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Old 2012-06-11, 02:37 PM   [Ignore Me] #1
OutlawDr
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Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


This is a discussion about making a deeper, more persistent metagame.
Required reading:
http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...t=39563&page=8

We often hear that PS2's maps and world will be persistent. While this is true, PS1 vets know this is really only half the truth. How you leave the map for the night is not how its going to look the next day. All the gains you and your outfit made the night prior could be completely altered by the handful of people playing in the early morning and afternoon before prime time. Thats the nature of Planetside, and it is what it is. Not much you can do about that directly.

However it can leave you deflated after awhile. I played PS1 for about a year and half, but left once I felt I was just doing the same thing over and over with no direction. There were no persistent, over reaching goals to shoot for that go beyond the night. In other words the metagame was shallow. Outfits can help with this, but only for so long. I'm amazed by people that stayed with PS1 for so many years. However, I get told the same by people when I tell them I played PS1 for over a year.

The good news is I think creating a deeper metagame won't be that hard, and would require simple enough additions that won't affect the gameplay at all (for those who are perfectly content with the way things are). The simple solution: keep score. Keep score of each empires holdings per server. Nothing gets people more fired up to play than good ole competition with bragging rights on the line. I'm NOT talking about matches, events or resets. Simply an official and robust system that keeps tabs on whats going on. Something that players can look at and see clearly whats going on. Nothing will pull players away from the main fight. Everyone is playing the same game. Its still going to be the same never ending war we all want. And at the same time nothing forces players to care about "the score", and they are free to ignore it and play as normal. For those that do care, it would give them that appreciated extra incentive to continue playing for the long haul. Its something that both casual players and competitive outfits can participate in and enjoy.

For example, at the end of each hour the game tallies the number of resources nodes an empire holds in their server across the continents and then assigns points for them. More important bases can go for more points. Those points are then tallied for the daily score. Daily scores can be tallied for the weekly, monthly and yearly...you get the idea. The reward for "winning" for that day, week, month ect..can be nothing more than bragging rights for that empire on the server. Honestly this enough for most people...its good enough for the endless amounts of non-professional gaming leagues. The one caveat I would add here is that the game only keeps score for hours during peek prime time (usually between 7pm-11pm). The main reason for this is to dissuade any farming and gaming of the system during off hours. Its easy for a groups of players to plan 4am base farm session with the use of cross faction alts. Server mods can combat this, but it will be an never ending battle which will leave suspicion and questions on the legitimacy of the scores. Limiting scoring to just prime time will side step all that. Plus this is when it will matter the most anyway, as most players will be on during that time and competition will be at its fiercest. EDIT:I've altered this part based on feedback. Points scored per hour are modified by current population compared to that empires peek population on server and by server faction population imbalances. If an empire is at 50% of peek population it translates to 50% of points scored per hour. At the same time empires with lower populations compared to the other empires score higher than normal and vice versa.

In the end, it really changes nothing on how the game is played, and it really is just a glorified and spruced up stat tracking system. But I think something simple like this can go a long way in making the metagame more meaningful, and help make players care a bit more about the daily happenings of the never ending war.
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:44 PM   [Ignore Me] #2
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


I hope they keep the old badges from ps1
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:46 PM   [Ignore Me] #3
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


So people who can't play during primetime don't count?
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:51 PM   [Ignore Me] #4
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by johnflenaly View Post
So people who can't play during primetime don't count?
They wouldn't count for scoring purposes, but how they leave the map for the next group will obviously have an impact. But I'd suggest playing in a server with a prime time during your main play times.
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:57 PM   [Ignore Me] #5
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


I'm probably one of the only people who would actually like resets a lá Guildwars 2 where each week/2 weeks there is a winner and the bases reset.
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Old 2012-06-11, 03:29 PM   [Ignore Me] #6
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by Bazilx View Post
I'm probably one of the only people who would actually like resets a lá Guildwars 2 where each week/2 weeks there is a winner and the bases reset.
You're not the only one. Having a "winnable" situation is one of the most fundamental components of any game.

I'm not saying I know the best way to implement it in a game like PS, but there should absolutely be long term goals that acquaintances, friends, outfits, and whole servers can work towards and win or fail to achieve. Some should last a weekend, some a week, some a month. Maps should be rotated, introduced, changed up. Score should be kept - personal statistics/contributions, as well as outfit and server accomplishments.

Variety is the spice of life, so I'm not sure why anyone thinks we'd want to take part in the same pointless fight month after month. Don't get me wrong, I'm very much looking forward to the game, but fun gameplay is not the whole equation. And it can only be enhanced by a good bigger-picture game, just as it can only be harmed by one that is poorly done.
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:58 PM   [Ignore Me] #7
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by OutlawDr View Post
They wouldn't count for scoring purposes, but how they leave the map for the next group will obviously have an impact. But I'd suggest playing in a server with a prime time during your main play times.
Maybe I don't want a horrible ping! That being said so what if people play in the off time, If they have the time there actions should mean something. Just because you don't have the time doesn't mean others wont, and punishing them by not letting there action contribute to the "meta game" is selfish. If somebody spends 16 straight hours playing, but only 4 hours out of that block actually "mean" something to the overall game, your degrading there gaming experience so your 4 hour effort means more. I'ts a 24 hour game, it should be a 24 hour game. Not a 4 hour game, with 20 hours of "practice".

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Old 2012-06-11, 03:04 PM   [Ignore Me] #8
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by johnflenaly View Post
Maybe I don't want a horrible ping! That being said so what if people play in the off time, If they have the time there actions should mean something. Just because you don't have the time doesn't mean others wont, and punishing them by not letting there action contribute to the "meta game" is selfish. If somebody spends 16 straight hours playing, but only 4 hours out of that block actually "mean" something to the overall game, your degrading there gaming experience so your 4 hour effort means more. I'ts a 24 hour game, it should be a 24 hour games. Not a 4 hour game, with 20 hours of "practice".
As at it stands now, the game will only be "24 hours of practice". If you can come up with a solution for the off hour farming and gaming problem, then I could change my mind about it. Imo its a deal breaker. Come up with a solution, or be the selfless person and take one for the team. Like I said, actions in off hours will effect how the map down the road. Its something.
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Old 2012-06-11, 11:12 PM   [Ignore Me] #9
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by OutlawDr View Post
They wouldn't count for scoring purposes, but how they leave the map for the next group will obviously have an impact. But I'd suggest playing in a server with a prime time during your main play times.
So you are suggesting i play on a laggy far away server because sometimes i like to play till the sun comes up. ya i call shenanigans. Night people are people too.

As for your idea it all just sounds like a giant E-Peen measuring contest. Let's fight for bases and resources, not superficial stats that add little.
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Old 2012-06-11, 11:42 PM   [Ignore Me] #10
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


IMO, a PS metagame would involve channeling resources from the "normal" game into player built continents. Building structures and defenses and capturing and/or destroying those of the other factions. The defenses available would be formidable enough to require sustained attack for hours so the front lines, once established, take serious effort and resources to move. It would be possible to wipe a faction off these continents and erase everything they ever built. That should promote some serious rivalry!
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Old 2012-06-11, 11:52 PM   [Ignore Me] #11
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by mynameismud View Post
So you are suggesting i play on a laggy far away server because sometimes i like to play till the sun comes up. ya i call shenanigans. Night people are people too.

As for your idea it all just sounds like a giant E-Peen measuring contest. Let's fight for bases and resources, not superficial stats that add little.
So... youre insulted that this metagame idea will not include you, but you don't want it anyway...even if it won't affect you in the slightest..BTW, I didn't mean to be an oppressor of the night people. Good news though, I've since changed my stance on how to handle off hours. Give it a read if you like.
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Old 2012-06-12, 05:58 AM   [Ignore Me] #12
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


While this is true, PS1 vets know this is really only half the truth. How you leave the map for the night is not how its going to look the next day. All the gains you and your outfit made the night prior could be completely altered by the handful of people playing in the early morning and afternoon before prime time. Thats the nature of Planetside, and it is what it is. Not much you can do about that directly.
Amazing!

People playing the game off-peak take and loose bases. Just like people playing on-peak. It's almost like they're... playing the game!

You know what's really annoying to me? Is those damn on-peak players that move the map around while I'm not playing. Rude and inconsiderate!


I'm sorry, this entire idea of "On-Peak Master Race" is beyond absurd. It's almost like you think that 'Persistent World' means 'Persistent when I play'.
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Old 2012-06-12, 06:01 AM   [Ignore Me] #13
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by Shade Millith View Post
I'm sorry, this entire idea of "On-Peak Master Race" is beyond absurd. It's almost like you think that 'Persistent World' means 'Persistent when I play'.
If a base falls in the wee small hours and there's no-one there to hear it, does it still make a sound?
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Old 2012-06-12, 10:14 AM   [Ignore Me] #14
OutlawDr
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


Originally Posted by Shade Millith View Post
Amazing!

People playing the game off-peak take and loose bases. Just like people playing on-peak. It's almost like they're... playing the game!

You know what's really annoying to me? Is those damn on-peak players that move the map around while I'm not playing. Rude and inconsiderate!


I'm sorry, this entire idea of "On-Peak Master Race" is beyond absurd. It's almost like you think that 'Persistent World' means 'Persistent when I play'.
Ohh gosh, more flippant indignation. Issues of exploitation were why I initially posted peek only, it wasn't just to steal your cookies. However a good solution has come about since then, so we can all eat our cookies in harmony.
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Old 2012-06-11, 02:47 PM   [Ignore Me] #15
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Re: Making a deeper, more persistent metagame


I agree. We could use percentages of time holding the continent per week or something. I'm sure we'll see "who's winning" stats and stuff.
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