Witht he new patch...

[zMessiahz]

Do you beta players think the Empires are now balanced?

Seems the Vanu got a little love, but is it enough? This is not a lobbying thread, I would just like some honest input. I've wanted to join Vanu cause their philosphy and looks kick ass, but the more I read on the beta boards and here, the less sure I am. I'ld probably still join them even if they are released as gimps, but I may not stay then.

There are some posts now about the Vanu being "balanced" which translated from an FPS players mouth (I know this well since I am a hardcore fps player myself) mean "They are OK weapons but not close to the best". Do you think by the end of the tweaks there will be a Vanu weapon that TR and NC folks bitch about the way they curently do about the mini-chain and phoenix?


Do you think its silly to consider the way whiners act to be relevant to balance? I do, simply because there are enough that bitch about anything that kills them. Lack of bitching from the whiney masses = nothing they fear.

If your answer is yes, then plese tell me why you think it so.

[Dharkbayne]

Yeah, the Vanu Sov. is alot better now, our weapons actually �O �AMAGE WHEN THEY HIT!!! W00TAGE! Can I get a moment of silence for the �evs who stood infront of the guns to test the �amage....

[WickedDeus]

Does this include the Beamer? I'm planning on playing an Infil but I understand the Beamer sucks. But why does it suck? Seems like it would be pretty nice since it can switch to AV dmg.

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Dharkbayne
Yeah, the Vanu Sov. is alot better now, our weapons actually �O �AMAGE WHEN THEY HIT!!! W00TAGE! Can I get a moment of silence for the �evs who stood infront of the guns to test the �amage....

They did OK damage before. Don't exaggerate. The Pulsar was somewhat underpowered, but only seemed awful compared to the Gauss and the Cycler at close range. The Lasher, too, was and has always been a decent weapon, just the FF issues kept it from being widely used. Personally, I feel the lack of VS players owes more to misconception and NC superiority rather than their weapons being terrible.

Oh, and as for the mini-chaingun and phoenix, I'd like to see both toned down, but the phoenix moreso. Being able to fire off an anti-vehicular weapon from behind the wall of a base and curve it around to hit a tank on the opposite side is pure garbage, no matter what excuses some NC players who care more about their own kill count than the overall playability will say. If anything, the phoenix missile should probably have the amount it can actually turn nerfed somewhat to require that the NC player expose themselves to risk in order to fire off their missiles.

The mini-chaingun on the other hand I've always wanted to see get a little bit of a barrle spin before it actually fires, although this is really more of a personal idea than anything. The way it is now, the mini-chaingun looks really lame when you run with it in your hands. If it were held against the chest and the barrle-spin added to facilitate the animation of dropping the weapon to firing level (and of course to give people a little more surivival time when faced with the weapon) it'd be a much cooler weapon overall, and more fun to fight against. And this comes from my time playing VS against the TR, by the way.

[Airlift]

the AV Gun switch is a dubious advantage. In fact, I'd say it's more just a distinction rather than an advantage because while it does allow you to carry more regular ammo, your clip sucks for anti-vehicle mode.

The main problem with a Beamer (from an infiltrator's perpective) is the beam. You are better off using the AMP, imo.

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Airlift
The main problem with a Beamer (from an infiltrator's perpective) is the beam. You are better off using the AMP, imo.

Anyone without a MAG-Scatter is better off using an AMP, unless of course you're fighting outdoors and can get a hold of a Repeater.

[Airlift]

I :love: the repeater, and that's the reason I don't use the mag-scatter very often. The AMP is a good gun that will serve to kill that first terran so I can take his gun. I also tend to collect all the various pistols in my locker, just for fun.

When I use the mag-scatter, it means I have to loot all the ammo, wheras with an AMP I just take the pistol.

[WickedDeus]

I was planning on carrying both AMP and Beamer(Beamer because they do AV dmg too). Are you saying that they do very little AV dmg that its not worth it? Anyone who plays a Vanu infil please tell me your setup.

[Airlift]

No, it does appropriate AV damage (I think, didn't do any definitive testing on the comparison of the modes), but the issue is that every AV shot takes two charges from your clip, severely limiting the shots per reload (and also taking a big bite out of your total ammo in inventory)

[Warborn]

With the new patch, pistol AP damage was reduced by 50%. Coupled with the new armor absorption for various vehicles, the pistol is essentially worthless for anything but attacking a MAX (MAXs don't have any absorption) I'd think, especially when your ammo supply is very limited as an infiltrator's is. So the fact that the Beamer can switch to AP mode very quickly is a pretty dubious benefit when you consider that it exposes your position.

I was planning on carrying both AMP and Beamer...

Ah, missed this. Word of advice: Don't. Inventory is extremely limited as an infiltrator, and I really consider it terribly inefficient to carry two pistols. Pick one, stick with it, know your limitations, and play with them in mind.

Unless of course you mean you plan on carrying two pistols as a non-infiltrator, in which case I'd think that mostly a waste of space also. Unless you're a pilot, you're going to have a bigger gun anyway. Pistols become mostly redundant when you're carrying a rifle. You will very likely have some other piece of equipment, or even a grenade, that would serve you better than a second pistol would.

[Ubernator]

I have heard people talk about revamping the Phoenix to make it like the rocket launcher from Half-Life. I find this to be a superb idea. The two other AV weapons require a line of sight... why not the Phoenix?

In fact almost ALL the weapons in PS require a line of sight. The thumper and TR max can bounce grenades around corners and tanks have arc-firing that can be used to shoot something on the other side of a wall, but that is NOTHING compared to the Phoenix's ability.

So, make it wire guided, but require the user to keep the reticle on the target for steering. No more launching from behind cover.

[WickedDeus]

Ok, so just go with the AMP. What about recoil? Is Beamer better then AMP in that?

[Warborn]

Originally posted by WickedDeus
Ok, so just go with the AMP. What about recoil? Is Beamer better then AMP in that?

Absolutely. The AMP sucks for range, but up close it's extremely dangerous. The Beamer is similar to the Repeater in that it's reasonably damaging and fairly accurate, but has a comparatively low rate of fire. Which pistol you use is dependent on what you want to do in the game.

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Ubernator
I have heard people talk about revamping the Phoenix to make it like the rocket launcher from Half-Life. I find this to be a superb idea. The two other AV weapons require a line of sight... why not the Phoenix?

In fact almost ALL the weapons in PS require a line of sight. The thumper and TR max can bounce grenades around corners and tanks have arc-firing that can be used to shoot something on the other side of a wall, but that is NOTHING compared to the Phoenix's ability.

So, make it wire guided, but require the user to keep the reticle on the target for steering. No more launching from behind cover.

/agree

I really hope it gets fixed soon. In a Prowler, if I go near an NC base, I very quickly have several Phoenix missiles coming at me, fired by an enemy I can't do anything against. The only option for me is to drive away. While sometimes I can catch Phoenix users outside and have my gunners kill them (or run them over myself) most of the time they hide where you can't hit them and proceed to launch rocket after rocket. I'd hate to see how many packs of Phoenix missiles these guys have on them when they first gear up.

[BigTony]

OOOOoooooo i know lets make the pheonix a 2 person weapon. Someone can paint a target with a shiny red lazer and anther can fire it!!! yea that be cool..

[Dharkbayne]

Only problem with the Beamer, is that it lights up everything around you, so you can only get about 3 shots in till they know where ya are, so its only good if the other person is low on health or fighting, but for most h4xx0rz, the AMP is the way to go, I love the AMP , its the l33tn3$$

[Hellsfire123]

The pheonix has been quite nerfed. Its the second least damaging rocket in the game next to the rocklet luancher (why is that in the game? just wondering). The turn speed is slow, and it has a short fuse. Not to mention the size of the ammo box. You can only carry 6 in reinforced armor. Its really only dangerous in large numbers (which happens).

I hated the beamer. Little damage, slow refire and horrible recoil. I eventually just went NC, and i never loot one, so i might try Vanu again when they let us back in.

[DarkDragon00]

leave my chaingun alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and if ur weapons get better, i get better weapons to kill u with cuz i always have another empires tech with me. i like to see their faces when they finaly realize it isnt FF, its a guy with their gun!!!

[Venoxile]

If chaingun doesn't get toned down at all, I was thinking of just becoming an anti-cg whore. Just go all out with gauss, and a jackhammer (i'm assuming jackhammer will get boosted). I expect to be taking bases pretty frequently or defending them, and man do I enjoy killing infantry (in games like cs, rtcw, bf1942). And no, i'm not going to be freelancing with my only weaponry being designed to kill infantry lol. I'm guessing that the gauss is pretty effective at long ranges when firing 1 shot at a time? And does the accuracy or the recoil change when firing ap rounds (for any weapon)?

[Hamma]

I will reserve judgement till I play for a few hrs tonight.

[Venoxile]

Originally posted by Hamma
I will reserve judgement till I play for a few hrs tonight.

After you play tonight, would you make a large post of what you think about all the new changes?

[Warborn]

The pheonix has been quite nerfed. Its the second least damaging rocket in the game next to the rocklet luancher (why is that in the game? just wondering). The turn speed is slow, and it has a short fuse. Not to mention the size of the ammo box. You can only carry 6 in reinforced armor. Its really only dangerous in large numbers (which happens).

The Phoenix is dangerous in any quantity, not because it's damaging, but because it can be extremely difficult to stop the missiles from being fired, and unless you're in a small, fast moving vehicle, it's very difficult to avoid getting hit with them.

Anyway, balance is a never ending process, so if the Phoenix were made to be less cheesy, I'd very much approve of it being boosted to compensate. However, I have a feeling that the weapon will either remain cheesy, or be nerfed to the point that's it's ineffective, all to retain the ability for Phoenix users to attack from behind walls, inside doorways, over hills, and anywhere else they can fire it from that they can't be directly attacked by their victim.