Now that the Fury is nerfed...

[blashyrk]

I think the Proton PPA and the NC variant of the AI weapon (was it Enforcer Modified?) should be a bit buffed to compensate for the Marauder which is now basically a better and cheaper Fury.

I'll only propose a buff for the PPA since I never used the NC variant: increasing projectile velocity. This way it would keep the traits of a Vanu weapon without it crossing over into NC (more damage) or TR (higher ROF) territory.

I'll leave it to NC players to propose an Enforcer Modified buff since I've never actually seen it in combat :huh:

[Hamma]

My poor fury :(

[OmegaPREDATOR]

I'll leave it to NC players to propose an Enforcer Modified buff since I've never actually seen it in combat :huh:

And you will never see one cause it's pointless.

Basically it's the same as a air-hammer, so very good against vehicules at CQC only. On Reaver no trouble, you can come close and leave fast, but on a tank who is supposed to have the better range of the 3 MBT it's better to take a normal Enforcer.
(also with the NERF of air-hammer, the Enforcer Modified need 2 or 3 shoots for kill an infantery ... so worth than a pomp-action shotgun).

No range, not that much damage, a window where the gunner could shoot with its own weapon would be more usefull than the Enforcer Modified.

[Chewy]

Punt gun (shotgun) video - best angle - YouTube

Looks like a shotgun that belongs on a tank to me.

[Obstruction]

i played with mine today and it really isn't that bad.

we still soloed a lightning and took down an AV base turret.

still gibs infantry just fine. so i don't see the major problem except that we can't solo MBTs as easily without changing to the Halberd.

maybe the major nerf is fury versus MAX? either way i still run those over, and a 9 round mag seems plenty to do the job.

if i'm missing something please let me know.

[OmegaPREDATOR]

if i'm missing something please let me know.

The trouble IMO is here :
http://i.imgur.com/s5kXqXn.jpg?1
With a Fury cost of 1000 cert points and the Marauder costing 250 cert points. So TR have a good faction AI weapon when VS have PPA and NC have Modified Enforcer. Maybe VS and NC could have something close to Marauder in term of usefulness again infantery to be balanced ?

[blashyrk]

The trouble IMO is here :
http://i.imgur.com/s5kXqXn.jpg?1
With a Fury cost of 1000 cert points and the Marauder costing 250 cert points. So TR have a good faction AI weapon when VS have PPA and NC have Modified Enforcer. Maybe VS and NC could have something close to Marauder in term of usefulness again infantery to be balanced ?

Exactly what I meant. With the risk of rattling some players' cages, I will say that TR got a pat on the back again with everyone getting the short end of the stick.

I believe the price of the Fury should at least drop too 500C if not lower, and I think buffs to VS/NC counterparts should be in order.

[Obstruction]

well i play TR and i prefer the Fury because the vehicle damage on the Marauder is crap.

so they really aren't similar weapons at all. the difference is like i said, you can take out lightnings, sunderers, base turrets, low flying ESF, and gank/harass MBTs with a Fury whereas you cannot at all do these things effectively with the AI Marauder.

it has a deep clip and a good ROF but it's not something you should be so upset about.

just invest in a Fury the nerf isn't that bad at all imo. and trust me i was worried because i invested certs in mine on all 3 factions.

[MrMak]

Id rather the Marauder be brought in line with the Fury. Bring its direct hit damage down to keep the old proportion.

I dunno why the VS keep complaining about the PPA so much. being on the recieving end it seems good enaugh considering it has no drop and so outranges all the other AI secondaries. Maybe increse the projectile speed a bit but its far from as useless the Vanu make it out to be (as with most of their things in recent months realy).



The C85 needs an overhaul however. Simplest thing i can think of is making each pellet a small explosive round.

[blashyrk]

Id rather the Marauder be brought in line with the Fury. Bring its direct hit damage down to keep the old proportion.

I dunno why the VS keep complaining about the PPA so much. being on the recieving end it seems good enaugh considering it has no drop and so outranges all the other AI secondaries. Maybe increse the projectile speed a bit but its far from as useless the Vanu make it out to be (as with most of their things in recent months realy).


Well it's not terrible but I still find it lacking compared to Fury/Marauder. Sure enough, it has no bullet drop, but with negligible splash damage and 2 direct shots needed to kill, and with such slow projectiles it is much more situational than both. It is fairly good only against clustered infantry but then again Fury/Marauder also are, the latter being significantly better against vehicles as well.

[AThreatToYou]

Holy shit the Fury got nerfed hard! What am I supposed to use on my Flash now?? The S12? LOL! Make the S12 fire explosive pellets. The C85 should fire cluster bombs.

[blashyrk]

Holy shit the Fury got nerfed hard! What am I supposed to use on my Flash now?? The S12? LOL! Make the S12 fire explosive pellets. The C85 should fire cluster bombs.

Having a Fury on a Flash in the first place is what lead to a slow, vulnerable, tractionless quadbike costing 150 vehicle resources :P.

I'd really wish they'd separate resource prices for Flashes with and without weapons, but I guess that's a whole different topic. I'll stop here to avoid changing the thread's topic.

[AThreatToYou]

Having a Fury on a Flash in the first place is what lead to a slow, vulnerable, tractionless quadbike costing 150 vehicle resources :P.

I'd really wish they'd separate resource prices for Flashes with and without weapons, but I guess that's a whole different topic. I'll stop here to avoid changing the thread's topic.

Thread derailed, by me.

The slow, traction-less quadbike was always the way it was. It wasn't caused by having a Fury on it, not by a long shot. I cite it always being a shitty ATV ever since alpha as evidence toward this. I've no idea why they don't make its traction better.

And, even with no cooldown timer and constantly zerging into the enemy force without a subscription or boost, I can always earn back those 150 resources. And by zerging I mean flipping the piece of shit over on the tiniest bump.

[blashyrk]

Thread derailed, by me.

The slow, traction-less quadbike was always the way it was. It wasn't caused by having a Fury on it, not by a long shot. I cite it always being a shitty ATV ever since alpha as evidence toward this. I've no idea why they don't make its traction better.

And, even with no cooldown timer and constantly zerging into the enemy force without a subscription or boost, I can always earn back those 150 resources. And by zerging I mean flipping the piece of shit over on the tiniest bump.

What I meant is, the Flash's PRICE got increased because of cloak/Fury/whatnot, but not the handling, and right now if I just want to go from point A to point B I have to pay 150 vehicle resources for a quad bike that drives like a speedboat on land (slower than a Harasser and imposible to use except on completely flat surfaces). I mean, it's a off-raod QUAD BIKE and it can barely go up a 45 degree sloped miniature hill? For 150 resources? That's ridiculous.

[OmegaPREDATOR]

well i play TR and i prefer the Fury because the vehicle damage on the Marauder is crap.

so they really aren't similar weapons at all. the difference is like i said, you can take out lightnings, sunderers, base turrets, low flying ESF, and gank/harass MBTs with a Fury whereas you cannot at all do these things effectively with the AI Marauder.

it has a deep clip and a good ROF but it's not something you should be so upset about.

just invest in a Fury the nerf isn't that bad at all imo. and trust me i was worried because i invested certs in mine on all 3 factions.
Just NC and VS need a REAL AI gun. Marauder is (not really good AV but that's normal). We have the VS Saron who seems to be better AI than PPA and Enforcer is far better AI than the modified one (even bulldog is better). So whe have AV guns who are the best AI whe can have.

Maybe time to make modification to transform AI weapons in AI weapons ...

[typhaon]

There are so many things that need balancing...

[Mustarde]

As someone who abused the fury wraith quite heavily prior to GU11, I am not very surprised with the changes that were made.

HOWEVER, I do have some concerns with how SOE went about balancing the fury. First, I think the fury itself was fine, and the old version had distinguishing features from the marauderer, which gave the two weapons some pros and cons. I agree that now, there is no reason to not use the marauderer, which is unfortunate.

The real problem with the fury was what happened when you threw it on highly mobile vehicles like the flash and the harasser - and the harasser fury farming really hit a fevered pitch a few weeks ago. Furies on sunderers were not a big deal... even a battle bus with dual furies had the drawbacks of being slow and easy to hit.

My personal gripe with how they balanced flashes is that in GU11, they drastically cut the ammo capacity of the fury (only for the flash). Combined with the global increases in vehicle costs, I saw a lot less wraith flashes out there, and I saw my own performance fall to a more reasonable level. But before the devs had enough time to asses their data and see if GU11 went too far, not far enough, or had it just right, the fury damage nerf went on the PTS and is now live with GU12. This leads me to conclude that the changes were predetermined and were made blindly, without factoring in what happened in GU11.

So now the Flash fury has been double nerfed, over the course of about 3 weeks. And flashes had their resource cost tripled, and still flip over and die when you sneeze at them. No real data has been shared on the flash lately, and I don't think the devs even looked at the data between GU11 and 12 - just not enough time to do so.

If they no longer wanted to put a fury on the ATV, I would have been fine with them just removing it and refunding certs. But double nerfing it, and making it more expensive... flashes are going to end up being as rare as they were before wraith and passenger seats were added. I am considering buying the shotgun for lolz. I've tried the kobalt with dismal results. Now I'm only pulling my flash for radar or to sneak behind a zerg to reach a good sniping perch

Also, I would have liked to see the ammo nerf for the fury brought over to the harasser too (instead of the damage nerf). It really does reduce the blatant farming potential of the platform, because you had to frequently return for ammo, even after dumping tons of certs. I suspect that would have been enough to balance the platform out.

[OmegaPREDATOR]

Finally we know why Fury was nerf.

Nothing to do with balance or some useless thing like this, too far from SOE policies !

SO it's just an old trick they always do for ...

Sell new weapons !

They just NERF the most played one (so who will no more be sell) and add something who will do the same (or close).

Why did I forgot that ! It's the only thinks SOE do !

Here the WHY :

VS Flash Rocket Launcher.
TR Flash Rocket Launcher.
NC Flash Rocket Launcher.

Or it may just some fun from Vanu Labs (but I really think SOE don't give a f*** of us so it may be the answer).

[OmegaPREDATOR]

OK maybe I was a little to in a bad mood when I write that. It seems to just be some tests from Vanu Labs. But commercial policies of SOE are not that far. as I describe.

[AThreatToYou]

Nerfing Flash anti-infantry in favor of returning the original Fury Flash to its former glory [by introducing a weapon that should have been here all along]? I vote yay.

[Thunderhawk]

Not sure what I am doing wrong (or right in this case) but the Fury is still as effective as ever at clearing out whole squads of players hanging around rocks and AMS'

I havent noticed any side effect to the "nerf" everyone is banging on about.....

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2

[Obstruction]

it's harder to solo an MBT basically. the direct hit damage is down, the AP resist type is up, the balance means probably a few more rounds (never really tested before) to take small armored targets, and a clip or so more for MBTs who have AP weakness AND the HP buff.

i'm pretty sure it was aimed at Fury Flash getting a double nerf vs MBT.

[AThreatToYou]

it's harder to solo an MBT basically. the direct hit damage is down, the AP resist type is up, the balance means probably a few more rounds (never really tested before) to take small armored targets, and a clip or so more for MBTs who have AP weakness AND the HP buff.

i'm pretty sure it was aimed at Fury Flash getting a double nerf vs MBT.


Hmm...

Resist type for the weapon has improved against vehicles, which partially mitigates this decrease in direct hit damage

Nope.

Plus, when did the Fury ever kill MBTs?

[BlazingSun]

(also with the NERF of air-hammer, the Enforcer Modified need 2 or 3 shoots for kill an infantery ... so worth than a pomp-action shotgun).

No range, not that much damage, a window where the gunner could shoot with its own weapon would be more usefull than the Enforcer Modified.

The funny thing is that it doesn't have more ammo than a handheld shotgun either and a pretty long reload on top. It's hands down the worst gun that you can get for a vehicle in this game. Good job SOE. :domotwak:

[Mastachief]

The enforcer modified is utterly worthless.. really go try it. There is no situation where you would equip that garbage. One more weapon the TR have the edge in. Striker/fracture/marauder/vulcan/mcg.

[Mastachief]

Not sure what I am doing wrong (or right in this case) but the Fury is still as effective as ever at clearing out whole squads of players hanging around rocks and AMS'

I havent noticed any side effect to the "nerf" everyone is banging on about.....

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2

It is there, you will notice it Vs vehicles/maxes/trying to kill people on top of walls more obviously. The main issue is that the TR have the marauder which is now a better fury.

[Thunderhawk]

It is there, you will notice it Vs vehicles/maxes/trying to kill people on top of walls more obviously. The main issue is that the TR have the marauder which is now a better fury.

The TR have better everything, whats new? :rolleyes:

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2

[Corvo]

Wow that's a lot of whining in this thread! I don't feel like wasting my time to try and convince VS/NC guys that TR don't have 'better everything' (thanks for a good laugh btw), so I'll just jump to something more productive.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Flash, Sunderer and Harasser Furies all different weapons? If that's the case, why didn't they tweak them separately? I see how OHK capability could be easily abused on flashes and harassers, but did they really need to nerf the Sunderer Fury?

I don't think that the devs could miss a point that obvious, so I have serious doubts about this nerf being somehow tied to 'OP' cloaked flashes and harassers. I think what they are trying to do is implement the jack-of-all-trades NS design philosophy more consistently one step at a time.


Step 1. New models for Marauder and Vulcan to make them look more TR. Changes to Enforcer and Saron models. Ugly stripes everywhere!
Step 2. Changes to Saron and Enforcer to give them a mechanic different from the halberd
Step 3. Tweaking Saron and Enforcer to make their AI damage worse than that of Halberd (specialization vs. jack of all trades)
Step 4. Bringing Vulcan in line with other factions AV secondaries. New spin-up mechanic and sound
Step 5. AV secondaries look okay! Time to work on AI secondaries now. Fury damage nerf. The direct result of this is that TR now have a gun that's better against infantry but worse against armor. Fury is now a versatile NS gun that's okay at everything. (Specialization vs. jack of all trades again)
Step 6. A balance pass on VS and NC AI secondaries?