Why gals need to return

[Taramafor]

Now I know what you're thinking. "Noo, gals have been tried and tested and failed because everyone ghost capped" but that's certainty not the reason I say they need to return.

Let's think about it for a moment. Gals were used to ghost cap when the hex system was in place. But now we have lattice. A gal is a big and easy to hit target and since we're forced to fight on the front now, that means they can have a use. Something other then fly, drop everyone and watch it crash because you bail because it served its purpose which frankly is just plain silly.

So, the idea at hand. Have gals squad deploy. Why? Because every time there's an enemy sun high up on a cliff, the times the other side can get a sun up on their side is rare. Sometimes you can't even get up there on foot (or at least, not get enough up there on foot). Right now all you can do is fight up hill against the never ending swarm or gal drop into the swarm and hope you get the sun before you die. Or send other aircraft and get ripped by anti air of which the zerg WILL have. Having gal use squad deploy is a good counter for this. Set it a reasonable distance away on the same cliff or even another one. You're still fighting against the odds but at least now you're a little more mobile. Get other squads to deploy other gals in the general area and it offers flanking tactics and such. Since it's squad deploy only, they will not replace suns (of which are smaller and easier to hide and not blow up). It might also make air tower fights more interesting.

To discourage people from just using squad deploy (not to mention people come and go in zergs/squads and need suns) I also recommend a 500 cert deploy ability, as much as the idea detests me.

So to put it bluntly, no ghost capping. Squad deploy so suns aren't replaced. Front line. Cliffs.

If this idea does come into effect just remember that you, the players, are expected to use suns and gals alike. Any devs reading this should also note that just because an idea fails the first time doesn't mean it can't be used at a later date with a different system (eg: lattice now where we had hex before).

[camycamera]

they are going to have repair gals, ammo gals, gals that can carry vehicles and AMS gals (that can only be used by squads) in the gal update.


so, yeah, its pretty much "comming back".

[Neurotoxin]

1000 certs. I dunno what ever happened to the idea of Galaxy having a squad deploy feature, but I'd love to see the discussion come up again. If nothing else, I miss the ability to deploy a Galaxy and have it put up that awesome energy shield, even that I'd probably be willing to spend 1000 certs to have.

I also wanna see Galaxy Gunships. Probably a different discussion entirely. All hardpoints can have Shredder, Dalton, or Zepher, and the top hardpoint can have a Skyguard. Restrict the number of seats to 5, and take out the safe bail feature. I think the only issue would be the ability to restrict guns from the Dropship without having to completely rework the UI.

[Neurotoxin]

they are going to have repair gals, ammo gals, gals that can carry vehicles and AMS gals (that can only be used by squads) in the gal update.


so, yeah, its pretty much "comming back".

Has the vehicle transport gal been confirmed? And will it actually be able to carry Sunderer sized vehicles?

[Taramafor]

gals that can carry vehicles


so, yeah, its pretty much "comming back".

That... Just made my day. GO AIRBORNE! :D

[EVILPIG]

OP is confusing. Gal/Spawn is coming back for squads. You want to really fix "everyone drops and gal crashes"? Make it so the pilot has no inertial dampener. He can skillfully LA or die. Either way, who cares if Gals serve their purpose and is then ditched? This is a disposable culture. Respawning is not just a game mechanic, the soldiers of Auraxis REALLY DO respawn. Life is cheap and gear is cheaper.

[Taramafor]

OP is confusing. Gal/Spawn is coming back for squads. You want to really fix "everyone drops and gal crashes"? Make it so the pilot has no inertial dampener. He can skillfully LA or die. Either way, who cares if Gals serve their purpose and is then ditched? This is a disposable culture. Respawning is not just a game mechanic, the soldiers of Auraxis REALLY DO respawn. Life is cheap and gear is cheaper.

Uh-huh. Have you seen the price tag of a b-52 bomber? From what I understand, the whole point of this war is to control the resources on the planet. Even if gals are cheap soldiers burning through 52 million of them (the price of a b-52 from 1998 btw if gals were 1 dollar each) from respawning is still going to cost.

But more importantly, it's just plain silly to have a gal, a heavy transport vehicle, have it do its job ONCE and then be USELESS. It makes for boring gameplay with them after the first drop (from the gal perspective. Not the person being dropped perspective) and they have no reason to be on the battlefield after that until the gal updates come into effect, which will make them much more useful and allow them to remain on the battlefield. You know, just like every other vehicle. Even flashes are more useful right now. With the hectic combat, people rarely have the luxury of boarding a gal after a big fight which most likely get blown up because it was put inside the base because there's no reason to keep it safe.

Of course, I'm sure C4 gals and gal drops are still going to be used. I expect it too and there's nothing wrong with that. But in a real war one rarely ditches equipment so easily and some of us actually like a battle that is at least somewhat semi realistic.

If you like bailing out of a gal and discarding it on a single drop, that's fine. That's the play style you want. I prefer to have long term use out of things that need resources (something else I'm sure will get updated. Perhaps a resorce pool shared by players in factions?). And I'm certainty not alone seeing as the devs are already working on putting exactly that into the game.

That wasn't an attack btw. If it seemed like that then it's because I'm on edge right now and I apologize in advance if it did.

[camycamera]

Has the vehicle transport gal been confirmed? And will it actually be able to carry Sunderer sized vehicles?

yes.

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/september-vehicle-update-galaxy.106322/
We would like to polish and enhance the Galaxy.
Some of the ideas being bandied about internally for the Galaxy at this point include stuff like:

Deploying into a forward garrison
Certifications for Proximity Repair
Certifications for Proximity Ammo Dispenser
Allowing it to provide transport for other vehicles
Adding a fifth, front facing weapon
Adding/unlocking some additional weapons for the wing slots

These are still only ideas at this point - we may end up with some, all, or none of this stuff by the time we go live with the galaxy update, but it at least gives some more insight on what we're thinking about at the moment. Let us know what you think and please keep leaving your feedback for other cool ideas for the Galaxy.

there are a few others i forgot to mention as you can see above, but these are currently ideas they have, but we have conformation that they have at least acknowledged the idea.

people in my outfit however think that it would be OP, because you could drop a tank on top of a building or something, but i disagree.

edit: and there is also this: http://planetside.wikia.com/wiki/Community_Galaxy_Suggestions

if anyone is interested, it is simply a collection of ideas that people have come up with, archived there.

[Canaris]

I didn't even know they'd removed gals from the game... the fuck was I flying around in all day yesterday then, oh that does it I'll never trust a travelling hobo again, when he said they were magic beans I thought tasty..... oohhh I need to lie down :sick:

oh and on topic I'd love to see the skywhales get some more features

[Sunrock]

I can see it now.. Harassers parked inside Bio Domes...

[Ghoest9]

Ghost capping is fun.

Or shoudl I say attempting to ghost cap is fun.

[ringring]

@op

I don't quite understand the point you're making.

It sounds like (I think I am misunderstanding you) that you want gals as spawn points so that you can combat an enemy that has set up a AA/AV nest on a cliff?

Personally I would like gals to return in their proper role, as hot drop transport. Or at least see more of that occur.

[Qwan]

OP is confusing. Gal/Spawn is coming back for squads. You want to really fix "everyone drops and gal crashes"? Make it so the pilot has no inertial dampener. He can skillfully LA or die. Either way, who cares if Gals serve their purpose and is then ditched? This is a disposable culture. Respawning is not just a game mechanic, the soldiers of Auraxis REALLY DO respawn. Life is cheap and gear is cheaper.

Well currently now it may seem cheap, since most things cost resource points aquired by the individual. But if and when they impliment the resource system that will start to drain bases instead of individual resources. I like this concept, and I really hope they impliment it, G I wonder were that concept came from :doh:

[Lonehunter]

I don't think anything anyone has said here about changes is actually confirmed yet, they're just conceptual ideas. "These are still only ideas at this point" is ON the SOE post lol.

But the point is the Galaxy does need more roles then just troop transport. Squad spawning will be nice but not enough.

[Wargrim]

If we can airlift vehicles, i hope we can drop them in the air. BOMB THEM WITH SUNDERERS!

[Babyfark McGeez]

Airlifting vehicles is definetely needed and a good addition (if that becomes avaible i actually might pull a gal sometime).
But i think it should work like in ps1, where you had to actually drive into the loadstar and had to land to release the vehicle (if i recall right). I mean let's be real, gals dropping tanks in midair would be incredibly stupid lol.

[bpostal]

A lodestar mod for the Gal would be preferable to a squad spawn Gal IMO.

[Taramafor]

A lodestar mod for the Gal would be preferable to a squad spawn Gal IMO.

Both would be good. If it's just the former, it would still be a case of drop and ditch (the only vehicle to continually be done so). I'm raking my brain over how squad spawn could work while being fair to those in none squads though. Perhaps a spawn timer slapped on which requires resources (a respawn resorce)? That way you can spawn at it for a bit without doing it constantly like with the sun and not be forced to be in a squad which is a win for all.

And yes, tanks in a gal would be a bit silly. I'm thinking maybe tanks could be too wide for them. Maaayyybe lightnings but defiantly leave faction vehicles out (Which are much heavier then lightnings).

[Aaron]

I think gals should give droppers defensive buffs. That might make it more worth the effort.

[ringring]

1. Make maps within outposts better so that specific targets are easier to identify at longer ranges.
2. Soldiers should be able steer their fall better, similar to PS1.

That above will make gal drops more effective and possibly more prevalent.

[Omnimon]

Why use a galaxy when there are better cheaper options ?

Just grab a cloaked flash + infil , toss a spawn beacon down . 11 players are in the re-spawn screen, deploy on spawn beacon and boom, Iron rain .

Cost : 100 mechanized resources and a one time cost for few certs for the cloaked flash and beacon . Requires a bit more coordination , but its far cheaper and more effective ( drop pods won't be seen as easily as a galaxy ) .

If the spawn beacon gets destroyed, no problem just spawn on the squad leader. Switch squad leader, drop another beacon in a tree/ rooftops ( where only LA's can get to or ESF / Libs ) . Do not need really baby sit a drop beacon , esp if its in a tree .

This works anywhere, even in areas where there is heavy fighting . * Bonus* since drop pods aren't seen as easily , surprising the enemy from the rear is far easier with this method .

Versus :

Recalling to warp gate waiting for 12 people to load up , try to get to objective alive without being killed ( must have air dominance and or huge skill gap between galaxy pilot + gunners versus ESF's / Dalton liberators ) . Works best if there isn't too much heavy fighting , slightly faster for ghost capping , but good luck trying to use this option during a large fight .

Costs : 350 air resources , *could* use a stock galaxy for this operation , 0 cert investment involved . Also need to babysit the galaxy during the fight unless its just a one time use.

Since the galaxy is large and is VERY visible ( on the radar map / spotting, etc ) , your not going to surprise too many defenders unless they're very uncoordinated.

Until they change the mechanics to which squad beacon / squad deploy ( on leader) works. Galaxies are just a luxury if your coordinated. Better off using air resources on ESF's, etc .

At the moment ( if you have a coordinated squad ) , squad beacons / spawn on leader mechanics can almost replace the need for a sunderer / galaxy if the squad is experienced AND coordinated . They're ( squad beacon / squad deploy) amazing for sunderer hunting , they're amazing for having to infiltrate the base by bypassing defensive choke points with ease . They're also amazing for surprise attacks. If PS1 had that , i bet most of those bases would be far easier to take ( let alone the LA class which circumvents many defensive choke points ) . They're also one of the reasons why the battle feels like a TDM . Defenders have to expect an attack from anywhere . Doesn't matter if you have a spawn room to your six with people coming out of it, someone can just drop pod behind your defensive position and just wreck havoc with bricks of C4 / guns, etc.

For PS1 , you *could* do this via certing a liberator / ESF and just drop podding behind enemy lines but extremely long timers prevented this tactic's frequent use. But pulling it off ? Esp if you were packing Adrenaline rush + JH yielded amazing results , but aren't too common as they are today .

[EVILPIG]

The main thing is that what Gals are best for are surprise attacks on distant targets. If you're just following the Lattice it's best to not use a Gal. 1. The Gal pilot must stay in the Gal and focus on keeping it alive. 2. You're usually better off just moving across the ground and bringing AMS's. Most targets are very close together and it does not take much time to get anywhere.

[Taramafor]

Why use a galaxy when there are better cheaper options ?


If anything this just proves my point about gals not having enough use. Why have them in the game at all if it's just a luxury with no real impact on the battlefield (it does have a bit of an impact, which is drop pods. But it's not quite enough)?

The main thing is that what Gals are best for are surprise attacks on distant targets. If you're just following the Lattice it's best to not use a Gal. 1. The Gal pilot must stay in the Gal and focus on keeping it alive. 2. You're usually better off just moving across the ground and bringing AMS's. Most targets are very close together and it does not take much time to get anywhere.

I think you're underestimating what gals can do with squad deploy. Gals might be bigger and more obvious but they have much more maneuverability. Let's say there's two suns and they belong to two different empires. They both push towards each other 'till one eventually is taken down. Now if someone manages to get a gal behind them or off to the side then suddenly it's not a tug of war anymore. One empire has to keep an eye on two sides. And this can be done MUCH more quickly then with a sun (in terms of getting into a position which the gal mostly bypasses as it flys past/around the front line). That's not to say gals are better, it's a trade off. You're a bigger target and you need to find a nice spot but it IS doable and offers attacks from unexpected directions (while still being able to work with the lattice and zergs). A sun trying to reach the other side of a base is pretty much certain death for it, but a galaxy is capable of flying around and with squad deploy it can, say, deploy itself on a nice hill somewhere where a sun has difficulty reaching. Nice vantage point gained quickly while a sun would have to have driven uphill. Good positions taken quickly can quickly turn the tide of battle into your favor. If it pays off, it's a shorter fight with a higher chance of the gal surviving. If not, it becomes trench warefare (for lack of a better term) with the survivability chance lowering. If nothing else it will give people a reason to decide if they should have anti air or anti ground rocket launchers (right now I'd imagine ground would be miles ahead due to the threat of suns). The only threat there is the striker so I sense an armor/air nerf once it comes into effect. >_>

Also I imagine gals being more useful in the volcano continent that will come into effect at some point, which I imagine will be somewhat ground vehicle unfriendly due to the lava (aw hell, mags on lava. Gulp).

[EVILPIG]

If anything..

I'm not underestimating anything. The Galspawn was removed because it was too useful and caused battles to simply bypass terrain. My last paragraph was speaking of the current state of the Gal. I'm not sure why they are considering bringing back the Gaspawn, even limited to squad, and especially since you cannot hack if you do not have a secure link. As for toughness, Gals are plenty tough and were much more survivable than sundy's. Their size is not such a big issue as their is tons of terrain that Gals can hide behind. Hiding doesn't necessarily mean unable to find, but most importantly, not having direct line of sight to enemy ground forces.

We must ask ourselves, "Why?" Why should the Galaxy have AMS capability again? What impact will being able to park a Gal where a Sundy could never reach have? How will being able to bypass terrain affect gameflow? How much more powerful does an offense become if this is added in addition to Squad Deploy and Beacons? How does this affect large scale battles vs. smaller ones?

[Geist]

I know what you're saying, "3 pages? That's not much, why didn't you read them?" Because I'm lazy. ;)

There was an idea a while back where we would cert an ability on the Gal and be able to spawn inside of it(idea maybe have been squad spawn only) so the pilot could come back for another pass should the squad wipe. That's how I think it should work personally, instead of doing something the Sunderer can already do.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[Taramafor]

I'm sure gals can work if done correctly. It's just a matter of keeping the squad size small enough to not end up a zerg. Which is why I want some sort of redeploy resource for gals. The main aim with gals should be smaller squads (regardless of any "squads" one may or may not be in). I'm not saying it's going to be easy to get gals working without reducing effectiveness of suns but I'm sure it's doable.

Also, one must consider the disadvantages of spawn gals as well. Having a gal land on a hill will provide a good vantage point but you won't be having any tanks up there. And even if you get one up there, aiming will be limited (less likely to shoot at the base of the hill for example).

As for bypassing terrain, that's why we got lattice now. Terrain will be bypassed to some degree but only to the next base on the line (unless you want to stand around in a base you can't take over). Some might find fighting smaller squads and hunting some gals boring, but air drops happen in any war and it adds an extra challenge. Which is fun for some. Just like playing one class will be boring for some yet fun for others. I find artillery somewhat boring to use myself but wouldn't be against it if it comes into effect as it happens in war and know others feel differently. Which is what this game is about.

[Belhade]

How does Gal spawn work anyways? Dropping little turds around like pigeons on a powerline? Steel coffins?

[EVILPIG]

How does Gal spawn work anyways? Dropping little turds around like pigeons on a powerline? Steel coffins?

Last version deployed like a Sundy.

[Blynd]

do we know if they will allow full sundies to be airlifted by gals ?? if so then its just 2gals 2 full sundies one ams/ammo and the other ams/repair and drop the pair in one spot it will give the best life expectancy of the sundies as the troops pile out and take down the enemy the sundies have the option of one deploying till the situation is sorted and the repair sundie sits in cover as best it can giving that bit of extra life and when the other goes that one can deploy

[Taramafor]

do we know if they will allow full sundies to be airlifted by gals ?? if so then its just 2gals 2 full sundies one ams/ammo and the other ams/repair and drop the pair in one spot it will give the best life expectancy of the sundies as the troops pile out and take down the enemy the sundies have the option of one deploying till the situation is sorted and the repair sundie sits in cover as best it can giving that bit of extra life and when the other goes that one can deploy

Good point. Suns might need to be left out of being air-lifted, otherwise a transport gal would just equal a basically deployable gal with no squad restrictions. Tanks will most likely also be left out of (at least faction ones) but flashes and harassers seem perfectly reasonable to me.

[Carbon Copied]

Excuse not reading the last 3 pages so don't know if it's been mentioned but as much as I want the Gals to return to a useful asset, and even after the much needed gal update I fear that they'll be stomped back to their current state if they decide to follow through with the lazy space umbrella shield domes. I really hope they steer firmly clear of this clearly shit design idea for the sake of many aspects of the game.

[Oracen]

I think in order to make Gals worthwhile you'd need:
-Hotdrop only for squad beacons (and make the damn thing render further out than 30 odd meters). Iron rain, while kinda nifty, was gamebreaking. Put Beacon Deploy on a 3 minute c/d, and only let you deploy a beacon once every 20 minutes fully certed. Major nerf, but hold your boos. (Hisses still welcome.)
-Squad deploy on a half hour cooldown. Make it so you don't drop from the sky, you appear on your squad leader. You can't spawn on him if the leader is dead.
-Tie both of these abilities to individual squad members so that it can't be hotseated. (Vanny shield, anyone?)
-Instant action simply deploys you at the nearest spawn/sundy to the fight. No drop pods.
-Redeploy will only allow you to deploy within a short range, or to warpgate.

So. AMSs (and battle-busses) in general are now a thing again, and the ability to rapidly redeploy vast numbers has been removed. Guess what steps into that void? If you said "the galaxy in its intended role", you get a sticker. Glitter and all. It hurts to remove people's freedom, but there needs to be some kind of logistics in this game for strategy to truly shine. A lot of people will be mad at the restricted movement, but I'd argue this just makes you think a little harder about HOW to move. Clicking a button is so dull.

Anyway, flame on, forumdwellers. Curious to see what the one constructive PS forum has to say.

[Omnimon]

I think in order to make Gals worthwhile you'd need:
-Hotdrop only for squad beacons (and make the damn thing render further out than 30 odd meters). Iron rain, while kinda nifty, was gamebreaking. Put Beacon Deploy on a 3 minute c/d, and only let you deploy a beacon once every 20 minutes fully certed. Major nerf, but hold your boos. (Hisses still welcome.)
-Squad deploy on a half hour cooldown. Make it so you don't drop from the sky, you appear on your squad leader. You can't spawn on him if the leader is dead.
-Tie both of these abilities to individual squad members so that it can't be hotseated. (Vanny shield, anyone?)
-Instant action simply deploys you at the nearest spawn/sundy to the fight. No drop pods.
-Redeploy will only allow you to deploy within a short range, or to warpgate.

So. AMSs (and battle-busses) in general are now a thing again, and the ability to rapidly redeploy vast numbers has been removed. Guess what steps into that void? If you said "the galaxy in its intended role", you get a sticker. Glitter and all. It hurts to remove people's freedom, but there needs to be some kind of logistics in this game for strategy to truly shine. A lot of people will be mad at the restricted movement, but I'd argue this just makes you think a little harder about HOW to move. Clicking a button is so dull.

Anyway, flame on, forumdwellers. Curious to see what the one constructive PS forum has to say.


To be honest such changes need to be implemented. Right now its just WAY too easy to get to the " front' lines by passing the need for real logistics in PS2 ( which the galaxy filled that role decently in PS1 for several reasons ) .

Cheap( Cert and resource wise ) and easy mechanisms circumvent that .

1) Squad beacons - you can always redeploy to where the fighting is easily as a squad if someone has a squad beacon and your squad is remotely partially organized . As what I've said before, all you need is an infil or LA with a flash ( cloaked if infil ) or ESF . Boost your way behind the enemy lines ( easy enough given the size of the maps ) Toss down a squad beacon and boom, Iron rain . Behind enemy lines for that flashy motage your waiting for . There's barely any cost to this, save for a few certs if even that .

If you can't get behind enemy lines ( say an amp station) no problem. Squad beacon the nearest friendly line , Iron rain 12 players behind enemy lines , wreck havoc .

Squad beacon go boom ? no problem drop another one or switch squad leaders to drop another if your squad leader is dead. Squad beacons can also be placed on tree branches ( so you need a LA to kill it or an ESF/ liberator , far more defendable then a galaxy/ sunderer ) , clip through rocks ( thus unkillable ) .


2) Squad deploy - Same thing granted the respawn time IS higher, but its only limited by 5 minutes. cost ? 0 . Benefits ? Immense , dropping 11 guideable drop pods to one location that aren't easily detected = why even take a galaxy ? Hell your squad leader could DEAD and this works .

Never mind that these ARE THE best way of taking out sunderers/ tanks without breaking much sweat .

With those 2 low cost cheap options and some MINIMAL organization , why even get a galaxy ? Its a waste of resources unless your squad is just a squad in name and just unorganized as hell . These 2 options are FAR better then what ANY galaxy can bring to the table period. You can have a galaxy operate as a FOB , but even then its a huge large target, which requires resources to defend .

Dropping on the squad leader? 0 resources the actual " respawn" point requires 0 defenders even , 0 certs needed. *can * be detected on radar but you have 0 idea who the hell that squad lead is . Even then if the squad leader is dead you can still spawn on a squad leader. Also each individual player is in control of where they can land in the drop pod.

Dropping on a Squad beacon ? 0 resources , minimal cert cost( one time fee) , the actual respawn point can be placed in hard to shoot at areas, like tree branches . Even then if its destroyed can be EASILY replaced . You can *see* where the beacon is but your more liable to see maxes at a distance then seeing where that squad beacon is . Also cannot be detected by radar. Also each individual player is in control of where they can land in the drop pod.

Dropping on a point with a Galaxy ? 350 Air resources, *might* need a cert investment , requires defending ( air and ground ) . Huge target, can be seen from a long distance , is detectable on the radar. Far more difficult to surprise defenders then the " iron" rain from a spawn beacon or squad leader . Players are NOT in control of where they can land , this is up to pilot discretion .

TLDR : Forget using galaxies , even if they had something " extra" your better off with squad leader drop podding or squad beacon antics . Until there are huge revamps with how those 2 aspects of the game are, there is no real reason to use a galaxy unless your just a squad " in name only " .

[Greenthy]

Galaxies comming with a limited resource system used for spawns and re-equips
Now I like that Idea :)

No need to do a squad only galaxy, it'll just drain faster. Making the galaxy a 'specialist' thing:
Get your team in a location and not provide it to the mass zerg.

Now the things that made the galaxy so strong in beta was because:
1. Hex system
2. Shields at the sides
With both these gone and perhaps the resource system, I can imagine some fun gameplay.

[Falcon_br]

Hey, they made a video with the suggestions on this topic that came from another topic!

http://youtu.be/GqcvyU-op8U