Cycler > ???

[adaeus]

Cycler is much better than the pulsar and moderately better than the gauss...thats from what I see and experience.

I pick up a cycler and notice suddenly the entire game gets easier, its a weapon with minimal recoil, very fast firing rate, and deals outstanding dmg at close range, long range it only does armor damage (maybe a little hp damage), but with a 50 bullet clip, you've got more than enough bullets to take down that enemy.

This is where the gauss beats the cycler, the gauss hurts at long range. But the gauss shoots much slower, with a bit less accuracy, and then theres the pulsar which I just call the vanu crappy weapon. (I think of it (pulsar) as a gauss that doesnt pierce armor at long range.)

Anyhowww... I think the cycler needs tweaking, such as a dmg tweak, or a clip size tweak.

I'd also add a little thing about the sweeper shotgun, it does the same dmg as a jackhammer (give or take a few hps) but has 10 less rounds in the clip, I'm not so sure its balancing as it only takes 2 points to get.

Just another thread about the opinion of balance within game. :)

What are your opinions?

[RandoMTerroR]

Actually i was moderatly disappointed with all the rifles, when i first started playing... But thats properly just me, coming from cs, with one shot kills, hitzones and stuff...

But when i get a gauss in my hands, that just feels way worse than pulsar and cycler, dont know why... The pulsar has great accuracy, and pretty low damage (imo) while the cycler is slightly less accurate, and has a bigger clip size... The gauss... Well i cant make myself use that weapon for more than � a minute at a time...

[Tieom]

Okay, this is seriously bugging me: They made the Gauss LESS accurate than the cycler? WTF?
Unless of course you are talking about full-auto accuracy, not 'single shot' accuracy. Please tell me the Devs didn't make the cycler more accurate than the gauus at long range with single shots...

[cgreene415]

Yeah if anything the guass should be more accurate than the cycler because its a full auto....im not in beta vut Im speaking from what I hear

[AztecWarrior]

I like the Punisher a bit more than the Gauss, to be honest. It's a lot more convenient to fire a plasma grenade behind the rock that the Terran is hiding behind than to wait for him to kill me with his AWP machine gun I mean Cycler.

My 256 RAM comes into play. I have to deal with them out there. They can't get too close. So EAT PLASMA, REDNECK!

[Delirare]

cycler has 2 issues that need to be addressed. Its armor punching ability with standard ammo at close range and its COF. Its COF needs to be larger, as in more recoil, and it needs to stop chewing through health at close range when a guy is at full armor. Doing this overpowers it since it spits out bullet so quickly that it SHOULD chew up armor and not health right away. Also since it fires quickly it causes more reticule knock then its counterparts, another thing that needs looking at.

[Destroyeron]

It's a Terran weapon. It should have a large clip, and it should spit out bullets like crazy.

[Warborn]

The Cycler can fire three bullets before the reticule starts getting bigger and your aim screws up. The Gauss can fire 2 bullets before that happens. However, the Gauss does more damage per bullet than the Cycler. Up close, if the Gauss and Cycler users are both good at shooting, the Gauss will usually win, armor and implants aside, because it will outdamage the Cycler, and the 20 extra rounds the Cycler has won't matter.

As for how big the reticule gets when you start firing, I am not positive, but it can't be any worse than the Cycler. If you start firing a lot with the Cycler, that reticule gets really big, and you will miss a hell of a lot.

[adaeus]

im going to have to test it sometime, compare how fast each gun takes down a man
lol

[Venoxile]

Originally posted by Warborn
The Cycler can fire three bullets before the reticule starts getting bigger and your aim screws up. The Gauss can fire 2 bullets before that happens. However, the Gauss does more damage per bullet than the Cycler. Up close, if the Gauss and Cycler users are both good at shooting, the Gauss will usually win, armor and implants aside, because it will outdamage the Cycler, and the 20 extra rounds the Cycler has won't matter.

As for how big the reticule gets when you start firing, I am not positive, but it can't be any worse than the Cycler. If you start firing a lot with the Cycler, that reticule gets really big, and you will miss a hell of a lot.

Warborn, as cool as you are, that just sounded really biased, lol. Sounds like you really want your cycler. I haven't heard anyone say yet that the gauss would even come close to killing a cycler user in close combat. Even most terrans i've talked to are humble enough to admit the cycler owns gauss in practically every range except wayyy far away.
I'm not in beta, but it sounds to me that if the gauss is supposed to be a long range assault rifle, it's accuracy should be better then the cycler.

[Warborn]

Well, what I said was a bit misleading. If all shots are landed, the Gauss will do more damage than the Cycler, and therefore it will take you down faster. However, not many fights involve perfect aim, even at close range, and the fact that the Cycler has 20 more rounds than the Gauss and doesn't do that much less damage means that, yes, it is better than the Gauss in most cases.

I wasn't saying that it's perfectly balanced, only that the Guass does have a bit of an advantage in terms of shot power. Unfortunately for the NC though, that shot power does not always make up for the 20 more rounds the Cycler fires.

Anyway, I'll leave you with this: I've seen plenty of kills from a Gauss rifle, and plenty from a Cycler. If there's any balancing to be done, I don't believe it will require drastic measure to even things up. There is an advantage to the Cycler, but it's not a massive, game-breaking advantage like the old Gauss rifle used to be (where it had ungodly accuracy, even when full auto).

[Shadowsword8]

In very close combat, you and the enemy strafe left and right and turn around each other, so most of the rounds you fire miss. In medium range combat, you often find more than one enemy around you, and with a Gauss you'll very probably have to reload after the death of the first. And in long lange combat, the Gauss accuracy isn't great, and you can count yourself lucky if half your bullets hit.
So, the clip size has a BIG importance.
Also, when you fire in semi automatic mode (fast salvos of 4-5 bullets at once) the Cycler kill faster than the Gauss.

[BeerJedi]

I would normally agree about the cycler being the best medium assault gun until recently. During one of the latest patches, the COF or the recoil or damage in general has been adjusted.

I'm not super master gamer, nor some piss poor shooter, but i've been outgunned recently by the punisher. I'm a terran, and I like the cycler, if i can get with in 10 ft, you go down, and down hard. Outside of 10ft, i feel its who ever gets the drop, over medium - long ranges, cycler has lost some of it affectiveness.

Part of this is probably user error, but i don't seem to mow people down like i used to with the cycler.

[Pilgrim]

Said it before... will say it agian

I'm good with a cycler... get plenty of kills, most NC (tend to hang on cyssor)

The majority of my kills come from taking a knee and calmly tracking and shooting the gauss user who is straffing and jumping. They'll hit me twice, I'll hit them 9-12 times and they die.

In a fight where the NC monkey takes a knee and fires it's even money who will win... and 9 times out of 10 it AIN'T ME!

I think the difference between to cycler and the gauss is simply a case of the cycler being slightly more noob friendly. Think of it as a PARA in CS. While the gauss requires much more control and discipline to use.

On the other server where I play NC, with a little control and skill I OWN TR almost every time.

I think whining about the Gauss is just an institution now, and few people look at the reality of it.

Just my opinion!

PAX

[Sprocket]

Yet everyone still agrees that the Pulsar sucks, and its AP rounds are broken.

The pulsar needs increased velocity, increased AP damage. Thats it. It's a fine weapon and nice clip size etc but its projectiles are too slow.

Anyway I have 2 Gauss' and 5 Cyclers in my locker (as a Vanu) along with a TR Minigun for when I get Heavy Assault. It shows what weapons are best when you have 50% or more of experienced Vany players (the guys I squad with) looting and using TR weapons more than their own specialized weapons.

personally at this point I would be fine with giving EVERY faction rifle the exact same CoF, clip size, damage, etc. Make them identical and let the skill of the shooters determine the fight. I know this would take alot of flavor out of the game but the current system leaves bad taste in my mouth. As it is I can get the drop on a TR with my Pulsar at close range and I will still go down when he turns and starts firing.

[QKittie]

I'll throw in my two cents about my experiences with cycler, unfortunately I'm not familiar enough with the other faction weapons to name them.

That said, I've been in a large number of infantry fights and have experimented enthusiastically with all of the heavy weapons available to the Terrans. I'll say the same as the previous poster, that I think the Terran cycler is extremely user friendly, but that the difference for the more experienced players doesn't outweigh skill. What he said about gunning down the strafers at medium to long range strikes a chord with my experience.

At long range against kneeling targets I win 1/2 against solo NC and 1/3 against the nasty vanu high damage energy rifle which hurts and seems to be extremely accurate too.

If the enemy starts leaping around and strafing side to side, my percentage jumps way up, to 75%+ against NC and probably even against Vanu (dang energy weapon hurts, whatever it is). The lesson is, if you are leaping around like a monkey at full assault rifle range, don't even bother complaining about rifle balance, you are dead meat whatever you carry.

The third category is players I engage at range who manage to close the distance using trees/hill/ridges cover and skillful dodging to close the range. I see this most often from skilled NC players, who will promptly blow me away with their shotgun. Players good enough to do this will usually beat me, partly because the cycler clip will only last a scant few seconds and so if you miss your first burst, you are caught reloading at the worst time.

I'll repeat that last part for those of you tallying up weapon strengths and weaknesses, in outdoor settings where there is a ton of room to dodge and strafe around, the short range fights are often 75% missed shots in my experience. The cycler clip only lasts a couple seconds as a burst, and controlling bullets from a cycler while dodging for your life and aiming is not an easy task. I'd much rather have my finger permanently down for those fights, as I suspect our NC friends do with that seriously nasty shotgun, freeing them up to concentrate on aim and dodging.

QKittie

[adaeus]

i'm a croucher too, but i was noticing that at decent distances a TR guy would be running at me, standing, just going full auto on me, and beating the hell out of me, usually i win because not many people understand the use of medkits, but sometimes i just get whomped by the sheer mass of bullets it outputs.

who cares if your cof is huge when you've got so many chances to hit! lol

ill have to look out for any recent changes in the gun.

btw, jackhammer is not worth 4 points :D!

ill take a sweeper for 2 thanx!

[Airlift]

If we are talking about outdoor combat, I would take a Gauss every time. If we are talking about indoor combat, I would either go with the Cycler or the Sweeper. The Pulsar is ok, but I almost never choose to use it over the other options available. On the other hand, on the server where I play Vanu, I am certed for Special Weapons so I usually tote those around. As NC, I spend most of my time using stolen Terran Pistols, because my NC character is an infiltrator. On the TR server, I spend all my time in either a Prowler or a Deliverer, and when I get out it is the Cycler.

All balance issues aside, the Cycler is the best Medium Assault Rifle because it sounds like the Marine pulse rifle from Aliens.

[Chryse]

I see a lot of my TR comrades using the Cycler all wrong; going all-out, rock 'n' roll, full auto... while running around all over the place. They need to use entire clips to kill enemies because they have bought into a "spray and pray" mentality.

Little do they realize that their kill tallies would improve if they utilized a simple trick. The trick to using the Cycler is control . Instead of keeping the trigger squeezed till ammo is burned, the Cycler should be fired in short 3-5 round bursts. Once the COF begins to expand, cut the burst then wait a beat and fire another burst. Not only do you increase the chances of hitting, you conserve ammo.

The only time I go full auto is when I am in cramped quarters, at point blank range.

[QKittie]

Heheh Chryse, that took me a whole week to figure out and is something I've been showing frieinds ever since in the VR room.

However, if you play NC or Vanu on Marakov, I think the best strategy for long range fights is to remain standing, or alternate standing and crouching, and throw in a few small jinks side to side to make it interesting. If you could wear pink bunny ears while doing so, I'd be even more amused.

Seriously, I have no idea how terran cyclers can hit people while running with cycler on full automatic. Surely you must be thinking of indoor fights, or medium to short range firefights. I know when trying to hit far off targets, I have to be on a knee and spitting as few bullets as possible to reliably hit anything. The vanu energy weapon seems to be able to hit me while its user is running, maybe it has splash damage or something.

I hate the darn NC steerable missle. Nothing worse than hitting someone with 5-6 volleys to have them step behind a rock and start launching up those wobbly missles. Unless I think I can survive a charge all the way over to them, I'll often just run run run for my life when I see that, and hope that they find somebody else to shoot at. In open areas, or with just a few trees/rocks that thing is NASTY to try to get away from. Maybe I'll go try out surge implant tonight.

QKittie

[adaeus]

I may be weird but with my guass I rarely even burst, its more like fast clicking of the mouse, so i'm shooting almost as fast as normal, but not quite, and it keeps the COF under perfect control.

Might not work for cycler as you'd have to click much faster perhaps to get the effectiveness.

Works on the gauss though, enemies really far, just keep tappin the mouse button and poppin shots into them hehe.

[tmartinez72]

I have most of my kills with a cycler.

It has great accuracy over range when you crouch. Three shots at a time, and before they know where you firing from, they're almost dead.

Indoors, it's also great. The ROF is fantastic. The COF doesn't matter at close range. You'll hit. It rips through health fast.

My next fav weapon is the Thumper on secondary firing mode. It's EXTREMELY effective indoors. With the delayed times, you can bounce the grenade around corners. My record is five kills with one shot. I wasn't even tounched.

[Freedon]

I am far more effective outdoors with the gauss then I am with the cycler. In doors the cycler is mean but out side the gauss wins hands down. But that could just be me.