Health/Shield/Jetpack Mechanics from GDC Videos

[Erendil]

Yes, nice job summarizing the main infantry mechanics from the vid.

For grunts I'll just throw out these additional observations:

• Shooting rifles without ADS seems to have a CoF a little bigger than a standing lasher, but it doesn't seem to expand much at all, so running and gunning seems to be a somewhat valid tactic at what we'd consider PS1 "indoor range." Keep in mind Higby said that he had a foregrip attachment on his Gauss that improves non-ADS accuracy so YMMV.
  
• "Light" infantry troops (LA, Medics, Engies) all seem to take ~4-6 bullets before they die. Shots appear to do the same damage to health after the shield is down that they did to the shields initially, i.e. - there is no damage mitigation on the shield (I believe Higby has stated this earlier).
  
• "Heavies" are tougher to figure out. In the interview over at The Verge Higby's Heavy died after about 6 shots from the TR's Heavy Cycler. I'm guessing a couple of those were headshots since the TR Heavy troop he was fighting seemed to take 6-8 shots from a Heavy Gauss Rifle and kept coming. However, I believe someone mentioned a Dev stating that the Heavy armour wasn't near balanced yet..

And to extend the "shield" observations to vehicles:

• Both the Reaver and Vannie have "20 bars" worth of armour as well, so that bar length appears to be the standard size. Presumably each tick is 5% of the total armour and not a representation of a static amount of armour (like each tick = 50 armour, that sort of thing). In addition the armour totals between a Reaver and Vannie can be inferred to be very different values (see below).
  
• From 6:59 of GDC vid 1, a single railgun shot from a Mag takes 40% of a Reaver's total armour. Ouch! So it dies in 3 shots. In PS1 it takes 5 to kill and unshielded/base armour Reaver.
  
• From 1:25 of GDC vid 3, I believe a 3-shell volley was fired by the Prowler on screen at Higby's tank (3-shot volley is a Prowler sidegrade). Looks like he scored one hit and one near miss, for a total of 5 bars (25%) of Higby's armour. So if this is correct, each prowler shell does 3 bars of armour to a Vannie, or 8 hits to kill. In PS1 it takes 15 100mm shells to kill an unshielded/base armour Vannie.

So it looks like TTK on vehicles will be faster too.

[CutterJohn]

Very nice summary Malorn. You get three internets!

Originally Posted by Malorn

This does not explain the role of "armor" in the game, in terms of light assault vs heavy assault vs infiltrator at least. I assume that much like vehicle armor, class armor offers passive mitigation. For example, an infiltrator might take 12 damage per shot from a cycler, while a light assault only takes 10 and a heavy assault takes 8. There is no need to repair armor in this model it's just the heavier infantry simply take less damage overall.

My guess is that 'armor' is simply an abstraction now. Its just how the class looks, like how the classes in TF2 look different. I'm betting any difference will simply be in the amount of shield/health hitpoints each class receives. MAXs would probably be 250/250, Heavy Assault 150/150, Infils 50/50. Having differing absorption made sense in the context of PS1 because everyone had 100 hitpoints, and the armor existed merely to make that effectively larger. If you don't stick yourself to the arbitrary limit of 100 health, you can achieve the same effect as absorption by simply adding more health/shields.

Also, you won't run into the issue where high rof/low damage weapons are punished more severely by absorption than low rof/high damage weapons, like cycler vs gauss after the rexo buff.

[Erendil]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

My guess is that 'armor' is simply an abstraction now. Its just how the class looks, like how the classes in TF2 look different. I'm betting any difference will simply be in the amount of shield/health hitpoints each class receives. MAXs would probably be 250/250, Heavy Assault 150/150, Infils 50/50. Having differing absorption made sense in the context of PS1 because everyone had 100 hitpoints, and the armor existed merely to make that effectively larger. If you don't stick yourself to the arbitrary limit of 100 health, you can achieve the same effect as absorption by simply adding more health/shields.

Also, you won't run into the issue where high rof/low damage weapons are punished more severely by absorption than low rof/high damage weapons, like cycler vs gauss after the rexo buff.

Yup, that's exactly what I'm thinking.

[Coreldan]

Nice job, wish I hae thought this myself BTW, Higby didnt have a vertical grip until the courtyard fight began where he switched to the "white"ish camo.

[TheRagingGerbil]

Nice analysis Mal.

[Knocky]

Originally Posted by TheRagingGerbil

Nice analysis Mal.

Indeed, a very interesting read.

[MrBloodworth]

It was a good analysis.

So, why not just have this as armor. Why remove the teamwork and weaken the role of the Engi just so some people do not need others?

It's anther erosion of the team play aspect.

There is a non-trivial difference in the act of getting repaired (by self or others ) VS. just laying low for a moment.

One requires others to cover you for a time, or do the repairing ( Still needs cover ), the other just requires you lay low for a moment.

[Skitrel]

Support your points. Don't just say "it's going to remove teamwork and weaken the role", explain exactly how you get to that reasoning, why, logic and reasoning.

[MrBloodworth]

I believe I have done that, you just refuse to read that part.

In one situation, you need others to cover you, or your Medic/engi. - Teamwork.

In the other, you just need to hide behind something for a moment. - No Teamwork.

AFAIK you do not even have to stop for shields to recover. That's a non-trivial difference right there.

[colorpilot]

nice post. very informative thanks ^^

[Skitrel]

You are choosing to ignore that healing is still a mechanic, and that the ability to heal oneself has been removed.

They have taken the old mechanic, removed it's pointless aspect (absolutely everyone healing themselves) and added further to it with the addition of shields and the gameplay elements they'll contribute.

You are oversimplifying.

[Aurmanite]

This is a fantastic post. Great observation.

[MrBloodworth]

Originally Posted by Skitrel

You are choosing to ignore that healing is still a mechanic, and that the ability to heal oneself has been removed.

They have taken the old mechanic, removed it's pointless aspect (absolutely everyone healing themselves) and added further to it with the addition of shields and the gameplay elements they'll contribute.

You are oversimplifying.

Negative.

Everyone having the cert is not part of what I am talking about, again, its not related.

Healing is a mechanic, I never disputed that, not sure why you bring it up, however the method is entirely different for the reasons I stated.

I suppose I have to repeat them again.

In the new system, Regarding shields, you simply need to lay low for a moment. No other user is required, not even to cover you for X amount of time.

In the old system, you needed to be motionless, be healed by another, and covered by others for X amount of time.

One enables the individual player, the other relies on teamwork of the group.

[QuiCKaNdDeaDLy]

Good Job Sherlock!

[Skitrel]

Originally Posted by MrBloodworth

Negative.

Everyone having the cert is not part of what I am talking about, again, its not related.

Healing is a mechanic, I never disputed that, not sure why you bring it up, however the method is entirely different for the reasons I stated.

I suppose I have to repeat them again.

In the new system, Regarding shields, you simply need to lay low for a moment. No other user is required, not even to cover you for X amount of time.

In the old system, you needed to be motionless, be healed by another, and covered by others for X amount of time.

One enables the individual player, the other relies on teamwork of the group.

Do explain how it enables the individual any more than allowing everyone in game to heal themselves.