ESF with hover fully upgraded should hover for real.

[Livefire]

I think with the ESF revamp going on they should make it so if you choose the hover cert, when it gets fully upgraded it should be perma hover like the liberator. Your basically choosing to have a fixed wing craft that is more maneuverable and faster but can land and take off VTOL or a helicopter that is much slower and less maneuverable but actually hovers and is more stable so you can spam your dumb fire rockets, essentially one is an interceptor for air to air dogfights and the other is a ground attack helicopter.

The fact that the hover mod cert can just hover for a few extra secs and then fall to the ground like a rock is stupid and makes no mechanical sense. If this is introduced I want the speed and maneuverability cert buffed with an armor decrease so they actually fly like fighters and would own in dog fights. And then the Hover cert regarding speed and maneuverability nurfed and armor increased so it actually fly's like a helicopter.

Right now more pilots are using the hover cert for even air to air dog fighting then the speed/maneuverability which makes no sense. And with the hover cert laughably making pilots bounce up and down all the time as they spam there rockets actually make them harder for AA to hit then if they were just perfectly hovering.

[Lonehunter]

but actually hovers and is more stable so you can spam your dumb fire rockets.
and there is the problem, lot of people don't want that

[KesTro]

I think with the ESF revamp going on they should make it so if you choose the hover cert, when it gets fully upgraded it should be perma hover like the liberator. Your basically choosing to have a fixed wing craft that is more maneuverable and faster but can land and take off VTOL or a helicopter that is slower and less maneuverable but actually hovers and is more stable so you can spam your dumb fire rockets. The fact that it can just hover for a few extra secs and then fall to the ground like a rock is stupid and makes no mechanical sense.

Eh, no need to make lolpodding more easy than it already is. Besides most people I know who use hover use it for the dogfighting maneuvers anyhow.

Dat vert thrust OP.

[Livefire]

Eh, no need to make lolpodding more easy than it already is. Besides most people I know who use hover use it for the dogfighting maneuvers anyhow.

Dat vert thrust OP.

And that proves they need to make both these certs better and more defined. An aircraft with the hover cert should get owned in air to air against the speed and maneuverability cert.

[Livefire]

and there is the problem, lot of people don't want that
It goes both ways man if a pilot actually comes to a perfect hover like libs do when they rocket spam they would be even easier to hit with AA and RL's plus the cert should probably make the vehicle even less maneuverable with a slower top speed then it does.

[Ghoest9]

ESF should not be able to hover at all.

[Livefire]

ESF should not be able to hover at all.

Why do you say that as long as there rolls are actually defined?

[Lonehunter]

Why do you say that as long as there rolls are actually defined?

I think you mean "their roles"

The point is you're trying to make it easier to shoot rockets while hovering....
A LOT of people think it is all ready incredibly easy, because it is.
The nerf to the other flying controls is unnecessary as well. It's not a role change it's a style choice. All some people do is dogfight, some air to ground, different frames are good for different loadouts/situations in those individual play styles.

[KesTro]

I think you mean "their roles"

The point is you're trying to make it easier to shoot rockets while hovering....
A LOT of people think it is all ready incredibly easy, because it is.
The nerf to the other flying controls is unnecessary as well. It's not a role change it's a style choice. All some people do is dogfight, some air to ground, different frames are good for different loadouts/situations in those individual play styles.

It really all boils down to the fact the pilots get touchy when you screw with the ESF balance.

[Livefire]

It really all boils down to the fact the pilots get touchy when you screw with the ESF balance.

Flying sucks in the game right now as even the dev's admit. Distinguishing the "styles" to actually be roles will make it a lot better.

[Badjuju]

Flying sucks in the game right now as even the dev's admit. Distinguishing the "styles" to actually be roles will make it a lot better.

No... Infantry farming ESFs are not a "style" anyone wants in the game besides people fly around doing it, and that is the only real use for it. We already tried aircrafts that could farm the hell out of infantry and people left the game in droves because of it. It isnt balanced and it isnt fun for anyone but the people who do it.

In my opinion ESFs hover more than well enough and LOLpoding should only be effective against vehicles.

They are taking steps in the next up date to create more defined roles which do not include air farming infantry with lame mechanics.

[AThreatToYou]

Given that actually hovering ESF are extremely vulnerable, I want this both as a ground-pounder and possibly an ESF pilot.

[Livefire]

Given that actually hovering ESF are extremely vulnerable, I want this both as a ground-pounder and possibly an ESF pilot.
Yes they are more vulnerable but they are also more accurate at performing there roles as a close air support helicopter. And the air frames that use speed and maneuverability over the hover ability will perform the task of air superiority fighter much better. This makes absolute sense to me.

[Livefire]

No... Infantry farming ESFs are not a "style" anyone wants in the game besides people fly around doing it, and that is the only real use for it. We already tried aircrafts that could farm the hell out of infantry and people left the game in droves because of it. It isnt balanced and it isnt fun for anyone but the people who do it.

In my opinion ESFs hover more than well enough and LOLpoding should only be effective against vehicles.

They are taking steps in the next up date to create more defined roles which do not include air farming infantry with lame mechanics.

I don't think you understand what I am saying as this is exactly what the dev's should do to create more defined roles instead of just adding weapons and nurfing some current features like the fire and forget missile lock on which is what they are talking about doing.

As the fighters air frames actually would create 2 different kind of aircraft one designed around air to air and the other designed for close air support for the ground battle. Making this essentially 2 different aircraft that each do there role very well rather then one aircraft that doesn't do ether very well makes a lot more sense.

Based on what you are saying I think you just like to only fight on the ground and despise being killed by close air support. This game is designed around a total warfare environment with land, air, and eventually sea, if you want to play an infantry only ground game you are playing the wrong game bro.

[Ghoest9]

Hover should be removed from ESF

[Baneblade]

ESFs need to have rockets removed and replaced with something that requires some modicum of skill, like a lock on anti tank missile.

[PredatorFour]

ESFs need to have rockets removed and replaced with something that requires some modicum of skill, like a lock on anti tank missile.


Isn't a lock on missile easier though than non lock on rockets ? Think there is enough lock on weapons already in this game as it is. I would like some kind of bomb you could drop onto a tank, would be hard but you need some skill to use it.

[Roderick]

I can see all sorts of fail with a total hover ESF. So many sitting ducks just waiting to be shot out of the sky by the enemy [air or ground].

Make the change I say.

See the new level of complaints from those that use it. See those that love to air farm thank the Devs profusely for the gift.

[Dragonskin]

Given that actually hovering ESF are extremely vulnerable, I want this both as a ground-pounder and possibly an ESF pilot.

I agree. Generally the people lolpodding are the ones low to the ground. My decimator likes those.. hell the default launcher is good enough to severly damage an ESF. The people that hover way out in the distance aren't really an infantry threat and would be easily dealt with with lock-on AA or flak.

As an ESF pilot you have 2 options for frames really right now. You have the racer frame to outrun threats or the hover frame for dogfighting. The actual frame for dogfighting is terrible... that means the roles aren't defined well at all. OP has a point.

Plus lolpods aren't nearly as damaging to infantry as they were in the past. I can live through a salvo as a heavy assualt with resist shield and medkits... i've even killed pilots while being fired on with my RL.

[snafus]

I think with the ESF revamp going on they should make it so if you choose the hover cert, when it gets fully upgraded it should be perma hover like the liberator. Your basically choosing to have a fixed wing craft that is more maneuverable and faster but can land and take off VTOL or a helicopter that is much slower and less maneuverable but actually hovers and is more stable so you can spam your dumb fire rockets, essentially one is an interceptor for air to air dogfights and the other is a ground attack helicopter.

The fact that the hover mod cert can just hover for a few extra secs and then fall to the ground like a rock is stupid and makes no mechanical sense. If this is introduced I want the speed and maneuverability cert buffed with an armor decrease so they actually fly like fighters and would own in dog fights. And then the Hover cert regarding speed and maneuverability nurfed and armor increased so it actually fly's like a helicopter.

Right now more pilots are using the hover cert for even air to air dog fighting then the speed/maneuverability which makes no sense. And with the hover cert laughably making pilots bounce up and down all the time as they spam there rockets actually make them harder for AA to hit then if they were just perfectly hovering.

Don't want to come across as to mean man but it isn't hard to manipulate vertical thrust to stay level. Just give your space bar a tap here and there and you will maintain at your desired altitude.

[snafus]

ESFs need to have rockets removed and replaced with something that requires some modicum of skill, like a lock on anti tank missile.

Yes because a lock on based weapon takes skill?

[Baneblade]

Yes because a lock on based weapon takes skill?

It does if it follows the new upcoming lock rules.

[SolLeks]

It really all boils down to the fact the pilots get touchy when you screw with the ESF balance.

Yes we do. The reason for that is we have been at both ends of the OP <--> UP spectrum and we wish to stay in the middle.

It does if it follows the new upcoming lock rules.

Oh, you mean 'keep nose on target and don't worry about anything like bullet drop or lead' ?

Pro skills there bro.


As for the hover topic, I say no thank you. I would hate to not be able to just drop at random speeds when using it in a dog fight (there is up, then falling, then falling + control).

[Dougnifico]

Ya. ESF's should't really have a hover. I think that a hovering vehicle should be introduced, but it would be more of a scout vehicle with light armament, like the hornet from Halo.

http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110819010908/halo/images/e/e8/AV-14_Hornet.png

Anything larger that hovers should be a slow moving glass cannon just for the sake of balance. ESF's have the ability to semi-hover and quickly escape. That's bad enough.

[snafus]

It does if it follows the new upcoming lock rules.

I have a feeling you don't fly very often baneblade. Now I won't go so far to say rocket pods are a difficult weapon to master. But they do require the user to lead targets and adjust for drop. And not to mention they have a ridiculously small blast radius making them very sloppy and inefficient. To say that is easy mode compared to a look towards enemy and click fire system is kind of funny man.

[Baneblade]

I have a feeling you don't fly very often baneblade. Now I won't go so far to say rocket pods are a difficult weapon to master. But they do require the user to lead targets and adjust for drop. And not to mention they have a ridiculously small blast radius making them very sloppy and inefficient. To say that is easy mode compared to a look towards enemy and click fire system is kind of funny man.

I don't fly much, and when I do... I make sure I drink enough to at least look like I know what I'm doing.

But even still a lock on would be a buff on my end, not yours.

[snafus]

I don't fly much, and when I do... I make sure I drink enough to at least look like I know what I'm doing.

But even still a lock on would be a buff on my end, not yours.

Fair enough dude, I just like my rocket pods to ;)