Virtual Reality Training [Try before you buy]

GoldDragon · 2011-02-21, 12:08 PM

Okay, so I've actually given a lot of though as to what the VR does for us. Apart from letting us see what weapons and vehicles are available, not to much. Here is my proposal...

Virtual Reality

1. Shooting Range - Familiarize yourself with the available weaponry.
2. Vehicle Range - Familiarize yourself with available vehicles and their controls.
3. Training Scenarios - Face AI's of varied difficulties to learn combat basics. Training Scenarios can be entered as an individual or as a squad.

3.1 - Infantry - A series of conflicts in which the user faces AI's using various tactics and weapons depending on the difficulty chosen.
3.2 - Vehicles - Same as infantry, though the user can pick a vehicle and their position in the vehicle.
3.3 - Aircraft - Same as previous two only in regards to aircraft.

I feel having this third option in VR would be the most beneficial to older players and those wishing to refine their tactics before trying them in the field. It would also allow squads to develop team tactics as well. While I recognize this IS NOT necessary to the game's livelihood, I do think that it would make the VR more practical.

Feedback anyone?

Canaris · 2011-02-21, 12:23 PM

I'd love to see an expanded VR training center for use in testing weapons and vehicles.
Good post

Just have to make it so you can have plenty of people using it and not disturbing other players while they do.
Also how would multi player vehicles work while you're on your own in VR, a.i. gunners?

Maybe for the flight sim have a few of the standard rings to fly through while doing training. Put the aircraft thru their paces.

GoldDragon · 2011-02-21, 12:30 PM

Really there are hundred of potential ways for a "training room" to be used. I mean I remember back when I first got PlanetSide they had a short tutorial run but I didn't really take anything away from that apart from stuff I could have figured out on my own. I'd love to see more of the open doors VR presents used.

And yes, multi-vehicles would be AI gunners that might say things to help you learn "You're to far left of the target, swing around for another run and try using the bombing camera!"

Just thoughts though.

Firefly · 2011-02-21, 01:32 PM

It has its uses, they're just not official functions. You have to figure out how to use it. My outfit uses them on occasion for "weapons range training", where squads use the firing line to learn coordinated left-to-right fire. It used to be that you could get a whole squad into the same vehicle room but that became a sort of random instance, you'd see the numbers on the map but the people would be in different rooms. Prior to that, we used to use vehicle-testing rooms for squad-based infantry training for new players.

GoldDragon · 2011-02-21, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by Firefly

It has its uses, they're just not official functions. You have to figure out how to use it. My outfit uses them on occasion for "weapons range training", where squads use the firing line to learn coordinated left-to-right fire. It used to be that you could get a whole squad into the same vehicle room but that became a sort of random instance, you'd see the numbers on the map but the people would be in different rooms. Prior to that, we used to use vehicle-testing rooms for squad-based infantry training for new players.

Aye, my crew does similar things. I still think that adding some sort of response from the environment would ultimately teach more. Like for infantry, how you act when shooting is different if you're actually being shot at in return. The current VR is good for initial tactics training but it doesn't allow people to develop response tactics. While you can fight your own outfit members it doesn't allow you to work as a whole unit, you're splitting people up. As a small-ops leader I know that splitting my team up for training doesn't really benefit them in the long run so we end up using target dummies (Motion Sensor / Spitfires), but those do not return fire...

My whole issue is having a game combat simulation to help players learn things that can be applied to real PlanetSide combat.

Firefly · 2011-02-21, 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by GoldDragon

As a small-ops leader I know that splitting my team up for training doesn't really benefit them in the long run so we end up using target dummies (Motion Sensor / Spitfires), but those do not return fire...

My whole issue is having a game combat simulation to help players learn things that can be applied to real PlanetSide combat.

Again, this is up to the players to figure out. There's a Public Test Server. My outfit has run internal competitions on the PTS, with one group as TR and the other as either VS or NC, depending on the scenario. Usually we would run two iterations, so each side could change teams and experience combat from the other side. That way, we had a better idea of what the opposition's capabilities were - in turn, providing a chance to develop a counter.

Hamma · 2011-02-21, 07:52 PM

Interesting thoughts! I think that expanding the VR area would be a good investment in the game for those outfits that want to spend more time refining their skills.

Timantium · 2011-02-21, 03:24 PM

What I would love to see is based to your AI training session is an option to train as a group in these scenarios or even to play wargames with your own empires.

My outfit ran training late at night on conts that we had locked. That way we could practice tower assaults, quick base secures, etc. If we could do this in VR with established scenarios or simply adjustable facility layouts (tower, bio lab, tech, interlink, bridge etc.) it would be a huge benefit to any outfit who was willing to train their members.

Peacemaker · 2011-02-22, 01:14 AM

I think this is a great idea. Either a customised mission maker (Select enemies, Select Enemy vehicle, Select AI difficulty, Select map (Bio lab, Tech Lab...) Select Tower Type, Select AI Behavior and you get an instanced fight in a moderate sized map. Or just preprogrammed missions by the Devs. Id love to see a way to put my self in a reaver and try to fight off 2 or 3 enemy reavers, or 5 tanks or something.

GoldDragon · 2011-02-22, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by Peacemaker

I think this is a great idea. Either a customised mission maker (Select enemies, Select Enemy vehicle, Select AI difficulty, Select map (Bio lab, Tech Lab...) Select Tower Type, Select AI Behavior and you get an instanced fight in a moderate sized map. Or just preprogrammed missions by the Devs. Id love to see a way to put my self in a reaver and try to fight off 2 or 3 enemy reavers, or 5 tanks or something.

Like I've said, VR opens so many possibilities for usage but it's nothing other than a Weapons gallery really. I'm sure some would argue that this adds an RPG element to the game and how it goes against planetside... w/e.

Having an environment to train is important to developing strategy and combat tactics in my opinion. Training facilities exist in order to prepare for the greater fight. Militaries (usually...) don't train their men and women by throwing them on the front lines, that's not going to do anything but get people killed and in the case of gaming, annoy new players who are facing people with years of experience with the game mechanics (even if they are reworked slightly).

The Desert Fox · 2011-02-22, 02:16 PM

I agree, I feel that the VR training was really cool but very limited in PS, Something where entire outfits could customize training simulations and save them for future use would be extremely useful for Outfit "Basic Training" if you will.

CutterJohn · 2011-02-22, 03:57 PM

I'd like the experience from training to be account wide, and when you start a new character everything you already have examined does so again. This way you don't have to waste 45 minutes running around getting weapons and getting in and out of vehicles.

I'd like VR to have mobile enemies. In vehicle training, any vehicle you can gun on can be ridden on a track in the gunners position, and there are targets there.

Enemy vehicles and weapons should also be available in VR, on the off chance you happen to get one, you can have some experience.

This is all just for familiarization though, so a newb can get some rounds without dying every 2 seconds.

Sure, put a few proper bases in the VR for outfits to train with, but there needn't be a whole lot to that.. Ultimately training in a simulation of a simulation is pointless. There are few enough downsides to losing in game. Just go and do it.

GoldDragon · 2011-02-22, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

Sure, put a few proper bases in the VR for outfits to train with, but there needn't be a whole lot to that.. Ultimately training in a simulation of a simulation is pointless. There are few enough downsides to losing in game. Just go and do it.

I see your point here, and I do agree that a "simulation of a simulation" isn't necessarily ideal. Here's my counter though, the current player base is very familiar with the controls and game play of PlanetSide so these training scenarios aren't necessarily appealing. However assuming SOE plans on expanding the player base (marketing ftw maybe?...) these new recruits might appreciate a facility that they-and their friends-can practice working together against AI. While that is far from the true feel of PlanetSide it will allow them to have a more realistic expectation of what they'll find in the battlefield.

Yes, an outfit can adopt players and teach them but from my experiences not every new player (or current player) knows or wants that. Some find satisfaction in learning on their own. This is more about offering options to players and giving outfits (my personal reason for wanting this) a training ground to develop and refine tactics.

My final thing is that I don't see everyone wanting to just jump in and die. I believe I've said this before but the opening player base is not going to be a bunch of newbies but a large percentage of highly experienced players, this can make learning and starting a game disheartening, even with PlanetSide keeping the playing field relatively even.

Firefly · 2011-02-23, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by GoldDragon

Yes, an outfit can adopt players and teach them but from my experiences not every new player (or current player) knows or wants that. Some find satisfaction in learning on their own. This is more about offering options to players and giving outfits (my personal reason for wanting this) a training ground to develop and refine tactics.

My outfit runs a three-tiered set of training - Basic, Advanced, and Leadership. Each is geared towards a specific aspect of the game. Basic is for 1) new players and 2) new players to BWC. It teaches them fundamentals of the game if they don't know it, and how to operate with the outfit - from using Teamspeak/Vent to basic squad formations. It's designed to take a brand new player and give them at least a month of experience in the span of about a half-hour. That way we can take a n00b and run them with the squad without fearing that we'll decrease effectiveness. Advanced is basically small-unit infantry tactics (US Army FM 7-8 and a few others), how squads work and how squads work together as a platoon, conducting ambushes and flanks, etc. And Leadership training is how to run a squad and platoon. These are run in VR Training, in Sanctuary, or on live-fire continents. This is our training ground. And it's not mandatory to take any of them, it's offered but not expected.

It falls to the individual player to find out how to play the game. My biggest tip to brand new players is, find a good outfit. Not every outfit cares about new people, and not every outfit even cares enough to be serious. Which is fine - for every outfit that doesn't, there's an outfit that does. Some go the whole mile, like Warrior Nation, Dragonwolves, BWC, etc. Others just have a bunch of pro-tips. Diff'rent strokes, etc.

GoldDragon · 2011-02-23, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by Firefly

It falls to the individual player to find out how to play the game. My biggest tip to brand new players is, find a good outfit. Not every outfit cares about new people, and not every outfit even cares enough to be serious. Which is fine - for every outfit that doesn't, there's an outfit that does. Some go the whole mile, like Warrior Nation, Dragonwolves, BWC, etc. Others just have a bunch of pro-tips. Diff'rent strokes, etc.

I understand that and appreciate it, but does that really merit not including the tool should people want to take advantage of it? I'm just wondering if the idea doesn't appeal to you specifically because you don't see your unit using it. I don't mean this negatively but do you have a reason outside of that for disagreeing with the implementation of a more advanced VR? I would love having something like this to help train my outfit, but if no one else has a use or can see a use for it than I suppose it really loses it's merit to anyone else.

(Just looking to understand your perspective on this atm)