Now that I have played Planetside, I'm not sure PS2 can work.

[Tatwi]

I've played at least 60 hours on NC/VS in Planetside now and I've learned something very, very important:

It takes a lot of people to make the game fun. A lot.

I've played at various points throughout the day, on weekends and weekdays, and it seems that in Planetside there are only ever, at most, three battles happening at the same time. Usually, it's one big battle and a couple little ones here and there. While that is OK and entertaining I've noticed, the battles are really heavily effected by people logging out and that just shouldn't happen in this type of game.

Just as it is with Planetside, 100% of the content in Planetside 2 will be player generated - without people to shoot and be shot by, there won't be anything to do. When we factor in the ambitious size and scope of Planetside 2, we're probably looking at somewhere around 25,000 players per server just to keep the game interesting through the peek periods of the week and weekend. This is important, because the deciding factors of victories and losses should be based upon the tactics used rather than the transience of the population. In other words, when one squad member logs off, there should always be someone to fill his place, else the game stagnates for all sides, causing even more people to log off out of boredom.

This issue does not present itself as noticeably in smaller squad based games, like Counter-Strike and even World of Warcraft's Battlegrounds, as each match has a beginning, duration, and end for a set number of people. Folks have been saying for ages that "world pvp" in WoW is dead, and apart from the occasional ganking of a noob, it really is quite dead. People just don't do it (years of personal experience on Malorne and Darkspear PvP servers, Feathermoon RP server). That has to mean something, given 10 million people play the game. That's a lot of people. Anyhow, when the matches require fewer people and have a beginning, middle, and end, PvP seems to be a much more popular pass-time than open ended conflicts.

With this in mind, despite my initial enthusiasm for Planetside and Planetside 2 (I loved Tribes!), I must ask, can this concept of 100% community generated content really sustain the volume of subscribers required to make Planetside 2 work? Fundamentally, I'm not sure that it can and I really don't know what to suggest to make it work any better than PS1 (PS1 is a fun, well rounded game that has a lot to offer, seems to have a good reputation, still looks visually acceptable, yet it has a small population compared to almost any other MMO and has had for most of its run). What do you think? Can it work?

We already know how well Planetside has worked. What did we learn from that experience and how can we use that knowledge to do better the second time around? Or, is it even possible to do better with this concept of a 100% community generated content game? There really isn't, to my knowledge, another MMO like that (especially not EVE, with its PvE and player economy).

[Brusi]

I honestly think the free to play model will eliminate this threat in a way.

People will always get bored and distracted, but as long as there is constant development to lure players back and there are no obstacles stopping these players from returning such as $15 sub, then there will always be enough other people playing to keep it interesting for those returning. Whether they return for just for a day, a month or another whole dirty 3 months without showering or leaving the house, it's all about initiating that lifetime addiction.

Now... constantly having multiple 1000 person battles.... Let me just say that i would be happy with constantly having multiple 100 person battles. We'll see...

[Tatwi]

Originally Posted by Brusi

I honestly think the free to play model will eliminate this threat in a way.

People will always get bored and distracted, but as long as there is constant development to lure players back and there are no obstacles stopping these players from returning such as $15 sub, then there will always be enough other people playing to keep it interesting for those returning. Whether they return for just for a day, a month or another whole dirty 3 months without showering or leaving the house, it's all about initiating that lifetime addiction.

Now... constantly having multiple 1000 person battles.... Let me just say that i would be happy with constantly having multiple 100 person battles. We'll see...

That is insightful and I think you're right about reducing or eliminating the obstacles between a person thinking about playing and actually logging in to play. It might not be hundreds of people logged in all the time, but keeping people logged in most of the time is way more important in Planetside's style of game play than any other MMO, ever.

[Bags]

Originally Posted by Tatwi

I must ask, can this concept of 100% community generated content really sustain the volume of subscribers required to make Planetside 2 work?

It worked back in 2003 before World of Warcraft and micro-transactions became huge, widespread broadband internet and the average computer could handle it.

Why couldn't a sequel work now?

[Raymac]

Quite simply, you should have seen Planetside in 2003. Having enough players was never a problem. Now clearly they didn't sustain those numbers, but Planetside 2 stands to be a much better game because of the lessons learned from the original.

Thats one of the reasons I'm so excited for Planetside 2. I remember how epic it was back in the early days, and imagining that plus more is why I'm looking forward to this game. You're absolutely right that the game needs alot of players, but it can do that easy.

[Huma]

Man back in the day the brawls were huge and you had atleast 2 pop locked fights and 2 skirmishes going on off peak hours. The game your playing now is a ghost town compared to what it once was. Just wait man, this game is like the field of dreams. Once it's built they will come and we'll all reap a bloody harvest of death and destruction on an epic scale. Daddy likey!

[Haro]

Yeah, even in the later days of 2005 or 2006, planetside reserves managed to keep things fairly interesting. If they go for a basic f2p package right from the beginning, I think the game could do pretty well at the very least. Like others have said before, the games core concept managed to attract a pretty solid population all the way back in 2003, with some fairly broken gameplay elements and technology that couldn't just keep up. If PS2 manages to get off to a better start (and it's hard for it not to) then the game can probably go even further.

[Valdae]

PS1 came out when I was supposed to be studying for my school exams. Every time I played it I never wanted to leave because there was always a new battle going on somewhere else to be part of!

I imagine PS2 will be like this for a while, but if I remember correctly SOE will be dictating certain territories to take anyway. They've also promised less downtime in between battles. All in all what I'm saying is even if their are fewer people, there should still be a good battle or two to fight in!

[Sirisian]

I was reading this thread like "An MMOFPS like they've described can't exist. Have you ever played an MMOFPS that lasted for more than a year?"

I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment. A game like Planetside is impossible. I don't even know why they're trying.

[Graywolves]

Planetside rolled strong from atleast 03'-06' on a subscription business model shortly before MMO's became popular/well-known and while Gaming in general was climbing over the negative stigmatisms.


Even if they went with their original plan of just brushing up PS1, I think it would've been successful. As long as a commercial or two make it out before launch or something I don't see any way of this failing.



Unless someone screws something up >_>

[Brusi]

Planetside was successful for the Epic Battles!

It's pretty hard to say that PS now is better or more fun than other games on the market as there are a LOT of quality multiplayer games around now. It's a so so game that some die-hard fans still play, and has been more and more fun of late due to 45 days free players and hype around PS2 bringing some back.

However, "Planetside back in the day"™ is still a more amazing and memorable experience than what people are playing now, perhaps even any game since!

If they can pull off the next break-through in the MMOFPS genre and then keep the server populations reasonably high, i think it has the potential to be very, very successful for a long time.

Remember, all they need is for 18% of those players to make micro-transaction purchases and Smed is rolling in hookers and coke.

[Graywolves]

Originally Posted by Brusi

Remember, all they need is for 18% of those players to make micro-transaction purchases and Smed is rolling in hookers and coke.

I love Coke! I drink it all the time!

[SgtMAD]

PlanetSide at release wasn't anything like you could have experienced in your 60 hours playing.

there will be plenty of ppl at release,the problem is getting them to all stay subbed after the fourth month.

PS had two east coast and two west coast servers,if they cut that down to one server for each coast you will see a huge population,which is what the game needs.

Planetside '03/'04 was nothing like you could have seen in the last two years.

[2coolforu]

Planetside never had any problems with pop until it was totally killed by bad patching, and that was during a time when broadband + good computers were pretty rare. I mean we have like 2 billion people on the internet and gaming is far more mainstream now than it was in 2003, there are so many more players that I can easily see Planetside 2 being relatively unsuccessful for a mainstream FPs and still netting 2-3 times the population of peak Planetside 1.

Even then during all-nighters on Planetside 1 on Werner when pops could drop down into double figures almost it was still fun. What makes Planetside unfun now is the prevelance of one-many army BR40 all-certs as it means that anyone can do anything and when you have less people the one-man-army aspect becomes all the more obvious as people stop voluntary teamwork and just switch to 'One Man Army' mode.

[basti]

60 hours? Dude, you have no clue what planetside is yet.
Post again once you started understanding what you are talking about, but you wont ever, because you have never seen the way the game was intended to be: 3 or more pop locks.