switching weapons. The pump shotguns are nice, but outside like 20m they are crap while the Jackhammer will still hit people fairly reliably. 3 shot burst is nice to cut down on burning through ammo so quickly. Could it use a buff? Probably. The MCG needs it's spin up fixed, but after that it would be pretty beast.. just the model still sucks and could use a animation update like the Lasher received.

If I played NC I would probably own one.

Baneblade

2013-04-26, 10:25 AM

Jackhammer should have 12 round mag without upgrades and be able to cert a 24 round drum upgrade.

Dragonskin

2013-04-26, 10:29 AM

Jackhammer should have 12 round mag without upgrades and be able to cert a 24 round drum upgrade.

That is a buff I could agree with. Damage wise it's sitting pretty nice.

Kail

2013-04-26, 10:42 AM

Jackhammer should have 12 round mag without upgrades and be able to cert a 24 round drum upgrade.

That's honestly the biggest complaint I have about the jackhammer; as a shotgun you really can't play with its damage much, but it really should have a larger magazine and waaay more total ammo.

And a suppressor. Why would the ultimate shotgun of scifi not have a suppressor? I mean come on now.

DrankTHEKoolaid

2013-04-26, 11:26 AM

All three of them suck, I actually think the Jackhammer is the best. It rewards accuracy and if you can be really accurate it's better than other shotguns in certain situations.

The thing that sucks is that it's not very unique. It's not that different from the other shotguns where as the MCG and Lasher are.

Dragonskin

2013-04-26, 11:38 AM

That's honestly the biggest complaint I have about the jackhammer; as a shotgun you really can't play with its damage much, but it really should have a larger magazine and waaay more total ammo.

And a suppressor. Why would the ultimate shotgun of scifi not have a suppressor? I mean come on now.

Because PS2 imitates the Battlefield series and not Call of Duty haha.

Dodgy Commando

2013-04-26, 12:27 PM

Because PS2 imitates the Battlefield series and not Call of Duty haha.

Actually BF3 Shotties have a suppressor accessory if you look them up in the Battlelog. Only available to DICE employees of course :D

A suppressed shottie in PS2? I'd be ok with it, but I fear it would cause much whinage forumside.

Ghoest9

2013-04-26, 12:41 PM

Jackhammer should have 12 round mag without upgrades and be able to cert a 24 round drum upgrade.

Thats the smartest suggestion i have seen for fixing it.

RykerStruvian

2013-04-26, 01:38 PM

A larger magazine both uncerted/certed would make sense and give it a nice edge. That would be pretty cool. And to be honest, I would like it too if IR/NV was an option to cert into. Those pesky vanu and their pitch black textures in biolab fights at night :l

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-26, 02:56 PM

In other words you dont actually have a point - youre just trying to vaguely promote the lie that TR is at a disadvantage.

Maybe you just can't read...

I'm not saying either of the heavy faction specific weapons is better than the other, I'm just saying that each is equally hard to use. I would have to say I feel the worst for the VS, their gun doesn't even do direct damage!

Haha, ok... you are in The Enclave. Your fearless leader went out of his way one day to try to show how bad the MCG was before the buff that was supposed to fix spin up. He goes on kill spree after kill spree all while mowing down people and talking about how terrible the MCG is.

Sorry, but Buzzcut isn't a super skillful player. That is why he always gravitates to whatever gives him an edge and he freely admits that.

I would link the recording, but it looks like I can't get to any of his recording right now. He spent 45 minutes to an hour killing people with only the MCG.Picard***39;s Epic Double Facepalm - YouTube

Did I ever say ANYTHING relating to TE or BuzzCutPsycho in any way? No, I clearly did not. I am claiming that the MCG is bad, the Jackhammer is bad, and the lasher is bad. I am not claiming ANY of them is good, that one is better. I THINK THEY ARE ALL TERRIBLE. This claiming that because I'm in TE immediately means that I suck buzz's dick when it comes to any of his opinions, well quite frankly it is ridiculous and please proceed to do suck one yourself.

Dragonskin

2013-04-26, 03:19 PM

Maybe you just can't read...

Picard's Epic Double Facepalm - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNsrK6P9QvI)

Did I ever say ANYTHING relating to TE or BuzzCutPsycho in any way? No, I clearly did not. I am claiming that the MCG is bad, the Jackhammer is bad, and the lasher is bad. I am not claiming ANY of them is good, that one is better. I THINK THEY ARE ALL TERRIBLE. This claiming that because I'm in TE immediately means that I suck buzz's dick when it comes to any of his opinions, well quite frankly it is ridiculous and please proceed to do suck one yourself.

LOL overly defensive about your leader and services you may or may not provide him. I was simply stating that your leader Buzzcut was trying to point out that the MCG sucks will killing tons of people left and right. You are free to do whatever you want for your leader... those were your words.. not mine.

Goldymires

2013-04-26, 05:04 PM

You should feel bad for them. They get paid shit.

Not really true. People in the industry get paid reasonably well. With QA testers getting paid the least and the business side (CEO, legal etc) getting paid the most.

Sardus

2013-04-26, 05:08 PM

All three heavy assault weapons are really poor. They try to fill rolls that other guns simply do better. They are a jack of all trades, but suck at anything in particular.

Thankfully they are supposed to get an overhaul soon.

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-26, 05:46 PM

LOL overly defensive about your leader and services you may or may not provide him. I was simply stating that your leader Buzzcut was trying to point out that the MCG sucks will killing tons of people left and right. You are free to do whatever you want for your leader... those were your words.. not mine.

Please explain to me what Buzzcut has to do with AT ALL with this situation? Is it just because I'm in TE?

Ghoest9

2013-04-26, 06:37 PM

Please explain to me what Buzzcut has to do with AT ALL with this situation? Is it just because I'm in TE?

It was explained clearly.
I guess you could disagree - but if you are confused thibnk it wasnt explained as you claim, that just means you dont understand basic communication and porbably shouldnt be posting on forums.

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-26, 11:36 PM

It was explained clearly.
I guess you could disagree - but if you are confused thibnk it wasnt explained as you claim, that just means you dont understand basic communication and porbably shouldnt be posting on forums.

The whole ideology of Buzzcutpsycho having to do at all with the MCG, merely because I'm in TE is totally irrelevant.

You sir, should not post until you have spell checked. ;)

EDIT: As any person with forums powers may observe, this thread has become nothing but a troll to TE therefore, it has no use. /thread

leifnielsen

2013-04-27, 01:19 AM

Not really true. People in the industry get paid reasonably well. With QA testers getting paid the least and the business side (CEO, legal etc) getting paid the most.

Yeah I didn't mean the CEO's and high level positions. I meant the guys who do all the heavy lifting. My friend was a programmer for F.E.A.R. 3 and he got paid minimum wage. With all of the knowledge he has and the time he's put into learning all that stuff, minimum wage is unacceptable. He got out of the game industry because of all the bullshit and now he's a professor who teaches game industry business.

Developers and programmers don't get paid nearly enough for the work they do.

Koadster

2013-04-27, 05:31 AM

You should feel bad for them. They get paid shit.

Recent article stated they get paid 80+K a year.. thats not bad!

This comment is so ignorant that all I can do is this...

I feel the worst for the VS, their gun doesn't even do direct damage!

^^^ This comment is so ignorant

The lasher has become bit too good with recent buffs, 5 shots to kill a man, 19 shots to kill a max. Ive had lashers kill me faster then scattmaxes!!

Go try it in the VR room now. I think Buzzs IQ has rubbed off on you :lol::rofl:

EVILoHOMER

2013-04-27, 06:31 AM

Planetside 2's weapon design sucks, they've made every weapon play the same, just all generic and shit. They keep on adding more and more generic shit, bland weapons no one cares about.

Planetside is so much better, all the weapons are fun and different. Until they turn the MCG from a rifle wannabe to a proper underslung MCG then I wont come back.

Emperor Newt

2013-04-27, 11:12 AM

The lasher has become bit too good with recent buffs, 5 shots to kill a man, 19 shots to kill a max. Ive had lashers kill me faster then scattmaxes!!
If you are killed by a single lasher in an even infantry combat scenario you are doing something horribly wrong.

ThatGoatGuy

2013-04-27, 12:33 PM

^^^ This comment is so ignorant

The lasher has become bit too good with recent buffs, 5 shots to kill a man, 19 shots to kill a max. Ive had lashers kill me faster then scattmaxes!!

Go try it in the VR room now. I think Buzzs IQ has rubbed off on you :lol::rofl:

/facepalm

I think that we can all agree that the faction specific heavy weapons overall are not very good/require quite a skill curve. Lets just say, there is always just a straight upgrade to each of them.

Tell me, what's it like having an extra chromosome? :doh:

moosepoop

2013-04-27, 12:52 PM

Koadster

2013-04-27, 08:45 PM

If you are killed by a single lasher in an even infantry combat scenario you are doing something horribly wrong.

:lol: 5 direct hits isnt very hard to achieve.

And no about the lasher im not being sarcastic, why not goto VR room now and test it.

Just re-tested, even at 50 meters lasher will kill in 6 shots, coupled with AOE dmg its very easy to get kills with it now, so no your not doing something wrong if you die to the current lasher.

ShadoViper

2013-04-27, 09:29 PM

Please explain to me what Buzzcut has to do with AT ALL with this situation? Is it just because I'm in TE?
First of all

LOL overly defensive about your leader and services you may or may not provide him. I was simply stating that your leader Buzzcut was trying to point out that the MCG sucks will killing tons of people left and right. You are free to do whatever you want for your leader... those were your words.. not mine.

Holy balls, you're a fucking idiot on a crusade.

Second of all

It was explained clearly.
I guess you could disagree - but if you are confused thibnk it wasnt explained as you claim, that just means you dont understand basic communication and porbably shouldnt be posting on forums.

do us a favour, Re-read that shit post of yours, his posts had nothing to do with his outfit.

And lastly,

I think something does need to be done about the Jackhammer... i don't think in my entire time playing I've seen or been killed by one. Seems like a possible problem to me...

WSNeo

2013-04-27, 10:46 PM

Haha, ok... you are in The Enclave. Your fearless leader went out of his way one day to try to show how bad the MCG was before the buff that was supposed to fix spin up. He goes on kill spree after kill spree all while mowing down people and talking about how terrible the MCG is.

Sorry, but Buzzcut isn't a super skillful player. That is why he always gravitates to whatever gives him an edge and he freely admits that.

I would link the recording, but it looks like I can't get to any of his recording right now. He spent 45 minutes to an hour killing people with only the MCG.

Anyway, back on topic. The Jackhammer isn't terrible.. it's just not great. I was actually killed by one last night at a good range... for a shotgun it's range is impressive. As for why that is a good thing.. you can kill things at multiple ranges without switching weapons. The pump shotguns are nice, but outside like 20m they are crap while the Jackhammer will still hit people fairly reliably. 3 shot burst is nice to cut down on burning through ammo so quickly. Could it use a buff? Probably. The MCG needs it's spin up fixed, but after that it would be pretty beast.. just the model still sucks and could use a animation update like the Lasher received.

If I played NC I would probably own one.

LOL

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/8/81005/2183373-what_the_fuck_am_i_reading.jpg

Emperor Newt

2013-04-28, 07:21 AM

:lol: 5 direct hits isnt very hard to achieve.

And no about the lasher im not being sarcastic, why not goto VR room now and test it.

Just re-tested, even at 50 meters lasher will kill in 6 shots, coupled with AOE dmg its very easy to get kills with it now, so no your not doing something wrong if you die to the current lasher.

How about trying it against enemies who are moving and shooting back? (And also are very likely to have Flak Armor equipped)
Do that, come back afterwards.

PS: Not saying that it is impossible to get kills with it. But any LMG is superior in direct infantry engagements. The thing the lasher has for it is being a very good suppression weapon and distraction tool. But damage and ttk wise, it's way behind the others.