Prone and lean

[GreatMazinkaise]

Silly OP, T-A-C-T-I-C-A-L isn't how you spell "camping"...

[Coreldan]

Originally Posted by I SandRock

It makes little difference to the situation. The defender still has the entrenched position, you will not catch him out in the open, at most you will catch him popping in and out of lean. Or being statically in lean to cover the entrance. The defender can sit and wait for as long as he wants making use of cover while the attacker has to move in and attack at some point. Planetside 2 also has wide open spaces and large outside areas for attackers to traverse. We have seen little actual indoor corridors. Which means attackers will be caught out in the open more often while defenders use lean to make a small target of themselves..

And I don't baseline disagree. In my head though, having the option to leave increases the attacking sides survivability more than it increases the defending side ability to camp and that is why I want it implemented/I'm not against it.

In fact, I believe Planetside is the only online shooter I've ever played more than 2 hours that didn't have the option to lean. EDIT: No wait, BF3.

[Landtank]

Originally Posted by Bags

Grenade spam in PS1 wasn't enough, let's put a shit ton of mechanics that require them in PS2, this can't end badly.

Hah maybe, but since grenades cost money it wouldn't in theory be too bad. Its a good point though, definitely could be abused.

Besides grenades are just one example, you can wait for the enemy to pop out, it limits the amount of people allowed to clog up a hallway, makes snipers way more noticeable outdoors I feel, idk just throwin around ideas.

Leaning allows you to check your corners more effectively, and I think it allows for better firefights, but I could be wrong. Its all based on opinion, but I just don't like the idea of having to throw my whole body into the line of fire to take a shot, or to stay behind a MAX suit just to take some pot shots.

[QuantumMechanic]

I think PS2 definately should have some mechanics that facilitate "camping".

Firstly as has been mentioned the fights usually will have an attacker / defender situation where one team is defending some type of building or feature. Do you expect the defenders to run around willy-nilly in the open instead of taking advantage of base defense features?

Secondly killing campers gives infiltrators something fun to do.

[Poser]

Originally Posted by DreadPirate

There's no such thing as camping in this game. Grenades, planes, jump jets, and sheer numbers negate any real damage a camper can do. This is a different type of game than the "other" fps games most are used to. So the normal fps faux pas don't apply.
Just my 2 cents.

This. Plus you forgot that you can "spot" guys on the map too, for your team.

[Landtank]

Originally Posted by QuantumMechanic

Secondly killing campers gives infiltrators something fun to do.

Exactly my thinking too.

[Bags]

Originally Posted by Landtank

Hah maybe, but since grenades cost money it wouldn't in theory be too bad. Its a good point though, definitely could be abused.

Besides grenades are just one example, you can wait for the enemy to pop out, it limits the amount of people allowed to clog up a hallway, makes snipers way more noticeable outdoors I feel, idk just throwin around ideas.

Leaning allows you to check your corners more effectively, and I think it allows for better firefights, but I could be wrong. Its all based on opinion, but I just don't like the idea of having to throw my whole body into the line of fire to take a shot, or to stay behind a MAX suit just to take some pot shots.

What incentive do defenders have to pop out when they can lean and wait for you to come to them?

Originally Posted by QuantumMechanic

I think PS2 definately should have some mechanics that facilitate "camping".

Firstly as has been mentioned the fights usually will have an attacker / defender situation where one team is defending some type of building or feature. Do you expect the defenders to run around willy-nilly in the open instead of taking advantage of base defense features?

Secondly killing campers gives infiltrators something fun to do.

Defenders already have the advantage.

and all you need is one defender to have a DL scope or an infared scope and the cloaker is useless.

[Coreldan]

Originally Posted by Bags

What incentive do defenders have to pop out when they can lean and wait for you to come to them?

Defenders already have the advantage.

They already have no incentive to pop out even without lean.

Like BF3. I miss the option to lean in it, but never as the defender, but the attacker. If I want to camp as the defender, they will lose regardless if I have lean or not. As the attacker it gives me a tad better chance to do something about it. Yes, defender still has the advantage, but I'm a bit less at a disadvantage.

Think it like...... If you have 2 apples and get 2 apples more, you get a 100% increase. If you have 100 apples and you get 2 apples more, it's a 2% increase Point being, it's a far bigger boost to the attacker than it is to the defender. Not at such percentages as in the examples, but still

Now I'm off to sleep though, so I won't be replying in the next 8 hours, but I guess there's nothing more for me to reply, I said my opinion already

[Toppopia]

Originally Posted by Landtank

Hah maybe, but since grenades cost money it wouldn't in theory be too bad. Its a good point though, definitely could be abused.

Besides grenades are just one example, you can wait for the enemy to pop out, it limits the amount of people allowed to clog up a hallway, makes snipers way more noticeable outdoors I feel, idk just throwin around ideas.

Leaning allows you to check your corners more effectively, and I think it allows for better firefights, but I could be wrong. Its all based on opinion, but I just don't like the idea of having to throw my whole body into the line of fire to take a shot, or to stay behind a MAX suit just to take some pot shots.

Its weird having to expose my whole body just to shoot, thats one reason i love games with cover mechanics, it allows me to effectively fight from cover, and i always ADS round corners to give me a nice controlled pace i can look round corners, and since grenades cost resouces and hopefully can't be resupplied by ammo boxes, then grenade spam won't be too bad,

[Immigrant]

Originally Posted by Toppopia

But this game is about defending bases, so its not camping, its called defending a base/tower/whatever, kind of hate how most people say "You're sitting in one place killing me? You must be a camping noob."

Toppopia I wasn't talking about that... base defense is not "camping". Even camping is a legit tactics sometimes imo i.e. when ambushing...

However there will be those guys (snipers mostly) who will go to your bases/towers, hide between 2 rocks and shoot at soldiers spawning nearby like that one guy in E3 footage. they will have stealth cloaks already but there's no need to make them OP by allowing them to have even less visibility by going prone or leaning behind the rock.

[maradine]

Originally Posted by Poser

lol didn't come up. I looked everything was from 2011. My bad I guess...

Don't worry about it. I think all the principal constituents on both sides are argued the hell out anyway.

edit: oh christ, apparently not.

[Landtank]

Originally Posted by Coreldan

They already have no incentive to pop out even without lean.

Like BF3. I miss the option to lean in it, but never as the defender, but the attacker. If I want to camp as the defender, they will lose regardless if I have lean or not. As the attacker it gives me a tad better chance to do something about it. Yes, defender still has the advantage, but I'm a bit less at a disadvantage.

Yeah the way I see it, the defender should almost always have the advantage over the attacker in a 1v1, that's the nature of the game, but leaning cuts down that advantage just enough that you have actually stand a good chance if you can get to cover.

[captainkapautz]

Gotta love people going all "DONT ADD THAT, IT HELPS CAMPERS!" when at the same time people want strategy and tactics.

Last time I checked there were more strategies and tactics than going "HARPDARP IMA RUSH IN THER".

Defenders SHOULD have the advantage, equal numbers on both the defending and attacking sides should atleast be stalemates or favor defenders, unless one side uses superior tactics.

This whole train of thought that prone would encourage camping has no basis whatsoever, when camping is a valid tactic in this kind of game.

[Toppopia]

Originally Posted by Immigrant

Toppopia I wasn't talking about that... base defense is not "camping". Even camping is legit a legit tactics imo when i.e. when ambushing...

However there will be those guys (snipers mostly) who will go to your bases/towers, hide between 2 rocks and shoot at soldiers spawning nearby like that one guy in E3 footage. they will have stealth cloaks already but there's no need to make them OP by allowing them to have even less visibility by going prone or leaning behind the rock.

My apologies, normally when people talk about camping they talk about corner camping and such, but with the numbers of people spawning, then hopefully the case you said wouldn't be too bad, thats where someone spawns a aircraft or get people to lay down suppressing fire while someone flanks him. But snipers cloaks don't last forever and i presume they have a recharge time so that hopefully stops any of that being too powerful. And some people might argue that that is a valid tactic of slowing down an enemy advance, like in BF3 operation metro, me and my friends were defending and got pushed back, but we stayed outside and killed everyone that tried to run down the tunnel, ahh, good times, and only 1 person would ever try and kill me, which was a bad move on their part.

[Rumblepit]

prone would be nice, but it dosnt work for all games. lean i am all for it. adds so much more dimension to the combat.