MBT ES secondary weapons feedback for Higby

[ChipMHazard]

https://twitter.com/mhigby/status/334768713402294273

[wasdie]

If the ML85 was wire guided. That would be awesome.

[Neurotoxin]

My replies:

No delay on the Saron between clicking and firing, and increasing the projectile speed, is what it needs to be effective.

Or just give options to put Supernova on top for the gunner, and give the driver secondary weapon options. Far more fair that way.

PPA needs love too. Projectiles travel too slow AND have too small a splash to compensate. It doesn't handle AI duty at all.

Either the PPA needs to be like a purple orb machinegun w/ tiny burst, or slower RoF with faster travel speed and potent explosions.

[ringring]

There's only one way that I know of and I've suggested it previously. Make secondary weapons hit harder. Make it so that the sensible tank driver will always look for a gunner.

[Whiteagle]

Or just give options to put Supernova on top for the gunner, and give the driver secondary weapon options. Far more fair that way.
Indeed, SWITCH THE WEAPONS!!!

[PredatorFour]

Make the saron cooler by taking away the 'wobble` that has been affecting it for some time now.

[capiqu]

There's only one way that I know of and I've suggested it previously. Make secondary weapons hit harder. Make it so that the sensible tank driver will always look for a gunner.

Second.

[EvilNinjadude]

There's only one way that I know of and I've suggested it previously. Make secondary weapons hit harder. Make it so that the sensible tank driver will always look for a gunner.Third!
To be honest, the secondary gun on most tanks does nothing, except perhaps dedicated AA. It's useless for everything else as most people would pack more firepower by pulling their own tanks.

By making the secondary weapon more powerful, it'd be a viable option. Like Harassers are now, ya know?

I still wanna try having dedicated drivers, but players would get upset since they wanna gun their own tanks. SOE will let them. Okay, I guess.

[Soothsayer]

would like a rotary vulcan that fires a larger projectile with a slower rof. Something that just chugs out the big rounds consistently. Maybe draw directly from the ammo pool as opposed to reloading.

[GeoGnome]

My suggestion from PS2

The secondaries on tanks have ES, AA, AV, AI, and some that work in multiple roles. Going off of traditional weapon designs, you run the risk of power creep, needlessly. TTK being what it is, power creep should be avoided at all costs, instead, make something NEW

No, I don't mean an ES upgrade to another one of the traditional roll weapons... I mean make a weapon mechanic that is new. examples: give the Vanu some kind of Arc Lightning gun or beam cutter, the NC a rail driver or a cluster gernade, and the TR a flamethrower or Mortar. Introduce not a new kind of traditional weapon, but a NEW KIND OF WEAPON with it's own specialized form of use, roll, and what have you.

Explanations of above examples:

VS have high technology, give them an AI Weapon that jumps between targets, lesser damage, but again it can jump between multiple targets to drive people back, and the closer you are to the weapon the more powerful it is.
A VS beam cutter would be a beam that shoots out, that can be swept in an arc and damages constantly along the beam, maybe the longer it is on a target, the more damage it causes (Beam burning through the target).

The NC need something that hits like a bus, but is slow to reload. Rail gun, no bullet drop and good damage you'd have to hit your target, but it would count as 30mm type ammo, in that it ignores most armor on armored vehicles.
A NC Cluster gernade would be like a cluster bomb, shooting out into the air it would/could break apart and scatter gernades over an area.

The TR just need a reliable weapon that will always be of use, maybe a flame thrower. Where it hits, it leaves a temporary pain zone, that people can't walk through without some damage, it causes a bit of damage but it's greatest advantage is that it will leave a burning effect on whoever it hits for a few moments
Mortar would be a weapon that shoots in an arc with a wide splash. It would be difficult to fire as it would arc Up before dropping, but you could charge up How far you want to shoot it and alter the angle. A high skill weapon.

See? Completely new types of Weapons, that potentially could contribute meaningfully to gameplay, while sticking to the theme of each respective faction.

[mrmrmrj]

Count me in the camp that the driver should have the smaller gun, the one that can be changed. The big gun should be for the dedicated gunner.

[Soothsayer]

Count me in the camp that the driver should have the smaller gun, the one that can be changed. The big gun should be for the dedicated gunner.

For sure. Just the option, that's all that's needed.

[Ghoest9]

Make the secondary roughly equal to main gun in overall power.

At least as concerns anti-armor. Their anti infantry potential is already just fine.

[Baneblade]

Other than inheriting the vehicle camo, I can't really think of anything the secondary guns need.

[Shamrock]

PPA is a terrible Anti-Infantry weapon, either buff the direct damage or give it some splash damage on the orbs, a cool alternative would be burn splash damage like the PS1 Comet used to do to infantry.

[WSNeo]

The PPA is complete ass on anything other than a Scythe where you fire top down on infantry. The fire rate is terrible, the damage is underwhelming and the gun glows bright at night.

The gun would be much more appealing if the fire rate was much faster (think the speed of the Lasher). A damage buff to make it more potent rather than three shotting (IIRC) infantry with a gun that's already hard to aim on a Magrider.

Another peeve is precision aiming from a distance. At a point if you're trying to tag a target with the Saron from long distance (usually someone on a hill) there's a certain area where you cannot aim at. Like there is box that the aiming reticule uses and you can only aim at the four corners, not but the center. Does anyone else know what I'm talking about?

Edit: I feel also feel that I need to make this clear as well:

NO MORE CHARGE WEAPONS FOR VS!!!!

[Kail]

Going to echo that PPA needs some help. Personally I would love it to be inspired from the Thresher's weapon in PS1, but regardless right now it feels like it either needs to hit harder or shoot faster.

[KesTro]

The Modified ML85 shotgun for the tank is a PoS, honestly I don't know what can be done to save that weapon because I don't know a soul that uses it.

[Ruffdog]

Cooler? Not sure....

HOTTER!!

http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2010/5/30/108982-Armoured,%20Colour,%20Flame%20Tank,%20Hell%20Hound ,%20World%20War%202.jpg

Might even change my Vulcan for that :evil:

[Gatekeeper]

I'd say the Saron HRB is pretty much perfect as it is now - what we need to see are all tank secondaries balanced at this level. That means buffing the PPA - either faster firing, more splash, more damage to vehicles, or (ideally) some combination of the above.

And buff the Basilisk and the Kobalt while you're at it... as it stands explosive weapons always seem to trump the machine guns.

[Methonius]

IMO they need to just fix the secondary AI tank weapons cause they are all boring as hell to use.

Then add some new ES interesting ones to use that are able to fire at all targets but do a little less damage.

VS - A continuous laser beam that penetrates through targets or arcs through them. Does more and more damage the longer its held down. -Think about the voidrays from starcraft 2.

NC - A Rail gun like the thing from ps1 that hits decently hard and left radiation spheres on the ground after the explosion but fires slowly.

TR - Rapid firing missiles, like a barrage of them smaller damage with smaller explosions but they fire extremely fast. Could fire like 4 at once that spiral around in different directions.

[Jax Blake]

Remove the nerf to the vulcan and put it back to 900 rpm. Also with the upcoming fury nerf it's extremely similar to the maruader.

[Gimpylung]

Make the saron cooler by taking away the 'wobble` that has been affecting it for some time now.

This.

[Baneblade]

The Modified ML85 shotgun for the tank is a PoS, honestly I don't know what can be done to save that weapon because I don't know a soul that uses it.

I like it on my solo tank.

[bpostal]

I like it on my solo tank.

Most every tank I see is a solo tank.

Either way, the few times I do roll out with a gunner it's typically when I'm driving into a hotly contested area (where the life span is probably shorter than my timer). To extend my lifespan and to piss aircraft off, I use the Ranger. It's not that pretty and it's only worth about maybe half a burster but it's better than nothing and it's nice to have one's own AA.
My suggestion (that is fair and balanced, of course) is to up the ROF to make them a little more of a deterrent.

Otherwise I've got a Vulcan on top that acts as a spare seat. Maybe a squadmate needs a ride, maybe I've got a spare gun I can jump to.

[ToweTwelve]

For Saron HRB:
change it to fast firing cannon:
500 dmg per shot
0.75 sec reload time
0.25 sec delay before each shot

For magrider PPA:
make it like a lasher machine-gun,
or a slow plasma ball thrower, like a BFG from Doom.

[Varsam]

PPA is straight-up garbage. Saron mechanics too generic, even without projectile drop, and the .25 firing delay is completely unnecessary - makes it feel unresponsive and unwieldy, especially for a precision weapon. Suggest a reverse charge mechanic - starts charged for full damage, must wait after shot for recharge and full damage again.

Vulcan needs much larger mag capacity, slightly lower and more consistent/accurate damage to fit TR sustained fire MO. Currently operates more like a burst damage weapon, which is completely counter-intuitive for a chain gun.

Enforcer is way, way too similar in form AND function to Halberd. Very little reason to use one over the other. Needs some special quality to make it unique - the question "Enforcer or halberd?" should always be relevant.

can't comment on Enforcer cannister or marauder, as I have very little experience with both.