The Deliverer

Jeffey · 2005-03-07, 04:25 AM

One thing I've always wondered is the effectiveness and reasoning behind the existance of the deliverer. Whichever cert pack you get it with, you always will certify both the deliverer and your empire specific variant.

As a TR I cannot find any advantage whatsoever in using a deliv over a raider. The deliv packs 2 20mm guns while the raider has 4 15mm guns. Frankly the ratio of 2 to 1 seems to outweigh the difference in ammunition.

Even If I was in a scenario where I was pulling it to transport only two friendlies, I would probably pull a marauder for speed and the beloved ground pounder.

Does anyone have any insight to the Deliverer?

Kuraltai · 2005-03-07, 05:11 AM

Originally Posted by Jeffey

One thing I've always wondered is the effectiveness and reasoning behind the existance of the deliverer. Whichever cert pack you get it with, you always will certify both the deliverer and your empire specific variant.

As a TR I cannot find any advantage whatsoever in using a deliv over a raider. The deliv packs 2 20mm guns while the raider has 4 15mm guns. Frankly the ratio of 2 to 1 seems to outweigh the difference in ammunition.

Even If I was in a scenario where I was pulling it to transport only two friendlies, I would probably pull a marauder for speed and the beloved ground pounder.

Does anyone have any insight to the Deliverer?

Actually, for over a year, the Deliverer was all we had. They make a good small unit transport when Gals are not available. Plus, they float. The variants were only recently introduced, and as usual, it takes more soldiers to man the Raider and make it effective than the Thunderer or Aurora.

Warborn · 2005-03-07, 08:30 AM

The Deliverer is faster than the Raider, and its 12mm's do more damage to air targets than 15mm's (that's not a typo, the 12mm is the superior anti-air shell).

Jeffey · 2005-03-07, 11:31 PM

Originally Posted by Warborn

The Deliverer is faster than the Raider, and its 12mm's do more damage to air targets than 15mm's (that's not a typo, the 12mm is the superior anti-air shell).

My friend and I checked last weekend when I brought this up on vent, raider is 15mm, deliv is 20mm?

Warborn · 2005-03-08, 01:06 AM

Originally Posted by Jeffey

My friend and I checked last weekend when I brought this up on vent, raider is 15mm, deliv is 20mm?

Yeah, 20mm, that's it. If it were 12mm it'd pass through BFR shields, which it certainly does not. Its guns are inferior against land targets (I believe) but superior against air targets (this part I know for sure), compared to the 15mm guns of a Raider. And it's faster. So if you need some ghetto anti-air, you can pull a Deliverer and do alright.

DeepStrikeck · 2005-03-07, 03:55 PM

The deliverer is especially useful for the VS, because the Aurora sucks rocks against air

Electrofreak · 2005-03-08, 03:26 AM

Actually, still wrong. The Deliverer does have 2 20mm guns, but it is more effective against all vehicles and armored units than the 15mms. 12mm do the best damage versus infantry and other very lightly armored targets, which is why they are actually somewhat effective versus aircraft (which don't have much in terms of damage absorbtion in their armor). But 20mm machineguns are the best against all types of ground and air in the game (other than Liberator nosegun and tail gun).

So, if you only have 2 gunners handy, a Deliverer would fare better versus aircraft or enemy vehicles than a Raider with just 2 15mm gunners. With the added speed, it also is a bit more capable of pulling out of a sticky situation or chasing down an armored target.

IMO, the Deliverer Variants are all overpowered, but the Devs haven't changed them so I'm assuming that we're stuck with them this way and should just get used to it...

Jeffey · 2005-03-08, 11:54 AM

I don't know though - again it all goes back to the simple concept of 4 guns to 2. In my experience when gunning a raider and some jackass reaver does his little hover in to spray his missles, we down him like a brick.

But again, I'm a TR, so I guess as far as I should be concerned, Deliv = 5 man amphibious transport and raider = 5 man crewed combat vehicle?

Warborn · 2005-03-08, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by Jeffey

I don't know though - again it all goes back to the simple concept of 4 guns to 2. In my experience when gunning a raider and some jackass reaver does his little hover in to spray his missles, we down him like a brick.

Assuming all of your guys focus on a target, the Raider will outdamage a Deliverer against any target. The damage difference between the weapon types isn't large enough to make up for two additional guns firing. However, a lot of the time it's rare to have all your gunners coordinating, so in some cases a Deliverer may still get in more damage, simply because against a Raider or Deliverer, aircraft tend to dive in and then fly off rather than hover around spamming rockets or what have you, so the Deliverer would get more out of the brief fire window many pilots expose themselves to when attack a Raider/Deliverer.

But again, I'm a TR, so I guess as far as I should be concerned, Deliv = 5 man amphibious transport and raider = 5 man crewed combat vehicle?

If you have enough guys to fully crew a Raider, there's little reason to get a Deliverer. Apart from the weapons, the Deliverer is faster by a bit, but it's less durable.

iluvthequasar · 2005-03-09, 12:31 AM

make good use of the floating ability. i was in a deli along with 2 cr5s (one was driving), we took out 4 prowlers before having to retreat for ammo.

GreyFlcn · 2005-03-09, 12:42 AM

The deliverer is pretty underestimated ;D

I've actually found it's the perfect vehicle to compliment the Magrider.
Same speed, Same Float, Same Range
Odd number of Gunners, and extra seats.

Together, you got better AA than a Skyguard.

Hell, I like rolling a bunch of em.
Takes only 3 to wax a Gunner BFR without any casualties.
Although I've done it before with only 1.

Deliverer is probably my favorite ground vehicle

Although, dunno if I had access to Thunderer or Raider.
Since I'm VS haven't really had much access.

But as far as cheap, reliable transport that gets half a squad moving around
Deliverer is where it's at.
Only thing it can't do is drive with Rexo, or passenger seats for Maxes.
Which can usually be remedied with AdvHack, AMS or a Tower.

Jeffey · 2005-03-09, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by GreyFlcn

Together, you got better AA than a Skyguard.

Well I wouldn't go that far...

iluvthequasar · 2005-03-14, 11:41 PM

Originally Posted by GreyFlcn

The deliverer is pretty underestimated ;D

I've actually found it's the perfect vehicle to compliment the Magrider.
Same speed, Same Float, Same Range
Odd number of Gunners, and extra seats.

Together, you got better AA than a Skyguard.

Hell, I like rolling a bunch of em.
Takes only 3 to wax a Gunner BFR without any casualties.
Although I've done it before with only 1.

Deliverer is probably my favorite ground vehicle

Although, dunno if I had access to Thunderer or Raider.
Since I'm VS haven't really had much access.

But as far as cheap, reliable transport that gets half a squad moving around
Deliverer is where it's at.
Only thing it can't do is drive with Rexo, or passenger seats for Maxes.
Which can usually be remedied with AdvHack, AMS or a Tower.

liek omg nerf teh deli!!!1

and am i the only one who noticed that router pad? and it looks like an NC is hotdropping