A2Am are now an I-win button

[phungus]

So I'm a dirty A2Am user, always have been because they have been, through most of the game, incredibly overpowered. I use overpowered weapons.

Now though they are beyond overpowered, they are pure I-win buttons.

I don't think this is good for gameplay - in fact from playing this morning all I can conclude is that it completely ruins gameplay. There is no counter to A2Am, they kill a target in less time then it takes to fire flares, determine threat is A2Am and turn around or get to cover. They are litterally autohit weapons that don't need to be even aimed, with no viable recourse. They used to be OP, but this is beyond anything I've ever experienced in a video game.

Basically A2Am now function like an autohit sniper rifle, that does 33% damage to any infantry in a sniper's scope. That's crazy and such a weapon should not exist.

[Illtempered]

I only use them for the lols and seem to get hatetells for every kill with them. What if we gave aircraft more flares to use before cooldown. I don't even use them any more because I find fire-suppression saves my ass more in combo with fuel-tanks.

Edit to say: I know you're a very good pilot, but it's rare, at least on mattherson and waterson, for good pilots to use A2A on a regular basis. So they don't seem to be too much of an issue for us. If I get lock and am without friends and allies, all I can do is hope I'm a better enough pilot to overcome. If not, I consider it my own fault.

[phungus]

I only use them for the lols and seem to get hatetells for every kill with them. What if we gave aircraft more flares to use before cooldown. I don't even use them any more because I find fire-suppression saves my ass more in combo with fuel-tanks.

Edit to say: I know you're a very good pilot, but it's rare, at least on mattherson and waterson, for good pilots to use A2A on a regular basis. So they don't seem to be too much of an issue for us. If I get lock and am without friends and allies, all I can do is hope I'm a better enough pilot to overcome. If not, I consider it my own fault.

I'm actually not very good anymore. It takes more then an hour or so of play a week to keep your game up, and I'm clearly not up to snuff. The last time I logged in though it seemed everyone was using A2Am - which is fine I don't mind tasting my own medicine, lord knows I deserve it. But I switched from AB tanks to A2Am and found out they were buffed to the point of ridiculousness. They've always been defacto auto hit, but now they have like no lock on time so even with AB tanks you can't even turn and face your attacker before 3 A2Am's shoot you down. There is litterally no recourse, they just function like pure I-win buttons.

Serious question can anyone else think of a PvP weapon in any game that was this I-win? I can't think of any, even the BFG in Doom II was easier to deal with... Seriously does anyone have any real examples of weapons like this that were in a PvP game? It really seems like this is the most obscene and overpowered weapon I have ever seen in PvP in any video game I have ever played.

[HereticusXZ]

Except that there far from OP? Between Flares that can be instant popped w/ a 15-30 second CD, Line-Of-Sight breaks, and this little trick...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gis_oKWuwus

A2A Missiles aren't to effective beyond a introduction attack and a execution when the targets running away. The nose gun murders you faster, you can just circle drift and avoid the lock-on completely.

Gals and Liberators laugh at A2A considering how long it takes you to kill them with a lonely A2A missile attack.

I think your just getting extremely lucky and shooting down bad and brand new pilots who have no idea what to do... It is a F2P game where any common joe with no experience can pull a vehicle with relatively no penalty if lost, So there's a lot of bad pilots...

Playing devils advocate though it would be nice to see the Striker Lock-On mechanic applied to ESF A2A missiles. If you fire the missile and look away then the missile loses it's lock and goes crazy completely missing the target, You have to fire the missile and keep the target locked on the whole time in your target reticle until the missile hits the target instead of fire-and-forget, Something like radar guided missiles.

[phungus]

Except that there far from OP? Between Flares that can be instant popped w/ a 15-30 second CD, Line-Of-Sight breaks, and this little trick...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gis_oKWuwus

A2A Missiles aren't to effective beyond a introduction attack and a execution when the targets running away. The nose gun murders you faster, you can just circle drift and avoid the lock-on completely.

Gals and Liberators laugh at A2A considering how long it takes you to kill them with a lonely A2A missile attack.

I think your just getting extremely lucky and shooting down bad and brand new pilots who have no idea what to do... It is a F2P game where any common joe with no experience can pull a vehicle with relatively no penalty if lost, So there's a lot of bad pilots...

Playing devils advocate though it would be nice to see the Striker Lock-On mechanic applied to ESF A2A missiles. If you fire the missile and look away then the missile loses it's lock and goes crazy completely missing the target, You have to fire the missile and keep the target locked on the whole time in your target reticle until the missile hits the target instead of fire-and-forget, Something like radar guided missiles.

You clearly have not flown an ESF since the December 21st patch.

Why are you commenting on an aspect of gameplay you know nothing about?

[snafus]

The amount of A2AM ESF packs have increased over the past few weeks again. Gets frustrating when you take on three of them and none even bother to engage with the nose gun. But as we have seen over the past year SOE will always keep forms of skill less weapons approachable and to powerful.

[BlaxicanX]

I imagine dying is appropriate in most 3-1 odds.

[phungus]

I imagine dying is appropriate in most 3-1 odds.

You know, I can and have taken on small squads of 5 players before. Recently, just a couple days ago I offensively took a base as infantry against 3 players who were defending - just me and my heavy assault.

If you are good enough 1 v 3 is not an instant death sentence in infantry fights. Skill has an impact, and you can actually acomplish something. In the current air game A2Am completely remove any impact of skill, they are pure I-win weapons.

[BlaxicanX]

The problem being that failing to kill 3 guys because they have missiles doesn't necessarily mean that the missiles are broken.

SOE didn't put A2A missiles into the game to increase the skill-ceiling for flyers; they did it for the opposite reason actually, to lower the skill-ceiling and make it possible for newer players to not get hopelessly blown out of the sky by veterans. If Snafu, whose one of the best pilots in the game, tried to hammer three newbs simultaneously and got killed for his trouble, it sounds like the missiles might be working as intended.

What I'm basically asking for is something beyond personal anecdotes for evidence of why A2A missiles are broken.

[Baneblade]

I'll have to give them a try again, but the last time someone was bitching about them, they were terrible to use effectively.

[Lonehunter]

I don't think they've actually changed anything about them in a while have they? Reworking the whole lock on system was talked about during the ESF update, but all that was put in the back seat for the OMFG update

[Tatwi]

If they genuinely do not have an effective counter and they genuinely do not require any skill to use, then yes that sounds out of balance.

I set up my mossy for ground attack strafing at high speed (which often ends me in slamming into something :) ) and I haven't had much of a problem out running lockons. I tend to get nailed hard by ground based AA to justify bailing, so I use the ejection seat rather than flares. Jump out and hope for the best. lol...

Once again I have to say that "the hover game" is the joke at the heart of many issues with the flight system. If weapons would not fire if the aircraft was flying forward slower than 60KPH or so, then none of these issues would exist, because would be forced to FLY to use their flying weapons platform. I guess I am just a crazy old man though, so what do I know.

[Baneblade]

The OP is full of shit. A2AM are just as crap as they have been since the 'fix'.

[phungus]

The OP is full of shit. A2AM are just as crap as they have been since the 'fix'.

Thanks for the well thought out post.

A2Am have always been overpowered, but now they are worse. They did buff speed, made them impossible to dodge, and reduced lock on time in the Dec 21st patch. These are quantifiable facts: Either you're a liar or a moron who spouts incorrect bs out your ass, either way you're way you're the idiot who is full of shit.

[Baneblade]

It is easier and quicker to just use the nose gun.

[camycamera]

....no they're not...

[Falcon_br]

I tried 3 times to use a2am since Dec 21.
I could not kill anything with it.
People still avoid it and the nose gun is still better for BR 100 players.

[snafus]

The problem being that failing to kill 3 guys because they have missiles doesn't necessarily mean that the missiles are broken.

SOE didn't put A2A missiles into the game to increase the skill-ceiling for flyers; they did it for the opposite reason actually, to lower the skill-ceiling and make it possible for newer players to not get hopelessly blown out of the sky by veterans. If Snafu, whose one of the best pilots in the game, tried to hammer three newbs simultaneously and got killed for his trouble, it sounds like the missiles might be working as intended.

What I'm basically asking for is something beyond personal anecdotes for evidence of why A2A missiles are broken.

Oh I agree I was most likely going to lose that fight due to the off chance even one of them was a mediocre pilot and that is perfectly fine with me. I was simply commenting on the sad fact none of them even attempted to nose gun me in between missile salvos. Currently though A2AM are simply broken in how they operate along with the ridiculous missile tracking that is allowed. I am ok with them being in the game but they are currently far to effective with no real skill required to reach that effectiveness other then facing in the general direction of your enemy.

http://youtu.be/CxbJKPnP3uQ
This was Bequ's video which I sniped from the official forums which I feel show how good A2AM have become as of late.

[KesTro]

Yeah they probably are a little too good as of now but if they ever got nerfed into the ground I think it would hurt the air-game more than it would help. Take of it what you will but a lot of pilots rely on a2am to have any edge what so ever in the air. All of a sudden that gets taken away and a large portion of pilots quit and the flyboys are stuck with very few targets giving them even less dogfights that they claim they want(Not they wouldn't just start farming ground).

[phungus]

The same people who thought AA MAXes should be able to snipe aircraft at 1000m ranges think A2Am in their current state are fine. Wow, go figure. People who hate the idea of the airgame like the fact it's being ruined by an I-win button that basically functions like an unaimed autohit sniper rifle. If you never fly an ESF in this game maybe you get a kick out of knowing such a broken weapon is in the game and ruining the game for people who do.

It is easier and quicker to just use the nose gun.
You don't give up or stop using your nose gun when you take A2Am. A2Am are used to supplement the nose gun, or rather they were, now the nose gun can be used to supplement the A2Am.

Watch the video snafu linked. Near instantaneous locks, missile flys and hits target faster then rotary rounds, flys around terrain and usually ignores flares, and to top it off it doesn't even need to be aimed - the target just needs to be near the center of the screen to acquire a lock... Something like this has no place in any PvP game setting. It is broken, simply absurdly broken.

I ask again does anyone have an example of a weapon this overpowered in any PvP game they have ever played? I really can't think of any, I'm trying to think of something to compare it to, but I haven't been able to. I've never seen anything this absurd before.

[KesTro]

I feel like this video relates to this thread quite a bit and it has been linked to a conversation somewhat similar to this.

2:00 - 3:00 in particular CoD being PS2 in this case.

http://youtu.be/EitZRLt2G3w

*edit* That being said I still do think they can do with a bit of a nerf. But as long as we can be flipping all over the place and ignoring the laws of physics, I don't ever expect to see A2AM complaint threads go away.

Ironic really. :F

[Tatwi]

That video is a perfect example of how broken the flight model is. Dude uses "the reverse maneuver" to fly backwards (making it easy to keep attackers in his sights) at 190+ KPH. "Ace pilots" in PS2 are those who excel at using a flying machine as a turret.

SOE should add actual jets, that fly at 400 - 800 KPH (stall at 395 KPH, afterburners to 1000 KPH), extend the maps out over the water by 4Km, and raise the ceiling by 6Km (only for the jets). Give the jets A2G bombs (that drop like bombs, but blow up after 400m of flight to avoid super long range dropping) and A2A machine guns, then people could use them for "Orbital Strike" style coordinated bombing and proper dog fighting. Launch them from and land them on aircraft carriers. Give them immunity to lock-ons by using afterburner for 3+ seconds.

"Go Play ______". Riiiight... because _____ is totally the same thing as Planetside 2....

Then the derp flight model could be kept while adding something that isn't lame as hell, for people who actually want to fly.

[snafus]

That video is a perfect example of how broken the flight model is. Dude uses "the reverse maneuver" to fly backwards (making it easy to keep attackers in his sights) at 190+ KPH. "Ace pilots" in PS2 are those who excel at using a flying machine as a turret.

SOE should add actual jets, that fly at 400 - 800 KPH (stall at 395 KPH, afterburners to 1000 KPH), extend the maps out over the water by 4Km, and raise the ceiling by 6Km (only for the jets). Give the jets A2G bombs (that drop like bombs, but blow up after 400m of flight to avoid super long range dropping) and A2A machine guns, then people could use them for "Orbital Strike" style coordinated bombing and proper dog fighting. Launch them from and land them on aircraft carriers. Give them immunity to lock-ons by using afterburner for 3+ seconds.

"Go Play ______". Riiiight... because _____ is totally the same thing as Planetside 2....

Then the derp flight model could be kept while adding something that isn't lame as hell, for people who actually want to fly.

Love how he makes a A2AM thread and another linear flight model fan wants to change the subject.

[Tatwi]

Love how he makes a A2AM thread and another linear flight model fan wants to change the subject. Nah, you guys keep talking about A2M. I'll bitch about the flight model in a thread about Oprah, so just ignore me. :)

[snafus]

Nah, you guys keep talking about A2M. I'll bitch about the flight model in a thread about Oprah, so just ignore me. :)

fair enough.

[Plaqueis]

Umm.. so i gave them another go (i've barely used them after the purchase ages ago since they were such a disappointment) after reading this thread. I have them with full upgrades (choice of full reload, lock on or range) on my VS character. But since i've been trying to rank up my TR character lately, i decided to try them without all the certs used. Result; they do more damage (takes 2 of them to kill an ESF instead of earlier 3), but getting those 2 to actually lock on is just as much of a challenge as it was before for a poor point'n'clicker as myself (i call them point'n'clickers cause as a flight simulator veteran , i don't consider the so called flying in this game 'piloting'.. it's just a point and click game, who ever is better with his keyboard and mouse, wins. You don't need to know jack shit about actual flying.

However, i can imagine the point of view for the best point'n'clickers in game; they may actually die when going alone against 5 relative newbs out there, since now those newbs don't need to be just as good as this best point'n'clicker is.

That must really suck, no more easypeasy points for ya huh?

EDIT: I have an idea; how about instead of whining about stuff like this, demand the developers to bring the weapons in game to same fantasy level as the most of the equipment is? I mean, we have a hovering tank, hovering aircraft, plasma weapons of all sorts, infantry with fucking rocketpacks, but everything else is 1980's tech or earlier? WTF?

Jeez, fish can hold their breath longer than 'people' can in the game, a bi/tri/pod for a machinegun was invented the same time the weapon was, so like 18hundreds.. damn, our characters don't even know how to lie down...)

[JackD]

Oh I agree I was most likely going to lose that fight due to the off chance even one of them was a mediocre pilot and that is perfectly fine with me. I was simply commenting on the sad fact none of them even attempted to nose gun me in between missile salvos. Currently though A2AM are simply broken in how they operate along with the ridiculous missile tracking that is allowed. I am ok with them being in the game but they are currently far to effective with no real skill required to reach that effectiveness other then facing in the general direction of your enemy.

http://youtu.be/CxbJKPnP3uQ
This was Bequ's video which I sniped from the official forums which I feel show how good A2AM have become as of late.

This video basically shows nothing that the A2Am could do before.And all that aces have no right to complain. The only reason why everybody uses them now is because we get shot down by aces with A2Am missiles all the time.

[Baneblade]

The same people who thought AA MAXes should be able to snipe aircraft at 1000m ranges think A2Am in their current state are fine. Wow, go figure. People who hate the idea of the airgame like the fact it's being ruined by an I-win button that basically functions like an unaimed autohit sniper rifle. If you never fly an ESF in this game maybe you get a kick out of knowing such a broken weapon is in the game and ruining the game for people who do.

You have utterly failed to substantiate your claims, and what do AA MAXes have to do with it?

My conclusion is that if you are being shot down by A2AM, you aren't as good a pilot as you think you are.

[snafus]

This video basically shows nothing that the A2Am could do before.And all that aces have no right to complain. The only reason why everybody uses them now is because we get shot down by aces with A2Am missiles all the time.

I'm curious on which server you play on. And that video shows how the recent update has allowed missile tracking to even be further buffed with the ability to pull 180 turns at point blank range which used to allow it to miss. Not to mention it does a wonderful job of showing just how amazingly powerful that weapon has become with little effort put in. As far as Aces using them I cant speak for other servers but Connery that would be incredibly rare to see an Ace with those on, hell I don't even own them out of spite myself.

[MaxDamage]

The range on them is so low... you might as well use nose gun.

[BlaxicanX]

After watching the video SNAFU posted, I do have to agree that the turns those things were making are ludicrous. No missile should be capable of doing a 90+ degree turn at near point-blank range like that.

A2A missiles should be most useful at mid-range, with flares making them less useful at long-range and sharp turns throwing them off at close-range. Their damage at least seems balanced, so a nerf to their turning-radius would be adequate, I think.

[JackD]

I'm curious on which server you play on. And that video shows how the recent update has allowed missile tracking to even be further buffed with the ability to pull 180 turns at point blank range which used to allow it to miss. Not to mention it does a wonderful job of showing just how amazingly powerful that weapon has become with little effort put in. As far as Aces using them I cant speak for other servers but Connery that would be incredibly rare to see an Ace with those on, hell I don't even own them out of spite myself.

Iam playing on Cobalt. The Bling Squad already changed to A2Am which is an Outfit consisting of a handful aces + other good pilots. Also some other random aces and pilots of top outfits changed to A2Am I used to run with fuel pods and fire supr. this is sucide now.

Yeah the 180 turns are ridiculous but the tracking was not less ridiculous before.

[snafus]

Iam playing on Cobalt. The Bling Squad already changed to A2Am which is an Outfit consisting of a handful aces + other good pilots. Also some other random aces and pilots of top outfits changed to A2Am I used to run with fuel pods and fire supr. this is sucide now.

Yeah the 180 turns are ridiculous but the tracking was not less ridiculous before.

To be honest after speaking to some of the top pilots left on Connery these days it may just be a good idea to start abusing them. Like everything else in PS2 unless we start to farm kills with them it will be considered balanced and It may be well time I sully my account and max them out.

As far as them being even more ridiculous they used to be able to be dodged repeatedly at close quarters but that is now very unlikely with the new changes. Not to mention they removed the ability to do the dodge maneuver when you face them, yes I know it was a bug technically. Guess what is left of the top flyers in PS2 need to go full on troll mode and show just how broken these weapons are.

[BeyondNinja]

[QUOTE=HereticusXZ;952696] Except that there far from OP? Between Flares that can be instant popped w/ a 15-30 second CD, Line-Of-Sight breaks, and this little trick...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gis_oKWuwus

Except that flares have a 25-40 second CD, the missiles lock so fast that breaking LOS is unviable to do consistently unless you fly within 10m of cover at all times, and 'that trick' has been confirmed to not work anymore since PU2...

[BeyondNinja]

The whole problem of A2A missiles atm is that they have literally 0 skill cap.
As it stands there is hardly any reason why an ace would actually perform significantly better with them than an average pilot...

[Lonehunter]

Really not a huge deal once you learn how to avoid them. With the ESF update adding radar tracking for missiles it will be even easier. Almost guaranteed for the skillful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gis_oKWuwus

[snafus]

Really not a huge deal once you learn how to avoid them. With the ESF update adding radar tracking for missiles it will be even easier. Almost guaranteed for the skillful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gis_oKWuwus

They nerfed the ability to dodge A2AM since that video came out. Currently A2AM are nearly a 100% chance to hit if no flares are deployed.

[War Barney]

I don't know about A2A but DON'T make flares more effective, its already almost pointless to use G2A rocket launchers as they need to me more or less hovering right over your head before they are in range then they have flares almost non stop.

Buying the anti-air rocket launcher was the biggest mistake I've made in terms of purchases, sure I've not used the cyclone since I bought the blitz but it was good for the time I had it, the hawk is just a useless thing I'll never use again, maybe if it didn't take 5+ shots to kill people it would be ok... but 5+ shots at very close range with flares to counter.. what idiot would go for that

[Boildown]

I don't know about A2A but DON'T make flares more effective, its already almost pointless to use G2A rocket launchers as they need to me more or less hovering right over your head before they are in range then they have flares almost non stop.

Buying the anti-air rocket launcher was the biggest mistake I've made in terms of purchases, sure I've not used the cyclone since I bought the blitz but it was good for the time I had it, the hawk is just a useless thing I'll never use again, maybe if it didn't take 5+ shots to kill people it would be ok... but 5+ shots at very close range with flares to counter.. what idiot would go for that

You expect too much. You need to position yourself well to get hits with the Hawk. You can hold a lock and see if they flare before you fire it off. If they don't, and then they flare after you shoot the Hawk (or Annihilator), then you wait 5 seconds and see if they're still around, and if they are, the second one will hit.

If you're expecting kills, you need to realize that it takes 3 to kill an ESF. Either team up with other people or lower your expectations. You can still have a positive effect on your airspace with lockons, even without getting kills. And you can help keep friendly ESFs in the skies by helping shoot down the enemy mossies and scythes, even if you don't get the killshot.

To say the Hawk is worthless is just ignorant however.

Example of how to use the Hawk/Annihilator: http://www.twitch.tv/boildown/c/3518579 .

[JackD]

I start to get really excited about the upcoming ESF patch. A2Am changes look great and i might even be able to run without the flares again. The new weapons also look balanced now. Looks like its going to be fine.

[War Barney]

You expect too much. You need to position yourself well to get hits with the Hawk. You can hold a lock and see if they flare before you fire it off. If they don't, and then they flare after you shoot the Hawk (or Annihilator), then you wait 5 seconds and see if they're still around, and if they are, the second one will hit.

If you're expecting kills, you need to realize that it takes 3 to kill an ESF. Either team up with other people or lower your expectations. You can still have a positive effect on your airspace with lockons, even without getting kills. And you can help keep friendly ESFs in the skies by helping shoot down the enemy mossies and scythes, even if you don't get the killshot.

To say the Hawk is worthless is just ignorant however.

Example of how to use the Hawk/Annihilator: http://www.twitch.tv/boildown/c/3518579 .

well it is, you might get a lucky hit but generally your just wasting time trying to use a hawk on flying enemies as they can so easily fly out of range. Sure idiot pilots might stay around when they've used flares but most competent ones will fly off for a few seconds till they have flares again then come in to fight so at the very best you're just slightly slowing down the attack and in exchange aren't helping anywhere else

[Obstruction]

well it is, you might get a lucky hit but generally your just wasting time trying to use a hawk on flying enemies as they can so easily fly out of range. Sure idiot pilots might stay around when they've used flares but most competent ones will fly off for a few seconds till they have flares again then come in to fight so at the very best you're just slightly slowing down the attack and in exchange aren't helping anywhere else

the word that you are groping for is "deterrent." it's been stated many times through not only player discussion but also developer notes, and widely agreed upon by all but the most ignorant groundlings that deterrence is the intended function of single unit AA weapons.

these weapons are intended to deny airspace only when enough units "aren't helping anywhere else." which is what we call asymmetrical balance. 4-5 player units dedicated to AA can achieve deadly force, rapid TTK, and with proper support can deny airspace until such time as an armor column or opposing infantry squad can be brought in combination with CAS to clear it out. i've purposed and commanded both squads and platoons myself to exactly this end, from both ground and CAS roles.

ground units are resource free, timer independent, low skill floor, and out-populate air units 10 to 1 in the smallest fights, 30 or more to 1 in large fights. many tools have been placed at ground's disposal, including fixed, armored turrets that don't run out of ammo and occupy key strategic positions at all major installations and most minor ones. these even got a buff recently. some ground based AA weapons can even be fired through spawn shields, and believe me they almost always are.

if you want to defeat air units with just your one player unit, learn to fly, get up here, and try to take me out yourself. even when you lose i will have a lot more respect for your effort than i do watching you make a fool of yourself in public like this, crying that the game just isn't fair.

now if we could, please, let's get this thread back to discussion of A2A missiles and away from this ignorant whining.

[War Barney]

the word that you are groping for is "deterrent." it's been stated many times through not only player discussion but also developer notes, and widely agreed upon by all but the most ignorant groundlings that deterrence is the intended function of single unit AA weapons.

these weapons are intended to deny airspace only when enough units "aren't helping anywhere else." which is what we call asymmetrical balance. 4-5 player units dedicated to AA can achieve deadly force, rapid TTK, and with proper support can deny airspace until such time as an armor column or opposing infantry squad can be brought in combination with CAS to clear it out. i've purposed and commanded both squads and platoons myself to exactly this end, from both ground and CAS roles.

ground units are resource free, timer independent, low skill floor, and out-populate air units 10 to 1 in the smallest fights, 30 or more to 1 in large fights. many tools have been placed at ground's disposal, including fixed, armored turrets that don't run out of ammo and occupy key strategic positions at all major installations and most minor ones. these even got a buff recently. some ground based AA weapons can even be fired through spawn shields, and believe me they almost always are.

if you want to defeat air units with just your one player unit, learn to fly, get up here, and try to take me out yourself. even when you lose i will have a lot more respect for your effort than i do watching you make a fool of yourself in public like this, crying that the game just isn't fair.

now if we could, please, let's get this thread back to discussion of A2A missiles and away from this ignorant whining.

I realise you want the game to be easy so try to just insult people instead of saying anything that makes sense or is helpful but the comparison in damage is still ridiculous as it takes about 5 hawk rockets to get 1 kill so you aren't even a good deterrent, most people will wait till they are 1 or 2 rockets from dead then land, heal up in a few seconds then come back.

I know you will keep trying to say *but you stop then doing stuff for a few seconds thats worth you not doing a single thing for ages!* but its really not when you don't get any kills or any real damage while the thing your shooting at will often be destroying many tanks and people (hell they will often start by killing you easily).

And I know its hard for you to understand simple concepts but I brought this up as people mentioned making flares refresh faster as a fix for A2A which would then adversely affect G2A launchers thus why I brought it up as a bad idea.

Now please stop spouting your complete drivel and let this discussion continue in peace

[Obstruction]

most people will wait till they are 1 or 2 rockets from dead then land, heal up in a few seconds then come back.

de·ter·rent
diˈtərənt/
noun
noun: deterrent; plural noun: deterrents

1.
a thing that discourages or is intended to discourage someone from doing something.


in this case the deterrent makes the pilot leave. that's what it means. you're complaining that it does what you're saying it does.

if you are insulted by being described as ignorant, there is probably a reason for that. it is not intended as an insult, it is just a simple, accurate description of the point of view being presented.

ig·no·rance
ˈignərəns/
noun
noun: ignorance

1.
lack of knowledge or information.

i hope this clears things up a bit. i've tried to caution you about the risk of appearing foolish, but i think at this point it's clear you are unconcerned. so, soldier on, brave, brave fool.

===

back on topic, the only time A2A bother me much at all are in groups. but there isn't a lot you can do if you're that badly outnumbered anyway. 3 v 1 or 4 v 1 is always going to come down to luck.

we can take out 2 lock on ESFs usually, unless one of them is also very talented in the hover meta and using the primary with skill as well.

if a very talented ESF is using lock ons correctly to take us down 1 v 1, they are using them to increase DPS because it's difficult to get us without using almost all available ammo.

a bad ESF with lock ons isn't really even a threat alone in a 1 v 1 with our lib. they don't get consecutive locks, or engage with the primary. they let our nanites function and don't do enough DPS to take us out. then they either get too close to the dalton, try to run and get tankbustered, or fail to move fast enough and i run them over.

so while they may be a real pain in the ass in groups, that's just sort of what i expect from planetside. G2A, MAX flak, Basilisks, all those things reach a critical mass that can deny air with deadly efficiency when used properly in groups. this is just another example of that, although in this case the only remedy is bringing an equally sized but more skilled ESF group to counter.

the real concern here, and one that i share, is that lowering the skill floor further may create an environment where low skill weapons are the majority, and the air meta becomes mainly low skill players swarming objectives with little room for player skill to have an impact.

it would be like having an auto aim for people who are not good at infantry. or some type of OHK missile that locks onto infantry. you could do that to make the FPS ground portion of the game more accessible, but it would clearly ruin the game. i feel the same about adding more and more low skill/no skill lock on weapons to the A2A and G2A meta.

[Baneblade]

I use the shit out of my Annihilator now that it does the same damage as the Hawk. My kill rate went up a ton.

[Whiteagle]

You have utterly failed to substantiate your claims, and what do AA MAXes have to do with it?

My conclusion is that if you are being shot down by A2AM, you aren't as good a pilot as you think you are.
This is the same guy who kept running into the debris from his own kills...
...He was NEVER as good a pilot as he thought he was!

Anywho, how are the NEW Air weapons?
The Coyote looks right up my alley!

[KesTro]

Anywho, how are the NEW Air weapons?
The Coyote looks right up my alley!

They're not so great. I think they said in FNO they're looking to buff them. I just hope they don't buff them too much otherwise they'll get quickly nerfed. Coyotes act more as a supplement for when you're reloading your nose gun.