Linda Carlson on Community and Offensive Players

[Hamma]

http://www.planetside-universe.com/news-linda-carlson-on-community-and-offensive-players-3071.htm

[EvilNinjadude]

I just wanna mention that there have been both reports and actual recorded instances of people being wrongfully banned. They may be a 0.05% of the 0.05%, but they're there, sometimes they're actual good members of the community, and then they get banned out of the blue. If nobody knows them, there's no chance they're getting the account back. There is no proper way to appeal.

And while there's people we all want gone from the game, like cheaters, hackers, or exploiters, they gotta make sure they don't accidentally ban the wrong person with no way to undo it - Or even worse, no way for them to show that they have been wronged in the first place.

Just wanted to say this. Peace.

[EVILPIG]

The positive: Making the community aware that social status will not save you.

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

Was it her intention to say that? I do not know, but that is what I get from it. If it is such a policy to view FPS players in such a way, it should be a private policy.

Either way, I appreciate the message of intolerance for exploiters.

[o Solei o]

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

Was it her intention to say that? I do not know, but that is what I get from it. If it is such a policy to view FPS players in such a way, it should be a private policy.

Either way, I appreciate the message of intolerance for exploiters.

They do have to come out and say it otherwise players in other games (such as their upcoming EQ titles) will point to the standard of behavior in the shooters they own (PS titles) as justification for behaving the way they do. They have to be clear that each genre has its own standards, and I'm reasonably certain that anyone who has played FPS games for any period of time is well aware of how much more of a cesspool FPS communities tend to be.

Case in point: In slightly cartoony MMOs like the EQ franchise, encountering someone playing the game with their kids is not that uncommon. However, the other night I encountered a dad trying to teach his ~10 year old daughter how to play. As is often the case with new players, there was some confusion as to whether or not they were talking in local voip or squad voip. The disgusting amount of trolls that came out of the woodwork with less than a dozen people in the entire WG was astounding. It's a sad state of affairs, but if they were to not be more lenient with the standards of conduct in FPS games, they'd wind up banning a rather sizable amount of the community.

[Kalee J]

The negative: Publicly saying that the FPS players are basically allowed to misbehave more.

I disagree with you here, EvilPig. I read this and got an entirely different message. I think she simply stated that we as FPS gamers are simply competitive by nature. As such we need to be handled by a different set of standards than in cooperative games like most MMORPGs.

[Neurotoxin]

QUOTE: When I first started playing in 1999, it was the most extraordinarily, overtly sexist environment ever," she says when we meet after her talk. "That's one of the reasons I started playing as a male dwarf. I made a female wood-elf, and it was, 'Hey baby, nice rack!' So I made a female human - not as attractive - and it was still just people wanting to cyber. I finally went for a male dwarf, because nobody wants to touch that."

Then below the following paragraph, two sexy near-naked female warriors. In 14 years, boobs have only gotten more detailed and emphasized. If there was supposed to be a transition to make female characters and players feel more comfortable in EQN, it didn't happen. I'm not saying that a player shouldn't have the option to make their character use the mostly-revealing attire options, but that busty cleavage shouldn't be the default on the character creation screen and the focus of many sets of gear.

Nobody should have to make a male dwarf for the reasons listed. I wonder how things would be different if Linda didn't have that experience, and instead stayed as a female elf the whole time. Would the game and community be distinctly different than it is now? Would we see different SOE Fan Faire / Live cosplay?

[Stew]

I think this whole article goes a little to far in my opinions , i think thats every game and game environement have their policicy and code of coduct strict to that game and when you agree the policicy its about in game and related game contents ....

I think that pretending that you saw X or Y player saying something offensive on twitter and banned this person on everquest , DCUO , and planetside 2 as a exemple it goes Way to far .

And iam not even sure its legals , peoples pay for games and also sign an agreement and i doubt the agreement can include ( others medias ) ..

Anyones think it goes a little to far ?

Also anyones can trolls and make themself a Totalbiscuit accont somehwere and say iam total biscuit go f yourself everyones and so on ...

I think every games as to be taken apart and each agreement that player sign as to be respected in that matters

Cheaters and exploiters in game tho as to be punish no matter if they are huge outfit leader or not on thats i agree

[Tatwi]

The only accurate sweeping generalization about humanity is that there simply isn't a sweeping generalization that accurately describes humanity as a whole. I had to get old to realize this.

Throwing one's hands up and simply accepting failure is a sure fire way to perpetuate the circumstances that lead to the failure. It would be nice if these online game companies made an international community conduct standard so that, across the board, everyone would know beyond a shadow of a doubt "where the the line is" and when they've crossed it. Failure to act against it is the same as actively encouraging people to create a hostile, intolerant society. It's another one of those cases where we need to do these things "not because they are easy, but because they are hard". With games and online communities being the playground of our young people, we'd be stupid to not enforce suitable rules and to lead by example.

Granted, not all people who are callous fucks "grow up" to be social degenerates, but why risk it by letting people behave that way at all?

When one considers that there are more people in one city in China than there in many entire countries, the level of internet censorship in China starts to make a little more sense. For instance, 5,000 workers at a Foxxcon plant had what was basically a bar room brawl over a disagreement between a couple people and a plant security guard. 5,000 people... 5,000! Duking it out over something fairly inconsequential in the long run. That's pretty insane and a practical example of why it's a good idea to minimize needless negativity in large societies - shit can quickly get out of hand! And for what? Property damage and some personal injuries?

In any event, communities should be managed with honesty, integrity, and no shortage of strict frankness; "Suck it up, buttercup. It's not OK to be a dick".

[Stew]

When one considers that there are more people in one city in China than there in many entire countries, the level of internet censorship in China starts to make a little more sense. For instance, 5,000 workers at a Foxxcon plant had what was basically a bar room brawl over a disagreement between a couple people and a plant security guard. 5,000 people... 5,000! Duking it out over something fairly inconsequential in the long run. That's pretty insane and a practical example of why it's a good idea to minimize needless negativity in large societies - shit can quickly get out of hand! And for what? Property damage and some personal injuries?

In any event, communities should be managed with honesty, integrity, and no shortage of strict frankness; "Suck it up, buttercup. It's not OK to be a dick".

You certainly show up your TR traits here , i think freedom of expression is essential for a healthy society , censorship in china is outrigth discusting , no matters if the authority dont find it ( manageable ) its still agains everything that i beleive on and its outrigth slavely and asking there peoples to shup up and dont say a words its the opposite of whats a healthy society should have ...

peoples in china basically live in the matrix

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6dQyUyAo4M

Anger is part of the human nature and when peoples have a way to express there anger you migth learn something from that anger or from a internet rant , human have whats we call feeling and they arent always nice , i know that , its part of our life

But been able to express our point of view or our feeling or opinions is truely important , bullying or dead threats are unacceptable and should be denonced and condamned ...

censorship ( especially chinease one ) as to be condamned ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZdssVmgDJM

[Tatwi]

I agree that China has horrible problems with government suppression/oppression of its population, etc. however that line of chat is for another thread in a different forum.

The incident I mentioned is good example of how things can get WAY out of control due to small initial problem, which can be catastrophic when it involves a huge population. Another really good example would be the the riots in Canada after a hockey game, where property was vandalized/destroyed and people were hurt, just because the home team lost - this level of epic stupidity from a supposedly peaceful, civil society.

Aye, people get angry. Some times people get angry and don't deal with in a classy manner (/wave) and that's fine. Rage is part of what kept our ancestors alive. However, that's simply NOT what makes online communities awful. What makes them awful are the people who mean/rude/evil for the sake of doing so.

[camycamera]

hm, not really news to me, but it is a slow news day.

[Hamma]

When people start comparing situations like this to censorship in China or Japan or *Insert Country Here* I laugh. SOE is a company, just like if I decided tomorrow that I wanted to censor the word "ZOE" on PSU I could do so without repercussion, it's a private website and SOE can can do the same. If they correlate someone on Twitter who is harassing a Dev personally (for example) they are well within their rights to remove them from the community.

[Hyncharas]

Trolling is, unfortunately, not something I suspect will ever be removed from the Internet. People who do it to other users do it because they can and see it as fun in their sick, little minds, sometimes with drastic consequences. So, if the BCPs of the world get banned from our online communities for their flammable attitudes to everyone else, that's a situation of their own making and shouldn't be surprised if it happens...

In the case of sexist comments towards female game characters, however, I think users forget that even though it may be offensive to them, people rarely know what gender they are anyway unless they are publicly acknowledging it. It comes with the territory and I'm sure there are male game characters who get stereotyped by female players just as easily.

[Ghoest9]

The only "social" reasons anyone should ever be banned are real life threats, public racism, and continued harassment(by that I mean if you keep coming back and finding ways to insult an individual who doesnt want to deal with you - simply getting in an argument and calling them some names over a 5 minute period is some thing that should be dealt with by means of personal filters.)

And even public racism should result in a warning the firast time in all but the most extreme cases.

[Brusilov]

I think rudeness/abusive behaviour in general sucks! specially if its about something that should be entertaining and fun like games.

Its not needed and in my opinion below anybody who should be considered civilised.

[GeoGnome]

All of these overt attempts to weed out malicious and bitter people, for some reason is misconstrude as Censorship, like someone is threatening your 1st amendment rights here in the US. It then often leads to people becoming more rude and malicious because they don't understand what 'Free speech' actually means... Wherever is that wonderful example I found earlier... link (http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/comments/1mpifw/soe_will_ban_players_for_vile_behaviour_on_any/ccbopt5)

Look folks, this isn't how Communist china got started. Only someone with a shaky, non-critical view on history would say something that breathtakingly idiotic. No one is taking away your ability to be critical of SOE. You have the right to speak, but you also have the right to be responsible for what you say. If you are saying something that is overtly threatening and is going to offend a large group of people, because you yourself are kind of a child, then you wont get banned. If this policy was such that people would get banned for making wild accusations and behaving like the kind of immature man child that gaming is sterotyped for... well I can think of like 3 people that would have been banned months ago.

They are just stating that if you behave like a tit, if you actively harass or bully someone, you will get banned, making stupid comments on reddit instead of IG doesn't make you immune from recrimination.

Again: You have the right to free speech, but if you say something that is offensive, the rest of humanity has the right to step in and call you a moron, your right to free speech doesn't supersede someone else's, and other people have all the rights in the world to limit you if you are speaking counter to the public good.

[VaderShake]

It's their game they can make their rules....but make no mistake any multiplayer game policy is less about the players and their behavior than it is about the companies potential liability and any impact a negative experience may have on overall sales.

Here are some helpful hints to the Narci.....erm I mean people who are easily offended: http://meanttobehappy.com/10-ways-you-too-can-stop-being-so-easily-offended/

Been playing online a long time and when there were no rules the players managed to sort things out just fine.

[Crator]

Been playing online a long time and when there were no rules the players managed to sort things out just fine.

At what expense? That's the reason why companies would have a community relations department. To mitigate the issues that cause many customers to just up and leave, never to be seen again.

[maradine]

Been playing online a long time and when there were no rules the players managed to sort things out just fine.

Sometimes. And sometimes they produced toxic communities full of entitled, offensive children. There was online gaming long before there was residentially available Internet and it wasn't always pretty.

SOE has every right to build and encourage whatever type of community they wish. Gamers of all identities have the right to play in a community where they feel included and unobjectified. People who want to be offensive and use the "suck it up, thinskin" defense have the right to speak however they wish. But that confluence of competing rights takes us to precisely where we are - enforced community standards.

[EvilNinjadude]

Yo. I'm back with constructive stuff.

I went from your link, GeoGnome, over to reddit, where a link was posted to an article showing a slightly different stance. (http://www.pcgamesn.com/planetside/soe-ban-players-extreme-behaviour-outside-their-games) The following is from the comments:

To be honest, after seeing how EA did the same thing and used it in RIDICULOUSLY bad fashion, to the point of banning forum posters for things they didn't even say...

Let's just say I'm fairly skeptical that this won't end up in a fair amount of abuse of the system. I get concerned when devs say that they'll actively lock you out of games when they "don't like your behaviour".

I don't like trolls, I hate aggro behaviour and similar. Things like death threats over patches are all kinds of outright and sheer insanity. But I also don't like the idea that they can simply lock me out of a purchased game because they feel like it.

Basically I don't expect the people doing the banning to be any less of jerks with their powers than those getting banned.

In order for me to trust such a system, I'd want to be clear, I'm talking seriously crystal-completeley-defined-lawyer-triple-checked-for-possible-alternate-interpretations clear in their definitions of what does and does not constitute a bannable offense. Because what almost always happens with these systems is the wording is loose and effectively comes down to vague terms like "behaviour that causes offense". Which whilst understandable, could also mean _anything_, and is frequently used to that effect.Linda here... believe me, we RARELY even ban people from our forums. To be banned from our games takes an extremely offensive or sustained series of actions, and we document them very, very carefully, because we are fully accountable for these deicisons. It's not anybody's idea of fun here, and we strongly prefer to use reason and discussion before having to take those steps.

;-)#
Adapted for BBCode, naturally.

So this is where you turn when you're banned for "social behavior". However, there's people I know who've been banned for in-game "third-party-software-use" that they haven't committed (because they turn to r/planetside instead of a hacker board which would have told them how to effectively avoid being b& in the first place) whom this information won't exactly be useful for. :(

Also, while we're at it, TotalBiscuit's opinion. (At 9:31)

[GeoGnome]

So this is where you turn when you're banned for "social behavior". However, there's people I know who've been banned for in-game "third-party-software-use" that they haven't committed (because they turn to r/planetside instead of a hacker board which would have told them how to effectively avoid being b& in the first place) whom this information won't exactly be useful for.

Yeah, I have heard anecdotal accounts of that happening myself, thing is, and I hate to sound callous here, but with any system that is there to limit people behaving like baboons, you will get a few innocent people slipping through the cracks. No system in which people were asked to monitor and police other people, in the history of mankind, has not persecuted, prosecuted, or punished an innocent person. This is just one of those imperfects of humanity you just have to deal with. I mean it's like what TB said there, a community devoid of toxic assholes is a better community overall. It is going to be people who openly and overtly harass and abuse other people.

It isn't like the community isn't doing this itself.

There are people I know of, who have been banned from joining outfits, because those outfits don't want that kind of person in their group. This is the same thing, scaled up.

[snafus]

If people are banned for behaving badly in a SOE game I'm all for allowing SOE to punish them accordingly. But when a company puts themselves in open dialogue on social media they need to accept the fact that mean words will be said. As long as someone isn't threatening life or limb I would hope SOE employees would have the testicular fortitude to ignore negative individuals. As I mentioned on Reddit this all reminds me of when schools suspend kids for fighting outside of school. Shit just doesn't make since to me.

[PredatorFour]

If people are banned for behaving badly in a SOE game I'm all for allowing SOE to punish them accordingly. But when a company puts themselves in open dialogue on social media they need to accept the fact that mean words will be said. As long as someone isn't threatening life or limb I would hope SOE employees would have the testicular fortitude to ignore negative individuals. As I mentioned on Reddit this all reminds me of when schools suspend kids for fighting outside of school. Shit just doesn't make since to me.

When you put it like that, i agree. Social networking is just bound to draw attention, good or bad.

[Skittles]

I call bullshit. Before too long you're going to have a 'No Negativity' problem here and issues stemming from that.

Ya-ya-ya, I get what someone said on the 1st page, but Im quick posting and too lazy to flip back for it, but essentially you have SOE just trying to intercept any possible legal actions that 'party A was offended by party B on an SOE site' lawsuit.

This whole society has become completely emo about everything. Don't bully, don't talk shit, don't call out someone on being retarded, don't name call, don't do X,y, z because low-n-behold someone is going to get a hurt feeling and then next thing you know they're eating a bullet because they're so pathetically weak minded they cant handle their own emotions. Its unbelievable really. Kids today cant even hug in school, don't fight on or off campus, don't tell someone theyre dumb or next thing you know we're going to suspend you.

If there weren't so many panzy ass hippy pacifist parents so afraid to put a hand on their kid, to give them a little tough love, to tell them "Timmy hit you? Well. Go hit that little fucker back" instead of "well, I'll go talk to his dad (if he's around) and sue him" we'd probably have a lot better off kids. Its the whole thing of watching their kids act like complete asses in the grocery store to get something instead of one good backhand to get them to realize, "you know what? you don't always get what you want" kind of thing.

I will concede however, that some policing is totally necessary for racism, harassment, and all the other usual suspects, but what is suggested by the topic is just a 1st step towards basically a muted community where eventually the only reason to even have a chat function in a game will be to spam gold farming, PUGs, and guild spamming sanctuary/warp gates.

[EvilNinjadude]

I will concede however, that some policing is totally necessary for racism, harassment, and all the other usual suspects, but what is suggested by the topic is just a 1st step towards basically a muted community where eventually the only reason to even have a chat function in a game will be to spam gold farming, PUGs, and guild spamming sanctuary/warp gates.
Have you read what's been written on the reddit post? If not, do it. Some of what those people write really puts a bitter taste into my mouth. Some people have no respect for either other players or the developers.

As was said earlier, I think this is less about stopping the interactions between players at lower levels from getting out of hand, but rather going after the big piles of BS out there, the BCPs inside and outside the game that are interacting with it.

I think this is a good thing, as long as
a) This is as far as it goes
b) This is properly and conscientiously enforced.

[Babyfark McGeez]

I don't get the fuzz.

First of all, if you are an insufferable jackass on social medias AND use the same email for your game account (or how else are they going about this?), why would i care if they ban you? Chances are you will be even more intolerable with an "anonymous" game character.

Second, it's their game, and as far as i know they can do whatever the fuck they want. It's not public space. Freedom of speech does not apply here. Read the EULA.

It may seem a littlebit excessive to spend resources for investigating players outside of their SOE realms, especially when you consider the layoffs they just had, but that's all.

[Mastachief]

They never banned buzzcutnobhead so i ponder just how far you can go.

[ChipMHazard]

They never banned buzzcutnobhead so i ponder just how far you can go.

Aye it's clear that although it was their "official" stance back then they never enforced it to the degree that they claimed they would. This makes you wonder if it's a change in attitude or just PR.

[Captain1nsaneo]

If people are banned for behaving badly in a SOE game I'm all for allowing SOE to punish them accordingly. But when a company puts themselves in open dialogue on social media they need to accept the fact that mean words will be said. As long as someone isn't threatening life or limb I would hope SOE employees would have the testicular fortitude to ignore negative individuals. As I mentioned on Reddit this all reminds me of when schools suspend kids for fighting outside of school. Shit just doesn't make since to me.

Devs are humans too and should be able to manage their own accounts freely and block people. I fully agree that this reminds of schools suspending kids for things that happened off campus. If it's not in your territory you shouldn't penalize for it as it's not your business. Besides, if that person screwed up outside your game they're likely to screw up in it as well. You just need to wait and watch and then when they do screw up you can show whoever they messed with that you are acting to remove such things and it gives the victim a concrete example of action making it personal. Such an experience would make the victim more loyal to the company as they now see the company as actively looking out for them.

It's like they don't even want to play mind games.

[bpostal]

Sometimes. And sometimes they produced toxic communities full of entitled, offensive children. There was online gaming long before there was residentially available Internet and it wasn't always pretty.

SOE has every right to build and encourage whatever type of community they wish. Gamers of all identities have the right to play in a community where they feel included and unobjectified. People who want to be offensive and use the "suck it up, thinskin" defense have the right to speak however they wish. But that confluence of competing rights takes us to precisely where we are - enforced community standards.

One of the key points about gaming prior to the widespread acceptance of internet; If one of your buddies is being annoying as hell during a LAN party, you can always slap the shit outta him or wait for him to pass out and them duct tape him to the ceiling.

Unfortunately we can't do that over the internet. So we have trolls.

[Mastachief]

The original ps1 forums 2003-2005 self moderated the trolls kept the clueless scrubs at bay. You had to have a thick skin and give a good as you took but it worked and the forum community thrived it was far less negative and actually fun to use those forums. This namby pandy approach just lets the weak clueless retarded idiots thrive, which in turn will effect the game as they get stupid stuff implemented.

Stick with PSU at least if a poster is an idiot you can tear him down without getting a 3 day ban, people these days need to man the fuck up.

[EvilNinjadude]

The original ps1 forums 2003-2005 self moderated the trolls kept the clueless scrubs at bay. You had to have a thick skin and give a good as you took but it worked and the forum community thrived it was far less negative and actually fun to use those forums. This namby pandy approach just lets the weak clueless retarded idiots thrive, which in turn will effect the game as they get stupid stuff implemented.

Stick with PSU at least if a poster is an idiot you can tear him down without getting a 3 day ban, people these days need to man the fuck up.
I have once experienced a forum the likes of which you have just described. It was my first ever forum.

I got banned, trolled, shouted at, insulted, and made fun of. I hated it at the time.

And it's an experience I would recommend to anyone to go through at least once in their life.

Being human is crazy, I know. You can get used to all sorts of stuff. I got used to playing at 20 FPS. I got used to riding a crappy bike. And before that, i was used to being a silly person. But no longer.

Doesn't mean every forum should turn into an abominable cesspit like 4chan though. The people there like it, but get this, not everyone does. And the majority should enjoy their time here, in my opinion. And it's not their fault.

[Obstruction]

the "you should have a thick skin" movement has a name. it's called hazing.

it's also called "vertical violence" and refers to a host of abusive behaviors from simple verbal bullying all the way to actual spousal violence.

the general idea is that whatever negativity has been visited upon a person, in the process of them gaining social/group status or coming of age, they then justify as being part of a natural process and then justify their own transmission of the negative behavior to the next generation of hazers, bullies, or abusers.

in other words, "you have to have a thick skin, i went through it, it's just part of growing up and now it's my turn to be the one to make the new guy feel as terrible as i did."

the truth is, this is not healthy, especially in a "consequence free" environment online. it makes people feel bad and it makes them treat others badly. when combined with the dis-inhibiting effect of the anonymity of the internet (google "online disinhibition effect") bullying and hazing can be magnified to shocking levels - in many already documented cases leading to victims' suicide.

it may not seem like a lot to be bullied in a game, on a forum, or social media outlet. your own experience may have been "toughening up." but that is no justification for what was done to you, and no justification to visit it upon anyone else, any more than hazing, bullying, or domestic verbal abuse or violence can be justified.

removing toxic personalities from our online communities through careful moderation may not be the best answer, but we certainly can't rely on victims of toxic behavior to end the cycle themselves. the representative in question made plenty of qualifying remarks about this policy that should speak for themselves. i support it, and look forward to that toxic .05% being kept out of EQ3 the best we are able, before they can transmit that behavior vertically and cause the toxicity to become the norm as it has, so famously, in LoL, among other communities.

[Mastachief]

Of course every forum should have moderation but it is my opinion that this should be there for the extremes rather than SOE's current kid protection policies they use to jump on anything and everything that someone feels they can report a user for.

This i think is why the planetside 2 forums are purely full of nerf this, buff that overppop rggh, there is nothing else on there, no community because you cannot speak openly because the moment someone dislikes your opinion you get reported for trolling and puff post gone suspension inbound.

[maradine]

I realize this may be somewhat of a forgotten skill, but it turns out you can argue with someone quite respectfully. I haven't seen a good example of a post getting nuked that didn't make it personal, obscene, or both.

[Skittles]

the "you should have a thick skin" movement has a name. it's called hazing.

it's also called "vertical violence" and refers to a host of abusive behaviors from simple verbal bullying all the way to actual spousal violence.

the general idea is that whatever negativity has been visited upon a person, in the process of them gaining social/group status or coming of age, they then justify as being part of a natural process and then justify their own transmission of the negative behavior to the next generation of hazers, bullies, or abusers.

in other words, "you have to have a thick skin, i went through it, it's just part of growing up and now it's my turn to be the one to make the new guy feel as terrible as i did."

the truth is, this is not healthy, especially in a "consequence free" environment online. it makes people feel bad and it makes them treat others badly. when combined with the dis-inhibiting effect of the anonymity of the internet (google "online disinhibition effect") bullying and hazing can be magnified to shocking levels - in many already documented cases leading to victims' suicide.

it may not seem like a lot to be bullied in a game, on a forum, or social media outlet. your own experience may have been "toughening up." but that is no justification for what was done to you, and no justification to visit it upon anyone else, any more than hazing, bullying, or domestic verbal abuse or violence can be justified.

removing toxic personalities from our online communities through careful moderation may not be the best answer, but we certainly can't rely on victims of toxic behavior to end the cycle themselves. the representative in question made plenty of qualifying remarks about this policy that should speak for themselves. i support it, and look forward to that toxic .05% being kept out of EQ3 the best we are able, before they can transmit that behavior vertically and cause the toxicity to become the norm as it has, so famously, in LoL, among other communities.

Who says its not healthy? You? How did you become judge/jury on this topic? Because, I say it IS healthy to have a hazing/tough skin community. In fact, I whole heartedly encourage it. And furthermore, I think it works much better for most competitive games in general. Does it work in games that are strong in role play and fantasy? EQ-UO-SWTOR. No. Games like BF-PS-Cod, EVE? Yes.

I think its comical you think people playing EQ-Next are the people you're playing w/in PS2. Its a completely different community. Its like saying you went to a MMA fight and were amazed at how over the top the crowd was compared to the John Mayer concert and how at some point the two crowds are going to "mingle" together.

The problem with the whole thing is the fact Person A makes some comment on Reddit-Twitter-Facebook that has ZERO connection to SOE. Person B, reports, links, copy/pastes it someplace or directly to SOE and BAM, Person A is now banned. That applies to HERE as well from the way I read it. The other issue is that its completely arbitrary as to what is and is not out of bounds. What is out of bounds? Who is making the call on out of bounds? Some right wing ultra conservative, religious fanatic, women in the kitchen, no sex before marriage type? Or is it some left wing, tree hugging, socks with sandals, I'll never hit my child type? Yeah, you just don't know. What may be out of bounds on Tuesday may be fair game on Thursday before happy hour.

Not a big deal to me either way. SOE hasn't had a decent game release since PoTBS, but this whole "we're going to ban offensive players" is a freaking joke when its such a grey area they haven't clarified on. They didn't do jack-shit about BCP and his racist rant filled tirade he went on. If he were to go on it now on his OWN vent/TS server and someone recorded it, posted it now, would he be banned for it? Its his server. His right to talk-spew shit out his mouth non-stop, but now they can ban him because they say they're going to ban people make it all good?

Or lets say its FC and they go on their gay pride, man love thing and someone is offended do they get banned? How about a discussion about underage sex? Amputee sex? Capitol punishment? It all becomes a grey road......

[Babyfark McGeez]

Who says its not healthy? You? How did you become judge/jury on this topic? Because, I say it IS healthy to have a hazing/tough skin community. In fact, I whole heartedly encourage it.

...

You are a fucking idiot who likes getting his balls licked by deranged stray dogs.
There. Your daily dose of healthy. No need to thank me.

Social skills and the ability to communicate normally with other human beings is something you need in your everyday life, and personally i think that should be encouraged rather than the opposite. What kind of signal would it be to say "We know our playerbase is full of raging 13 year olds so we encourage prepubescent behaviour on our boards. Dickjokes full ahead!". I'm sure a statement like that would fly very well with the public.

[PredatorFour]

If you argue with someone you don't fall out with them. If you fall out with someone over an argument where you are right or wrong then you might as well just take your ball home as well as throwing the rattle out the pram.

All i can say on this matter though is that i'm glad i have never used the official forums once. Why ? What is the point ? This forum is the planetside forum.


If someone is continually wrong they'll get the message at some point by people telling them over and over. If people are getting banned for calling out this idiot who keeps posting then what good is that going to do ? All it will do is let the idiot's roam free without anyone putting them in place. You add this to the Troll Revolution and you got a real bad problem where trolls aren't getting banned and decent players are.